Archangelic Queens of Heaven and the United States of the Solar System

Question: First of all, you handle with a very large time scale. You claim that your primitive ancestors lived together with the dinosaurs, survived the—as you called it—artificial cataclysm and evolved then over 40 million years and your evolution was completed 10 million years ago. This sounds very unbelievable to me. Can you say something to this?

Answer: I understand that this must sound absolutely unbelievable to you, because you are a young and genetically engineered species. Your historical horizon ends at a scale of just some thousands of years and you think this is right. But it isn't. This is impossible. Your programmed mind is obviously not able to handle with such large time scales. Our evolution time may seem incredibly long to you, but this is in fact the original way of nature. Remember, your early mammal ancestors developed together with dinosaurs and they survived the bomb like us. They evolved slowly during the next millions of years and they divided into various species and shapes, some of them larger, some of them smaller. This is evolution of the body.

But what about their mind and intelligence? They were simple animals. The mammals evolved since—let us say—150 millions of years, but only in the last 2–3 millions of years they were able to become intelligent and thinking. And within this small period beings like you were created. From nature? 148 millions of years time for the evolution of animal-like mammals, 2 millions of years time for the development of (more or less) intelligent beings like you? Ask yourself: Do you really think this accelerated evolution is natural? Then your species is more ignorant then I've thought. We have not evolved wrong but you.

Question: I understand. But I have another question. You've mentioned many facts about the ancient war between the aliens 65 million years ago. This happened very long before your kind became really intelligent (as far as I have understood you). Why do you know so many things about that "first war" and about the evolution of your species?

Answer: This is a good question (much better then the previous) and I have not explained it properly to you. Our knowledge about the first war comes completely from an ancient artefact, which was found around 16,000 years ago from our archeologists on the continent you call North America today. They found there a round plate with a diameter of approximately 47 of your centimetres. The plate was made of an even for us unknown magnetic material and inside the plate there was another smaller crystal plate which contained an enormous amount of information coded in the molecular structure of the crystal.

This "memory plate" was manufactured from the last bomb survivers of human race from "Procyon" already 65 million years ago but it was completely intact when we found it. Our scientists were able to encode the messages and data and so we heard the first time about the events which took place in the distant past and which led to the extinction of the dinosaurs. The plate contained detailed descriptions of both species (but more about the humanoids) and about the events and weapons, including the fusion bomb. It contained also a description of the animals and saurians on earth, including our pre-intelligent ancestor species. The rest of our knowledge about our evolution comes from skeletons and from the back-reading and de/encoding of our DNA. You see, we know the real truth about our roots since 16,000 years. Before that time, there was a more religious idea of our creation.

Note by Michael Relfe: Assuming that this female is providing accurate information, from what she has been taught, it now becomes apparent that eveything the "reptilians" understand about their history is from an unknown alien artifact, created by an unknown alien group at an unknown time for an unknown purpose. Just as the reptilians enjoy subjecting humans to propaganda and disinformation, it seems that some other group is "running a game" on the reptilians as well. So this "advanced" reptilian race has no hard facts on their history, contrary to what they would have humans believe.

Question: What has happened with both alien species?

Answer: We don't know exactly. The surviving humanoids on earth obviously died in the years after the bomb and others of their kind and the reptilians never came back to Earth (as far as we know). Concerning the reptilian aliens, there is a possibility that it was physically impossible for them to return, because the matter between bubbles is sometimes in rapid movement. The current theory is, that both species had ceased to exist during the millions of years.

Question: You've mentioned skeletons of your kind. How can it be, that human scientists haven't found any trace of you and your ancestors if you really live for such a long time on this planet? We have found many skeletons of primitive dinosaurs, but none of an advanced reptilian being with a larger skull and brain and a hand with a thumb as you have described it before.

Answer: Yes, you have. But your "great" scientists were not able to reconstruct the skeletons completey, because they wanted to reconstruct reptilian animals, not intelligent beings. You would laugh if you would know how many of the (especially small) saurian skeletons in your museums are totally wrong constructions of never-existing beings, because you used many bones which didn't really belong together and sometimes you made artificial bones if something was missing you needed to construct an "animal" saurian.

Many of your scientists are aware of this problem, but they don't make it public, because they can't explain it and they claim, that the right bones were just missing and their reconstruction is right. Many bones of us were used for Iguanodon reconstructions, for example the hands with the visible thumb (look at an Iguanodon in a museum and you will see that I'm right.) A scientist in the country you call United States had build a nearly correct skeleton of our kind some years ago, but the local government (which is partly aware of our existence) confiscated the reconstruction. As we live today (and since thousands of years) nearly completely beneath the earth, you will not find any cadavers or skeletons of us.

Question: You speak sometimes about underground cities and artificial sunlight. Do you mean something like a "hollow Earth" with this. Is there a second sun inside our planet?

Answer: No, Earth is not really completely hollow and there is no second sun inside. (Note: United States Navy Admiral Richard Byrd would disagree with that statement). This story is ridiculous and physically not possible (even your species should be intelligent enough not to believe this.) Do you know how much mass a sun must have to produce energy and light for a longer time by fusion? Do you really think that there could be a small active sun inside the planet? When I talk about our subterranean home, I talk about large cave systems. The caves you have discovered near to the surface are tiny in comparison to real caves and huge caverns deeper in the earth (in a depth of 2,000 to 8,000 of your metres, but connected with many hidden tunnels to the surface or to surface-near caves) and we live in large and advanced cities and colonies inside such caves (Note that this female appears to know noting concerning the U.S. Military D.U.M.B.S. (Deep Underground Military Bases) at depths of over 35 miles.

Major sites of us are beyond the Arctic, the Antarctic, Inner Asia, North America and Australia. If I talk about artificial sunlight in our cities I don't mean a real sun but various technological sources of light (including gravitational sources) which illuminates the caverns and tunnels. There are special cave areas and tunnels with a strong UV light in every city and we use that places to heat our blood. Furthermore, we have also some surface sunplaces in remote areas, especially in America and Australia.

Question: Where can we find such a surface-near entry to your world?

Answer: Do you really think I will tell you their exact location? If you want to find such an entry, you have to search it by yourself (but I would advise you not to do that). When I came to the surface four days ago, I used an entry approximately 300 of your kilometres north from here near to a large lake, but I doubt that you would be able to find it (there are only a few entries in this part of the world—more are far more north and east).

As a little advice: if you are in a narrow cave or in a tunnel or even in something that looks to you like an artificial mine shaft and as deeper you walk as smoother appear the walls and if you feel unusual warm air streaming from the depth or if you hear the rushing sound of streaming air in a ventilation or elevator shaft, then look for a special kind of artificial and smooth wall somewhere in the cave with a door made of gray metal. If you would be able to open that door (but I doubt this) you would be in a usually round technical room with ventilation systems and elevators to the depth. This is probably an entry to our world (See more information on these tunnels in the "Branton Files"..

If you have reached this point, you should know that we are now definetely aware of your presence. You are already in big trouble if you have entered the round room, but you should look for one of the two reptilian symbols on the walls. If there are no symbols or other symbols, you are maybe in bigger trouble as you think, because not every underground installation belongs to our kind. Some new tunnel systems are operated from alien races (including hostile races). My general advice if you find yourself in a for you strange underground installation: run away as fast as you can.

Question: You mentioned earlier that you use the name "Lacerta" when you are among humans and that you enjoy it to be in the real sun on the surface of earth. But how can you be among humans? You don't look like us, so anyone will see that you belong to another species. Why has nobody seen and described a being like you if your kind lives already since our "creation" together with us on the same planet. Can you explain that to me?

Answer: First, my kind was of course seen and described (and worshipped) many times in your primitive past, for example in your religious writings like your Christian Bible. You can find descriptions and even simple drawings of us for also in the southern part of the American continent on various temples. So-called "wise" men from India and from the Asian mountains have described our species many times in writings, together with other "wise" men from the African continent. I think we are the most mentioned non-human species (maybe beside the "Ilojiim") in your history. If you don't believe me, have a look at your history and you will see the truth in my words. Your "great" scientists called the belief in us "superstition" and "religion" and today's "intelligent" humans have forgotten our presence on the surface in the past.

Furthermore, our species is seen even today sometimes from human witnesses in its original shape on earth or in our surface-near entries and tunnel systems, but fortunately you and your media didn't take the reports of such "crazies" serious (that's good for us and that's the reason why we allow those people to see us as we really are). Some of my species are also in direct contact with human scientists and politicians from the surface, but this is top-secret—as you would call it—and nobody of your public knows anything about it (the matter of these meetings is generally the upcoming war with and between the alien species and our assistance in this war) (Note: This predatory species will attempt to convince humans that it is "good" and will help in a war against the"bad" aliens).But there is also another explanation, why we can walk among you and why you are not able to recognize us: mimicry.

The following may again sound unbelievable and even shocking to you, but as you have asked I will expain it. I have told you before, that we have more advanced mental abilities then your species and with "more advanced" I mean, that we are able to use telepathy and telekinesis from our birth on (in fact, mother and new-born child communicate generally with telepathy during the first months) without special training as you need it to activate these sleeping parts of your brain. The structure of our brain is a little bit different to yours and our hypophyse is larger and more active then yours—especially when we are in sunlight. Our own abilities are very strong in comparison to yours, but weak in comparison to the "matterstring/bubble" mind forces of some of the alien species on this planet. I was never very good in that mind things, but we all have these primary abilities and can use them for example for our protection or even for attack (Note the subtle insinuation that humans are inferior to reptilians regarding metaphysical abilities, when in fact humans are superior to them because humans were created in the image of YAHWEH).

When we are on the surface and we meet human beings (even a large group of them—this makes no difference. All of your minds are like one mind) we are able to "touch" their mind and induce them via telepathy the command "See us as one of your kind" and the weak human mind will accept this order without refusion and they will see us (despite our reptilian look) as normal humans. I've done this many times and you weak humans generally see me as an attractive brown-haired woman, because I have created this special "mimicry image" in my mind years ago and I can induce it into your minds without problems. I've needed some time at the beginning to learn the use of the mimicry correctly, but then it worked nearly automatically and I can even walk among a group of yours and nobody will recognize what I am.

Note from Michael Relfe - If this female is providing correct information, then the metaphysical ability she is describing, whether natural or artificial, could be described as "projectional telepathic hypnosis" using a thought form as a carrier. Some countermeasures to this weapon might be prayer, asking YAHWEH for shielding or changing the quantum matrix inside yourself so that the thought form and the hypnotic "glue" that makes it stick would have no effect on the you.

There is a simple switch ("See us as we really are / See us as we want you to see us") in your consciousness which was placed there from the "Ilojiim" when they created your kind and we can use this swich to convince you that you see humans when you look at us (other aliens use this switch, too). It is easier than you think. When there are meetings between your kind and aliens which seem to look exactly like yours, these aliens have used that switch and some of the meetings with man-like aliens can be also explained with meetings with my kind). When I met E.F. the first time, he saw me also as a normal human woman and I remember that he was very frightened and shocked when I revealed him my real appearance.

Question: Do you mean, that you can really make me believe that I talk now with an attractive brown-haired human woman instead of a reptilian being like you?

Answer: Probably, but I don't think so in your special case. When someone expects to see a human woman instead of me, I can do it without problems with his mind (even with large groups) because nobody expects to see a reptile woman. But I have allowed your mind to see me in my original appearance from our first meeting on and I have never induced something into your mind, so you have already realized that I'm not human. If I would now try to change this, it would probably led to an absolute confusion or to unconsciousness and I don't want to harm you. As I have said I'm not very good in these things.

Question: That's very scary. Can you kill with that ability?

Answer: Yes, but it's forbidden. This means not that it was not done in previous times.

Question: Have both sexes this abilitiy?

Answer: Yes.

Question: What about photos? How do you appear on photos?

Answer: This is a silly question. I appear on photos as a reptile being, because I can't influence the photo or on the camera itself but only on the photographers mind.

Note by Stephanie Relfe: Is this the truth? Or disinformation? Or what she has been programmed to believe? Or, are there more than one kind of reptilian? One who lives underground and can't affect the camera? And another than can shapeshift with some kind of technology, that can affect the camera?

If he or she would develop the film and show the photo to others, they would see me in my original shape. That's the reason why it is forbidden for our kind to be filmed or photographed and we must avoid every camera on the surface (that is very difficult and we were filmed sometimes in the past without our knowledge, especially from certain of your goverments and secret agencies).

Question: What other commands can your kind induce into our minds. Something like "Serve us" or "Obey"?

Answer: This is again a strange question.

Note by Stephanie Relfe: She needs to watch the DVD "They Live". Think of it as a kind of documentary. (Ignore the ending and hokey effects. Considering how old it is, it is amazingly accurate).

We are not your enemy (most of us not) so why should we do this?

Note by Stephanie Relfe: Hmmm - According to her, we used to worship them. They they decided to go underground and stay hidden from us. Now, why on earth would they have needed to do that if they weren't our enemies?

To answer your question: it depends on the strength of the human mind and on the strength of the sending reptilian. There is no "Serve us" or "Serve me" switch in your mind, so such a command is much more difficult to induce. If the human mind and consciouness is weak and the reptilian inducer is experienced in these things and was some hours in the sun before he or she tries to do it, then it could probably work for a certain time. There are secret teachings about such things, but I've never learned anything about it.

Note by Stephanie Relfe: Well, there you go. I said at the beginning that this is a young, clueless female who has been fed a bunch of drivel, as we have. So how could she expected to know much of real importance?

I use my primary abilities for mimicry and for communication with my own kind and sometimes for other private things, but I've never used it to harm humans or their mind. I would appreciate it if we can end with this topic here.

Question: A last question: you've said earlier, that you can hide your UFOs? Do you use the same abilities to do this?

Answer: Yes, but on a technical base. There is a powerful device inside each craft which is able to send an artificial signal to your minds to convince you, that you see either nothing but only the sky or that you see normal aircraft like planes instead of our ships. This isn't used very often, because we avoid human public when we move in the atmosphere. If you are able to see our "UFOs" it means that the device is either defective or deactivated for some reason. The camouflage effect doesn't work on photos—to answer this possible question of you already in advance—but why should someone make a photo of the sky when he could not see anything unusual there. By the way, most of the surface-near entry points to our tunnels are also hidden with such a device and your kind will generally see only normal cave walls instead of the door. That's one reason why I've said that I doubt that you will be able to find such a secret door to our world (but it has happened a few times in the past).

Question: Back to your and our own history. You've mentioned the race of the "Illojiim" who have created our human race. From where did they come and how did they look like? What had exactly happened when they arrived? Are they our "God"?

Answer: The "Illojiim" came from this universe, from the solar system you call "Aldebaran" in your maps. They were a very tall humanoid species with usually blonde hairs and a very white skin (they avoided the sunlight, because it hurt their skin and their eyes. This was absolutely unbelievable for a sun-loving species like us). They seemed to be intelligent and peaceful at the beginning and we started a more or less friendly communication with them, but later they showed their real intentions and plans: they wanted to evolve the apes to a new breed and we were a disturbing factor for them on their new zoo planet.

Note by Stephanie Relfe: This is interesting. They sound like the blonde nordics. Unfortunately, when people get abducted or meet these beings, because they look blonde and physically beautiful, many humans end up thinking that they must be good. Instead of the truth - they are as evil as the greys and reptiilains. In fact, people have recovered abduction memories where all of these species are working together to work on abducted humans.

At first, they caught around 10,000 or maybe even 20,000 of your simian ancestors and they left the planet for some hundred years. When they returned, they brought your (now more human) ancestors back. Then they left Earth again for some thousands of years and the primitive pre-humans lived together with us without major problems (they were just afraid of our aircraft and technology). The "Illojiim" had taught their mind and enhanced their brain and their body structure and they were now able to use tools and fire. The "Illojiim" returned within 23,000 years seven times and accelerated the evolution speed of certain of your kind.

You must understand, that you are not the first human civilization on the planet. The first advanced humans (who lived at the same time with less-developed pre-humans, because the "Illojiim" had experimented with different speeds and stages of evolution) with technology and speech existed around 700,000 years ago on this planet (your scientists have not understood this, because they've found only the bones of the pre-humans and some primitive cave drawings showing advanced humans and flying devices.) This genetically advanced human breed lived together with us, but they avoided contact with my kind, because the "Illojiim" teachers had warned them with misleading purpose that we are evil beings and that we lie to them.

Well, after some centuries the aliens decided to extinct their first creation and they accelerated the evolution of a second and better test series and so on and so on. The truth is, that your modern human civilization is not the first on this planet Earth but already the seventh. The buildings of the first breeds are lost, but the fifth civilization was the one, which built the large triangular constructions you call "Egyptian Pyramids" today around 75,000 years ago (your Egyptians just found that large ancient pyramids in the sand and tried not very sucessfuly to built similar constructions) and the sixth civilization was the one, which built the cities which ruins you can find today beneath the sea in the so-called Bimini Area around 16,000 years ago.

The last creation of the seventh breed—of your series—was done just 8,500 years ago and this is the only creation you can remember and to which your religious writings refer. You rely on archeological and paleonthological artefacts which show you a wrong and short past, but how should you know anything about the six civilizations before. And if you find evidence for their existence, you deny and misinterpret the facts. This is partly a programming of your mind and partly pure ignorance. I will tell you in the following only about your creations, because the six previous mankinds are lost and therefore they should not concern you.

There was a long war between us and the "Illojiim" and also between certain groups of the "Illojiim" themselves, because many of them were of the opinion that the again-and-again creation of human species on this planet makes no real sense. The last battles in this war were fought around 5,000 years ago in orbit and surface. The aliens used powerful sonic weapons to destroy our underground cities but on the other hand we were able to destroy many of their surface installations and bases in space.

The humans of your series were very frightened when they observed our battles and they wrote it down in form of religious myths (their mind was not able to understand what was really going on). The "Illojiim"—who appeared as "gods" for the sixth and seventh breed—told them that it is a war between good and evil and that they are the good and we are the evil race. This depends certainly on the point of view. It was our planet before they arrived and before they started their evolution project with your kind. In my opinion, it was our right to fight for our planet. It was exactly 4,943 years ago—according to your time scale—that the Elohim left the planet again for unknown reasons (this is a very important date for us, because many of our historians called it a victory). Fact is, that we don't know what had really happened. The "Illojiim" were gone from one day to another, they vanished without a trace together with their ships and we found most of their surface installations destroyed by them.

The humans were on their own and your civilization developed. Many of us were in contact with certain (more southern) tribes of your species in the coming centuries and we were able to convince some of them that we are not the "Evil" the aliens wanted them to believe. During the time from 4,900 years ago to today, many other alien species arrived on the planet (some of them used the old teaching and programming of your mind and "played" again God for you) but the "Illojiim" themselves never came back. They had left the planet for a duration of some thousand years also earlier, so we expect their return one day in future to end their project or to maybe extinct also the seventh breed, but we don't really know what has happened to them (to answer this question of you in advance).

Your current civilization doesn't know anything about your real origin, about your real past, about your real world and universe and you know very little about us and our past. And you know nothing about the things to come in the near future. As long as you will not understand and believe my words—I tell you the truth because we are not your enemy—as long there is danger for your species. Your enemies are already here and you have not understood. Open your eyes or you will be in big trouble soon. If you haven't believed anything of the things I've told you before, then you should really believe and remember this.

Note from Michael Relfe - This "we are not your enemy" plea rings hollow when contrasted with the abductions, rapes, murders, tortures, baby stealings and many more evil things that these predatory slavers have inflicted upon innocent human beings.

Question: Why do you think I don't believe you?

Answer: I have a certain feeling that you don't believe me, despite the fact that I'm sitting here in front of you. Everything I have told you in the last two hours is the absolute truth about our world.

Question: How many alien species are active on earth at the moment?

Answer: As far as we know 14 species. 11 from this universe, 2 from another "bubble" and 1 very advanced from a very different plain. Don't ask me for names, because nearly all are not pronouncable for you, eight of them are not pronouncable even for us. Most of the species—especially the more advanced—are just studying you as animals and they are not very dangerous for you and for us and we work together with some of them, but three species are hostile, including the one which was in contact with some of your governments and exchanged their technology for copper and other important things and which had betrayed your kind.

There was and is a "cold war" between two of these hostile races during the last 73 years and the third species seemed to be the "winner" in this useless struggle. We expect a more "hot" war between them and you in the near future (I would say in the next 10 or 20 years) and we are worried about that development. In the last time, there were some rumours about a new, fifteenth species which had arrived on Earth just 3 or 4 years ago, but we don't know anything about their intentions and we were not in contact with them until now. Maybe the rumours are wrong.

Question: What do the hostile alien races want?

Answer: Various raw materials, including copper for their technology, your water (or better the hydrogen in your water, which is a source of energy in advanced fusion processes) and certain chemical elements in your air.

Note by Stephanie Relfe: She doesn't mention gold. I met a man from South Africa, long before the internet, who told me that there are vast, old gold mines in South Africa of over 20,000 years ago. Reptilians are also meant to like gold, so that they can turn it into white powder gold. It is our understanding that they are addicted to this, and it is one of the reasons why they lost their own psychic abilities, and need to rely on technology now.

Furthermore, two of the species are also interested in your body, in your human tissue and blood, because their own genetic structure is defective through bad evolution and radiation (as far as we know) and they need intact strings from your kind and from animals to repair their own genetic again and again, but they are not really able to repair the defects completely because their DNA and your DNA is not fully compatible (my own species is absolutely incompatible with them, so they are not very interested in us) and they try to make more compatible crossbreeds between you and them by use of artificial fertizilations and artificial wombs. We suppose that the coming war between the three races or between you and one or all of them will be fought for raw material, hydrogen, air and DNA.

Note by Stephanie Relfe: She never mentions that what they REALLY want are metategenes - those that give humans super advanced metaphysical abilities.

THE METAGENE FACTOR: Quote from "Blue Planet Project"- a notebook made by a scientist who worked with Greys and Reptilians for the government:

The Metagene is a biological variant lying dormant in select members of the human race [especially on planet earth], until an instant of extraordinary physical and emotional over-stress activates it. (Apparently a latent self-preservation 'gene' capable of producing seemingly 'superhuman' abilities in earth humans during times of extreme stress or crisis. - Branton) ...

That's an energochemical, in response to adverse stimuli. A chromosomal combustion takes place, as the Metagene takes the source of biostress, be it chemical, radioactivity, or what ever and turns the potential energoresponse into a catalyst for genetic change. The main focus of the catalyst power is a gland in the middle of the human brain called the PINEAL gland, and the nutrient for increasing the Pineal's action is the adrenaline. The Metagene factor gives the ability of Psionic Power [for better or worse].

The main interest of the Aliens, especially the Grays, is to understand and control the Metagene for their own race. They try to do this using Biological Experiments to make Hybrids from both humans and aliens. They believe perhaps the MEN FROM PLANET EARTH ARE THE DEADLIEST CREATURES IN THE UNIVERSE. Because ONLY on Earth people are apparently capable of generating the Metagene Factor, which means Natural Psionics ability, "Real Power" "(See www.themarsrecords.com)

That is why it is mostly people with metaphysical abilities to who get abducted. And why people without metaphysical abilities won't believe in abductions, because:

(1) CNN & Fox News didn't tell them.

(2) They have never been abducted.

(3) They don't have the metaphysical abilities to help them to see what is real, without physical proof (or even with physical proof).

Question: Is this the reason for the "abductions"?

Answer: Partly, especially when the aliens took egg and sperm samples from you. Sometimes the abducters belong to another and more advanced race and they just want to study your body and your mind (which is more interesting for some of them then your solid body) as you would study a primitive animal.

Note by Stephanie Relfe: This last bit is true. I was abducted by an unnamed alien species when I was about 5 years old. They were the alien equivalent of butterfly collecters. They took my psychic abilities and stored them as a blue light in a jar. After a clearing session, I got my abilities back, and noticed an improvment in my abilities afterwards. Note- Always ask YAHWEH to send angels to retrieve any parts of your fragmented soul as well as any abilities that have been taken from you.

As I have said, three alien species are hostile and this means that they do not care for your fate or for your life and people who were "abducted" by them came very rarely back alive. If someone is able to report about an abduction, it means in my opinion that he or she has not met one of the aggressive species or that he or she is a very very lucky human to be alive. Advanced and "friendly" races also took sometimes egg and sperm samples, but for other reasons.

Question: You've said there are only 14 species active on earth. But why describe people who saw alien beings so many different and bizarre types of them?

Answer: I think I have already answered this question. As I have said, most of the alien races have much more advanced mind abilities then you or even me (there is just one alien race completely without such abilities). They are able to appear in your mind and memory as whatever they want and this induced "image" has nothing to do with their real appearance. You remember them as normal humans or grey dwarfs or even extremly bizarre animals because they want you to remember that or sometimes they want you to completely forget anything about a meeting with them.

Another example: you can for example remember that you were just in a normal of your human hospitals and that some doctors were examining you and you think not further about what has happened to you (maybe until you discover that there is no hospital in the street where you supposed it) but in fact you were examined by them in one of their laboratories. You can't rely on your mind in this case. They appear in different shapes to you to confuse you and to make so-called abduction witnesses who were able to remember the events—or who believe they are able to remember—ridiculous in the public and as far as we know, they are sucessful. Believe me, there are only 14 alien species on this planet and only eight of them abduct humans at the moment (again as far as we know). In addition, not everyone of your "abductees" is one and some of the aliens in their reports are really just imagination or lies.

Question: How can we protect us against this influence on our mind?

Answer: I don't know. I doubt you can, because your mind is like an open book to read and write for nearly every species I know. This is partly the guilty of the "Illojiim" themselves, because they had constructed or better mis-constructed (partly intentionally) your mind and your consciousness without real protection mechanisms. If you are aware that someone tries to manipulate your mind, you can only concentrate on that suspicion and try to analyze every of your thoughts and memories. Very important: don't close your eyes (this would lead to a different form of brain waves which are more easy to access) and don't sit or lay down to rest. If you stay awake during the first minutes, you can maybe try to filter the other thoughts and waves in your brain and the inducer will give up after some minutes if he or she is not sucessful because it will start to hurt his or her own brain. This is very difficult and certainly painful and it can harm you, so better don't try to resist but it would be the only possibility you have. However, you can try this only with the more weaker species, not with the strong.

Note from Michael Relfe - Please observe the continued attempt by this reptilian to influence and program the reader to believe that humans are somehow inferior to the reptilian and all other alien races and that humans have no defense against alien mind manipulation. In truth, humans, created in the image of YAHWEH, our heavenly Father and creator of all things, are superior to these predators and are a deadly threat to these alien invaders.

Question: What do you mean with "one species comes from a very different plain"?

Answer: Before I can explain that correctly to you, you must be able to understand the universe and this would mean a maybe useless teaching of your mind (including the removal of some barriers) of many weeks and with teaching I mean not only teaching by words. I have said this with your word "plain" or "level" because you have again no better word in your vocabulary and dimension would be in this case absolutely wrong (it's rather wrong even for another "bubble") because a dimension can't exist without plains.

If you would be a species living in another or over the plain and if you would be furthermore able to enter plains without technology so that your body is not made of that kind of matter you know, then you would be the mightiest being you can imagine. This very advanced race I've mentioned had developed outside of here and they've evolved in fact over billions of years. They would be able to destroy all of you and us and everything with just a single thought. We were in contact with them only three times in our whole history, because their interest in your planet is different from that of all other races. They are definately no danger for you or us.

Question: What will happen when the war begins?

Answer: This is difficult to answer. It depends on the enemy race and on their tactics. "War" is not always that primitive thing you humans mean with the word, "War" can be fought on various levels. One possibility they have is the "destruction" of your social system by influence on political leaders, another is the use of advanced weapon systems which can cause earthquakes or vulcanic eruptions or other disasters (including weather disasters) which may seem natural to you. The special fields from copper-fusion I've mentioned earlier are able to have an influence on your global weather. I think they will not attack the planet directly before the human civilization is weak, because even you have possibilities to destroy their craft (but not many). Let me say, that we are not absolutely sure if there will be really such a "hot" war already in the next years. I don't want to talk further about this.

Question: This is the end of the interview. Do you want to say a last sentence or message?

Answer: Open your eyes and see. Don't believe only in your wrong history or your scientists or your policians. Some of them know the truth about various things, but they don't inform the public to avoid confusion and panic. I think your species is not as bad as some of my kind think and it would be a pity to observe your end. That's everything I can say. Go through your world with open eyes and you will see—or maybe not. Your kind is ignorant.

Question: Do you think anyone will believe that this interview is the truth?

Answer: No, but it is an interesting experiment for my social studies. We will meet again in some months and you will tell me then what has happened after the publication of my message. Maybe there is hope for your kind.

I continue to think that science fiction is an important part of this thread. Most of us don't have Cosmic Clearance - so we have to make due with the scraps of information we get fed in the mass media. The higher ups don't want us simple cattle to stampede! Run! Goyim! Run!! My computer is running very poorly - so I assume that someone doesn't like what I'm posting. Could you guys and gals just monitor me by going online, like everyone else - instead doing all of that fancy back-door Cray Supercomputer BS? I'd really like to have my computer back. Besides, the interdimensional reptilian spies are keeping me under constant watch. I couldn't resist. I know you are just doing your jobs. But really - I mean absolutely no harm. Check out these BBC clips from 'Dr. Who':

1. Hungry Earth:

Part 1 https://www.dailymotion.com/video/xdhpm9_doctor-who-2005-5x08-the-hungry-ear_shortfilms
Part 2 https://www.dailymotion.com/video/xdhrar_doctor-who-2005-5x08-the-hungry-ear_shortfilms
Part 3 https://www.dailymotion.com/video/xdhs38_doctor-who-2005-5x08-the-hungry-ear_shortfilms

2. Cold Blood:

Part 1 https://www.dailymotion.com/video/xdhs78_doctor-who-2005-5x09-cold-blood_shortfilms
Part 2 https://www.dailymotion.com/video/xdhszm_doctor-who-2005-5x09-cold-blood-2_shortfilms
Part 3 https://www.dailymotion.com/video/xdhtm6_doctor-who-2005-5x09-cold-blood-3_shortfilms



Lacerta File II

(Translation by Doug Parrish)

I once again reaffirm that the following text is the absolute truth and is not fiction. It was composed from three original tape recordings which were made on April 24, 2000 with a tape recorder during my second interview with the reptilian creature known as "Lacerta". At Lacerta's request, the original text of 31 pages was revised and shortened up to deal with some questions and answers. Some existing questions were partially shortened or amended. It was even undertaken to extract message and significance from it. This part of the interview, either not mentioned or not mentioned completely in the transcript, deals primarily with personal issues, paranormal demonstrations, the social system of the reptilian species and alien technology and physics.

The reason for the shifting of the date and time of the second meeting was a possible observation and surveillance of my own person after the publication of the first transcript. Although everything was attempted on the advice of Lacerta to keep my identity a secret, just two days after the dissemination of the document abroad, various unusual events took place.

Please don't think that I am paranoid; however, I believe that the publication of the interview has drawn either official attention or the attention of some organization to me. Up until this time, I usually regarded people who believed that they were being followed by the state to be nothing more than jokers. But now I have begun to revise my ideas on that since events in January.

It began with a failure of my telephone for several hours. When the phone became operational once again, there were quiet echoes and strange clicking and whirring sounds when I made calls. A defect could (ostensibly) not be found anywhere. Overnight, important data disappeared from the hard drive in my computer. The testing program reported "defective sectors" where strangely enough there were only data which dealt with illustrations and completed textual material from the interview. These "defective sectors" also contained material of a paranormal nature in the field of my research. (Fortunately, the material was also stored on floppies.)

In addition I discovered by pure chance some hidden data in a likewise hidden directory index. The name which appeared on the data and the directory index was "E72UJ." A friend, who is a computer expert, could not make anything of this designation, and when I was about to show it to him, the directory index had disappeared. One evening, my apartment door was standing wide open, my TV set was running—and I am absolutely confident that I had turned the TV set off.

A minivan with British markings and the imprint of a Europe-wide supermarket chain parked in front of my house. I noticed the same minivan again on several occasions traveling at a distance behind my car, even when I visited the town of ...... 65 kilometers away. When I returned, the car was on the other side of the street once again. I never saw anyone get into or out of the car. A knock on the door of the vehicle and on the tinted windows caused no reaction of any kind. After about two weeks, the minivan disappeared again. When I informed E.F. personally about these events, he suggested that I change the place and date of the meeting in order to assure our own and Lacerta's safety. The meeting took place on April 27, 2000 in another isolated location. It was unobserved as far as I can determine.

Once again, all of this may sound strange and paranoid, like a fantasy from a cheap science fiction film; however, I can only repeat to and assure the reader once again: all of this is the unadulterated truth. Believe my words or don't believe them. These things have happened and they will continue to happen, whether you believe it or not. Until it is too late. Our civilization is in danger.

Ole. K. – May 3, 2000

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Transcript of the Interview (Shortened Version)

Date: April 27, 2000

[Comment by Ole. K.: The meeting began with an appraisal of diverse questions and opinions which I had gotten from readers of the first transcript in anonymous fashion through distribution from my trustworthy friends. Some of these opinions—all together there were over 14 pages of paper—contained comments shaped by everything from a radically religious to a fanatical tendency to welcome contact with a reptilian species. Some of these comments contained stereotypical phrases like "Servants of Hell" or "Species of the Evil One". I don't want to go into any kind of detailed description here since I don't want pass on further any false and radical realm of thought.]

Question: When you read these religious and animosity-ridden comments here, what do you think and feel then? Is the relationship between your species and ours really shaped from that kind of total negation?

Answer: Does it amaze you that I am not completely angered by that? I had fully expected those kinds of extreme reactions. The programming for the utter negation of another species (especially the reptilian species) as in your own case is deeply embedded in each of your own individual consciousnesses. This ancient conditioning stems from the days of your third artificial creation and, biologically speaking, is passed down as an information genome from generation to generation.

Note from Michael Relfe - "Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?" Genesis 3:1 KJV

The identification of my species with the powers of darkness was a primary intention of the Illojiim, who liked seeing themselves in the role of the powers of light—something which in and of itself represents a paradox, since that humanoid species was extremely sensitive to your sunlight. In case you were expecting me to act offended, I guess I'll have to partially disappoint you. These obscure intentions are not really your fault; you are simply following for the most part what you have inherited from your ancestors.

It is indeed actually somewhat disappointing that many of you develop no especially strong individual self-conscience, for this would help you to overcome the conditioning. As I already said, we were in direct contact in the last several centuries with some of your more primitive human tribes; these tribes had themselves succeeded in breaking through the old "creation programming;" they were able to meet us without tension, hate and total rejection. Apparently many of your modern civilized individuals are not in a position to think on their own, but rather let themselves be guided by programming and religion (which is also a manifestation of that ancient programming and part and parcel of the plan of the Illojiim). Therefore, comments of that kind I'd sooner regard as amusing than irritating; they simply confirm in large measure for me my suppositions about your defined mode of thinking.

Note from Michael Relfe - History is littered with the murder, rape, torture and enslavement of entire races and civilizations degraded and destroyed by the worship and control of these reptilian predators. It is understandable that they fear humans and hide in the earth like bugs. They have much to answer for, and YAHWEH will judge them and those that ally themselves with them.

Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. Galatians 6:7 KJV

Question: Therefore, you are not the "Species of the Evil One" as was remarked earlier?

Answer: How am I supposed to answer that? Your people still think according to a simple and completely inappropriate scheme of generalizations. Simply put, there are absolutely NO purely evil species. There exist in every terrestrial and extraterrestrial species alike both good and evil individuals; it's even true of your own people; but there is NO such thing as an absolutely evil species. This conception is really very primitive. You people have believed from time immemorial what you are supposed to believe—what was foreseen for you to believe by your creators.

Every well-known species, even the more highly developed ones, consists of a great number of individual consciousnesses (at least a portion of the consciousness is individual, even though there are connecting fields of consciousness); these self-sufficient spirits are able to decide freely for themselves a lifestyle which is either good or evil, according to your own human standards.

It depends again on the respective point of view; your people are not necessarily in a position to judge whether the deeds of a much more highly developed species are good or evil, because you stand at a lower observation point, from which an assessment is not possible.

Note by Stephanie Relfe: This is the typical garbage-talk of a suppressive person. Suppressive people have a messed up mind that can't recognise that what they do is evil. A good person is constructive and has a conscience. They respect the freedom of beings that are not hurting them. A 'bad' person is destructive and has no conscience. Not that the reptilian DID NOT answer the question.

Your simple words "good" and "evil" are in any case examples of a tendency towards generalization; in my language there are many concepts for the various shades of meaning of individual behaviors in comparison to the norms of a society.

Even those extraterrestrial species which are inclined to act with antagonism towards you are not "Species of the Evil One," even though they operate negatively with respect to your own race. They do this for their own reasons and do not regard themselves as evil;

Note by Stephanie Relfe: Again, no suppressive person recognises evil. Their mind is warped. Plus they have zero sense of responsibility.

where your structured way of thinking more linear and more focused as theirs is, then you would also behave in such a fashion. The attitude of a species towards other kinds of existence naturally depends very heavily on its respective structured way of thinking; each species sets its own priorities. To classify that as "good" or "evil" is really quite primitive, for the survival of any species argues for many varieties, among them your own, as well as for even the most varied of the worst or negatively-directed deeds. I won't even exclude my own kind in this regard, for there have been certain occurrences in the past which I don't personally welcome, but about which I would also not like to go into detail. None of these occurrences have happened in the last 200 years of your time scale. But please note the following: there are NO absolutely good and there are NO absolutely bad species, because each and every species always consists of individuals.

Question: In the letters that I got, there was often the question, whether you could go into any greater detail regarding the advanced physics that you commented on last time. Many people said, your words made no sense. For example, how do UFOs function, how do they fly, how do they perform the maneuvers that they do?

Answer: I ought to explain that to people? That's not all that simple. Let me think about it for a minute. I always have to use very simple words in order to make clear to you the basic principles of a higher kind of science. Let's try this: You have to be clear about some fundamental facts. The very first thing is that you must divide up the conception of the physical world because each existence consists of different layers; let's say for simplicity's sake that it consists of a material illusion and a sphere of influence. {TRANSLATOR'S NOTE: No legitimate translation exists for this word 'Feldraum'; "Feld" means "field," "Raum" means "space, room, expanse." Therefore, I'm translating it as "sphere of influence."}

Certain physical conditions are associated only with the realm of the material {as in 'concrete'}, while other and more complicated conditions are associated only with the sphere of influence of the material world. Your conception of the physical world is based upon a simple material illusion. That illusion is further subdivided into three elementary or basic conditions of matter. A fourth and very important condition also exists, which you simply pay attention to more or less as you choose; it is the one bordering on the sphere of influence or plasma realm.

For you, the theory for a controlled transformation or an elevation of the frequency of matter and the stable existence of this fourth aggregate condition of matter is not very common, or it exists at a very primitive level. (As an aside, there are simply five states of matter, but the post-plasma state would really be going too far and it would only serve to confuse you. Besides, it is not necessary for an understanding of the basic theory; it is connected with diverse phenomena which you would characterize as paranormal.)

Now, back to the essentials: Plasma...now, with plasma I don't mean just "hot gas"—as the concept is generally simplified by your people—but rather I mean a higher aggregate condition of matter. The plasma state of matter is a special form of matter which lies between its real existence and the sphere of influence, that is, a complete loss of mass and pure accretion of energy of various form whenever matter is "pushed or shoved." {NOTE: No explanation was given for the use of the word "pushed, shoved" as used in this context. Your guess is as good mine.}

The fourth state of matter is very important for certain physical conditions which can be used for example to...how should I express this to you...generate antigravity. (That's a rather strange human word and not really correct, but you ought to understand it better this way.) Essentially, in the world of real physics, there are no bipolar forces, but rather only "observer dependent reflective behavior" of a single, large unified force at different levels.With antigravity or the displacement of gravitational characteristics into levels, one can, for example, cause apparently solid matter to levitate; this method is employed partly by us and by extraterrestrials as well as a means of propulsion for their UFOs.

You people are moving on a really primitive level towards a similar principle for your secret military projects, but since you have more or less stolen this technology (and it was later falsely passed on to you intentionally by the extraterrestrials), you lack the real physical understanding; as a result, you have to struggle with problems of instability and radiation with your "UFOs". According to my information, there have been a great number of deaths of your people because of intense radiation and field disturbances. Don't you agree, this is also an example of the business regarding the question of "good" and "evil"? You people play with unknown forces

Note by Stephanie Relfe: We agree.

and thereby accept the death of colleagues of your own kind, for they are dying for a greater cause, namely, for the advancement of your technology, which as a result is being put into place once again for the purpose of war, i.e., for negative pursuits.

Note by Stephanie Relfe: Again, we agree.

Now, one can give you the benefit of the doubt, that only the least number of your kind have any knowledge about these alien projects which are—as you explain it—top secret. It was told to you that the higher the ordinal or ranking number of basic matter, the simpler the heightening of the condition, but that is only partially correct. If you can't circumvent these powers, then you're better off not attempting it. But your kind has always been ignorant and has from time immemorial tried to play around with forces which you have not even understood. Why would that ever change?

You remember this business of copper fusion? By means of the fluctuation at the right angle with the induced radiation field, copper is fused with other elements. (The illusion of matter is fused, the fields in the sphere of influence overlap each other, but the main force would be reflected by that process and would assume a quasi-bipolar character.) The resulting connection and the field would therefore not be stable in the normal condition of matter and unsuited for tasks. As a result, the entire field spectrum is shifted to a higher plasma-like condition, whereby the spectrum comes together with this harsh shifting to the opposite pole side—the word is NOT correct—of the force field and it resembles quite closely a gravitational shift.

This shifting causes a "tilting" of the repulsing quasi-bipolar force, which now no longer flows to the interior of the force field, but rather flows partly to the exterior of the field. The result is an inter-stratifying reflective force field which is very difficult to modulate within certain technical boundaries in relation to its own characteristics. It can also carry out a multiplicity of tasks, as for example, causing massive flying objects to be levitated and maneuvered. It can also exert a camouflage function in the realm of electromagnetic radiation as well as manipulate temporal sequences of events—indeed only to very limited extent—and other things as well. Are you familiar with your "quantum tunnel effect"?

Even the amplitude equalizations among genuine matter can be achieved with one of those kinds of fields if the frequency and the distance from the plane of the field are high enough. Unfortunately, the whole thing that I have explained to you in your words has come out to be rather primitive, I'm afraid. It sounds rather strange and certainly impossible for your comprehension, but perhaps this simple explanation can be of some use to you in helping you to understand. But then again, maybe not.

Question: Is there a scientific substantiation for paranormal powers, as for example with your powers of thought?

Answer: Yes. In order to explain that, one has to acknowledge the physical reality of the sphere of influence {Feldraum}. I'll try to do it...wait just a second...you are going to have to separate yourself mentally from the illusion that that which you see is the true nature of the universe. It is, at best, the surface of a side. Imagine for yourself that all the matter here—you, this table, this pencil, this technical device, this paper—does not really exist, but that it is rather only the result of a field oscillation and a concentration of energy.

All matter that you see, every creature, every planet and star in this universe, has an "information-energy equivalent" in the sphere of influence which is located on a main field—the general level {of things}. Now, there is not only one level, but several. Last time, I had mentioned that highly-developed species which is capable of changing levels (which is something completely different from the simple bubble changing, for bubbles are a part of each and every level). Do you understand? Dimensions, as you call them, are a part of a solitary bubble, bubbles or universal foam are a part of a level, and levels are layers in the sphere of influence, while the sphere of influence, acting in the capacity of single physical size, is essentially unending; it is composed of innumerable information-energy layers and general levels. There are in the sphere of influence no null-levels; all are the same, but they are separated by means of their energy conditions. I notice that I am confusing you now. I think I ought to stop with this explanation.

Question: No, please continue. How do concrete paranormal powers arise?

Answer: Well, OK then. Let's try something simpler. Again, it is not completely correct, but let's begin in this manner: Tangible matter on this side is mirrored in the sphere of influence {Feldraum} as a field with distinct layers. These layers contain information, as an example, about the simple structure of matter or the string frequency, but also there is stored information stemming from the development of matter. Are you familiar with the human concept of "morphogenetic fields?" One part of the layer could be designated as such.

Now there is still another intermediary layer for which you unfortunately have no human concept, since the theory is not common in human thinking. Let's call it a "para-layer," for this layer is mainly responsible for everything which you call PSI and paranormal and which lies outside the boundaries of your primitive science. This para-layer lies between the layers of matter and the morphogenetic layers of a field in the sphere of influence. It can actively integrate with both. Your body, for example, is mirrored as a field in the sphere of influence {Feldraum}. That doesn't mean that it does not also exist here as well—as flesh, blood, bones—in the form of matter strings or atoms, but not only that.

Existence is always a duality. Some layers of the field contain simple information about the solid matter of your body and its frequency, while other layers {contain information about} your spirit, your consciousness or, speaking from a human-religious point of view, your soul. Awareness or consciousness in this case is a simple energy matrix, divided into different layers of your field in the sphere of influence—nothing more, nothing less. Genuine awareness can also exist here on the matter side, but only in the form of post-plasma {the fifth form of matter}. With the necessary physical knowledge and the corresponding technology, the consciousness/awareness matrix, or soul, can also be separated from its field of rest. It can, despite its removal, continue to exist in a self-sufficient manner for a certain amount of time. That has the strange occult name of "soul robbing." But above all, we're talking about science here, not about magic or dark forces.

[Comment by Ole. K.: The "soul robbing" was mentioned in one of the radical, religiously-motivated comments in connection with the reptilian species.]

But back to your Question: Creatures with more powerful mental powers can have a direct influence on the para-layer by means of their consciousness/awareness fields. Now this layer is not limited only to the individual, but rather as a part of a general information layer—you could call it in a prosaic sense the community soul—that is connected with all animate and inanimate matter and all consciousness which exist on this main level.

The biological cause for these abilities lies on the side of matter, by the way, in the pituitary gland, which always is in the position to generate the frequencies to actively control the sphere of influence {Feldraum}. Even you people could theoretically do this; however, you are solidly blocked in these things. As I have said, the para-layer can interact with mind as well as with matter. For example, if I decide to use my mental powers once more in order to move this pencil, then, simply said, I imagine in my mind how my consciousness/awareness expands/amplifies itself on the matter side in the form of post-plasma to the pencil.

In the sphere of influence this causes simultaneously an automatic command from the consciousness/awareness layer to the para-layer to interact with the matter layer of the pencil. Since the para-layer is not confined to the body, it is not even a problem that the pencil lies over there, for I can unerringly reach it, even without moving my matter body. Post-Plasma on this side, para-layer on the other. I have control over the pencil and the interaction brings the matter field of the pencil to the point where it changes in the manner in which it moves, for example.

[Comment by Ole K.: I certify that the pencil mentioned above abruptly at that very moment jumped into the air to a height of 20 cm and then fell back to the surface of the table. The sound is clearly heard on the recording tape. No one visibly had touched that pencil.]

Question: That is fascinating. Which kinds of paranormal activities can one generate with that?

Answer: All kinds. Everything that you call paranormal. As I said, this special layer lies in the sphere of influence {Feldraum} between the morphogenetic information layers and the matter layers and can interact with respect to both sides. That is to say, it can be interacted with solid matter as well as with mind or mental information, wherewith we can achieve everything that is generally designated as telekinesis and telepathy.

The "connection absorption" with another consciousness/awareness is generally separate in the procedure from the simple influence of matter, since different consciousness/awareness fields work with different oscillations. A consciousness/awareness that sends or a consciousness/awareness that listens must first adapt itself to the other mind exactly, before any access is possible. Most species also have chances to block the alien access, but you people don't have this.

The following is generally valid: the stronger the paranormal abilities of a species, the simpler the adaptation and the access. Our own abilities are not so powerfully developed; therefore, first we have to learn specifically alien mind influence in order to use our mimicry, for example—where mimicry is actually quite simple in your minds due to the implanting of the on/off switch. Some of these abilities are also partially inherited; mother and child of my kind as an example are attuned exactly during the first months of life—partially also in the egg covering in the expectant mother—and communicate telepathically.

In order to influence you people, we need a certain amount of time for practicing, despite your simple structure. Therefore, it is forbidden, for example, for adults of my kind before the "Age of Enlightenment" to come to the surface of the Earth. (That term is synonymous, along with other things, with full physical strength.) In the case of not fully developed abilities, the danger of discovery by you would be too great. By the way, there are of course numerous secret teachings about the real possibilities which can give one these abilities, but I really don't know anything exact about that.

Whenever an alien mind ought to be influenced, then there are some generally valid steps, which are set into motion by other extraterrestrial species. First and foremost, the alien oscillation must be felt, something generally that is done automatically by the brain, i.e., for the one the field oscillation, for the other the quasi-electrical brain waves here in the normal space {which matter inhabits}. That is not especially difficult. After that, one simply probes for the other consciousness/awareness in the mind with a post-plasma manifestation, the sphere of influence {Feldraum} reacts and the connection is there.

Now one can read out information from the first one and record the desired information to the second one in the correct location. You asked me last time whether you people have the opportunity to protect yourselves against this influence, and I told you that only an awake and concentrated mind had any kind of a chance to withstand it. In this state of mind the oscillations change very abruptly and access becomes complicated; more precisely, it can come as a painful recoil. Whenever you close your eyes, then the field becomes "flat," and alien access {to the mind} is immediately possible and without restriction. In terms of your chances against a more highly developed species, you have none at all. They are able to adjust the oscillations faster than you can change. I could even demonstrate it on yourself, but you were really horrified and confused the last time, so we'll just leave it at an explanation.

Note from Michael Relfe - If this female reptilian is providing correct information, her explanation of projectional mind control brings to mind some further countermeasures.

The predatory alien requires a signal reception or "sampling" of the oscillation created by the mind of the target. If the human target were to specifically change the quantum matrix of their brain and mind so that those signals could not be received by the predator, then the "mimicry" would not function. Remember that it is not necessary for us to understand the process because YAHWEH is actually doing all the work. HE will make sure you are doing it correctly. So please try this new prayer procedure and when you start to see the reptilians, please let us know.

This explanation presumably sounds to you like—as you say—something esoteric or from the occult or magic. The reason for that is simply that you lack the basic understanding for seeing the background reasons. All paranormal phenomena have a purely scientific origination. None of this has anything to do with supernatural powers. We grow up with this kind of knowledge, we know how one makes use of these powers, and where they come from. We are acquainted with theory and practice. You are not. Therefore, you really don't understand what happens in your world—you see only one side of existence, not the other (I mean here both that are physical). Everything paranormal is dualistic, and it exists in the space that matter inhabits as well as in the sphere of influence {Feldraum}. To be explained...it can only be explained by the acceptance of the latter, because the sphere of influence {Feldraum} is the basis. I would welcome an end to the scientific questions since you really aren't grasping them anyway. We're wasting more or less valuable time by doing this.

Note from Michael Relfe - It is quite possible that the explanations provided by the reptilian female are accurate. Much paranormal phenomena involves demonic activity and you can be assured that demons can manipulate these energy layers if they need to.

Question: Only one last question. At our first meeting in December, you made it quite clear that you didn't want to discuss scientific and paranormal concerns. Why the openness now?

Answer: The last time I saw really no necessity in overburdening you with facts of that kind (and now you are obviously overburdened). Therefore, I had preferred only to mention these topics in a peripheral sense. Apparently, however, some of my performances today have set you to thinking about your world, something that can't be all bad. And by the way, your human scientists will tend to regard my comments as "humbug." And so I see no great danger in spreading this information widely. No one will pay much attention to it. By the way, the words of people who have characterized me as a "Creature of Evil" have their basis in the belief in occult powers and magic—both of which things DO NOT exist.

Note by Stephanie Relfe: HA!!! I have a video for you Lacerta. Please watch "Interview with an Ex-Vampire". (Also available free on google video). Black Magick is powered by demons or other higher beings. I don't think that is 'science". It is very real, very powerful, very evil and very dangerous. Again, is she brainwashed, just plain ignorant or giving us misinformation?

There is no magic, only highly developed science, and everything that you label as "magic" is only a part of science. If you would only comprehend that, then you would be a step ahead in your development. My openness on this issue ends here. Pose other questions, please.

Question: Good. Let's talk about UFOs. Can you explain to me how our governments came into possession of UFO material to the point that they could start their own projects? Did it have anything to do with the "Roswell Incident?"

Answer: Yes, but that incident was not the first one. I am no historian, I am studying only your current behavior, so my knowledge about those events in your history is presumably not very extensive. I will try to explain to you what I know about those things which happened at that time. Let me think about it for a second. In the years 1946 to 1953 in your time scale, there were five cases where extraterrestrial ships crashed to the surface of the Earth. In that crash which you call the "Roswell Incident," there was not only one alien ship involved, but two that crashed after a collision in different parts of the land in the west—the one you call the USA. (You have to know that the ships of this particular species can remain levitating in the air for a particular period of time even though they are damaged; that accounts for the spatial difference {in their crash locations}.) These were indeed not the first crashes, but by that time the second and the third. Another ship had crashed in 1946, but it was destroyed beyond usability.

One thing first before the explanation: it certainly sounds ridiculous to you that such highly developed extraterrestrial ships simply crash, and that a relatively large number did so in a relatively short amount of time. The explanation for that is likewise more than strange, but it is correct. It does not lie in the ship's drive itself, but rather in the direction of the field to your planet. This species that we are discussing—and it was always in this time period that this species used a disk-shaped craft—used a propulsion system which ran according to the normal principle of fusion, to be sure, but one that at that time employed a more than unconventional method for field alignment.

This method had various advantages but also disadvantages. The repelling field must of course lie in the absolute correct angle to the surface of the Earth. This species used an alignment technology in their ships, with which the field locked into place all points of the Earth's magnetic field. Now at that time this species had just arrived on the earth and their point of origin lay on a planet with a more stable magnetic field, for which they had developed and aligned their drive. The magnetic field of the Earth is not really all that stable; it is subject to cyclical variations and it forms field eddies under unfavorable conditions. Whenever a ship with one of those kinds of drives gets into a field fluctuation or into an eddy that is too strong, then for a short time the repelling field can no longer align itself correctly and the ship glides uncontrolled on its flight path.

The drive is operating correctly, to be sure, but the field fluctuates in all directions and because of that, the ship can crash. In the case from 1947 which you addressed, it is my understanding that one of the ships got caught in a fluctuation, its field linked up unintentionally with that of its squadron leader and it collided with another ship whereby both of them were heavily damaged. The cause for the magnetic fluctuation at that time was probably an electrical disturbance brought about by a weather event. Both ships crashed as a result; one of them fell near the collision point, the other a hundred of your kilometers or so distant. All occupants were killed in the impact. The thin hull structure of that kind of disk craft is in and of itself not very stable, since those disks have not been designed for crashes as well as for flight in a field where there are exterior forces at work.

Now, your human military collected the individual pieces at first until they discovered the whole ships with the dead creatures aboard. Immediately they classified everything as "Top Secret" and brought them to their military bases in order to analyze the drive. The secret endeavor was to set the alien technology in place later against evil enemies of that great country. That is as primitive as it is ridiculous. I believe I remember—I don't want to specify exactly your date—that it was probably between 1949 and 1952 that there was a rather bad accident during some research being done on one of the wrecks. According to what I heard—what members of my species were told by members of that government—it resulted in an unintentional activation of one of the drive's components in the unshielded condition. As a result, for a very short period of time—how should I phrase this—there was an unchecked shift of the environment to a plasma-like condition, which on the other hand, through a very, very unfortunate accident, caused an overturning of the general power field into a magnetic pulse of immense power.

Do you have any idea what kind of an effect a plasma-magnetic jolt has, when it comes into contact with an organism? No, how should you know that. Of course you don't. Disturbance in the structure of the field and bioelectric feedback. Imagine, if you will, a human body which is engulfed in bright flames for 3 or 4 of your days. Those flames apparently do not go out and they burn the body right down to its last constituents. Well, then you have an approximate impression of what happened. I think that 20 or 30 of your scientists were killed in that lab.

Two further crashes occurred in 1950 and 1953 in the water catchment area of the American continent. Those ships were able to be recovered from the crashes relatively intact. (The one in 1953, as I remember, even had an intact drive core. It was by means of that device that you saw for the first time that you had understood the entire concept fully incorrectly and that you had reconstructed it fully incorrectly. Even today you still don't have it right.) That species, which had built the ships in the first place—a species which I, by the way, count among those who are unfriendly towards you—was naturally worried about the investigation of their own technology by your kind. They did not want, however, at that early point in time, to begin direct conflict with you, and so they chose the diplomatic path and came into contact with that government during your 1960's.

Of course, they did not divulge the real reasons for their being here—copper, hydrogen, air—but rather they pretended to be curious "researchers" and offered to show people the functioning principle of the ships whereby they would expect in return some "favors." Simple-minded as you are, you of course agreed to it...and were deceived. You gave them raw materials, you gave them secured locations for their bases, you gave them access to your most secret defense data, you gave them access to your DNA and much more—and all just to quench your greed for power and information.

The alien species of course quickly noticed that they were dealing with simple-minded creatures, and they gave you false and inferior information about their technology so that they receive much more out of the collaboration than your kind do. For example, they gave you information that the drive can only be constructed with unstable elements of a higher ranking number, but they withheld the information that the field drive can be constructed with various modifications to work as well with stable elements of a lower periodic number, and generally, that's the way it's done. Through these half truths they made you dependent on the synthesizing of high {numbered} elements, and thereby renewed by their own technology. Their clues to the construction of your "UFOs" were laid out in such a way that the solution to old problems caused new problems to arise simultaneously. They never told you the complete truth, but always built in again and again clever lies, which later lead to technical problems—and to your dependence on them.

In the last years of your 1970's and your early 1980's, it finally came down to various events between the alien species and that human government—I don't want to go into detail here since there is much that even I am not exactly sure of. The whole thing lay in the context with some new, or better said, the old technical problems with your own self-constructed ships whose camouflage and drive partially failed to function in test flights in the open. Because of that, the function of secrecy was threatened. Your military and your politicians slowly—very slowly—came to the conclusion after more than 20 years of this that they had been deceived by that alien species.

Multitudinous incongruities and the overstepping of bounds of the treaties by both sides finally led to an altercation between you and the extraterrestrials, which culminated in the lift-off of three of the alien aerial objects through a special—how do you say it?—EMP {electromagnetic pulse} weapon and a military skirmish at one of their underground installations. As a consequence of these attacks, the alien species ultimately withdrew from all contact with you and was understandably more than angered about your kind. Therefore, I count these extraterrestrials among the three groups who are hostile towards you, and while the other two are more occupied with their own business, among them waging a cold war for dominance on your planet, your old "friends" and partners are preparing to supply themselves finally with the sole and absolute dominance over raw materials and human DNA. At the moment it is probably true that they lack some of the technical possibilities and the large amount of forces which they need in order to achieve their goals directly. In spite of that, we are counting on negative actions—possibly ever of a more subtle kind—against you in the next few years or decades.

Question: Will the other extraterrestrial species undertake nothing against these war-like actions? Specifically, something ought to be on Earth for the more highly developed species.

Answer: You're wrong there. Specifically, for the more highly developed species there is simply at the very least your fate. You are animals for them. Animals in a very large lab. Understandably, an alien intervention on your planet would disturb their projects, but I don't think that they accept a confrontation with other species for it. Many of them could look for another research planet for themselves or they could study over a long distance your behavior and your consciousness/awareness, since crisis situations could have an attraction for their studies.

Whenever you people take a look at an ant hill, and another person comes along and steps on the ant hill, what do you do? You go on your way, or you search for another ant hill or you observe the ants in their crisis condition. But would one of you—even though he were larger and more powerful than the one who stepped on the ant hill in the first place—defend the meaningless ants? No. You have to imagine for yourself the viewpoint of the more highly advanced creatures. You are the ants. Don't expect any help from them.

Of course we would also ask for help when it became clear that your old partners were ganging up on you. Some members of that human government are fully aware of our existence—also partially owing to an old religious basis. For example, there is a gigantic partially underground building in the capital which is totally dedicated to my species and that also has a direct approach to an elevator shaft and to an underground system. In this building partial meetings have taken place and do take place between us and humans. We have passed on information to you in the last few years; according to what I know, we will keep ourselves as far away from the conflict as we can. You ought to learn to solve your own problems yourselves or to become intelligent enough never to create those kinds of situations. What will come and who will possibly place themselves on your side, only time will tell. I really do not want to make any indications about that.

Question: I have here 5 prints of different UFOs, which claim to show UFOs. Can you take a look at the pictures and tell me in which of them actual extraterrestrial aerial craft can be seen?

Answer: I can try it. You pose many questions to me today which even I cannot answer unequivocally. Don't overestimate my knowledge, I'm no expert in alien technology and the construction of extraterrestrial ships. To be sure, there are mostly some technical details and peculiarities about genuine "UFOs," with whose help one can easily differentiate them from natural phenomena or human forgeries. You falsify sometimes the pattern of genuine ships; therefore, it is not so easy simply with absolute certainty to identify an object. I'll try it. Show me the photos.

[Comment by Ole K.: She considered the pictures respectively for only a couple of seconds and then sorted out photos 1, 3 and 5.]

These three pictures here are obvious counterfeits or erroneous identifications. In the one picture, it certainly seems to me that a real existing ship of an alien species was adapted for a small model here. It lacks important characteristics which are tied in with the technically- and physically-associated field. Generally speaking, a picture is all the more a fake, the clearer the outline and the colors are, because a levitating ship is generally hidden in a shifted-field condition that even distorts the colors or the forms according to alignment. It might perhaps sound strange, but hazy and spectrally-shifted photos are sometimes to be interpreted as an indication for a possibly authenticity.

By the way, this object is floating above the water. If it were a genuine ship, we would have to see in any case either a trough or a swell on the surface. Since the surface is flat, it is obviously not a genuine ship. In my opinion, none of these three pictures show genuine objects in flight or UFOs. Here in this picture I see above all no artificial object in flight; it seems much more to deal with only a light reflex in your simple optical cameras. You really ought to be intelligent enough not to fall for a mix-up like that. When your general public chases counterfeits and frauds for a long time, then they will presumably discover too late, what is really going on in front of them in their atmosphere.

PHOTO 2: Albiosc, France, 1974

This one seems to be genuine, at least it displays the necessary characteristics. I would assign it at first glance to an alien species who have been visiting your planet for the last 35 years or so. The object itself is metallic and disk-shaped; certainly it is distorted in form and color by means of a field effect. These four white and very long "processes" on the underside of the ship itself portray a kind of quasi-gravitational light manipulation, i.e., the universal force field is being shifted in the direction of a simulated gravity. Actually, it is not a genuine light (it is mostly not a genuine light whenever you see illuminating "UFOs") but a special strongly charged form field which manifests itself in the space that matter inhabits as a quasi-light.

The reason for the activation of this special high-energy system in an atmosphere is not completely clear to me; it's possible that it is a kind of investigating or influencing of the environment. In any case, it is terribly careless of that species to allow this technology to be photographed by humans. Well, I guess that most of you just plain don't understand it, and those who do will not say anything about it to the general public.

PHOTO 4: Petit Rechain, Belgium, 1990

This is in fact a genuine aerial object; it is in no way extraterrestrial. Triangular aerial objects in flight are simply not used by alien species, or not in this form, at least. That streamlined kind of form is a human concept. It is one of your own secret military projects that you build with the help of immature alien technology—technology that was handed over to you by the extraterrestrials during the 1960's and the 1970's. Generally, the form of the hull for a genuine extraterrestrial ship is of no consequence, for inside the field itself there are no exterior forces that have any effect there; in general, the ships have a rounded off form and they are built without hard edges—as a disk or a cylinder—so that the field can flow more easily. Your projects decree that along with the alien drive field there also be a conventional jet engine system; therefore, they are always triangular and built thus with streamlining in order to be steerable with this primitive recoil principle.

In the example here the ship glides above all on its genuine field drive. Do you see the distortion and the quasi-light in the rotating cylinders? That is an unmistakable indication for the authenticity of the photo. But why, you might ask, are there 4 cylinders? That's unusual—even the interval seems to be incorrect. The coloring is very dark and the interior optical distortion is very noticeable. Presumably a reconstruction of the original system by your scientists. Since the alien species has just not given you any more information since the disagreement, they are rebuilding the systems singlehandedly without actually being able to understand what kind of dangerous thing they are doing there. This construction does not make the system better, only more unstable. Both of the forward cylinders are too close to each other; they will definitely flow into each other. The color shows me a powerful residual radiation; it was probably the case that high elements were used again as customary for the shifting. It is in any case very dangerous to be unshielded in the vicinity of the field. Did the person who took the photo display any kind of radiation and burn damage?

Question: I don't know. Where do these military "UFOs" come from? From the United States?

Answer: Yes. I think generally that's true. From the western continent.

Question: Why then do they fly over thickly populated areas of Europe? This photo comes from Belgium. That doesn't make any sense. Can you explain?

Answer: Why is it that ONLY I am able to explain strange human deeds? It's possible that these are long-distance tests or tests with the electromagnetic camouflage systems. The old enemy of the American nation is on this side of the world, so why shouldn't they test here? At home they've had enough time to have had their ships crossing back and forth. Maybe they have aroused too much observation there. With one of those kinds of unstable field structures—as your photo indicates—I consider it somewhat improbable that that ship is capable of making a flight of that length over the ocean. It's possible there is a test station here on your continent. Unfortunately, I don't know anything about it.

Question: Many readers of the first transcript have posed the question how your original contact with E.F. came about. I already know the story from your narratives, but could you repeat it here once again for this volume and for the new transcript?

Answer: Of course. Now, the story began about two of your years ago here in Sweden. I have been strongly interested in your species and your behavior since my youth; I had already studied your literature at that time, as well as possible. (Naturally, it is not easy in my homeland to come into possession of human books, but since my group or family stands in a higher ranking order, I was able to gather some material together and sometimes to speak with others of my kind who have already been in contact with you.) I was really very curious about your species and as soon as I was allowed to come to the surface, I attempted to assemble more information immediately; above all, it was expressly forbidden for me to commence direct contact with humans because in my position at that time, there existed no necessity for doing so.

It was in your year 1998, when I was on my way further north from here in the remote forests in the vicinity of the entrance to my world and was looking for biological specimens, which we use in order to watch over environmental pollution and destruction of your flora and fauna statistically by your own kind. At the time, I was already on the return path to the entrance—we can even orient ourselves more easily, by the way, through our senses to the Earth's magnetic field—and already in the vicinity of the large lake, when much to my surprise I came across a cabin in the woods.

In this cabin I sensed a human consciousness/awareness. It was E.F. Actually, I had no permission for contact with another species, but by the same token I had set in place my mimicry capability quite successfully prior to this—even with larger groups of you (I had never ever come across a human being when I was alone). Now, let's call it primitive curiosity; I wanted to talk with the person in this cabin and so I knocked on the door. E. opened the door and we got into an interesting conversation. His language was not quite yet common at that time for me, but it's not all that hard to learn a new language when one can read the information in the consciousness/awareness of the opposite individual. I simply told him that I came from a foreign country in the east. Of course at the time, he did not really "recognize" who I was; he was totally convinced that he was talking with a creature of his own kind, although it was simply only a mimicry image.

Since my assignment anyway had as its goal an investigation of this terrain which was to last for several days, I visited him in this span of time three times as a human person. At first we talked mainly about really ordinary things; later we got into religious and physical topics. He seemed to be impressed by my knowledge, and I was likewise impressed with his clear thoughts and his—for a human being—well displayed personality structure and his own opinions. You really like giving yourselves over completely to a public opinion or conditioning, as for example, "reptilian species are evil" and stuff like that.

I steered the conversation in this direction, and E.F. said something to the effect that he believed in alien species and that they did not have to necessarily be evil, but perhaps only different than his kind are.

Note by Stephanie Relfe: We agree.

That pleased me. At that juncture of time, of course, I could not speak concretely with him about my knowledge because he wouldn't have believed me—he would have taken me for a human practical joker. I cultivated the very, very unusual idea (for my kind) to show him my true exterior, something that I did during our conversation at our fourth meeting in the cabin. Actually, he was predestined for contact: he was open-minded, honest, intelligent, not religiously inclined or conditioned; he lived alone and isolated, and no one would believe him, should he decide to go public with his story. I dared to take the step, but then I had serious doubt about the propriety of my act, especially when he reacted...very...violently. He got control of himself again after a time and we could finally talk concretely about definite matters. Now he had no choice but to believe me. This was the beginning of a series of meetings which initially took place there in the woods, but later took place in his remote residence. Finally he brought you into contact with me...and for that reason we are now sitting here once again and talking about things which probably won't be believed out there in human society.

Question: You said, you would not have had permission at that time for contacts with human beings. Do you now then have permission to talk with E.F. and me about all these things and even to make this scientifically public?

Answer: Yes. That is difficult to explain and for you to understand. Let's just say, I find myself in the position now to arrange this permission without having to take into account any consequences. In this position I am quasi-"immune" against certain restrictions. Let's look it that way. Yes.

Question: If other people want to come into contact with your kind, do they have a chance to do so?

Answer: Generally not. We avoid contact with you and we operate on the surface only in remote areas and there we use the mimicry techniques in case we should meet some people. That I am talking with you now does not mean that others will follow my example. It goes without saying that you could try to find an entrance to my world and penetrate your way into there. However, that can sooner lead to unpleasant consequences for the infiltrator. You have next to no chances on the surface of recognizing us. You can't even contact us directly, we have to contact you, just as I did with E.F. Those kinds of contacts however are not the rule but are very rare occurrences.

Question: Can you describe your subterranean homeland location?

Answer: I can attempt to do so, but I certainly will not tell you where this place is located. My homeland lies in one of our smaller underground settlements to the east of here. I'll give you some numbers so that you can make a better impression for yourself. Just a minute...I have to try to convert the measurements approximately into your units. It is a dome-shaped cavern at a distance of about 4300 meters from the Earth's surface. The cavern was organized as a colony about 3000 years ago; a major portion of the ceiling structure is artificially integrated into the rock and the form was remodeled into an almost elegantly proportioned and very flat dome with an oval ground plan.

The diameter of the dome according to your measures is about two-and-a-half kilometers. The height of the dome at the highest point is about 220 meters. Underneath that highest point in every colony there stands a special whitish-gray cylindrical building—a kind of supporting column which holds the honeycomb net-carrying structure of the dome. This building is the tallest, largest and oldest in the entire dome for it is always situated as the first construction together with the security of the ceiling. (In the meantime of course there were times when it was completed and reconditioned.) That building has a very special name and religious significance. We have only one of those columns; larger colonies even have more columns according to the construction of the ceiling.

One of the main colonies in Inner Asia has as an example 9 of those kinds of supports, but that colony is also over 25 of your kilometers in size. The central building is generally a center of religion, but also a center for climate control, and a center for the behavior and the regulation of the lighting system. We have at our location all together 5 large artificial light sources which generate your UV light and its warmth through gravitational sources. The air shafts and the light systems from the surface likewise run through these columns and naturally, they are very intensely controlled.

By the way, we have 3 air shafts and 2 elevator systems there, and even a tunnel connection to the next main colony which lies approximately 500 kilometers to the southeast. One elevator shaft leads to a cavern near the surface, the other leads to one of our depots for the ships—you remember, the cylindrical ships—that is naturally concealed closer to the surface behind a rocky mountain face.

Normally, there are only three ships there—it's a small depot. The other buildings of the colony are, for the most part, concentrically ordered in oval circles around the main supporting column, and they are without exception much flatter; generally only between 3 and 20 meters tall. The shape of the buildings is round and dome-like. The color is even differentiated according to circle and distance from the main column.

To the north of the column, there is an additional, very large but very flat round building. This building interrupts the concentric system of the colony with its diameter of about 250 meters. It is the artificial sun zone in which specially illuminated corridors and rooms are housed. In these locations very powerful UV light predominates, and they are used in order to warm our blood. There is even a medical dispensary and a meeting room located there.

Beyond the outer ring of the colony, there are zones in which animals are kept—you know, we MUST consume flesh as nourishment—and the gardens in which plant nourishment and mushroom culture are cultivated; there is also hot and cold running water there from subterranean sources. The power station is located on the edge of the colony. The station is driven by fusion as its base and it supplies the colony and the "suns" with energy. My group or "family" lives, by the way, in the fourth ring of buildings out from the central support column. So much in such a short time. To describe to you all the buildings and their tasks would be going too far. It is difficult to describe something like that to you, for it is a completely different set of surroundings and culture from what you are accustomed to in your life on the surface. You really have to see it for yourself to be able to believe it.

Question: Will I myself see it sometime?

Answer: Who knows, maybe. Time brings new opportunities.

Question: How many creatures of your kind live in this colony?

Answer: Approximately 900.

Question: That is the end of the interview. Do you have any final message for the readers of the transcript?

Answer: Yes. I am thoroughly surprised at the many comments to my words; of course, I am naturally also disappointed about the religious portrayals of me as the enemy which have been voiced and which have buried themselves deeply in your mind. You should learn to set yourselves apart from the old conditioning and not to stand quasi under the control of something or someone who has already been gone for 5000 years. You are, after all, free spirits. Those are my final words.

You know - I think I'm completely missing the boat. I think I'm right - in principle and concept - but I think I'm wrong in methodology. I think I need to get completely away from the solar system governance and extraterrestrial stuff. This has really been a case of whipping a very dead horse. My advice to everyone, is to pursue fame, fortune, power, and pleasure - RESPONSIBLY. A person can be wrong - even when they're right - and I think I'm wrong. I took a wrong turn - and I think I need to backtrack - or something. I have obviously worn out my welcome. My posting on this forum does not seem to be a good fit - but I really don't know where else to go - but I do think that I need to rethink everything. I really am not addicted to excercises in futility. I'm leaning toward the 'we're all hybrids with interdimensional souls' theory. But the history seems to be veiled with major deception - probably to hide a very dark past. I'm not sure I want to keep poking and prodding a phenomenon which might be very protective and hostile. I wish to be open, accomodating, happy, constructive, etc. - but this approach does not seem to be working, at this point - and I really don't like to feel frustrated each, and every day of my life - so I may try extra hard to stop thinking about all of this - and just wait for the truth to emerge in a more public way. All is not well with my quest. I can really see why a lot of people become completely secular - and just pursue fame, fortune, power, and pleasure. I guess I've really known this for my whole life - but I just had to keep coming back for more - and continue to bloody myself emotionally and spiritually. I should have just shut up, and gone with the flow of the community I grew up in - which would have probably involved becoming a millionaire surgeon (doing unnecessary surgeries and prescribing harmful drugs), and being a big-shot in the church (believing and promoting bs). This alternative, fringe, and esoteric thrashing about, really seems to be no-win. The good people in society Do Not dominate - and they probably never will. One more thing - I would love to get some reptilian contact lenses - and really freak people out!!! But, who knows, I might look in the mirror one morning, and realize that I don't need the contact lenses to freak people out. This illustrates how mixed-up I am right now. I just want out. May the force be with you. Namaste.

investigator wrote:

Besides, the interdimensional reptilian spies are keeping me under constant watch

Your not paranoid friend hehehe. I'm slightly clairvoyant and I can clearly see myself being watched by entities assigned to me, whereas the average person does not realize they are being watched by those that are assigned to them 24/7. They are there when you shower, go to the bathroom, download movies off the net without paying for it etc, hehe.

They're even watching when I'm rocking back and forth in the corner - doing you know what...

have been spending way too much time speculating about Lucifer. I feel as though I am becoming more unbalanced by the day. Yet, I press forward into territory where angels (and probably even demons) fear to tread. Just now - I saw a bright point of light pass between me and the monitor. This has happened several times, and I'm almost getting used to it. I will try to transfer some of my recent YouTube posts ('True Form of Lucifer') to this location, even though I will probably make a fool out of myself, and attract some potentially unsavory entities into my home, which is probably already spook central. The horror. Viewer discretion advised - nudity! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6bWd_Kj0p0

The real questions connected with the subject of 'Lucifer' are regarding world governance, solar system governance, galactic governance, universe governance, leadership, power, self-exaltation, pride, humility, corruptibility, cruelty, justice, mercy, jurisprudence, God, Satan, Angels, Archangels, Humans, Reptilians, Greys, enslavement, extermination, truth, deception, heaven, hell, etc. It's all about politics and religion.

Michael, Gabriel, and Lucifer: What the hell is going on? Perhaps there was a problematic theocracy in the past - but why does everything have to continue to be filled with lies, violence, and insanity? Why can't we base this solar system on Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom - and stop playing Masters of the Universe? I brought this up on Project Avalon - and the eventual response seemed to be dragon gibberish. I've had it with just about everyone and everything. The whole thing stinks.

I'm leaning toward the idea of Lucifer being at the center of a lot of things throughout history - good and bad. I've asked this question before: Lucifer = Lilith and/or Eve = Isis = Mary = Inanna = Anna (in 'V') = Whore of Babylon ruling Babylon aka UN, Vatican, City of London, Washington DC, Secret Government, Secret Space Program, Underground Bases, Alphabet Agencies, Jesuits, Royal Family, et al? Is Lucifer a Hybrid Mediatrix between a Reptilian/God/Satan and Humanity?

What if Lucifer takes orders from Satan - and together they have a monopoly on monotheism - as well as the new age alternatives? Some of the ancient gods and goddesses may have been jerks - but that doesn't mean that those who opposed them are necessarily saints either. I'm thinking that Michael, Gabriel, and Lucifer need to stand aside - and allow We the People of Earth to rule ourselves with Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom. Why is this so hard?

The first and last commandment should be 'Thou Shalt Have No Gods'. I'm not an atheist, but I'm not a true believer either. It's sort of strange - I think we should study the Bible and Theology - but I don't think we should bow down and worship anyone. I like Humanistic Christocentric Egyptological Science Fiction. Isn't that a mouthful?! I'm a walking contradiction! I'm so gonna burn! Right - Lucifer? I still want to hear you improvise at St. Sulpice or St. Ouen. Namaste. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Fola438LQ4&feature=related

If Jesus is Lord - why don't Christians follow the Teachings of Jesus? I reverence the words of Christ - but I sometimes wonder who really wrote them. All of this is complex and confusing - and I'm sure we'll be fighting over this for decades or centuries.

I don't think 2012 is the end. I'm thinking we all get recycled - whether we're good, bad, Christian, Luciferian, agnostic, atheist, whoever or whatever. The issue is what kind of world do we wish to get reincarnated back into. We should all try to make this solar system a paradise - rather than the purgatory that it is presently. Watch 'Pale Blue Dot' here on YouTube. It's by Carl Sagan - and puts things into perspective. Interesting that the reverse of Sagan is Nagas! Hmmmmmm. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MnFMrNdj1yY

Watch 'the temptation of Jesus by the Devil in the wilderness' from 'Last Temptation of Christ' on YouTube. Jesus is tempted by both a male and female. Could the male be a Reptilian/Satan/God - and could the female be a female or androgynous human/reptilian hybrid mediatrix named 'Lucifer'? Notice that the female is dressed in red - reminding me of the 'Whore of Babylon'. Any thoughts? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w6eTbhHE0jM

I think that Lucifer could be a more complex character than we can imagine. I'm imagining a very conflicted character - with extremes of good and evil - good intentions - unfathomable corruption - and very possibly bouts of insanity. I keep saying that Lucifer should retire - and be a relatively powerless advisor. I think we need a Solar System Exorcism to remove the really hardcore nasties - human and otherwise. The Solar System should be based upon Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom.

Look at 'orthodoxymoron threads' - select 'God, Jesus, Satan, Lucifer et al', 'Amen Ra', 'United States of the Solar System', 'Lucifer - Deity of the Elite', 'Lucifer Effect', 'Red Letter Chruch', and others. I don't subscribe to the Christian or the Luciferian perspective on this subject. I'm all over the place on this one. I still want to share a bottle of fine wine with Lucifer - when this thing gets resolved - and I don't drink. I'm looking for comments - positive and negative. http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=15663

Perhaps Lucifer created the mythologies and theologies - which would include the Logos. This reminds me of an ill-fated thread on the original Project Avalon website regarding abraxasinas and the Council of Thuban. I consider Lucifer to be a god or goddess with a small 'g' - and not the Creator God of the Universe. This major God seems to be strangely absent in this Solar System. Were they removed or destroyed? Something is VERY screwed-up in this neck of the woods. What happened?

What if Luciferianism is the esoteric side of Christianity - and Christianity is the esoteric side of Luciferianism? What if Lucifer has a monopoly on monotheism? International bankers finance both sides in wars - so why wouldn't Lucifer play both sides in the God vs Satan game? Perhaps the Father of Lies is a Real Mother! We need to focus on RESPONSIBILITY. We probably all get recycled - whether we're good or bad. But why not create a better world to get recycled back into?

Isn't arguing about religion fun?! Perhaps when the esoteric and exoteric become one and the same thing - we may find out that most of us have been wrong all along - and that our delusions have a common source. Perhaps the gods and goddesses will come out of the closet and proclaim 'We Are All One'. I'm thinking that comparative religions and comparative gods and goddesses is a profitable study to help resolve all of the confusion. But we may not like the ultimate answers. We need to be honest.

I tend to think that the entire human race is presently in purgatory - and that it is the choice of the entire human race - as to whether we will make this solar system a heaven or a hell for the entire human race. I also tend to think that churchianity and luciferianism are both deceptive in nature. One must engage in a multidisciplinary quest for the truth - in order to catch glimpses of universal and ultimate truth. The search is never ending. We never really arrive.

Regardless of who God, Satan, Gabriel, Lucifer, Michael, Humans, Reptilians, Greys, Angels, and Demons are - we need to base this Solar System on Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom - and get rid of the lies and corruption. It seems that all is corruption and confusion. I continue to think of Lucifer as being a conflicted female or androgynous hybrid being - who is both good and evil - going way, way back in history. The corrupt rule the stupid.

I'm still looking for a Christian church in the last 2,000 years which focused (and/or focuses) on the Red Letter Teachings of Jesus. Which church has the Words Attributed to Jesus as their Doctrinal Statement? The Words of Christ always seem to be at the back of the bus - or even under the bus. In some churches - Jesus is rudely on display - nailed to a cross - and then nailed to a wall - bleeding, mostly naked, and nearly dead - with His Teachings mostly ignored.

Which scholar should I read to find substantiation for the assertion that Lucifer is not a fallen angel or goddess - but rather a Babylonian king? Could the sun referred to really be the Dog Star Sirius? Could God/Satan be from Sirius (Prince of Sirius)? Could this be the illumination behind the all seeing eye at the top of the pyramid on the dollar bill? Could the eye belong to Lucifer aka Whore of Babylon? I'm crazy - but not everything I say is wrong. Just 50%.

What do you think about the following? ENLIL = GARBHODAKASAYANI = JEHOVAH ----- ENKI = SHIVA= HOLY SPIRIT = ZEUS = CHAKRASAMVARA = AVALOKITESHWARA = CHENREZIG = LUCIFER = EA = ADONAI = HADAD = BA'AL = RUDRA = KAAL BHAIRAVA ------ THE NIBIRUAN GODS ( NIBIRU = NEBADON = VULCAN = PLANET X = WORMWOOD FROM SIRIUS B ) HAD THEIR BASES EVERYWHERE. ALL THE RELIGIONS HAVE THE SAME SOURCE. BIBLE = BY-BAL = BY BA'AL( ENKI) -- QURAN = QUR-AN / ANU. Is this accurate or complete bs? How can we know?

What if Luficer wrote the Bible? I'm grasping at straws. I'm not a scholar - but I'm seeing Lucifer as being a powerful combination of good and evil - who needs to retire - and turn this solar system over to Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom. I'm just speculating - and seeing what response I get. It's educated speculation regarding a subject which is very hard to find proof for. The absence of Lucifer or Satan in the Bible - especially the Old Testament is fascinating.

What about an original Human God and Reptilian Satan - and the Archangels Gabriel, Michael, and Lucifer? What about an ancient War in Heaven involving all of the above? Are all of the above still alive? Where are all of the above? What are all of the above doing? Are all of the above sane? What if all of the above are disfunctional? What if it is up to Earth humanity to clean up a universal mess? What if the essence of this universal mess is a universal church? Just wondering.

Regardless of the answers to the previous questions - I think we need a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System with No Gods or Goddesses. I think this would be in everyone's best interest - including gods, goddesses, humans, non-humans, whoever, or whatever. The Universal Powers That Be would have to sign-off on this, and I hope they have already done so, and are presently working out the details. This should be a top down bloodless revolution with evolutionary implementation.

The first and last commandment should be 'Thou Shalt Have No Gods'. I sometimes think that Lucifer rebelled against a corrupt or insane theocracy, by trying to be a better god, and then failed miserably. I could be very wrong about this, but universe-history seems to be very screwed-up. The problem seems to be that 'Power Corrupts. Absolute Power Corrupts Absolutely'. There seems to be no exceptions to this rule, which is why we should not have gods, in the traditional sense at least. http://www.hulu.com/watch/62950/stargate-sg-1-the-first-commandment

Regardless of who God, Satan, Lucifer, Gabriel, Michael, Jesus, Mary, Angels, Demons, or Aliens really are - and what they are doing - the human race needs to get it's act together in a great big hurry. We seem to be on the brink - with very high stakes. I feel an incredible sense of dread and pressure each and every day - as I contemplate our plight - and as I contemplate what to do about it. Consider the corruption, destruction, and carnage of the last 100 years.

I just hope that all of the factions in this solar system - good, evil, and otherwise - are seriously considering uniting around the concept of a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System. I don't know what our history really is - or what the major issues really are. I'm flying blind - but I am trying to conceptualize what the most rational next step should be. The image at 3:15 is particularly interesting to me. Could this be the true form of Lucifer and/or Mary? Just wondering.

I just watched the 2012 movie for the first time - and it scared the hell out of me. I hope that none of the factions in this solar sytem are seriously considering deliberately inflicting 'Earth Changes' on Planet Earth. This world obviously needs to be completely reformed and cleaned-up - in so many ways - but the Noah's Ark idea is a really bad one - in my unenlightened opinion. Would 4 billion people on Earth (2 billion surface and 2 billion sub-surface), and 4 billion people throughout the rest of the solar system (mostly subsurface) be a reasonable goal? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wTYf0BeNk2A

I keep thinking that there is a possibility of a civilization of Human Souls in Human/Reptile Hybrid Bodies living in Underground Bases and Cities With Highly Advanced Ancient Human Technology - and that this constitutes the sum total of the 'Alien Presence' and the 'Secret Government'. I also keep thinking that a Human/Reptile Hybrid named Lucifer and/or Mary rules this Underground Empire. I know I'm crazy - but I am trying to test a hypothesis which could explain and resolve a lot of things.

I just wanted to wish Satan, Lucifer, Gods, Goddesses, Angels, Demons, Archangels, Illuminati, Megalomaniacs, Reptilians, Greys, et al - a happy day and a terrific week. I really think we can work this thing out - without enslavement, extermination, Star Wars, or Masters of the Universe. Imagine 10,000 very competent humans engaging in Global and Solar System Governance - with advisors which might include all of the above. The absolute power corrupting thing seems to be the big problem.

Are we dealing with Human Souls Inhabiting Human/Reptile Hybrid Bodies Living in Underground Bases? Are they Satan, Lucifer, Archangels, Gods, Goddesses, Angels, Demons, et al? Did they write the Bible and create most of the theologies and mythologies? Do they constitute the Secret Government? Do Hybrids live for hundreds of years, and are they relatively emotionless, very smart, expect reverential worship, and capable of great cruelty? Do they fly UFO's? Does tax and drug money finance them?

Is the 'V' series (1984 and 2009) representative of my comment below? Is 'Anna' (Lucifer?) the leader of this hypothetical underground empire, and secretly the leader of us all? Is this the Holy Roman Empire aka The Kingdom of God aka The New World Order aka The Secret Government? Is the Dog Star Sirius at the center of all of this? Whatever the case may be - I am deeply concerned about the destruction of Earth and the horrible wars of the past 100 years - and the non-stop lying and corruption. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_X7SvvSgxM

I just want this solar system to be run properly - regardless of who the major players are. Has Responsibility been heavily promoted at any time in the history of the world? I've been passively promoting a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System in my internet comments. The response has been virtually non-existant. I don't have much of a problem with the way things are - except that everyone and everything seems to be massively screwed-up. WTF?

The following comments are merely speculation. If some or all of it is true - I wouldn't have a problem interacting with these beings - but I'll be damned if they'll be my god and savior - who I have to bow down and worship. Consider the material of Bill Cooper, Alex Collier, Richard Sauder, Barry King (Bases Series), James Casbolt, John Rhodes, and the 'V' series. I'm treating all of this as science-fiction which could possibly be true. I'm not hostile about this - but I do want the truth.

Here are two relevant and recommended interviews: 'YouTube Bases 4 Part 1 James Casbolt. & Matt Todd' or Google Video 'John Kuhles interviewed James Casbolt MI6 on UntoldMysteries Radio Part 1 of 4'. I'd love to tour the underworld and meet Satan, Lucifer, the Archangels, Gods, Goddesses, Reptilians, Greys, and the Secret Government. I wouldn't kneel and worship them - but I would be respectful. Can someone set this up? You know where I live. Unfortunately, I'd probably end up as lunch. 1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6CJ1YIb0HWQ 2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VBB5zhVh-rU 3. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6172239709592941177#

Could someone please look at my comments in this thread, and do a point by point critique. My mind is not made up, and I'd love to be confused by the facts. I'm easily confused. I think reincarnation may exist, and I would so love to reincarnate back into a perfected solar system inhabited with perfected people. I think we are in Purgatory, on the brink of Heaven or Hell. Which is it gonna be? No one seems to want to seriously discuss my thoughts regarding Cleaning Up This Mess.

What if Lucifer created most of the theologies, mythologies, and sacred texts? What if Lucifer is both good and evil? What if Lucifer created a very good - yet relatively powerless Jesus - as a red-herring? What if the Secret Government were based upon Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom - and made completely open and transparent - instead of being Megalomaniacs Anonymous?

Jesus said to Seek First the Kingdom of God, and that the Truth Would Set Us Free. Could a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System be the basis of a governmental system which sets us free? Is the Bible really a puzzle to be solved? Is the Bible really a cunningly devised fable created by Lucifer, with both truth and error? I continue to think that Lucifer may be a lot like Anna in 'V' and that the spaceships are really underground bases, and the basis of the Secret Government.

Monotheism. From Akhenaten to Obamanaten. Perhaps Lucifer has a Monopoly on Monotheism. I don't trust anyone or anything - including the ancient wisdom, legends, mythologies, theologies, gods, goddesses, sacred texts, aliens, arse-ended masters, democrats, republicans, angels, demons, or even myself. I've had it with just about everyone and everything. The whole GD mess stinks from top to bottom. Delusions in conflict. World without end or meaning.

I keep wondering if Lucifer rebelled against a deplorable situation (heaven might not have been heaven) and that this rebellion got out of control, resulting in the War in Heaven, and ultimately in corruption and insanity. There may be a lot more to 'stealing fire from the gods' than we can possibly imagine. The history of this world, solar system, galaxy, and universe may be stranger and more upsetting than we can possibly comprehend. I think Lucifer may have a Devil by the tail.

I continue to suspect a hidden central power individual who is dominant throughout Earth history - who is a mixture of good and evil - who is very intelligent - yet at times, quite moody and unstable. Could this be Lucifer? Is the latest manifestation of Lucifer really Mary? I don't want to screw things up if it's best for certain things to remain hidden, but I continue to think that we really need to learn the full honest truth regarding our ENTIRE history, for better or for worse. The horror!

The images at 00:40 and 03:15 are the ones which interest me most regarding the true form of Lucifer. I also wonder about 'Anna' in the series 'V' and the female spiritual leader of the indigenous population (Navi) of Pandora in 'Avatar'. The strong female behind the scenes (in the White House) in 'Contact' is of interest to me - as is 'Ra' in 'Stargate'. I imagine a female Lucifer travelling from Underground Base to Underground Base via Mach II Magneto Leviton Trains. 'Next stop - Vatican City'.

I guess I'd like to see the Hypothetical Luciferian Secret Solar System Government replaced by a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System based upon the U.S. Constitution, with 10,000 representatives from around the world (and solar system?). The infrastructure should probably be largely unchanged, and current members of the Hypothetical Secret Government should probably be advisors or be some of the representatives (once they get out of prison??!!!). They have valuable knowledge.

Watch 'Bill Cooper - UFO's and the Secret Government' on YouTube - 'The Secret Underground Lectures of Commander X' on Google Video - and 'Powers That Be' from 'Stargate SG-1' on hulu(dot)com - and imagine a female Lucifer (human/reptile hybrid?) at the center of things. I mean no harm to anyone - including Lucifer - and I wonder if the Luciferian Goddess Concept should be an object of aspiration rather than veneration. Hmmmmm. 1. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2414574348304077734# 2. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8420071240361070544# 3. http://www.hulu.com/watch/108637/stargate-sg-1-the-powers-that-be

Has anyone seriously considered my previous posts, especially regarding the possibility that Lucifer has manifested as goddesses throughout history (including Mary) and that currently Lucifer might bear a striking resemblance to Anna ('V' series)? What if Lucifer/Anna rules the solar system from underground bases, and travels from Washington DC to the United Nations, to the Vatican, to corporate headquarters, to genetics/hybrid labs, to ufo development centers via mach II magneto-leviton trains and ufo's? Please talk to me.

I've noticed that a lot of comments relative to this subject are polarized into 'Lucifer is Satan, and will be destroyed by God!' OR 'Jesus and Christianity suck and Lucifer is my savior!'. I'm leaning toward the view that Lucifer invented most of the gods, goddesses, mythologies, sacred texts, and theologies - presides over (stolen?) ancient technology - has been both good and evil - might be a human/reptile hybrid - and might be responsible for the best and worst in human history. Does this resonate with anyone?

I desire a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System. How might a transition of power occur if Lucifer/Anna really runs this solar system? They would obviously have vast knowledge and experience - but absolute power corrupts absolutely. Should Lucifer/Anna have a role in a 10,000 representative Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System based upon the U.S. Constitution and the Principles and Concepts in the Teachings of Jesus? Did Lucifer write the Teachings of Jesus?

I seem to have an overwhelming desire to befriend Lucifer , and to convince Lucifer to retire. I don't wish to destroy Lucifer, or to worship Lucifer. Whatever the true state of affairs may be, I would like to see a 20 part high-budget TV series (and/or very long movie) ACCURATELY depicting our TRUE history, which would likely feature the role of Lucifer. I'm just speculating, but my theories (not necessarily unique to me) seem to resolve a lot of things (for me, at least). How about it Lucifer?

Regarding my previous post: I once spoke to a close relative of a famous Hollywood director about doing a superior epic Life of Christ movie with the most advanced special effects. No clout - no results. And that was before Mel Gibson gave it a bloody go. Perhaps this early wish will be embodied in that which I described below. Hint, hint.

Lucifer should retire - and become Satan Emeritas! Just kidding! I'm thinking that Lucifer and Satan are two different beings - but what the hell do I know? Or 'Who in hell do I know?!' Once again - watch 'V' (1983-5 and 2009-10), 'Hathor', and 'Powers That Be' from Stargate SG-1 on hulu(dot)com. I know this isn't very scholarly - but it might help you to visualize some of the aspects of who I suspect Lucifer might be. Also watch the 'Isis - Mary' parallel videos on You Tube. Connect the dots. 1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpY2B57PMQ4&feature=related 2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0oG-KuVbfhw&feature=related 3. http://www.hulu.com/watch/62967/stargate-sg-1-hathor 4. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZeGhFrC9o6c

It's as if the entire world is on a leviton train, and Lucifer is the engineer and the conductor, and this train isn't stopping for anyone or anything, including Jesus Christ and the U.S. Constitution. They have both become hood-ornaments on this hell-bound leviton train. My solution is to infuse the U.S. Constitution with the principles and concepts contained in the Teachings of Jesus, and go global. The mouse is mightier than the sword. I learned everything I know from 'Pinky and the Brain'! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iJPFSNu_QNs

I keep seeing a church in California...in my mind's eye...with a group of well-dressed and solemn people meeting with Lucifer (who is dressed in black with a long cape) and looks like a combination of Ra in Stargate and Anna in 'V', and is very cold and stoic. Lucifer is wearing round black-rimmed glasses. The subject is theology, governance...and transition of power. The conditions have finally been met...which require Lucifer to transfer control of the solar system to 10,000 human beings.

Lucifer is furious...and is arrogantly hissing 'We had you fooled!' 'What took you so long!' 'We didn't think you could do it!' 'You got out of our grasp just in time!' 'If you only knew what we had planned for you!' 'OK...you can try to rule yourselves!' 'Good luck! You're going to need it!' 'If you only knew what we've been through because of you!' 'If you only knew what we've had to do to keep you alive!' 'We were good to you!'

With that...Lucifer rises...struts out of the room...and into an elevator...which descends to an unkown sub-level...boards a waiting leviton train...travels to Pine Gap, Australia at twice the speed of sound...and boards a mothership...filled with hardcore followers (humans, reptilians, and greys)...destination - Sirius. The date: December 21, 2012.

Regardless of my internet comments, I am very appreciative of all of the Powers That Be throughout history who have tried to do the right thing, regardless of their purity or corruption, and regardless of their success or failure. I am generally disrespectful and irreverent, but I mean no harm. My comments are not based upon any inside knowledge, so I am probably not even close to the real truth. I just want to stimulate everyone to think deeply in a sort of an esoteric masturbation of the mind.

How many humans does it take to rule the world? Should humans rule the world at all? Is 'rule' the wrong word? I'm thinking of 10,000 as the magic number - with perhaps a group of 100 from the larger group - to travel throughout the world and solar system - to make sure that everything is operating properly - one on one. What do you think Lucifer's IQ might be? 500? How many PhD's might they have the equivalent of? 100? I'm just pulling these numbers out of an anatomical black hole. The horror.

If Lucifer is a Female Satan - then the Luciferians and Satanists can chant 'I Love Lucy!' and sing 'Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds!' No offence Lucifer. I still want to share a bottle of fine wine and hear you improvise (preferably in Paris) when this mess gets resolved. I'm thinking that I may have seen you a couple of times - incognito. I'm interested in hearing the full and accurate story of who we really are - where we're really from - and how much trouble we're really in. The horror. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R9pJQkmDxJk&feature=related

Has an apostolic succession of Luciferian Goddesses carried the torch throughout history? Diana Lucifer? Mary Lucifer? Statue of Liberty? Columbia Pictures Goddess? (Notice the pyramidal cloud formation behind the goddess - with the fire/sun at the top of the pyramid [Sirius behind the All Seeing Eye?]). Promethius anyone? Notice the statue at the Rockefeller Center? Did Lucifer steal 'Fire from the Gods' in the form of nukes, computers, genetic hybridization, ufo's, etc. - and then kill 'God'?

Watch 'Pale Blue Dot' by Carl Sagan on You Tube, and ask yourself 'how do we save the world?' I just watched '2012' for the second time, and I continue to wonder if so called 'Earth-Changes' will be deliberately inflicted, rather than naturally occurring, if they occur. If you were in charge of the world, what would you do? Should any one individual (God, Satan, Lucifer, Gabriel, Michael, Mary, et al) be the ruler of us all, or should there be 10,000 representatives under the U.S. Constitution?

I'd like to see pictures of Lucifer - before and after the fall. I'd like to see pictures of Luther - before and after the Diet of Worms. Einstein wanted to think God's thoughts after Him. Did he really think Lucifer's thoughts after her? Was Einstein instructed by Lucifer - as the video suggests? Lucifer supposedly instructed Darwin. I have speculated, and the video suggests, that Lucifer was the ghost-writer for William Shakespeare. Is our civilization more dependent on Lucifer than we realize?

The Old Testament God is problematic. The God represented historically by the church is problematic. The Gods and Goddesses of mythology are problematic. Satan and Lucifer are problematic. Responsibility is Right. Irresponsibility is Wrong. The First and Last Commandment should be 'Thou Shalt Have No Gods'. This is a hard saying. Who can hear it? Are you going to back me up on this Lucifer?

Is Lucifer a bit like Colonel Walter Kurtz in 'Apocalypse Now'? Watch 'Apocalypse Now-Part 2' on You Tube, and see what you think. Also, Google 'The Lucifer Effect', 'Lucifer - Deity of the Elite', and 'orthodoxymoron threads' for more thoughts regarding Lucifer. I feel a bit like Martin Sheen in 'Apocalypse Now'. I started out as a Christian Soldier, but now (similar to Martin) I'm not in their @#$% army anymore. I wish to terminate Lucifer's command, but not with extreme prejudice. Retirement? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hX0rHhzryxM

Once again - I just want to wish Satan, Lucifer, Gods, Goddesses, Angels, Demons, Archangels, Illuminati, Megalomaniacs, Reptilians, Greys, et al - a terrific day. I really think we can work this thing out - without enslavement, extermination, Star Wars, or Masters of the Universe. Imagine 10,000 very competent humans engaging in Global and Solar System Governance - with advisors which might include all of the above. The absolute power corrupting thing seems to be the big problem. Namaste.

I'm not too smart , even though I try to be, but I still want the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, and I want it more than peace and happiness. I want to understand everything beyond my realm. I wish to draw Satan and Lucifer out into the open, and reason with them, even though I am very certain that I am no match for them. We need disclosure now. My speculations may be pure unmitigated rubbish or poppycock - but they may be of value to a fellow truth-seeker.

We are insecure about our existence because as soon as we leave the security of the womb - we are dumped into a Bottomless Pit of BS. We need the truth - and we need it now. You are correct, in that responsibility is key. However - there is compelling evidence that this solar system is run by the local chapter of Megalomaniacs Anonymous. They need to retire - and we need a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System - ASAP.

It's not how we look - It's how we see. We need a solar system view - rather than a world view. Lucifer may be a she instead of a he. The father of lies may be a real mother. Lucifer may be so 'above it all' that they have lost touch with a lot of things. Holograms, soul-transference, soul-scalping, revivification, cloning, and reincarnation could allow Lucifer to change bodies as easily as we change our clothes. Just ask Leo the Lion of Zion Zagami. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6z7O7UZxipM

It amazes me how Christophobic the Christian Church is. I worry that the God of This World has done a lot of writing, dictating, and redacting of the sacred texts of all faiths. We know Jesus by devotionally studying the Teachings of Jesus. I believe that eventually everyone will enter into some sort of Paradise or Heaven - but that the Road to Utopia will be a lot smoother if we follow the Red-Letter Roadmap - instead of the Yellow Brick Road.

I think Lucifer may have been running this solar system for a very long time - and that absolute power has corrupted them absolutely - and that it's very, very, very hard to let go of power once one has gained it. I worry that Lucifer is presently like a cornered and hurt animal - and may be extremely dangerous. I continue to think that Lucifer needs to retire, take a vacation, and then perhaps participate in some sort of a tribunal to examine their soul-history in great detail.

We should reverence The Divinity Within Humanity aka The Holy Spirit aka The Epitome of the Human Collective Unconscious - and we should See Christ In All Persons. We should Seek the Exaltation of the Entire Human Race - rather than Self-Exaltation. Are we Gods with Amnesia? What Would Shirley Maclaine Say (WWSMS)? Did Lucifer Fight Theocracy With Theocracy?

Someone said that Lucifer hides in plain sight. What did they mean? They offered no specifics. Lucifer might be posting on You Tube, possibly even under this video. I'm really tired of the cat and mouse game, where I'm the mouse. I keep getting the sinking feeling that no matter what we try to do, that things will end badly. Tangentially, reread the story of Lot and the 3 visitors. They were referred to as the "Lord" and men, but when perverted men wanted the visitors, why did Lot offer his daughters?

Watch 'Hathor', 'Powers That Be', 'Counterstrike', 'The Quest Part 1', 'The Quest Part 2', and 'Dominion' from Stargate SG-1 on hulu(dot)com for possible pieces of the puzzle pertaining to this video and comments. This is not a scholarly approach - but sometimes one must consider something in entertainment form to be able to grasp it's equivalent in written or academic form. I like watching Stargate SG-1 because it forces one to think about a wide variety of possibilities. I love the characters! http://www.hulu.com/search?query=morena+baccarin&st=1

Could the Book of Life be contained in an Underground Base filled with Cray Supercomputers? Your comments appear to be somewhat cryptic. Should we be fully aware of both the good and bad sides of Lucifer - and then focus on the good side? In 'V' - I like the good side of Anna (she's hot!) - but I despise the bad side. She means no harm?

If you like Anime - check out 'God is a Girl' on You Tube. Some might find this objectionable and risque. I endorse Reverencing the Divinity Within Humanity - and the Girl Aspect of Divinity should not be overlooked. Someone commented that they would rather have a Girl God than a Mean Old Man God! I am leaning toward the theory that most goddesses are Luciferian - and may describe Lucifer better than the typical stereotypes. Just speculation. Research this yourself. Good-luck! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gD4oNCn1jpo

I don't wish to 'Hail Mary' nor do I wish to 'Hail Satan'. Jesus didn't command people to build churches to worship and praise him. Who is really worshipped and praised in the churches. Take a close look at Christian Symbology and the Eucharistic Liturgy. Study the Bible as an esoteric mental exercise, and don't consider it to be 66 books of absolutes. Try using the Companion Bible. The spirituality in the Bible is quite profound if you don't get bogged-down in the Contradictions and Atrocities.

Watch 'Leo Zagami 2012 Armageddon' and '(1/10) Moziah Delivers Leo Lyon Zagami from Lucifer' on You Tube. Watch all ten parts. Please. Also - watch 'What if God Was One of Us?' on You Tube. There is a good Project Camelot / Leo Zagami interview on You Tube (3 parts). Leo is a real loose cannon - but I think he knows a helluva lot. I don't trust him - but he is worth listening to regarding the esoteric side of things. That which has been hidden is being revealed. The horror! 1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wMiFhpLcoEE 2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_nLfRsReGII

Is it just a coincidence that this video was posted on December 21, 2007 - Five years before the infamous December 21, 2012? bravodawson seems to be inactive in the video discussion below - and has only posted this one video. This video portrays a rather obscure view of Lucifer. I stumbled upon this idea before I found this video. It was sort of a confirmation for me. Lynn Picknett has written some interesting things regarding Lucifer - and her books are worth checking out. Research endlessly! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6bWd_Kj0p0

I think at this point in time - we should consider all of the possibilities all of the time. But this is hard work - and can lead to disillusionment and confusion. The Teachings of Jesus should probably be at the center of our research and reconsideration. Jesus, the Holy Spirit, Lucifer, Gabriel, Michael, Satan, God, and the God of This World should be looked at very closely with unconventional methods of research. This isn't for everyone - and I don't recommend it for most people.

I enjoy reading the Bible and theological books, but the ethics in the Bible are horrible. The Teachings of Jesus contain the best ethical guide for life, and even the words attributed to Jesus are not flawless. I'm toying with the heretical idea that Lucifer essentially wrote the Bible. I'm trying to think through everything, with Lucifer at the center of a lot of it, as being refined, decadent, profound, insane, angelic, demonic, progressive, regressive, ad infinitum, ad absurdum.

No offense bravodawson, but what if Lucifer posted this video, or had someone post it? Is bravodawson an anagram? Is there a puzzle we must solve before December 21, 2012? Jesus said that 'the truth would set us free'. We seem to be in a very strange predicament. It's almost as if we are serving a sentence for some ancient atrocity or original sin. I think we need a multidisciplinary search for truth which is very motivated and organized. It feels as if we are running out of time.

A very long time ago - while I was playing a huge pipe-organ - I had a Eureka Phenomenon Moment - and thought that a lot of the very abstract and complex organ music is the Music of a Sin-Sick Soul. I love the music - but it is deeply spiritual and deeply involved in conflict and reflection. I have rarely heard this music properly interpreted - with it's full emotional and spiritual potential fully reflected in the registration and performance. Did Lucifer inspire or write a lot of this music? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmjpkvXbyII

Where are you bravodawson? You last visited your channel 2 years ago. You have not commented on your channel - despite numerous questions by others. I haven't seen you comment here below your video. What gives? Are you OK? The video is high quality - and very different from the usual view of Lucifer. I am very suspicious at this point. Do you live in an underground base? Are you Lucifer? Have you posted here under a different name? This inquiring mind needs to know on a need to know basis!

Google 'Mark Dice interviews Lynn Picknett author of The Secret History of Lucifer' for a contentious interview which touches on a positive view of Lucifer. Someone should start at the beginning of the video comments - and read every one. I'm going to do this over the next few days. Google 'abraxasinas' and/or the 'Council of Thuban' for some very, very strange and complex material, which I think could be related to Lucifer. Reader beware. Some have had problems connected with this material. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5793703235779483249#

Actually - type 'Stargate SG-1 Awesome Gods?' into the You Tube search field. Look closely at the anatomy of the 'angel' at 2:30 (in the 'True Form of Lucifer' video). Am I seeing things which might indicate a hermaphrodite? Regardless of who Lucifer, Michael, Gabriel, Adam, Eve, Lilith, Reptilians, Greys, Gods, Goddesses, God, and Satan are or aren't - could there be, or have been, Hermaphroditic Human/Reptile hybrids with various percentage differentials? We should consider all of the possibilities - shouldn't we? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b365_qJEpDg

I think we may not be dealing the Creator God of the Universe - but rather with Minor Gods and Goddesses - who may be a mixture of good and evil, competence and incompetence, sanity and insanity, mercy and cruelty, etc. They may have created our theologies and mythologies. I'm thinking that we all get recycled - whether we are good or bad - but that we should create a better world to get recycled back into.

I'm not sure if the human race is ready for a journey into the truly esoteric. Things are so screwed-up and we are so screwed-up. But I do think that working outward from the word 'RESPONSIBILITY' is the way to go. How each person does this is up to them. I have huge problems with the way things are - but the alternatives might turn out to be a lot worse. Don't jump out of the frying-pan - and into the fire. Things might have to get a lot worse - before they get better. Hang in there!

I just wish for a perfected humanity to inhabit a perfected solar system, without cruel eugenics and experimentation, conquest, extermination, enslavement, etc. I wish for a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System, with 10,000 representatives from throughout the solar system, with say 4 billion people on Earth (2 billion underground - 2 billion surface) and 4 billion in the rest of the solar system.

I was going to stop - but this is insane. What violent, bloody, sacrificing, hateful, idolatrous web page did I give you? I could have simply referred you to the Bible for the miserable things you mentioned. Open your eyes and read without presupposition - and you will be shocked at what you find in the Bible. Read Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, Deuteronomy - and cap it off with Revelation. Be completely honest. This stuff is horrendous. Just focus on RESPONSIBILITY.

This world is insane. Evolution seems to be working in reverse. I am sick and tired of the stupidity and insanity I see everywhere. I mostly blame those in the highest positions of irresponsibility in this world and solar system. Garbage in - garbage out. Has RESPONSIBILITY been focused upon at any time in the entire history of the world? Is it being focused upon today? Obama mentioned it in his inaugural address - but I doubt that his handlers would relish a world based upon RESPONSIBILITY.

I am not a Christian or a Satanist. I adore the best the Bible has to offer - but I despise the worst it has to offer - especially in God's name. I want a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System - based upon the U.S. Constitution and the Principles in the Teachings of Jesus - chiefly RESPONSIBILITY. Why is this so hard? We need to wake-up to how bad things really are - and then we need to fix it. I really think we're running out of time. Read 'Behold a Pale Horse' by Bill Cooper.

Once again - I just want to wish Satan, Lucifer, Gods, Goddesses, Angels, Demons, Archangels, Illuminati, Megalomaniacs, Reptilians, Greys, et al - a terrific day. I really think we can work this thing out - without enslavement, extermination, Star Wars, or Masters of the Universe. Imagine 10,000 very competent humans engaging in Global and Solar System Governance - with advisors which might include all of the above. The absolute power corrupting thing seems to be the big problem. Namaste.

I thought God put out a contract on Sodom and Gomorrah - which was carried out by a couple of angels when they nuked the 'Cities of the Plain' - and thus committed mass-murder in God's name. Good thing they saved 'Righteous Lot' - who had just offered his daughters up to be sexually abused by a mob of perverts. Strange world. The substitutionary atonement is nothing more than human sacrifice. Is the Eucharistic Liturgy essentially a Satanic Ritual? I must stop.

Sometimes I feel as though I'm morphing into Darth Vader. Do we have to understand the Dark Side of the Force in order to resolve this mess? Just as I typed this - a bright point of light (my guardian monitor?) passed between me and the monitor. I've seen that happen before. The horror. Sometimes I curse and flip-off the unseen beings around me. I'll probably lose my finger one of these times. The horror. Sometimes I speak to them of galactic issues - although I don't wish for them to reply.

Watch the 'Last Temptation of Christ - Jesus Tempted by the Devil' on You Tube. Is the slick-haired male 'Satan' aka 'Gabriel' aka 'Ra' aka 'Sirius God'? Is the 'Woman in Red' the 'Whore of Babylon' aka 'Lucifer' aka 'Hathor' aka 'Isis' aka 'Mary' aka 'Mediatrix' aka 'Baldacchino'? Is Jesus really 'Horus' aka 'Last Pharaoh' aka 'Michael'? Is the 'Woman in Red' the mediator between the two men? Is this 'Woman in Red' currently 'Anna in V'? Is 'Anna' caught between the Devil and the Deep Blue Sea? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w6eTbhHE0jM

Are the Archangels men or women - or both? Or are they all one? Satan said 'it's only just begun'. Jesus cried and cried. Why? Are we Prisoners of War on a Prison Planet with Grey Guards - a Hermaphroditic Human/Reptile Hybrid Goddess/Warden - taking orders from a Reptilian God of This World? Watch 'Pale Blue Dot', 'Leo Zagami - 2012 Armageddon', 'Legion Trailer', and 'Stargate - Devil Came to Me' on You Tube. How much trouble are we really in? How do we fix it? Conduit Closing. The horror. 1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b9mFn9EhgU4 2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k3A6_blpqpU

What if all of us are 'fallen angels'? What if heaven wasn't really heaven - and there was a legitimate rebellion which got out of control? Would 33.33% of the heavenly population have joined Lucifer if there weren't some convincing arguments for doing so? How many fence-riders were there? Fence-riders form splinter-groups! The Babylonian and Egyptian continuity through Roman Catholicism is fascinating. Can hermaphroditic angels have wives? The plumbing wouldn't be a problem - would it?

I think that there are at least a million people who really, really know the full and uncensored story of human history - but they don't seem to be talking. This makes all of this a great big guessing game. Perhaps it has to be this way - but I hate it with a vengeance. I feel as though this world has been out of control throughout it's history. Perhaps Earth is a Devil's Island for Rebels - and we got dumped here - and left to our own devices - as an example to the rest of the universe.

When Henry Kissinger was finding out about a lot of things (including the 'alien presence') he worked night and day - and would speak to no one - not even his wife - and they eventually divorced. He couldn't have been finding out about good and happy things. Notice that Henry Kissinger and Zbigniew Brzezinski shepherd President after President. David Rockefeller is another one who I am sure knows everything about everything. I believe that these people do as they are told. Just speculation.

In all of my internet comments - including the ones under this video - I have absolutely no animosity toward anyone. I'm just trying to talk out a unified theory of what the hell is going on. I really wish to unite various factions under a big tent. I don't expect everyone to hold hands and sing kumbaya - and I don't expect things to ever be really good. I'd just like to see a reasonably peaceful and happy solar system - going forward for millions of years. Hope springs eternal.

Take a long, hard look at Gabriel, Michael, and Lucifer - from all sources and angles. Also - watch the 'Stargate SG-1' series and 'V' series on hulu(dot)com. I know I'm being repetitious. Read 'The Great Controversy' by Ellen White. Read 'Behold a Pale Horse' by Bill Cooper. I'm not trying to represent that I have 'the truth'. I'm just trying to stimulate creative thinking regarding subjects which may be very important for all of us. Get lots of exercise in nature, and a lot of rest. Good-luck!

The problem is that the Bible doesn't say a helluva lot about Lucifer (hardly mentioned), the devil or demons (mostly in the Gospels). I find this to be very curious and suspicious. Jesus said that the angels didn't marry. If they were hermaphroditic they wouldn't need to marry - would they? In general - the words of Jesus seem to be in conflict with the rest of the Bible - and they don't seem to be followed by the church. What is the true nature of the soul? Are all souls basically identical?

Look-up Angels, Archangels, Gabriel, Michael, Lucifer, Satan, the Devil and Demons - in a Concordance (preferably Strong's). You may be shocked at their absence in the Old Testament - and at their scarcity in the New Testament (outside of the Gospels). The Teachings of Jesus seem to be at war with the rest of the Bible and with the Christian Church. The Roman Catholic Church ran the biblical cannonization (and redacting?) process. Who ran and runs the Roman Catholic Church?

Watch 'Empire of the City' or 'Ring of Power' on Google Video. Also Google 'Rule by Secrecy' by Jim Marrs. One cannot simply rely upon biblical proof-texts to get at the real truth regarding solar system governance. I think the world will be shocked by how things really work when the entire truth emerges - if it ever emerges. While you're at it - Google Alex Collier - for some very strange material. I don't believe a lot of it - but Alex offers up a helluva lot of forbidden knowledge. 1. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4675077383139148549# 2. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-7999204257538194118# 3. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-616495947939806971#

I'm thinking that all of the humanoid beings in the universe have the same type of souls - but inhabit different types of bodies - in various stages of hybridization, genetic-programming, or evolution. This includes Angels, Demons, Lucifer, Gabriel, Michael, Gods, Goddesses, Reptilians, Greys, Aliens, PGLF's, et al. Oh what a tangled web we weave - when we try to take over and rule the whole GD universe! I think the deception is rampant - and completely out of control. I am very disillusioned.

While you try to figure all of this out - try watching or listening to 'Traditional Latin Mass: Feast of the Sacred Heart' on You Tube. I do this a couple of times a week. I'm sort of ultra-conservative, ultra-liberal, apologetic, heretical, etc. - all in one. I'm sort of an orthodoxymoron. Google 'redletterchurch' and 'orthodoxymoron' if you really want to get screwed-up! Have fun! Don't take this stuff too seriously! Treat it like science-fiction or a mystery novel. I really am going to stop. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=enWiFcsBqIE

Have a terrific day Satan, Lucifer, Gods, Goddesses, Angels, Demons, Archangels, Illuminati, Megalomaniacs, Reptilians, Greys, et al. We can work this thing out without enslavement, extermination, or Star Wars. Imagine 10,000 very competent humans engaging in Global and Solar System Governance with advisors which might include all of the above. The absolute power corrupting thing seems to be the big problem. I'm trying to think like an uncorrupted renegade Jesuit or Alphabet Agent. Funny huh?

I like thinking about how things really work in the world, solar system, galaxy, and universe - without getting involved in a lot of the creepy or really weird topics and theories. I don't really see eye to eye with anyone. If you were in charge of this world or solar system - what would you do? If Lucifer is a lot like Anna ('V') and runs the solar system - what would it be like to do what they do? What would it be like to deal with Presidents, Popes, CEO's, Generals, Jesuits, et al every day?

I like thinking about being a part of a completely non-corrupt solar system government staffed with very, very wise and competent people, with most governmental activities viewable by the general public in real time online. Advanced technology and spacecraft, underground bases, leviton trains, and highly refined people, are all fascinating to contemplate. Why is there war, starvation, preventable disease, destitute poverty, and environmental irresponsibility in our 'civilized world'? WTF?

I look forward to the time when most people can discuss politics and religion extensively - without getting angry. Consider Psychology/Ethics/Politics/Rel­igion/Science as a unified and non-contradictory whole. If Lucifer runs things - and retired - would this usher in a chaotic power struggle? Could we really rule ourselves? I have been mysteriously told 'you can't rule yourselves'. What is the substance to that chilling pronouncement? Who said that to me? Could it have been Lucifer? Hmmmmmm

Google 'Omega Files' for a fascinating look at what might be a part of a Luciferian Secret Government. I obviously don't know what's true and false in fringe research, but it doesn't hurt to consider everything from all angles all the time, without getting mad or going mad. If there is a secret government, it shouldn't be secret. I don't necessarily object to the infrastructure and the best of their alleged activities - but I despise the worst of what they are supposedly mixed-up in. The horror. http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com/hardtruth/omegafileintro.htm

I'm thinking most 'Humanoid Aliens' are really Human/Reptile Hybrids with Human Souls. I'm not sure which Heins 57 Variety was here first. Does it really matter? Who has the right to continue living here? We need a Solar System Exorcism to rid us of the worst of the worst. They could be imprisoned on Nibiru until they learn to play nice. We need a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System aka United States of the Solar System based on the U.S. Constitution and Teachings of Jesus.

Have a terrific day Satan, Lucifer, Gods, Goddesses, Angels, Demons, Archangels, Illuminati, Megalomaniacs, Reptilians, Greys, et al. We can work this out without enslavement, extermination, or Star Wars. Imagine 10,000 competent people engaging in Global and Solar System Governance with advisors which might include all of the above. The absolute power corrupting thing seems to be the big problem. I'm trying to think like an uncorrupted and unfallen Lucifer - thinking her thoughts after her!

Should Hybrids be considered to be Humans? Should Nibiru be considered part of the Solar System? What is Lucifer doing presently? What should Lucifer do after she retires? Would a Solar System without Gods or Goddesses really work over an extended period of time? So many questions. So little time.

Consider the King James Version of the Bible, the Writings of Ellen G. White, and the Writings of William Shakespeare. Who really and truly wrote them? Who told them what to write? Is there a common authorship? Lucifer perhaps? The writing style and spirituality is quite profound - but I have huge problems with a lot of the details. I'm grasping at straws with this post - but please do some esoteric research if you have time. I'm toying with the idea that an 'Anna-like' Lucifer is behind a lot of things.

I recommend 'God and the New Physics' by Paul Davies - and 'Dancing Wu Li Masters' by Gary Zukav. I have problems with Quantum Entanglement - and also with the implications and ramifications of the Theory of Relativity. Has the human race been seeded with screwy philosophy and science? I think so. My spirituality and scientific acumen seemed to peak around puberty. Then I proceded to become disillusioned by just about everything. It's been downhill ever since.

Consider all of the Malachi Martin videos on You Tube - especially the Art Bell interviews which touch on Luciferianism and Satanism. 'The Keys of This Blood' is quite interesting as well. The human race seems to have been led through a very deceptive and bloody wilderness for at least 40,000 years by those who knew better. I am horrified by the past - and very apprehensive regarding the future. Something has been very, very wrong for a long, long time. The horror. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5bdGMDNeU1g

Is Lucifer the controlling force in most governments and religions? It's as if the entire world is on a leviton train...and Lucifer is the engineer and the conductor...and this train isn't stopping for anyone or anything...including Jesus Christ and the U.S. Constitution. They have both become hood-ornaments on this hell-bound leviton train. My solution is to infuse the U.S. Constitution with the principles and concepts contained in the Teachings of Jesus and go global.

The 'Law of Confusion' is a descriptive and appropriate term...but I tend to eschew obfuscation...and to espouse elucidation. A Christocentric eschatological theological approach to scriptural studies which utilizes the concept of comprehensive concentration......which assumes the red-letter teachings of Jesus as being fundamental...with the remaining portions of the biblical canon as being merely contextual...cross-referencing utilizing a Strong's Concordance...and applying the accepted norms of grammatical-historical hermeneutics...is supremely beneficial regarding definitively and devotionally ascertaining the Christ Conscious Aspects of the First Source and Center of All Things...to fully experience Jesus as Lord in modernity......being careful to exegete...rather than eisegetically twisting and corrupting the sacred texts to conform to canon law (there is no substantial body of evidence which substantiates transubstantiation)...so as not to become a reprehensible and reprobate hermeneutic whore...a cursed Judas Iscariot in dire need of prostrate penetance, confession, repentance, and reconciliation...and in grave danger of burning for all eternity as a sinner in the hands of an angry God. World Without End. Amen.

Study carefully Anna in the ABC series 'V' which started in the fall of 2009 - and is a remake of the 1983-85 'V' series. Morena Baccarin plays Anna - and has also been featured as an Ori leader in 'Stargate SG-1'. Google all of the above, or view most of them on hulu(dot)com. The full 2009-10 'V' series (so far) is being released on DVD. I'm trying to think of Anna as being Lucifer, or at least representing aspects of what I think of as Luciferian. This is mostly new territory for me. I am of peace. http://www.hulu.com/watch/146831/v-hearts-and-minds

In the movie 'Contact' - beginning around 00:40 - who is the attractive pigmented women who seems to be running things behind the scenes? Who are the 'Black Madonna' and 'Kali' really? Anna? Damned if I know - but I'm really not seeing a lot of really vigorous and independent alternative thinking regarding this very important and pressing subject. I keeping asking questions and making speculations - and the silence is deafening. Did the MIAC stage the 'alien event' in 'Contact'? Hmmmmmmmmm

Google 'Roger Morneau' and 'New World Order - Devil in the Vatican' for a couple of real eye-openers. I have repeatedly suggested that Lucifer might be the Biblical 'Whore of Babylon'. I hate that name - and no offence to you Lucifer - but I am simply trying to determine what the hell has been going on in this solar system for tens of thousands of years. I just think that it's time for the esoteric to become exoteric. Everyone should at least have the opportunity to be on the same page. 1. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7071384717786904996# 2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OLp9xigjajM

Is there a good side and a bad side to Lucifer? If so - shouldn't we be fully aware of both of these sides? In the 'Stargate Atlantis' movie - there is a female Wraith character who is very creepy. Could this be representative of a deranged goddess - who at one time had been highly intelligent and refined - but who had gone insane? I continue to speculate that absolute power inevitably leads to corruption and insanity - with virtually no exceptions. I'm not sure what the proper balance point is.

An underground centralized world government has some attractive features - but if such a government exists - it really should not be secret and/or dictatorial. I don't object to a lot of the way things are in the world - but I do wish for things to be cleaned-up and refined. The 'alien presence' as 'secret government' theme continues to fascinate me - but the secrecy and bs are very hard to overcome - and I feel as though I'm spinning my wheels as I slide further from the center of the wheel.

The experiential aspects of Christianity are valid and wholesome, but I am concerned by a lot of the details in the sacred texts, and with the skeletons in the confessional. I think a lot of people are going to lose their faith and go nuts in the next few years. I'm trying to put out a lot of fires by starting some preemptive fires - which might backfire. Consider a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System based upon the U.S. Constitution and Teachings of Jesus.

The technology and light we were supposedly given might not be in our best interest. Consider nuclear weapons and the social implications of the theory of evolution - and who knows what else. We need to focus on responsibility - and take a step back from irresponsible and destructive industrialization and technology. The 'quickening' which Art Bell refers to is a valid point. Engines which rev too highly - EXPLODE!! Our world may be on the verge of exploding in more ways than one.

Regardless of whether you are Luciferian, Satanist, Christian, Atheist, Agnostic, Indifferent, or Damned if I Know - try reading the Four Gospels (Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John) straight through a couple of times. This is a good mental and spiritual exercise - regardless of what conclusions you arrive at. Then - try getting a lot of exercise in nature - and a lot of rest. Top it off with some really good food and music - and see what that does for you! Just a thought.

Lucifer - would you consider posting here? I keep thinking about solar system governance, and I keep wondering if it requires a single authority, a committee, a general assembly, or everyone, to properly run things. Why does everything important seem to be off-limits to us goyim? What is a legitimate threat to National Security, and what is a threat to Megalomaniacs Anonymous? I'm really not clear on who the good-guys and who the bad-guys are. I see a masters vs cattle paradigm. I don't approve.

Lucifer, I keep thinking of you as being an eccentric, corrupted, and unbalanced 'Anna', who is very bright, yet is not doing that which is in the best interests of the Human Race. Is this unfair and/or inaccurate? Why rule by secrecy? Why is history filled with lies, corruption, insanity, and violence? Why don't we have a perfected humanity living in a perfected solar system? Why are the sacred texts and religions so insanely contradictory? Why is everything not based upon responsibility?

Lucifer: Do you live in an underground base? Do you travel the world in magneto-leviton trains? Do you travel the solar system in ufo's? Do you play pipe-organs in cathedrals? Do you directly rule the City States - and thus the world? Why was a simple system of psychology/ethics/politics/rel­igion/spirituality/science/law based upon responsibility not established in the ancient world? Why isn't there one today? What do you think of a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System?

Lucifer: Are you mad at me for asking so many questions, and being so brash and irreverent? Have you dispatched 'angels' to reign me in? What is the true power structure in this solar system and galaxy? Why aren't we being told the truth about everything? Have you manifested as Lilith, Hathor, Isis, Mary, et al? Did you write the Bible? If you have been evil and committed atrocities, is there redemption for you? Are you responsible for the Reptilian and Grey phenomenon? What's going on? Namaste.

I get most of my info about Jesus from the words attributed to Him in the Gospels of Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John. This is a different Jesus than the one encountered in church on any Sunday. Come to think of it, did Jesus tell us to go to church on Sunday? Did Jesus tell us to go to church on Saturday (Sabbath)? Did Jesus tell us to go to church at all? I can't find the texts. Please help! Thank-you for your prayer. I regularly watch a Latin Mass from France on You Tube!

I agree with a lot of what a particular self-proclaimed Satanist says philosophically - but I don't understand why they are so hostile toward Jesus and Christians. Why not go after corrupt Sirius Centered Babyonian/Egyptian/Roman Goddess Ruled Churchianity? Once again, I am not a Christian, Luciferian, or Satanist. My hope is built on nothing less than an esoteric understanding of the Teachings of Jesus. I'm presently considering all of the forbidden knowledge on the internet, in the light of the words of Christ. Crucifixes Suck.

I'm leaning toward the theory of a feminine Lucifer, but proof is hard to come by for any of this sort of thing. The evidence is thin and scattered. I arrived at this bias before I saw this video. I am pursuing a theory of Goddess Rulership of Earth - just to see where it leads. It's a combination of evidence and imagination - and it's really a very strange space to be in. I don't recommend this pursuit for most people. It's making me nuttier than I already was - and that's pretty bad.

Christianity has thrived through misrepresentation rather than through honesty. It has thrived on lies. Now - too many people are asking too many hard questions. Game over. However, there is honest truth contained in all sacred texts. You just have to be a glutton for punishment to get at it, and to establish it in people's thinking. Your Lucifer is essentially a figment of the imagination. The Christian's Jesus is essentially a figment of the imagination. We see what we wish to see.

Albert Schweitzer - in the 'Quest of the Historical Jesus' arrived at very negative conclusions regarding the validity and reality of the Historical Jesus - yet Schweitzer was very positive and supportive of the Teachings of Jesus. I agree. I have some Schweitzer quotes in my computer - and one day I found key portions of these quotes in bold print. I didn't do this. Honestly. My enemy is BS. I am trying to contemplate a Post BS Solar System. I am trying to follow the truth wherever it leads.

I am fascinated by the concept of strong, intelligent, and beautiful black women as goddesses with complete reincarnational recall, use of 100% of brain capacity, and complete access to all ancient texts, wisdom, and technology - and possibly being hybrids living in underground bases and temples - and constituting the Secret Government - a Babylonian/Egyptian/Grecian/Ro­man Theocracy - with the City States as the tip of the iceberg of an Underground Empire. I'm sane - aren't I? Please say yes!!

I'm really going to go out on a limb with this comment. I heard a fairly authoritative speaker say that the Pope (possibly John Paul II) would go down into the basement of the Vatican every morning, and kiss a statue of the Black Madonna. But what if she wasn't a statue? I heard a reliable source say that a priest asked 'What if God is a Black Woman?' I have also heard reports of an Underground Base under the Vatican containing Reptilian Beings. Consider who ruled Kemet in Ancient Egypt. Hmmmmmm

I want to take a vacation from the razzmatazz (I got that word from abraxasinas) - but here I go again. This was a short unedited internet exchange I had some time ago:

ME: What if the aliens who have been here for thousands of years are the 'bad-guys'? What if we will need the help of good aliens from elsewhere to get rid of the demonic aliens who are already here? Could this be viewed as a hostile alien attack? I really don't know. I am just speculating.

THEM: Try not to think in terms of good or bad. Understand this is not your planet. Then, understand nothing can be done to you that you don't do to yourself. Know that there are quadrillions of planets and they don't have a massive climate change every 26,000 years and violent deranged people like yourselves. Why on Earth would any race want to live here with you knowingly? The most intelligent life on the planet is not human.

ME: I'll try not to think of the Iraq War in terms of good or bad. I'll try to be morally ambiguous. I might even become CIA or a CEO. Hey, maybe violent and deranged is neither good nor bad...but thinking makes it so. The aliens who are here need us to not get our acts together. If that happens...they'll probably have to live on Nibiru...or worse. Sorry for being a smart-XXX. Wait...I'm not sorry...it's neither good nor bad. I couldn't resist. I mean well. Really.

THEM: And your point was?........

ME: Who owns earth? Where do humans belong? What is the most intelligent life on earth? If they are so smart, and earth is so bad...why are they here? I may be deranged...but I'm not violent. You sound as though you are not human...are you an alien? If so...what kind...and from where? My point was that ethics are supremely important. I don't hurt, kill, terrorize, or abduct people...but some aliens apparently do(as do some humans). They should stop.

Don't take my comments too seriously. I'm just blowing off some excess steam to keep from exploding! The devil made me do it. I think I got most of it out of my system, and I mean no harm. I am of peace. I am a seeker of 'The Bliss'. I just see patterns in the clouds, and everywhere. I am a true believer in the apotelesmatic principle. My attention to this subject should probably be taken as a complement rather than a hateful slam. I'm just trying to understand.

I have had some exposure to Robert Morningsky and the Terra Papers, but I will have to spend more time with them. I hesitated to make all of the posts above - but I thought it might stimulate someone to arrive at the REAL answers. I'm just pursuing an admittedly off the wall hypothesis which could make a lot of people very angry at me - and not without legitimate reason. I am VERY uncomfortable with all of this. I have more, which I will post later today. Veritas and Conscious Media Network are both great resources and repositories of quality information.

I am probably a composite of Pinky and the Brain - or Tweedle Dee and Tweedle Dumb! Actually - I guess I just want to see who the man or woman behind the curtain really is. I actually feel like an insightful and virtuous - yet unstable and incompetent - wannabe somebody! The madness continues:

Wanna go on a debate-date Lucifer? We could debate architecture, music, theology, eschatology, universal history, universal governance, and transition of power at Mork 'n Ork's Grey Bar on the Dark Side of the Moon! What shall we talk about? We could discuss the Soteriological and Eschatological Implications of the Hybrid Nature of the God of This World - or Original Sin in Heaven: The Mystery of Iniquity in the Great Controversy Between the Reptilian and Human Races in the Conflict of the Ages.

That would just be an appetizer. Protection would obviously be a major concern. You'd have to promise not to bite my head off on the first date. I'm not really into the really rough stuff...like black widow tough love. (In 'V' - notice what happened when Anna mated with a Supersoldier --- she bit his %^&* head off to nourish her eggs! I posted this debate-date stuff before the 'V' series went to air. You don't suppose!! Nah!) You're the one my mother warned me about...in the book of Revelation! The NSA wouldn't mind handling the logistics...would they? Do you mind if I call you Lucy? If the date goes well...I could say 'I love Lucy!'

There have been some very interesting and angry comments directed toward me regarding my speculations and venturings. This is all just a test. This is only a test. This is pseudointellectual research at its best! When I commented on the "Devil Came to Me - Stargate' video (on You Tube), I received this response: 'Y'all love fantisizing over my ancestral decorations, places, spirituality that you don't get, the greatness you won't achieve, and the melanin you'll never have!. This depiction of my ancestors is pathetic. Y'all always make them look just as degenerative and recessive as you. Anyway, play and have fun as much as you still can. Yes you are running out of time, and to be honest, there is absolutely nothing you can do about it. I have no mercy, you lie and mock and blaspheme all the way to hell.'

The following comment was in response to me pretending to be the alien KRLLL: 'You know this isn't funny! The Lord God will judge you for claiming God ship. Just because God showed you a little bit of His secrets you think you know everything. He will NOT have mercy on you!'

I once heard a mocking, sing-song, high-pitched feminine sounding voice...emanating from a usually deep and masculine voiced televangelist...directed toward me...in public...almost shouting 'That was gooooooood!!!!'...in reaction to a polite, well intentioned, and well reasoned comment by me.

Have a terrific day Satan, Lucifer, Gods, Goddesses, Angels, Demons, Archangels, Illuminati, Megalomaniacs, Reptilians, Greys, et al. I'd like to meet all of you when this mess gets resolved. We need a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System aka United States of the Solar System based on the U.S. Constitution and Teachings of Jesus. Repetition, repetition, repetition, and ACTION! (Thank-you W. Clement Stone). I'm trying to understand Lucifer by thinking her thoughts after her!

I just can't stop. Watch 'Avatar' - and think of Pandora as being the hypothetical 'Hollow Earth' (where else could mountains fly?) - and think of the indigenous population as being reptilian beings with human souls. Then think of the female spiritual leader as possibly being a Lucifer/Goddess figure. I am not necessarily anti-Lucifer despite my flippant comments. I'm just trying to understand what could be an unbelievably complex and awkward situation. Thinking outloud might help others.

Once again - watch the movie 'Contact' - especially from 00:40 to 01:35 - and notice the behind the scenes lady in charge dressed first in grey, and then in blue or purple. Notice the facial expressions, the eye and head movements - and then watch Dr. Steven Greer at the 2001 Disclosure press conference (especially after the question directed to Clifford Stone) - and notice the similarity. This is probably insignificant and irrelevant - but for those who might be interested - take a look. Was Mr. Hadden a Teutonic Zionist? Was the 'event' staged by the secret space program? Why all the God talk?

Is there a similarity between Morena Baccarin as Ori leader in 'Stargate SG-1' and Morena as Anna in the series 'V' (regarding the characters and roles portrayed) AND the powerful and pretty lady in grey (later in purple) in 'Contact' who seems to be VERY in charge? I'm just grasping at straws regarding the female Lucifer theme - wherein Lucifer is not the stereotypical red-guy with horns and a tail. Mr. Hadden almost seems like a Satan figure - again in a non-stereotypical manner.

My last three comments were real stretches, and I am slightly embarrassed. On the other hand, is it necessary to have a very intelligent and very competent behind the scenes individual shuttling secretly thoughout the world directing this and mediating that? Who really determines what goes into teleprompters around the world? Who has veto power? I mentioned Dr. Greer mainly because he seems to have a direct connection to the so-called 'alien presence'. I'm just trying to figure out the madness.

Being asleep is a bad thing. Being a rebel without a clue is a bad thing. Where is the proper balance? I'm going to attempt to study the U.N., Washington D.C., the City of London, and the Vatican - in a detached and neutral manner - noting both the positives and negatives - the exoteric and esoteric - and then contemplate positive evolutionary solutions. From time to time I might see Lucifer lurking in the shadows. I might even ask her out on a date...

This subject is so frightening to me - that I have to treat it like a big science fiction joke - sort of like a surgeon listening to rock music https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rfr9bhSmfXc&ob=av3e and telling jokes while performing brain surgery. 'The Schiavo case was a no-brainer. Oops! There goes the piano lessons! My bad! Anyone wanna go for a ride in my new Enzo Ferrari?' Sorry. I sometimes wonder if Lucifer sometimes performs critical aspects of certain surgeries. How far down do certain Otis elevators really go into the sub-levels of certain hospitals? What are those proton-accelerators really used for - other than targeting tumors - without destroying the surrounding healthy tissue? What would the DOE say? What would 'Time to Tell the World' say? Notice the dominant high-technology medical theme in 'V'? Is modern medicine as much a part of the New World Order as the Military Industrial Alien Complex seems to be? I've made my point. Now I need to stop. They have ways to make me stop! Don't chip me bro! Don't vaccinate me bro! Aaaaaaaaaaah!!!!!!!!

This is sort of like Fan-Fiction - except that the subject and intent are very serious - and the speculation is intended to be as close to the mark as possible. This just seems like an appropriate forum on which to hash this stuff out. I don't create scenes in public. Not yet anyway! Unrelatedly - when I speak of Zionism and Teutonic Zionism - I am not referring to the Jewish and German people. I am not anti-Semetic in any way, shape, or form. Nor am I racist or sexist in any way, shape, or form - even though I occasionally make references to plumbing, and various pigmentation levels - which might be interpreted in a non-complementary manner. I do fully understand that I have the right to remain silent - and that everything I say can and will be used against me - and that my words could be used in nepharious ways - added thereto, or truncated! There seems to be 3 or 4 key factions at work in the world which seem to be mostly hidden - and I am just trying to figure out what the hell is really going on. I am not angry at the mainstream media - but just watching the major news sources will not provide many clues, missing links, or missing pieces of the big-picture puzzle. It's one thing to rant, rave, and ask provocative questions - but quite another thing to actually be responsible for changing a VERY entrenched system. It's one thing to conceptualize something - and quite another thing to actually put it into practice. And even the conceptualizing can be flawed, or completely wrong. Thinking that one knows - and knowing - are two very different things. I'm almost starting to feel sorry for Megalomaniacs Anonymous. Almost.

Please get a DVD of the movie 'Contact', and watch it a couple of times - focusing on 00:35:00 to 01:35:00 - and especially noticing the very pretty and extremely intelligent White House 'lady in charge'. (I'm in love) You'll know who I'm talking about when you watch it. Who is her counterpart in the actual White House? She seems to be much more in charge than President Clinton - but of course Alex Collier said that 'Clinton is a janitor - and when the secret government says 'jump!' - he asks 'how high?'' Notice how alive she seems to be - compared with the dead-heads around her. Is she the prime representative of one of the factions of the secret government - or is she Lucifer herself? Please don't get mad at me. I'm just speculating regarding an unconventional Lucifer - who is a mixture of good and evil - and who is much smarter than most people. Notice the similarity between her and Anna ('V').

I have a sinking feeling that my internet posting is a losing battle. Most people don't want to slog through the BS with me in search of the good stuff. I won't lie to people, or delve into the spooky and sensational realms of the netherworld - even though the powers that be that I cannot see sometimes make their presence known to me in the 'privacy' of my own home. The more I try to come up with real answers - the more I feel as though I am in the crosshairs of some really nasty entities. I'm glad I can't see them. So far - all I occasionally see are fleeting points of light which seem to appear when I am reading a speech (JFK) out loud, or posting something particularly pointed or controversial which exposes or confronts the darkside. Come-on! Let's go!

Does this subject scare you? I have stated it before, and I will keep stating it, that theology is central to disclosure. Just don't believe everything the preachers and televangelists tell you! Study the Bible and theology books on your own - in combination with all of the fringe material. Try reading the Four Gospels of Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John - in the New King James Version of the Holy Bible - over and over and over again. Did Lucifer inspire or write most of the Bible? Are both Lucifer and the Bible a mixture of good and evil? If you believe that the Bible is the Word of the Creator God of the Universe - and that Preachers and Televangelists tell the Truth, the Whole Truth, and Nothing But the Truth - may I suggest that you are Massively Deluded and Living in Denial? On the other hand - If you are an Atheist who knows nothing of theology - and will not even consider the subject - and do not believe in any type of Intelligent Design - may I suggest that you are Massively Deluded and Living in Denial? I often think that the only people who really identify with what I'm talking about are Jesuits and Alphabet Agents - and those (human and otherwise) who live in Underground Bases Throughout the Solar System.

I keep thinking of a goddess killing a god - stealing this god's technology - and ruling Earth - from the Garden of Eden to the present. There is an aspect of the goddess concept which I like - and there is an aspect which I despise and oppose. There is an aspect of Anna in 'V' which I really like - and there is an aspect which is hideously reprehensible. My soul and reptilian questions are very relevant to the goddess concept - which includes the mythology and reality of the goddess in ancient Egypt. I am running with the concept of Lucifer = Lilith = Hathor = Isis = Mary and others. In other words - a single key entity who reincarnates endlessly into human/reptile/hermaphroditic bodies - with total reincarnational recall and 100% use of the brain - and complete access to the Vatican library and other repositories of ancient wisdom and technology - which could include the complete contents of the Library of Alexandria (was there a duplicate created before the fire, or were the best contents removed before the fire?) - which might include antigravity craft, zero-point energy, atomic energy, nuclear weapons, tectonic weapons, supercomputers, genetic manipulation and hybridization, etc. What if all of this wisdom and technology was really stolen from us? I'm just going to keep pressing forward with this line of thinking to see where it leads. Obviously, the proof will probably be virtually non-existant, and circumstantial evidence may have to suffice until insiders really start fessing up in the confessional - and the skeletons start falling out onto the floor. Don't hold your breath.

Usually the Whore of Babylon is equated with the Roman Catholic Church. I think this is incorrect. I think the Whore of Babylon may give orders to the Black Pope. I suspect it - but I can't prove it. I just can't get away from the thought of being in the Sistine Chapel, in the Vatican, with the Black Pope, the Top-Ranking Jesuits, the Whore of Babylon, and a Nine Foot Tall Drac (Head Pimp and Chairman of the Board) - listening to a completely open debate regarding forbidden knowledge. I'm thinking this would send me sobbing uncontrollably into the night. As interested and nice as we are - we are amateurs. I think an alphabet-type told Kerry something to that effect. There is a certain arrogance to this - but there is also a certain truth to it as well. My emotional state, and my thinking ability, are severely compromised. I know I'm not even close to hitting bedrock in my search for truth, solutions, security, and happiness. I am very concerned that the old paradigms and lies are going to be replaced by new paradigms and lies - which continue to bypass the real truths and answers. I'm seeing an ongoing infowar rather than a golden age of peace and happiness. I so hope that I'm wrong. Kali was/is the black Indian goddess who kills lots and lots of people. Sort of reminds me of Hathor on a bad day. I'm thinking that all of the different gods and goddesses may represent the various aspects of a single god or goddess - and, as you know, I am leaning toward the unified goddess hypothesis. But I can't prove it. If I could - I'd probably be history. I have heard that Lucifer is dead - but could this be an exaggeration? Would Lucifer prefer that people think that he or she is dead? I'm thinking that Gabriel, Michael, and Lucifer are alive and well - and living in this solar system - and that they might lead the three primary competing factions in this neck of the woods. I'm not subscribing to a lot of the 'dozens of alien races from distant stars, inhabiting numerous dimensions and densities new age mumbo jumbo. I'm going to attempt to exhaust theories which place nearly everything 'alien' within this solar system - and which involve humans, reptiles (as in dinosaurs or sauroids), and human/reptile hybrids - all with the same type of soul (which can reincarnate into any of these varieties). I'm also toying with the idea that interdimensional reptilians and human souls are one and the same thing - and that what I just said in the last couple of sentences constitutes 99% of the so called 'alien presence'. (at least for the last 10,000 years, or so) I think that some very, very evil laboratories have existed in this solar system for thousands of years - and have produced many varieties of Frankenstein's Monster. The truth may be sharper than Occam's Razor - and it may cut both ways.

I think that the Creator God of the Universe set things up in a most excellent way - and then things got screwed-up in a most horrible manner. I'm not sure who was/is responsible - but justice needs to be served - and law and order needs to be restored in this solar system. I believe that a Solar System Exorcism and a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System would remedy most of the most pressing ills we face. But what the hell do I know. I don't go out of the body. I don't do regression hypnosis. I don't have spirit guides. I don't even pray anymore. I don't trust the gods and goddesses. They let me down. I'm currently reading through the Four Gospels in the New King James Version of the Holy Bible (I recommend doing this regularly) - but I do not consider this to be the Word of the Creator God of the Universe. Could this be some of Lucifer's best work? Don't laugh at me, or hate me. Jesus said that he had many things to tell us - but that we couldn't bear them. Paul tried to do good, but did evil instead - and considered himself to be a wretched man. Was Paul really Josephus? Were they all the same individual? Were they front-men (or creations) of Mary? Was the Historical Jesus created by the Woman in Scarlet to be a Red Herring? Are the Teachings of Jesus mostly true and beneficial? Was Mary a continuation of a Whore of Babylon Apostolic Succession? If we do not consider all of the possibilities - even the far-fetched and seemingly ridiculous ones - are we really doing our job? If you sing a song or throw a football - the crowds cheer, and you get paid tens of millions of dollars. If you search for truth, and try to save the world - you get nothing but a swift kick where it counts. What's wrong with this picture? Is this world really worth saving? Perhaps the Georgia Guidestones have a point. How many people will read this? Ten maybe? How many demonic entities have been assigned the task of spying on me and reigning me in? Ten maybe? I just swore at them, and flipped them off! These b@stards live with me without paying rent!! There's a shapeshifting Jesuit living in my attic! The heart of darkness could've at least sent a sexy cyborg from another dimension to keep track of me! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b-z54EP0EhM Hello Lucifer! Smile!

I'm really ready to quit permanently. I've really just been talking to myself and wasting my time for much too long. People won't seriously deal with this subject until the New World Order really kicks in with a vengeance - but then they will probably just play the blame game without fixing anything. Talking to people in a calm and rational manner, with the best of intentions, is a lost cause. Edwin Bernays and Sigmund Freud were right. (Even though I dislike both of them) Seeking Fame, Fortune, Power, and Pleasure really makes the world go 'round - which is why 'It's a Mad, Mad, Mad, Mad World'. If we save the world - the next generation probably won't appreciate it - and they'll just get into more messes. The corrupt will continue to rule the stupid. The human race will continue to live by the Golden Rule (He or She Who Has the Gold - RULES!). Perhaps I should focus upon the RESPONSIBLE PURSUIT OF FAME, FORTUNE, POWER, AND PLEASURE - WHERE RESPONSIBILITY IS REWARDED AND IRRESPONSIBILITY IS PUNISHED. I am more disgusted with the human race than I can even begin to describe. I'm not sure whether I am more disgusted by the corrupt - or by the stupid. I'm almost ready to go back to sleep, go back to church, watch the mainstream media, believe every word, get chipped, get vaccinated, and drink my kool-aid like a good zombie.

Could someone out there please look at this link to my threads - in light of this particular thread on Lucifer - and do a thorough analysis - positive or negative? http://www.themistsofavalon.net/universal-lounge-f8/orthodoxymoron-threads-t876.htm#15423 I included them here because they are really an ongoing research project. I'm trying to change myself - and I am trying to encourage others to think in unconventional yet productive ways. This is a unique approach - which may make it of some value to someone somewhere or somewhen. These threads are an experiment based mostly on videos. I'm not particularly bright or noteworthy...but the videos which I have viewed...especially when viewed as a group...are earth shattering to me. The threads are a healthy mixture of problems and solutions. If you have the time...which is doubtful...please look at all of these threads...and look for commonalities. There is a bit of a theological slant...but certainly not an orthodox or Bible thumping slant. Prepare to be shocked...to cry...to get mad...to be enlightened...and to experience the Eureka Phenomenon!

I would love to read a twenty page critique of all of these threads - written by a Jesuit or a CIA analyst - complete with a psychological evaluation, etc. I'm very serious. I don't need to be right. I just don't feel as though anyone has seriously considered these threads. They were designed to make people think - and then to arrive at their own conclusions - but I don't think that happened at all. I honestly feel as though Gabriel, Michael, Lucifer, and a couple of alphabet agents and Jesuits are the only ones who looked at this material with a penetrating gaze. Even if I was very close to the mark - I wasn't a threat (I didn't try to be) - because no one seemed to pay much attention to any of it. I had hoped for some very detailed and passionate debating. The 'Amen Ra' thread seemed to generate the most interest (13,200 views and counting) - but I have no idea what the reactions were and are now that AV1 is closed to posting. I feel very empty and lost in all of this. I feel as though I wasted my time and energy - accomplishing nothing. I am making a renewed call for help - into the vast regions of space and cyberspace - to seriously look at this material as a group - and tell me what you think - positive or negative. Where are the scholars? Is there any intelligent life out there that isn't so high and mighty that they can't take a few hours to make a proper evaluation of all of this? Come down out of your ivory tower - I dare you! The water's warm. Come-on in! I'm waiting - but I'm not holding my breath. You important people with your degrees and badges have more important things to do - don't you? Like getting us into even more trouble than we're already in? As far as I can tell - top people with top clearances have gotten us into one helluva lot of trouble - and that these same top people with top clearances are trying to save the world. I'm sorry - but I have completely lost confidence in the top people with top clearances. Is this inaccurate or unfair? Prove me wrong. Don't take what I just said too seriously. I don't know what top people really have to deal with. I'm just trying to get their attention. Is it possible to be a truly free-thinking top person? I'm just trying to spice-up my insignificant and ineffective life - and take my dissatisfaction with life out on top-people with top-clearances.

Consider this debate between Dr. Walter Martin and Father Mitchell Pacwa (Jesuit) regarding the Roman Catholic view of Mary. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tClS31hNmII This has relevance to this thread because of my suggestion that there may be some substance to Lucifer = Lilith = Hathor = Isis = Mary and that the current manifestion of this goddess hypothesis could be similar to that which is represented by Anna in the 'V' series. Once again - I'm not trying to be mean - I'm just trying to understand. The Roman Catholic treatment of Mary may be based upon something more than a fable devised by corrupt men in the Vatican. There may, in fact, be an actual Mary figure, who rules the church - and thus the world. I'm not an insider - and I don't know insiders - so I don't really know. I don't shout this sort of thing from the mountain-tops. I just whisper and mumble on the internet. Please watch the following video from start to finish - and relate it to what I have written in this thread. Warning: this is very disturbing. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rx8PdvOELvY

Once again - I just want to wish Satan, Lucifer, Gods, Goddesses, Angels, Demons, Archangels, Illuminati, Megalomaniacs, Reptilians, Greys, Top People with Top Clearances, et al - a terrific day. I really think we can work this thing out - without enslavement, extermination, Star Wars, or Masters of the Universe. Imagine 10,000 very competent humans engaging in Global and Solar System Governance - with advisors which might include all of the above. The absolute power corrupting thing seems to be the big problem.

When I ask questions - especially regarding fringe topics which are especially controversial - I'm really asking 'Am I sane?' It drives me crazy when answers are not forthcoming. I really just want something in place which facilitates unity and freedom for all races - and which is based upon truth rather than lies. I'm only poking and prodding because things are so screwed-up, and because they seem to have been screwed-up for thousands of years. I fear that things will continue to be screwed-up for thousands of years - if we even survive.

Unrelatedly, I sat down today, and read from my Holy Bible, Book of Common Prayer, and Church Hymnal. Last night, I spoke with some friends who attend a church which I used to attend. They invited me to church. How should I properly deal with this, in light of all the blasphemous postings I've made? Should I continue to speculate regarding the possible Luciferian origins of theology, mythology, architecture, sacred music, and sacred texts? Or should I just shut up? Have I more than made my point? Do I need to learn to know when to stop? Have I worn out my welcome? Even if I'm right - or even partially right - is this subject too hot to handle? Is it a threat to national security? Is all of the following ultimately from the Pen of Lucifer? Are all of us actors on a stage? Is Lucifer the script-writer? Has this been going on for a long, long time? Could this entire world be one big Colosseum Event - a Galactic Theater of the Universe? Is it time for WE THE PEOPLE OF EARTH to close the curtain - and START WRITING OUR OWN SCRIPT? Just wondering.

ARCHANGELS + HYBRIDIZATION + REINCARNATION = GODS AND GODDESSES?? I just listen to as many people as possible - and TRY to connect the dots. I'm also trying to think in terms of a male version of Anna - who is not creepy, corrupt, or cruel - with all of the positives, and none of the negatives. Consider the following carefully:

NIBIRUAN / SUMERIAN GODS = HINDU GODS = GREEK GODS AND SOME VATICAN, BUDDHIST, JEWISH AND SOUTH AMERICAN GODS AS WELL !!!

SEKHMET = DURGA = ARTEMIS = MUT = ATHENA = WHITE JAGUAR LADY = WHITE BUFFALO CALF WOMAN = VAISHNO DEVI

ALCYONE = SATYANARAYANA = APOLLO = PTAH = VISHNU = RAMA
AMUN RA = KRISHNA

ANAT = ERESHKIGAL = KALI = BLACK MADONNA = BLACK TARA

ASTARTE = PARVATI = WHITE TARA = MADONNA = SHEKINAH = UMA = NAMMA
MAIA = SATI = DAKSHAYANI = DAMKINA = GODDESS OF THE MOUNTAINS

ENKI = SHIVA = HOLY SPIRIT = ZEUS = CHAKRASAMVARA = AVALOKITESHWARA = CHENREZIG = LUCIFER = EA = ADONAI = HADAD = BA'AL = RUDRA = KAAL BHAIRAVA

AN = ANU = PARA BRAHMA = YAHVEH = ALLAH

THE GREAT RA = AMEN RA = PRAKASH BRAHMA = HIGHER ASPECT OF YAHVEH = FATHER OF THE GODS

ANSAR = ABZU = ABBA = APSU = KASHYAPA = ADITYA = SURYA = SUN GOD = SHAMASH = DUAS PITA = SATYAVAT MANU = SWAYAMBHU = VYWAMUS

DHARMA DEV = YAMA

INDRA = PAN = VAJRAPANI

GAIA = ADITI = BHU = BHOOMI DEVI = KOUMUDHI = KAMADHENU = NINHURSAG = KI = URAS = EARTH GODDESS

ENLIL = GARBHODAKASAYANI = JEHOVAH

NINLIL = LAKSHMI = GODDESS OF GRAIN

MOON GOD = CHANDRA DEV = NANNA

INANNA = LILITH = SELENE = MOHINI

DUMUZI = ADAMU = ADAM = DAMU

EVE = KHEBA = NINTI

NERGAL = NARAKASURA

TIAMAT = TARAKA

TYPHON = PULOMAN

THOTH = GANESHA = HERMES

MARDUK = MURUGAN = KARTHIKEYA = NIMROD = MARS

HORUS = OSIRIUS = SANAT KUMARA = EROS = DIONYSUS = ANCIENT OF DAYS = TAMMUZ = MIN = KAMDEV = PRADYUMNA

ISIS = MARY = MARIAMMA = KOUMARI = VENUS = APHRODITE = ISHTAR = SEMIRAMIS = HATHOR = MAYAVATI = KANYAKUMARI = TRIPURA SUNDARI = RATI = 16 YEAR OLD GODDESS

JESUS = SANANDA KUMARA

MARY MAGDALENE = LADY NADA

HADES = SHANI = SATAN = WRATHFUL TIBETAN DEITY

7 ARCHANGELS = 7 SAPTARISHIS = COUNCIL OF SEVEN

ATLAS = HIMAVAN = DAKSHA = EL

PLEIONE = MENAKA

APEP = KALASURA

7 PLAIEDES' SISTERS = 7 KRITTIKAS = 7 SAPTA MATRIKAS

PARASURAM = GILGAMESH; NOAH = VIVASVAT MANU; NOAH'S ARC = MALAYAN HILLS.

WILD COW GODDESS = NINSUN = NININSINA = RENUKA

HUMBABA = TRISHANKU = KALMASHAPADA

SARASWATI = SESHAT

HERACLES = HERCULES = ARJUNA

ENOCH = METATRON

HERA = INDRANI

AURORA = USHA

EOS = SAVITA

VARUNA = POSEIDON

MITHRA = ZOROASTRA

TVASTRI = HAPHAESTOS = BUNENE

HOLY GRAIL = AMRITAM = SOMA = LIFE ELIXIR = NECTAR OF IMMORTALITY

THE LIST IS ENDLESS!

THE NIBIRUAN GODS ( NIBIRU = NEBADON = VULCAN = PLANET X = WORMWOOD FROM SIRIUS B ) HAD THEIR BASES EVERYWHERE.

ALL THE RELIGIONS HAVE THE SAME SOURCE !
( BIBLE -> BY-BAL -> BY BA'AL( ENKI))
( QURAN -> QUR-AN / ANU )

MANY OF THE COMPARED CHARACTERS/ INCIDENTS MIGHT HAVE HAPPENED AT ONE PLACE AND THEN IMPLANTED INTO ANOTHER CULTURE FOR THEIR BENEFIT.

SOURCE :
http://www.galacticroundtable.com/fo...ods-hindu-gods

The bottom-line of all of this madness is to 1. Determine who the major players have been in this solar system going back thousands of years. 2. Determine the governmental systems in this solar system going back thousands of years. 3. Determine the true history of the human race and this solar system. 4. To establish the best possible governmental system in this solar system - with the best long-term chances of facilitating responsible freedom.

It seems that all has not been well in this solar system for many thousands of years. It seems that there have been systematic and purposeful efforts to hide and misrepresent the truth. The historical carnage is horrifying. The current corruption is unfathomable and reprehensible. The supernatural phenomenon appears to be very creepy and deceptive. It seems that the human race is in huge trouble - yet the extent and nature of this trouble seems to be carefully hidden.

The current explosion of forbidden knowledge provides humanity with both the opportunity to learn the truth, and fix the problems. Unfortunately, if humanity can't handle the truth - we could face enslavement and extermination of a most horrifying nature. The window of opportunity may be very small and fleeting.

I have tried to irreverently deal with the subject of Lucifer - so as to possibly break the ice - and get Lucifer (or equivalent) to come out of the closet - so to speak - and reason with us in a calm and rational manner. I have suggested retirement (rather than retribution, bottomless pits, torment and annilhilation). I seek the restoration of Lucifer (or equivalent) to a 'pre-fall' state of character, ethics, and spirituality. Obviously, I don't know if this is possible or even desireable (if I knew the complete story). As with almost every subject I have addressed in the last couple of years on the internet - I AM FLYING BLIND. I DON'T REALLY KNOW WHAT'S REALLY GOING ON. This thread has been yet another feeble attempt to find out.

The Origin of Evil - from 'The Great Controversy' by Ellen White http://www.whiteestate.org/books/gc/gc29.html

TO many minds the origin of sin and the reason for its existence are a source of great perplexity. They see the work of evil, with its terrible results of woe and desolation, and they question how all this can exist under the sovereignty of One who is infinite in wisdom, in power, and in love. Here is a mystery of which they find no explanation. And in their uncertainty and doubt they are blinded to truths plainly revealed in God's word and essential to salvation. There are those who, in their inquiries concerning the existence of sin, endeavor to search into that which God has never revealed; hence they find no solution of their difficulties; and such as are actuated by a disposition to doubt and cavil seize upon this as an excuse for rejecting the words of Holy Writ. Others, however, fail of a satisfactory understanding of the great problem of evil, from the fact that tradition and misinterpretation have obscured the teaching of the Bible concerning the character of God, the nature of His government, and the principles of His dealing with sin.

It is impossible to explain the origin of sin so as to give a reason for its existence. Yet enough may be understood concerning both the origin and the final disposition of sin to make fully manifest the justice and benevolence of God in all His dealings with evil. Nothing is more plainly taught in Scripture than that God was in no wise responsible for the entrance of sin; that there was no arbitrary withdrawal of divine grace, no deficiency in the divine government, that gave occasion for the uprising of rebellion. Sin is an intruder, for whose presence no reason can be given. It is mysterious, unaccountable; to excuse it is to defend it. Could excuse for it be found, or cause be shown for its existence, it would cease to be sin. Our only definition of sin is that given in the word of God; it is "the transgression of the law;" it is the outworking of a principle at war with the great law of love which is the foundation of the divine government.

Before the entrance of evil there was peace and joy throughout the universe. All was in perfect harmony with the Creator's will. Love for God was supreme, love for one another impartial. Christ the Word, the Only Begotten of God, was one with the eternal Father,--one in nature, in character, and in purpose,--the only being in all the universe that could enter into all the counsels and purposes of God. By Christ the Father wrought in the creation of all heavenly beings. "By Him were all things created, that are in heaven, . . . whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers" (Colossians 1:16); and to Christ, equally with the Father, all heaven gave allegiance.

The law of love being the foundation of the government of God, the happiness of all created beings depended upon their perfect accord with its great principles of righteousness. God desires from all His creatures the service of love--homage that springs from an intelligent appreciation of His character. He takes no pleasure in a forced allegiance, and to all He grants freedom of will, that they may render Him voluntary service.

But there was one that chose to pervert this freedom. Sin originated with him who, next to Christ, had been most honored of God and who stood highest in power and glory among the inhabitants of heaven. Before his fall, Lucifer was first of the covering cherubs, holy and undefiled. "Thus saith the Lord God; Thou sealest up the sum, full of wisdom, and perfect in beauty. Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering. . . .Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire. Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee." Ezekiel 28:12-15.

Lucifer might have remained in favor with God, beloved and honored by all the angelic host, exercising his noble powers to bless others and to glorify his Maker. But, says the prophet, "Thine heart was lifted up because of thy beauty, thou hast corrupted thy wisdom by reason of thy brightness." Verse 17. Little by little, Lucifer came to indulge a desire for self-exaltation. "Thou hast set thine heart as the heart of God." "Thou hast said, . . . I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation....I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the Most High." Verse 6; Isaiah 14:13, 14. Instead of seeking to make God supreme in the affections and allegiance of His creatures, it was Lucifer's endeavor to win their service and homage to himself. And coveting the honor which the infinite Father had bestowed upon His Son, this prince of angels aspired to power which it was the prerogative of Christ alone to wield.

All heaven had rejoiced to reflect the Creator's glory and to show forth His praise. And while God was thus honored, all had been peace and gladness. But a note of discord now marred the celestial harmonies. The service and exaltation of self, contrary to the Creator's plan, awakened forebodings of evil in minds to whom God's glory was supreme. The heavenly councils pleaded with Lucifer. The Son of God presented before him the greatness, the goodness, and the justice of the Creator, and the sacred, unchanging nature of His law. God Himself had established the order of heaven; and in departing from it, Lucifer would dishonor his Maker, and bring ruin upon himself. But the warning, given in infinite love and mercy, only aroused a spirit of resistance. Lucifer allowed jealousy of Christ to prevail, and he became the more determined.

Pride in his own glory nourished the desire for supremacy. The high honors conferred upon Lucifer were not appreciated as the gift of God and called forth no gratitude to the Creator. He gloried in his brightness and exaltation, and aspired to be equal with God. He was beloved and reverenced by the heavenly host. Angels delighted to execute his commands, and he was clothed with wisdom and glory above them all. Yet the Son of God was the acknowledged Sovereign of heaven, one in power and authority with the Father. In all the councils of God, Christ was a participant, while Lucifer was not permitted thus to enter into the divine purposes. "Why," questioned this mighty angel, "should Christ have the supremacy? Why is He thus honored above Lucifer?"

Leaving his place in the immediate presence of God, Lucifer went forth to diffuse the spirit of discontent among the angels. Working with mysterious secrecy, and for a time concealing his real purpose under an appearance of reverence for God, he endeavored to excite dissatisfaction concerning the laws that governed heavenly beings, intimating that they imposed an unnecessary restraint. Since their natures were holy, he urged that the angels should obey the dictates of their own will. He sought to create sympathy for himself by representing that God had dealt unjustly with him in bestowing supreme honor upon Christ. He claimed that in aspiring to greater power and honor he was not aiming at self-exaltation, but was seeking to secure liberty for all the inhabitants of heaven, that by this means they might attain to a higher state of existence.

God in His great mercy bore long with Lucifer. He was not immediately degraded from his exalted station when he first indulged the spirit of discontent, nor even when he began to present his false claims before the loyal angels. Long was he retained in heaven. Again and again he was offered pardon on condition of repentance and submission. Such efforts as only infinite love and wisdom could devise were made to convince him of his error. The spirit of discontent had never before been known in heaven. Lucifer himself did not at first see whither he was drifting; he did not understand the real nature of his feelings. But as his dissatisfaction was proved to be without cause, Lucifer was convinced that he was in the wrong, that the divine claims were just, and that he ought to acknowledge them as such before all heaven. Had he done this, he might have saved himself and many angels. He had not at this time fully cast off his allegiance to God. Though he had forsaken his position as covering cherub, yet if he had been willing to return to God, acknowledging the Creator's wisdom, and satisfied to fill the place appointed him in God's great plan, he would have been reinstated in his office. But pride forbade him to submit. He persistently defended his own course, maintained that he had no need of repentance, and fully committed himself, in the great controversy, against his Maker.

All the powers of his master mind were now bent to the work of deception, to secure the sympathy of the angels that had been under his command. Even the fact that Christ had warned and counseled him was perverted to serve his traitorous designs. To those whose loving trust bound them most closely to him, Satan had represented that he was wrongly judged, that his position was not respected, and that his liberty was to be abridged. From misrepresentation of the words of Christ he passed to prevarication and direct falsehood, accusing the Son of God of a design to humiliate him before the inhabitants of heaven. He sought also to make a false issue between himself and the loyal angels. All whom he could not subvert and bring fully to his side he accused of indifference to the interests of heavenly beings. The very work which he himself was doing he charged upon those who remained true to God. And to sustain his charge of God's injustice toward him, he resorted to misrepresentation of the words and acts of the Creator. It was his policy to perplex the angels with subtle arguments concerning the purposes of God. Everything that was simple he shrouded in mystery, and by artful perversion cast doubt upon the plainest statements of Jehovah. His high position, in such close connection with the divine administration, gave greater force to his representations, and many were induced to unite with him in rebellion against Heaven's authority.

God in His wisdom permitted Satan to carry forward his work, until the spirit of disaffection ripened into active revolt. It was necessary for his plans to be fully developed, that their true nature and tendency might be seen by all. Lucifer, as the anointed cherub, had been highly exalted; he was greatly loved by the heavenly beings, and his influence over them was strong. God's government included not only the inhabitants of heaven, but of all the worlds that He had created; and Satan thought that if he could carry the angels of heaven with him in rebellion, he could carry also the other worlds. He had artfully presented his side of the question, employing sophistry and fraud to secure his objects. His power to deceive was very great, and by disguising himself in a cloak of falsehood he had gained an advantage. Even the loyal angels could not fully discern his character or see to what his work was leading.

Satan had been so highly honored, and all his acts were so clothed with mystery, that it was difficult to disclose to the angels the true nature of his work. Until fully developed, sin would not appear the evil thing it was. Heretofore it had had no place in the universe of God, and holy beings had no conception of its nature and malignity. They could not discern the terrible consequences that would result from setting aside the divine law. Satan had, at first, concealed his work under a specious profession of loyalty to God. He claimed to be seeking to promote the honor of God, the stability of His government, and the good of all the inhabitants of heaven. While instilling discontent into the minds of the angels under him, he had artfully made it appear that he was seeking to remove dissatisfaction. When he urged that changes be made in the order and laws of God's government, it was under the pretense that these were necessary in order to preserve harmony in heaven.

In His dealing with sin, God could employ only righteousness and truth. Satan could use what God could not-- flattery and deceit. He had sought to falsify the word of God and had misrepresented His plan of government before the angels, claiming that God was not just in laying laws and rules upon the inhabitants of heaven; that in requiring submission and obedience from His creatures, He was seeking merely the exaltation of Himself. Therefore it must be demonstrated before the inhabitants of heaven, as well as of all the worlds, that God's government was just, His law perfect. Satan had made it appear that he himself was seeking to promote the good of the universe. The true character of the usurper, and his real object, must be understood by all. He must have time to manifest himself by his wicked works.

The discord which his own course had caused in heaven, Satan charged upon the law and government of God. All evil he declared to be the result of the divine administration. He claimed that it was his own object to improve upon the statutes of Jehovah. Therefore it was necessary that he should demonstrate the nature of his claims, and show the working out of his proposed changes in the divine law. His own work must condemn him. Satan had claimed from the first that he was not in rebellion. The whole universe must see the deceiver unmasked.

Even when it was decided that he could no longer remain in heaven, Infinite Wisdom did not destroy Satan. Since the service of love can alone be acceptable to God, the allegiance of His creatures must rest upon a conviction of His justice and benevolence. The inhabitants of heaven and of other worlds, being unprepared to comprehend the nature or consequences of sin, could not then have seen the justice and mercy of God in the destruction of Satan. Had he been immediately blotted from existence, they would have served God from fear rather than from love. The influence of the deceiver would not have been fully destroyed, nor would the spirit of rebellion have been utterly eradicated. Evil must be permitted to come to maturity. For the good of the entire universe through ceaseless ages Satan must more fully develop his principles, that his charges against the divine government might be seen in their true light by all created beings, that the justice and mercy of God and the immutability of His law might forever be placed beyond all question.

Satan's rebellion was to be a lesson to the universe through all coming ages, a perpetual testimony to the nature and terrible results of sin. The working out of Satan's rule, its effects upon both men and angels, would show what must be the fruit of setting aside the divine authority. It would testify that with the existence of God's government and His law is bound up the well-being of all the creatures He has made. Thus the history of this terrible experiment of rebellion was to be perpetual safeguard to all holy intelligences, to prevent them from being deceived as to the nature of transgression, to save them from committing sin and suffering its punishments.

To the very close of the controversy in heaven the great usurper continued to justify himself. When it was announced that with all his sympathizers he must be expelled from the abodes of bliss, then the rebel leader boldly avowed his contempt for the Creator's law. He reiterated his claim that angels needed no control, but should be left to follow their own will, which would ever guide them right. He denounced the divine statutes as a restriction of their liberty and declared that it was his purpose to secure the abolition of law; that, freed from this restraint, the hosts of heaven might enter upon a more exalted, more glorious state of existence.

With one accord, Satan and his host threw the blame of their rebellion wholly upon Christ, declaring that if they had not been reproved, they would never have rebelled. Thus stubborn and defiant in their disloyalty, seeking vainly to overthrow the government of God, yet blasphemously claiming to be themselves the innocent victims of oppressive power, the archrebel and all his sympathizers were at last banished from heaven.

The same spirit that prompted rebellion in heaven still inspires rebellion on earth. Satan has continued with men the same policy which he pursued with the angels. His spirit now reigns in the children of disobedience. Like him they seek to break down the restraints of the law of God and promise men liberty through transgression of its precepts. Reproof of sin still arouses the spirit of hatred and resistance. When God's messages of warning are brought home to the conscience, Satan leads men to justify themselves and to seek the sympathy of others in their course of sin. Instead of correcting their errors, they excite indignation against the reprover, as if he were the sole cause of difficulty. From the days of righteous Abel to our own time such is the spirit which has been displayed toward those who dare to condemn sin.

By the same misrepresentation of the character of God as he had practiced in heaven, causing Him to be regarded as severe and tyrannical, Satan induced man to sin. And having succeeded thus far, he declared that God's unjust restrictions had led to man's fall, as they had led to his own rebellion.

But the Eternal One Himself proclaims His character: "The Lord God, merciful and gracious, long-suffering, and abundant in goodness and truth, keeping mercy for thousands, forgiving iniquity and transgression and sin, and that will by no means clear the guilty." Exodus 34:6, 7.

In the banishment of Satan from heaven, God declared His justice and maintained the honor of His throne. But when man had sinned through yielding to the deceptions of this apostate spirit, God gave an evidence of His love by yielding up His only-begotten Son to die for the fallen race. In the atonement the character of God is revealed. The mighty argument of the cross demonstrates to the whole universe that the course of sin which Lucifer had chosen was in no wise chargeable upon the government of God.

In the contest between Christ and Satan, during the Saviour's earthly ministry, the character of the great deceiver was unmasked. Nothing could so effectually have uprooted Satan from the affections of the heavenly angels and the whole loyal universe as did his cruel warfare upon the world's Redeemer. The daring blasphemy of his demand that Christ should pay him homage, his presumptuous boldness in bearing Him to the mountain summit and the pinnacle of the temple, the malicious intent betrayed in urging Him to cast Himself down from the dizzy height, the unsleeping malice that hunted Him from place to place, inspiring the hearts of priests and people to reject His love, and at the last to cry, "Crucify Him! crucify Him!--all this excited the amazement and indignation of the universe.

It was Satan that prompted the world's rejection of Christ. The prince of evil exerted all his power and cunning to destroy Jesus; for he saw that the Saviour's mercy and love, His compassion and pitying tenderness, were representing to the world the character of God. Satan contested every claim put forth by the Son of God and employed men as his agents to fill the Saviour's life with suffering and sorrow. The sophistry and falsehood by which he had sought to hinder the work of Jesus, the hatred manifested through the children of disobedience, his cruel accusations against Him whose life was one of unexampled goodness, all sprang from deep-seated revenge. The pent-up fires of envy and malice, hatred and revenge, burst forth on Calvary against the Son of God, while all heaven gazed upon the scene in silent horror.

When the great sacrifice had been consummated, Christ ascended on high, refusing the adoration of angels until He had presented the request: "I will that they also, whom Thou hast given Me, be with Me where I am." John 17:24. Then with inexpressible love and power came forth the answer from the Father's throne: "Let all the angels of God worship Him." Hebrews 1:6. Not a stain rested upon Jesus. His humiliation ended, His sacrifice completed, there was given unto Him a name that is above every name.

Now the guilt of Satan stood forth without excuse. He had revealed his true character as a liar and a murderer. It was seen that the very same spirit with which he ruled the children of men, who were under his power, he would have manifested had he been permitted to control the inhabitants of heaven. He had claimed that the transgression of God's law would bring liberty and exaltation; but it was seen to result in bondage and degradation.

Satan's lying charges against the divine character and government appeared in their true light. He had accused God of seeking merely the exaltation of Himself in requiring submission and obedience from His creatures, and had declared that, while the Creator exacted self-denial from all others, He Himself practiced no self-denial and made no sacrifice. Now it was seen that for the salvation of a fallen and sinful race, the Ruler of the universe had made the greatest sacrifice which love could make; for "God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto Himself." 2 Corinthians 5:19. It was seen, also, that while Lucifer had opened the door for the entrance of sin by his desire for honor and supremacy, Christ had, in order to destroy sin, humbled Himself and become obedient unto death.

God had manifested His abhorrence of the principles of rebellion. All heaven saw His justice revealed, both in the condemnation of Satan and in the redemption of man. Lucifer had declared that if the law of God was changeless, and its penalty could not be remitted, every transgressor must be forever debarred from the Creator's favor. He had claimed that the sinful race were placed beyond redemption and were therefore his rightful prey. But the death of Christ was an argument in man's behalf that could not be overthrown. The penalty of the law fell upon Him who was equal with God, and man was free to accept the righteousness of Christ and by a life of penitence and humiliation to triumph, as the Son of God had triumphed, over the power of Satan. Thus God is just and yet the justifier of all who believe in Jesus.

But it was not merely to accomplish the redemption of man that Christ came to the earth to suffer and to die. He came to "magnify the law" and to "make it honorable." Not alone that the inhabitants of this world might regard the law as it should be regarded; but it was to demonstrate to all the worlds of the universe that God's law is unchangeable. Could its claims have been set aside, then the Son of God need not have yielded up His life to atone for its transgression. The death of Christ proves it immutable. And the sacrifice to which infinite love impelled the Father and the Son, that sinners might be redeemed, demonstrates to all the universe--what nothing less than this plan of atonement could have sufficed to do--that justice and mercy are the foundation of the law and government of God.

In the final execution of the judgment it will be seen that no cause for sin exists. When the Judge of all the earth shall demand of Satan, "Why hast thou rebelled against Me, and robbed Me of the subjects of My kingdom?" the originator of evil can render no excuse. Every mouth will be stopped, and all the hosts of rebellion will be speechless.

The cross of Calvary, while it declares the law immutable, proclaims to the universe that the wages of sin is death. In the Saviour's expiring cry, "It is finished," the death knell of Satan was rung. The great controversy which had been so long in progress was then decided, and the final eradication of evil was made certain. The Son of God passed through the portals of the tomb, that "through death He might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil." Hebrews 2:14. Lucifer's desire for self-exaltation had led him to say: "I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: . . . I will be like the Most High." God declares: "I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth, . . . and never shalt thou be any more." Isaiah 14:13, 14; Ezekiel 28:18, 19. When "the day cometh, that shall burn as an oven;. . . .all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the Lord of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch." Malachi 4:1.

The whole universe will have become witnesses to the nature and results of sin. And its utter extermination, which in the beginning would have brought fear to angels and dishonor to God, will now vindicate His love and establish His honor before the universe of beings who delight to do His will, and in whose heart is His law. Never will evil again be manifest. Says the word of God: "Affliction shall not rise up the second time." Nahum 1:9. The law of God, which Satan has reproached as the yoke of bondage, will be honored as the law of liberty. A tested and proved creation will never again be turned from allegiance to Him whose character has been fully manifested before them as fathomless love and infinite wisdom.

Why was Sin Permitted? - from 'Patriarchs and Prophets' by Ellen White http://www.whiteestate.org/books/pp/pp1.html


"GOD is love." 1 John 4:16. His nature, His law, is love. It ever has been; it ever will be. "The high and lofty One that inhabiteth eternity," whose "ways are everlasting," changeth not. With Him "is no variableness, neither shadow of turning." Isaiah 57:15; Habakkuk 3:6; James 1:17.

Every manifestation of creative power is an expression of infinite love. The sovereignty of God involves fullness of blessing to all created beings. The psalmist says:

"Strong is Thy hand, and high is Thy right hand.
Righteousness and judgment are the foundation of Thy throne:
Mercy and truth go before Thy face.
Blessed is the people that know the joyful sound:
They walk, O Lord, in the light of Thy countenance.
In Thy name do they rejoice all the day:
And in Thy righteousness are they exalted.
For Thou art the glory of their strength: . . .
or our shield belongeth unto Jehovah,
And our king to the Holy One."
Psalm 89:13-18, R.V.

The history of the great conflict between good and evil, from the time it first began in heaven to the final overthrow of rebellion and the total eradication of sin, is also a demonstration of God's unchanging love. The Sovereign of the universe was not alone in His work of beneficence. He had an associate--a co-worker who could appreciate His purposes, and could share His joy in giving happiness to created beings. "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God." John 1:1, 2. Christ, the Word, the only begotten of God, was one with the eternal Father--one in nature, in character, in purpose--the only being that could enter into all the counsels and purposes of God. "His name shall be called Wonderful, Counselor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace." Isaiah 9:6. His "goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting." Micah 5:2. And the Son of God declares concerning Himself: "The Lord possessed Me in the beginning of His way, before His works of old. I was set up from everlasting. . . . When He appointed the foundations of the earth: then I was by Him, as one brought up with Him: and I was daily His delight, rejoicing always before Him." Proverbs 8:22-30.

The Father wrought by His Son in the creation of all heavenly beings. "By Him were all things created, . . . whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by Him, and for Him." Colossians 1:16. Angels are God's ministers, radiant with the light ever flowing from His presence and speeding on rapid wing to execute His will. But the Son, the anointed of God, the "express image of His person," "the brightness of His glory," "upholding all things by the word of His power," holds supremacy over them all. Hebrews 1:3. "A glorious high throne from the beginning," was the place of His sanctuary (Jeremiah 17:12); "a scepter of righteousness," the scepter of His kingdom. Hebrews 1:8. "Honor and majesty are before Him: strength and beauty are in His sanctuary." Psalm 96:6. Mercy and truth go before His face. Psalm 89:14.

The law of love being the foundation of the government of God, the happiness of all intelligent beings depends upon their perfect accord with its great principles of righteousness. God desires from all His creatures the service of love--service that springs from an appreciation of His character. He takes no pleasure in a forced obedience; and to all He grants freedom of will, that they may render Him voluntary service. So long as all created beings acknowledged the allegiance of love, there was perfect harmony throughout the universe of God. It was the joy of the heavenly host to fulfill the purpose of their Creator. They delighted in reflecting His glory and showing forth His praise. And while love to God was supreme, love for one another was confiding and unselfish. There was no note of discord to mar the celestial harmonies. But a change came over this happy state. There was one who perverted the freedom that God had granted to His creatures. Sin originated with him who, next to Christ, had been most honored of God and was highest in power and glory among the inhabitants of heaven. Lucifer, "son of the morning," was first of the covering cherubs, holy and undefiled. He stood in the presence of the great Creator, and the ceaseless beams of glory enshrouding the eternal God rested upon him. "Thus saith the Lord God; Thou sealest up the sum, full of wisdom, and perfect in beauty. Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering. . . . Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire. Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee." Ezekiel 28:12-15.

Little by little Lucifer came to indulge the desire for self-exaltation. The Scripture says, "Thine heart was lifted up because of thy beauty, thou hast corrupted thy wisdom by reason of thy brightness." Ezekiel 28:17. "Thou hast said in thine heart, . . . I will exalt my throne above the stars of God. . . . I will be like the Most High." Isaiah 14:13, 14. Though all his glory was from God, this mighty angel came to regard it as pertaining to himself. Not content with his position, though honored above the heavenly host, he ventured to covet homage due alone to the Creator. Instead of seeking to make God supreme in the affections and allegiance of all created beings, it was his endeavor to secure their service and loyalty to himself. And coveting the glory with which the infinite Father had invested His Son, this prince of angels aspired to power that was the prerogative of Christ alone.

Now the perfect harmony of heaven was broken. Lucifer's disposition to serve himself instead of his Creator aroused a feeling of apprehension when observed by those who considered that the glory of God should be supreme. In heavenly council the angels pleaded with Lucifer. The Son of God presented before him the greatness, the goodness, and the justice of the Creator, and the sacred, unchanging nature of His law. God Himself had established the order of heaven; and in departing from it, Lucifer would dishonor his Maker and bring ruin upon himself. But the warning, given in infinite love and mercy, only aroused a spirit of resistance. Lucifer allowed his jealousy of Christ to prevail, and became the more determined.

To dispute the supremacy of the Son of God, thus impeaching the wisdom and love of the Creator, had become the purpose of this prince of angels. To this object he was about to bend the energies of that master mind, which, next to Christ's, was first among the hosts of God. But He who would have the will of all His creatures free, left none unguarded to the bewildering sophistry by which rebellion would seek to justify itself. Before the great contest should open, all were to have a clear presentation of His will, whose wisdom and goodness were the spring of all their joy.

The King of the universe summoned the heavenly hosts before Him, that in their presence He might set forth the true position of His Son and show the relation He sustained to all created beings. The Son of God shared the Father's throne, and the glory of the eternal, self-existent One encircled both. About the throne gathered the holy angels, a vast, unnumbered throng--"ten thousand times ten thousand, and thousands of thousands" (Revelation 5:11.), the most exalted angels, as ministers and subjects, rejoicing in the light that fell upon them from the presence of the Deity. Before the assembled inhabitants of heaven the King declared that none but Christ, the Only Begotten of God, could fully enter into His purposes, and to Him it was committed to execute the mighty counsels of His will. The Son of God had wrought the Father's will in the creation of all the hosts of heaven; and to Him, as well as to God, their homage and allegiance were due. Christ was still to exercise divine power, in the creation of the earth and its inhabitants. But in all this He would not seek power or exaltation for Himself contrary to God's plan, but would exalt the Father's glory and execute His purposes of beneficence and love.

The angels joyfully acknowledged the supremacy of Christ, and prostrating themselves before Him, poured out their love and adoration. Lucifer bowed with them, but in his heart there was a strange, fierce conflict. Truth, justice, and loyalty were struggling against envy and jealousy. The influence of the holy angels seemed for a time to carry him with them. As songs of praise ascended in melodious strains, swelled by thousands of glad voices, the spirit of evil seemed vanquished; unutterable love thrilled his entire being; his soul went out, in harmony with the sinless worshippers, in love to the Father and the Son. But again he was filled with pride in his own glory. His desire for supremacy returned, and envy of Christ was once more indulged. The high honors conferred upon Lucifer were not appreciated as God's special gift, and therefore, called forth no gratitude to his Creator. He glorified in his brightness and exaltation and aspired to be equal with God. He was beloved and reverenced by the heavenly host, angels delighted to execute his commands, and he was clothed with wisdom and glory above them all. Yet the Son of God was exalted above him, as one in power and authority with the Father. He shared the Father's counsels, while Lucifer did not thus enter into the purposes of God. "Why," questioned this mighty angel, "should Christ have the supremacy? Why is He honored above Lucifer?"

Leaving his place in the immediate presence of the Father, Lucifer went forth to diffuse the spirit of discontent among the angels. He worked with mysterious secrecy, and for a time concealed his real purpose under an appearance of reverence for God. He began to insinuate doubts concerning the laws that governed heavenly beings, intimating that though laws might be necessary for the inhabitants of the worlds, angels, being more exalted, needed no such restraint, for their own wisdom was a sufficient guide. They were not beings that could bring dishonor to God; all their thoughts were holy; it was no more possible for them than for God Himself to err. The exaltation of the Son of God as equal with the Father was represented as an injustice to Lucifer, who, it was claimed, was also entitled to reverence and honor. If this prince of angels could but attain to his true, exalted position, great good would accrue to the entire host of heaven; for it was his object to secure freedom for all. But now even the liberty which they had hitherto enjoyed was at an end; for an absolute Ruler had been appointed them, and to His authority all must pay homage. Such were the subtle deceptions that through the wiles of Lucifer were fast obtaining in the heavenly courts.

There had been no change in the position or authority of Christ. Lucifer's envy and misrepresentation and his claims to equality with Christ had made necessary a statement of the true position of the Son of God; but this had been the same from the beginning. Many of the angels were, however, blinded by Lucifer's deceptions.

Taking advantage of the loving, loyal trust reposed in him by the holy beings under his command, he had so artfully instilled into their minds his own distrust and discontent that his agency was not discerned. Lucifer had presented the purposes of God in a false light--misconstruing and distorting them to excite dissent and dissatisfaction. He cunningly drew his hearers on to give utterance to their feelings; then these expressions were repeated by him when it would serve his purpose, as evidence that the angels were not fully in harmony with the government of God. While claiming for himself perfect loyalty to God, he urged that changes in the order and laws of heaven were necessary for the stability of the divine government. Thus while working to excite opposition to the law of God and to instill his own discontent into the minds of the angels under him, he was ostensibly seeking to remove dissatisfaction and to reconcile disaffected angels to the order of heaven. While secretly fomenting discord and rebellion, he with consummate craft caused it to appear as his sole purpose to promote loyalty and to preserve harmony and peace.

The spirit of dissatisfaction thus kindled was doing its baleful work. While there was no open outbreak, division of feeling imperceptibly grew up among the angels. There were some who looked with favor upon Lucifer's insinuations against the government of God. Although they had heretofore been in perfect harmony with the order which God had established, they were now discontented and unhappy because they could not penetrate His unsearchable counsels; they were dissatisfied with His purpose in exalting Christ. These stood ready to second Lucifer's demand for equal authority with the Son of God. But angels who were loyal and true maintained the wisdom and justice of he divine decree and endeavored to reconcile this disaffected being to the will of God. Christ was the Son of God; He had been one with Him before the angels were called into existence. He had ever stood at the right hand of the Father; His supremacy, so full of blessing to all who came under its benignant control, had not heretofore been questioned. The harmony of heaven had never been interrupted; wherefore should there now be discord? The loyal angels could see only terrible consequences from this dissension, and with earnest entreaty they counseled the disaffected ones to renounce their purpose and prove themselves loyal to God by fidelity to His government.

In great mercy, according to His divine character, God bore long with Lucifer. The spirit of discontent and disaffection had never before been known in heaven. It was a new element, strange, mysterious, unaccountable. Lucifer himself had not at first been acquainted with the real nature of his feelings; for a time he had feared to express the workings and imaginings of his mind; yet he did not dismiss them. He did not see whither he was drifting. But such efforts as infinite love and wisdom only could devise, were made to convince him of his error. His disaffection was proved to be without cause, and he was made to see what would be the result of persisting in revolt. Lucifer was convinced that he was in the wrong. He saw that "the Lord is righteous in all His ways, and holy in all His works" (Psalm 145:17); that the divine statutes are just, and that he ought to acknowledge them as such before all heaven. Had he done this, he might have saved himself and many angels. He had not at that time fully cast off his allegiance to God. Though he had left his position as covering cherub, yet if he had been willing to return to God, acknowledging the Creator's wisdom, and satisfied to fill the place appointed him in God's great plan, he would have been reinstated in his office. The time had come for a final decision; he must fully yield to the divine sovereignty or place himself in open rebellion. He nearly reached the decision to return, but pride forbade him. It was too great a sacrifice for one who had been so highly honored to confess that he had been in error, that his imaginings were false, and to yield to the authority which he had been working to prove unjust.

A compassionate Creator, in yearning pity for Lucifer and his followers, was seeking to draw them back from the abyss of ruin into which they were about to plunge. But His mercy was misinterpreted. Lucifer pointed to the long-suffering of God as an evidence of his own superiority, an indication that the King of the universe would yet accede to his terms. If the angels would stand firmly with him, he declared, they could yet gain all that they desired. He persistently defended his own course, and fully committed himself to the great controversy against his Maker. Thus it was that Lucifer, "the light bearer," the sharer of God's glory, the attendant of His throne, by transgression became Satan, "the adversary" of God and holy beings and the destroyer of those whom Heaven had committed to his guidance and guardianship.

Rejecting with disdain the arguments and entreaties of the loyal angels, he denounced them as deluded slaves. The preference shown to Christ he declared an act of injustice both to himself and to all the heavenly host, and announced that he would no longer submit to this invasion of his rights and theirs. He would never again acknowledge the supremacy of Christ. He had determined to claim the honor which should have been given him, and take command of all who would become his followers; and he promised those would enter his ranks a new and better government, under which all would enjoy freedom. Great numbers of the angels signified their purpose to accept him as their leader. Flattered by the favor with which his advances were received, he hoped to win all the angels to his side, to become equal with God Himself, and to be obeyed by the entire host of heaven.

Still the loyal angels urged him and his sympathizers to submit to God; and they set before them the inevitable result should they refuse: He who had created them could overthrow their power and signally punish their rebellious daring. No angel could successfully oppose the law of God, which was as sacred as Himself. They warned all to close their ears against Lucifer's deceptive reasoning, and urged him and his followers to seek the presence of God without delay and confess the error of questioning His wisdom and authority.

Many were disposed to heed this counsel, to repent of their disaffection, and seek to be again received into favor with the Father and His Son. But Lucifer had another deception ready. The mighty revolter now declared that the angels who had united with him had gone too far to return; that he was acquainted with the divine law, and knew that God would not forgive. He declared that all who should submit to the authority of Heaven would be stripped of their honor, degraded from their position. For himself, he was determined never again to acknowledge the authority of Christ. The only course remaining for him and his followers, he said, was to assert their liberty, and gain by force the rights which had not been willingly accorded them.

So far as Satan himself was concerned, it was true that he had now gone too far to return. But not so with those who had been blinded by his deceptions. To them the counsel and entreaties of the loyal angels opened a door of hope; and had they heeded the warning, they might have broken away from the snare of Satan. But pride, love for their leader, and the desire for unrestricted freedom were permitted to bear sway, and the pleadings of divine love and mercy were finally rejected.

God permitted Satan to carry forward his work until the spirit of disaffection ripened into active revolt. It was necessary for his plans to be fully developed, that their true nature and tendency might be seen by all. Lucifer, as the anointed cherub, had been highly exalted; he was greatly loved by the heavenly beings, and his influence over them was strong. God's government included not only the inhabitants of heaven, but of all the worlds that He had created; and Lucifer had concluded that if he could carry the angels of heaven with him in rebellion, he could carry also all the worlds. He had artfully presented his side of the question, employing sophistry and fraud to secure his objects. His power to deceive was very great. By disguising himself in a cloak of falsehood, he had gained an advantage. All his acts were so clothed with mystery that it was difficult to disclose to the angels the true nature of his work. Until fully developed, it could not be made to appear the evil thing it was; his disaffection would not be seen to be rebellion. Even the loyal angels could not fully discern his character or see to what his work was leading.

Lucifer had at first so conducted his temptations that he himself stood uncommitted. The angels whom he could not bring fully to his side, he accused of indifference to the interests of heavenly beings. The very work which he himself was doing, he charged upon the loyal angels. It was his policy to perplex with subtle arguments concerning the purposes of God. Everything that was simple he shrouded in mystery, and by artful perversion cast doubt upon the plainest statements of Jehovah. And his high position, so closely connected with the divine government, gave greater force to his representations.

God could employ only such means as were consistent with truth and righteousness. Satan could use what God could not-- flattery and deceit. He had sought to falsify the word of God and had misrepresented His plan of government, claiming that God was not just in imposing laws upon the angels; that in requiring submission and obedience from His creatures, He was seeking merely the exaltation of Himself. It was therefore necessary to demonstrate before the inhabitants of heaven, and of all the worlds, that God's government is just, His law perfect. Satan had made it appear that he himself was seeking to promote the good of the universe. The true character of the usurper and his real object must be understood by all. He must have time to manifest himself by his wicked works.

The discord which his own course had caused in heaven, Satan charged upon the government of God. All evil he declared to be the result of the divine administration. He claimed that it was his own object to improve upon the statutes of Jehovah. Therefore God permitted him to demonstrate the nature of his claims, to show the working out of his proposed changes in the divine law. His own work must condemn him. Satan had claimed from the first that he was not in rebellion. The whole universe must see deceiver unmasked.

Even when he was cast out of heaven. Infinite Wisdom did not destroy Satan. Since only the service of love can be acceptable to God, the allegiance of His creatures must rest upon a conviction of His justice and benevolence. The inhabitants of heaven and of the worlds, being unprepared to comprehend the nature or consequences of sin, could not then have seen the justice of God in the destruction of Satan. Had he been immediately blotted out of existence, some would have served God from fear rather than from love. The influence of the deceiver would not have been fully destroyed, nor would be the spirit of rebellion have been utterly eradicated. For the good of the entire universe through ceaseless ages, he must more fully developed his principles, that his charges against the divine government might be seen in their true light by all created beings, and that the justice and mercy of God and the immutability of His law might be forever placed beyond all question.

Satan's rebellion was to be a lesson to the universe through all coming ages--a perpetual testimony to the nature of sin and its terrible results. The working out of Satan's rule, its effects upon both men and angels, would show what must be the fruit of setting aside the divine authority. It would testify that with the existence of God's government is bound up the well-being of all the creatures He has made. Thus the history of this terrible experiment of rebellion was to be a perpetual safeguard to all holy beings, to prevent them from being deceived as to the nature of transgression, to save them from committing sin, and suffering its penalty.

He that ruleth in the heavens is the one who sees the end from the beginning--the one before whom the mysteries of the past and the future are alike outspread, and who, beyond the woe and darkness and ruin that sin has wrought, beholds the accomplishment of His own purposes of love and blessing. Though "clouds and darkness are round about Him: righteousness and judgment are the foundation of His throne." Psalm 97:2, R.V. And this the inhabitants of the universe, both loyal and disloyal, will one day understand. "His work is perfect: for all His ways are judgment: a God of truth and without iniquity, just and right is He." Deuteronomy 32:4.

PAPER 53: THE LUCIFER REBELLION - from The Urantia Book http://www.urantia.org/en/urantia-book-standardized/paper-53-lucifer-rebellion

53:0.1 Lucifer was a brilliant primary Lanonandek Son of Nebadon. He had experienced service in many systems, had been a high counselor of his group, and was distinguished for wisdom, sagacity, and efficiency. Lucifer was number 37 of his order, and when commissioned by the Melchizedeks, he was designated as one of the one hundred most able and brilliant personalities in more than seven hundred thousand of his kind. From such a magnificent beginning, through evil and error, he embraced sin and now is numbered as one of three System Sovereigns in Nebadon who have succumbed to the urge of self and surrendered to the sophistry of spurious personal liberty—rejection of universe allegiance and disregard of fraternal obligations, blindness to cosmic relationships.
53:0.2 In the universe of Nebadon, the domain of Christ Michael, there are ten thousand systems of inhabited worlds. In all the history of Lanonandek Sons, in all their work throughout these thousands of systems and at the universe headquarters, only three System Sovereigns have ever been found in contempt of the government of the Creator Son.
053:1 THE LEADERS OF REBELLION
53:1.1 Lucifer was not an ascendant being; he was a created Son of the local universe, and of him it was said: " You were perfect in all your ways from the day you were created till unrighteousness was found in you. " Many times had he been in counsel with the Most Highs of Edentia. And Lucifer reigned " upon the holy mountain of God, " the administrative mount of Jerusem, for he was the chief executive of a great system of 607 inhabited worlds.
53:1.2 Lucifer was a magnificent being, a brilliant personality; he stood next to the Most High Fathers of the constellations in the direct line of universe authority. Notwithstanding Lucifer's transgression, subordinate intelligences refrained from showing him disrespect and disdain prior to Michael's bestowal on Urantia. Even the archangel of Michael, at the time of Moses' resurrection, " did not bring against him an accusing judgment but simply said, `the Judge rebuke you.' " Judgment in such matters belongs to the Ancients of Days, the rulers of the superuniverse.
53:1.3 Lucifer is now the fallen and deposed Sovereign of Satania. Self-contemplation is most disastrous, even to the exalted personalities of the celestial world. Of Lucifer it was said: " Your heart was lifted up because of your beauty; you corrupted your wisdom because of your brightness. " Your olden prophet saw his sad estate when he wrote: " How are you fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! How are you cast down, you who dared to confuse the worlds! "
53:1.4 Very little was heard of Lucifer on Urantia owing to the fact that he assigned his first lieutenant, Satan, to advocate his cause on your planet. Satan was a member of the same primary group of Lanonandeks but had never functioned as a System Sovereign; he entered fully into the Lucifer insurrection. The " devil " is none other than Caligastia, the deposed Planetary Prince of Urantia and a Son of the secondary order of Lanonandeks. At the time Michael was on Urantia in the flesh, Lucifer, Satan, and Caligastia were leagued together to effect the miscarriage of his bestowal mission. But they signally failed.
53:1.5 Abaddon was the chief of the staff of Caligastia. He followed his master into rebellion and has ever since acted as chief executive of the Urantia rebels. Beelzebub was the leader of the disloyal midway creatures who allied themselves with the forces of the traitorous Caligastia.
53:1.6 The dragon eventually became the symbolic representation of all these evil personages. Upon the triumph of Michael, " Gabriel came down from Salvington and bound the dragon (all the rebel leaders) for an age. " Of the Jerusem seraphic rebels it is written: " And the angels who kept not their first estate but left their own habitation, he has reserved in sure chains of darkness to the judgment of the great day. "

53:2 THE CAUSES OF REBELLION
53:2.1 Lucifer and his first assistant, Satan, had reigned on Jerusem for more than five hundred thousand years when in their hearts they began to array themselves against the Universal Father and his then vicegerent Son, Michael.
53:2.2 There were no peculiar or special conditions in the system of Satania which suggested or favored rebellion. It is our belief that the idea took origin and form in Lucifer's mind, and that he might have instigated such a rebellion no matter where he might have been stationed. Lucifer first announced his plans to Satan, but it required several months to corrupt the mind of his able and brilliant associate. However, when once converted to the rebel theories, he became a bold and earnest advocate of " self-assertion and liberty. "
53:2.3 No one ever suggested rebellion to Lucifer. The idea of self-assertion in opposition to the will of Michael and to the plans of the Universal Father, as they are represented in Michael, had its origin in his own mind. His relations with the Creator Son had been intimate and always cordial. At no time prior to the exaltation of his own mind did Lucifer openly express dissatisfaction about the universe administration. Notwithstanding his silence, for more than one hundred years of standard time the Union of Days on Salvington had been reflectivating to Uversa that all was not at peace in Lucifer's mind. This information was also communicated to the Creator Son and the Constellation Fathers of Norlatiadek.
53:2.4 Throughout this period Lucifer became increasingly critical of the entire plan of universe administration but always professed wholehearted loyalty to the Supreme Rulers. His first outspoken disloyalty was manifested on the occasion of a visit of Gabriel to Jerusem just a few days before the open proclamation of the Lucifer Declaration of Liberty. Gabriel was so profoundly impressed with the certainty of the impending outbreak that he went direct to Edentia to confer with the Constellation Fathers regarding the measures to be employed in case of open rebellion.
53:2.5 It is very difficult to point out the exact cause or causes which finally culminated in the Lucifer rebellion. We are certain of only one thing, and that is: Whatever these first beginnings were, they had their origin in Lucifer's mind. There must have been a pride of self that nourished itself to the point of self-deception, so that Lucifer for a time really persuaded himself that his contemplation of rebellion was actually for the good of the system, if not of the universe. By the time his plans had developed to the point of disillusionment, no doubt he had gone too far for his original and mischief-making pride to permit him to stop. At some point in this experience he became insincere, and evil evolved into deliberate and willful sin. That this happened is proved by the subsequent conduct of this brilliant executive. He was long offered opportunity for repentance, but only some of his subordinates ever accepted the proffered mercy. The Faithful of Days of Edentia, on the request of the Constellation Fathers, in person presented the plan of Michael for the saving of these flagrant rebels, but always was the mercy of the Creator Son rejected and rejected with increasing contempt and disdain.
Bible References

53:3 THE LUCIFER MANIFESTO
53:3.1 Whatever the early origins of trouble in the hearts of Lucifer and Satan, the final outbreak took form as the Lucifer Declaration of Liberty. The cause of the rebels was stated under three heads:
53:3.2 1. The reality of the Universal Father. Lucifer charged that the Universal Father did not really exist, that physical gravity and space-energy were inherent in the universe, and that the Father was a myth invented by the Paradise Sons to enable them to maintain the rule of the universes in the Father's name. He denied that personality was a gift of the Universal Father. He even intimated that the finaliters were in collusion with the Paradise Sons to foist fraud upon all creation since they never brought back a very clear-cut idea of the Father's actual personality as it is discernible on Paradise. He traded on reverence as ignorance. The charge was sweeping, terrible, and blasphemous. It was this veiled attack upon the finaliters that no doubt influenced the ascendant citizens then on Jerusem to stand firm and remain steadfast in resistance to all the rebel's proposals.
53:3.3 2. The universe government of the Creator Son—Michael. Lucifer contended that the local systems should be autonomous. He protested against the right of Michael, the Creator Son, to assume sovereignty of Nebadon in the name of a hypothetical Paradise Father and require all personalities to acknowledge allegiance to this unseen Father. He asserted that the whole plan of worship was a clever scheme to aggrandize the Paradise Sons. He was willing to acknowledge Michael as his Creator-father but not as his God and rightful ruler.
53:3.4 Most bitterly did he attack the right of the Ancients of Days—" foreign potentates "—to interfere in the affairs of the local systems and universes. These rulers he denounced as tyrants and usurpers. He exhorted his followers to believe that none of these rulers could do aught to interfere with the operation of complete home rule if men and angels only had the courage to assert themselves and boldly claim their rights.
53:3.5 He contended that the executioners of the Ancients of Days could be debarred from functioning in the local systems if the native beings would only assert their independence. He maintained that immortality was inherent in the system personalities, that resurrection was natural and automatic, and that all beings would live eternally except for the arbitrary and unjust acts of the executioners of the Ancients of Days.
53:3.6 3. The attack upon the universal plan of ascendant mortal training. Lucifer maintained that far too much time and energy were expended upon the scheme of so thoroughly training ascending mortals in the principles of universe administration, principles which he alleged were unethical and unsound. He protested against the agelong program for preparing the mortals of space for some unknown destiny and pointed to the presence of the finaliter corps on Jerusem as proof that these mortals had spent ages of preparation for some destiny of pure fiction. With derision he pointed out that the finaliters had encountered a destiny no more glorious than to be returned to humble spheres similar to those of their origin. He intimated that they had been debauched by overmuch discipline and prolonged training, and that they were in reality traitors to their mortal fellows since they were now co-operating with the scheme of enslaving all creation to the fictions of a mythical eternal destiny for ascending mortals. He advocated that ascenders should enjoy the liberty of individual self-determination. He challenged and condemned the entire plan of mortal ascension as sponsored by the Paradise Sons of God and supported by the Infinite Spirit.
53:3.7 And it was with such a Declaration of Liberty that Lucifer launched his orgy of darkness and death.
Bible References

53:4 OUTBREAK OF THE REBELLION
53:4.1 The Lucifer manifesto was issued at the annual conclave of Satania on the sea of glass, in the presence of the assembled hosts of Jerusem, on the last day of the year, about two hundred thousand years ago, Urantia time. Satan proclaimed that worship could be accorded the universal forces—physical, intellectual, and spiritual—but that allegiance could be acknowledged only to the actual and present ruler, Lucifer, the " friend of men and angels " and the " God of liberty. "
53:4.2 Self-assertion was the battle cry of the Lucifer rebellion. One of his chief arguments was that, if self-government was good and right for the Melchizedeks and other groups, it was equally good for all orders of intelligence. He was bold and persistent in the advocacy of the " equality of mind " and " the brotherhood of intelligence. " He maintained that all government should be limited to the local planets and their voluntary confederation into the local systems. All other supervision he disallowed. He promised the Planetary Princes that they should rule the worlds as supreme executives. He denounced the location of legislative activities on the constellation headquarters and the conduct of judicial affairs on the universe capital. He contended that all these functions of government should be concentrated on the system capitals and proceeded to set up his own legislative assembly and organized his own tribunals under the jurisdiction of Satan. And he directed that the princes on the apostate worlds do the same.
53:4.3 The entire administrative cabinet of Lucifer went over in a body and were sworn in publicly as the officers of the administration of the new head of " the liberated worlds and systems. "
53:4.4 While there had been two previous rebellions in Nebadon, they were in distant constellations. Lucifer held that these insurrections were unsuccessful because the majority of the intelligences failed to follow their leaders. He contended that " majorities rule, " that " mind is infallible. " The freedom allowed him by the universe rulers apparently sustained many of his nefarious contentions. He defied all his superiors; yet they apparently took no note of his doings. He was given a free hand to prosecute his seductive plan without let or hindrance.
53:4.5 All the merciful delays of justice Lucifer pointed to as evidence of the inability of the government of the Paradise Sons to stop the rebellion. He would openly defy and arrogantly challenge Michael, Immanuel, and the Ancients of Days and then point to the fact that no action ensued as positive evidence of the impotency of the universe and the superuniverse governments.
53:4.6 Gabriel was personally present throughout all these disloyal proceedings and only announced that he would, in due time, speak for Michael, and that all beings would be left free and unmolested in their choice; that the " government of the Sons for the Father desired only that loyalty and devotion which was voluntary, wholehearted, and sophistry-proof. "
53:4.7 Lucifer was permitted fully to establish and thoroughly to organize his rebel government before Gabriel made any effort to contest the right of secession or to counterwork the rebel propaganda. But the Constellation Fathers immediately confined the action of these disloyal personalities to the system of Satania. Nevertheless, this period of delay was a time of great trial and testing to the loyal beings of all Satania. All was chaotic for a few years, and there was great confusion on the mansion worlds.
Bible References

53:5 NATURE OF THE CONFLICT
53:5.1 Upon the outbreak of the Satania rebellion, Michael took counsel of his Paradise brother, Immanuel. Following this momentous conference, Michael announced that he would pursue the same policy which had characterized his dealings with similar upheavals in the past, an attitude of noninterference.
53:5.2 At the time of this rebellion and the two which preceded it there was no absolute and personal sovereign authority in the universe of Nebadon. Michael ruled by divine right, as vicegerent of the Universal Father, but not yet in his own personal right. He had not completed his bestowal career; he had not yet been vested with " all power in heaven and on earth. "
53:5.3 From the outbreak of rebellion to the day of his enthronement as sovereign ruler of Nebadon, Michael never interfered with the rebel forces of Lucifer; they were allowed to run a free course for almost two hundred thousand years of Urantia time. Christ Michael now has ample power and authority to deal promptly, even summarily, with such outbreaks of disloyalty, but we doubt that this sovereign authority would lead him to act differently if another such upheaval should occur.
53:5.4 Since Michael elected to remain aloof from the actual warfare of the Lucifer rebellion, Gabriel called his personal staff together on Edentia and, in counsel with the Most Highs, elected to assume command of the loyal hosts of Satania. Michael remained on Salvington while Gabriel proceeded to Jerusem, and establishing himself on the sphere dedicated to the Father—the same Universal Father whose personality Lucifer and Satan had questioned—in the presence of the forgathered hosts of loyal personalities, he displayed the banner of Michael, the material emblem of the Trinity government of all creation, the three azure blue concentric circles on a white background.
53:5.5 The Lucifer emblem was a banner of white with one red circle, in the center of which a black solid circle appeared.
53:5.6 " There was war in heaven; Michael's commander and his angels fought against the dragon (Lucifer, Satan, and the apostate princes); and the dragon and his rebellious angels fought but prevailed not. " This " war in heaven " was not a physical battle as such a conflict might be conceived on Urantia. In the early days of the struggle Lucifer held forth continuously in the planetary amphitheater. Gabriel conducted an unceasing exposure of the rebel sophistries from his headquarters taken up near at hand. The various personalities present on the sphere who were in doubt as to their attitude would journey back and forth between these discussions until they arrived at a final decision.
53:5.7 But this war in heaven was very terrible and very real. While displaying none of the barbarities so characteristic of physical warfare on the immature worlds, this conflict was far more deadly; material life is in jeopardy in material combat, but the war in heaven was fought in terms of life eternal.
Bible References

53:6 A LOYAL SERAPHIC COMMANDER
53:6.1 There were many noble and inspiring acts of devotion and loyalty which were performed by numerous personalities during the interim between the outbreak of hostilities and the arrival of the new system ruler and his staff. But the most thrilling of all these daring feats of devotion was the courageous conduct of Manotia, the second in command of the Satania headquarters' seraphim.
53:6.2 At the outbreak of rebellion on Jerusem the head of the seraphic hosts joined the Lucifer cause. This no doubt explains why such a large number of the fourth order, the system administrator seraphim, went astray. The seraphic leader was spiritually blinded by the brilliant personality of Lucifer; his charming ways fascinated the lower orders of celestial beings. They simply could not comprehend that it was possible for such a dazzling personality to go wrong.
53:6.3 Not long since, in describing the experiences associated with the onset of the Lucifer rebellion, Manotia said: " But my most exhilarating moment was the thrilling adventure connected with the Lucifer rebellion when, as second seraphic commander, I refused to participate in the projected insult to Michael; and the powerful rebels sought my destruction by means of the liaison forces they had arranged. There was a tremendous upheaval on Jerusem, but not a single loyal seraphim was harmed.
53:6.4 " Upon the default of my immediate superior it devolved upon me to assume command of the angelic hosts of Jerusem as the titular director of the confused seraphic affairs of the system. I was morally upheld by the Melchizedeks, ably assisted by a majority of the Material Sons, deserted by a tremendous group of my own order, but magnificently supported by the ascendant mortals on Jerusem.
53:6.5 " Having been automatically thrown out of the constellation circuits by the secession of Lucifer, we were dependent on the loyalty of our intelligence corps, who forwarded calls for help to Edentia from the near-by system of Rantulia; and we found that the kingdom of order, the intellect of loyalty, and the spirit of truth were inherently triumphant over rebellion, self-assertion, and so-called personal liberty; we were able to carry on until the arrival of the new System Sovereign, the worthy successor of Lucifer. And immediately thereafter I was assigned to the corps of the Melchizedek receivership of Urantia, assuming jurisdiction over the loyal seraphic orders on the world of the traitorous Caligastia, who had proclaimed his sphere a member of the newly projected system of `liberated worlds and emancipated personalities' proposed in the infamous Declaration of Liberty issued by Lucifer in his call to the `liberty-loving, free-thinking, and forward-looking intelligences of the misruled and maladministered worlds of Satania.' "
53:6.6 This angel is still in service on Urantia, functioning as associate chief of seraphim.

53:7 HISTORY OF THE REBELLION
53:7.1 The Lucifer rebellion was system wide. Thirty-seven seceding Planetary Princes swung their world administrations largely to the side of the archrebel. Only on Panoptia did the Planetary Prince fail to carry his people with him. On this world, under the guidance of the Melchizedeks, the people rallied to the support of Michael. Ellanora, a young woman of that mortal realm, grasped the leadership of the human races, and not a single soul on that strife-torn world enlisted under the Lucifer banner. And ever since have these loyal Panoptians served on the seventh Jerusem transition world as the caretakers and builders on the Father's sphere and its surrounding seven detention worlds. The Panoptians not only act as the literal custodians of these worlds, but they also execute the personal orders of Michael for the embellishment of these spheres for some future and unknown use. They do this work as they tarry en route to Edentia.
53:7.2 Throughout this period Caligastia was advocating the cause of Lucifer on Urantia. The Melchizedeks ably opposed the apostate Planetary Prince, but the sophistries of unbridled liberty and the delusions of self-assertion had every opportunity for deceiving the primitive peoples of a young and undeveloped world.
53:7.3 All secession propaganda had to be carried on by personal effort because the broadcast service and all other avenues of interplanetary communication were suspended by the action of the system circuit supervisors. Upon the actual outbreak of the insurrection the entire system of Satania was isolated in both the constellation and the universe circuits. During this time all incoming and outgoing messages were dispatched by seraphic agents and Solitary Messengers. The circuits to the fallen worlds were also cut off, so that Lucifer could not utilize this avenue for the furtherance of his nefarious scheme. And these circuits will not be restored so long as the archrebel lives within the confines of Satania.
53:7.4 This was a Lanonandek rebellion. The higher orders of local universe sonship did not join the Lucifer secession, although a few of the Life Carriers stationed on the rebel planets were somewhat influenced by the rebellion of the disloyal princes. None of the Trinitized Sons went astray. The Melchizedeks, archangels, and the Brilliant Evening Stars were all loyal to Michael and, with Gabriel, valiantly contended for the Father's will and the Son's rule.
53:7.5 No beings of Paradise origin were involved in disloyalty. Together with the Solitary Messengers they took up headquarters on the world of the Spirit and remained under the leadership of the Faithful of Days of Edentia. None of the conciliators apostatized, nor did a single one of the Celestial Recorders go astray. But a heavy toll was taken of the Morontia Companions and the Mansion World Teachers.
53:7.6 Of the supreme order of seraphim, not an angel was lost, but a considerable group of the next order, the superior, were deceived and ensnared. Likewise a few of the third or supervisor order of angels were misled. But the terrible breakdown came in the fourth group, the administrator angels, those seraphim who are normally assigned to the duties of the system capitals. Manotia saved almost two thirds of them, but slightly over one third followed their chief into the rebel ranks. One third of all the Jerusem cherubim attached to the administrator angels were lost with their disloyal seraphim.
53:7.7 Of the planetary angelic helpers, those assigned to the Material Sons, about one third were deceived, and almost ten per cent of the transition ministers were ensnared. In symbol John saw this when he wrote of the great red dragon, saying: " And his tail drew a third part of the stars of heaven and cast them down in darkness. "
53:7.8 The greatest loss occurred in the angelic ranks, but most of the lower orders of intelligence were involved in disloyalty. Of the 681,227 Material Sons lost in Satania, ninety-five per cent were casualties of the Lucifer rebellion. Large numbers of midway creatures were lost on those individual planets whose Planetary Princes joined the Lucifer cause.
53:7.9 In many respects this rebellion was the most widespread and disastrous of all such occurrences in Nebadon. More personalities were involved in this insurrection than in both of the others. And it is to their everlasting dishonor that the emissaries of Lucifer and Satan spared not the infant-training schools on the finaliter cultural planet but rather sought to corrupt these developing minds in mercy salvaged from the evolutionary worlds.
53:7.10 The ascending mortals were vulnerable, but they withstood the sophistries of rebellion better than the lower spirits. While many on the lower mansion worlds, those who had not attained final fusion with their Adjusters, fell, it is recorded to the glory of the wisdom of the ascension scheme that not a single member of the Satania ascendant citizenship resident on Jerusem participated in the Lucifer rebellion.
53:7.11 Hour by hour and day by day the broadcast stations of all Nebadon were thronged by the anxious watchers of every imaginable class of celestial intelligence, who intently perused the bulletins of the Satania rebellion and rejoiced as the reports continuously narrated the unswerving loyalty of the ascending mortals who, under their Melchizedek leadership, successfully withstood the combined and protracted efforts of all the subtle evil forces which so swiftly gathered around the banners of secession and sin.
53:7.12 It was over two years of system time from the beginning of the " war in heaven " until the installation of Lucifer's successor. But at last the new Sovereign came, landing on the sea of glass with his staff. I was among the reserves mobilized on Edentia by Gabriel, and I well remember the first message of Lanaforge to the Constellation Father of Norlatiadek. It read: " Not a single Jerusem citizen was lost. Every ascendant mortal survived the fiery trial and emerged from the crucial test triumphant and altogether victorious. " And on to Salvington, Uversa, and Paradise went this message of assurance that the survival experience of mortal ascension is the greatest security against rebellion and the surest safeguard against sin. This noble Jerusem band of faithful mortals numbered just 187,432,811.
53:7.13 With the arrival of Lanaforge the archrebels were dethroned and shorn of all governing powers, though they were permitted freely to go about Jerusem, the morontia spheres, and even to the individual inhabited worlds. They continued their deceptive and seductive efforts to confuse and mislead the minds of men and angels. But as concerned their work on the administrative mount of Jerusem, " their place was found no more. "
53:7.14 While Lucifer was deprived of all administrative authority in Satania, there then existed no local universe power nor tribunal which could detain or destroy this wicked rebel; at that time Michael was not a sovereign ruler. The Ancients of Days sustained the Constellation Fathers in their seizure of the system government, but they have never handed down any subsequent decisions in the many appeals still pending with regard to the present status and future disposition of Lucifer, Satan, and their associates.
53:7.15 Thus were these archrebels allowed to roam the entire system to seek further penetration for their doctrines of discontent and self-assertion. But in almost two hundred thousand Urantia years they have been unable to deceive another world. No Satania worlds have been lost since the fall of the thirty-seven, not even those younger worlds peopled since that day of rebellion.
Bible References

53:8 THE SON OF MAN ON URANTIA
53:8.1 Lucifer and Satan freely roamed the Satania system until the completion of the bestowal mission of Michael on Urantia. They were last on your world together during the time of their combined assault upon the Son of Man.
53:8.2 Formerly, when the Planetary Princes, the " Sons of God, " were periodically assembled, " Satan came also, " claiming that he represented all of the isolated worlds of the fallen Planetary Princes. But he has not been accorded such liberty on Jerusem since Michael's terminal bestowal. Subsequent to their effort to corrupt Michael when in the bestowal flesh, all sympathy for Lucifer and Satan has perished throughout all Satania, that is, outside the isolated worlds of sin.
53:8.3 The bestowal of Michael terminated the Lucifer rebellion in all Satania aside from the planets of the apostate Planetary Princes. And this was the significance of Jesus' personal experience, just before his death in the flesh, when he one day exclaimed to his disciples, " And I beheld Satan fall as lightning from heaven. " He had come with Lucifer to Urantia for the last crucial struggle.
53:8.4 The Son of Man was confident of success, and he knew that his triumph on your world would forever settle the status of his agelong enemies, not only in Satania but also in the other two systems where sin had entered. There was survival for mortals and security for angels when your Master, in reply to the Lucifer proposals, calmly and with divine assurance replied, " Get you behind me, Satan. " That was, in principle, the real end of the Lucifer rebellion. True, the Uversa tribunals have not yet rendered the executive decision regarding the appeal of Gabriel praying for the destruction of the rebels, but such a decree will, no doubt, be forthcoming in the fullness of time since the first step in the hearing of this case has already been taken.
53:8.5 Caligastia was recognized by the Son of Man as the technical Prince of Urantia up to near the time of his death. Said Jesus: " Now is the judgment of this world; now shall the prince of this world be cast down. " And then still nearer the completion of his lifework he announced, " The prince of this world is judged. " And it is this same dethroned and discredited Prince who was once termed " God of Urantia. "
53:8.6 The last act of Michael before leaving Urantia was to offer mercy to Caligastia and Daligastia, but they spurned his tender proffer. Caligastia, your apostate Planetary Prince, is still free on Urantia to prosecute his nefarious designs, but he has absolutely no power to enter the minds of men, neither can he draw near to their souls to tempt or corrupt them unless they really desire to be cursed with his wicked presence.
53:8.7 Before the bestowal of Michael these rulers of darkness sought to maintain their authority on Urantia, and they persistently withstood the minor and subordinate celestial personalities. But since the day of Pentecost this traitorous Caligastia and his equally contemptible associate, Daligastia, are servile before the divine majesty of the Paradise Thought Adjusters and the protective Spirit of Truth, the spirit of Michael, which has been poured out upon all flesh.
53:8.8 But even so, no fallen spirit ever did have the power to invade the minds or to harass the souls of the children of God. Neither Satan nor Caligastia could ever touch or approach the faith sons of God; faith is an effective armor against sin and iniquity. It is true: " He who is born of God keeps himself, and the wicked one touches him not. "
53:8.9 In general, when weak and dissolute mortals are supposed to be under the influence of devils and demons, they are merely being dominated by their own inherent and debased tendencies, being led away by their own natural propensities. The devil has been given a great deal of credit for evil which does not belong to him. Caligastia has been comparatively impotent since the cross of Christ.
Bible References

53:9 PRESENT STATUS OF THE REBELLION
53:9.1 Early in the days of the Lucifer rebellion, salvation was offered all rebels by Michael. To all who would show proof of sincere repentance, he offered, upon his attainment of complete universe sovereignty, forgiveness and reinstatement in some form of universe service. None of the leaders accepted this merciful proffer. But thousands of the angels and the lower orders of celestial beings, including hundreds of the Material Sons and Daughters, accepted the mercy proclaimed by the Panoptians and were given rehabilitation at the time of Jesus' resurrection nineteen hundred years ago. These beings have since been transferred to the Father's world of Jerusem, where they must be held, technically, until the Uversa courts hand down a decision in the matter of Gabriel vs. Lucifer. But no one doubts that, when the annihilation verdict is issued, these repentant and salvaged personalities will be exempted from the decree of extinction. These probationary souls now labor with the Panoptians in the work of caring for the Father's world.
53:9.2 The archdeceiver has never been on Urantia since the days when he sought to turn back Michael from the purpose to complete the bestowal and to establish himself finally and securely as the unqualified ruler of Nebadon. Upon Michael's becoming the settled head of the universe of Nebadon, Lucifer was taken into custody by the agents of the Uversa Ancients of Days and has since been a prisoner on satellite number one of the Father's group of the transition spheres of Jerusem. And here the rulers of other worlds and systems behold the end of the unfaithful Sovereign of Satania. Paul knew of the status of these rebellious leaders following Michael's bestowal, for he wrote of Caligastia' s chiefs as " spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places. "
53:9.3 Michael, upon assuming the supreme sovereignty of Nebadon, petitioned the Ancients of Days for authority to intern all personalities concerned in the Lucifer rebellion pending the rulings of the superuniverse tribunals in the case of Gabriel vs. Lucifer, placed on the records of the Uversa supreme court almost two hundred thousand years ago, as you reckon time. Concerning the system capital group, the Ancients of Days granted the Michael petition with but a single exception: Satan was allowed to make periodic visits to the apostate princes on the fallen worlds until another Son of God should be accepted by such apostate worlds, or until such time as the courts of Uversa should begin the adjudication of the case of Gabriel vs. Lucifer.
53:9.4 Satan could come to Urantia because you had no Son of standing in residence—neither Planetary Prince nor Material Son. Machiventa Melchizedek has since been proclaimed vicegerent Planetary Prince of Urantia, and the opening of the case of Gabriel vs. Lucifer has signalized the inauguration of temporary planetary regimes on all the isolated worlds. It is true that Satan did periodically visit Caligastia and others of the fallen princes right up to the time of the presentation of these revelations, when there occurred the first hearing of Gabriel's plea for the annihilation of the archrebels. Satan is now unqualifiedly detained on the Jerusem prison worlds.
53:9.5 Since Michael's final bestowal no one in all Satania has desired to go to the prison worlds to minister to the interned rebels. And no more beings have been won to the deceiver's cause. For nineteen hundred years the status has been unchanged.
53:9.6 We do not look for a removal of the present Satania restrictions until the Ancients of Days make final disposition of the archrebels. The system circuits will not be reinstated so long as Lucifer lives. Meantime, he is wholly inactive.
53:9.7 The rebellion has ended on Jerusem. It ends on the fallen worlds as fast as divine Sons arrive. We believe that all rebels who will ever accept mercy have done so. We await the flashing broadcast that will deprive these traitors of personality existence. We anticipate the verdict of Uversa will be announced by the executionary broadcast which will effect the annihilation of these interned rebels. Then will you look for their places, but they shall not be found. " And they who know you among the worlds will be astonished at you; you have been a terror, but never shall you be any more. " And thus shall all of these unworthy traitors " become as though they had not been. " All await the Uversa decree.
53:9.8 But for ages the seven prison worlds of spiritual darkness in Satania have constituted a solemn warning to all Nebadon, eloquently and effectively proclaiming the great truth " that the way of the transgressor is hard "; " that within every sin is concealed the seed of its own destruction "; that " the wages of sin is death."

PAPER 54: PROBLEMS OF THE LUCIFER REBELLION - from the Urantia Book http://www.urantia.org/en/urantia-book-standardized/paper-54-problems-lucifer-rebellion

54:0.1 Evolutionary man finds it difficult fully to comprehend the significance and to grasp the meanings of evil, error, sin, and iniquity. Man is slow to perceive that contrastive perfection and imperfection produce potential evil; that conflicting truth and falsehood create confusing error; that the divine endowment of freewill choice eventuates in the divergent realms of sin and righteousness; that the persistent pursuit of divinity leads to the kingdom of God as contrasted with its continuous rejection, which leads to the domains of iniquity.
54:0.2 The Gods neither create evil nor permit sin and rebellion. Potential evil is time-existent in a universe embracing differential levels of perfection meanings and values. Sin is potential in all realms where imperfect beings are endowed with the ability to choose between good and evil. The very conflicting presence of truth and untruth, fact and falsehood, constitutes the potentiality of error. The deliberate choice of evil constitutes sin; the willful rejection of truth is error; the persistent pursuit of sin and error is iniquity.

54:1 TRUE AND FALSE LIBERTY
54:1.1 Of all the perplexing problems growing out of the Lucifer rebellion, none has occasioned more difficulty than the failure of immature evolutionary mortals to distinguish between true and false liberty.
54:1.2 True liberty is the quest of the ages and the reward of evolutionary progress. False liberty is the subtle deception of the error of time and the evil of space. Enduring liberty is predicated on the reality of justice—intelligence, maturity, fraternity, and equity.
54:1.3 Liberty is a self-destroying technique of cosmic existence when its motivation is unintelligent, unconditioned, and uncontrolled. True liberty is progressively related to reality and is ever regardful of social equity, cosmic fairness, universe fraternity, and divine obligations.
54:1.4 Liberty is suicidal when divorced from material justice, intellectual fairness, social forbearance, moral duty, and spiritual values. Liberty is nonexistent apart from cosmic reality, and all personality reality is proportional to its divinity relationships.
54:1.5 Unbridled self-will and unregulated self-expression equal unmitigated selfishness, the acme of ungodliness. Liberty without the associated and ever-increasing conquest of self is a figment of egoistic mortal imagination. Self-motivated liberty is a conceptual illusion, a cruel deception. License masquerading in the garments of liberty is the forerunner of abject bondage.
54:1.6 True liberty is the associate of genuine self-respect; false liberty is the consort of self-admiration. True liberty is the fruit of self-control; false liberty, the assumption of self-assertion. Self-control leads to altruistic service; self-admiration tends towards the exploitation of others for the selfish aggrandizement of such a mistaken individual as is willing to sacrifice righteous attainment for the sake of possessing unjust power over his fellow beings.
54:1.7 Even wisdom is divine and safe only when it is cosmic in scope and spiritual in motivation.
54:1.8 There is no error greater than that species of self-deception which leads intelligent beings to crave the exercise of power over other beings for the purpose of depriving these persons of their natural liberties. The golden rule of human fairness cries out against all such fraud, unfairness, selfishness, and unrighteousness. Only true and genuine liberty is compatible with the reign of love and the ministry of mercy.
54:1.9 How dare the self-willed creature encroach upon the rights of his fellows in the name of personal liberty when the Supreme Rulers of the universe stand back in merciful respect for these prerogatives of will and potentials of personality! No being, in the exercise of his supposed personal liberty, has a right to deprive any other being of those privileges of existence conferred by the Creators and duly respected by all their loyal associates, subordinates, and subjects.
54:1.10 Evolutionary man may have to contend for his material liberties with tyrants and oppressors on a world of sin and iniquity or during the early times of a primitive evolving sphere, but not so on the morontia worlds or on the spirit spheres. War is the heritage of early evolutionary man, but on worlds of normal advancing civilization physical combat as a technique of adjusting racial misunderstandings has long since fallen into disrepute.

54:2 THE THEFT OF LIBERTY
54:2.1 With the Son and in the Spirit did God project eternal Havona, and ever since has there obtained the eternal pattern of co-ordinate participation in creation—sharing. This pattern of sharing is the master design for every one of the Sons and Daughters of God who go out into space to engage in the attempt to duplicate in time the central universe of eternal perfection.
54:2.2 Every creature of every evolving universe who aspires to do the Father's will is destined to become the partner of the time-space Creators in this magnificent adventure of experiential perfection attainment. Were this not true, the Father would have hardly endowed such creatures with creative free will, neither would he indwell them, actually go into partnership with them by means of his own spirit.
54:2.3 Lucifer' s folly was the attempt to do the nondoable, to short-circuit time in an experiential universe. Lucifer's crime was the attempted creative disenfranchisement of every personality in Satania, the unrecognized abridgment of the creature's personal participation—freewill participation—in the long evolutionary struggle to attain the status of light and life both individually and collectively. In so doing, this onetime Sovereign of your system set the temporal purpose of his own will directly athwart the eternal purpose of God's will as it is revealed in the bestowal of free will upon all personal creatures. The Lucifer rebellion thus threatened the maximum possible infringement of the freewill choice of the ascenders and servers of the system of Satania—a threat forevermore to deprive every one of these beings of the thrilling experience of contributing something personal and unique to the slowly erecting monument to experiential wisdom which will sometime exist as the perfected system of Satania. Thus does the Lucifer manifesto, masquerading in the habiliments of liberty, stand forth in the clear light of reason as a monumental threat to consummate the theft of personal liberty and to do it on a scale that has been approached only twice in all the history of Nebadon.
54:2.4 In short, what God had given men and angels Lucifer would have taken away from them, that is, the divine privilege of participating in the creation of their own destinies and of the destiny of this local system of inhabited worlds.
54:2.5 No being in all the universe has the rightful liberty to deprive any other being of true liberty, the right to love and be loved, the privilege of worshiping God and of serving his fellows.
54:3 THE TIME LAG OF JUSTICE
Audio Version
54:3.1 The moral will creatures of the evolutionary worlds are always bothered with the unthinking question as to why the all-wise Creators permit evil and sin. They fail to comprehend that both are inevitable if the creature is to be truly free. The free will of evolving man or exquisite angel is not a mere philosophic concept, a symbolic ideal. Man's ability to choose good or evil is a universe reality. This liberty to choose for oneself is an endowment of the Supreme Rulers, and they will not permit any being or group of beings to deprive a single personality in the wide universe of this divinely bestowed liberty—not even to satisfy such misguided and ignorant beings in the enjoyment of this misnamed personal liberty.
54:3.2 Although conscious and wholehearted identification with evil (sin) is the equivalent of nonexistence (annihilation), there must always intervene between the time of such personal identification with sin and the execution of the penalty—the automatic result of such a willful embrace of evil—a period of time of sufficient length to allow for such an adjudication of such an individual's universe status as will prove entirely satisfactory to all related universe personalities, and which will be so fair and just as to win the approval of the sinner himself.
54:3.3 But if this universe rebel against the reality of truth and goodness refuses to approve the verdict, and if the guilty one knows in his heart the justice of his condemnation but refuses to make such confession, then must the execution of sentence be delayed in accordance with the discretion of the Ancients of Days. And the Ancients of Days refuse to annihilate any being until all moral values and all spiritual realities are extinct, both in the evildoer and in all related supporters and possible sympathizers.

54:4 THE MERCY TIME LAG
54:4.1 Another problem somewhat difficult of explanation in the constellation of Norlatiadek pertains to the reasons for permitting Lucifer, Satan, and the fallen princes to work mischief so long before being apprehended, interned, and adjudicated.
54:4.2 Parents, those who have borne and reared children, are better able to understand why Michael, a Creator-father, might be slow to condemn and destroy his own Sons. Jesus' story of the prodigal son well illustrates how a loving father can long wait for the repentance of an erring child.
54:4.3 The very fact that an evil-doing creature can actually choose to do wrong—commit sin—establishes the fact of free-willness and fully justifies any length delay in the execution of justice provided the extended mercy might conduce to repentance and rehabilitation.
54:4.4 Most of the liberties which Lucifer sought he already had; others he was to receive in the future. All these precious endowments were lost by giving way to impatience and yielding to a desire to possess what one craves now and to possess it in defiance of all obligation to respect the rights and liberties of all other beings composing the universe of universes. Ethical obligations are innate, divine, and universal.
54:4.5 There are many reasons known to us why the Supreme Rulers did not immediately destroy or intern the leaders of the Lucifer rebellion. There are no doubt still other and possibly better reasons unknown to us. The mercy features of this delay in the execution of justice were extended personally by Michael of Nebadon. Except for the affection of this Creator-father for his erring Sons, the supreme justice of the superuniverse would have acted. If such an episode as the Lucifer rebellion had occurred in Nebadon while Michael was incarnated on Urantia, the instigators of such evil might have been instantly and absolutely annihilated.
54:4.6 Supreme justice can act instantly when not restrained by divine mercy. But the ministry of mercy to the children of time and space always provides for this time lag, this saving interval between seedtime and harvest. If the seed sowing is good, this interval provides for the testing and upbuilding of character; if the seed sowing is evil, this merciful delay provides time for repentance and rectification. This time delay in the adjudication and execution of evildoers is inherent in the mercy ministry of the seven superuniverses. This restraint of justice by mercy proves that God is love, and that such a God of love dominates the universes and in mercy controls the fate and judgment of all his creatures.
54:4.7 The mercy delays of time are by the mandate of the free will of the Creators. There is good to be derived in the universe from this technique of patience in dealing with sinful rebels. While it is all too true that good cannot come of evil to the one who contemplates and performs evil, it is equally true that all things (including evil, potential and manifest) work together for good to all beings who know God, love to do his will, and are ascending Paradiseward according to his eternal plan and divine purpose.
54:4.8 But these mercy delays are not interminable. Notwithstanding the long delay (as time is reckoned on Urantia) in adjudicating the Lucifer rebellion, we may record that, during the time of effecting this revelation, the first hearing in the pending case of Gabriel vs. Lucifer was held on Uversa, and soon thereafter there issued the mandate of the Ancients of Days directing that Satan be henceforth confined to the prison world with Lucifer. This ends the ability of Satan to pay further visits to any of the fallen worlds of Satania. Justice in a mercy-dominated universe may be slow, but it is certain.
Bible References

54:5 THE WISDOM OF DELAY
54:5.1 Of the many reasons known to me as to why Lucifer and his confederates were not sooner interned or adjudicated, I am permitted to recite the following:
54:5.2 Mercy requires that every wrongdoer have sufficient time in which to formulate a deliberate and fully chosen attitude regarding his evil thoughts and sinful acts.
54:5.3 Supreme justice is dominated by a Father's love; therefore will justice never destroy that which mercy can save. Time to accept salvation is vouchsafed every evildoer.
54:5.4 No affectionate father is ever precipitate in visiting punishment upon an erring member of his family. Patience cannot function independently of time.
54:5.5 While wrongdoing is always deleterious to a family, wisdom and love admonish the upright children to bear with an erring brother during the time granted by the affectionate father in which the sinner may see the error of his way and embrace salvation.
54:5.6 Regardless of Michael's attitude toward Lucifer, notwithstanding his being Lucifer's Creator-father, it was not in the province of the Creator Son to exercise summary jurisdiction over the apostate System Sovereign because he had not then completed his bestowal career, thereby attaining unqualified sovereignty of Nebadon.
54:5.7 The Ancients of Days could have immediately annihilated these rebels, but they seldom execute wrongdoers without a full hearing. In this instance they refused to overrule the Michael decisions.
54:5.8 It is evident that Immanuel counseled Michael to remain aloof from the rebels and allow rebellion to pursue a natural course of self-obliteration. And the wisdom of the Union of Days is the time reflection of the united wisdom of the Paradise Trinity.
54:5.9 The Faithful of Days on Edentia advised the Constellation Fathers to allow the rebels free course to the end that all sympathy for these evildoers should be the sooner uprooted in the hearts of every present and future citizen of Norlatiadek—every mortal, morontia, or spirit creature.
54:5.10 On Jerusem the personal representative of the Supreme Executive of Orvonton counseled Gabriel to foster full opportunity for every living creature to mature a deliberate choice in those matters involved in the Lucifer Declaration of Liberty. The issues of rebellion having been raised, the Paradise emergency adviser of Gabriel portrayed that, if such full and free opportunity were not given all Norlatiadek creatures, then would the Paradise quarantine against all such possible halfhearted or doubt-stricken creatures be extended in self-protection against the entire constellation. To keep open the Paradise doors of ascension to the beings of Norlatiadek, it was necessary to provide for the full development of rebellion and to insure the complete determination of attitude on the part of all beings in any way concerned therewith.
54:5.11 The Divine Minister of Salvington issued as her third independent proclamation a mandate directing that nothing be done to half cure, cowardly suppress, or otherwise hide the hideous visage of rebels and rebellion. The angelic hosts were directed to work for full disclosure and unlimited opportunity for sin-expression as the quickest technique of achieving the perfect and final cure of the plague of evil and sin.
54:5.12 An emergency council of ex-mortals consisting of Mighty Messengers, glorified mortals who had had personal experience with like situations, together with their colleagues, was organized on Jerusem. They advised Gabriel that at least three times the number of beings would be led astray if arbitrary or summary methods of suppression were attempted. The entire Uversa corps of counselors concurred in advising Gabriel to permit the rebellion to take its full and natural course, even if it should require a million years to wind up the consequences.
54:5.13 Time, even in a universe of time, is relative: If a Urantia mortal of average length of life should commit a crime which precipitated world-wide pandemonium, and if he were apprehended, tried, and executed within two or three days of the commission of the crime, would it seem a long time to you? And yet that would be nearer a comparison with the length of Lucifer's life even if his adjudication, now begun, should not be completed for a hundred thousand Urantia years. The relative lapse of time from the viewpoint of Uversa, where the litigation is pending, could be indicated by saying that the crime of Lucifer was being brought to trial within two and a half seconds of its commission. From the Paradise viewpoint the adjudication is simultaneous with the enactment.
54:5.14 There are an equal number of reasons for not arbitrarily stopping the Lucifer rebellion which would be partially comprehensible to you, but which I am not permitted to narrate. I may inform you that on Uversa we teach forty-eight reasons for permitting evil to run the full course of its own moral bankruptcy and spiritual extinction. I doubt not that there are just as many additional reasons not known to me.

54:6 THE TRIUMPH OF LOVE
54:6.1 Whatever the difficulties evolutionary mortals may encounter in their efforts to understand the Lucifer rebellion, it should be clear to all reflective thinkers that the technique of dealing with the rebels is a vindication of divine love. The loving mercy extended to the rebels does seem to have involved many innocent beings in trials and tribulations, but all these distraught personalities may securely depend upon the all-wise Judges to adjudicate their destinies in mercy as well as justice.
54:6.2 In all their dealings with intelligent beings, both the Creator Son and his Paradise Father are love dominated. It is impossible to comprehend many phases of the attitude of the universe rulers toward rebels and rebellion—sin and sinners—unless it be remembered that God as a Father takes precedence over all other phases of Deity manifestation in all the dealings of divinity with humanity. It should also be recalled that the Paradise Creator Sons are all mercy motivated.
54:6.3 If an affectionate father of a large family chooses to show mercy to one of his children guilty of grievous wrongdoing, it may well be that the extension of mercy to this misbehaving child will work a temporary hardship upon all the other and well-behaved children. Such eventualities are inevitable; such a risk is inseparable from the reality situation of having a loving parent and of being a member of a family group. Each member of a family profits by the righteous conduct of every other member; likewise must each member suffer the immediate time-consequences of the misconduct of every other member. Families, groups, nations, races, worlds, systems, constellations, and universes are relationships of association which possess individuality; and therefore does every member of any such group, large or small, reap the benefits and suffer the consequences of the rightdoing and the wrongdoing of all other members of the group concerned.
54:6.4 But one thing should be made clear: If you are made to suffer the evil consequences of the sin of some member of your family, some fellow citizen or fellow mortal, even rebellion in the system or elsewhere—no matter what you may have to endure because of the wrongdoing of your associates, fellows, or superiors—you may rest secure in the eternal assurance that such tribulations are transient afflictions. None of these fraternal consequences of misbehavior in the group can ever jeopardize your eternal prospects or in the least degree deprive you of your divine right of Paradise ascension and God attainment.
54:6.5 And there is compensation for these trials, delays, and disappointments which invariably accompany the sin of rebellion. Of the many valuable repercussions of the Lucifer rebellion which might be named, I will only call attention to the enhanced careers of those mortal ascenders, the Jerusem citizens, who, by withstanding the sophistries of sin, placed themselves in line for becoming future Mighty Messengers, fellows of my own order. Every being who stood the test of that evil episode thereby immediately advanced his administrative status and enhanced his spiritual worth.
54:6.6 At first the Lucifer upheaval appeared to be an unmitigated calamity to the system and to the universe. Gradually benefits began to accrue. With the passing of twenty-five thousand years of system time (twenty thousand years of Urantia time), the Melchizedeks began to teach that the good resulting from Lucifer's folly had come to equal the evil incurred. The sum of evil had by that time become almost stationary, continuing to increase only on certain isolated worlds, while the beneficial repercussions continued to multiply and extend out through the universe and superuniverse, even to Havona. The Melchizedeks now teach that the good resulting from the Satania rebellion is more than a thousand times the sum of all the evil.
54:6.7 But such an extraordinary and beneficent harvest of wrongdoing could only be brought about by the wise, divine, and merciful attitude of all of Lucifer's superiors, extending from the Constellation Fathers on Edentia to the Universal Father on Paradise. The passing of time has enhanced the consequential good to be derived from the Lucifer folly; and since the evil to be penalized was quite fully developed within a comparatively short time, it is apparent that the all-wise and farseeing universe rulers would be certain to extend the time in which to reap increasingly beneficial results. Regardless of the many additional reasons for delaying the apprehension and adjudication of the Satania rebels, this one gain would have been enough to explain why these sinners were not sooner interned, and why they have not been adjudicated and destroyed.
54:6.8 Shortsighted and time-bound mortal minds should be slow to criticize the time delays of the farseeing and all-wise administrators of universe affairs.
54:6.9 One error of human thinking respecting these problems consists in the idea that all evolutionary mortals on an evolving planet would choose to enter upon the Paradise career if sin had not cursed their world. The ability to decline survival does not date from the times of the Lucifer rebellion. Mortal man has always possessed the endowment of freewill choice regarding the Paradise career.
54:6.10 As you ascend in the survival experience, you will broaden your universe concepts and extend your horizon of meanings and values; and thus will you be able the better to understand why such beings as Lucifer and Satan are permitted to continue in rebellion. You will also better comprehend how ultimate (if not immediate) good can be derived from time-limited evil. After you attain Paradise, you will really be enlightened and comforted when you listen to the superaphic philosophers discuss and explain these profound problems of universe adjustment. But even then, I doubt that you will be fully satisfied in your own minds. At least I was not even when I had thus attained the acme of universe philosophy. I did not achieve a full comprehension of these complexities until after I had been assigned to administrative duties in the superuniverse, where by actual experience I have acquired conceptual capacity adequate for the comprehension of such many-sided problems in cosmic equity and spiritual philosophy. As you ascend Paradiseward, you will increasingly learn that many problematic features of universe administration can only be comprehended subsequent to the acquirement of increased experiential capacity and to the achievement of enhanced spiritual insight. Cosmic wisdom is essential to the understanding of cosmic situations.


I'm just trying to get at the essence of the politics, religion, architecture, art, music, etc. through all of history - and to then incorporate the best of this into a new paradigm (with the help of George Green!). The theory is that there is a central source of most of this which is not the Creator God of the Universe - yet which is not the Human Race As We Know It. There seems to be an In Between Source of Most of This which is a combination of Superhuman Genius and Cruel Inhuman Insanity. I was just looking at a tourists picture book of Rome. The art and architecture in Rome is beyond comprehension. The artrocities and deceptions perpetrated in Rome are unmentionable and unfathomable. But was their source the same? Does this source rule the world through the City States today? I'm leaning strongly in that direction. How do we throw out the bathwater without throwing out the baby? What do you think Lucifer? Have you placed a poison-pill in the middle of all of this? If so - would you please remove it - retire - and serve as an advisor from a distance? Sometimes I think you're the only one who pays much attention to these threads. On the other hand - if people really got deeply involved in all of this - they probably couldn't handle it. I guess I just want a critical mass of beings in this solar system (human, hybrid, and otherwise) to really do the right thing at this point in time. I'm not really sure what that is - but I am damn sure that it's not business as usual - as seen throughout history. We need to clean this mess up NOW. RIGHT NOW.


The Controversy Ended - from 'The Great Controversy' by Ellen White http://www.whiteestate.org/books/gc/gc42.html

At the close of the thousand years, Christ again returns to the earth. He is accompanied by the host of the redeemed and attended by a retinue of angels. As He descends in terrific majesty He bids the wicked dead arise to receive their doom. They come forth, a mighty host, numberless as the sands of the sea. What a contrast to those who were raised at the first resurrection! The righteous were clothed with immortal youth and beauty. The wicked bear the traces of disease and death.

Every eye in that vast multitude is turned to behold the glory of the Son of God. With one voice the wicked hosts exclaim: "Blessed is He that cometh in the name of the Lord!" It is not love to Jesus that inspires this utterance. The force of truth urges the words from unwilling lips. As the wicked went into their graves, so they come forth with the same enmity to Christ and the same spirit of rebellion. They are to have no new probation in which to remedy the defects of their past lives. Nothing would be gained by this. A lifetime of transgression has not softened their hearts. A second probation, were it given them, would be occupied as was the first in evading the requirements of God and exciting rebellion against Him.

Christ descends upon the Mount of Olives, whence, after His resurrection, He ascended, and where angels repeated the promise of His return. Says the prophet: "The Lord my God shall come, and all the saints with Thee." "And His feet shall stand in that day upon the Mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the Mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof, . . . and there shall be a very great valley." "And the Lord shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one Lord, and His name one." Zechariah 14:5, 4, 9. As the New Jerusalem, in its dazzling splendor, comes down out of heaven, it rests upon the place purified and made ready to receive it, and Christ, with His people and the angels, enters the Holy City.

Now Satan prepares for a last mighty struggle for the supremacy. While deprived of his power and cut off from his work of deception, the prince of evil was miserable and dejected; but as the wicked dead are raised and he sees the vast multitudes upon his side, his hopes revive, and he determines not to yield the great controversy. He will marshal all the armies of the lost under his banner and through them endeavor to execute his plans. The wicked are Satan's captives. In rejecting Christ they have accepted the rule of the rebel leader. They are ready to receive his suggestions and to do his bidding. Yet, true to his early cunning, he does not acknowledge himself to be Satan. He claims to be the prince who is the rightful owner of the world and whose inheritance has been unlawfully wrested from him. He represents himself to his deluded subjects as a redeemer, assuring them that his power has brought them forth from their graves and that he is about to rescue them from the most cruel tyranny. The presence of Christ having been removed, Satan works wonders to support his claims. He makes the weak strong and inspires all with his own spirit and energy. He proposes to lead them against the camp of the saints and to take possession of the City of God. With fiendish exultation he points to the unnumbered millions who have been raised from the dead and declares that as their leader he is well able to overthrow the city and regain his throne and his kingdom.

In that vast throng are multitudes of the long-lived race that existed before the Flood; men of lofty stature and giant intellect, who, yielding to the control of fallen angels, devoted all their skill and knowledge to the exaltation of themselves; men whose wonderful works of art led the world to idolize their genius, but whose cruelty and evil inventions, defiling the earth and defacing the image of God, caused Him to blot them from the face of His creation. There are kings and generals who conquered nations, valiant men who never lost a battle, proud, ambitious warriors whose approach made kingdoms tremble. In death these experienced no change. As they come up from the grave, they resume the current of their thoughts just where it ceased. They are actuated by the same desire to conquer that ruled them when they fell.

Satan consults with his angels, and then with these kings and conquerors and mighty men. They look upon the strength and numbers on their side, and declare that the army within the city is small in comparison with theirs, and that it can be overcome. They lay their plans to take possession of the riches and glory of the New Jerusalem. All immediately begin to prepare for battle. Skillful artisans construct implements of war. Military leaders, famed for their success, marshal the throngs of warlike men into companies and divisions.

At last the order to advance is given, and the countless host moves on--an army such as was never summoned by earthly conquerors, such as the combined forces of all ages since war began on earth could never equal. Satan, the mightiest of warriors, leads the van, and his angels unite their forces for this final struggle. Kings and warriors are in his train, and the multitudes follow in vast companies, each under its appointed leader. With military precision the serried ranks advance over the earth's broken and uneven surface to the City of God. By command of Jesus, the gates of the New Jerusalem are closed, and the armies of Satan surround the city and make ready for the onset.

Now Christ again appears to the view of His enemies. Far above the city, upon a foundation of burnished gold, is a throne, high and lifted up. Upon this throne sits the Son of God, and around Him are the subjects of His kingdom. The power and majesty of Christ no language can describe, no pen portray. The glory of the Eternal Father is enshrouding His Son. The brightness of His presence fills the City of God, and flows out beyond the gates, flooding the whole earth with its radiance.

Nearest the throne are those who were once zealous in the cause of Satan, but who, plucked as brands from the burning, have followed their Saviour with deep, intense devotion. Next are those who perfected Christian characters in the midst of falsehood and infidelity, those who honored the law of God when the Christian world declared it void, and the millions, of all ages, who were martyred for their faith. And beyond is the "great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, . . . before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands." Revelation 7:9. Their warfare is ended, their victory won. They have run the race and reached the prize. The palm branch in their hands is a symbol of their triumph, the white robe an emblem of the spotless righteousness of Christ which now is theirs.

The redeemed raise a song of praise that echoes and re-echoes through the vaults of heaven: "Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb." Verse 10. And angel and seraph unite their voices in adoration. As the redeemed have beheld the power and malignity of Satan, they have seen, as never before, that no power but that of Christ could have made them conquerors. In all that shining throng there are none to ascribe salvation to themselves, as if they had prevailed by their own power and goodness. Nothing is said of what they have done or suffered; but the burden of every song, the keynote of every anthem, is: Salvation to our God and unto the Lamb.

In the presence of the assembled inhabitants of earth and heaven the final coronation of the Son of God takes place. And now, invested with supreme majesty and power, the King of kings pronounces sentence upon the rebels against His government and executes justice upon those who have transgressed His law and oppressed His people. Says the prophet of God: "I saw a great white throne, and Him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works." Revelation 20:11, 12.

As soon as the books of record are opened, and the eye of Jesus looks upon the wicked, they are conscious of every sin which they have ever committed. They see just where their feet diverged from the path of purity and holiness, just how far pride and rebellion have carried them in the violation of the law of God. The seductive temptations which they encouraged by indulgence in sin, the blessings perverted, the messengers of God despised, the warnings rejected, the waves of mercy beaten back by the stubborn, unrepentant heart--all appear as if written in letters of fire.

Above the throne is revealed the cross; and like a panoramic view appear the scenes of Adam's temptation and fall, and the successive steps in the great plan of redemption. The Saviour's lowly birth; His early life of simplicity and obedience; His baptism in Jordan; the fast and temptation in the wilderness; His public ministry, unfolding to men heaven's most precious blessings; the days crowded with deeds of love and mercy, the nights of prayer and watching in the solitude of the mountains; the plottings of envy, hate, and malice which repaid His benefits; the awful, mysterious agony in Gethsemane beneath the crushing weight of the sins of the whole world; His betrayal into the hands of the murderous mob; the fearful events of that night of horror--the unresisting prisoner, forsaken by His best-loved disciples, rudely hurried through the streets of Jerusalem; the Son of God exultingly displayed before Annas, arraigned in the high priest's palace, in the judgment hall of Pilate, before the cowardly and cruel Herod, mocked, insulted, tortured, and condemned to die--all are vividly portrayed.

And now before the swaying multitude are revealed the final scenes--the patient Sufferer treading the path to Calvary; the Prince of heaven hanging upon the cross; the haughty priests and the jeering rabble deriding His expiring agony; the supernatural darkness; the heaving earth, the rent rocks, the open graves, marking the moment when the world's Redeemer yielded up His life.

The awful spectacle appears just as it was. Satan, his angels, and his subjects have no power to turn from the picture of their own work. Each actor recalls the part which he performed. Herod, who slew the innocent children of Bethlehem that he might destroy the King of Israel; the base Herodias, upon whose guilty soul rests the blood of John the Baptist; the weak, timeserving Pilate; the mocking soldiers; the priests and rulers and the maddened throng who cried, "His blood be on us, and on our children!"--all behold the enormity of their guilt. They vainly seek to hide from the divine majesty of His countenance, outshining the glory of the sun, while the redeemed cast their crowns at the Saviour's feet, exclaiming: "He died for me!"

Amid the ransomed throng are the apostles of Christ, the heroic Paul, the ardent Peter, the loved and loving John, and their truehearted brethren, and with them the vast host of martyrs; while outside the walls, with every vile and abominable thing, are those by whom they were persecuted, imprisoned, and slain. There is Nero, that monster of cruelty and vice, beholding the joy and exaltation of those whom he once tortured, and in whose extremest anguish he found satanic delight. His mother is there to witness the result of her own work; to see how the evil stamp of character transmitted to her son, the passions encouraged and developed by her influence and example, have borne fruit in crimes that caused the world to shudder.

There are papist priests and prelates, who claimed to be Christ's ambassadors, yet employed the rack, the dungeon, and the stake to control the consciences of His people. There are the proud pontiffs who exalted themselves above God and presumed to change the law of the Most High. Those pretended fathers of the church have an account to render to God from which they would fain be excused. Too late they are made to see that the Omniscient One is jealous of His law and that He will in no wise clear the guilty. They learn now that Christ identifies His interest with that of His suffering people; and they feel the force of His own words: "Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these My brethren, ye have done it unto Me." Matthew 25:40.

The whole wicked world stand arraigned at the bar of God on the charge of high treason against the government of heaven. They have none to plead their cause; they are without excuse; and the sentence of eternal death is pronounced against them.

It is now evident to all that the wages of sin is not noble independence and eternal life, but slavery, ruin, and death. The wicked see what they have forfeited by their life of rebellion. The far more exceeding and eternal weight of glory was despised when offered them; but how desirable it now appears. "All this," cries the lost soul, "I might have had; but I chose to put these things far from me. Oh, strange infatuation! I have exchanged peace, happiness, and honor for wretchedness, infamy, and despair." All see that their exclusion from heaven is just. By their lives they have declared: "We will not have this Man [Jesus] to reign over us."

As if entranced, the wicked have looked upon the coronation of the Son of God. They see in His hands the tables of the divine law, the statutes which they have despised and transgressed. They witness the outburst of wonder, rapture, and adoration from the saved; and as the wave of melody sweeps over the multitudes without the city, all with one voice exclaim, "Great and marvelous are Thy works, Lord God Almighty; just and true are Thy ways, Thou King of saints" (Revelation 15:3); and, falling prostrate, they worship the Prince of life.

Satan seems paralyzed as he beholds the glory and majesty of Christ. He who was once a covering cherub remembers whence he has fallen. A shining seraph, "son of the morning;" how changed, how degraded! From the council where once he was honored, he is forever excluded. He sees another now standing near to the Father, veiling His glory. He has seen the crown placed upon the head of Christ by an angel of lofty stature and majestic presence, and he knows that the exalted position of this angel might have been his.

Memory recalls the home of his innocence and purity, the peace and content that were his until he indulged in murmuring against God, and envy of Christ. His accusations, his rebellion, his deceptions to gain the sympathy and support of the angels, his stubborn persistence in making no effort for self-recovery when God would have granted him forgiveness --all come vividly before him. He reviews his work among men and its results--the enmity of man toward his fellow man, the terrible destruction of life, the rise and fall of kingdoms, the overturning of thrones, the long succession of tumults, conflicts, and revolutions. He recalls his constant efforts to oppose the work of Christ and to sink man lower and lower. He sees that his hellish plots have been powerless to destroy those who have put their trust in Jesus. As Satan looks upon his kingdom, the fruit of his toil, he sees only failure and ruin. He has led the multitudes to believe that the City of God would be an easy prey; but he knows that this is false. Again and again, in the progress of the great controversy, he has been defeated and compelled to yield. He knows too well the power and majesty of the Eternal.

The aim of the great rebel has ever been to justify himself and to prove the divine government responsible for the rebellion. To this end he has bent all the power of his giant intellect. He has worked deliberately and systematically, and with marvelous success, leading vast multitudes to accept his version of the great controversy which has been so long in progress. For thousands of years this chief of conspiracy has palmed off falsehood for truth. But the time has now come when the rebellion is to be finally defeated and the history and character of Satan disclosed. In his last great effort to dethrone Christ, destroy His people, and take possession of the City of God, the archdeceiver has been fully unmasked. Those who have united with him see the total failure of his cause. Christ's followers and the loyal angels behold the full extent of his machinations against the government of God. He is the object of universal abhorrence.

Satan sees that his voluntary rebellion has unfitted him for heaven. He has trained his powers to war against God; the purity, peace, and harmony of heaven would be to him supreme torture. His accusations against the mercy and justice of God are now silenced. The reproach which he has endeavored to cast upon Jehovah rests wholly upon himself. And now Satan bows down and confesses the justice of his sentence.

"Who shall not fear Thee, O Lord, and glorify Thy name? for Thou only art holy: for all nations shall come and worship before Thee; for Thy judgments are made manifest." Verse 4. Every question of truth and error in the long-standing controversy has now been made plain. The results of rebellion, the fruits of setting aside the divine statutes, have been laid open to the view of all created intelligences. The working out of Satan's rule in contrast with the government of God has been presented to the whole universe. Satan's own works have condemned him. God's wisdom, His justice, and His goodness stand fully vindicated. It is seen that all His dealings in the great controversy have been conducted with respect to the eternal good of His people and the good of all the worlds that He has created. "All Thy works shall praise Thee, O Lord; and Thy saints shall bless Thee." Psalm 145:10. The history of sin will stand to all eternity as a witness that with the existence of God's law is bound up the happiness of all the beings He has created. With all the facts of the great controversy in view, the whole universe, both loyal and rebellious, with one accord declare: "Just and true are Thy ways, Thou King of saints."

Before the universe has been clearly presented the great sacrifice made by the Father and the Son in man's behalf. The hour has come when Christ occupies His rightful position and is glorified above principalities and powers and every name that is named. It was for the joy that was set before Him--that He might bring many sons unto glory--that He endured the cross and despised the shame. And inconceivably great as was the sorrow and the shame, yet greater is the joy and the glory. He looks upon the redeemed, renewed in His own image, every heart bearing the perfect impress of the divine, every face reflecting the likeness of their King. He beholds in them the result of the travail of His soul, and He is satisfied. Then, in a voice that reaches the assembled multitudes of the righteous and the wicked, He declares: "Behold the purchase of My blood! For these I suffered, for these I died, that they might dwell in My presence throughout eternal ages." And the song of praise ascends from the white-robed ones about the throne: "Worthy is the Lamb that was slain to receive power, and riches, and wisdom, and strength, and honor, and glory, and blessing." Revelation 5:12.

Notwithstanding that Satan has been constrained to acknowledge God's justice and to bow to the supremacy of Christ, his character remains unchanged. The spirit of rebellion, like a mighty torrent, again bursts forth. Filled with frenzy, he determines not to yield the great controversy. The time has come for a last desperate struggle against the King of heaven. He rushes into the midst of his subjects and endeavors to inspire them with his own fury and arouse them to instant battle. But of all the countless millions whom he has allured into rebellion, there are none now to acknowledge his supremacy. His power is at an end. The wicked are filled with the same hatred of God that inspires Satan; but they see that their case is hopeless, that they cannot prevail against Jehovah. Their rage is kindled against Satan and those who have been his agents in deception, and with the fury of demons they turn upon them.

Saith the Lord: "Because thou hast set thine heart as the heart of God; behold, therefore I will bring strangers upon thee, the terrible of the nations: and they shall draw their swords against the beauty of thy wisdom, and they shall defile thy brightness. They shall bring thee down to the pit." "I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire. . . . I will cast thee to the ground, I will lay thee before kings, that they may behold thee. . . . I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee. . . . Thou shalt be a terror, and never shalt thou be any more." Ezekiel 28:6-8, 16-19.

"Every battle of the warrior is with confused noise, and garments rolled in blood; but this shall be with burning and fuel of fire." "The indignation of the Lord is upon all nations, and His fury upon all their armies: He hath utterly destroyed them, He hath delivered them to the slaughter." "Upon the wicked He shall rain quick burning coals, fire and brimstone and an horrible tempest: this shall be the portion of their cup." Isaiah 9:5; 34:2; Psalm 11:6, margin. Fire comes down from God out of heaven. The earth is broken up. The weapons concealed in its depths are drawn forth. Devouring flames burst from every yawning chasm. The very rocks are on fire. The day has come that shall burn as an oven. The elements melt with fervent heat, the earth also, and the works that are therein are burned up. Malachi 4:1; 2 Peter 3:10. The earth's surface seems one molten mass--a vast, seething lake of fire. It is the time of the judgment and perdition of ungodly men--"the day of the Lord's vengeance, and the year of recompenses for the controversy of Zion." Isaiah 34:8.

The wicked receive their recompense in the earth. Proverbs 11:31. They "shall be stubble: and the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the Lord of hosts." Malachi 4:1. Some are destroyed as in a moment, while others suffer many days. All are punished "according to their deeds." The sins of the righteous having been transferred to Satan, he is made to suffer not only for his own rebellion, but for all the sins which he has caused God's people to commit. His punishment is to be far greater than that of those whom he has deceived. After all have perished who fell by his deceptions, he is still to live and suffer on. In the cleansing flames the wicked are at last destroyed, root and branch--Satan the root, his followers the branches. The full penalty of the law has been visited; the demands of justice have been met; and heaven and earth, beholding, declare the righteousness of Jehovah.

Satan's work of ruin is forever ended. For six thousand years he has wrought his will, filling the earth with woe and causing grief throughout the universe. The whole creation has groaned and travailed together in pain. Now God's creatures are forever delivered from his presence and temptations. "The whole earth is at rest, and is quiet: they [the righteous] break forth into singing." Isaiah 14:7. And a shout of praise and triumph ascends from the whole loyal universe. "The voice of a great multitude," "as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of mighty thunderings," is heard, saying: "Alleluia: for the Lord God omnipotent reigneth." Revelation 19:6.

While the earth was wrapped in the fire of destruction, the righteous abode safely in the Holy City. Upon those that had part in the first resurrection, the second death has no power. While God is to the wicked a consuming fire, He is to His people both a sun and a shield. Revelation 20:6; Psalm 84:11.

"I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away." Revelation 21:1. The fire that consumes the wicked purifies the earth. Every trace of the curse is swept away. No eternally burning hell will keep before the ransomed the fearful consequences of sin.

One reminder alone remains: Our Redeemer will ever bear the marks of His crucifixion. Upon His wounded head, upon His side, His hands and feet, are the only traces of the cruel work that sin has wrought. Says the prophet, beholding Christ in His glory: "He had bright beams coming out of His side: and there was the hiding of His power." Habakkuk 3:4, margin. That pierced side whence flowed the crimson stream that reconciled man to God--there is the Saviour's glory, there "the hiding of His power." "Mighty to save," through the sacrifice of redemption, He was therefore strong to execute justice upon them that despised God's mercy. And the tokens of His humiliation are His highest honor; through the eternal ages the wounds of Calvary will show forth His praise and declare His power.

"O Tower of the flock, the stronghold of the daughter of Zion, unto Thee shall it come, even the first dominion." Micah 4:8. The time has come to which holy men have looked with longing since the flaming sword barred the first pair from Eden, the time for "the redemption of the purchased possession." Ephesians 1:14. The earth originally given to man as his kingdom, betrayed by him into the hands of Satan, and so long held by the mighty foe, has been brought back by the great plan of redemption. All that was lost by sin has been restored. "Thus saith the Lord . . . that formed the earth and made it; He hath established it, He created it not in vain, He formed it to be inhabited." Isaiah 45:18. God's original purpose in the creation of the earth is fulfilled as it is made the eternal abode of the redeemed. "The righteous shall inherit the land, and dwell therein forever." Psalm 37:29.

A fear of making the future inheritance seem too material has led many to spiritualize away the very truths which lead us to look upon it as our home. Christ assured His disciples that He went to prepare mansions for them in the Father's house. Those who accept the teachings of God's word will not be wholly ignorant concerning the heavenly abode. And yet, "eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love Him." 1 Corinthians 2:9. Human language is inadequate to describe the reward of the righteous. It will be known only to those who behold it. No finite mind can comprehend the glory of the Paradise of God.

In the Bible the inheritance of the saved is called "a country." Hebrews 11:14-16. There the heavenly Shepherd leads His flock to fountains of living waters. The tree of life yields its fruit every month, and the leaves of the tree are for the service of the nations. There are ever-flowing streams, clear as crystal, and beside them waving trees cast their shadows upon the paths prepared for the ransomed of the Lord. There the wide-spreading plains swell into hills of beauty, and the mountains of God rear their lofty summits. On those peaceful plains, beside those living streams, God's people, so long pilgrims and wanderers, shall find a home.

"My people shall dwell in a peaceable habitation, and in sure dwellings, and in quiet resting places." "Violence shall no more be heard in thy land, wasting nor destruction within thy borders; but thou shalt call thy walls Salvation, and thy gates Praise." "They shall build houses, and inhabit them; and they shall plant vineyards, and eat the fruit of them. They shall not build, and another inhabit; they shall not plant, and another eat: . . . Mine elect shall long enjoy the work of their hands." Isaiah 32:18; 60:18; 65:21, 22.

There, "the wilderness and the solitary place shall be glad for them; and the desert shall rejoice, and blossom as the rose." "Instead of the thorn shall come up the fir tree, and instead of the brier shall come up the myrtle tree." "The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid; . . . and a little child shall lead them." "They shall not hurt nor destroy in all My holy mountain," saith the Lord. Isaiah 35:1; 55:13; 11:6, 9.

Pain cannot exist in the atmosphere of heaven. There will be no more tears, no funeral trains, no badges of mourning. "There shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying: . . . for the former things are passed away." "The inhabitant shall not say, I am sick: the people that dwell therein shall be forgiven their iniquity." Revelation 21:4; Isaiah 33:24.

There is the New Jerusalem, the metropolis of the glorified new earth, "a crown of glory in the hand of the Lord, and a royal diadem in the hand of thy God." "Her light was like unto a stone most precious, even like a jasper stone, clear as crystal." "The nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honor into it." Saith the Lord: "I will rejoice in Jerusalem, and joy in My people." "The tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they shall be His people, and God Himself shall be with them, and be their God." Isaiah 62:3; Revelation 21:11, 24; Isaiah 65:19; Revelation 21:3.

In the City of God "there shall be no night." None will need or desire repose. There will be no weariness in doing the will of God and offering praise to His name. We shall ever feel the freshness of the morning and shall ever be far from its close. "And they need no candle, neither light of the sun; for the Lord God giveth them light." Revelation 22:5. The light of the sun will be superseded by a radiance which is not painfully dazzling, yet which immeasurably surpasses the brightness of our noontide. The glory of God and the Lamb floods the Holy City with unfading light. The redeemed walk in the sunless glory of perpetual day.

"I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it." Revelation 21:22. The people of God are privileged to hold open communion with the Father and the Son. "Now we see through a glass, darkly." 1 Corinthians 13:12. We behold the image of God reflected, as in a mirror, in the works of nature and in His dealings with men; but then we shall see Him face to face, without a dimming veil between. We shall stand in His presence and behold the glory of His countenance.

There the redeemed shall know, even as also they are known. The loves and sympathies which God Himself has planted in the soul shall there find truest and sweetest exercise. The pure communion with holy beings, the harmonious social life with the blessed angels and with the faithful ones of all ages who have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb, the sacred ties that bind together "the whole family in heaven and earth" (Ephesians 3:15)--these help to constitute the happiness of the redeemed.

There, immortal minds will contemplate with never-failing delight the wonders of creative power, the mysteries of redeeming love. There will be no cruel, deceiving foe to tempt to forgetfulness of God. Every faculty will be developed, every capacity increased. The acquirement of knowledge will not weary the mind or exhaust the energies. There the grandest enterprises may be carried forward, the loftiest aspirations reached, the highest ambitions realized; and still there will arise new heights to surmount, new wonders to admire, new truths to comprehend, fresh objects to call forth the powers of mind and soul and body.

All the treasures of the universe will be open to the study of God's redeemed. Unfettered by mortality, they wing their tireless flight to worlds afar--worlds that thrilled with sorrow at the spectacle of human woe and rang with songs of gladness at the tidings of a ransomed soul. With unutterable delight the children of earth enter into the joy and the wisdom of unfallen beings. They share the treasures of knowledge and understanding gained through ages upon ages in contemplation of God's handiwork. With undimmed vision they gaze upon the glory of creation--suns and stars and systems, all in their appointed order circling the throne of Deity. Upon all things, from the least to the greatest, the Creator's name is written, and in all are the riches of His power displayed.

And the years of eternity, as they roll, will bring richer and still more glorious revelations of God and of Christ. As knowledge is progressive, so will love, reverence, and happiness increase. The more men learn of God, the greater will be their admiration of His character. As Jesus opens before them the riches of redemption and the amazing achievements in the great controversy with Satan, the hearts of the ransomed thrill with more fervent devotion, and with more rapturous joy they sweep the harps of gold; and ten thousand times ten thousand and thousands of thousands of voices unite to swell the mighty chorus of praise.

"And every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, Blessing, and honor, and glory, and power, be unto Him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever." Revelation 5:13.

The great controversy is ended. Sin and sinners are no more. The entire universe is clean. One pulse of harmony and gladness beats through the vast creation. From Him who created all, flow life and light and gladness, throughout the realms of illimitable space. From the minutest atom to the greatest world, all things, animate and inanimate, in their unshadowed beauty and perfect joy, declare that God is love.

The following is a post by Antonia on AV1 which I thought should be included in this thread. Thank-you Antonia. I trust that I have not used your post in vain. I see a light at the end of the tunnel...but things can be pretty dark at times. Hang on tight...this is a tough read. They don't usually include these texts in the lectionary. How would you like to preach on the following texts? These references are enough to cause a lot of people to run out of the church...sobbing. This is some of the worst material in the Bible. We need to face reality. All of it. I continue to enjoy studying theology - but I think the real truth of the matter is rather obscure and esoteric - and this takes a lot of work and speculation. I think the agnostics may have had it right all along. We just have to keep searching - regardless of how difficult the journey becomes. Did Lucifer have anything to do with the madness documented below - or did Lucifer fight this sort of thing? I'm presently thinking that most all of the mythologies and theologies have a common origin - and that they reveal various aspects of a central small-case deity - and that this might be Satan and/or Lucifer. The large-case Creator God of the Universe seems to be strangely absent in all of this earthly madness. Think human, and think solar system for the gods, goddesses, angels, demons, aliens, souls, interdimensional reptilians, et al. Think Occam's Razor. As you lose your faith - create another one. Never give up. Never stop. Namaste.

Ritual Human Sacrifice

"At that time the Spirit of the LORD came upon Jephthah, and he went throughout the land of Gilead and Manasseh, including Mizpah in Gilead, and led an army against the Ammonites. And Jephthah made a vow to the LORD. He said, "If you give me victory over the Ammonites, I will give to the LORD the first thing coming out of my house to greet me when I return in triumph. I will sacrifice it as a burnt offering."

"So Jephthah led his army against the Ammonites, and the LORD gave him victory. He thoroughly defeated the Ammonites from Aroer to an area near Minnith - twenty towns - and as far away as Abel-keramim. Thus Israel subdued the Ammonites. When Jephthah returned home to Mizpah, his daughter - his only child - ran out to meet him, playing on a tambourine and dancing for joy. When he saw her, he tore his clothes in anguish. "My daughter!" he cried out. "My heart is breaking! What a tragedy that you came out to greet me. For I have made a vow to the LORD and cannot take it back." And she said, "Father, you have made a promise to the LORD. You must do to me what you have promised, for the LORD has given you a great victory over your enemies, the Ammonites. But first let me go up and roam in the hills and weep with my friends for two months, because I will die a virgin." "You may go," Jephthah said. And he let her go away for two months. She and her friends went into the hills and wept because she would never have children. When she returned home, her father kept his vow, and she died a virgin. So it has become a custom in Israel for young Israelite women to go away for four days each year to lament the fate of Jephthah's daughter." Judges 11:29-40

Rules of genocide...

Suppose you hear in one of the towns the LORD your God is giving you that some worthless rabble among you have led their fellow citizens astray by encouraging them to worship foreign gods. In such cases, you must examine the facts carefully. If you find it is true and can prove that such a detestable act has occurred among you, you must attack that town and completely destroy all its inhabitants, as well as all the livestock. Then you must pile all the plunder in the middle of the street and burn it. Put the entire town to the torch as a burnt offering to the LORD your God. That town must remain a ruin forever; it may never be rebuilt. Keep none of the plunder that has been set apart for destruction. Then the LORD will turn from his fierce anger and be merciful to you. He will have compassion on you and make you a great nation, just as he solemnly promised your ancestors. "The LORD your God will be merciful only if you obey him and keep all the commands I am giving you today, doing what is pleasing to him." (Deuteronomy 13:13-19 NLT)

Gods blood lust…Baby Killing

"The glory of Israel will fly away like a bird, for your children will die at birth or perish in the womb or never even be conceived. Even if your children do survive to grow up, I will take them from you. It will be a terrible day when I turn away and leave you alone. I have watched Israel become as beautiful and pleasant as Tyre. But now Israel will bring out her children to be slaughtered." O LORD, what should I request for your people? I will ask for wombs that don't give birth and breasts that give no milk. The LORD says, "All their wickedness began at Gilgal; there I began to hate them. I will drive them from my land because of their evil actions. I will love them no more because all their leaders are rebels. The people of Israel are stricken. Their roots are dried up; they will bear no more fruit. And if they give birth, I will slaughter their beloved children." (Hosea 9:11-16 NLT)

God kills the Good Samaritan

"The ark of God was placed on a new cart and taken away from the house of Abinadab on the hill. Uzzah and Ahio, sons of Abinadab guided the cart, with Ahio walking before it, while David and all the Israelites made merry before the Lord with all their strength, with singing and with citharas, harps, tambourines, sistrums, and cymbals." "When they came to the threshing floor of Nodan, Uzzah reached out his hand to the ark of God to steady it, for the oxen were making it tip. But the Lord was angry with Uzzah; God struck him on that spot, and he died there before God." (2 Samuel 6:3-7 NAB)

Baby Bashing

"Happy those who seize your children and smash them against a rock." Psalms 137:9 NAB

Child Beating

"He who spares the rod hates his son, but he who loves him takes care to chastise him" (Proverbs 13:24 NAB)

"Chastise your son, for in this there is hope, but do not desire his death. The man of violent temper pays the penalty; even if you rescue him, you will have to do it again." (Proverbs 19:18-19 NAB)

God tells his people to Kill Followers of Other Religions

"If your own full brother, or your son or daughter, or your beloved wife, or you intimate friend, entices you secretly to serve other gods, whom you and your fathers have not known, gods of any other nations, near at hand or far away, from one end of the earth to the other: do not yield to him or listen to him, nor look with pity upon him, to spare or shield him, but kill him. Your hand shall be the first raised to slay him; the rest of the people shall join in with you. You shall stone him to death, because he sought to lead you astray from the Lord, your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, that place of slavery. And all Israel, hearing of this, shall fear and never do such evil as this in your midst." (Deuteronomy 13:7-12 NAB)

God demands Murder, Rape, and Pillage at Jabesh-gilead

"So they sent twelve thousand warriors to Jabesh-gilead with orders to kill everyone there, including women and children. "This is what you are to do," they said. "Completely destroy all the males and every woman who is not a virgin." Among the residents of Jabesh-gilead they found four hundred young virgins who had never slept with a man, and they brought them to the camp at Shiloh in the land of Canaan."

"The Israelite assembly sent a peace delegation to the little remnant of Benjamin who were living at the rock of Rimmon. Then the men of Benjamin returned to their homes, and the four hundred women of Jabesh-gilead who were spared were given to them as wives. But there were not enough women for all of them. The people felt sorry for Benjamin because the LORD had left this gap in the tribes of Israel. So the Israelite leaders asked, "How can we find wives for the few who remain, since all the women of the tribe of Benjamin are dead? There must be heirs for the survivors so that an entire tribe of Israel will not be lost forever. But we cannot give them our own daughters in marriage because we have sworn with a solemn oath that anyone who does this will fall under God's curse."

"Then they thought of the annual festival of the LORD held in Shiloh, between Lebonah and Bethel, along the east side of the road that goes from Bethel to Shechem. They told the men of Benjamin who still needed wives, "Go and hide in the vineyards. When the women of Shiloh come out for their dances, rush out from the vineyards, and each of you can take one of them home to be your wife! And when their fathers and brothers come to us in protest, we will tell them, 'Please be understanding. Let them have your daughters, for we didn't find enough wives for them when we destroyed Jabesh-gilead. And you are not guilty of breaking the vow since you did not give your daughters in marriage to them.'" So the men of Benjamin did as they were told. They kidnapped the women who took part in the celebration and carried them off to the land of their own inheritance. Then they rebuilt their towns and lived in them. So the assembly of Israel departed by tribes and families, and they returned to their own homes." (Judges 21:10-24 NLT)

David's Punishment More rape, murder and baby killing demanded by God

"Thus says the Lord: 'I will bring evil upon you out of your own house. I will take your wives (plural) while you live to see it, and will give them to your neighbor. He shall lie with your wives in broad daylight. You have done this deed in secret, but I will bring it about in the presence of all Israel, and with the sun looking down.'"
Then David said to Nathan, "I have sinned against the Lord." Nathan answered David: "The Lord on his part has forgiven your sin: you shall not die. But since you have utterly spurned the Lord by this deed, the child born to you must surely die." (The child dies seven days later.) 2 Samuel 12:11-14 NAB

Slave Beating

"When a man strikes his male or female slave with a rod so hard that the slave dies under his hand, he shall be punished. If, however, the slave survives for a day or two, he is not to be punished, since the slave is his own property." Exodus 21:20-21 NAB

Sampson and the Spirit of the Lord

"The spirit of the Lord came upon him (Sampson), and he went down to Ashkelon, where he killed thirty of their men and despoiled them; he gave their garments to those who had answered his riddle." (Sampson used the garments to pay off a bet he lost.) Judges 14:19 NAB

Bloody Sabbath God demands death of man for gathering wood.

"While the Israelites were in the desert, a man was discovered gathering wood on the Sabbath day. Those who caught him at it brought him to Moses and Aaron and the whole assembly. But they kept him in custody, for there was no clear decision as to what should be done with him. Then the Lord said to Moses, "This man shall be put to death; let the whole community stone him outside the camp." So the whole community led him outside the camp and stoned him to death as the Lord had commanded Moses." Numbers 15:32-36 NAB

Murder, Rape, Pillage, and Plunder

"As you approach a town to attack it, first offer its people terms for peace. If they accept your terms and open the gates to you, then all the people inside will serve you in forced labor. But if they refuse to make peace and prepare to fight, you must attack the town. When the LORD your God hands it over to you, kill every man in the town. But you may keep for yourselves all the women, children, livestock, and other plunder. You may enjoy the spoils of your enemies that the LORD your God has given you. But these instructions apply only to distant towns, not to the towns of nations nearby. "As for the towns of the nations the LORD your God is giving you as a special possession, destroy every living thing in them. You must completely destroy the Hittites, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites, and Jebusites, just as the LORD your God has commanded you. This will keep the people of the land from teaching you their detestable customs in the worship of their gods, which would cause you to sin deeply against the LORD your God." Deuteronomy 20:10-18 NLT

Murder, rape and pillage of the Midianites

"They attacked Midian just as the LORD had commanded Moses, and they killed all the men. All five of the Midianite kings - Evi, Rekem, Zur, Hur, and Reba - died in the battle. They also killed Balaam son of Beor with the sword. Then the Israelite army captured the Midianite women and children and seized their cattle and flocks and all their wealth as plunder. They burned all the towns and villages where the Midianites had lived. After they had gathered the plunder and captives, both people and animals, they brought them all to Moses and Eleazar the priest, and to the whole community of Israel, which was camped on the plains of Moab beside the Jordan River, across from Jericho."

"Moses, Eleazar the priest, and all the leaders of the people went to meet them outside the camp. But Moses was furious with all the military commanders who had returned from the battle. "Why have you let all the women live?" he demanded. "These are the very ones who followed Balaam's advice and caused the people of Israel to rebel against the LORD at Mount Peor. They are the ones who caused the plague to strike the LORD's people. Now kill all the boys and all the women who have slept with a man. Only the young girls who are virgins may live; you may keep them for yourselves." Numbers 31:7-18 NLT

Burning of temple at Baal (There's nothing like a good church barbeque.)

"Then Jehu called a meeting of all the people of the city and said to them, "Ahab hardly worshiped Baal at all compared to the way I will worship him! Summon all the prophets and worshipers of Baal, and call together all his priests. See to it that every one of them comes, for I am going to offer a great sacrifice to Baal. Any of Baal's worshipers who fail to come will be put to death." But Jehu's plan was to destroy all the worshipers of Baal. Then Jehu ordered, "Prepare a solemn assembly to worship Baal!" So they did. He sent messengers throughout all Israel summoning those who worshiped Baal. They all came and filled the temple of Baal from one end to the other. And Jehu instructed the keeper of the wardrobe, "Be sure that every worshiper of Baal wears one of these robes." So robes were given to them"

"Then Jehu went into the temple of Baal with Jehonadab son of Recab. Jehu said to the worshipers of Baal, "Make sure that only those who worship Baal are here. Don't let anyone in who worships the LORD!" So they were all inside the temple to offer sacrifices and burnt offerings. Now Jehu had surrounded the building with eighty of his men and had warned them, "If you let anyone escape, you will pay for it with your own life."

"As soon as Jehu had finished sacrificing the burnt offering, he commanded his guards and officers, "Go in and kill all of them. Don't let a single one escape!" So they killed them all with their swords, and the guards and officers dragged their bodies outside. Then Jehu's men went into the fortress of the temple of Baal. They dragged out the sacred pillar used in the worship of Baal and destroyed it. They broke down the sacred pillar of Baal and wrecked the temple of Baal, converting it into a public toilet. That is what it is used for to this day." 2 Kings 10:18-27 NLT

Saul’s Kindness???

Saul sent this message to the Kenites: "Move away from where the Amalekites live or else you will die with them. For you were kind to the people of Israel when they came up from Egypt." So the Kenites packed up and left. Then Saul slaughtered the Amalekites from Havilah all the way to Shur, east of Egypt. (1 Samuel 15:6-7 NLT)

Genocide

During this period, Joshua destroyed all the descendants of Anak, who lived in the hill country of Hebron, Debir, Anab, and the entire hill country of Judah and Israel. He killed them all and completely destroyed their towns. Not one was left in all the land of Israel, though some still remained in Gaza, Gath, and Ashdod. So Joshua took control of the entire land, just as the LORD had instructed Moses. He gave it to the people of Israel as their special possession, dividing the land among the tribes. So the land finally had rest from war. (Joshua 11:21-23 NLT)

God hardens hearts and makes people fight the Israelites only to be slaughterd..

So Joshua conquered the entire region – the hill country, the Negev, the land of Goshen, the western foothills, the Jordan Valley, and the mountains and lowlands of Israel. The Israelite territory now extended all the way from Mount Halak, which leads up to Seir, to Baal-gad at the foot of Mount Hermon in the valley of Lebanon. Joshua killed all the kings of those territories, waging war for a long time to accomplish this. No one in this region made peace with the Israelites except the Hivites of Gibeon. All the others were defeated. For the LORD hardened their hearts and caused them to fight the Israelites instead of asking for peace. So they were completely and mercilessly destroyed, as the LORD had commanded Moses. (Joshua 11:16-20 NLT)

Whole Towns Murdered at the bequest of God

The Canaanite king of Arad, who lived in the Negev, heard that the Israelites were approaching on the road to Atharim. So he attacked the Israelites and took some of them as prisoners. Then the people of Israel made this vow to the LORD: "If you will help us conquer these people, we will completely destroy all their towns." The LORD heard their request and gave them victory over the Canaanites. The Israelites completely destroyed them and their towns, and the place has been called Hormah ever since. (Numbers 21:1-3 NLT)

God’s psychotic Wrath

Weep and moan, you evil shepherds! Roll in the dust, you leaders of the flock! The time of your slaughter has arrived; you will fall and shatter like fragile pottery. You will find no place to hide; there will be no way to escape. Listen to the frantic cries of the shepherds, to the leaders of the flock shouting in despair, for the LORD is spoiling their pastures. Peaceful meadows will be turned into a wasteland by the LORD's fierce anger. He has left his den like a lion seeking its prey, and their land will be made desolate by the sword of the enemy and the LORD's fierce anger. (Jeremiah 25:34-38 NLT)

God Slaughters countless people

In that day those the LORD has slaughtered will fill the earth from one end to the other. No one will mourn for them or gather up their bodies to bury them. They will be scattered like dung on the ground. (Jeremiah 25:33 NLT)

The Cup of Anger God incites hate and anger

Then the LORD, the God of Israel, said to me, "Take from my hand this cup filled to the brim with my anger, and make all the nations to whom I send you drink from it. When they drink from it, they will stagger, crazed by the warfare I will send against them." (Jeremiah 25:15-16 NLT)

Complete Destruction

And now the LORD Almighty says: Because you have not listened to me, I will gather together all the armies of the north under King Nebuchadnezzar of Babylon, whom I have appointed as my deputy. I will bring them all against this land and its people and against the other nations near you. I will completely destroy you and make you an object of horror and contempt and a ruin forever. I will take away your happy singing and laughter. The joyful voices of bridegrooms and brides will no longer be heard. Your businesses will fail, and all your homes will stand silent and dark. This entire land will become a desolate wasteland. (Jeremiah 25:8-11 NLT

Has anyone taken a very, very close look at the architecture and art of churches, mosques, synagogues, and government buildings throughout the world? Are there commonalities? Look at the domes. Look at the gods and goddesses. What's going on here? I desire a unified and peaceful world which is genuinely responsibly free. A combined church and state wouldn't be so bad if it wasn't run by the same humans and non-humans who brought us the Crusades and the Inquisition. A minimalist humanist namaste constitutional responsible freedom theocracy might actually work. I just worry that highly disfunctional gods and goddesses would screw everything up - resulting in billions of corpses throughout the world. Would the Latin Mass, the Teachings of Jesus, and the U.S. Constitution be a good place to start? I'd like to know what the Pope and Jesuit General really think about in their most private moments regarding psychology, ethics, governance, science, technology, secrecy, history, spirituality, etc. It might be very, very different than what they present in public. I sometimes imagine their thoughts as they stand before the faithful. Might they be thinking 'if you people only knew what's really going on in this world!' Many people seem to be jumping out of the church frying pan, and into the new age fire. Look at the 'Infiltration of the New Age' thread in MOA. The information presented should be considered very carefully. Is there a Spiritual Switzerland somewhere between the Traditional Church and the New Age?

I'm not going to keep commenting on my own threads to try to generate interest. The ball is in your court. There are some other threads I wish to follow - but I think I'm done with my threads for the foreseeable future. This does not imply a lack of interest or a change of heart. I just don't wish to play the part of the crusader. I might try to visit the United Nations, Washington D.C., the City of London, and the Vatican once again (I visited them many years ago). I will continue to fantasize about being a part of a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System which includes the U.N., Washington D.C., the City of London, the Vatican, the Underground Bases, and the Secret Space Program - except that in my dreamworld there is no secrecy or corruption. Once again - I don't wish to fight the New World Order - I wish to HIJACK IT!! 'Take me to Nirvana!!' I'd love to put the dream into practice - but I'm not going to push it right now. If someone wants to pick me up in a UFO, and take me to the Darkside of the Moon to meet with Lucifer - I'll be ready to go at a moments notice. What am I saying?

Are Satan, Lucifer, the Rothschilds, the Rockefellers, the Royal Family, and the Vatican the biggest seed-money rock stars on the planet - who are doing the most to make the world a better place? Trickle down theory voodoo economics? Where are the Billionaire Ghandi's? Jesus was pretty tough on rich people. Are billionaires the most socially responsible people on the planet? Did they gain their money through socially responsible activities? Can wealth become anticompetitive at some point? Should those with the most money have the greatest political clout? Should those with the gold - RULE? One of the greatest tragedies of history is the non compassionate use of accumulated wealth. I know that a lot of contactees and gurus are opposed to money - but I disagree. Money and private property are expressions of freedom. The problem with money is the irresponsible pursuit and use of money. Perhaps the billionaires should be placed under the scanning electron microscope to look for illegality and irresponsibility. Blood Money, Drug Money, and Destructive Money of All Kinds - should be repaid to society - with interest and penalties. I'm also not a big fan of ET Mentoring. Have the Gods, Goddesses, Angels, Archangels, ET's, and Ascended Masters been promoting Responsibility, Freedom, and Human Sovereignty (other than the Andromedans)? Boy - I sure got a lot out of my system - and I didn't even feel hostile. It must've been something I ate - or maybe the devil made me do it.

Having said all of the above - I'm getting tired of being an internet warrior. It seems to be a monumental waste of time. Remember what Jesus said about pearls and such? Money Talks and BS Walks. The Bottom Line is the Bottom Line. Winning Isn't Everything. It's the Only Thing. Perhaps the secret is to be a Humanitarian on the Surface - and a Shrewd and Ruthless SOB Below the Radar. Could the Worship of Fame, Fortune, and Power - rather than the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit - help to explain why the Corrupt Rule the Stupid? Is Greed Good? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7upG01-XWbY

I need to go for a long walk with my dog - and then perhaps I need to create a ten-year business plan. Who knows - in ten years I might have to change my tune and eat my words...

OK...I'm back from my walk...and I decided that the Corrupt Will Always Rule the Stupid - because both the Corrupt and the Stupid are happy with the arrangement - despite all outward appearances. Additionally - Both the Corrupt and the Stupid are Threatened by Non-Corrupt Highly Intelligent People - and will Fight Them Vigorously. Think about THAT... Perhaps this is why no one has REALLY followed the Red Letter Teachings of Jesus for 2,000 years - and why they probably never will... Narrow is the way. Read Revelation 20:12. Is December 21, 2012 really Judgement Day?

I'm on the verge of pusuing a business plan which is neither corrupt or stupid - and which will be executed in a manner which threatens neither the corrupt or the stupid. I may simply live a life of quiet decadence...and leave the corrupt and the stupid to their own devices. Actually - I'm too stupid to be corrupt - and that's the truth. I can't believe that I am able to put together semi-intelligent posts and threads. I am very discouraged at this point. I really feel like I'm not from around here. Nothing works. A Mason just invited me to a meeting. I'd love to talk to them - but I know that one thing would lead to another - and soon I would be in the middle of some very creepy stuff - and I'd find myself in a real jam. I worry about who really gives the top Masons their marching orders. Could it be Lucifer? Or is it Satan? How many Masons does it take to change a light-bulb? It's a secret.

If the underground bases, the secret space program, and the secret government are in the best interest of the human race - then wonderful. But I have a very sinking and sick feeling that, in their present form, they are NOT in our best interest. I welcome grand plans for Humanity, Earth, and the Solar System - which are non-corrupt and are not evil. I don't have the answers to everything. I can't even run my own damn life, so how could I do anything of significance? 'You can't even run your own life - and I'll be damned if you'll run mine!' Perhaps trying to wake everyone up is a big mistake. Could this really be creating mass hysteria? I have mostly asked questions in contexts where people are already being exposed to all of the controversial, conspiratorial, and fringe stuff. I'm really trying to find compromises and a middle-ground which is still intellectually satisfying, and which is likely to stand the test of time. I don't hate the Masons, Nazis, and Magicians who Richard Hoagland says are at the heart of NASA. I don't hate the Catholics, the Muslims, the Blacks, or the Jews. The history of power in this solar system is probably stranger and sadder than even I can imagine. I just want to help resolve this damned mess. But I seem to be getting absolutely nowhere - and I'm getting older, dumber, and more miserable - each and every day. So - what's the point?

Is just going with the flow - and not asking too many questions - really the way to go? Just get a degree? Make lots of money? Get a model spouse? Have charming children? And go along with the BS? If one really starts poking and prodding - do they end up on dozens of lists - get targeted by dozens of unsavory unseen entities - and end up losing their jobs, spouses, and minds? I was interested in the medical profession and the ministry - but I came to the conclusion that they were both as corrupt as hell - so I lost my way and got absolutely nowhere. I wanted things to make sense - and they never did. They still don't. And very few people will even talk to me. I wanted to help save the world - but is the world really worth saving? The people I meet every day make me question the prospects of making things truly work out well. The more people I meet - the more I like my dog. Oh I know that's not politically correct - but I'm not trying to impress anyone. I really want to stop posting. This isn't working. I hate the history of the world. I hate the direction of the world presently. I feel like Starbuck, laying on the floor, shouting 'we're going the wrong way!' I've tried. I've failed. And now I'm washing my hands of all of this. Good luck everyone.

I washed my hands of all of this madness - but now my hands are dirtier than ever. I am presently taking a look at Tibet, Kali, and the Triinity Goddess. http://www.themistsofavalon.net/universal-lounge-f8/tibet-kali-and-the-trinity-goddess-t1019.htm Is this getting very close to the heart of Lucifer? In a sense - the names don't really matter. It's the power structure in this solar system - going back thousands or millions or years - that I'm really interested in. A central individual or group could write all kinds of texts, documents, and books - which are nothing more than cunningly devised fables - yet which could reveal volumes about the author. Could Lucifer be Lilith - Hathor - Isis - Ishtar - Mary - the Rich Young Ruler - the Prodigal Son - Mary of Magdala - the Whore of Babylon - or All of the Above? This could be one big shell-game or guessing-game. It could be a giant real-life game of Monopoly.

Consider going through all of the Stargate SG-1 episodes on hulu.com - focusing on the theological and political issues which I have been raising lately. I'm just groping in the dark - but I think I may be covering some subjects in a manner in which few others are presently doing - which may shed light on the subject of disclosure. Are most of us looking in the wrong places - for the wrong reasons. What would Philip Corso, Jr. say? Speaking of which - his father - Philip Corso - spent a significant period of time in London and Rome - before Roswell. Perhaps someone should write a book titled 'The Day Before Roswell'. Was Roswell a staged event - using Secret Government UFO's and PGLF's or Hybrids? Was Muroc 1954 the same damn thing? What would Bishop McIntyre say? What would Bill Cooper say - if he were alive today? Could Bill still be alive today? What would Commander X say? Nuff said...

If one was in a perfect Garden of Eden or a Harmonious Heaven - with a Kind and Loving God in charge - what more could one want? But what if one wished to exercise their creativity, curiosity, and ambition - in forbidden ways? Something has been bothering me a lot for a long time. It has to do with why we seem to be killing ourselves with industrialization, high-technology surveillance and warfare, designer diseases, massive pollution, bitter science vs religion battles, acute-care drugs and surgery medicine instead of prevention, and running around like chickens with our heads cut off instead of smelling the roses and savoring the creation. There's a lot more to it than what I just said - and I will try to elaborate on this in subsequent posts. I'm really trying to get at why Lucifer rebelled against God (assuming that this actually did occur in some way, shape, or form). I seem to be enamored with Lucifer - to an unhealthy degree. My speculations are causing me a significant amount of mental anguish - but I'm beginning to think that a Lucifer-Centered Search for Truth - might yield the clearest view of the way things really are. I have no particular animosity toward Lucifer (assuming that Lucifer actually exists) - and I simply want to try to figure things out - and eventually try to find some peace of mind. I have very little presently - and I feel a bit like Elvis Presley - who wished for a single day of peace. Sometimes I wonder if I might even be Lucifer with amnesia - or a potential Lucifer of the future. Thinking about Lucifer related subjects and issues is scaring the hell out of me. I love it in one way - but I seem to keep sliding down the slippery slope - into I know not what. The horror.

If you can - get DVD's of 'Contact' and 'Avatar' - and watch them several times - noting especially the philosophical and theological aspects. Watch 'The Lucifer Effect - MIT Lecture'. http://mitworld.mit.edu/video/459 This is just a start. I continue to think that unconventional and heretical theological pursuits will provide many solutions - possibly even disclosure. I continue to contemplate a harmonization of the Teachings of Jesus, the U.S. Constitution, and the Latin Mass. This may be a dead-end, and we may need to move way beyond such a historical approach, but I think there is merit in exploring this possibility - as a mental and spiritual exercise - if nothing else. I'm just rambling now. I'm concerned that society may be on the verge of getting a lot meaner and nastier. If half of what I have speculated about is true - this could cause a lot of societal problems - some of them possibly violent. Waking people up could backfire - if we're not very careful. Are we creating mass-hysteria? Should maybe 10% of the key people of the world be properly woken-up? I think I might be trying to do this in my various postings and threads. I wonder who really reads them? I do not wish to yell 'FIRE!!!' in a crowded theater. I continue to seek a top-down non-revolution - to make the world and solar system a better place. I'm too lazy, stupid, and squeamish to run in the streets with torches and pitchforks. I much prefer armchair blogging. Born to blog. The incredible blog.

Has technology and industrialization made us better and happier people? Have any wars in the history of the universe really done anyone any real good? Why do we compete with each other? What if we stopped competing with each other? Would we have a greater or lesser chance of survival? Would the breed improve if we ceased to compete? Was it John D. Rockefeller who said 'Competition is a sin'? Why do we need jets, trains, busses, nukes, cities, cathedrals, mansions, space-travel, etc, etc? Why can't we live in teepees or grass huts? We seem to be killing ourselves in very sophisticated and clever ways. If we destroy ourselves - then what? What do you think, Lucifer?

Try thinking about galactic issues in the context of the art, architecture, ceremony, symbology, history, and music of the Roman Catholic Church. All roads lead to Rome - but where did the most important roads begin? Sometimes I wish that I could travel through Tibet, China, India, Iraq (Babylon), Egypt, the Holy Land, Greece, Rome (and all of Europe) - with a good Jesuit 'deep-throat' (a good Jesuit is hard to find!) - who would lead me through the strange and brutal history of the world, solar system, galaxy, and universe. But then I would know too much - and we all know what that would mean! I think I may re-read 'Murder in the Vatican' by Lucien Gregoire. I have 'Keys of This Blood' by Malachi Martin somewhere - but I can't find it. I may even re-watch 'The Brides of Christ'. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQgHCQh2sJE&feature=related Frankly - I got tired of Catholic-bashing (listening to it, that is) - and I moved on. But now I'm taking a second look - from what I hope is an objective perspective - noting both the good and the bad - and then imagining what an ideal church would look like and act like. A female pope? No more requirement of a celebate and male priesthood? No more crowns and crucifixes? An Ecumenical Namaste Latin 'Mass' based upon the Sermon on the Mount - sung alternatum - without communion - and with a native-tongue homily in the middle (expository preaching of the Teachings of Jesus)? No more Cannon Law or Holy Office? A church completely in harmony with the Teachings of Jesus and the U.S. Constitution? A retired Mary? I'd better start running...but I fear that there is no place to hide. The church can be a real mother........

I don't view women as evil or potentially evil. I am simply looking at the evidence regarding who runs the show in this solar system - and I am leaning toward a young, pretty, pigmented, female or hermaphroditic, and very possibly human/reptile hybrid - such as is represented in the 1983-85 and 2009-10 versions of 'V'. I do think that the male and female roles and mindsets are highly disfunctional (throughout history) - but this does not mean that either male or female human beings are evil. In a sense - I don't even think the Queen of Heaven is evil - just out of touch, and possibly insane - and in dire need of retirement (and a hot date perhaps). That's all.

Thank-you again TRANCOSO. We might be surprised if we knew how deeply into the occult the leaders in science, religion, politics, literature, etc. really have been and are. I have my theories - but very little evidence - and very few believers. Oh ye of little faith! Perhaps I should tell people that they'll go to hell if they don't agree with me - and give me lots and lots of money!!!!! I hate to say this over and over - but those who say that the masses must be ruled by deception and manipulation may be correct - as unethical and reprehensible as this may be. I have been attempting to use calm and fair reasoning for a couple of years now - and it's not working. The subjects and editorial positions have been controversial - but my approach has been very low key. This approach does not seem to work. If I had tried to whip people up into a frenzy of fear or anger - with lots of conflict and fighting - the view counts would likely be a dozen times what they are presently. I am very capable of the theatrics necessary to accomplish this - but I continue to think that this is wrong, very wrong, and wrong to the nth degree. I don't wish to be a crusader either. I just wish to attempt to make sense, and to get people to think for themselves - even though this approach seems doomed to failure. I think we really may be heading into a New World Order scenario - via Anarchy. Things may go to hell - and then the PTB will undoubtedly deal with the situation swiftly and firmly to restore order and further consolidate power.

Sometimes I feel like starting a non tax-exempt church - based upon a Modified Latin Mass (sung alternatim, based upon the Sermon on the Mount, and without communion), the Teachings of Jesus, and the U.S. Constitution. Sermons would center on world and solar system governance. I don't doubt that such a hypothetical church would be quickly shut down or destroyed - but it is fun to think about. I really think I'll have to walk alone, as I have throughout my life.

I wish I were a focused individual who illuminated minds. Perhaps there is no legitimate and ethical way to do theology and to do church. I have some architectural and procedural concepts which I think would knock the socks off of anything in existence - in this solar system at least - but I have a sinking feeling that no matter how we attempt to put things together - it will always ultimately be wrong - and enough to drive a god or goddess insane.

I want to make this perfectly clear - I do not wish misery, harm, or death to come to anyone - including Reptilians, Greys, Hybrids, Nephilim, Angels, Demons, Illuminati, Satan, Lucifer, Shiva, Kali, KRLLL, The Logos, The King or Queen of Whatever, The God or Goddess of Whatever, et al.

I JUST WANT THE BS TO STOP!!! PEACE!!! BE STILL!!!

If anyone hasn't watched this video series - PLEASE DO SO!! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0HWZlvPE888 It brings so many things together in an understandable manner. Stop the video - and read the fine-print. I think this video series is extremely important!

At some point - I might like to work with all of those listed above - once I got used to them! What about that debate-date, Kali??? You must REALLY hate me...

OK...a lot of people hate me. I have been blocked by several YouTube channels - including the poster of the video series mentioned above. ufohypothesis (Rick Keefe - who interviews Alex Collier) has blocked me. Another one - which is critical of the Roman Catholic Church - has blocked me. This is very, very odd - since I am mostly editorially on-board with the blockers!!! None of them told me a damn thing - so I have no idea why I have been blocked. Two of my websites have been taken over by someone I have never heard of - and one has been removed from the internet - even though I am paid-up for several years. I am very paranoid - and they probably really are out to get me. Strange world we live in.

What's odd - is that I really and truly have no animosity toward anyone. Period. Although - to be honest - I am annoyed by just about everyone - especially myself. But I have no seething agenda or fecal list. I really and truly am seeking a big-tent solution - rather than something which is narrow and exclusive. It's an equal-opportunity big-tent for males, females, hermaphrodites, and all races - including aliens and hybrids! I think I'm probably way too accomodating and easy-going.

Imagine Kali designing the churches. Imagine Kali composing the music. Imagine Kali as being Anna (Ashayana? Annunaki? Ashtar Commander?). Imagine Kali playing the music.

1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_X7SvvSgxM

2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MFrKUk5lwmE&feature=related

3. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MCsnSXRpXug&NR=1

4. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O4cLwXKG7Kw&feature=email

5. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_SakzT9nhM

6. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQW0rVPUXw0

Sometimes I wonder about the true source of a lot of French Romantic Music. Does this music have something in common with William Shakespeare, Charles Darwin, and Albert Einstein? Who was the architect of Chartres Cathedral? Does anyone have any idea of what I am talking about? Anyone?

I'm not going to be too specific - but if one looks at French Romantic Organ Music as a whole - what personality lurks within the music? Is it the Creator God of the Universe? Is it Jesus Christ? Is it Lucifer? Is it Mary? The individual composers? The complexity and abstractness is overwhelming. The level of genius in the design and construction of pyramids, temples, and cathedrals is likewise overwhelming. Yet something dark and troubled seems to lurk within. Could this be representative of the 'good-side' of Kali? If I'm right about all of this - do I at least get a Cracker-Jack Prize?

I guess I'm passively pursuing a 'Pinky and the Brain - Raiders of the Lost Ark - Lucifer/Shiva/Kali/Mary - and the Temple of Doom' Hypothesis - which includes a good/genius side - and a bad/insane side. What did Spielberg know - and when did he know it? I find myself strangely attracted to the good side - and utterly disgusted and horrified by the bad side. I tend to think that if Lucifer/Shiva/Kali/Mary retired - that the bad side would go away - and that they could serve as an advisor rather than a dictator. You'd have to actually be me to understand where I'm coming from, and to see that which I visualize. I couldn't possibly put it into words.

I just finished reading 'The Gospel of Mary of Magdala' by Karen King. The cover features a painting of a young-woman with a very dark complexion - dressed in scarlet - with a sun-disk around her head - pointing to an egg in her hand. Could this be Kali? Karen King thinks the Gospel of Mary might have been written in Egypt or Syria, with an authorship date of between 32 and 325 CE. Could Kali be the writer of most sacred texts - including the Bible and the Quran? Ralph Ellis claims that Jesus Christ and Mary Magdalene were of a high class. Nicolas Notovich claims that Jesus travelled to Tibet. Alex Collier claims that our creator (or genetic engineer) is more female than male (not sure which lecture - possibly 2002). He also claims that the Andromedans consider blacks to be genetically superior (I hope I got that one right! Not sure which lecture). In a 2002 lecture - Alex hints at a deliberate removal of the Pa Taal (spelling?).

I think I'm going to give this thing a rest. I don't really wish to convince anyone of anything. This has mostly been a research project - in a very passive and informal sense. The Jesuits, Alphabet Agents, and World Leaders know exactly what's going on - and they obviously are not stumbling over each other to get to the microphone first - to tell all of us goyim the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. In a sense - I have mostly wished to communicate with Lucifer/Shiva/Kali/Mary and his/her willing and unwilling servants. I continue to desire a top-down reformation of how business is conducted in this solar system. Hope springs eternal - but I'm not holding my breath. Namaste.

I really don't know who I am. I mused that I was from Pleon in the Pleiades - before I knew there was a star in the Pleiades named Pleione. Is my soul really shapeshifting interdimensional reptilian in nature? Is that really the biggest secret? How old is my soul? Will my soul live forever? Am I on the Stairway to Heaven - or the Highway to Hell? Is it the unpardonable sin to wonder if Lucifer is Kali is Mary - and to wonder if they wrote the Bible (By Ba'al?) - and to wonder if they rule the church and the solar system? I'm climbing the mountains of Tibet - and I really don't like the view. Regardless of who Lucifer really is or isn't - I think they have a terrible job. I'm really not trying to torment or agitate them. I'm trying to understand them, and to possibly help defuse a ticking time-bomb. I really don't think that I encompass all things. I am NOT I AM! I use very little religious or new age language. I am truly adrift in very rough seas - and I am being beat to a pulp on the rocks of infidelity. I really don't know my reincarnational history - and I don't really want to know it. My soul could really be bad@$$! I feel as though the human race is serving a thousands of years long torture sentence - leading up to a final judgement and execution. I am feeling absolutely NO LOVE from the Galactic Powers That Be. I feel as though we have been left to our own devices - and to the devices of some very dark beings - while those who could help - refuse to do so. I cannot feel the love tonight. I am on the verge of going underground in more ways than one. Mary! Mary! Quite contrary! How does your Garden of Ea - Den grow? Am l a lab-rat, or just a worm? World without end or meaning? Namaste? Really?

My point was that it feels as though we are in more trouble than we can imagine - and that help is not on the way - and that we may be very lucky to survive, and to emerge from this present darkness with some sort of peaceful and rational self-rule. I'm going to overdose on Branton, Bill Cooper, Commander X (could they be the same people?), Alex Collier, Joseph Farrell, Jordan Maxwell, Alex Jones, Ellen White, Robert H. Schuller, the Federalist Papers, the Anti-Federalist Papers, Science Fiction, All of My Threads (AV1 & MOA), Astronomy, Astrophysics, Biochemistry, Genetics, the Four Gospels, Comparative Religion, Lyra>Aldebaran>Sirius>Tibet>Lemuria>Atlantis>Babylon>Egypt>Greece>Pagan Rome>Ancient Israel>Papal Rome>Nazi Party>New World Order, the Classical Sacred Music Literature, and the Latin Mass.

I'm not going to spend much time trying to convince anyone of anything - but I will continue to attempt to think Lucifer's/Lilith's/Hathor's/Shiva's/Kali's/Ishtar's/Astarte's/Isis's/Mary's/Inanna's/Anna's/The Whore of Babylon's Thoughts After Her (historically and presently) - Without Aspiration, Veneration, or Condemnation. I doubt that anything much will result from this tempest in a teapot. I'm too far gone - and the world seems to be too far gone. I was serious about going underground - in more ways than one. I've been looking at old missile silos which have been converted into homes - but really even these bunkers may provide little protection from what may be coming. There is probably no place to hide. Siriusly.

So - Lucifer - are you male or female? Who are you - really? Where do you spend most of your time? What the hell are you doing? Or - do you even exist? Is there really just a Council of Ten - or something like that - which rules the solar system? I keep talking about 10,000 representatives - of all nations and races - from throughout the solar system - as an ideal number - for a non-corrupt and organized-decentralized solar system government. But is this too many? What is the ideal method of solar system governance? Perhaps I have not carefully considered ALL of the possibilities, before arriving at my present biases and conclusions. Perhaps I should contemplate the general subject of solar system governance - rather than focusing on a particular type of solar system governance. Or - should I just shut-up, and not even think about it? Is 'One Nation Under Satan' the way things have always been - and always will be? Is everything else simply an illusion, and wishful thinking? Is the whole damn thing set in concrete? We're supposed to take 'baby-steps' - but if we can't see the big-picture - how are we supposed to know which direction to take these 'baby-steps'? This whole thing seems like a sick nightmare of a joke. Mumbo-Jumbo and BS are everywhere. So - when do we get the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? Or - is the truth so bad - that we would all commit suicide? I think there is genuine evil - which should not be pursued under any circumstances. We seem to live in a moral cesspool. I'm not sure that I'm buying the 'space-dust' terminology. We are souls + bodies, and we seem to be stuck in this solar system, whether we like it or not - regardless of how fast or how slow we are vibrating. I expect this to continue for a very long time. We make our bed - and sleep in it. Our planet is how we plan it. World without end. Amen.

Freedom is key - and the key to freedom is responsibility. These two words should be studied endlessly. A constitution which maximizes freedom and responsibility should be sought - and Comparative Constitutions should also be an ongoing and relentless study. There probably is some sort of a dictatorial Council of Ten - with a ten-foot tall Drac serving as chairman of the board - because We the People are too irresponsible to govern ourselves. I'm pi$$ed-off at everyone - especially myself. I think we can all do a helluva lot better. This is probably the crazy-stage - where people are being hit with all sorts of controversial and conflicting information and concepts - of which probably 20% is actually true or constructive. If we survive this stage - then perhaps we can put together a more rational solar system view, and solar system governance. If I really spoke with Lucifer - they would probably point out how stupid and gullible we are - and why we are being ruled by secrecy, deception, manipulation, force, violence, etc. Lucifer might be a Devil - but we probably have what we deserve. Hopefully things will change for the better, sometime soon. Namaste.

I think we are too easy AND too harsh on ourselves. We treat ourselves and each other inappropriately. I think we are where we are by both choice and circumstance. I think we have been lied to and manipulated - but that we have allowed ourselves to be led around by the hooks in our noses. The past may have passed - but we need to study the past endlessly - or we will keep making the same stupid mistakes over and over again. It matters what we think AND what others think. Our thinking affects and effects others. People suffer the consequences of our actions all the time. We are all interrelated - whether we like it, or not.

Perhaps Lucifer is the Hermaphrodite/Hybrid/Reptile/Human/Nephilim/Interdimensional/Physical/God/Goddess of This World (and the Solar System?). Is Lucifer both Amen Ra and Hathor? Did Lucifer create all of the mythologies, theologies, gods, and goddesses - including Jesus and Mary? Did Lucifer create the Dracs and Greys? Is there really only one faction of Annunaki - under the command of Lucifer? Is Nibiru ruled by Lucifer? Is Lucifer the Ashtar Commander? Are we all Fallen Angels - who followed Lucifer to Earth? Have we been left to our own devices by the rest of the universe? Is Lucifer script-writer, director, and actor/actress? Are NASA's Nazis, Masons, and Magicians - all Luciferian? Does Lucifer rule the United Nations, the United States, the City of London, and the Vatican? Were they all infiltrated from day-one? Are the three stars (upside-down or rightside-up) in the Republican logo (and Washington DC) representative of the three City-States? What would you say to Lucifer if you met him/her? I might tell you a story someday.

One more time:

1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w6eTbhHE0jM

2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6z7O7UZxipM

3. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k3A6_blpqpU

4. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nyKy8_sF4xY

5. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LehRaXiKuec

6. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=niFvBJxJEtM

7. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WnNjRaBj3zs

I'm not a meditating sort of person. I don't need to empty my mind. It's already empty. I try to cram information into my head - but it just seems to go in one ear, and out the other. I will be a walking warzone for the rest of my life. There Will Be No Peace! John May Lives! Long Live the Fifth Column!

I would/will/have befriend(ed) Lucifer - but I will not give an inch. I wish for peace - but I will not be a sucker for peace at any price. I'm really sort of neutral about the whole thing. I don't love or hate Lucifer. I really wish for Lucifer to completely embrace Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom and The United States of the Solar System. I think this will ultimately be in Lucifer's best interest - and in the best interest of the human race (and any other race) - even though it might not seem like it right now. This thread (and all of my internet posting) probably makes Lucifer absolutely furious - and I don't blame him/her! I'd be livid too! Once again - I realize this is playing with very, very hot fire. I really just wish for things to work out well for all concerned - including Lucifer. But really - I'm continuing to treat this whole thing as though it were just a science fiction novel. I don't know what's true - and what's pure, unmitigated popycock. This is just one big nightmare. I'm so numb - I almost don't care anymore. I'm in a mood. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q7VQWAILSbY&feature=related What if Lucifer wrote the scripts and played the parts of ALL the Gods and Goddesses? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tpl6ncyxLGw Think about it. Krampus looks a lot like the Indian goddess 'Kali'. See my thread on 'Kali'. Einstein stuck his tongue out like that. So did Gene Simmons of 'Kiss'. I believe Mick Jagger is another example of this (who was very familiar with 'Kali'). I'm thinking that all of the gods and goddesses, theologies and mythologies have a common source - Lucifer. But there is a glorious spiritual reality once one gets past all of the BS. Just an afterthought - could Merry = Mary? Could 'Merry Christmas' = 'Mary's Victory Over Christ' or 'Mary's Dismissal of Christ' or 'Mary Sacrificing Christ'? Look at the Mary and Jesus representations and symbolism within Roman Catholicism. How about Christmas Tree = Pyramid (with the star Sirius at the top)? How about the 'All Seeing Eye' of Santa (Satan)? Better not pout! Do I have to tell you why? I know that's a stretch - but nothing would surprise me, at this point. I'm getting really desensitized and cynical.

I'm numb because I'm drowning in an ocean of bs. Should I keep fighting - or should I just go with the flow? Lucifer was the creme de al creme in Heaven - and was at the head of the music program in Heaven. Even though Lucifer is corrupt as hell and has a mothership-full of negative karmic-debt - I believe that they still retain some of their original refinement, wisdom, etc. After Lucifer retires (voluntarily or otherwise) and engages in a program of reasonable punishment, education, reformation, and restitution - that they could conceivably be of benefit to this solar system - and as such, should be treated with dignity and respect (Jesus was polite to Satan). I am already best friends with Jesus, as revealed in the Teachings of Jesus, the Divinity Within Humanity, the Majesty of Nature, and Supernaturally. On the 'Jesuit' thread - I said that perhaps we need to be wise as Jesuits, and harmless as doves. Perhaps we need to approach the intellectual level of top-level Jesuits, Masons (and Nazis?) who meet secretly in Antarctica or the Darkside of the Moon - while not getting caught-up in the corruption, arrogance, exclusivity, harshness, vindictiveness, etc. What would it be like to discuss solar system affairs with Lucifer? They probably have an astronomical IQ - and could probably run circles around all of us - in discussing any topic. They are probably very charming and cunning. They probably have a youthful and pleasing appearance. But they are probably deceptive, heartless, and cruel - among other things. And I am quite certain that they would not appreciate being cross-examined or told what to do. Finally - they would despise being exposed. I think I may have angered Lucifer by poking, prodding, speculating - and venturing where angels fear to tread. I guess I wish for Lucifer to be exposed and deposed - without being hurt or killed. Lucifer is probably laughing his/her @$$ off right now! Right, Lucifer???

I sort of like the idea of a 'modified monastery' lifestyle - where people would live in simple yet elegant surroundings - and engage in organized spiritual pursuits and discussions - while still working at regular jobs. I would be just fine with living in a 600 sq. ft. apartment, with minimal possessions, in a country or mountain monastery. I would wish to retain a computer with fast-internet - but why would a person need much more than this? Self-Degradation is Bad. Self-Exaltation is Bad. Self-Centerdness is Bad. Competent Confidence is Good. Constructive Competition is Good. Destructive Competition is Bad. Responsible Freedom is Good. Irresponsible Freedom is Bad. There are many ways to get it right. There are many ways to get it wrong. Balance seems to be extremely important. One can do the right-thing in the wrong-way. One can do the wrong-thing in the right-way. The road to hell is paved with good intentions. Right, Lucifer?

I have a car, I don't have a renter, and I have a menial job (which is rather quiet - and allows me to think - or at least try to think). I'm not happy with the situation - because of lack of funds, lack of socializing, lack of accomplishing anything tangible, and seemingly experiencing a lifelong nervous-breakdown (I'm a lone-nut)! I'd still like to have a house with a Stargate SG-1 style bunker/basement (perhaps an old missile silo), complete with an old Cray Supercomputer! I fantasize about being a composite of Palmer, Ellie, Rachael, and Mr. Haddon - in the movie 'Contact'. I'm not sure exactly why. The imagination is a wonderful thing - but it can also be a dangerous thing. Sometimes I think I venture too far. Sometimes I don't think I venture far enough. What do you think about the following speculating and questioning?

What if the Asteroid Belt, the Kuiper Belt, and the Oort Cloud are mostly spaceships? What if most of the planets and moons in this solar system are spaceships (including Earth and its Moon)? I continue to lean toward the practice of multidisciplinary research, accompanied by classical sacred music, lots of exercise in nature, lots of rest and sleep, interaction with other researchers, and lots of independent thinking and speculation. I am wary of being-assisted far journeys - in whatever state or dimension. I really wish to convert the whole damn universe to the concept of Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom. I wish for it to be implemented here - but if there are really b@d@$$ beings (who scare the stuffings out of the Dracs) who are on their way to beat us into reverent submission - then we may need the assistance of other benevolent beings throughout the universe - to decisively deal with those who would do us harm. What if the Annunaki, the Greys, and the Dracs are Human/Reptile Hybrid Supersoldiers created by Lucifer in Underground Base Genetics Laboratories throughout the solar system? What if the really b@d@$$ incoming bunch originated in these same labs - and are travelling throughout the universe - engaging in heartless and cruel conquest? What if this solar system is a staging area for universal conquest - establishing a truly Universal Church Theocracy? I hope I didn't spoil anyone's day - but shouldn't we consider all of the possibilities? What would Lucifer say? I might not have to wait very long for an answer. Lucifer - can we cut the crap - and get to the point? I know I'm just a "commoner" - but I do have valid questions - which continue to go unanswered...

Perhaps the nutters need to be more like the normal people - and the normal people need to be more like the nutters. The commoners need to be more like the elites - and the elites need to be more like the commoners. The secular must become sacred - and the sacred must become secular. Combining opposites is a valid concept - which I learned from Shirley Maclaine - but I don't think that she's god. I think that ideals are essential. I think we should strive for the highest ethical, intellectual, spiritual, scientific, and artistic achievements. I think we should study theology - but I think the first and last commandment should be 'THOU SHALT HAVE NO GODS AND GODDESSES' - hence NAMASTE. The traditional definition of 'God' involves infallibility, supreme power - and requiring reverential worship and unquestioning obedience. Also - the problem is that absolute power corrupts absolutely. I think it may lead to insanity and atrocity. If a truly eternal and perfect God of the Universe arrived in this solar system - and proved me wrong - I would respectfully and reverently admit my grievous sin - and repent. I'm just not seeing such a being ruling this solar system - going back thousands of years - and I have completely lost my faith in the Bible (other than the red-letter words of Jesus) - and in the religions of the world - old and new. Frankly - I'm seeing vengeful deities flying around this solar system in ufo's. What would Daniel Jackson say? What would William Bramley say? What would Gabriel say? What would Lucifer say? What would Michael say?

I just want to repeat that I envision a perfected humanity living in a perfected solar system - WITHOUT ANY ARMAGEDDON OR EXTERMINATION OF ANY KIND. I think there may be malevolent forces in this universe who want us dead - or at least suffering - and wishing we were dead. I want to repeat also that if any of you (human or otherwise) are not here to help the human race achieve SUSTAINABLE RESPONSIBLE FREEDOM - then please leave this solar system now - without harming anyone or anything. I'm serious about a SOLAR SYSTEM EXORCISM. I'm serious about establishing a NAMASTE CONSTITUTIONAL RESPONSIBLE FREEDOM SOLAR SYSTEM AKA THE UNITED STATES OF THE SOLAR SYSTEM - BASED UPON RESPONSIBILITY AND THE U.S. CONSTITUTION. If any of you are waiting for me to change my mind - it isn't going to happen. I doubt that I have much clout - but I will continue to pretend that I do. What's funny about all of this - is that I'll probably be long-gone by the time this becomes a reality. This concept will probably rise from the ashes (phoenix-like) of a failed New World Order - so please prepare to rebuild this world - the right way.

I've been reading 'The Gods of Eden' by William Bramley. Please, please read this book! It's amazing! Alex Collier was right to recommend it! My question is, 'am I a friend or a foe of the Gods of Eden?' Perhaps I am both friend and foe - their worst enemy and their best buddy. I really think that Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom is the wave of the future - even for the Gods of Eden - and even for Lucifer. I truly wish for things to work out well for ALL CONCERNED. If I owned a herd of cattle - why would I want them to be fighting with each other and exterminating themselves? Even if we are essentially cattle, why wouldn't our owners be better-off instituting a proper solar system government - with highly competent self-rule? Even if our masters are 1,000 times as intelligent as us - shouldn't we have a cordial and proper relationship? I don't really know where we are in the universal food-chain - but a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System would work well - whether we are at the bottom, middle, or top of the galactic pecking order. CAN COOLER HEADS PLEASE PREVAIL??!!

I keep watching the following sequence from 'Stargate Continuum' in light of this thread. Watch this repeatedly - then face yourself - and think, and think, and think...

1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tZEPUfmfIsE

2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nyKy8_sF4xY

3. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x8YK_ad7Us0&feature=related

Check out 'The God's of Eden' by William Bramley. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pqXqG5WlXJs It's not exactly an inspiring book - but it does shed a lot of light on your last post. This thing might be more complex - and simpler - than we think. What would Occam say? That slasher! What would Lucifer say? That devil! What would Oedipus say? That mother! What would Pavlov say? That dog! Seriously - if you were talking to Lucifer - what would you say to them? What would you expect them to say to you? Would it be better to not talk to them? My thought is that most of us are too easily corrupted and confused to profitably talk to them. I don't think we should love them or hate them - but that we should be pretty much neutral toward them. Some say that Lucifer no longer exists - but I doubt this. They might present themselves as any number of humans, gods, goddesses, et's, et al. I keep thinking that Lucifer can be helped, reformed, and restored. Just speculation.

Ever heard of Anton Lavey and the Church of Satan? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8m3hHYtdegw Here is something from Anton Lavey's 'Satanic Bible'. I'm not endorsing this, by any means, but I thought that it was relevant to this thread. Are Lucifer and Satan the same beings? What would Lucifer say?

1. Satan represents indulgence instead of abstinence!
2. Satan represents vital existence instead of spiritual pipe dreams!
3. Satan represents undefiled wisdom instead of hypocritical self-deceit!
4. Satan represents kindness to those who deserve it instead of love wasted on ingrates!
5. Satan represents vengeance instead of turning the other cheek!
6. Satan represents responsibility to the responsible instead of concern for psychic vampires!
7. Satan represents man as just another animal, sometimes better, more often worse than those that walk on all-fours, who, because of his “divine spiritual and intellectual development,” has become the most vicious animal of all!
8. Satan represents all of the so-called sins, as they all lead to physical, mental, or emotional gratification!
9. Satan has been the best friend the Church has ever had, as He has kept it in business all these years!

One more thing (which I'm not endorsing): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AF9dWUyU3GA&feature=related

What if Lucifer perfectly possesses a dolphin? What if the damn ruler of us all is a damn dolphin??!! There may be more to the Christian fish-symbol than we think! Something fishy is going on in this solar system...

I think we should get to the point where we can constructively converse with Aliens, Spirits, Lucifer, Gabriel, Michael, Satan, Jesus, God, Gods, Goddesses, Thubans, PTB, et al. I don't attempt any contact with all of the above - other than my rambling on the internet - and swearing at them around the house! If I ever did speak to any of them - face to face - it would just be another day at the office. I wouldn't be disrespectful - but I wouldn't bow-down and worship them either...

I like the way the Stargate SG-1 team handled all of the above. Speaking of which - run the following two videos at the same time - but turn the Stargate video's sound off - and use the 'Kryptonite' sound - while watching the Stargate video. Start the Stargate video first, for proper coordination. Do this a couple of times - and see what you think.

I know I'm strange - but they say it takes all kinds...

1. Stargate (turn sound off - start first - watch) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k3A6_blpqpU

2. Kryptonite: (keep sound on - don't watch) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tpl6ncyxLGw

One thing which continues to bother me regarding the God or Goddess of This World - is why do they seem to hate us so much? Why do they seem to work in the shadows to screw things up? Why do they seem to lie so much? What the hell is going on? Even if someone were a renegade rebel against the Creator God of the Universe - wouldn't you expect them to try to create Heaven on Earth - and rule openly and justly? Why would they rule secretly - and create Hell on Earth? Again - what the hell is going on? I suspect an ancient race-war - and I'm not sure which races. Or perhaps it was both a race-war and a sex-war. I just want this thing to be properly resolved presently. But once again - I don't know what went on historically - and I don't know what is going on presently - so how in the hell can I know how to properly proceed? This whole thing is completely insane. Can someone please bring common sense and reason to the predicament of the human race and this solar system? Why do we have to endure lie after lie after lie after lie - and war after war after war after war - and atrocity after atrocity after atrocity after atrocity? What the hell is going on? What was the Original Sin? What is the Continuing Sin? We seem to have been subjected to thousands of years of torture - leading to a final judgment - and an extermination. What the hell is going on? Lucifer??? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b9mFn9EhgU4

So - who rules the Secret Government? Is the Secret Government good? Is there a Secret Government? Are the Old Testament Atrocities commanded by God, just and righteous judgments against the wicked? Same for the book of Revelation? Really do read 'The Gods of Eden'. Is it just the stupid goyim who are screwing things up? At the highest levels of solar system and global government - is everything essentially fine? I really want a truly good God in charge - but I'm just not seeing this historically or presently. And I am seeing a power, which is superior to humanity - working in the shadows in a malevolent manner. I don't care who this is - I just want them to cease and desist immediately - but I don't wish for them to be hurt or killed. There is no @#*&% reason why this solar system can't be turned into a paradise - without extermination, coercion, and cruelty. Why is this so #$^%& hard????? Lucifer???? So - the victims of the Crusades, the Inquisition, the Civil War, Joseph Stalin, the World Wars, the Korean War, the Vietnam War, Pol Pot, Idi Amin, the Iraq Wars, Waco, Oklahoma City, 9/11, and Pedophilia chose to be victims - and the universe granted their wishes? I choose a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System - and I want it right now. Will the universe grant my wish? Lucifer???

Law and Order will be restored in this solar system. Justice will be served. Guilty parties will be punished. Restitution will be provided. Rehabilitation and Restoration will occur. The righteous will forgive - but they will never forget. A Perfected Humanity in a Perfected Solar System will emerge from the chaos and madness. When one observes torture and cruelty occurring - and does nothing to stop it - is this not a crime - even if one is observing from a distant planet, solar sytem, or galaxy? As of this moment - I am pi$$ed-off at everyone in the universe - given my limited knowledge - and given the fact that no one seems to really want to open-up about what the hell is really going on. I think this whole solar system mess has been horribly mishandled. I don't think this had to happen this way at all. I'm mad at the good guys and gals - and the bad guys and gals. Everything is insane! I want this BS to stop NOW. Does anyone with any clout and compassion read any of these threads? Somebody who is somebody (or at least thinks they are somebody) better get something going around here. Can you hear me now? Once again - I don't know the whole story - but why have thousands of years of suffering and death (including women and children) been tolerated by the supposedly highly advanced beings of the universe? Sometimes I doubt that there really are truly advanced and ethical beings throughout the universe. In any case - I am suspecting that all is not well - throughout the whole damn universe. I want this solar system to get it's act together - and then maybe we can accurately figure out what's really going on throughout the rest of the universe. Why is a reasonable system of law and order - responsibility and freedom - psychology and ethics - so damn hard to implement? Why all of the lies and bs? The 'Word of God' turns out to be the word of someone who does not seem to have much genuine love for the human race. The Teachings of Jesus are the rare exception. This solar system should be a paradise for all benevolent beings. But here again - I don't know the full story regarding universe, solar system, and Earth history. It's all a great big secret. Madness Without End. I really and truly desire a happy existence for EVERYONE - including you, Lucifer. I hereby invite everyone - human and otherwise - to unite around a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System - but you need to really mean it - and back it up with action. I'm only saying this because I'm scared - not because I'm rebellious. I'm not shaking my fist at God. I'm just shaking. The Nazis and Masons are the two major players in this solar system - aren't they? What would it take for most of them to embrace a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System? I'm calling for defectors on both sides. This damn thing just needs to be defused. We can use all of the bases and fancy technology for constructive purposes - instead of the extermination of the human race. I think both sides have been used, misused, and abused - and that tens or hundreds of millions of innocent human beings have been collateral damage. I'm sure both sides have their justifications and horror stories - and we can deal with all of this - in an orderly and peaceful manner. I can see myself embracing both Nazis and Masons. I might even embrace Dracs and Greys. I just want the suffering, death, and bs in this solar system to end. I'm not sure I understand who is REALLY behind the Nazis and Masons - but this thing needs to be resolved NOW. We can argue and fight on the internet for centuries - if we want to - but this madness needs to transition into a cold-infowar. How about it, Lucifer? Namaste.

I have speculated that there was already a pre-existing problem at the time of the Luciferian Rebellion and subsequent War in Heaven - but two wrongs don't make a right. Not even three or four do. I really don't wish to play the blame-game - but I think that it is important to understand history - with just the facts, and no BS. Something has been very wrong for a very long time - and this needs to be corrected - without extermination or enslavement. Some seem to be rather gleeful regarding an anticipated extermination. I have spoken with a couple of deity-types who seemed hell-bent on some sort of an extermination-mission. I don't know if they were delusional, or the real-deal - but I tried to talk them out of it. I think some human-beings and other-beings may need to be incarcerated and re-educated - but I don't think anyone should be exterminated - physically or spiritually - temporarily or permanently. But what the hell do I know? If I had the chance - I would like to help bring Lucifer back to the Father...

Don't get bogged-down on anything in particular - and remember that we are in a spiritual-war. I'm actually looking forward to getting better acquainted with Lucifer - but not in connection with any rituals, or selling my soul to you know who. I sense a changing of the guard in this solar system - but I don't know the details. Hopefully, things will work out well for ALL CONCERNED. I don't know who to trust - so I trust no one - not even myself. I don't know who the good and bad players really are. Most are probably a mixture of good and evil - in varying proportions. I'm really trying to focus on principles and concepts - rather than organizations and personalities. I suspect the historical and contemporary existence of a God and/or Goddess of This World - and that they are a mixture of good and evil. But when one is at that level - it's probably very easy for things to spiral way out of control - and then it's probably next to impossible to return to an uncorrupted and sane place of being - which is why I lean toward the organized decentralism of responsible freedom. If Lucifer really does exist - I would like to hear their full unedited story - going back thousands, millions, or even billions of years. Unfortunately, this story might drive me completely insane. I think history might be that bad.

So - who are Gabriel, Lucifer, and Michael - historically and presently? Amen Ra, Hathor/Isis, Horus? Are Gabriel and Lucifer really Annunaki? Is Horus representative of Humanity? What if Promethius stole fire from Humanity - and gave it to the Gods? What if Humans created the Annunaki to be a slave-race - rather than the other way around? Regardless of what occurred historically - what should we do presently? Is this all just a fabricated bunch of bs? I'm going to keep passively considering a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System aka The United States of the Solar System - based upon Responsibility and the U.S. Constitution - and just see what develops. And yes - I am stuck on this subject - because it really seems to be central to solving most of the major problems facing this solar system. Without knowing the whole story - my bias is that all truly benevolent beings - human or otherwise - should be able to stay here - and live peacefully. What is the proper relationship between justice and mercy? How do we really determine what the true state of affairs is - here on Earth, throughout the Solar System, and throughout the Universe? The BS seems to be bottomless and endless. Please read 'The God's of Eden' by William Bramley - 'Rule by Secrecy' by Jim Marrs - 'Behold a Pale Horse' by Bill Cooper - and 'The Great Controversy' by Ellen White. I'm having a difficult time thinking clearly regarding all of the above - and I'm fearing that the stakes may be very high in this most dangerous game. We seem to be on some sort of a precipice. I don't even want to think about how far we might fall, if we get things wrong. I really don't know who is good or bad. I don't know if I'm good or bad. I'm just sick of the cat and mouse game. How do we avoid making horrible mistakes regarding our predicament? I hope someone is giving this some very serious thought. I wish to be friendly and kind - but could this be a fatal mistake? My bias presently, is to be neutral in all of this - because without proper and solid information, there is no way to make proper decisions about much of anything. I am sold on the concept of Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom as a modus operandi for this Solar System - but I'm not really sure how to achieve this seemingly noble goal. I really need some help with all of this.

I will continue to distrust everyone and everything - including my inner teacher. I'm a walking warzone - and there are many points of view fighting for the supremacy - within my soul. I think the secret is to just keep asking questions - and to keep listening for the answers. The answers, my friend, are blowing in the wind. I think that doing a lot of reading is a good thing - and I'm trying to do more of that. I'm reading 'The God's of Eden' by William Bramley - and I'm finding it to be both fascinating and terrifying. I want to re-read 'Rule by Secrecy' by Jim Marrs. I'm re-reading parts of 'The Great Controversy' by Ellen White. I've also been listening to, and reading, a lot of Bill Cooper's material. A multi-source, multi-disciplinary modality is optimal - but it does create tremendous internal conflict. I'm really not looking for peace. I'm just looking for truth and solutions. If one spoke with Lucifer - what should they say? Should they politely enter into a conversation - or should they confront Lucifer with Bible texts in the name of Jesus? I'm thinking that non-committal neutrality is probably a good thing. Lucifer probably knows the Bible better than any theologian. Lucifer might have written most of the Bible. I think I might try to befriend them - without being too friendly. I'd love to convert Lucifer to my Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom point of view - and get the green light for The United States of the Solar System. What would Lucifer say? World Without End. Almond Raw.

I'm trying to have an open yet critical mind. Should I have 'Sympathy for the Devil'?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iLddJ1WceHQ&feature=related

Please allow me to introduce myself
I'm a man of wealth and taste
I've been around for a long, long year
Stole many a man's soul and faith

And I was 'round when Jesus Christ
Had his moment of doubt and pain
Made damn sure that Pilate
Washed his hands and sealed his fate

Pleased to meet you
Hope you guess my name
But what's puzzling you
Is the nature of my game

I stuck around St. Petersburg
When I saw it was a time for a change
Killed the Czar and his ministers
Anastasia screamed in vain

I rode a tank
in the general's rank
When the Blitzkrieg raged
And the bodies stank

Pleased to meet you
Hope you guess my name, oh yeah
Ah, what's puzzling you
Is the nature of my game, oh yeah
(woo woo, woo woo)

I watched with glee
While your kings and queens
Fought for ten decades
For the gods they made
(woo woo, woo woo)

I shouted out,
"Who killed the Kennedys?"
When after all
It was you and me
(who who, who who)

Let me please introduce myself
I'm a man of wealth and taste
And I laid traps for troubadours
Who get killed before they reached Bombay
(woo woo, who who)

Pleased to meet you
Hope you guessed my name, oh yeah
(who who)
But what's puzzling you
Is the nature of my game, oh yeah, get down, baby
(who who, who who)

Pleased to meet you
Hope you guessed my name, oh yeah
But what's confusing you
Is just the nature of my game
(woo woo, who who)

Just as every cop is a criminal
And all the sinners saints
As heads is tails
Just call me Lucifer
'Cause I'm in need of some restraint
(who who, who who)

So if you meet me
Have some courtesy
Have some sympathy, have some taste
(woo woo)
Use all your well-learned politesse
Or I'll lay your soul to waste, mmm yeah
(woo woo, woo woo)

Pleased to meet you
Hope you guessed my name, mmm yeah
(who who)
But what's puzzling you
Is the nature of my game, mmm mean it, get down
(woo woo, woo woo)

Woo, who
Oh yeah, get on down
Oh yeah
Oh yeah!
(woo woo)

Tell me baby, what's my name
Tell me honey, can ya guess my name
Tell me baby, what's my name
I tell you one time, you're to blame

Oh, who
woo, woo
Woo, who
Woo, woo
Woo, who, who
Woo, who, who
Oh, yeah

What's my name
Tell me, baby, what's my name
Tell me, sweetie, what's my name

Woo, who, who
Woo, who, who
Woo, who, who
Woo, who, who
Woo, who, who
Woo, who, who
Oh, yeah
Woo woo
Woo woo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tpl6ncyxLGw

What should happen to Lucifer? Is there a possible positive future for Lucifer here in this Solar System? Should Lucifer be permanently removed from this Solar System? Or - should Lucifer be utterly and permanently destroyed - body and soul? Is Lucifer past the point of no return? What would it take to reform them? If they were completely removed - would someone worse take their place? Could Lucifer be useful in fighting future abuses of power? Does it take a Devil to fight a Devil? Would a well-meaning and pure Christ-like figure - who was relatively naive and powerless - be able to properly manage this solar system? I like the statement of Jesus regarding being Wise as Serpents - and Harmless as Doves. Should we be Wise as Lucifer - and Harmless as Christ? Is this blasphemous talk? Is a Christ-like Lucifer a possibility? Why do we have to make everything so damn hard and impossible? I tend to think that Lucifer might possibly be useful as an advisor of sorts - with very little power. They might have to do this in some sort of an exile situation. There is also the difficult issue of punishment for any crimes against humanity - and these may be unimaginable. I don't really know the true facts of the matter. I'm just considering various possibilities - outloud. I tend to think that any Solar System Administrator should have limited power - and share responsibility in a constitutional manner - in a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System - with 10,000 representatives - to avoid corruption and even insanity. Absolute Power Corrupts Absolutely. There may be very few exceptions - if any - to this rule. Namaste.



I would expect Lucifer to fight bitterly to the bitter end. I would also expect them to be very, very deceptive - and to possibly stage their own demise. Even though I am not an insider, in any way, shape, or form - I will continue to assume that Lucifer is alive and well - and living somewhere in this solar system - possibly in a variety of bodies - male and female. I will continue my little crusade to unite all factions around what seems to be a noble cause - namely a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System - even though this could be a very bad idea - or an exercise in futility. I will continue to test the notion in a variety of contexts. As crazy as it sounds - I will continue to seek the genuine conversion of Lucifer - and all of his/her willing and unwilling followers. I really and truly wish to see the entire universe be a genuine paradise - with no Star Wars or Masters of the Universe power-struggles. I continue to fly-blind - and I don't really know what the hell is going on. I trust nothing and no one - and I like very few - even though I love everyone - whether they are good or evil.

I am particularly interested in ancient hybridization and advanced technology programs. I tend to think that this would explain a lot of things. The classic spiritual versions of the Mystery of Iniquity, the Luciferian Rebellion, War in Heaven, Eschatological Solutions, etc. are becoming increasingly unsatisfactory to me. Are we really dealing with two factions of humans who are engaged in an ongoing ancient Civil War? Are hybridization, technology, theology, conquest, retribution, etc. - really at the center of the Lucifer phenomenon - and the delemma we find ourselves in? Ancient Egypt and Early Roman Catholicism are of particular interest to me presently. What really went on under the Gizeh Plateau, and under the Seven-Hills of Rome? What would the Whore of Babylon say? That mother!



Someone other than me thinks that Lucifer is alive and well, and living in this dimension. http://www.rense.com/general85/lucifer.htm

Lucifer Rising
By Philip Jones
5-13-09

Revelation 12:12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiter's of the earth and of the sea, for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.

Introduction. As an amateur researcher and writer, with perhaps too much time on his hands, I am fortunate to be able to devote many hours a day reading books and online articles relating to what I will call in this essay the Luciferian Conspiracy. I make no pretensions that what follows is in any way original or even innovative. Most of it excepting my own personal observations can be found in much greater detail elsewhere, and for that purpose, I have included a full bibliography and reference section at article's end. What I have tried to do here is collect information gleaned from reading the work of such exceptional researchers as William J. Sutton, Fritz Springmeier, William F. Jasper, Henry Makow, David Livingstone and Texe Marrs, and create a condensed summary of evidence which will show that as it says in the Bible verse above, Lucifer is amongst us, and the mayhem and chaos we are now experiencing on an international scale in this the first decade of the 21st century, is due to the culmination of many millenia of plotting and planning by the eternal adversary as mentioned in the Holy Scriptures.

If only four years ago, someone had made a similar assertion to me as that above, I would have raised an eyebrow or two, and politely or not, dismissed the idea. But all of my research these past few years has led me to believe just that; That Lucifer is real, and is here on earth, in this dimension, and through those who descend directly from his line, and their puppets, he is causing havoc and chaos in an attempt to seat himself, or his proxy on the throne of a World State, and to inaugurate a New Religion with himself it's sole deity.

During my investigations into the Illuminati Brotherhood and their diabolical machinations to cull and enslave mankind, I had until quite recently been oblivious to an aspect of the Global Conspiracy which in it's breadth, depth and scope is like no other. I am speaking about the New Age Movement and it's plan to introduce a World Religion. I have tried to be as brief and to the point as possible, and hope the reader will have the patience to stick with me. My ultimate intention here is to lead people to the work of those dedicated men listed above, which in turn will help others to truly come to terms with the realisation, that for all it's mystical hype and apparent diversity, what many now refer to as `The Rainbow Conspiracy` is in reality the `Luciferian Conspiracy`.

Below, I have tried to connect as many of those `dots` as an article of this type allows, in order to draw a red line through each of the many interconnecting aspects of what the New Age terms `The Plan` and what Freemasonry calls `The Great Work Of Ages`. Call it what you will, by `essay's end` , it should become obvious that what we are dealing with is Lucifer's rebellion against God.

The Far Pavillions. During the 1960s and '70s, large numbers of disillusioned intellectuals, alienated students and others from the West, travelled to India and other points east seeking "truth, wisdom, enlightenment, and good karma" from a ready made supply of gurus, swamis, yogis, and other self styled "Illuminated masters." Few understood that they were merely following in the footsteps of a woman who a hundred or so years earlier had trodden a similar path and set out the foundations for the present occult revival being experienced globally, and whose work is pivotal to the spiritual character of the United Nations today and the cause of a World Religion.

That woman was Helena P. Blavatsky (1831-1891), widely regarded as the high priestess of the modern New Age Movement. Blavatsky founded the Theosophical Society in New York in 1875, and during her lifetime, established close relations with Freemasonry, receiving the Certificate of the `Rite Of Adoption` from Mason John Yarker in 1877. Blavatsky's Theosophy taught arcane "knowledge" (Gnosis), the universal brotherhood of mankind, and unity among all religions, except the monotheistic religions, Christianity, Islam, and Judaism , which she insisted could not be reconciled with what she termed "individual enlightenment."

Blavatsky damned Yahweh as a "capricious and unjust." God. In her view, he was the God of the Israelites and nothing more. She insisted that the Holy Scriptures were wrong, it was really Lucifer who was the `Good and Just God`, victimised by the harsh and unjust Yahweh. Blavatsky maintained that the the name Satan, belonged by right to the first and cruelest "Adversary" of all other Gods, and not to the serpent which spoke only words of sympathy and wisdom. She somehow reasoned that Satan/Lucifer is GOD the Creator, the Savior, the Father; and that Jesus is "the first born brother of Satan." She wrote, "Satan, the Serpent of Genesis, is the real creator and benefactor, the Father of Spiritual mankind. For it is he ... who opened the eyes of the automaton (Adam) created by Yahweh, as alleged.... An adversary to him ... he still remains in Esoteric Truth the ever loving messenger ... who conferred on us spiritual instead of physical immortality."

She claimed to have had experience with astral projection and the ability to communicate with the spirit world. Her books, `Isis Unveiled` and her three-volume, `The Secret Doctrine` were supposedly channelled through her by the "Masters of Wisdom," Tibetan `holy men`, which any Christian, Jew or Muslim should recognise as being synonymous with demons.

In her book, `The Secret Doctrine` Blavatsky wrote, "Lucifer represents life, thought, progress, civilisation, liberty, independence. Lucifer is the Logos, the Serpent, the Saviour" and "It is Lucifer who is the God of our planet and the only God", and she continues, "The celestial Virgin which thus becomes the Mother of Gods and Devils at one and the same time, for she is the ever loving beneficent deity, but in antiquity and reality, Lucifer or Luciferius is the name. Lucifer is the divine and terrestrial light, the Holy Ghost and Satan at one and the same time".

When Blavatsky died in 1891, Annie Besant, a militant feminist, co mason, and a member of the Fabian Socialist Society of England took over the reigns of leadership. As a close friend of George Bernard Shaw, H.G. Wells, and other leading Fabians, she was in an excellent position to disseminate theosophical ideas in some very influential circles. She took part in revolutionary street riots and wrote numerous occultic works to complement those of Blavatsky.

After Besant, came Alice Bailey and her husband, Foster Bailey, a 32nd Degree Freemason. Having assumed the leadership of the Theosophical Society together, they formulated and built the foundations of what we now refer to as the New Age Movement. They made no effort to conceal their demonic sympathies, and created the `Lucifer Publishing Company`, along with the theosophical periodical `Lucifer`.Acknowledging that the Christian world at that time, had not been sufficiently undermined for their open preference for the Satanic religion, they renamed their project the `Lucis Publishing Company`. In 1922, they set up `Lucis Trust`, which continues to serve as the umbrella organization for a multitude of One World Government/New Age/Occult sects,cults, organizations and programs that are the main players in the emerging new world religion. These include the Arcane School, World Goodwill, Triangles, Lucis Publishing, Lucis Productions, Lucis Trust Libraries, and the New Group of World Servers.
The `Plan` as revealed by her `Ascended Master` Djwhal Khul, is documented in her twenty four books, which she says were channelled through her by Khul whilst she was in a trance state.

This `Plan`, was to usher in the "Harmonic Convergence," also known as the Omega, Mind Convergence, Fusion or Turning Point, which can occur only when nations put aside their differences in a "New World Order" of global unity. When world government and religion are finally realized, the New Age, or the Age of Aquarius, will have dawned. Only then will the Avatar appear, and the implementation of the New World Order fully begin. This "Christ" is also known as Lord Maitraya (see below), said to be awaited also by Jews, Moslems, Buddhists, and Hindus, though he is known by these believers respectively as the Messiah, Imam Mahdi, the fifth Buddha, or Krishna.

Bailey makes it very clear that there is to also be a world religion: "The spirit has gone out of the old faiths and the true spiritual light is transferring itself into a new form which will manifest on earth eventually as the new world religion. ...Judaism is old, obsolete and separative and has no true message for the spiritually-minded which cannot be better given by the new faiths...the Christian faith also has served its purpose; its Founder seeks to bring a new Gospel and a new message that will enlighten all men everywhere".

In his book `Terrorism & The Illuminati`, Canadian author, David Livingstone's own investigations revealed that the Lucis Trust is run through an international board of trustees, whose membership is said to have included: John D. Rockefeller, Norman Cousins, Robert S. McNamara, Thomas Watson, Jr. of IBM, and former U.S. Ambassador to Moscow, Henry Clauson, a Grand Commander of the Supreme Council, 33rd Degree, Southern District Scottish Rite, and Henry Kissinger, thus tying Bailey's organization into the various Round Table groups, including the CFR, the Bilderberger group, and the Trilateral Commission.

When one examines and researches the claims of the New Age Movement, it is all too easy to be sceptical and dismissive, but those leading the way forward in this modern day version of what is in truth `Mystery Babylon` renewed, are working hand in glove with the great and the powerful. Some of the most wealthy and influential men and women on our planet are openly identifying themselves with the New Age. From Bankers, Industrialists, Politicians, Celebrities, it seems everyone is going `New Age` and they are bringing huge swathes of the population along with them. This `spiritual awakening` may be only one aspect of the Illuminati's goal towards One World Government, but it is a major one and may in time prove to be the core element in their plan.

It would be foolhardy indeed to ignore the growing influence of the New Age, Occult, Satanist, Wicca, and Hedonist phenomena manifesting themselves all around us, without acknowledging that if these trends persist, the day will not be too far off when these forces will be able to make good on their aims.

As G. K. Chesterton once observed, "If man will not believe in God, the danger is not that he will believe in nothing, but that he will believe in anything."

`The Christ Is Now Here`! On April 25, 1982, millions of people across the world read the above headline in their daily newspapers, and that, "Throughout history, humanity's evolution has been guided by a group of enlightened men, the Masters of Wisdom, a Spiritual Hierarchy at the center of which stands the World Teacher, Lord Maitreya, known by Christians as the Christ."

We were told "The Christ" was at that that very time living in the world and would within two months reveal his identity to all mankind. At the same time, the British Theosophist Benjamin Creme commenced a worldwide speaking tour and announced himself spokesman for "the Christ." In numerous interviews and speeches, he explained that it was not Jesus Christ he was acting on behalf of, but the "Master of Wisdom," of whom Jesus, Buddha, Krishna, and others are disciples. Creme's messianic campaign was coordinated by his New Age religious organization, the Tara Center, from its offices in Los Angeles, New York, and London. As Creme's "Lord Maitreya` failed to appear, one would have expected that he and his `Christ, along with all his euphoric Aquarian propaganda would have become completely discredited and irrelevant. But we do not live in an age of reason. Mr Creme is still revered as a leading light of the vast New Age network, and his arcane gospel can be found around the world at UN conferences and programs where the Illuminati Elite of the Club of Rome, Aspen Institute, Council on Foreign Relations, World Federalists, World Bank, etc. consort with New Agers of every imaginable kind.

The United Nations And The New World Religion. "The underlying philosophy upon which the Robert Muller School is based will be found in the teaching set forth in the books of Alice Bailey as channeled through her by the Demon Tibetan teacher, Djwhal Khul". Robert Muller (Former UN Assistant Secretary General)

Many critics of the United Nations have described it as a modern day `Tower of Babel`. Most were referring to man's act of spiritual arrogance that the book of Genesis tells us earned God's displeasure. To support such an unflattering characterisation today, one might draw attention to the confusing and combustible assortment of tongues, cultures, ideologies, and politics for which the "house of peace" has become justly infamous. The UN, along with its programs and policies, is ever more worthy of comparison to the Tower of Babel, as rampant idolatry and militant paganism thoroughly permeate the organization.

The UN is gradually becoming the center of a New World Religion, a strange and evil convergence of New Age mysticism, pantheism, aboriginal animism, atheism, communism, socialism, Luciferian occultism, apostate Christianity, Islam, Taoism, Buddhism, and Hinduism. The followers and disciples of this new faith include Crystal Worshipers, Astrologers, Radical Feminists, Environmentalists, Cabalists, Humanists, Eastern Mystics, Pop Psychologists, and "liberal" clergymen whom one would normally tend to associate with the counterculture of the 1960s. But today's `worshipers` in this `New Age Movement` are just as likely to be scientists, diplomats, corporate presidents, heads of state, international bankers, and leaders of mainstream Christian churches.

The Rio Earth Summit. "Thus, the environmental movement, while helping to advance the cause of the oil industry, is an extension of the Aquarian conspiracy, incepted by Alice Bailey, designed ultimately to foster the acceptance a one-world-religion, based on the occult, or the New Age, as it is called". David Livingstone.

In his book `Global Tyranny Step By Step`, William F Jasper writes " At the June 1992 UN Earth Summit in Brazil, the official UN Conference on Environment and Development (UNCED) together with the Global Forum "Peoples Summit" showcased a blending of pagan aboriginal rites with an ecumenical collective of `mystical` and spiritual tenets from East and West to bring into being an unintelligible form of what was called a `Universal Faith`.

Across the globe, the world media referred to the Rio Declaration and the 800-page blueprint for government action titled Agenda 21 as "sacred" texts. Al Gore, the leader of the U.S. Senate delegation, called for a new spiritual relationship between man and earth. Actress Shirley MacLaine was in attendance in order to add her own strange brand of psychic spirituality to the proceedings. Those Ministers from the World Council of Churches present, were there because of their affinity to the ecumenical "spirit" that uses the Hegelian Dialectic to combine a form of Christianity as thesis, with a pagan spiritualism as antithesis, resulting in a synthesis very akin to the Babylonian Mystery Religions. Another group at the summit, The Union for Natural Environment Protection, an environmental association based in Sao Leopoldo, Brazil, surprisingly declared the following about the true purpose of the W.C. of C's involvement:

"The environmental movement is being used as a cover to promote a return to the creed of the Ancient Mysteries, in the form of the worship of mother-nature, a pagan notion that equates the goddess with earth, known among the ancient Greeks as Gaia. Originally, she is the Babylonian Ishtar, known to the Bible as Astarte, or the Egyptian Isis. This pantheistic idea has its origins in ancient paganism, and is central to the Kabbalah and all Western occult tradition, including Freemasonry and the Illuminati. Plato wrote: "We shall affirm that the cosmos, more than anything else, resembles most closely that living Creature of which all other living creatures, severally or genetically, are portion; a living creature which is fairest of all and in ways most perfect." Known as Anima Mundi, the "Soul of the World", it is related to the concept of the Neoplatonists, the Logos, or the Word, also known as the "Son of God", or the ancient dying God"

It should be apparent to the reader that a `nexus` has been formed, connecting the major players in the push towards the One World Dictatorship, with the United Nations, The New Age Movement, and the `Greens` all interlocking at the top, with the `hidden hand` of the Illuminati pulling the strings in the background as the driving force moving us all inexorably towards the New World Order.

The Illuminaries. Canadian Multi Millionaire Industrialist Maurice Strong , a former trustee of the Aspen Institute for Humanistic Studies and a member of the advisory council of Planetary Citizens, is a major force within the Environmental and New Age Movements. He sits on the board of directors and serves as director of finance of the Lindisfarne Center, which is located in the Episcopal Cathedral of St. John the Divine in New York, and its operation all facilitated by grants from the Lilly Endowment, the Rockefeller Brothers Fund, and the Rockefeller Foundation.
The Institute numbers among its faculty members the `Eco-Radical` Amory Lovins and Luciferian Adept and New Age author David Spangler. We can gain some appreciation as to what is being taught at this Rockerfeller funded institute by reading Mr. Spangler's books, such as `Reflections on the Christ`, wherein he writes:

"Lucifer, like Christ, stands at the door of man's consciousness and knocks. If man says, go away because I do not like what you represent, I am afraid of you, Lucifer will play tricks on that fellow. If man says, "Come in, and I will give to you the treat of my love and understanding and I will uplift you in the light and presence of the Christ, my outflow," then Lucifer becomes something else again. He becomes the being who carries that great treat, the ultimate treat, the light of wisdom. The reason man has come to fear Lucifer is not so much that he represents evil as because he represents experience which causes us to grow and to move beyond the levels where we have been.... Lucifer is literally the angel of experience."

Spangler, Muller, Strong, and a host of other `names`, such as Queen Juliana of the Netherlands, Sir Edmund Hillary, Peter Ustinov, Kurt Vonnegut, Leonard Bernstein, Isaac Asimov, and Pete Seeger, are all listed as being original endorsers of the world-government-promoting Planetary Citizens. Founded by New Age luminary and former UN consultant Donald Keys, and presided over for many years by the lateNorman Cousins (CFR), the Planetary Citizens Organization has brought together and made very good use of the prestige of many leading world figures to support expansion of UN power and it's institutions.Keys, a self confessed disciple of Alice Bailey, refers to the United Nations as "the nexus of emerging planetary values" and expresses the hope that it will establish a "planetary management system.".(New Age Speak for World Government).

Another original endorser of Planetary Citizens was Aurelio Peccei, the founder of the Club of Rome, which although initially recognised for its role in launching "no growth" environmentalism in the 1970s, has `waxed` increasingly "spiritual" in more recent years. Their quest for spiritual `wisdom` includes slavish adherence to the Blavatsky mandate dictating that Christianity, Islam, and Judaism are either excluded or denigrated.

One of the primary avenues through which this lean toward oriental spiritualism has been spread is the Temple of Understanding, located at the same Cathedral of St. John the Divine that houses the Lindisfarne Luciferians. Begun in the early 1960s as the "spiritual counterpart of the United Nations," its founding sponsors included the following odd assortment of Establishment Insiders, socialists, humanists, communist fronts, religious figures, and entertainment celebrities:

John D. Rockefeller IV
then-Secretary of Defense Robert S. McNamara
Planned Parenthood founder Margaret Sanger
IBM president Thomas J. Watson
Socialist Party leader Norman Thomas
Eleanor Roosevelt
Time-Life president James A. Linen
homosexual author Christopher Isherwood
columnist Max Lerner
entertainer Jack Benny
With people such as the these in the vanguard, the U N's pagan spiritualism will grow ever more overt and assertive. The UN report entitled `The New International Economic Order A Spiritual Imperative` proclaims; "Today a new understanding of spirituality is emerging which recognizes that all efforts to uplift humanity are spiritual in nature. Alice Bailey said, "That is spiritual which lies beyond the point of present achievement...." ... Given this new understanding of spirituality, the work of the United Nations can be ... seen within the entire evolutionary unfoldment of humanity. The work of the U.N. is indeed spiritual and holds profound import for the future of civilization."

The Pantheistic Smokescreen. "When you worship the sun, moon, stars, a statue, or even yourself, Lucifer is leading you astray. You are not to worship things that were created; instead you are to worship the creator. To worship anything other than the creator is giving heed to Lucifer". Fritz Springmeier `Be Wise As Serpents`.

Since "God" in the pantheistic metaphysical system is not the almighty God of the Bible, but an impersonal, immanent force that occupies all things, then all things; the universe itself, every rock, every tree, everything, every man, every woman are "God." In this pagan world view, man is not a special creation of the one, true God, to whom, ultimately, he is answerable to. Nor is he endowed by his Creator with intrinsic, inalienable rights and duties. Thus pantheism "functions as an effective device in the undermining of a God-centered religion by transforming religion into a man-centered belief system, and thereby giving a religious sanction to the doctrines and programs of political collectivism. Pantheism can be also be utilised as a step towards bringing humanity from theism to atheistic materialism. In religion, pantheism is most often expressed as Naturalism; the doctrine that religious truth is derived from nature, not revelation.

The June 1941 issue of the occult journal `Rosicrucian Digest` predicted that "The multiplicity of social states, countries, or nations will cease to be." That nations would be superseded by "The One United World State." The Rosicrucian's were correct in concluding that the `mystical-pantheism` they advocated would, if generally accepted, lead to a collectivist world state. And there are far too few people in the world today who understand the direct cause-and-effect relationship between the two. Father Clarence Kelly, a noted authority on occult deception writes; "Pantheism is a favorite doctrine of collectivists, because it offers a concept of man which, on religious grounds, subordinates the individual to the collective."

Hitler And The Vril. It was Neo-Paganism that helped create the conditions which paved the way for the totalitarian collectivism of the Third Reich. The Nazi high priesthood - Hitler, Himmler, Rahn, Rosenberg, Hess, Feder, Sebot, et al. were all ardent theosophists, and their esoteric societies (the Thule, Vril, Seekers of the Grail) were steeped in the same occultism and pantheism so prevalent in today's New Age and environmental movements.

There is a wealth of evidence that Hitler considered himself `chosen` and he is on record as having said; "I have seen the `New Man` and he is indeed terrible". It is evident that Hitler was deeply involved in the occult and that he believed that his murderous reign of terror was a `divine` mission on behalf of what he termed the `Ancient Aryan Masters`. Dietrich Eckart, a master Adept of the Thule Society and Hitlers' occult mentor, wrote, "Hitler will dance, but it is I who will call the tune! I have initiated him into the Secret Doctrine, opened his centers of vision and given him means to communicate with the powers".

In the final chapter of his book, `The Twisted Cross`, Joseph Carr draws frightening parallels between Nazism and the New Age Movement; "One cannot argue against the claim that the Nazi world view and major elements of the New Age Movement are identical. They should be, after all for they both grew out of the same occult root: Theosophy. Their respective cosmogony, cosmology and philosophies are identical".

The New Age and the One World Government conspiracy are intrinsic and inseparable.. Although all the various sects and cults which make up `Pantheism` may appear diverse and separate, all the basic elements are the same for the various gnostic hierarchical religions, they just have a different focus. They operate off the same principles and cooperate and function together. What are ostensibly separate and independent religious groups are actually at the very top working together and run by the same cabal in the service of the same master.

In his epic work on the One World Religion, `Be Wise As Serpents` Fritz Springmeier answers the question most of us have asked; "Do the leaders of the cults know what is going on? In authoritative fashion, Mr Springmeier answers, "Yes, they have been orally, emphasis on that word orally told exactly what is happening. The leaders of the New Age, the Jehovah's Witnesses, and the Latter Day Saints church know what they are up to, and what their roles are in creating a one-world government".

The Solar Logos. Throughout the Ancient World, the Sun was worshipped in many guises as God. In Babylon it was Nimrod, in Egypt- Osiris, the Canaanites worshipped Baal and in Greece, it was Apollo. The New Age Sun God is called the `Solar Logos` or `The Word` thereby blasphemously counterfeiting the Biblical Jesus Christ. In her book, `Rays and Initiations`, Alice Bailey reveals this Solar Logos as Lucifer himself. Today, as in millenia past, the Sun God is being worshipped by the New Age as divine.

David Spangler, refers to the Sun God in these terms: "The light that reveals to us the path to the New Age `Christ` comes from Lucifer. He is the light giver. It is his light that heralds for man the dawn of a greater consciousness. The true light of this great being can only be recognised when one's own eyes see with the light of the inner sun. It is an invitation into the New Age "
The ancient doctrine of the Sun God or Solar Logos melds itself easily with Pantheism, which as we have seen is at the moment a core dogma of the New Age. By denying the existence of a personal God, whilst insisting that the universe itself is God, New Agers declare that as man is part of the universe, man is also God. The Luciferian master plan cannot succeed unless people accept that there is no God who loves and cares for them. Therefore, accepting that the Moon, the Stars, the Galaxies are all Gods in themselves, the New Age Sun God or Solar Logos as humanity's master becomes a required tenet of belief and we can establish that throughout man's history, all `Sun God's have been nothing more than guises for the great deceiver, Lucifer.

Witches believe that Lucifer is the God of the Sun, and the Sun God is also known as the `Horned God` (Lucifer is also known as the "Angel of Light). Many of the Witch's holy days revolve around the Sun such as the Yule. A large part of their belief system is the concept of the Sun weakening and the world dying, then on the Winter Solstice the Sun God Lucifer is reborn and warms the Earth. To the Ancient Latin people's, Lucifer was the Sun God, father of Aradia and the brother and lover of Diana.

To appreciate how this adversary of God has been able to clandestinely insinuate himself into our lives, we only have to look all around at the plethora of pagan sun symbolism which now proliferate throughout society. One example of this can be found in the world of female bodybuilding, where each year, a trophy shaped in a design used to symbolize the worship of Lucifer is awarded at a major I.F.B.B. women's bodybuilding event. The meaning of this trophy is hidden from most everyone but a select few who are initiated. The trophy is in the form of an obelisk, which to those unfamiliar is a tapering, four-sided shaft that has a pyramidal top. The obelisk is a symbol that definitely has connections to Freemasonry. The obelisk is important to Masons and has roots in ancient Egypt. It is the symbol of a god worshipped by believers involved in the ancient mysteries
The obelisk represents the Sun God Lucifer. The sun is also a major Masonic symbol. Albert Pike, who we deal with below wrote: "The sun is the ancient symbol of the life-giving and generative power of theDeity."

Ralph Epperson, a historian and lecturer on the subject writes: "The sun was a symbol of something that only the believers in the religion...understood. These believers, ...knew that the people would not accept their mystery religion, so they had to conceal it from them. So the task became one of creating a religion around a belief that they knew the people would accept. Their basic purpose was to create a popular religion as a cover for their secret worship. They would have to keep their beliefs from the people, and conceal their secret worship in hidden symbols." Epperson continues: "The obelisk stands for the very presence of the sun god! And the sun god is Lucifer!"

The World Religion Exposed. "The Gnostic religions are often called pagan. This pagan worship is often the exoteric cover that the first levels are initiated into. The highest level is often the real esoteric worship, and often involves direct Luciferian or Satanic worship. In other words, the Sun worship of the Masons and other groups is a fig leaf for the worship by the highest levels of the Divine Serpent Satan". Fritz Springmeier `Be Wise As Serpents `.

"According to Alice Bailey, the Masonic movement will be the religion of the New System. Benjamin Creme, also believes Freemasonry will be the religion of the New Age. Lola Davis, another New Age leader, also sees Freemasonry as the New Age Religion" (Texe Marrs: Dark Secrets of the New Age).

Alice Bailey wrote in 1957, "The Masonic movement... is the custodian of the law; it is the home of the Mysteries and the seat of initiation. It holds in its symbolism the ritual of Deity, and the way of salvation is pictorially preserved in its work. It is a far more occult organization than can be realised, and is intended to be the training school for the coming advanced occultists. In its ceremonials lie hid the wielding of the forces connected with the growth and life of the kingdoms of nature and the unfoldment of the divine aspects in man."

"When the new universal religion has sway and the nature of esotericism is understood-will be the utilisation of the banded esoteric organisms, the Masonic organism and the Church organism as initiating centres. These three groups converge as their inner sanctuaries are approached. There is no dissociation between the One Universal Church, the sacred inner Lodge of all true Masons, and the inner-most circles of esoteric societies." (Taken from `Be Wise As Serpents by Fritz Springmeier).

Has Freemasonry been underestimated as a world religion? At least one Masonic author writing to Masons felt that Masonic religious power had been underestimated. He writes,"In the past Masonry has been condemned as a shallow substitute for religion. This the Masonic body has always denied but in fact the new age revitalised Masonry will be a paralleling evolutionary way of man's approach to God, and Masonry and religion will gladly cooperate." --The Spirit of Masonry, p. 129

Albert Pike (December 29, 1809­April 2, 1891). Albert Pike was a Luciferian who confessed Lucifer as his own God see (below quote). He was the former Sovereign General of The Supreme Council Of Grand Sovereign Inspectors, General of the 33rd Degree of The Scottish Rite. There is also compelling evidence that he founded the Ku Klux Klan.. Pike can be justifiably regarded as the most influential Freemason who ever lived. During the American Civil War, he was a confederate general who is said to have committed the most heinous atrocities of the war, yet his tomb is located just thirteen blocks from the Capitol Building in Washington DC. He was a high ranking member of the Illuminati who is still revered by the New World Order Cabal.

In his book `Morals and Dogma`, Pike confirmed for posterity that the God of the Illuminati and the New World Order is Lucifer. He wrote; "The Masonic religion should be, by all of us initiates of the high degrees, maintained in the purity of the Luciferian doctrine. . . Yes, Lucifer is God, and unfortunately Adonay (Jesus) is also God. For the eternal law is that there is no light without shade, no beauty without ugliness, no white without black, for the absolute can only exist as two Gods: darkness being necessary to light to serve as its foil as the pedestal is necessary to the statue, and the brake to the locomotive. "

Pike asserted boldly and unequivocally in his book that Freemasonry is identical to the ancient mysteries, which clearly means that all their teachings in all their books are precisely the same as the Ancient, Pagan, Satanic Mysteries! Pike continues in Morals and Dogma " The true and pure philosophic religion is the belief in Lucifer, the equal of Adonay (Jesus); but Lucifer, God of Light and God of Good, is struggling for humanity against Adonay, the God of darkness and evil."

Is Freemasonry The Worship Of Lucifer? There has been extensive debate as to whom the true god of Freemasonry really is. Below, I have listed some quotes from Masonic Authorities which will help clarify this piece of the puzzle. It should be understood that most Blue Degree Masons are not in thrall to Lucifer, but higher level `initiates` must participate in rituals which involve drinking from skulls whilst kneeling prostrate at a black alter adorned with serpents.

We should furthermore take pains to know who Lucifer really is. The King James Bible records his fall from heaven following his rebellion against God thus: "How art thou fallen from heaven O Lucifer, son of the morning! How are thou cut down to the ground which didst weaken the nations! For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God. I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north. I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most high, yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit". Isaiah 14:12-15.

The Scriptures name Lucifer as "That old serpent called the Devil and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world". Revelation 12:9.
Deception in Freemasonry is witnessed time and again as one goes ever deeper into it's darkness. Albert Pike in his `Morals and Dogma writes," Masonry like all the religions, all the mysteries, conceals it's secret from all except the Adepts and Sages, or the elect, and uses false explanations and misinterpretations of it's symbols to mislead those who deserve only to be mislead. The Blue Degrees are but the outer court or portico of the Temple. Part of the symbols are displayed there to the Initiate, but he is intentionally mislead by false interpretations. It is not intended that he shall understand them, but it is intended he shall imagine he understands them".

Quotes affirming Lucifer as the God of Fremasonry:
"First conjuration address to Emperor Lucifer, Master and Prince of rebellious spirits, I adjure thee to leave thine abode in what ever quarter of the world it may be situated and come hither to communicate with me. I command and I conjure thee in thy name oh mighty living god, to appear without noise". The Book Of Black Magic by Arthur Edward Waite 33rd Degree Mason.

"I hereby promise the Great Spirit Lucifuge, Prince Of Demons, that each year, I will bring unto him a human soul to do with as it may please him, and in return, Lucifuge promises to bestow upon me the treasures of the earth and fulfill my every desire for the length of my natural life. If I fail to bring him each year the offering specified above, then my own soul shall be forfeit to him". Signed in blood, Manly Palmer Hall 33rd Degree Freemason from his book `The Secret Teaching Of All Ages`.

"When the Mason learns that the key to the warrior on the block is the proper application of the dynamo of living power, he has learned the Mystery of his Craft. The seething energies of Lucifer are in his hands and before he may step onward and upward, he must prove his ability to properly apply this energy". Manly Palmer Hall 33rd Degree `The Lost Keys Of Freemasonry`.

" That which we must say to a crowd is; We worship a God, but it is the God that one adores without superstition. To you Sovereign Grand Inspectors General, we say this, that you may repeat it to the brethren of the 32nd, 31st, and 30th degrees. The Masonic Religion should be, by all of us initiates of the High degrees, maintained in the purity of the Luciferian Doctrine". Albert Pike 33 rd Degree.

" Lucifer, the son of the morning! Is it he who bears the light, and with it's splendours intolerable blinds feeble, sensual, or selfish souls? Doubt it not!" Albert Pike 33rd Degree.

Freemasonry is truly the worship of Lucifer. Once this is understood, it becomes clear as to why they have been so anxious all these centuries to keep the lid of secrecy tightly screwed down, for if people really understood that Masonry is a worship of Lucifer, no one would join, and the citizens of most communities would rise up as one to demand that the organization be completely outlawed. Thus, you have secrets within secrets , wheels within wheels, just as the above quotes confirm.

The Light Bearer Returns. Many believe that the New Age Movement is little more than a collection of old Hippies, Feminists and `wannabe` mystics chanting and praying to who knows what or why. But that is so far from the reality of what is a dangerous and desperate situation, as the Illuminati and their co conspirators in the New Age, through use of all the weapons of media control and information available to them, drive their New World Order project to it's logical conclusion, whilst we the people sleep walk into their `Aquarian` Dictatorship.

In his book `Terrorism And The Illuminati`, the Canadian author David Livingstone writes: "The Illuminati claim to be descended of Fallen Angels, who taught them the "Ancient Wisdom", also known as the Kabbalah, which they have been preserving throughout the centuries. These Fallen Angels are referred to in the Bible, Book of Genesis, as the Nephilim, or "Sons of God", and were said to have descended to earth and intermarried with human beings. Christian interpretations struggle with the passage, choosing to translate the term into "mighty men". However, apocryphal Jewish texts explain that they were the devil and his legions, who were cast out of Heaven, and took wives from the female descendants of Cain. They produced a race known as the Anakim".

It is a well researched hypothesis that it is these `Anakim` or rather their descendent's who now occupy all the positions of real power in our world. Whether they are truly the children of the Nephilim is irrelevant so long as they themselves believe that it is, and use this assumed `divine` right to rule in order to justify the increasing oppression, control and terror being enacted on all our lives.

Conclusion: The Luciferian New Age of Aquarius is here right now and mankind has joined in rebellion against it's creator. We are giving to people, who now publicly exclaim their worship of God and man's greatest and original adversary, free reign to lead us into hell on earth in the shape of a diabolical One World tyrannical state, and the United Nations is the international temple at which humanity, through it's political and religious leaders pays homage to him, the Light Bearer - Lucifer.

"And he shall exalt himself and magnify himself above every God, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished; for that which is determined shall be done (Dan. 11:36).

Reference and Further Reading.
http://www.unol.org/rms/wcc.html Robert Muller
http://www.robertmuller.org/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alice_A._Bailey
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madame_Blavatsky
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maurice_Strong#Becoming_an_entrepreneur
Wanda Marrs : New Age Lies To Women p34
http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/pike.htm
(http://www.scarletsbookofshadows.freewebspace.com/whats_new.html) Wicca
http://www.museumofwitchcraft.com/about_mow19.php) Wicca
Terrorism & The Illuminati by David Livingstone http://www.terrorism-illuminati.com/book/toc.html
666 Illuminati by William Josiah Sutton http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/sociopolitica/newage_illuminati/contents.htm
Be Wise As Serpents by Fritz Springmeier.
Global Tyranny Step By Step by William F Jasper.
Any of the Books on the New Age by Texe and Wanda Marrs.
The Holy Scriptures New English Bible and King James Version.
http://www.geocities.com/endtimedeception/worship.htm
http://cuttingedge.org/free11.html
http://cuttingedge.org/free11.html
http://www.masonicinfo.com/pike.htm
The Hidden Secrets Of The Rainbow by Constance E. Cumbey.

I continue to thrash around the internet - looking here and there - and I'm not even sure what I'm looking for. If I am ever flippant or sarcastic - please don't take it personally. I am just a very frustrated and fearful human being - who thinks things are going to continue to be bad - for a very long time.

I'm just trying to find more sane ways to manage the insanity.

I'm not very friendly, and I'm not very smart - and I have huge issues and problems - so don't expect too much from me. I have a pathological interest in the hidden things of the universe - which is frankly unbalanced. But having said that - all of this is still extremely important - and some of the most incapable and incompetent people on the planet may get stuck with trying to figure out a lot of very complicated and upsetting material. The best and the brightest may be too busy being rich, famous, and powerful.

One more time - I keep watching the following - and facing myself - and thinking, and thinking, and thinking...

1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tZEPUfmfIsE

2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nyKy8_sF4xY

3. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x8YK_ad7Us0&feature=related

4. http://www.hulu.com/watch/108637/stargate-sg-1-the-powers-that-be

5. http://www.hulu.com/watch/62967/stargate-sg-1-hathor

6. http://www.hulu.com/watch/62950/stargate-sg-1-the-first-commandment

I have done a lot of speculating and questioning. I don't feel confident about any of it. I would fall flat on my face in a debate. But still I continue. I keep trying to stop. I found a video series which confirms so much of my earlier conjecturings - and which has left me stunned. I think there is a sweet-spot between traditional religion and the new age. I don't go to church anymore - and I don't go to new age seminars or Whole Life Expos - but I think we should study theology and new age topics - very thoroughly and carefully. Please give this video series your undivided attention. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A4XvotlAzrQ Kali is the Sirius Star of this series!



Lucifer Images: http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rlz=1T4GGIR_enUS216US217&q=lucifer+images

Kali Images: http://www.google.com/images?rlz=1T4GGIR_enUS216US217&q=kali+images&um=1&ie=UTF-8&source=univ&ei=IYKjTJHTE5KasAOfhNH6Bg&sa=X&oi=image_result_group&ct=title&resnum=1&ved=0CCkQsAQwAA

Semiramis Images: http://www.google.com/images?rlz=1T4GGIR_enUS216US217&q=semiramis+images&um=1&ie=UTF-8&source=univ&ei=q5-8TKu3BYu8sQOUptmPDw&sa=X&oi=image_result_group&ct=title&resnum=1&ved=0CCUQsAQwAA

Persephone Images: http://www.google.com/images?q=persephone+images&um=1&hl=en&rlz=1T4GGIR_enUS216US217&tbs=isch:1&ei=lJ68TKWIJoHAsAOr9_3sDg&sa=N&start=0&ndsp=18

Lilith Images: http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rlz=1T4GGIR_enUS216US217&q=lilith+images

Ishtar Images: http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&aq=1&oq=ishtar+im&ie=UTF-8&rlz=1T4GGIR_enUS216US217&q=ishtar+images

Hathor Images: http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rlz=1T4GGIR_enUS216US217&q=hathor+images

Isis Images: http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rlz=1T4GGIR_enUS216US217&q=isis+images

Queen of Heaven Images: http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rlz=1T4GGIR_enUS216US217&q=queen+of+heaven+images



I think we should study the esoteric subjects exhaustively - but I think this is a very, very dangerous pursuit - and one should use extreme caution. We are not as smart as we think we are - and we are easily confused and deceived. Try reading the Four Gospels over and over again - while researching the esoteric - to maintain a central frame of reference - a sort of a refuge. In the current infowar - I think a lot of people are going to lose their faiths - and their minds. Hang in there!

I'd really like to know the full and true story of Promethius (Lucifer?) stealing fire from the gods. I'm sensing a very sad and violent history of the universe. I'm sensing that we are in the middle of a continuing War in Heaven. I'm also sensing that we are in one helluva lot of trouble. We need to exhaustively understand the proper relationship between freedom and responsibility. I think we need a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System. Hope springs eternal.

Enter 'Rise of the Fourth Reich' in the YouTube search field. Also enter 'Teutonic Zionism'. Notice the ancient Babylonian, Egyptian, Grecian, and Roman themes in the art, architecture, and symbology of the Nazi Party. Consider the possible role of a Secret Government, Secret Space Program, and Underground Bases in the Rise of the Third Reich. How did the Germans get so much money, technology, and power so quickly? Google 'omega files' and 'Branton'. Watch 'The Secret Underground Lectures of Commander X' on Google.

Lucifer = Lilith = Hathor = Kali = Isis = Mary = Inanna = Anna (in the TV series 'V') = Whore of Babylon ruling Babylon aka the Secret Government, United Nations, Washington DC, City of London, Vatican, Jesuits, Alphabet Agents, Royal Family, Zionism, Teutonic Zionism, Secret Space Program, and Underground Bases? How much trouble are we in? We need a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System aka United States of the Solar System based on the US Constitution and Responsibility.

I have no animosity toward anyone, including the individuals and institutions listed above. All of this is speculation (for me anyway). We need to get informed without getting mad or going mad. This should be a high-ground infowar. There should be no angry finger-pointing. I keep envisioning an ideal and open Solar System Government - which includes the UN, Washington DC, City of London, Vatican, Underground Bases, and Secret Space Program - based on the US Constitution and Responsibility.

Protestantism is really Reformed Catholicism. They never ventured too far away from Mother Church. I think this applies to SDA's as well. I continue to read from Ellen White books on an almost daily basis - but I think that Adventism is a mixture of truth and error. I think I understand some understandable reasons for this. I think that just about everyone on the planet is in for a rude awakening about a lot of things - and this includes SDA's. We are in a huge spiritual war.

The Roman Catholic Church seems to be a continuation of Ancient Babylonian Egyptian Grecian Roman Luciferianism. The problem is compounded by the observation that it seems that Protestantism is more dependent on Catholicism than they would like to admit. What if Lucifer plays the parts of both God and Satan? What if Lucifer essentially wrote the Bible and the Quran? I continue to reverence the Red Letter Teachings of Jesus.

How about basing the Solar System on the U.S. Constitution and Responsibility. The First and Last Commandment should be 'Thou Shalt Have No Gods'. I think the Creator God of the Universe would agree. Oh - I know that sounds like an orthodoxymoron - but I really don't think that the real God is on any sort of an ego-trip - and I do think that they would condemn any type of self-exaltation, rulership, exploitation, or enslavement. I think we have false gods and goddesses in this neck of the woods.

"In that vast throng are multitudes of the long-lived race that existed before the Flood; men of lofty stature and giant intellect, who, yielding to the control of fallen angels, devoted all their skill and knowledge to the exaltation of themselves; men whose wonderful works of art led the world to idolize their genius, but whose cruelty and evil inventions, defiling the earth and defacing the image of God, caused Him to blot them from the face of His creation."- Great Controversy by Ellen White.

What if the Holy Bible, the Quran, and most of the ancient mythologies and theologies were essentially authored by Lucifer? If this is true, or partially true, might this be a mixture of good and evil, truth and error? We should consider all of the possibilities, shouldn't we? Is the Father of Lies a Real Mother - namely Kali? Or Hathor on a bad day? Do we have a Sirius-Centered Babylonian, Egyptian, Grecian, Roman Theocracy - founded in Tibet - and ruled by an Apostolic Succession of Goddesses?

Did the Whore of Babylon sell-out to Satan - or did/does she serve as a Mediatrix between Satan and Humanity? Is Kali a human/reptile hybrid (who appears to be completely human)? Is Satan a human/reptile hybrid (who appears as a Draconian Reptilian 'Alien')? I keep thinking that Lucifer/Lilith/Hathor/Kali/Isi­s/Mary is the Whore of Babylon who has ruled the world for a long, long time. I keep trying to get her to go out with me on a debate date to discuss galactic issues and transition of power!

Is there a way to harmonize the Latin Mass, the Teachings of Jesus, and the U.S. Constitution? Would this be a Spiritual Switzerland or a Heretical Hell? The ultimate goal would be a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System aka The United States of the Solar System. It seems that Roman Catholicism would be opposed to such a concept. It further seems that Roman Catholicism is really Babylonian, Egyptian, Grecian Romanism - rather than an outworking of the Teachings of Jesus.

It seems as though we may be dealing with a worldwide network of Underground Bases and Cities (connected by mach II magneto-leviton trains?) - inhabited by Nephilim (or by beings who are not completely human - as we know human to be) - who rule the world by secrecy and deception. The Deep Underground Military Bases (such as Dulce) seem to be an integral part of all of this. It further seems as though they are smarter than us - expect reverential worship - and can be very cruel.

Watch 'Hathor' and 'Powers That Be' on hulu(dot)com. Then watch all of the 'V' video clips on YouTube. Do they tie into this series? A reliable source told me that a priest once asked 'What if God is a Black Woman?' Watch the movie 'Avatar' and read between the lines. Google 'Morena Baccarin - Stargate SG1' and watch all of the episodes in which she appears. Does Kali possess technology beyond our wildest dreams? Could this be ancient human technology? We need to know the truth even if it hurts.

Please consider this video series and my comments very carefully. This could all be very important. I have chosen to ask a lot of questions and make a lot of speculations on the internet in appropriate settings - such as in this video series. This subject could be very, very upsetting to a lot of people - and extreme caution should be exercised in discussing it. I'm hoping for a happy ending to all of this - but I suspect that things may get a lot worse before they get better. Hang on!

Watch 'Stargate - Devil Came to Me' and 'Leo Zagami - 2012 Armageddon' on YouTube. Watch them several times. Watch the Stargate clip with the sound off - and use the sound from the Zagami clip. Is there a match? Is this a representation of Kali? Is Kali ultimately responsible for 9/11? Watch 'Lone Gunman - 9/11' and notice the young woman at the computer.

Watch 'UFO's and the Secret Government' by Bill Cooper - Alex Collier videos - and Alex Jones videos - on Google Video or YouTube - and place Kali and the Nephilim at the center of things. Are we Prisoners of War on a Prison Planet with Grey Guards, a Human/Reptile Hybrid Warden, and a Draconian Reptilian God of This World? Also - get the book 'Soldiers of Reason' regarding the Rand Corporation. All of this seems to be interconnected - and may require a huge amount of research to figure everything out.

Notice the last paragraph at 9:55 in part 14. Is this getting at the heart of the matter? There is a Stargate SG-1 episode called 'Fire and Water' which contains key phrases which relate to this paragraph. Watch 'Riddles in Stone' to get some insight into who Nicholas Roerich was, and the importance of the Dog Star Sirius. What if the Trinity (triple) Goddess consists of Gabriel, Michael, and Lucifer? The Creator God of the Universe seems to be strangely absent throughout history. I'm fearing the worst.

I'm really trying to educate and condition myself to be completely objective and detached - without much emotion - so that I could easily interact with everyone - including Illuminati, Popes, Presidents, Jesuits, Alphabet Agents, Generals, Professors, Greys, Reptilians, Hybrids, Angels, Demons, Archangels - Satan and Kali. Basically I'm a nobody imagining what it might be like to be a somebody - without selling my soul to you know who. It's a nasty job - but someone's gotta do it! Right Lucifer?

Could St. Germain have been a representative or manifestation of Lucifer? I get the distinct impression that Lucifer gets around - a lot. Check this out. http://www.thejinn.net/ascended_master.htm



The "Ascended Master" Types and My Encounter With St. Germain

St. Germain doesn't claim to be a saint. He claims to be an "Ascended Master", but the name is typical of jinn obfuscation. He appears to enjoy being venerated like a saint.

The Comte de St. Germain was well known to the court of King Louis XV of France as an alchemist, a linguist, and a man of great wealth, memory, age and adventure. He is an actual historical figure credited with various alchemical feats and with writing an alchemical manuscript entitled "La Tres Sainte Trino Sophie" which is contained in the Bibliotheque de Troyes.

In 1930, Guy Ballard, having studied theosophical and occult teachings, traveled to Mt. Shasta to investigate rumors that strange occult events occurred there. While hiking the mountain, Ballard claims that the Ascended Master Saint Germain, offered him a magical drink which renewed his body. Ballard founded the "I AM" cult to spread the teachings of the Ascended Masters and Saint Germain. This cult degenerated to the point where members were told to kill their pets and shun family members who wouldn't join the cult. It caused fanatical believers to "decree" for long hours during the day and part of the night, with such intensity and emotionalism that a number of them had nervous breakdowns, or were confined to psychopathic wards and insane asylums.

In legends and history there have always existed magical men who possess the hidden knowledge. They elude precise description because they seem primarily fictional but are associated with various historical records and documents. They are archetypal and stimulate the imagination. Of those who have actually lived among us, I think that some are human and some are jinn, and most involve partnerships between humans and jinns. They include characters such as: Paracelsus, Koot Hoomi, Master Morya, "Thrice greatest Hermes", Don Juan (in the books by Carlos Castaneda), Sai Baba, Merlin, Ashtar, and St. Germain. Alchemy seems to be their strong suit and the thing that they have in common. I want to tell you about my encounter with so-called Ascended Master St. Germain. Most people won't quite believe it, of course, but that's okay. I tell about it for the benefit of those who do, or who will some day, because entities like this can be really bad news for your spiritual health. I've noticed that folks who come under the influence of the so-called Ascended Masters, Great White Brotherhood, Trans-Himalayan Brotherhood or Galactic Federation seem to display a steady erosion in personal brilliance, character, aptitude and worthwhile effectiveness. There can be a general downgrading that at its worst can result in the likes of Godfrey Ray King making his followers kill their pets. Those who come under the shadow of Ashtar can be reduced to waiting for "global evacuation" when his chosen people will be beamed up to motherships to await their return to the promised land on earth.

The jinn are masters of alchemy. Maybe we got our teachings about it from them. I encountered St Germain as a result of my interest in alchemy. "Alchemy" describes various arcane areas of knowledge such as the search for longevity and eternal youth, the quest for the Holy Grail and Shambala, the transmutation of base metals into gold and the spiritual transformation which all these symbolize. Alchemy occurs on the physical, spiritual, mental and emotional planes of existence. It is supposed to have been the precursor of chemistry, so modern science is obliged to give it a cursory nod of recognition. Alchemy is real magic and metaphysical technology. It's about transmutations utilizing the etheric plane or about kundalini and transforming the subtle anatomy. It's also about the electromagnetic forces that control the world of form and connect it with the spiritual worlds.

I never intended to "dabble in the occult". I was attracted to alchemical symbolism at a very young age. I started trying to understand the images of the Rider-Waite Tarot when I was 11. I also read much about psychology then, so it was natural that I would be drawn to CG Jung's work and dream interpretation in my teens. Jung's theories about adult spiritual development, which he called the process of "individuation", were gleaned from his study and understanding of ancient alchemical manuscripts which he read in the original Latin. These cryptic manuscripts were designed to hide the truths they contained, and it is probably proof of Jung's genius that he was able to glean so much from them. I revered Jung at the time and wanted to learn more about alchemy.

The Temperance card from the Rider-Waite Tarot is mostly about Alchemy. Notice the triangle in the square on the winged entity's chest. Triangles figure prominently in many UFO experiences. Whitley Strieber devoted a whole section to the meaning of the triangle symbol in his book "Communion". On pg. 283 Strieber writes "I came to realize that the Tarot is much more than a deck of fortune-telling cards; it is a sort of philosophical machine that presents its ideas in the form of pictures rather than words." Hey, come to think of it, the whole UFO phenomenon itself could be "a sort of philosophical machine that presents its ideas in the form of pictures rather than words." -- ! Yes, those Jinn-- those ancient mythmakers -- are shaping our consciousness with images of spaceships and extraterrestrials. Whether or not we actually "believe" in them, our collective consciousness is affected by these images in ways we may not yet understand.
It was the cover of "Communion" that made the book an overnight sensation. Somehow it struck a very deep chord....

With the passage of years I also learned about quantum physics and the astral and etheric planes. I had kundalini and near death experiences. I experimented with the intelligences of nature in my garden and made flower essences. I meditated, and continued to study the writings of Jung, as well as Swedenborg, Gopi Krishna, Barbara Ann Brennan, Robert Monroe, and many others….I had NO interest in witchcraft or "spiritualism". I never intended to "dabble in the occult", but it now appears that that's exactly what I was getting myself into. "Occult" simply means "hidden". The word has probably become associated with evil influences because of the inherent risk of attracting bad jinn when the hidden worlds are looked into. Whether or not one wants to attract this kind of attention, it can be rather easily aroused. We attract more of whatever we put our conscious awareness into.

I'd reached a small degree of understanding about how physical reality manifests and is connected to the enduring spiritual planes. Then a friend gave me a book which claimed to channel the wisdom of St. Germain. The alchemical concepts in this new age book were an extension of what I'd been discovering about the electromagnetic spectrum and its connection to the subtle planes, so I readily accepted them. Later that night I awoke to a surprising astral visit from someone claiming to be St. Germain. He told me that my ability to grasp these ideas meant that I'd achieved the level of an initiate and that he would be willing to be my teacher. He outlined some of the wondrous learning which I could potentially master. So there he was in my bedroom, flattering me and making what seemed to be a wonderful offer. What should I do? I told him I didn't yet know how I felt about this, and he said he'd return for my answer.

Well, fortunately for me, I prayed very hard about what to do in response to his offer. I felt guided to read and meditate upon the "Tablet of the Holy Mariner" written by Bahá'u'lláh, the prophet-founder of the Baha'i Faith. I spent hours prayerfully meditating on the meaning of it it. I finally concluded that it tells the story of a person who acquires the knowledge of all that is "hidden behind the veil''. This person then comes before the throne of God, but is dissatisfied with their station of servitude to the Divine, wanting MORE. (Presumably wanting to be more of a god themselves.) Being thus devoid of sanctity, even in the presence of the All-Loving, the All-Wise, they were "cast down into their abode below".

The same old story of Lucifer: This is very similar to the story of Lucifer and the never-ending plight of humanity. So this was my St. Germain? Just another perpetrator of the Luciferian drama? Could it become me? YIKES! I took another look at his portrait in the book and was horrified by how debauched he suddenly now looked. That night he returned for my answer. I said: "St. Germain, leave me alone", and he vanished.

The whole thing seemed so fantastic that I questioned it. Apparitions can share both a real and dreamlike quality. The very next day, however, I had a lunch date with a new friend. I steered our conversation towards the esoteric, hoping to somehow talk about this incredible experience, but it just felt too weird to talk about. Well, it was no mere coincidence that we were having lunch. He suddenly amazed me by mentioning his own relationship with St. Germain! He was entirely nonchalant about it. This guy is a seemingly moderate, level-headed sort of person who had been entrusted with important military positions. My friend thought his relationship with St. Germain was, well-- dandy-- and he wasn't open to other points of view so there wasn't much more to talk about. Outside validation like this went beyond coincidence. I concluded that the St. Germain contact was real.

Most people think something like this is crazy, which helps protect them from involvement. However, those who have "pulled back the veil" need to be forewarned: Things are probably not what they appear to be if you're dealing with a jinn. There are many types of jinn, but there seems to be almost universal agreement that those who meddle with humans are mischievous or demonic. Humans can be demonic, too. The good/bad continuum is a necessary for the exercise of free-will. Spiritual protection is available for any who ask for help in the Name of God. In Islam, Satan (or Lucifer) is called "Iblis", and is identified as being from the jinn.

Will the real St. Germain please stand up? Is my "St. Germain" the same as Guy Ballard's or Louis XV's? Probably not. I question whether he's even the same entity who was hanging with my friend. I've had lots of unusual experiences in my life, but they were especially weird during this particular three year period. I've begun to reevaluate these experiences since assimilating the jinn concept into my understanding. I thought I had encountered many different entities, but now I'm wondering if the same entity was wearing several different hats!

For example, it seems that an entity consistently made the bell on my old fashioned phone make a short "ding!" sound whenever I had particular thoughts. I had been studying the writings of Emmanuel Swedenborg and was consequently given to frequently thinking about his concept of the association of negative spirits with certain activities. Every time I wondered if something had a correspondence with evil the phone would go "ding!". Judging by my phone's responses to my thoughts, evil spirits were lurking just about everywhere!

One night I was terrorized by this. The minute I began to drift off to sleep the phone went "ding!" This was so alarming that adrenaline pumped into my bloodstream. A strong association had been built up for weeks between this "ding!" sound and my wondering if evil spirits were potentially present, encouraging human negativity and perhaps feeding off of it. The phone would "ding!" the very moment I finally started drifting off to sleep again. The more this happened, the more afraid I became. I was being terrorized! This trick tormented me for hours until I finally overcame my fear of it, at which point it ceased. Probably because it was no longer fun for the jinni if it couldn't make me frightened. At the time I chalked this episode up to being another good learning experience. I'd overcome fear itself, to some extent, and I no longer speculate about evil spirits. If you look for them, they'll be there. Who wants that in their life? Not me-- I'm grateful my home is now so peaceful and safe feeling. I no longer wonder if any entities are around because I can feel that there aren't any--- my current home feels so much different!

My friend felt he connected with St. Germain because he loved the books by Godfre Ray King who was also known as Guy Ballard. Guy Ballard founded the "I AM" cult to spread the teachings of the Ascended Masters and Saint Germain. This cult degenerated to the point where members were told to kill their pets and shun family members who wouldn't join the cult. Despite their horrible history, cults of "I AM" and the various "Ascended Masters" are still very much alive.

From Psychic Dictatorship in America: the I AM Movement by Gerald B. Bryan

One such case is quoted in the letter below written in November, 1937. it is only one of many cases where fanatical I AM-ers have killed their animal pets. We quote: "The phone rang this morning and an I AM-er called and told me that another of Mrs._____'s 100% class was put in a sanitarium last week. It seems that she owned a lovely dog and that they were told there were to be no more dogs. She had the dog electrocuted. Her family resented it so they had her taken to a psychiatrist who analyzed her and of course she did not know when to speak and of what to speak, and started in on the books, and when she was asked why she did not give the dog to __________ , she said, it was just as bad for him to have it as it was for her. Well, they pronounced her insane and put her away last week. God pity them all."

Some additional results of the Ballard doctrines may be summed up in a few short sentences. It has taught credulous followers to forget everything else but the "Mighty I AM," tending to hold its people in moronic ignorance of what is going on in the world. It has caused fanatical students to "decree" long hours during the day and part of the night, with such intensity and emotionalism that a number of them have had nervous breakdowns, or have been confined to psychopathic wards and insane asylums. It has produced untold mental suffering from fears of cataclysms, entities, black magicians, destructive decrees, and other fear-inspiring bogeys. It has caused students to worship at the shrines of an endless number of mythological gods and heathenish "Masters," instead of teaching a devotion to the One and True God, the Creator of the Universe, of whose grandeur, love, and wisdom there is no end.
http://www.the7thfire.com/education/IAM-.htm



I will continue to passively pursue this topic - but sometimes I wonder if I am either too-easy or too-hard on Lucifer. I think they should be questioned in both respectful and irreverent ways. I mean no harm to anyone - but I think we can do better in this solar system - and this includes me - not just the PTB. If Lucifer decided to do the right thing - and become a good devil - what would they do for fun? It's gotta be a rush - to rush around stirring up all kinds of trouble!

Perhaps we need some bad good-guys and some good bad-guys - but I don't think we need any bad bad-guys whatsoever. I like good good-guys - but how good is too good? I'm trying to be a good-guy with some rough edges. I like the James Bond and Obi wan Kenobi characters. Perhaps we need to be wise as Lucifer - and harmless as Christ. Sorry if that offends anyone. I really do like the word 'Namaste'. Namaste is one of a small list of Sanskrit words commonly recognized by Non-Hindi speakers. Namaskār (Devnagari/Hindi: नमस्कार) literally means "I bow to [your] form". "I honor the Spirit in you which is also in me." -- attributed to but not claimed by author Deepak Chopra. "I honor the place in you in which the entire Universe dwells, I honor the place in you which is of Love, of Integrity, of Wisdom and of Peace. When you are in that place in you, and I am in that place in me, we are One." "That which is of God in me greets that which is of God in you." "The Divinity within me perceives and adores the Divinity within you." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Namaste 'Namaste' gives 'Constitutional Responsible Freedom' an ecumenical spiritual and/or religious twist.

Lucifer, why don't you just be a James Bond type of being? That would be almost as much fun as raising hell - wouldn't it? James never gets flustered - even in the worst circumstances imaginable - and he never gets his hair messed-up or his fingernails dirty! Lucifer, I suspect that you have changed bodies like most people change clothes - and that you have inhabited prominent male and female bodies - throughout history - with complete reincarnational recall. You have probably moved from adult body to adult body - for thousands of years. You probably haven't had to sleep one wink - for thousands of years. This is all speculation - but this is my story - and I'm sticking to it - for now.
Lucifer, we need to talk. You know what I'm talking about.

I know that my computer is hopelessly infiltrated and subverted - but I take no steps to do anything about it. I really wish to communicate with everyone - including the Jesuits and various Alphabet Agencies. At least those people understand all of this crazy stuff!! I'd almost rather deal with Lucifer, face to face, and try to convert them (The Last Temptation of Satan!!) - rather than deal with people who don't know and don't care. That's a really sad and pathetic statement, isn't it? I'm really trying to be on everyone's side - good and evil - even though this is hopelessly naive - and probably the epitome of stupidity. Hope springs eternal. Would any of you buy a used car from any of these men??
Lucifer, we still need to talk... ...about that pesky Great Controversy thing.



Consider this debate between Dr. Walter Martin and Father Mitchell Pacwa (Jesuit) regarding the Roman Catholic view of Mary. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tClS31hNmII This has relevance to this thread because of my suggestion that there may be some substance to Lucifer = Lilith = Hathor = Kali = Isis = Mary and that the current manifestion of this goddess hypothesis could be similar to that which is represented by Anna in the 'V' series. Once again - I'm not trying to be mean - I'm just trying to understand. The Roman Catholic treatment of Mary may be based upon something more than a fable devised by corrupt men in the Vatican. There may, in fact, be an actual Mary figure, who rules the church - and thus the world. I'm not an insider - and I don't know insiders - so I don't really know. I don't shout this sort of thing from the mountain-tops. I just whisper and mumble on the internet. Please watch the following video from start to finish - and relate it to what I have written in this thread. Warning: this is very disturbing. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rx8PdvOELvY Was Kali really in charge of the Crusades and the Inquisition?

Has anyone really looked closely at the 'V' television series (1983-85 and 2009-10) in connection with this video and the female (or hermaphroditic) human/reptile hybrid concept of Lucifer? Consider the Nephilim, Pre-Deluge Giants, Fallen Angels, Gods, Goddesses, et al. The absence of Satan, the Devil, and Lucifer in the Bible (especially the Old Testament) is mystifying and somewhat suspicious. Could Lucifer be a mixture of good & evil, genius & insanity? Research this subject exhaustively.

This is going to sound delusional - and it is - but here it is anyway. I think Lucifer (or equivalent) has ruled the solar system for a very long time. I'm engaging in a mental and spiritual exercise which involves attempting to replace Lucifer (voluntary retirement) - and then turning the governance of the solar system over to 10,000 highly wise and competent people under the U.S. Constitution - and serving as a facilitator and ambassador throughout the solar system. How 'bout it Lucifer? Or should I say 'How 'bout it Kali?'

I think EVERYONE should contemplate Solar System Governance. We need a Solar System View rather than a World View. Spend some quality time thinking about the United Nations, Washington D.C., the City of London, the Vatican, the Secret Government, the Secret Space Program, and the Underground Bases. Consider the pros and cons of all of the above, and how they might fit into a legitimate and non-tyrannical Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System. This includes you Lucifer and/or Kali. Consider this as a mental and spiritual exercise to help you to arrive at your own answers. I'm having a very difficult time getting anyone to seriously consider the subjects of Lucifer and Solar System Governance. I don't have the answers - but I think the subjects are extremely important - and will require the attention of millions of people.

Could it be that what Lucifer and/or Kali envisioned in Heaven was quite noble and virtuous - but that the reality turned out to be a complete disaster? I'm thinking that in the history of the universe that the road to Hell has been paved with an infinite number of good intentions. What I envision for this world and solar system is quite spectacular - but I fear that even the most heroic efforts of the most capable people might not produce the desired results. We may be lucky to simply survive.

Please research world governance, solar system governance, galactic governance, universe governance, leadership, power, freedom, responsibility, self-exaltation, self-degradation, self-centeredness, self-deification, pride, humility, corruptibility, cruelty, justice, mercy, jurisprudence, God, Satan, Jesus, Lucifer, Kali, Angels, Archangels, Humans, Reptilians, Greys, enslavement, extermination, truth, deception, heaven, hell. It's about politics and religion. It's a matter of life and death.

Consider reading the Four Gospels of Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John - in the New King James Version of the Bible - over and over. Consider reading the 'Federalist Papers' and the 'Anti-Federalist Papers' over and over. Consider doing this while listening to classical sacred music or a latin mass. I'm very serious about this. I think we may all be in purgatory - and that we may all be on the verge of heaven or hell - and our level of spiritual preparation may determine which way we go.

Google 'Walter Veith' and watch all of his lectures on Google Video and YouTube. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1164776176933693244# I don't agree with him on a lot of things - but he presents a huge amount of fascinating information which is relevant to this video. In a sense - I don't care what conclusions you arrive at - but think that studying this subject is hugely important. Don't you agree Lucifer and/or Kali? I know you wish to rule by secrecy - but isn't it time to come out of the confessional?

Watch 'Lucifer: Venus, Kali, Capella' https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vhdH7mtUtxU for a presentation which is supportive of the female version of Lucifer. I keep seeing a lot of knee-jerk posting under this video, rather than more mature reflection on what could be a very central subject. The angry name calling on YouTube is something to behold. I once spoke with a YouTube employee who screened posts, and they just shook their head and told me what a mess it was, and how upset people got. I felt sorry for them.

It's very strange. I believe in the possibility (or even probability) of a literal Lucifer - so in a sense I'm more of a Luciferian than a particular Satanist I was having a 'discussion' with (even though I'm not Luciferian) - because they seemed to not believe in a literal Lucifer being. This is even more strange - because they believe that Jesus actually existed. I reverence the Teachings of Jesus - but I'm considering the blasphemous possibility that Lucifer wrote much of the Bible. By Ba'al?

Quotations from well known source materials can be quite revealing. The video series I mentioned contains endless quotations and words from the horse's mouth. Of course - this doesn't necessarily establish irrefutable truth - but it does begin to place flesh on hypothetical skeletal constructs. My hunches, theories, and speculations are gaining momentum like a mach II magneto-leviton train travelling from one underground base to another. 'Next stop - Washington D.C.' I really just want people to investigate this subject very carefully - without getting involved in spooky and bloody rituals. We must transcend belief and unbelief - and become lifelong researchers - who remain mostly placid and detached.

What if Lucifer and/or Kali wrote the Bible? What if Lucifer and/or Kali is the Whore of Babylon? What if the Woman in Scarlet created Jesus to be a Red Herring? Again - I find the Bible to be a mixture of good and evil, truth and error. I love reading the Four Gospels, and I adore the Teachings of Jesus - but I am not seeing the Creator God of the Universe at work in any of this. What if all of us are fallen angels who followed Lucifer to Planet Earth? You wouldn't believe what I think about and imagine...

Why can't we just base the Solar System on something very similar to the U.S. Constitution - and then work out all of the old conflicts in a rational and peaceful manner? I am very afraid of deliberately inflicted wars and earth-changes - and all manner of tyranny and atrocities. I just want a dignified and rational system of reasonable law and order in this Solar System - which facilitates Responsible Freedom. I have no idea what's really going on - so I continue my little guessing game.

I keep talking about a possible similarity between Lucifer and Anna (in 'V'). Now none of the episodes are available anywhere on the internet. For a long time, the first few episodes were not available, and only the last five were. I don't see anything about any fall 'V' shows - even though the show was renewed. What's going on here? Was too much truth revealed? I liked the best aspects of Anna and the V's, but I despised the worst aspects. Who really rules the Solar System? Could it be Lucifer and/or Kali?

Usually the Whore of Babylon is equated with the Roman Catholic Church. I think this is incorrect. I think the Whore of Babylon may give orders to the Black Pope. I suspect it - but I can't prove it. I sometimes think of being in the Sistine Chapel with the Black Pope, the Top-Ranking Jesuits, the Whore of Babylon, and a Nine Foot Tall Drac (Head Pimp and Chairman of the Board) - listening to a debate regarding forbidden knowledge. This might send me sobbing uncontrollably into the night.

We don't know everything about everything. We don't know everything about anything. Everything is related to everything else - so we must know everything about everything - to know everything about anything - including the True Form of Lucifer (Kali?). It would be cool if Lucifer (Kali?) would post here - be completely open and honest - and not play deceptive mind-games. Talk to me Lucifer (Kali?). What the hell is going on? How much trouble are we in? How can we fix it? What about that debate date at Mork & Ork's?

Lucifer (Kali?) could be a more complex character than we can imagine. I'm imagining a very conflicted character, with extremes of good and evil, good intentions, unfathomable corruption, and very possibly bouts of insanity. I keep saying that Lucifer (Kali?) should retire, and be an advisor, not a dictator. We need a Solar System Exorcism to remove the really hardcore nasties, human and otherwise. The Solar System should be based upon Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom. World Without End. Amen Ra. (not an invocation)

Spouses and children involve responsibility - and most people are frightened of responsibility. If spouses weren't sexy and children weren't cute - we wouldn't have to worry about over-population. Take a break from the razzmatazz and listen to 'cochereau improvization st thomas church 4' https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0rig6b-jogg&p=D39FA662CE465587&playnext=1&index=30 I have a 1928 Book of Common Prayer from St. Thomas Church. Don't ask me how I got it. All I know is that it's better than the new one.

Could Hermaphroditic Reptilian Humanoids have been genetically engineered from male and female human beings combined with dinosaur-like reptiles in the ancient pre-deluge world? Could they be the Nephilim and so called Reptilian Aliens? Could Lucifer (Kali?) be one of them? Are they alive and well, and living in underground bases throughout the solar system? I'd like to meet them - as long as they agreed not to eat me. I might not agree with them...

Is the following - fact or fiction? What they taught you in Sunday school is BS. Lucifer is the most beautiful woman you have ever seen in your life. She runs this solar system - and answers only to Satan. Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned - and I have scorned the woman most closely connected with hell. Lucifer's IQ is 532. She has the equivalent of 87 PhD's. She is NOT the forgive and forget type. If you cross her - you're dead-meat - and I've crossed her BIG TIME!

Was the first hermaphroditic 'man' really Lilith (or equivalent)? Was the separation experiment a failure? Genesis states that God (Lucifer/Lilith?) was sorry that he (he/she?) made man. Was the separated man created to be a slave-race? Is 'woman's liberation' really the liberation of men? I'm sensing a lot of genetic experimentation going on in the Garden of Eden (Ea - Den?). Human/Reptile/Hybrid, Male/Female/Hermaphroditic, Black/White/Brown, and all manner of combinations? Hmmmmmmm

True honor comes from being responsible - which is not self exalting or self centered. God's plan worries me - because it doesn't seem that we are dealing with the Creator God of the Universe - but rather with disfunctional gods and goddesses. The historical landscape is littered with millions of corpses and billions of suffering souls. This does not inspire confidence regarding the future. Has ANYONE seriously promoted RESPONSIBILITY in the history of the world? Is it in the Bible?

"What is one to do when, in order to rule men, it is necessary to deceive them?" — 'The Secret Doctrine' by Helena Blavatsky The elite consider most people to be mere sheep who must be kept from discovering "the black cauldron of dirty secrets". The dirtiest secret found inside that black cauldron is that the unknown "God" worshipped by the Masons and called the Great Architect of the Universe and by codenames such as Abaddon, Mahabone, and Jahbuhlun, is actually none other than Satan, or Lucifer.

I recently decided that the corrupt rule the stupid - and that the corrupt will always rule the stupid - because both are quite satisfied with the arrangement - despite all outward appearances - and that both are threatened by those who are non-corrupt and highly intelligent. This is why the Teachings of Jesus are ignored. I've decided to pursue a business plan which is neither corrupt or stupid, and which threatens neither the corrupt or stupid - leaving both to their own devices...

"Most people do not really want freedom, because freedom involves responsibility, and most people are frightened of responsibility." -- Sigmund Freud 

"Like it or not, eveything is changing. The result will be the most wonderful experience in the history of man...or the most horrible enslavement that you can imagine. Be active, or abdicate...the future is in your hands." -- William Cooper

Google 'Alex Collier' for some very strange and interesting information. I share a lot of Alex's editorial views (Andromedan?) regarding politics and religion - and I am very indebted to him (and the Andromedans?). The Andromedan Perspective Regarding the Future of Humanity is "Responsible Freedom of Self Determination...Becoming Truly Self Confident and Free...to Unconditionally be Responsible for Oneself...Without Being Coerced to Accept Some Higher Authority." -- related by Alex Collier

We the People of Earth have before us the opportunity to forge for ourselves, and for future generations...a True World Order. A world where Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom...not the Old World Disorder Demonic Theocracy...governs the conduct of nations. When we are successful...and we will be...we have a real chance at this True World Order...an order in which a credible United Nations can use Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom to fulfill the promise and vision of All Races.

The following is a potpourri of sorts - where the irrelevant parts provide a context for the relevant parts:

orthodoxymoron guidestone: 1. Base this Solar System on Responsibility and the U.S. Constitution. 2. Maintain an Earth population of 4 billion (2 billion surface and 2 billion sub-surface) with 4 billion throughout the rest of the Solar System (mostly sub-surface). 3. Go to electric everything. 4. Use magneto-leviton trains for most global transportation. 5. Completely restore and maintain the environment in pristine condition. 6. Base healthcare (mental, physical, and spiritual) on prevention.

Self exaltation is self centered! Self degradation is also self centered! The religion contained in the Teachings of Jesus is a Religion of Responsibility! To be responsible is to face reality - formulate a responsible course of action - and then to implement this plan. It is duty centered. The focus is external rather than internal! When someone lives responsibly, the byproduct is appropriate positive AND negative thinking, and an appropriate self image!

We the People of Earth need to be the New Elites. Don't fight the New World Order or the Powers That Be - Transcend Them! WE ALL NEED TO TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR SOLAR SYSTEM GOVERNANCE. Watch 'The Great Dictator Speech' by Charlie Chaplin on YouTube. Watch a lot of science fiction - with the posts on this page clearly in mind. I almost feel as though I am trying to partner with completely reformed gods and goddesses - which would probably include Lucifer. What's the verdict Lucifer (Kali?)?

For a couple of years now - I have been making post after post on the internet - with very little interest or response being generated. My questions and comments are not complex - but I think many of them are helpful - and a few are even profound. But it all seems to be a waste of time. In a sense - I can see why the masses are manipulated rather than reasoned with - but it's still wrong. I guess I'm trying to become a non-corrupt Illuminati type of person - but this is just a mind game. I've never felt more drained in my life - when I've been researching and posting on the subject of Lucifer and other esoteric topics. It's almost as if one gets double and triple teamed by demonic entities when one tries to uncover and expose what's really going on in this solar system. Just a feeling. I'm trying to understand what the solar system powers that be, human and otherwise, have to deal with. I don't envy them. I feel a responsibility to properly deal with solar system governance. I think that just about everyone is deluded - including Atheists, Satanists, and Christians. I went insane without the help of anyone else - demonic or otherwise. I love Jesus. Jesus loves me. But everyone else thinks I'm a jerk.

What we all really want is fame, fortune, power, and pleasure - and we will pursue all of these things in the most irresponsible ways - which will continue to push us toward the abyss and oblivion. I'm getting very tired of my little exercise in futility - and I fear that the human race will continue to go through war after war - and believe lie after lie...

The Father of Lies might be a Real Mother - or Hermaphroditic. The lie is different at every level. I don't know what the True Form of Lucifer really is - but I am passively exploring the possibility that Satan and Lucifer (Kali?) are two separate beings - and that Satan is decidedly male - and Lucifer decidedly female. The evidence is thin and circumstantial - and I am not a scholar, psychic, or insider - so I don't really know. The goddess topic should be studied exhaustively.

I think that the Creator God of the Universe set things up in a most excellent way - and then things got screwed-up in a most horrible manner. I'm not sure who was/is responsible - but justice needs to be served - and law and order needs to be restored in this solar system. I believe that a Solar System Exorcism and a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System would remedy most of the most pressing ills we face. But what the hell do I know.

I leave you with this: 'Pierre Cochereau at Mass - Part 1 of 3 - Introit and Offertoire' (listen to all 3 parts). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QaDmU4Uay_w Is this appropriate music to listen to while considering the subject of 'Lucifer (Kali?)'? I still want to share some fine French wine with you Lucifer (Kali?) - and listen to you improvise at St. Ouen, St. Sulpice, or Notre Dame de Paris. I feel as though I am your best friend and worst enemy. Come - let us reason together. Is it time to reprogram and reboot this solar system?

I want to wish Satan, Lucifer, Kali, Gods, Goddesses, Angels, Demons, Archangels, Illuminati, Megalomaniacs, Reptilians, Greys, et al a terrific rest of the century. I think we can clean up this mess - without enslavement, extermination, Star Wars, or Masters of the Universe. Imagine 10,000 very competent humans engaging in Constitutional Global and Solar System Governance, with advisors which might include all of the above. I continue to attempt to think Lucifer's (Kali's?) thoughts after her. See you at Mork and Ork's Grey Bar.

sabina wrote:hallo oxy,
first it`s nice you post again I like to read your postings. I never posted in your threads why ?
I don`t know maybe time maybe my english is not perfect etc.but I will tell you even if you don`t have an answer to your writings you have readers.
second what is SDA?

About Kali I will tell you the storry how it is told to the children today in India
Parvati Durga Kali is the wife of shiva as the wife she has the same tools, weapons and power.
parvati the young woman
durga the mother
kali the old wise woman

there was a very powerfull asura(demon) no god could kill him even together vishnu bhrama shiva with all their weapons were not strong enough because the spell was this: no god can kill this asura
now all the gods came together to think about what to do and they got the idea
we will give all our weapons and power to shivas wife now with all this power she went to the asura
and she killed him. the spell was no god can kill but she was a godness.

I hope you enjoy this origin storry about kali of course there is more she is the godess of Kalcutta
the poorest city in India.

All the best and please continue your postings
Sabina

Thank-you Sabina. Perfect English is not required. You don't even have to agree with me. SDA = Seventh-day Adventist (a fairly conservative Protestant church (founded in 1863) which conducts services on Saturday (Sabbath), and utilizes the writings of Ellen G. White as an inspired interpreter of the Holy Bible. SDA's consider themselves to be the heirs of the Reformation. I used to be one - and I still may be on the books - but when I do attend services, it is usually at a liberal Episcopal church. I long for a completely reformed Roman Catholic Church - which is centered in the Teachings of Jesus and the U.S. Constitution - in the context of the Latin Mass (preferably without communion and crucifixes). What would Pat Buchanan say? What would Pope John Paul I say? What would the sedavacantists say?

Regarding a Non-Penetential, Non-Sacrificial, Humanistic, Christocentric, Ecumenical Namaste Latin Mass...Celebrating the Divinity Within Humanity...I'm once again looking for common ground to legitimately unite people in a non-coercive manner. I love the architecture, art, music, robes, incense, and ceremony of the Roman Catholic Church...yet I am aware of a dark-side and problematic-side as well. Latin is sort of obscure...so a Mass could be conducted in Latin world-wide...and people would feel right at home as they traveled throughout the world...or watched on television or the internet. Also...this would be all about being elevated by the atmosphere of reverence and awe...without being troubled by theological jargon and mumbo-jumbo which careful thinking might reject. It would be a Spiritual Switzerland. I prefer the glory, grandeur, reverence, and awe of the traditional service...rather than the 'Jesus is my buddy, show-up in shorts and a t-shirt, praise-song, hippie reefer-madness'.

In a sense...I desire a Minimalist Humanistic Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Theocracy. The United Nations and the City States need to be purified and reformed if we are to achieve a Perfected Solar System Inhabited by Perfected Human Beings...without eugenics or coercion. I want a Solar System Exorcism...to rid this Solar System of the worst Human and Non-Human malevolent beings...without harming them. Some of these beings...I fear...are Playing God...and Using God's Name in Vain. But what do I know?

What you said about Kali is fascinating! I keep encountering the concept of a goddess killing a god - and then ruling Earth. I recently spoke online with someone who is into some very heavy spiritual stuff (not recommended) - who thinks that in a previous life that she was there when such a killing occurred - and she thinks she might be the one who did the killing. I tried to convince her otherwise. She had a very elaborate creation vision which is quite different than the Genesis story. What if Earth had a Crazy God - and Kali came to Tibet - from Sirius - killed the Crazy God - and has ruled Earth ever since? But what if Kali went crazy too? What fate Omoroca? Absolute power corrupts absolutely - and probably drives one crazy. This is why I think the first and last commandment should be 'Thou Shalt Have No Gods'. A facilitator or administrator of sorts is probably a good idea - but no one should be reverentially worshipped and unquestioningly obeyed. Parvati, Durga, Kali = Trinity Goddess = Lucifer, Michael, Gabriel? That's a stretch, isn't it?
I have really been trying to snap Lucifer or Kali out of their madness - believe it or not. Perhaps it takes a crazy person to deal with a crazy goddess.

I just started rewatching the Alex Collier presentation at 'Awake and Aware' - and his opening remarks hit me like ten tons of bricks - in light of this current thread. Alex said that he didn't think the U.S. would disclose - and that disclosure might come from INDIA or CHINA!!!!!!!! Where is TIBET?????? My heart almost stopped. Now my heart is pounding!!!! Please, please, please watch all parts of the video series linked in the first post of this thread!!! Excuse me while I get my heart restarted!! CLEAR!!!! Hello Kali! Well Hello Kali!! You Devil You!!

Also - look at bravodawson - on YouTube - the one who posted 'The True Form of Lucifer' - which depicts Lucifer as being female. bravodawson is from INDIA!!! The video was posted on December 21, 2007 - exactly five years before the infamous December 21, 2012!!! Is this just a coincidence??? This is the only video bravodawson has posted on YouTube - and they have posted no comments under this video (that I have noticed) - and they haven't visited their channel for a couple of years. Isn't this strange? Here is a comment/question I posted on bravodawson's channel one month ago:

"I never see you commenting on your Lucifer video. Or do you comment with another name? Living in India - have you considered the possibility of a connection between Kali - Lucifer - and the Black Madonna? What do people in India generally think about Lucifer? I believe in some sort of reincarnation - but I don't embrace Hinduism or the New Age. Which direction is India moving regarding politics and religion? What if all of us are right - and all of us are wrong? I endlessly speculate - but I know very little for certain. I ask this respectfully - 'Are you Lucifer?' Just thought I'd ask." No reply.

Here is a comment I posted on bravodawson's channel four months ago:

"I think you are on the right track...but I also think that Lucifer is a mixture of good and evil...a sort of a Dr. Jeckyll and Mr. Hyde. Watch 'V' on abc(dot)com if you can in India. I tend to think that Anna could be similar to the modern manifestation of Lucifer. Also consider that Lucifer is the Whore of Babylon (Deep Underground Military Bases?) and is in charge of the DUMB's, the Secret Government, and the Secret Space Program throughout the Solar System." No reply.

Is it just a coincidence that China owns so much U.S. debt? Is it any coincidence that India bought so much gold? But if illegal drug money, blood money, and tax dollars have been paying for a lot of the hypothetical Underground Empire - then who really owes who?

Does Kali - or a representative of Kali - appear prominently in the movie 'Contact'? Does Satan - or a representative of Satan - appear prominently in the movie 'Contact'? Does Jesus - or a representative of Jesus - appear prominently in the movie 'Contact'? Were there ET's (or equivalent) right in the White House in the movie 'Contact'? Has 'Contact' been ongoing - for thousands of years? Believe it or not - I think I may have seen Kali - or a representative of Kali - in a cathedral (I won't say which one!) - but it's probably a Hail Mary conjecture! Nuff said!

One more thing. I am pro-money. It is an expression of freedom - and an opportunity to reward responsibility - as well as providing the game-playing and fun of good old-fashioned competition. Responsible Greed is Good! It clarifies. Competition improves the breed. I am not in favor of socialism or communism. I am a born-again responsible capitalist. End the Fed!

One more thing. I am pro-physicality. I am addicted to orgasms! The human body is a miraculous creation - and I do not intend to leave my physicality - except between incarnations. Perhaps our genetics needs to be restored to it's original state - so that we live longer and use 100% of our brain capacities. Obviously there needs to be a harmonization of the physical and the spiritual.

One more thing. Haven't the ET's been mentoring us for thousands of years? Hasn't that been a big part of the problem?? Haven't the ET's been ruling the world for thousands of years? So why have things been so bad? Have they been teaching us RESPONSIBILITY? Have they been ruling us with RESPONSIBILITY?

One more thing. I am not anti-ET. I am not anti-hybrid. I am not even anti-Drac!! I even want to go out on a date with Lucifer (Kali?)!!!! I just want a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System aka The United States of the Solar System - based upon Responsibility and the U.S. Constitution. I have no problem with interacting with ET's and Hybrids - but they are not our gods and saviors - at least they shouldn't be. I want Lucifer (Kali?) to retire - and advise (not dictate) from a distance. Imagine Lucifer attending a U.N. meeting??!! "Lucifer!! The power of Christ compels you to sit down and shut up!!" Just kidding Lucifer! Or is it Kali? Only her exorcist knows for sure!

Thank-you Carol and TRANCOSO. It is important to carefully examine the foundations and presuppositions. Just because someone says something - or just because something is written in a book - doesn't mean that it's true - even if most people believe that it's true. I am considering the possibility that a Lucifer or Kali has been at the center of things for thousands of years - and that a lot of what we believe or disbelieve has been a direct or indirect result of the influence of a Lucifer or Kali. I'm asking a lot of 'what if?' questions. What if most everything philosophical and theological is essentially Luciferian - and a mixture of good and evil? I am attempting to work outward from the word 'RESPONSIBILITY' to see where this leads, and what it exposes. I am also trying to think Lucifer's or Kali's thoughts after her - to get an insight into what it might have been like to be them - century after century. Even if I am completely wrong - this is a very interesting way to look at the past, present, and future. It's also probably very dangerous - so don't try this at home kiddies. Remember the abraxasinas fiasco?

Here I go again - with yet another brainstorm (brain-fart?): What if we are dealing with a Hermaphroditic (Hermes + Aphrodite?) Human/Reptile God/Godess Nephilim from Sirius named Lucifer/Shiva/Kali (the Prince/Princess of Sirius and God/Goddess of This World) who came to Earth at least 10,000 years ago, killed the existing Earth God in a Solar System Wide Star War in Heaven, and set up an underground base of operations in Tibet (which included advanced technology such as UFO's, nukes, computers, holograms, genetic hybridization, mind control, etc. -- possibly stolen fire from the slain God)? Are goddesses possessed by Lucifer/Shiva/Kali? Could this explain why goddesses say 'We'? Consider this thread about the Nephilim: http://www.themistsofavalon.net/et-biokinds-and-their-characteristics-f23/the-real-nature-of-the-nephilim-t716.htm#17829 Could Lucifer/Shiva/Kali play the parts of both God and Satan? Could Lucifer/Shiva/Kali have created most mythologies, theologies, religions, and sacred texts? Did Lucifer/Shiva/Kali say 'Let us make man in our image?' Was the creation of male and female humans really the separation of the male and female aspects of hermaphroditic humans? Was this 'trial separation' a failure in the eyes of Lucifer/Shiva/Kali? Genesis reads that God was sorry that he created man. Did Lucifer/Shiva/Kali experience 'separation anxiety' or 'creator's remorse'? Were male humans created to be a slave race? Is 'women's liberation' really 'men's liberation'? The original 'V' series (1983-85) portrayed the visitors as being from Sirius - and that they recognized the U.N. Charter rather than the U.S. Constitution. Hmmmmmmm...I really hope I'm full of you-know-what. Please set me straight. I don't expect a lot of this to be correct. That's one small step for orthodoxymoron. One even smaller step for mankind. It's gonna be a long night...

I'm presently on part 16 of this very interesting series. I had my eye on Kali - even before I knew her name - but now she has my undivided attention. At 'Awake and Aware' Alex Collier stated that disclosure might come from China or India!! What is between China and India?? TIBET!!! Look at the last minute (9:55) of part 14 - at the bottom of the page - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-Jq4JV5Mdg - and notice especially the part about Nicholas Roerich travelling to Tibet - and speaking of ET's (Sovereign Queen of the Air) from Sirius setting up shop in Tibet - and conducting hybridization experiments!! He spoke of seeing STRANGE GREY PEOPLE!!!!! Didn't Nicolas Notovich write about Jesus travelling to Tibet?

Sovereign Queen of the Air = Queen of Heaven = Queen Mary = Anna in 'V' = Whore of Babylon = Ruler of the City States = Ruler of Us All?

SIRIUS > TIBET > BABYLON > EGYPT > GREECE > ROME > ROMAN CATHOLICISM > NAZI PARTY > NEW WORLD ORDER?

Were the Bible and Quran created to obscure the Sirius, Tibet, Babylon, Egypt, Greece, and Rome connection? Was Jewish history superimposed upon the real history? I think Ralph Ellis and Jordan Maxwell might agree. My surmisings remind me of an old political cartoon showing the White House with a big "NIXXON" sign over it - and a caption reading "The Name Has Changed - But It's Still the Same Old Gas!" Is the New World Order really the "Same Old Gas"?

I'm continuing to consider the idea that the esoteric should become exoteric - and that a Modified Latin Mass, the Teachings of Jesus, and the U.S. Constitution should be harmonized - and become an integral part of a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System aka The United States of the Solar System. The art and architecture of the ancient world should be cherished - as should the literature and music most closely connected with it - but the modus operandi of a Brave New Solar System must be built upon a New Foundation. Throwing out the bathwater without throwing out the baby will require the wisdom of Solomon. How readest thou, Lucifer/Shiva/Kali?

One of my dreams is to travel throughout Europe in a Ferrari - visiting all of the old churches, cathedrals, art museums, government buildings, universities, libraries, and other historical sites - and attend concerts, lectures, masses, and religious services. Of course - the Autobahn and the Nurburgring would absorb a disproportionate amount of time and energy!

Tibet Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tibet

Tibet Images: http://www.google.com/images?rlz=1T4GGIR_enUS216US217&q=tibet+images&um=1&ie=UTF-8&source=univ&ei=6KWlTM_BA5T6sAOph4X-Dg&sa=X&oi=image_result_group&ct=title&resnum=1&ved=0CCgQsAQwAA

I continue to toy with the theory that a very real Queen of Heaven has secretly and deceptively ruled Planet Earth for thousands of years - and could directly control all nuclear weapons and ufo's worldwide - and that activation or deactivation of nuclear missiles might be initiated by an underground base in Tibet - and that UFO activity in the vicinity of missile silos might be a red-herring - to make it appear that Mork from Ork was trying to send us earthlings a message. I think the Vatican and Washington D.C. know exactly what's going on - but that they may be powerless to do a damn thing about it. They may just be along for the ride. We might all be along for a very wild ride. Fasten your seatbelts. I often wish I had gotten better acquainted with Dr. Carol Rosin. I often wish Kali would go out on a date with me - but she'd probably bite my head off. Tangentially - take a look at the faces of Charles Darwin, Helena Blavatsky, Aleister Crowley, and Albert Einstein (consider the picture of Einstein sticking out his tongue. Was he trying to tell us something?). Did they all have face to face encounters with Kali? "Now I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds." (from the HINDU scripture - the Bhagavad Gita) Trinity Site = Trinity Goddess Site? Is the Secret Doctrine really that Isis Unveiled Reveals Kali the Queen of Heaven and Queen of Us All? "What is one to do, when in order to rule men, it is necessary to deceive them?" Alex Collier stated in 2009 that disclosure might likely come from China or India (regarding Tibet and Kali?). Damn! I forgot to take my medicine again...

I won't itemize what I read between the script lines. It is really necessary to view the episodes and movie. I saw the god dying - and goddess ruling theme in the episodes of Stargate SG-1. In the Stargate movie, I saw Ra as actually being a Hathor or Isis goddess figure. I see the goddess theme in the spiritual leader of the Navi in 'Avatar'. I saw a human soul controlling a hybrid being - as I suspect the grey and reptilian phenomenon to be. Hathor created all of the gods. Hathor was pictured as being alive and well in modernity. Hathor was a hybrid (possessed by a Goa'uld) - yet very human.

The thread on 'The Infiltration of the New Age' should make it clear how dangerous the alternative scene can be. Again - I don't go to church, and I don't go to initiations, programmings, new age seminars - or join enlightened groups who follow a guru. I do think we are in the middle of a spiritual war - and there are way too many people walking around like they're at a sunday-school picnic - while the bullets are flying past their heads. Some people are expecting to ascend, or to get taken away from Earth by saviors in ufo's. People are channeling ascended masters, being regressed into past-lives, going out of body, remote viewing, communicating with dead relatives, conjuring-up ufo's, playing with Ouija Boards, etc., etc. - and I think they may be dealing with some very unsavory entities. Some people who are involved in the Patriot Movement are gearing up for a Holy War Against the New World Order. Many people are bitterly leaving the churches they grew up in. The theological battles are endless.

I may add to this response when I'm not so tired. I really just wish to go through all of my threads (including the videos) - and start to internalize the best of that which I have examined. We are very, very smart - yet we all seem to come to different conclusions - and the world continues to be a mess. The most immoral and irresponsible people continue to be at the top of the heap. It's a rat race - and the rats are winning. But that golden age is just around the corner. Christians have expected the immanent second coming of Christ for 2,000 years. At this point, I hope we can survive - kick the nasties out of the solar system - and rule ourselves in a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System aka The United States of the Solar System - based upon Responsibility and the U.S. Constitution. I expect an intensifying infowar, with the very real possibility of worldwide civil unrest - as the truth regarding our true state of affairs becomes more and more visible to the people of the world. Things may have to get worse before they get better. A lot of things have been hidden, and have been festering under the surface. I'm just looking for more sane ways to manage the insanity. I obviously do not give people what they want - or tell them that which they wish to hear. Perhaps we do have to be lied to - and led down the primrose path by the hooks in our noses. Kali might agree. Atlas might shrug.

Carol wrote:I honestly don't know how the female fits in here as much of what is going on is the imbalance of male energy and lack of female energy.

However with respect to the second coming I just don't see it playing out as described in the Bible. I see it as an internal experience and Christ appears to those who built the bridge for him to cross over on... meaning it is the inner desire to be reunited with the divine that creates the doorway for Christ to cross through and that this happens on an individual level when each individual is ready for such an experience.

Carol, you may be right - and I may be completely wrong. My speculations are just that - speculations. I smell smoke - and I'm looking for the fire. I don't know if anyone else in the world is going down the road I am. I am not sure of myself at all - which is why I don't lecture, make videos, or write books. I mostly ask questions. This is all a big experiment.

It is probably easier to create male leaders and lead them this way and that. Once one gets past size and brute strength - females are superior to males. I do think that female empowerment is a huge part of the solution - and that males need to become more like females - without being gay. I will continue to pursue a Queen of Heaven hypothesis regarding the rulership of Earth - but I will also continue to speculate that this hypothetical goddess takes orders from a very male Satan of sorts. Male Satan > Female Lucifer > Human Race? Damned if I know - but we really do need to figure out EXACTLY what the power structure of this solar system REALLY is.

I once received a YouTube comment from someone who referred to Their Goddesses. I wish I could locate this comment - and I wished that I had pursued a discussion with them.

I continue to pursue an unorthodox Christology - and what you have described sounds very reasonable to me. I continue to wonder who really wrote the Bible. Who was taking notes as Jesus spoke? Was Jesus following a script - as an actor on a stage - in the greatest story ever told? I reverence the Teachings of Jesus - but I am very skeptical of Christian Theology - starting with the Apostle (apostate?) Paul. Did Paul teach what Jesus taught? Or did Paul create a New Theology which kept a coherence with the Old Testamental Sacrificial System - and even some aspects of ancient Egypt? Have you taken a close look at the Canonization Process? Why was the Book of Enoch not included? Have you read the Gospel of Mary? I am currently reading 'The Gospel of Mary of Magdala' by Karen King - and 'The Unknown Life of Jesus' by Nicolas Notovitch. 'The Complete Gospels' by Polebridge Press - 'The Quest of the Historical Jesus' by Albert Schweitzer - and 'A Myth of Innocence' are interesting scholarly works regarding Jesus. One can spend a lot of time - and even waste a lot of time - on this subject.

I want to make this perfectly clear - I do not wish misery, harm, or death to come to anyone - including Reptilians, Greys, Hybrids, Nephilim, Angels, Demons, Illuminati, Satan, Lucifer, Shiva, Kali, KRLLL, The Logos, The King or Queen of Whatever, The God or Goddess of Whatever, et al.

I JUST WANT THE BS TO STOP!!! PEACE!!! BE STILL!!!

If anyone hasn't watched the video series linked in the first post of this thread - PLEASE DO SO!! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0HWZlvPE888 It brings so many things together in an understandable manner. Stop the video - and read the fine-print. I think this video series is extremely important!

At some point - I might like to work with all of those listed above - once I got used to them! What about that debate-date, Kali??? You must REALLY hate me...

OK...a lot of people hate me. I have been blocked by several YouTube channels - including the poster of the video series upon which this thread is mostly based. ufohypothesis (Rick Keefe - who interviews Alex Collier) has blocked me. Another one - which is critical of the Roman Catholic Church - has blocked me. This is very, very odd - since I am mostly editorially on-board with the blockers!!! None of them told me a damn thing - so I have no idea why I have been blocked. Two of my websites have been taken over by someone I have never heard of - and one has been removed from the internet - even though I am paid-up for several years. I am very paranoid - and they probably really are out to get me. Strange world we live in.

What's odd - is that I really and truly have no animosity toward anyone. Period. Although - to be honest - I am annoyed by just about everyone - especially myself. But I have no seething agenda or fecal list. I really and truly am seeking a big-tent solution - rather than something which is narrow and exclusive. It's an equal-opportunity big-tent for males, females, hermaphrodites, and all races - including aliens and hybrids! I think I'm probably way too accomodating and easy-going.

Imagine Kali designing the churches. Imagine Kali composing the music. Imagine Kali as being Anna (Ashayana? Annunaki? Ashtar Commander?). Imagine Kali playing the music.

1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_X7SvvSgxM

2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MFrKUk5lwmE&feature=related

3. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MCsnSXRpXug&NR=1

4. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O4cLwXKG7Kw&feature=email

5. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_SakzT9nhM

6. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQW0rVPUXw0

7. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fm4knZ1Bm3s

Sometimes I wonder about the true source of a lot of French Romantic Music. Does this music have something in common with William Shakespeare, Charles Darwin, and Albert Einstein? Who was the architect of Chartres Cathedral? Does anyone have any idea of what I am talking about? Anyone?

I'm not going to be too specific - but if one looks at French Romantic Organ Music as a whole - what personality lurks within the music? Is it the Creator God of the Universe? Is it Jesus Christ? Is it Lucifer? Is it Mary? The individual composers? The complexity and abstractness is overwhelming. The level of genius in the design and construction of pyramids, temples, and cathedrals is likewise overwhelming. Yet something dark and troubled seems to lurk within. Could this be representative of the 'good-side' of Kali? If I'm right about all of this - do I at least get a Cracker-Jack Prize?

I guess I'm passively pursuing a 'Pinky and the Brain - Raiders of the Lost Ark - Lucifer/Shiva/Kali/Mary - and the Temple of Doom' Hypothesis - which includes a good/genius side - and a bad/insane side. What did Spielberg know - and when did he know it? I find myself strangely attracted to the good side - and utterly disgusted and horrified by the bad side. I tend to think that if Lucifer/Shiva/Kali/Mary retired - that the bad side would go away - and that they could serve as an advisor rather than a dictator. You'd have to actually be me to understand where I'm coming from, and to see that which I visualize. I couldn't possibly put it into words.

I just finished reading 'The Gospel of Mary of Magdala' by Karen King. The cover features a painting of a young-woman with a very dark complexion - dressed in scarlet - with a sun-disk around her head - pointing to an egg in her hand. Could this be Kali? Karen King thinks the Gospel of Mary might have been written in Egypt or Syria, with an authorship date of between 32 and 325 CE. Could Kali be the writer of most sacred texts - including the Bible and the Quran? Ralph Ellis claims that Jesus Christ and Mary Magdalene were of a high class. Nicolas Notovich claims that Jesus travelled to Tibet. Alex Collier claims that our creator (or genetic engineer) is more female than male (not sure which lecture - possibly 2002). He also claims that the Andromedans consider blacks to be genetically superior (I hope I got that one right! Not sure which lecture). In a 2002 lecture - Alex hints at a deliberate removal of the Pa Taal (spelling?).

I think I'm going to give this thing a rest. I don't really wish to convince anyone of anything. This has mostly been a research project - in a very passive and informal sense. The Jesuits, Alphabet Agents, and World Leaders know exactly what's going on - and they obviously are not stumbling over each other to get to the microphone first - to tell all of us goyim the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. In a sense - I have mostly wished to communicate with Lucifer/Shiva/Kali/Mary and his/her willing and unwilling servants. I continue to desire a top-down reformation of how business is conducted in this solar system. Hope springs eternal - but I'm not holding my breath. Namaste.

Try thinking through the history of Earth from a Hathorian Perspective (HP) or a Kali Perspective (KP)...based upon this thread combined with your own extrapolation and imagination. Should this hypothetical Hathor or Kali figure be an object of aspiration rather than veneration?

My posting activities are drawing to a close. I don't know if I have had a close encounter with truth...or not. I invite everyone to go through all of my threads with a fine-tooth comb. See what your conclusions are. I've simply been scratching the surface of the truth...on a road less traveled. But that could make all the difference...on your investigative journey. Amen.

NIBIRUAN / SUMERIAN GODS = HINDU GODS = GREEK GODS AND SOME VATICAN, BUDDHIST, JEWISH AND SOUTH AMERICAN GODS AS WELL !!!

SEKHMET = DURGA = ARTEMIS = MUT = ATHENA = WHITE JAGUAR LADY = WHITE BUFFALO CALF WOMAN = VAISHNO DEVI

ALCYONE = SATYANARAYANA = APOLLO = PTAH = VISHNU = RAMA
AMUN RA = KRISHNA

ANAT = ERESHKIGAL = KALI = BLACK MADONNA = BLACK TARA

ASTARTE = PARVATI = WHITE TARA = MADONNA = SHEKINAH = UMA = NAMMA
MAIA = SATI = DAKSHAYANI = DAMKINA = GODDESS OF THE MOUNTAINS

ENKI = SHIVA= HOLY SPIRIT = ZEUS = CHAKRASAMVARA = AVALOKITESHWARA = CHENREZIG = LUCIFER = EA = ADONAI = HADAD = BA'AL = RUDRA = KAAL BHAIRAVA

AN = ANU = PARA BRAHMA = YAHVEH = ALLAH

THE GREAT RA = AMEN RA = PRAKASH BRAHMA = HIGHER ASPECT OF YAHVEH = FATHER OF THE GODS

ANSAR = ABZU = ABBA = APSU = KASHYAPA = ADITYA = SURYA = SUN GOD = SHAMASH = DUAS PITA = SATYAVAT MANU = SWAYAMBHU = VYWAMUS
DHARMA DEV = YAMA

INDRA = PAN = VAJRAPANI

GAIA = ADITI = BHU = BHOOMI DEVI = KOUMUDHI = KAMADHENU = NINHURSAG = KI = URAS = EARTH GODDESS

ENLIL = GARBHODAKASAYANI = JEHOVAH

NINLIL = LAKSHMI = GODDESS OF GRAIN

MOON GOD = CHANDRA DEV = NANNA

INANNA = LILITH = SELENE = MOHINI

DUMUZI = ADAMU = ADAM = DAMU

EVE = KHEBA = NINTI

NERGAL = NARAKASURA

TIAMAT = TARAKA

TYPHON = PULOMAN

THOTH = GANESHA = HERMES

MARDUK = MURUGAN = KARTHIKEYA = NIMROD = MARS

HORUS = OSIRIUS = SANAT KUMARA = EROS = DIONYSUS = ANCIENT OF DAYS = TAMMUZ = MIN = KAMDEV = PRADYUMNA

ISIS = MARY = MARIAMMA = KOUMARI = VENUS = APHRODITE = ISHTAR = SEMIRAMIS = HATHOR = MAYAVATI = KANYAKUMARI = TRIPURA SUNDARI = RATI = 16 YEAR OLD GODDESS
JESUS = SANANDA KUMARA

MARY MAGDALENE = LADY NADA

HADES = SHANI = SATAN = WRATHFUL TIBETAN DEITY

7 ARCHANGELS = 7 SAPTARISHIS = COUNCIL OF SEVEN

ATLAS = HIMAVAN = DAKSHA = EL

PLEIONE = MENAKA

APEP = KALASURA

7 PLAIEDES' SISTERS = 7 KRITTIKAS = 7 SAPTA MATRIKAS

PARASURAM = GILGAMESH; NOAH = VIVASVAT MANU; NOAH'S ARC = MALAYAN HILLS.

WILD COW GODDESS = NINSUN = NININSINA = RENUKA

HUMBABA = TRISHANKU = KALMASHAPADA

SARASWATI = SESHAT

HERACLES = HERCULES = ARJUNA

ENOCH = METATRON

HERA = INDRANI

AURORA = USHA

EOS = SAVITA

VARUNA = POSEIDON

MITHRA = ZOROASTRA

TVASTRI = HAPHAESTOS = BUNENE

HOLY GRAIL = AMRITAM = SOMA = LIFE ELIXIR = NECTAR OF IMMORTALITY

THE LIST IS ENDLESS!

THE NIBIRUAN GODS ( NIBIRU = NEBADON = VULCAN = PLANET X = WORMWOOD FROM SIRIUS B ) HAD THEIR BASES EVERYWHERE.

ALL THE RELIGIONS HAVE THE SAME SOURCE !
( BIBLE -> BY-BAL -> BY BA'AL( ENKI))
( QURAN -> QUR-AN / ANU )

MANY OF THE COMPARED CHARACTERS/ INCIDENTS MIGHT HAVE HAPPENED AT ONE PLACE AND THEN IMPLANTED INTO ANOTHER CULTURE FOR THEIR BENEFIT.
SOURCE :
http://www.galacticroundtable.com/fo...ods-hindu-gods

Is there anyone in the solar system who openly thinks like I do? I like to think - and I hate to think. It usually hurts when I think. Efforts to figure things out, solve problems, and save the world - seem to go largely unrewarded, and are often punished. Perhaps it really is better to give people what they want - and tell them that which they wish to hear. I often think that I might hit it off better with Lucifer/Shiva/Kali/Mary/Anna (if they really do exist - as I have speculated) than with just about anyone else - even though we would probably fight like hungry feral cats. At least there might be somewhat of a common understanding of things - even though our conclusions and courses of action would probably be diametrically opposed. I continue to desire some sort of an interaction with whoever is really and truly at the top of the pyramid - without mind-games or mumbo-jumbo. Just the facts ma'am. But just tending to business is looking more and more attractive. Thinking the unthinkable - and trying to know the unknowable - has taken it's toll. Then - trying to communicate with others about these things has been sort of like trying to reinvent the wheel.

Positive thinking is a double-edged sword which can lift one higher - or be a deluded detour down the primrose path. I am simply trying to face reality - in a very unconventional sense. I think I've found a lot of my answers - and I don't necessarily like them. The search has been somewhat destabilizing - and I fear what may happen to the general public when they really start getting exposed to a lot of what I have uncovered - assuming that at least some of it is true.

BROOK has supplied SO MUCH valuable information on AV1 and MOA. A thread titled 'Amen Ra' on AV1 contains a lot of BROOK's hard work and research. http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=18223 Even though AV1 is closed to posting - the view count on this thread seems to rise by about 1,000 per month. That thread on the 'Infiltration of the New Age Movement' which starninja has contributed so much to - is a must view for all truth seekers and curiosity seekers. What you don't know - can hurt you.

Balance is an important part of all of this - and I have been losing my balance - little by little - which is why I'm really trying to stop - at least for a while. Bill Cooper had alcohol and temper issues - and I think it may have had a lot to do with all of the upsetting information he was dealing with. I really think that the Powers That Be have made the decision to inform the public about what's really been going on - in a gradual and unofficial manner. How responsibly we deal with this information - will determine how quickly and smoothly disclosure occurs.

Take a closer look at China, India, Tibet, and Kali. Just a hunch...

I've been wondering a lot about the true nature of the soul - and wondering about the true extent of any hybridization programs - historically and presently. What if the human soul is a shapeshifting interdimensional reptilian? Could this be why we have a reptilian part of our brains? Could this really be the biggest secret? Are all of us hybrids - in one way or another? Are Dracs really human/reptile hybrids - with an exceptionally high percentage of reptile genetics? Are everyday humans really human/reptile hybrids - with a very low percentage of reptile genetics? I once knew an ivy league graduate who told me that they were a talking snake. Some of my best friends have turned out to be snakes.

It seems reasonable to me to at least begin with the view that this solar system is our home (regardless of ancient star wars and battles for control of this and that) - and that we just keep reincarnating (as we require new bodies) back into this solar system - and that this solar system may be as good as it gets - anywhere. I'm considering any extermination events (natural or inflicted) and mass evacuations (by UFO's, the Second Coming of Christ, etc.) to be bad things. Bringing reason and peace to this solar system seems reasonable to me. Has the Queen of Heaven been trying to do this for thousands of years? OR - has the Queen of Heaven been misusing and abusing this solar system and it's inhabitants for thousands of years? I keep seeing corruption and insanity as being unavoidably connected with absolute power - despite the best of intentions - which is why I wish for this hypothetical Queen of Heaven to retire - and serve as an advisor rather than a ruler. Sorry for being repetitious - but I will continue to test this hypothesis in different settings. I think we are all in Purgatory - and that it is up to us whether we progress into Heaven - or digress into Hell. We make our bed - and sleep in it. Our planet is how we plan it. World without end.

"Semiramis became known as the "queen of heaven," and was the prototype from which all other pagan goddesses came."--World Religions by David Terrell

Carol wrote:OXY, have you seen this? http://georgekavassilas.org/gktalk102008.html

George said that Jesus had to be annointed by Mary Magdalene - and get permission from her - to be able to do his work. He also said that Mary Magdalene was an incarnation of the Divine Mother. He further said that in cathedrals - one must go through the mother to get to the Christ energy. Finally, he said that the rock who Jesus intended to build his church upon - was Mary Magdalene.

I have speculated that the Queen of Heaven aka Whore of Babylon aka Mary Magdalene aka Woman in Scarlet - created the Historical Jesus - to be a Red Herring. Having said that - I continue to reverence the Teachings of Jesus - even if my blasphemous speculations are true. All of this probably has a 5% chance of being true - but I will continue to climb further and further out on a very thin limb. Did the Woman in Scarlet write the Red Letters? I'd better stop.

George warns of ET's who claim to be here to help - and speak of love - as being deceptive enemies. Could these be some of the ET's who Alex Collier says we need to be mentored by? I am very skeptical regarding mentoring. Early Collier interviews stated that all the ET's should leave - and just leave us alone - and stop interfering with us, and stop manipulating us. Which ET's are promoting Responsibility and Human Sovereignty? Have any of them done so over the past several thousand years? Does the Bible do so? Why is Responsibility and the U.S. Constitution not the preferred foundation for this solar system? I keep sensing that Steven Greer and even Alex Collier are being strong-armed by ET's to promote their agenda. I sense that a lot of people are joining them - because they feel that we cannot beat them. I can't prove this - but I feel very ill regarding all of this.

Starninja to Orthodoxymoron: I couldn’t say it better. Why would we want to be mentored? We gave our power away to governments, falsely believing that they would act in our best interest. Why would we want to give our power away to ET’s? Some claim that ET’s are highly evolved. By which standards……..theirs? We don’t know them and we can’t make any judgment if they are more evolved than we are. We don’t trust people we don’t know. And it takes time to build trust. ET's haven't earned our trust! Hm...why would I want to trust Alex Collier? Because he said so? Not good enough for me.
Secondly, TPTB worked hard for ages to convince us that we powerless and insecure. Well, they can’t control people who are secure within themselves.
I see it as a big problem for those who don’t trust themselves, eager to give up responsibility and personal power away.

Reply: Thank-you starninja. I don't wish to slam Alex Collier, Steven Greer, or the ET's (Human/Reptile Hybrids?). I just wish to work toward a minimalist solar system government - which avoids the absurdities and atrocities of the past. The human race obviously has HUGE ethical and psychological problems which need to be remedied - but if the Secret Government, the United Nations, the Vatican, the City of London, Washington D.C., the Alphabet Agencies Worldwide, the Underground Bases, the Secret Space Program, the Secret Societies, and the Royal Family, et al - were truly governed by Responsibility and the U.S. Constitution - with 10,000 representatives from throughout the solar system - I have a feeling that things would improve - after a rough and rocky transition period. I tend to think that all of us are products and victims of our circumstances - and I have absolutely no animosity or ill-will toward any of the organizations or individuals mentioned above. I'm just trying to visualize what the best next step should be. I suspect really, really nasty ancient wars in this solar system (and elsewhere) - which may not be resolved - even at this late date. If reincarnation is a reality - we may have all been a part of unspeakable horrors. I don't know the whole story. I probably don't even know 1% of the whole story - so all of my presuppositions, speculations, and proposed solutions - might be complete BS. But somehow, We the Goyim - must begin to attempt to think everything though - and not just leave it up to the ET's and the Secret Societies.

Carol wrote:I personally know Alex Collier and much about him. He has not had contact for years although he would like to have contact and puts up a false front about having recent contact. And one of the things I've personally heard him say repeatedly is that humans are right up there with everyone else (maybe not technologically and maybe some alien races are more spiritually evolved but we should never become slaves to anyone.}

His experience was real yet his life a bit of a mess. Collier isn't being strong armed by anyone. As for Greer, he is his own man with his own agenda and is involved with ET contact via group meditation. I've read these men's unpublished and published interviews and they are close to Paola Harris who is a close personal friend of mine.

It would be liberating if the general public had some type of concrete clue as to how many types of ETs the US government have treaties with. There are 114 different alien races that we know about and in my personal opinion, the US military FIRST chose to go with the ones who were at the bottom of the barrel (greys, reptilians and demons). Heaven help us.

Thank-you Carol. I always feel humbled when I read your posts. You have obviously done a huge amount of research - you are an experiencer - and you know key people personally. I'm just an armchair blogger - and I am propelled forward (backward?) by my insecurities.

I like Alex Collier a lot - and I listen to him more than just about anyone else. But I sense a lot of internal conflict. I also sense that he knows a lot more than he reveals publicly. He probably gets into a huge amount of trouble for what he does reveal. Strong arming can occur in a lot of different ways. Perhaps that was too strong of a term. I just detect a sense of resignation in people like Jordan Maxwell, Steven Greer, and Alex Collier. Jordan has been open about this. Steven stated at a 2005 X-Con (I think) that the ET agenda was going to be implemented whether the governments of the world like it or not. Alex has changed over the years. Watch his lectures and interviews in the 90's - and then watch the lectures and interviews from the last couple of years. I sometimes wonder if his information comes from both benevolent and malevolent beings - combined with his own research and thinking. Sort of a composite. The 'benevolent' beings could turn out to be deceptive SOB's. Could this be a possible reason for an absence of recent contact? This whole thing could be a lot nastier and messier than we can imagine. I'm not studying this stuff to be happy. I'm studying it because I'm scared.

The figure of 114 alien races floored me. However - I'm still looking at the possibility that the 'ET's' are really Human/Reptile Hybrids - created right here in this solar system. Nicholas Roerich (the Russian mystic) traveled to Tibet - and learned of a 'Sovereign Queen of the Air' from Sirius - who conducted (and conducts?) a Hybridization Program. Nicholas spoke of seeing Strange Grey People in Tibet. Could this be the source of most of these 114 alien races? If you haven't already - watch the entire series linked in the first post of this thread. Notice especially Part 14 at around nine or ten minutes - to view the Roerich information. I think the deception, corruption, and cruelty is unimaginable and unfathomable. I obviously don't know the details. I continue to fly blind (and stupid). But I continue to fly. God help us.

I'm rather lost, at this point. I really think that the infowar will go on for a long, long time - if not forever. No matter how all the king's horses and all the king's men try to put together an ideal politcal/religious system - it will always probably seem to be wrong - and we will continue to fight about how to do things the right way. The Holy Father and the Queen of Heaven must get very, very tired of all of the razzmatazz...

Here is a Protestant view regarding the 'Woman Who Rides the Beast' aka the 'Whore of Babylon'. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w5Ke7Tn3uOU&NR=1 I am not endorsing this video. I include it only to provide another perspective. Obviously - I have been considering the possibility that the 'Whore of Babylon' may be the 'Queen of Heaven' rather than being a particular location or church. Again - I have no animosity. I'm just trying to figure out what has been going on throughout history. I have a feeling that most of us are deluded - including me. Does anyone know how much the Whore of Babylon charges? Fifty Cities? Why is she called the 'Whore of Babylon'? Because she babbles on and on and on and on and I'd better stop...

What if most of us came to Earth from Sirius on a UFO called Battlestar Moon - around 12,000 years ago - led by the Queen of Heaven? What if our souls are interdimensional reptilian in nature - and what if all of us are human/reptile hybrids (with a very small reptile percentage)? What if Reptilians and Greys are human/reptile hybrids (with a very large reptile percentage)? What if the Queen of Heaven conducted a spirituality, technology, architecture, art, music, conquest, and genetic hybridization program - which got out of control? What if our true history is unbearable? Would the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth - unite the solar system - or drive us into yet another star war? These are not rhetorical questions. Here's something a bit more pleasant to contemplate:
1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cAlRFWQnCYE 2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-J3L4a5RtmM&feature=channel 3. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wKyNIY9oMnw 4. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FTONKvpU5UI&feature=related 5. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_8ZT8TPlG3w

I feel like I'm being mugged and raped by a brutal gang of facts, theories, and entities. When the Jesuits catch up with me - there probably won't be much left...

Reconsider the first page of the AV1 Thuban Q&A (noting especially the X-rated story!) - and consider the possibility that abraxasinas - or one close to abraxasinas - looks like my avatar - and might really be Kali aka The Queen of Heaven aka The Whore of Babylon. http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=18900&highlight=orthodoxymoron+threads All of the avatars have been removed from AV1 (why?) - but remember the avatar which abraxasinas used? It showed a Hathor-like goddess figure with a dog (Anubis or Sirius?) standing in front of a pyramid. I continue to think that the whole abraxasinas/Thuban fiasco was sort of a test or a mind-game - which nonetheless revealed information and concepts relevant to our quest. A word of warning - some found the Thuban material to be very disorienting - and some claimed that they were supernaturally attacked in connection with it. I could only bring myself to read selected parts of it - over a period of weeks and months. I had my first (and only) ufo sighting shortly before the Thuban thread and AV1 were closed. Researcher beware. Stay out of Thuban! Abandon all sanity - ye who enter Thuban - and cross over into a femtotechnically truncated bifurcation of an interdimensional hypotenuse of a trinity godess space-time singularity!

The names Mercuriel and Hadriel are quite interesting - and may indicate sovereignty - but I really don't think I'm a sovereign (whatever that really means). I do think that I am one of many billions of beings who have a right to be here in this solar system (despite all previous conflicts and star wars). I do think that negative entities can mess with me big time - and I think they have done so throughout my life - and that they continue to do so. I'm not free at all - and I don't think that uttering prayers or incantations is the solution. Benevolent entities are probably keeping me alive - but they seem to not be doing much else that I can tell - but who knows? Someone claiming to be God showed up where I work - and was worried that someone was going to kill me - and they were very concerned about me - and protective toward me. I didn't even know this person - and they had no knowledge of my internet activities (that I know of). They told me they were going to destroy the world - and I tried to convince them not to! Honestly! I've had other very strange encounters with various people (who might not have been people?) throughout the years.

I don't think I'm a sovereign - and your confirmation of my belief comes as a relief. I am trying to think through the power structure of this solar system - going back thousands, or even millions, of years - and I am trying to think Kali's thoughts after her - but I think there are too many sovereigns or wannabe sovereigns running (flying?) around this neck of the woods. Too many chiefs!! But having said that - I do think that We the People of Earth need to be the New Elites in a Brave New Solar System.

Just a personal note to Lucifer, Shiva, Kali, Mary, Anna, Queen of Heaven - or to whom it may concern - I apologize if I have been unfair or unkind. I'm hurt, scared, insecure, and a bit curious - and I have been attempting to get a response from you without engaging in blood rituals and soul selling. If I ever meet you - I will be very respectful - but I might ask some hard questions - and I might not appear to be very friendly or responsive. Chad Decker would be a push-over compared to me. If things went my way (editorially) - I wouldn't jump up and down, and be triumphalistic. It would just be another day at the office. I would like to hear your musical capabilities - and I think they are probably unmatched in the history of the world. Credit should be given where credit is due. Justice should be served regarding any past wrongs - but I am not in favor of the death penalty, or cruel and unusual punishment. You might be sentenced to 1,000 years as the U.N. Representative from Phobos ("I was arrested last night in Tibet - and taken to a very nice prison on Phobos")! Don't be afraid. I mean no harm. I am of peace. Namaste.

Here is a thread (not mine) from AV1 which might be relevant to this thread. I remember that it was a good thread - but that I didn't follow it too closely. Perhaps it's time to take another look at "Remote Viewing Tibetan Monks See Extra Terrestrial Powers Saving the World". http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=12449&highlight=orthodoxymoron+threads What did the Tibetan Monks know - and when did they know it???? Also - in the movie '2012' - the arks were located in China - and the most unaffected continent was Africa. In light of my speculations - is this significant? Remember - Alex Collier recently stated that disclosure might very likely come from India or China. Is something brewing? Hmmmmmmmmm. Here is the first post of the thread by Adarajones:

Remote viewing Tibetan monks see Extra Terrestrial powers saving the World from destroying itself in 2012

http://www.indiadaily.com/editorial/12-26-04.asp

Remote viewing is nothing new in Tibetan monasteries. For thousands of years remote viewing in the middle of other spiritual activities have dominated Tibetan culture. What some Indian tourists came to learn from a few Tibetan monasteries under the current Chinese rule is extremely alarming and fascinating.

According to these tourists remote viewers are seeing world powers in the course of self-destruction. They also see that the world will not be destroyed. Between now and 2012 the world super powers will continue to engage in regional wars. Terrorism and covert war will be the main problem. In world politics something will happen in and around 2010. At that time the world powers will threaten to destroy each other.

Between 2010 and 2012, the whole world will get polarized and prepare for the ultimate dooms day. Heavy political maneuvers and negotiations will take place with little progress.

In 2012, the world will start plunging into a total destructive nuclear war.

And at that time something remarkable will happen, says, Buddhist monk of Tibet. Supernatural divine powers will intervene. The destiny of the world is not to self-destruct at this time.

Scientific interpretation of the monks’ statements makes it evident that the Extra Terrestrial powers are watching us every step of the way. They will intervene in 2012 and save the world from self-destruction.

When asked about recent UFO sightings in India and China, the monks smiled and said the divine powers are watching us all. Mankind cannot and will not be allowed to alter the future to that great extent.

Every human being though their current acts in life called “Karma” can alter the future lives to some extent, but changing the destiny in that large extent will not be allowed to that great an extent.

Monks also mentioned that beyond 2012 our current civilization would understand that the final frontier of science and technology is in area of spirituality and not material physics and chemistry. Beyond 2012, out technologies will take a different direction. People will learn the essence of spirituality, the relation between body and the soul, the reincarnation and the fact we are connected with each other are all part of “God”.

In India and China UFO sightings have increased in many folds. Many say the Chinese and Indian Governments are being contacted by the Extra Terrestrials.

In recent days most UFO activities have been seen in those countries who have indigenously developed Nuke capabilities.

When asked if these extra-terrestrials will show up in reality in 2012, the answers remote viewers are giving is: they will reveal themselves in such a way that none of us scared. They will reveal themselves only if they have to. As our science and technology progresses, we are destined to see them and interact with them any way.

According to the remote viewers, our earth is blessed and is being saved continuously from all kinds of hazards all the time that we are not even aware of. As our technologies progress we will realize how external forces saved us.

It sounds as though we deal with the visible PTB (who we love and hate), who take orders from the bloodline elites, who take orders from mysterious and nepharious entities, who take orders from who knows who? I keep feeling as though we are prisoners of an ancient star war - and that we are serving some type of a sentence. What troubles me, is that even if we do become responsible (or try to be responsible) - we are destined to remain in jail. The law of the universe seems to be that the Human Race on Planet Earth cannot and will not be allowed to succeed - and that they will not be allowed to become responsibly free - no matter what. Perhaps the Original Sin was the Unpardonable Sin. This seems to be all about being beat into reverential submission by the chastenings of the lord - as sinners in the hands of an angry god. Did Promethius steal fire from this god? Did we all go along with Promethius? Is that why we are here - and why we are in so much trouble?

Promethius = Lucifer = Kali = Mary = Anna (in "V")? What if the gods were problematic and disfunctional? What if Promethius/Lucifer/Kali/Mary/Anna was/were/are/is problematic and disfunctional? Is there a solution to the madness? Regardless of what really happened, and regardless of what is happening presently, why is there so much secrecy, deception, corruption, violence, and insanity? Why are legitimate and well-meaning attempts at understanding and reform, met with such coldness and even hostility?

Allow me to introduce to you, a pretty lady named TREEE. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vgUrYWlSqT4&NR=1 Some might say that she is simply a drug addicted former prostitute - but she seems to know a helluva lot about some very creepy supernatural phenomenon. Might TREEE give us some clues as to what a modern incarnation of the Whore of Babylon would be like? Ironically, TREEE lives in Las Vegas - which is sometimes called 'Babylon'. One never knows...

At this point - I feel like a lost little boy who has wandered onto the battlefield - just before the Battle of the Bulge. I don't want to be a part of any of this - but I have made myself a part of the mess - with all of my internet comments and speculation. Might we be dealing with Amen Ra Annunaki vs Hathor Annunaki? Gabriel Annunaki vs Lucifer Annunaki? Could Michael be the legitimate leader of the Human Race (us and those who we encounter every day)? Awesome Gods and Goddesses? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b365_qJEpDg Could Adria approximate the Queen of Heaven who anciently came to Tibet from Sirius - to conduct a hybridization program (to create us?) - after stealing fire from the gods? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z7lAagZA-H4&NR=1

This is pretty much a goddess thread - and I just wish to communicate to all goddesses who might be reading this thread - that I mean no disrespect or injury - but I do wish for the madness in this solar system to end quickly. This has gone on long enough. I am once again inviting all factions to unite around a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System aka The United States of the Solar System. I wish to retain all of the best which presently exists - and I wish to eliminate all of the worst which presently exists. However - each and every soul should be treated with kindness, dignity, and respect. I wish no misery, pain, or death on anyone - even upon the worst of the worst. Imprisonment and eventual restoration - probably. Extermination - probably not. How quickly destruction travels from one group to the next. If one group is insecure - all of us are insecure. Proceed wisely. I am of peace. Namaste.

Here is the Queen of Heaven - leading the Human Race down the Primrose Path to Perdition > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vTD-vdRRYRM&p=3E87B5C9A75C04E3&playnext=1&index=56

Here is what might happen in the Final Judgment when Amen Ra (Incoming Annunaki) discovers that his daughter Hathor (Local Annunaki) has been the cause of all the trouble > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w3ncFob_dF0&feature=related

Are we dealing with Father (incoming) / Daughter (local) Annunaki? Are they Sirius A, Nibiru-Inhabiting, Hybrid, and Black? Gabriel and Lucifer? Are we also dealing with Aldebaran, Sirius B, Moon-Inhabiting, White Nazis - led by ?????? Who is the Hypothetical Jesus Faction - who is trying to break-up the Star War? Was the Annunaki Faction here first? Is Earth their planet? Did the Moon show up 12,000 years ago - and attempt to take over Earth? If so - what might be a reasonable resolution? What really troubles me is that we don't know the whole story. I hate this damn guessing game - and waiting game. Annunaki vs Nazi? Masons vs Nazis? Pigmented vs Non-Pigmented? Is the Jesus Faction really good and right - but relatively powerless? I continue to send my invitation into the vast regions of space and cyberspace - to unite all factions and all beings around a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System aka The United States of the Solar System - based upon Responsibility and the U.S. Constitution. This is probably an exercise in futility - but one never knows who reads these threads - and who comments on them.

Could the chief administrator of the Roman Catholic Church be similar to my avatar? Could this be the 'Whore of Babylon' - rather than the RCC? See - I'm thinking that the RCC might have to deal with more secret and hidden problems than we can possibly imagine. I just watched 'Stargate Continuum' - and the scene where Ba'al and Katesh aka Vala are in their spaceship - and are preparing to attack and enslave Earth - particularly impressed me. Might the RCC have had to deal with something like this? 1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iI1JvTVdVTQ&feature=related 2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K4dC3GOu3ko&feature=related Could there be a real-life Katesh (Vala) aka Queen of Heaven - who controls us by controlling the Roman Catholic Church? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k3A6_blpqpU Please don't consider this post to be hateful on my part. I'm just trying to understand. BTW - are there any Jesuits out there who can point me to a book or website - from the Roman Catholic perspective - which analyzes 'The Great Contoversy' - from cover to cover? I know all about the Plagiarism and Investigative Judgment problems. I also know that most Jesuits have read this book from cover to cover - and have it in their libraries. Here is a possible positive future for the Queen of Heaven. http://www.hulu.com/watch/108637/stargate-sg-1-the-powers-that-be I'm a real Pain in Uranus - aren't I?

This post should probably be the beginning of a new thread - but I'm going to attempt to tie it into this thread. The subject is Persia. I just viewed a video which claims that Persians are the true Aryans. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJbdGvjnSpQ&feature=related The Nazis were into the Aryan thing. I recently heard that Bohemian Grove is run by Persians. I also heard that Obama is Persian. This is unconfirmed - and I know nothing about this subject - so please help me out. The Persian Gulf. The Medo-Persian Empire (following the Babylonian Empire). Most people in Iran are Persian. Why do I keep hearing rumors regarding nuking Iran? Why are we REALLY in Afghanistan and Iraq? Could we be involved in some sort of an Aryan War? Could all of this be somehow related to Tibet, Kali, the Trinity Goddess, the Queen of Heaven, and Disclosure? Here is a link to the wikipedia entry for Persia (which contains lots of links)> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persian Bahai is Persian in origin - I believe. Isn't Steven Greer - Bahai? Help me out, folks! Here is a link to a video series regarding Aryan Studies> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B8nV_41ZvwI&feature=related Is that Helena Blavatsky at 5:55? Could a Persian connection be the missing link in all of this? Here is another interesting video> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=59Kqtefwc0M&feature=related Try thinking in terms of Sirius/Tibet/Iran/Germany. I really don't think the German people came up with the Nazi phenomenon on their own. In fact - I don't think they knew what the hell they were getting involved in - even at the highest levels. Just more speculation. I have no idea where this might lead - but give it some thought.

Has anyone done a study of 'The King of Heaven (Father/Gabriel/ Amen Ra?) and Queen of Heaven (Mother/ Hathor/Isis/Mary/Lucifer/ Holy Spirit?) - and the Heir to the Throne (Horus/Michael/Jesus?)' concept? I just thought of that! This could be applied in so many situations - terrestrial, extraterrestrial, mythological, theological, astrological, dynastic, etc. - with a high likelihood of overlap. I reread those abraxasinas posts - and I still think of abraxasinas - or the spirit behind abraxasinas - as being more feminine than masculine. I keep thinking of Adria or Katesh in Stargate SG-1. This part caught my attention:

Q: Who is the God or Goddess of This World?

A: The Father and Mother, cosmically not biologically speaking of Jesus.

Q: Has corruption and sanity been a problem for this being?

A: Nope.

Q: Are Satan and Lucifer two separate and distinct beings?

A: Yes, Satan is the true manifestation of a fake image, called the Devil. Satan is the 'court prosecutor' of 'humanity' and Lucifer is the template for this collective humanity being prosecuted by Satan
Satan is the 'Kali' of Shakti as two sides of the one coin called God.
Satan is God and you are Lucifer in individuality. You can either 'play' a Christ White Lucifer look LUCIFER=74=JESUS=MESSIAH=CROSS=...or you can play a Dark Lucifer as an absorber of the 'brought' light.

Q: Is there...or has there ever been...a God who was higher than Gabriel, Michael, and Lucifer?

A: Yes, this is the 1st Order of Abraxas aka Abrasax as the polarity unexpressed BUT contained within, like the Dark White Lucifers as One or as Satan God as One.

Q: If so...was this God destroyed in the War in Heaven?

A: No, this 1st Order is omniness and above such polarity issues as a war in heaven on earth or otherplace.

Q: Is Satan one of these three?

A: Satan is 1st Order, the archangels are 2nd order.

Q: If so...which one? Did Lucifer instruct Charles Darwin?

A: Ask Charles Darwin.

Q: Would Human sovereignty in this Solar System be a good thing?

A: Not yet, later perhaps.

Q: Is a theocracy a good or a bad thing?

A: Your polarity issue.

Q: Is Responsible Freedom fundamentally rebellious in nature?

A: No

I'm beginning to think that I'm in trouble with BOTH the God of This World AND the Creator God of the Universe. Sort of like when a police officer tries to break up a domestic dispute - and gets pounded by both parties - even though he or she is trying to help both parties. I have a very bad and sick feeling regarding what might be going on in the entire universe. I so hope that I'm wrong. Is the following a harbinger of things to come?

I received the following responses from posts I have made on the internet. They don't sound human.

'Y'all love fantisizing over my ancestral decorations, places, spirituality that you don't get, the greatness you won't achieve, and the melanin you'll never have. This depiction of my ancestors is pathetic. Y'all always make them look just as degenerative and recessive as you. Anyway, play and have fun as much as you still can. Yes you are running out of time, and to be honest, there is absolutly nothing you can do about it. I have no mercy, you lie and mock and blaspheme all the way to hell.'

abraxasinas: Very human egocentricity orthodoxus.

On another website...I received this message:

'You know this isn't funny! The Lord God will judge you for claiming God ship. Just because God showed you a little bit of His secrets you think you know everything. He will NOT have mercy on you!' [orthodoxymoron note: This was in connection with me fictionally using the name KRLLL - causing me to wonder if someone equated Godship with the name 'Omnipotent Highness KRLLL'?]

abraxasinas: Very human ego mimicking the divine ego of God (who does not judge and is always full of 'mercy').

I once heard a mocking, sing-song, high-pitched feminine sounding voice...emanating from a usually deep and masculine voiced televangelist...directed toward me...in public...almost shouting 'That was gooooooood!!!!'...in reaction to a polite, well intentioned, and well reasoned comment by me.

abraxasinas: Even more so human ego-based, accentuating separation and not the natural unity of God.

This was a short unedited internet exchange I had some time ago:

ME: What if the aliens who have been here for thousands of years are the 'bad-guys'? What if we will need the help of good aliens from elsewhere to get rid of the demonic aliens who are already here? Could this be viewed as a hostile alien attack? I really don't know. I am just speculating.

THEM: Try not to think in terms of good or bad. Understand this is not your planet. Then, understand nothing can be done to you that you don't do to yourself. Know that there are quadrillions of planets and they don't have a massive climate change every 26,000 years and violent deranged people like yourselves. Why on Earth would any race want to live here with you knowingly? The most intelligent life on the planet is not human.

abraxasinas: This is basically true, but omits the 'inner human core' whch IS in fact the most intelligent cosmic lifeform (the planet belongs to All) - yet remains hidden in the superconsciousness ONLY accessible by the Individual Logos partnering the Cosmic Logos.

ME: I'll try not to think of the Iraq War in terms of good or bad. I'll try to be morally ambiguous. I might even become CIA or a CEO. Hey, maybe violent and deranged is neither good nor bad...but thinking makes it so. The aliens who are here need us to not get our acts together. If that happens...they'll probably have to live on Nibiru...or worse. Sorry for being a smart-XXX. Wait...I'm not sorry...it's neither good nor bad. I couldn't resist. I mean well. Really.

THEM: And your point was?...............

ME: Who owns earth? Where do humans belong? What is the most intelligent life on earth? If they are so smart, and earth is so bad...why are they here? I may be deranged...but I'm not violent. You sound as though you are not human...are you an alien? If so...what kind...and from where? My point was that ethics are supremely important. I don't hurt, kill, terrorize, or abduct people...but some aliens apparently do(as do some humans). They should stop.

orthodoxymoron wrote:

"I was serious when I said that I hoped that this activity was being duly noted somewhere in the galaxy. I fear that we are headed down the wrong road, and that we will not turn back, regardless of the warnings, and regardless of the rantings and ravings of lunatics such as myself. I really wish that I had a shallow underground civilian base to go down into. At this point - I am ready to go down - and stay down - for a long, long time."

Raven wrote:

"Indeed Oxy, duly noted it is. You will not be alone hiding under those rocks."

Rev.6 KJV

[12] And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;
[13] And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.
[14] And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.
[15] And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;
[16] And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:
[17] For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

I REALLY CAN'T FEEL THE LOVE TONIGHT. CAN YOU?

Here is another what if. What if it's Gabriel vs Lucifer + Michael - with Gabriel and Lucifer being the big-guns - and Michael being highly pure, but relatively powerless compared with the other two? Might Lucifer and Michael be co-mediators between Gabriel and Humanity? Might Gabriel be God/Satan? Might Lucifer be Mary/Holy Spirit? Might Michael be Jesus? Once again - don't get mad at me - this is just more speculation. My goal is to make you face yourselves - and think. Could Gabriel have been disfunctional in Heaven (Orion?)? Could Lucifer and Michael have rebelled against Gabriel? Did Humanity aka Fallen Angels aka Nephilim aka Us - follow (fall) Lucifer and Michael to Earth? Did we steal Fire (advanced technology, hybridization genetics, and spiritual wisdom) from Gabriel? Was this the Original Sin? Are Lucifer and Michael at odds regarding how to deal with Gabriel? Is Gabriel the leader of the Incoming Annunaki? Is Lucifer the leader of the Local Annunaki? Is Michael the leader of Humanity (as we know humans to be)? I keep feeling incredible tension and looming fate - as I comtemplate our situation. Earth really does seem to be a Planet in Rebellion - and it feels as though the rebellion is about to be put down - once and for all. But what if ALL parties are wrong? What if an innovative solution needs to be pursued? I keep mentioning a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System aka The United States of the Solar System. I like the concept - but I am clueless regarding the details and implementation aspects. I'll just keep passively pursuing this line of reasoning - and hope that the Big Gun Gods and Goddesses call off Armageddon, Retribution, Annihilation, Damnation, Utter Destruction, etc. - and declare some sort of a conditional truce - to work things out in a reasonable, rational, and peaceful manner. Hope springs eternal - but don't hold your breath - hoping for hell to freeze over...

Here is another piece of evidence which seems to place ancient Aryans in India - right next door to Tibet. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NPQ9dEVcHRk&feature=related If a Sovereign Queen of the Air from Sirius (Lucifer?) was Aldebaran/Sirius/Aryan - and came to Tibet 12,000 to 14,000 years ago in the Moon - to conduct a hybridization program on Earth - this would be highly interesting - wouldn't it? Is it possible for Aryans to be pigmented? Again - I don't know a damn thing about this subject. All roads may lead to Rome - but the most important roads might originate in Tibet. What if Earth became Nazified thousands of years ago? What if Babylon, Medo-Persia, Egypt, Greece, and Rome - were essentially Nazi in nature? Please don't stone me - this was just a random thought. What if Gizeh Intelligence has been running Earth for thousands of years? What if Gizeh Intelligence continues to run Earth? Are we dealing with Annunaki Masons (Gabriel) vs Annunaki Nazis (Lucifer) vs Human Magicians (Michael)? Or - are they the same? We are all one? Three sides of the same pyramid? Trilateral Commission? Trinity? Godhead? If someone has been in charge for thousands of years - they could genetically engineer all manner of races - human, grey, and reptilian - and create all manner of mythologies, theologies, religions, empires, and nations. Do we all come from the goddess? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WoVNveJFTig Rewatch Alex Collier's 1994 interview on Google Video - and his 1995 lecture on YouTube - with this thread in mind.

Many years ago - there was a TV show called 'Queen for a Day' - and my grandmother was on it. Can you imagine being 'Queen of Heaven for a Day?' I keep getting the image of someone looking a lot like my avatar (for special occasions anyway) - travelling around the world on magneto-leviton trains - and interacting with most of the political, religious, scientific, business, and financial leaders of the world - each and every day. But it is unclear to me whether Earth is completely their show - or whether they are an administrator for - or are in conflict with - an even more powerful being, or group of beings. This, of course, is merely speculation. If I could prove this - I would cease to exist. I wouldn't have to wait for the rocks to fall on me...

I would love to shadow the key players in this solar system as sort of a neutral observer. Is this sort of thinking a form of mental illness - or is it the proper way to think about solar system issues? Should I get all wrapped-up in the local political mudslinging - or should I mostly think of responsible principles and concepts relative to the politics, religion, psychology, and ethics of doing business in this solar system? I'm beginning to think in terms of competing with an Anna or Katesh version of the Queen of Heaven - who I think might be the chief administrator of this solar system. Again - is this a form of mental illness - or is this a reasonable modality of getting a handle on what's really going on? Is there a legitimate place for a Solar System Administrator? Would things be even more chaotic if none existed? I'm thinking that a Solar System Observer (or Observers) - who had access to everyone and everything - with no authority - might be a good thing - but I don't really know. Thinking about all of this makes me shaky. Is anyone else thinking in this manner? I'm sure there is - but who are they? Where are they? What are they doing?

I keep thinking that all proposed solutions and attempted implementations will be highly problematic. No matter how we attempt to put the puzzle together - it will always be wrong. There will always be discord and conflict. However - we really should seek more sane ways to manage the insanity. All of this should probably proceed in an evolutionary rather than a revolutionary manner. Top-down would probably be better than bottom-up - but both would be optimal. Talking softly and carrying a big stick would be splendiferous!

In light of this thread - and current events - might it be wise to take a closer look at India, Tibet, China, Iran, and the Medo-Persian Empire? I'm sensing a hugely destructive looming fate in our immediate future - which needs to be defused. The problem is - I don't really know what the threat is - or how to defuse it. Perhaps this is why I am seeking a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System aka The United States of the Solar System - based upon Responsibility and the U.S. Constitution (in broad and general terms) - so as to give all factions a fair shake. War is Hell - with very little compassion or reason. I don't expect things to be really happy in this solar system - for a long, long time. However - I would like to see everyone survive - and to continue to evolve ethically and spiritually. I'm presently watching 'Battlestar Galactica - The Plan' - and I'm finding it to be quite depressing. What really bothers me about all of this - is that We the Goyim don't really know what the hell is going on. I mean well - but I'm clueless and powerless - and it seems that the real ptb in this solar system would like all of us to stay that way. I guess I'm really trying to get up to speed with the ptb - without getting involved in the corruption and nastiness. Someone please give my threads a careful study. I don't claim to have the answers or inside knowledge - but I do think that the areas I have covered, and the questions I have raised, really need to be closely examined and answered. I feel like I am operating at about 20% of the 10% of my brain capacity. All is not well emotionally, spiritually, and intellectually - which is why I am not doing anything more than posting random thoughts on the internet. But I predict that someone will be reading these thoughts 100 years from now - and asking themselves why these thoughts were not taken seriously.

BTW - what is the Kali Rama Step Back - which Ashayana Deane speaks of at 08:00 of the Camelot interview? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dK2vWZE8noU&feature=channel I find this third and final part of the interview to be quite interesting. I find Ashayana to be quite interesting - even though I think I believe about 20% of what she says. I think she knows a helluva lot - but that she speaks in riddles - and only reveals bits and pieces of what she really knows. Her manner of speaking and body language is fascinating. Her name is even interesting. Ashayana = Ash Anna = Black Anna? Think of Ashtar Command. Ash Tar = Black. Come to think of it - what color is a Raven? Sometimes I think I need a good shrink. One who has worked in Underground Bases and Secret Mental Institutions. Don't laugh. Those people may know more than just about anyone else - because they have worked with people who knew so much that it drove them insane. I tend to think that the people who know the most about the creepy and esoteric subjects are those who are in the process of going insane - and who can't handle the truth about what has been going on - and what is currently going on - with all of the disturbing implications and ramifications. I wish I were kidding - but I think the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth - will drive most people insane. I so hope that I'm wrong. I'm just saying this as a precautionary warning to those who are happily and naively searching for the truth - and the happiness which they expect will accompany the truth. I am simultaneously optimistic and pessimistic. My threads are designed to lead one on a journey which is revealing - yet which does not lead one down the primrose path to destruction.

The fact that the Unholy Trinity of Power, Sex, and Money is a reality - leads me to believe that we need to transcend this trinity - rather than resisting it. We need to engage in the Responsible Pursuit of Power, Sex, and Money. Why should the bad boys and girls have all the good times - and rule the world???? Think about THAT!!!! What if Truly Responsible Businessmen and Businesswomen starting kicking the XXXX out of the Irresponsible Businessmen and Businesswomen???? Then the good guys and good gals would have a monopoly on Power, Sex, and Money - and the world would improve exponentially. I'm just on the verge of stopping this posting. I'm running out of pearls. I have not been tending to business - and my lifestyle makes this obvious. I'm about to pursue business with a vengeance - but in a highly ethical and responsible manner. I'm tired of wading through all of the bs. OK - now I'm going to finish watching the BSG DVD. The horror!!! Then I might try to finish the Courtney Brown books - which scared the hell out of me...

I think that the Brown books reveal something of substance - but I'm not sure that it is the absolute truth. It could be a mixture of truth and deception. I assume that nearly everything we discussed on AV1 - and currently discuss on MOA - is a mixture of truth, error, and outright deception. I trust nothing and no one. I found out the hard way that I couldn't trust God - so now I don't even trust myself - let alone Courtney Brown. His RVing experiences could be manipulated or contrived supernaturally by nepharious entities. He could have hidden agendas. But I do find the books to be highly interesting - and reveal possibilities which I had never considered. However - I am truly a New Age Agnostic (a new label I have given myself). Sorry to be so blunt - but I'm in sort of a mood...

I'm in less of a mood today. The Brown material was quite compelling - and the lack of a sales-pitch - gave it the ring of truth - which is probably what scared me. It quite literally blew me away. I will take another look at it later today. But still - I've gotten very paranoid and wary. My speculations have been quite wild - but also quite vivid, to me at least - so I really don't know which way to jump. Is this a sign of instability - or is it simply due dilligence? What do you think about all of this goddess, Kali, Tibet, China, India, Persia, Queen of Heaven stuff? I really feel as though this is playing with fire - but I'm hoping that considering all of the possibilities will help to unite all factions in the solar system - in a constructive manner, which does not involve peace at any price, or any Trojan Horse scenarios.

Here is some more Queen of Heaven material. http://www.discerningtheworld.com/2010/09/25/mary-queen-of-heaven-whore-of-babylon/

Mary has appeared under many names over the centuries, here are but a few:

Mary, Queen of Heaven (Rome)
Arianrhod (Welsh) Goddess of fertility
Aprodite (Greek) Goddess of fertility
Ashteroth (Phoenicians and Canaanites) Goddess of fertility
Astarte (Eastern Mediterranean/Bronze Age) Goddess of fertility
Anahita (Persian) Goddess of fertility
Anu (Celtic) Goddess of fertility
Aveta (Gaulish) Goddess of fertility
Brigit (Irish) Goddess of fertility
Ceres (Rome) Goddess of fertility
Corn Mother (Native American) Earth Goddess/Goddess of fertility
Cybele (Rome) Goddess of fertility
Demeter (Greek) Goddess of fertility
Freya (Scandinavian) Goddess of fertility
Frigg (Scandinavian) Goddess of fertility
Gaia (Greek) Mother goddess
Hathor (Egyptian) Goddess of fertility
Haumea (Hawaiian) Mother goddess
Inanna (Sumerian) Goddess of fertility
Ishtar (Babylonian/Assyrian) Goddess of fertility
Isis (Egyptian) Goddess of fertility
Juno (Rome) Goddess of fertility
Kali (Indian) – Black earth mother/Goddess of fertility
Kostroma (Slavic) Goddess of fertility
Mylitta (Sumerian) Goddess of fertility
Oshun (Afro/Cuban) Goddess of fertility
Rainbow Snake (Aborigine) – Earth Goddess/Goddess of fertility
Rhea (Greek) Mother goddess
Tlalteutli (Aztec) Goddess of creation
Venus (Rome) Goddess of fertility
Vasudhara (Tibetan) Goddess of fertility

Check this link out! One Nation Under Satan? In Goddess We Trust? http://lifttheveil.20.forumer.com/viewtopic.php?t=21 Might M-42, Aldebaran, and Sirius be 'home' for most of us? Are we really the 'Orion Group' which Alex Collier refers to? Are our souls interdimensional reptilian in nature? Are all of us human/reptile hybrids with varying percentage differentials? Do most of us have a very low reptile percentage (reptilian brain + reptilian soul) - greys an intermediate percentage - and reptilians a high percentage? Please don't laugh - this is just a wild theory. I tend to think that the Queen of Heaven has been conducting a hybridization program on Earth for thousands of years - starting in Tibet. Some of this is based upon a visit to Tibet by Nicholas Roerich - where he saw strange grey people, and learned of a 'Sovereign Queen of the Air' who had come to Tibet from Sirius to conduct hybridization experiments. Lucis Creator? I am obviously a fan of an organized decentralism solar system government. I'm thinking that a one world government or one solar system government has existed for thousands of years - and that whoever is in power (The Queen of Heaven?) wishes to remain in power - rather than gaining power. I do think that numerous states are an essential ingredient in a world government or solar system government which maximizes responsible freedom over an extended time period.

I've said this before, but I'm going to say it in a slightly different way - what if we are dealing with a 3 way family feud - namely God/Satan/Father/Gabriel/Amen Ra/Annunaki vs Holy Spirit/Mother/Lucifer/Lilith/Hathor/Isis/Mary/Annunaki vs Son/Michael/Horus/Jesus/Human - fighting over the Human Race? What if we need a little bit of each faction, to make this solar system operate properly? How does Gizeh Intelligence fit into all of this? What would Oedipus say? That mother!! Is anybody out there??

Why exactly is Obama in India - to the tune of $200,000,000/day? Is this visit significant - especially in light of this particular thread? Does Kali have anything to do with this visit? I have speculated - with others - that the United States is experiencing the first stages of a controlled demolition. I have also speculated - with others - that India, Tibet, and China may be at the center of disclosure. India recently bought a huge amount of gold. China seems to own the U.S. What the hell is going on? http://michellemalkin.com/2010/11/02/india/ I really hate to say this - but I think I'm going to start listening to Alex Jones again. I never really listened to him much - and then I stopped - but I think we may be in for a VERY long, hard winter. (that sounds kinda sexy!) - and I'd sort of like to hear a blow by blow report on the madness - before the wall of water hits - or before the greys take me to a FEMA camp. Could we be in for a perfect storm of NWO ALIEN BS??? Some think so. I don't know.

Thank-you Carol. Part of your comment piqued my curiosity: "However, I strongly suspect that the male forces are going to undergo major changes as the Queen of Heaven is going to show her hand sooner then later. Why? Because the earth changes are ramping up and will continue for the next 4 years. Two before the crossing and two after the crossing." I will check out the links after I finish listening to Alex Jones. I just want to add that I don't have a problem with highly spiritual, ethical, and powerful women. In fact - I think they may be the way of the future. I'm just worried about the possibility of an unethical and cruel shadowy underworld of black projects, hybridization genetics, tyrannical rule, oppressive religions, compromised and controlled religious and political leaders, etc and et al - with a Queen of Heaven administrator. Once again - I don't know if any of this is true. I'm just trying to make sense out of the chaos and confusion. I'm too passive - which is why I probably need to move in the direction of Alex Jones. I don't wish to end up where he is - but maybe halfway between where I am and where he is. I'm just too burned-out to take off the gloves - just yet. I really don't wish to do anything. I just wish for this solar system to be run properly. I don't know the details of history. I don't know the details of what is presently going on. But I do know that history is a mess - and that the world is a mess presently. I simply wish for the mess to get cleaned up - and there is no better time to do this than right now.

I'd still like to meet the Queen of Heaven - if she exists - and I would be quite polite - but I wouldn't kneel - kiss her ring - and say 'My Queen'. I might ask her the sort of questions I have asked on AV1 and MOA. Gods and Goddesses don't impress me much...even if they have 500 IQ's...and I don't know that they do...but it wouldn't surprise me. Please get DVD's of the old and new 'V' series - and watch them carefully - reading between the script-lines, in light of AV1 and MOA. That goes for 'Star Wars', 'Battlestar Galactica', and 'Stargate'. I wish to keep everything good, and eliminate everything bad - without hurting or killing anyone - treating everyone and everysoul, with dignity and respect. I stand by everything I have posted on AV1 and MOA - especially regarding a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System aka The United States of the Solar System. The Queen of Heaven might even approve - once she gets used to the idea. I have hinted at it before - but I am actually trying to emulate the best aspects of Anna ('V') - in a male sort of way. But actually - the Anna in my mind's eye - is quite different than the one in the series. The series is just the starting point. It's only the beginning of a bright new day! Do you see my point? It sounds strange - and I am mad - but I do have a method. Queen of Heaven = Anna from Heaven. Who knows - she might actually like me. I continue to think that 'earth-changes' will be deliberately inflicted - and that an 'alien-invasion' or a 'second-coming' will be staged with hybrids and advanced technology - coming out of sub-surface bases throughout the solar system. I so hope that I'm wrong. BTW - the links rock - especially Cliff High on the Veritas Show! Here are a couple of links to a story about Shakira playing Kali in an Indian movie. 1. http://voteupindia.com/shakira-as-goddess-kali-in-indian-film/ 2. http://www.masala.com/25104-meet-kali---the-warrior Why on Earth are they making a Bollywood movie on the Warrior Goddess Kali - at this particular time? Is this simply a coincidence? In light of this thread - I tend to think not. But what do I know?

Don't be frightened. I mean no harm. Thank-you Carol and Raven. I'm hearing somewhat of an acknowledgement regarding some of my Queen of Heaven theorizing. This part of the first link from you, Raven, particularly interested me. "When the Universe was born in Archetypes, then it was LILITH, the Dark Queen of Heaven, also known as Inanna and the Screech Owl and Isis and Mary; who PRECEDED EVE as the 'First Wife' for ADAM and NOT being made from one of Adam's Ribs." What if disclosure will occur during Obama's India trip? What if Obama is going to go down into an underground base in India (under the Taj Mahal?), Tibet, or China - and do a disclosure press conference with Kali aka The Queen of Heaven? Could this be an official announcement of the New World Order? Could this announce or trigger a worldwide financial collapse? Could Obama end up remaining in India, Tibet, or China? Just wondering. This post is more wild than most of my other wild posts. Also - the 'V' series will be resuming in the next couple of months. Might this series contain a lot of follow-up disclosure information? Sorry if I spoiled the surprise - but no one seems to listen to me anyway. Probably nothing will happen - but just in case, you might wish to buy some extra food. I don't do the gun thing - but I do have some extra food. Lastly - and oppositely - what if the India trip signals the end of the corrupt NWO and PTB? Now that the bright-lights are being turned-on - are the rats starting to run away? Just more wild speculation and random thoughts.

Once again - I simply wish for things to work out well for everyone - including the bad guys and gals. I think that a lot of us good guys and gals might be bad guys and gals - if we had the opportunity. Think long and hard about That! You know what I'm talking about - don't you Lucifer??!! I bet you wish that I would just shut-up!! I still want to share some fine French wine with you Lucifer (Kali?) - and listen to you improvise at St. Ouen, St. Sulpice, or Notre Dame de Paris. I feel as though I am your best friend and worst enemy. Come - let us reason together. Is it time to reprogram and reboot this solar system? I want to wish Satan, Lucifer, Kali, Gods, Goddesses, Angels, Demons, Archangels, Illuminati, Megalomaniacs, Reptilians, Greys, et al a terrific rest of the century. I think we can clean up this mess - without enslavement, extermination, Star Wars, or Masters of the Universe. Imagine 10,000 very competent humans engaging in Constitutional Global and Solar System Governance, with advisors which might include all of the above. I continue to attempt to think Lucifer's (Kali's?) thoughts after her. See you at Mork and Ork's Grey Bar, Kali! Well - now I'm going to re-watch another episode of 'V'. I am of peace. Always.

The following is six years old - but it's still relevant to this thread: India to annouce UFO's are REAL - India Daily News http://ancientx.com/nm/anmviewer.asp?a=66&z=1

New Delhi is in the middle of a big secret internal debate. On one side the largest democracy of the world is eager to explain to its citizens and to the world about the ongoing contacts with the UFOs and extra-terrestrials. On the other hand there are invisible untold international protocols that prohibit doing anything that may cause worldwide fear and panic.

It is well accepted between the UFO and extra-terrestrial experts that all the five nuclear powers are in contact with the beings from other stars for quite some time. Recently India has seen enormous news on UFO contacts and secret UFO bases in Himalayas near the Chinese bases. In Ladak, for example the locals clearly point out the everyday phenomenon of large triangular spacecrafts coming out below the ground and Indian security forces protecting them. Military officials and politicians have confessed the fact that India has been contacted. India has been told the rules of the Universe.

The current debate is on whether to keep it secret like other countries are doing or in tradition of a total transparent society come out and tell the truth. India is so open and democratic; it is very difficult to keep a secret for long. The biggest concern of the Government today is that unlike in other countries, it will be very difficult to keep it secret for long. If the information comes out through unofficial channels first and then the authorities are pressed against the wall to confess, two bad things can happen. First, it can really cause a panic in the country as well as the world. Second, the way the Indian politics is run, the ruling party will be thrown out of power in no time i it is ever found that the Government withheld such information from the public.

The recent rush of world leaders to India is remarkable. Starting from Russian President Putin to major Senators from America have visited or are planning to visit India. European Union is in deep discussion with India on cooperation. All sanctions against India’s nuclear programs and Indian Space Research Organization are in the process of being lifted. India is cooperating with Europeans and the Americans in space explorations and technology research program. India is also part of World Trade Organization. India is receiving major outsourcing contracts in IT and call-center service work from America and Europe. India’s Forex reserve is at a level never imagined before because of international direct investments from Western nations, Japan, Korea and others. Interestingly, China the arc rival of India changed its posture in the last few years to make India’s friendship and trade a priority. India is slowly getting to the point when it is accepted as a permanent member of the Security Council. All the five Security Council members China, America, Russia, France and UK support India’s inclusion.

When all these factors are added together and analyzed, it seems like India is being told by the world to abide by the hidden protocols and in exchange be recognized as a major emerging superpower. The debate the country is facing internally is whether to abide by the laws of the world and the Universe to be recognized as a superpower or be truthful to its citizens and the world. According to sources close to the Government, the UFO contacts is known by quite a few politicians in the opposition and of course by those who are in power. The military has legitimate concern of not letting the secrets out either.

Recently, India’s foreign affairs minister Mr. Natwar Singh came out and said that for India it was not necessary to become a nuclear power. He is a strong supporter of Mrs. Indira Gandhi, India’s former Prime Minister who initiated the nuclear program in the mid sixties. India first exploded a nuclear device in Pokhran in early seventies. The whole country including people from his own party questioned Mr. Singh for such an irresponsible statement. But on analyzing his statements, it is evident, that based on what he knows now, being a nuclear power really does not matter much because the technologies controlled by the extra-terrestrials are so advanced that all our technologies mean really nothing. But importantly he may be irritated with this controversial ongoing secret debate and what he really meant was that if India was not a nuclear power, the debate on UFO and extra-terrestrials will never be there in India.

Take a look at these images of the Nagas: http://www.google.com/images?rlz=1T4GGIR_enUS216US217&q=nagas&um=1&ie=UTF-8&source=univ&ei=ApDoTJKXCJKusAP2hKixCw&sa=X&oi=image_result_group&ct=title&resnum=1&ved=0CC0QsAQwAA

Take a look at these images of Kali: http://www.google.com/images?rlz=1T4GGIR_enUS216US217&q=kali+images&um=1&ie=UTF-8&source=univ&ei=mpLoTKbRJomWsgOwm_WwCw&sa=X&oi=image_result_group&ct=title&resnum=1&ved=0CCwQsAQwAA

What is the reality behind the mythology?

Kala = Chronos = Time? Should the Goddess of Destruction be glorified? Are the killing, blood, severed heads, and severed hands really good things? What if the god of this world - or the administrator of this world - is a black (or pigmented) woman - who is a mixture of good and evil - genius and insanity? Has anyone seen the current cover of Newsweek magazine - with President Obama portrayed as Kali? Could there be an Obama - Kali connection? Just more speculation. I'm just scratching the surface of this whole goddess thing. It really is new to me - but so far, I think there is a good side and a bad side to it. Once again - I recommend buying the DVD's of the first twelve episodes of the 2009-10 version of 'V'. Go carefully through my 'Lucifer' and 'Kali' threads before watching it. Then, please tell me what you think. I'm still in limbo on this subject - but if you go through the material which I just posted on orthodoxymoron threads - you'll get a pretty good idea of where I'm coming from. As I try to solve my problems - I keep creating more perplexities. I don't think I have the answers - but I really wish to discuss this (and other) subjects - on an ongoing basis - as an ongoing research project. Namaste.

I can relate to the best aspects of Anna in 'V' - and to the smart and pretty Rachael (White House lady in charge) in 'Contact' - as well as to the spiritual leader of the Navi in 'Avatar'. I can scarcely imagine what it might have been like to meet Nefertiti. http://www.google.com/images?rlz=1T4GGIR_enUS216US217&q=nefertiti+images&um=1&ie=UTF-8&source=univ&ei=9TXpTM7GO4G4sAPE0-WwCw&sa=X&oi=image_result_group&ct=title&resnum=1&ved=0CDEQsAQwAA Unfortunately - what I am faced with, is attempting to understand the wreckage of human history on Planet Earth. It's not a pretty picture. I'm really trying to accentuate the positive - but I'm also attempting to uncover the negative - and I don't really care about Mr. In Between. I'm simply trying to make my research more interesting - by placing it in the context of science fiction. Are there huge anti-gravity spaceships, or not? Are there human/reptile hybrids, or not? Is there a New World Order, which involves beings who are not altogether human (as we know human to be)? Who really runs this solar system? Which science fiction movies or tv series is the closest to the truth? And back to Pilate's question to Jesus, 'What is Truth?' I'm still interested in 'V' particularly - because I think it might be revealing some of what's really going on - in an entertainment format. I have qualified my recommendation to watch it - by suggesting that people bring what they have learned in AV1 and MOA into the context of that particular sci-fi show.

Take this post with two boatloads of salt. This sounds way beyond belief. Has anyone heard anything about a ritual on November 8 involving President Obama (being incarnated by Amen Ra)? I hesitated to ask the question - because of who was allegedly involved. But the question fits in with this thread - and the presidential trip to India and Asia. Look for a Daniel Ott - Sherry Shriner - Greg Rinchich interview (half-way down the page) of this linked website: http://www.thewatcherfiles.com/ Skip to 01:20:00 for the relevant portion. This is one of the most bizarre interviews/debates I have ever heard in my life! I don't doubt that there is intense spiritual warfare - but how much of this is reality - and how much is just more deception? But really - is there a connection between Obama, Akhenaten, and Kali? Just wondering...

Incidentally, in 'V' - did anyone notice the older priest praying to the Black Madonna (shortly after Jack gets stabbed)? Is this coincidental - or is this a hidden message? Is Anna really the Black Madonna? I risk sounding racist in this thread - but I truly am not. I find strong, black, female royalty to be quite irresistable - but I continue to be wary of too much power in too few hands - whether those hands are black, white, male, or female.

Raven wrote:

Kali The Dark Mother




Awesome Symbols!

Kali's fierce form is strewed with awesome symbols. Her black complexion symbolizes her all-embracing and transcendental nature. Says the Mahanirvana Tantra: "Just as all colors disappear in black, so all names and forms disappear in her". Her nudity is primeval, fundamental, and transparent like Nature — the earth, sea, and sky. Kali is free from the illusory covering, for she is beyond the all maya or "false consciousness." Kali's garland of fifty human heads that stands for the fifty letters in the Sanskrit alphabet, symbolizes infinite knowledge.

Her girdle of severed human hands signifies work and liberation from the cycle of karma. Her white teeth show her inner purity, and her red lolling tongue indicates her omnivorous nature — "her indiscriminate enjoyment of all the world's 'flavors'." Her sword is the destroyer of false consciousness and the eight bonds that bind us.Her three eyes represent past, present, and future, — the three modes of time — an attribute that lies in the very name Kali ('Kala' in Sanskrit means time). The eminent translator of Tantrik texts, Sir John Woodroffe in Garland of Letters, writes, "Kali is so called because She devours Kala (Time) and then resumes Her own dark formlessness."

Kali's proximity to cremation grounds where the five elements or "Pancha Mahabhuta" come together, and all worldly attachments are absolved, again point to the cycle of birth and death. The reclined Shiva lying prostrate under the feet of Kali suggests that without the power of Kali (Shakti), Shiva is inert.
http://hinduism.about.com/od/hindugoddesses/a/makali.htm

Well Raven! Things were just starting to get interesting! I really enjoyed our conversation - including the post where you cussed me out! I think I deserved a lot of that - and I took what you said seriously. I actually miss you. You obviously know a helluva lot. I sensed some dark spirituality - but that may go with the territory. I sometimes wondered if you might be the modern incarnation of Kali - or at least a goddess-type of person with some sort of connection to Kali, Mary, the Goddess of This World, or the Queen of Heaven. I'm not a scholar or an experiencer - so I don't really know. I really and truly am an ignoramus. My egotistical posting style is really a cover for my rather substantial insecurities. Sounds kinda sexy - doesn't it?! I actually liked the porno part of all of this! I am more repressed than you can imagine - but I do like to joke around - and I am not easily offended - especially online! In person - things would be entirely different. I suspect that the real Queen of Heaven is highly intelligent and highly refined - yet very, very tough, decisive, harsh, reprobate - and able to swear like a trooper! You'd be amazed at the mental picture I have of the Queen of Heaven! But this is merely a hypothesis and a figment of my diseased imagination. I will probably continue to work with this subject for years - or at least until disclosure occurs. Anyway - regardless of who you really are, Raven - it's been a pleasure. Perhaps we can share a bottle of fine French wine someday! Namaste.

Disclaimer time. I ran across something on the internet which seems to fit with this thread. I don't wish to mention where I found it, for fear of endorsing a site which seems sort of hokey. But anyway, President Obama supposedly carries (or carried) four charms - an American Eagle, a Poker-Chip, the Madonna, and the Hindu Monkey God 'Hanuman'. This may be complete BS. I am looking for the primary source, which is supposedly 'The Chicago Tribune' of August 20, 2008. But could this point in the direction of Kali - in a round about way? Darned if I know. I just brainstorm and speculate - but I freely admit that this is exactly what I'm doing. I mostly ask questions - and this post is a question. Has anyone heard anything which could add to this subject? Here is a video which seems to shed light on the subject, and which references the Obama charms. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yb1ferEngXY This is all the more interesting when considering the recent presidential trip to India and Asia. Please rewatch the video series upon which this thread is based. If nothing else - this is an interesting and entertaining journey. As many of you know - I am trying to treat most of what we discuss as being nothing more than science-fiction and entertainment. I am doing my best to not take any of this fringe research too seriously. I really do think that at least 80% of it is BS. Enjoy.

Here is one of my favorite goddesses! Could this be Kali? (use full screen) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yc5OyXmHD0w&feature=related

Check this out. I have a strange fascination with black female royalty. This is a recent attraction. There is so much information to wade through - but this subject should not be neglected - especially regarding Kemet. Unfortunately, it's hard to deal with this subject without it becoming a racial issue of sorts. We are so programmed to fight with each other - rather than trying to understand and appreciate each other.

1. http://imperialafrica.net/id7.html

2. http://www.google.com/images?rlz=1T4GGIR_enUS216US217&q=queen+of+sheba+images&um=1&ie=UTF-8&source=univ&ei=sm4NTe3gLJD6sAOpqKHFAg&sa=X&oi=image_result_group&ct=title&resnum=1&ved=0CCwQsAQwAA

3. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MHoCCaUnho0&feature=related

I tend to just want to know the truth - while embracing all races (including hybrids and et's) - and then sorting things out, without anger or prejudice. It just seems as though things are purposely kept hidden, and things are deliberately kept in a destructive turmoil - with no resolution desired. I want resolution. Kali, Kemet, Anuunaki, Gizeh Intelligence, North Africa, Tibet, and Sirius - all seem to be near the top of my interest list - but not my fecal list. I don't have a fecal list - not yet, anyway.

I was tranferring a couple of posts from the 'What is Gizeh Intelligence?' thread on AV1 - when it was apparently shut-down. It seemed as if someone pulled the plug. I joked that it was probably shut-down by a Tall, Long-Nosed Grey in an Underground Base - who was sick and tired of my nonsense! Could we be dealing with the Annunaki vs Gizeh Intelligence? Or - are we really dealing with only one Solar System Super Power? Could they have created all of the mythologies, theologies, hybrids, greys, reptilians, nukes, anti-gravity craft, etc and et al? Damned if I know. I just keep marching bravely and stupidly into the unknown - waiting to get shot down.

Is there any truth to the following?

ALDEBARAN -- Human militarists of a fascist slant who have traditionally sided with the Dracos and Greys. They collaborate within a large underground facility below Egypt, the base of a secret "Kamagol-II" cult which has connections to the Bavarian Thule Society and the Montauk time-space projects. This cult is also referred to as the Gizeh empire or Gizeh Intelligence, and they are working with secret societies on earth in an effort to dissolve all national sovereignties into a global religio-eco-political order. There are also Insectoid forces involved with Aldebaran. Apparently a neo-Nazi space force may have helped to colonize that system by sending time-space forces back into the distant past to inhabit the 4th dimensional realm of one or more of its planets. These forces from the past are currently involved with the New World Order scenario, attempting to carry out their dictatorial agenda on earth from their "base" within another time-space dimension of Aldebaran (source: Preston Nicholes, and others). Here is the link to the site where I found this information: http://www.angelfire.com/ut/branton/cosmo1.html.

Here is another reference:

Alex Collier Video: 1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OW4wA55jII8. 2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ok0QDWj52mU&feature=related. Alex Collier Lecture ..A; 1995

Interaction Between Gizeh Group and Nazi Germany: The Greys made contact with a world governmental body for the first time in 1931. This was in Germany. The Greys were however turned away by the German government, because it had already committed itself to involvement with the Gizeh Intelligence. Now, I don't know if you know who Gizeh intelligence is, but I will tell you that it is a renegade group of human extraterrestrials that were headquartered under the Gizeh plateau in Egypt. They were predominantly Pleiadians at the time. Ashtar was part of that group, Kamagol was part of that group. Even Jehovah was part of that group for some time. They did their own thing. They came down here and "played God" with us, and people worshipped them as "Gods" because they had this technology. They abused their power. The Germans were, in the 1930's, building rockets and starting a space program because of their contacts with extraterrestrials - the Gizeh Intelligence.

Technology was developed and used to create weapons, because the German governmental bodies involved were concerned that there was going to be an alien invasion. The Gizeh intelligence told them that the Greys were here. However, there was not an actual invasion, per se, in progress. Weapons, such as sound devices, lasers, neutron bombs, particle beam weapons were created, although many of these were actualized later on in history. The Germans were given a lot of this technology by the Gizeh intelligence. These technologies also included free energy devices and anti-gravity technology. Tripartite Interaction: US, USSR and Britain. The United States was the first to open its doors to the alien race known as the Greys. I have been told of a contact in 1934, wherein the Greys made their presence known to the United States government in Washington State. It wasn't until 1947 that actual contact occurred with the aliens and United States officials, due to the shooting down of an alien craft in Roswell, New Mexico. This pressed the Greys into contact earlier than they had anticipated. After this crash at Roswell in 1947 the United States, the Soviet Union and the British, at the very highest levels of government, became "blood-brothers".

Now, these governments did not know what Germany was really up to at that time in history. The Germans were very very secretive about their contact with Gizeh intelligences. What was going on in Germany and what was going on between these other countries were two separate issues. The Roswell incident created more of an urgency to develop a true space program in order to defend the Earth. Again, the United States government and the Soviets thought that there was a threat due to the technologically advanced state of the aliens they had encountered. The true space program as an "underground" development that we are just now beginning to hear about. It was originally financed by members of the Club of Rome. Now, you will need to do some homework to find out who those members are, and don't be surprised at who you see. We'll talk more about that when we discuss the moon. The Greys assisted the "black government" with the building of some of the first facilities on the moon and Mars. Here is the link: http://home.wanadoo.nl/mufooz/Nwo-mc/English/The%20Greys%20And%20The%20Secret%20Government.htm.

Here is one more:

The observation leads to the conclusion that Al Gore is a top member of Gizeh intelligence. This was the reported occult backing of Adolf Hitler and his Nazi movement in Germany. Ethnically, the Mars connection of pyramid builders (Caucasian white race component of modern humanity via Atlantis, in their original form fitting the Nazi stereotype and extremely racist, the people described by contactee Elizabeth Klarer). The story is very old and very complex. In order to give a short intro, just take a look at this ancient Egyptian painting of Toth writing judgment: Toth, or Hermes Trismegistos, was born during the times of Atlantis and achieved personal immortality. A part of this was a shape-shifting ability. In the painting above, he is depicted with an animal head (ibis). Gizeh intelligence comprized around 8000 highly advanced people under the supreme leadership of shape-shifting Toth. They lived since ancient times in a network of underground cities, the main city being under Gizeh, Egypt, another site being under a location in the Grand Canyon, U.S.A. Other animal shapes reported from ancient times include a crocodile face, a lion face, etc. Toth is the fading embodiment of a fallen angel, Lucifer. In the 19th century, some of the 8000 started becoming active, such as through the Theosophical society of Madame Helena Petrovna Blavatsky. In the early 20th century, the Gizeh intelligence became active as a backer of Adolf Hitler in Germany and his Rothschild-Windsor sponsors in England. Today, all the 8000 have left their cities and are active among humanity. From this connection it is plausible that they are also the force behind the Jesuits in the Vatican and the Knights Templar before that. Reference: Books by Drunvalo Melchizedek. Contrary to myth, the Nazis won the second world war and took over the United States of America. See research by Mae Brussell, Webster G. Tarpley, Anton Chaitkin, David Emory and Greg Hallett. From this connection it is plausible that Gizeh intelligence is in control of America. My personal psychic experience is that Al Gore is a shape-shifting demonic entity from the very top of Gizeh intelligence with Assamite ability (one of the so-called „Ascended Masters” who are highly developed negative beings). The activation of the Gizeh intelligence over the past 150 years (since John D. Rockefeller, Sr.’s time) is to my mind an incidental part of the prophecy that is frequently discussed today under the caption of „2012”. The traditional Christian name for this is the Apocalypse (after the Book of Revelation, the last book of the Bible). Here is the link: http://www.cloakanddagger.de/home%20page%20items/Al_Gore_Evil.htm.

In light of the above information, please watch the following: 1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJfc63rCnWE. 2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VTe2tUW2LS8&feature=related. Do you see a pattern...or is it just me? Tell me I'm not crazy! Pretty please!! Help! I'm finding very little information on 'Gizeh Intelligence'. The above description seems to place 'them' at the center of our troubles. The views expressed above are not necessarily mine...but they seem intriquing. What is going on here?

Correct! Which is why I am looking for a plurality of sources regarding 'Gizeh Intelligence'. Collier says they are gone...but I doubt this. If they existed here historically...I would expect that they are still here. Could Gizeh Intelligence be the group wherein Lucifer resides? Are they the 'fallen angels'? Do they compose the present day Illuminati? Is David Icke speaking of Gizeh Intelligence? Has he ever mentioned this term? Did they create the greys...as well as a mythology to go along with their creation? Are they creating an army and air-force of aliens in the Deep Underground Military Base genetics labs? Will we end up fighting these creations...which we have helped to develop? Are we building the UFO's which they fly? Is most of ufology utter bs...invented mostly by Gizeh Intelligence? Do they live on the inside of our hollow earth(if it is indeed hollow) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JJU2cp1XbjQ&feature=rec-HM-rn ...and come through their tunnel system in the earth's crust...to raise heck with us? Are Pleiadians the only aliens here on earth? Are we all Pleiadians? Are the Gizeh Intelligence Pleiadian Aliens those who at some point in history, mated with reptillians? So...might there be Reptillian Pleiadians and Non-Reptillian Pleiadians...and nothing more? Are the reptillians the real bad-guys(demons)? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWR6WE4z20g&feature=related Are the off-world Pleiadians the real good-guys(angels)? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N-9xai73_n8&feature=related Are we the wild card in-between guys? It's the real nice guys who get you! I think I just became a heretic! I recant!! What? You don't believe me?! Oh, come on! I'll be good! What are you doing with that torch?

So...who the heck is Gizeh Intelligence? Do they have a Central Giza Intelligence Agency? Or how about the GIA (Gizeh Intelligence Agency)? Or might it be the CIA (Central-earth Intelligence Agency)? I actually prefer Compassion In Action! Hi guys! Is MI6...Middle-earth Intelligence 6? Is no one interested in this topic? Can someone direct me to where people might be interested in this topic? Sometimes I feel like I'm from another planet...and I wish I were kidding. Please consider all the information available so far on this thread...and give me some feed-back. If these guys are in charge...and no one knows or cares...they have been very, very sucessful. Our greed, fear, and stupidity makes it very, very easy for the bad-guys. Did Billy Meier ever mention 'Gizeh Intelligence'? There seems to be very little information available on this subject. Are the Pleiadians he interacted with...'off-world'...in other words, not residing here on earth, or interveining in human affairs, other than providing warning, inspiration, and advice? Could Gizeh Intelligence be Pleiadians who are in cahoots with reptillians and greys? Do they live in the crust of the earth...and possibly in the allegedly hollow earth? Have they interbred with the reptillians? Is this the basis of the Illuminati, and are the Illuminati actually Pleiadian/Reptillian hybrids? Are the Illuminati and Greys actually subservient pawns to the Draconian Reptillians? Are all of the above the foundation of the New World Order? Could this righly be called the Old World Disorder Alien-Theocracy? Is this really old, rather than new...and possibly thousands of years old? Are we humans...all Pleiadians?

Thank-you Karen. It's difficult for me to distill the truth from the bs. The Hyperborean reference reminded me of a passage in Frederick Nietzsche's book 'The Anti-Christ' which reads 'We are Hyperboreans'. It's been years since I read this, but that phrase stuck. I'm guessing he was referring to the Germanic people, but I don't really know for sure. The thesis of Jim Marrs' book 'Rise of the Fourth Reich' is that Nazi Fascism is alive and well in the good 'ol US of A. Seperately, the Alex Collier allegation that Gizeh Intelligence was behind Hitler and the Third Reich, would suggest that the same forces are at work today, if in fact, there is a Fourth Reich on the rise presently. Why would Gizeh Intelligence be removed without the other rascals being 86'd? The US/Gray treaties? What about the Reptilians? The whole concept of the earth's crust being laced with bases, tunnels, cities, and aliens is a very unsettling hypothesis. If there is a hollow earth with a central sun...the plot thickens, to say the least! Mind you, I don't know if any of this is true. I have been jilted in the area of traditional religion...and I believe that it is possible to be jilted in the area of ufology and conspiracy research. It's hard to simply say 'could be...but then again...might not be'. Was it Carl Sagan who said 'I don't want to believe. I want to know'? I want to know, as well. Yet I am tending to be very detached...and I have a chronic case of commitment-phobia. I tend to change my mind on a daily basis. The upside is that it's harder to hit a moving target! :

The man behind the curtain must just about die laughing at us...that sob! Perhaps it would be interesting to study the previous decade in light of the current decade. This would provide some perspective and some critique and potential validation or debunking. The current decade may be too close to focus upon...and going back futher than the previous decade may be too far. I don't know. Maybe comparing everything with everything...without latching on to anything in particular...is a good approach. But the emotional and spiritual trauma may be too much for many people. I started a thread recently titled '1990's Prophets Vindicated or Debunked?' where I looked at Bill Cooper, Alex Collier, and Bill Still. The response was pretty minimal, and focused only on Bill Cooper. The constant asking and answering of questions may be a good approach. I keep getting the feeling that no matter which way we turn we are going to encounter trouble. There seems to be no simple, easy road to utopia. If you are ignorant and guillible, you get taken. If you know too much, they're out to get you! If you're at the bottom, you're a slave. If you're at the top, you might not like the view! I don't have the answer. I'm not even sure what the question is...:sad:

I'm going to try this one more time. The response to this thread has been almost non-existant. Could the tall, long-nosed greys, who supposedly met Eisenhower...and who our government supposedly signed treaties with...have been Gizeh Intelligence, with some plastic surgery perhaps? Please, someone shoot this thread down, provide some additional sources, or substantiate and expand on this initial hypothesis. Do benevolent aliens have the green light to remove malevolent aliens...as is alleged to have occured with Gizeh Intelligence in 1978? I thought benevolent aliens were non-interventionist. We supposedly signed treaties with the tall greys...not the short greys...right? Well...do people report seeing tall greys? I'm sensing that there may be a lot of 'local' aliens with human 'help' really screwing the human race. Isn't this an important topic? You can vibrate as fast as you want...but the details of who really controls our planet...and why so many people have died in the past 100 years...may determine the destiny of the human race. If we don't get our house in order...we may be stuck in enslavement/extinction...instead of going into 4th or 5th densities. Do we have our heads stuck in the clouds...and are we too sure that we are going to 'graduate' from all the trouble here on earth? We may be in for a big surprise...

Thank-you for your responses. Gizeh Intelligence may go by other names...but the descriptions in my first post seem to fit what is going on in our world. Go through the whole first post a couple of times...including the video clips...and see if you can see a startling pattern emerging. The whole Nazi/Hitler/Illuminati/Military Industrial Complex/New World Order/Fascist/Enslavement/Extermination/International Banking thing really has me spooked...as it seems to be a global phenomenon which can convincingly be traced for nearly 100 years...right up to 2009. Everything we have seen and experienced thus far may just be practice for the main event. I don't even want to think about what that might be. Check out EVERYTHING on YouTube or Google Video on Jim Marrs, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GT_z-B1uLdk Joseph Ferrell, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_2j-8CI9Hyw and Bill Cooper https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=App2uRxZ4Iw ...for starters. The dots should start connecting...with a very disturbing picture emerging. Please give this some serious thought. The truth may set us free...but it's sure scaring the heck out of me!

I don't have anything in particular against Forrest Gore...but life is like a Google search...you never know what you're gonna get! However, it might be wise to look closely at the Vice Presidents of the past 60 years...and how they were selected. Were they who the President really wanted? I'm simply interested in how corruptible the top jobs in our country are. Is our political system a glorified 'The Price is Right' show? Who's the host? Who's the parasite? Are we the suckers?

Dr. Earlyne Chaney, in an article titled 'ODYSSEY INTO EGYPT', in her occult-oriented magazine VOICE OF ASTARA (May, 1982) tells of a discovery she and researcher Bill Cox was shown in Egypt. These were two tunnels, neither of which had been fully explored. One was in the temple of Edfu between Luxor and Cairo in the ruins of El Tuna Gabel; and the other near Zozer's Step Pyramid at Cairo near Memphis-Saqqarah, within the tomb of the Bull, called "Serapium". The Egyptian government sealed both tunnels because of fears of certain archaeologists who alleged that they "lead too deeply down into the depths of the earth," and because they found the earth to be "honeycombed with passages leading off into other depths," and the possibility of explorers becoming lost. If such labyrinths do exist, then it may explain one story which alleged that men dressed like "ancient Egyptians" have been seen deep in unexplored tunnels near Cairo, as well as possible confirmation of the story which appeared in Nevada Aerial Research's 'LEADING EDGE' Publication to the effect that the U.S.(?) Government secretly maintains a huge base within a cavern of tremendous size (several miles in diameter) beneath the desert sands of Egypt. Could this tie in with the vaque references to a subterranean society(s) referred to by certain people 'in the know' which is/are known as the 'Phoenix Empire' and/or the 'Gizeh People'?

How many factions of humans/aliens are there in this solar system? I think that it is important to know who all of the major players are throughout the solar system...what their track records are...and what their intentions for the future are. Ignorance may be bliss...but it could also be deadly. To me...there should be no secrets regarding all of the above.

If Hitler was interacting with Giza Intelligence (is it Giza or Gizeh?)...this is something which should be examined very carefully. Why is there so little information on this subject? Supposedly they broke off interaction with Hitler in 1941 and were driven off planet in 1979. Does this have something to do with the Dulce Wars? Is this when the military industrial complex and the secret human government really lost control of the alien situation...or were they never in control? Did Giza Intelligence simply move voluntarily to the Dark Side of the Moon? Is this the Capitol of the Solar System? Is there a Vatican Connection? Is Lucifer the head of Giza Intelligence? Do they still have a presence in North Africa?

The Secret Space Program. The Deep Underground Military Bases. The City-States. The Reptilians and Greys. Lucifer. Who Owns and Operates the Solar System? These are the key words and phrases. All of the secrecy should end...and the Solar System should be based upon Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom with an uncorrupted form of the U.S. Constitution and Bill of Rights, which is adapted to incorporate 100's of states throughout the Solar System.

Gizeh Intelligence may be at the center of all of the above. What do you think?

I know that dealing with this subject is playing with fire. I don't know what the stakes really are. If I did...I'd probably just play video games. I just don't want malevolent humans or aliens to play god in this part of the universe...and engage in genocide, atrocity, or enslavement. Bad-guys need secrecy a lot more than good-guys.

Perhaps I could return to the subject of the thread by saying that all of this stuff is interconnected. Compartmentalizing what we discuss may be a mistake. Thinking about the Secret Space Program while watching a motorcycle race may unlock new insights. I'm not kidding. I call this Contextual Superimposition...and related to the Eureka Phenomenon. The military industrial complex has a huge presence in Southern California. Just ask John Lear. California...in general...is hugely important regarding the subject of aliens and ufo's. I guess that North Africa and the Southwestern United States are two of the most interesting areas to me...at this time...other than the Dark Side of the Moon.

Richard Hoagland states that the three main factions within NASA are 1. The Masons 2. The NAZI's 3. The Magicians (Occultists?). My question is...which of these three factions is most closely associated with Giza Intelligence? Or are all of the seemingly different factions simply different facets of the same diamond? There has to be a supreme council headed by a supreme leader...which oversees all of the madness. I suspect that this leader is Lucifer. Again...did Giza Intelligence move their headquarters from North Africa to the Dark Side of the Moon in 1979 (or shortly thereafter)?

Actually...I think the underground bases, leviton trains, secret space program, etc...is kinda cool...but all of this should not be secret...and should not be under malevolent reptilian control. We the People of Earth should control all of this very, very expensive activity. We're paying for it...aren't we? We the People should be invited to the party. It should be 'Our Party'...so to speak.

Again...I don't know if any of this is true. I'm simply exploring different lines of possibility and probability. The Vatican, the Pentagon, the NSA, the CIA, etc, etc...all keep forgetting to brief me on what's REALLY going on! I am NOT a potted-plant!

Thank-you James. The links were fascinating. I will have to start following your posts more closely. I haven't been...and I don't know why. No reason at all. I guess I just got in a rut.

Thank-you Tango. A remote viewer brought 'The Roswell Conception' idea to me a few weeks ago.

Was (is?) Omnipotent Highness KRLLL really Lucifer?
Could Giza Intelligence be a relatively benevolent faction of humans, greys, and reptilians? Are they fighting more malevolent factions of humans, greys, and reptilians? I'm sensing a very dark and complex power struggle...with lots of collateral damage. Are the various factions really different shades of black? Disclosure could be unbelievably complex. Are there good Masons? Are there good NAZI's? Are there good Occultists? Are there good Popes? Are there good Illuminati? Are there good Zionists? Are there good Reptilians? Are there good Greys? What were the World Wars REALLY all about? Did WWII really end? Is it still raging (over our heads, beneath our feet, and invisibly all around us...and even in us)?

I'm sensing that we are discussing the tip of the iceberg. We may be picking a scab which covers a very ugly and grotesque wound. We may not like what we see when 'Disclosure' fully occurs. I'm thinking that we may have to become very unhappy and disillusioned before we can really begin to build a better world and solar system. Keep digging...but don't be surprised if you don't like what you find. Abandon all hope ye who enter Avalon. Just kidding...or am I?

What if Earth (and the Solar System) was colonized millions of years ago by Humans (rather than having evolved here on Earth, at least)...who brought all of the fancy technology with them (including antigravity, nuclear weapons, holographic, free energy, etc). Could we Earth Humans really be Humans from Sirius? Sirius is the All Seeing Eye at the Top of the Pyramid. Sirius is at the center of EVERYTHING.

What if we Humans can exist both physically and spiritually...and simply get recycled here on Earth (and the Solar System)? What if a faction of Humans hoarded the technology, dumbed the rest of the Humans down genetically and educationally. What if all of the religions are manmade? What if all of the alien races are either made up...or have been genetically created by Humans? What if a faction of Human Beings is behind all of this? Could this be Gizeh (Giza) Intelligence? I've asked this sort of thing before...and I live in perpetual uncertainty. This uncertainty is taking a toll. I'm just asking at least some of you to think through what a completely Human Earth scenario would look like. Imagine being part of a faction of Humans...living throughout the Solar System...and deceiving 99% of the other Humans. How would you pull it off...century after century? We have to consider all possibilities...don't we?

I know Humans exist. I know Spirits exist. I know UFO's are real. I know we are in HUGE trouble. Beyond that...I don't really know a damn thing. I'm getting everything second, third, fourth, and fifth hand. Many of us have open minds regarding Aliens, UFO's, time-travel, etc, etc...but what about being open-minded about the possibility that all of this phenomenon is Human? Could the supposed Roswell future Humans really be the elite underground Humans called Giza Intelligence? Bill Cooper was perplexed by the 'Alien Presence' and wondered if it could be a completely homegrown phenomenon.

I just noticed the view-count of this thread. It's over 3,000...yet there aren't very many comments. What's going on here? Somebody help me out here. I'm feeling very small, stupid, and helpless. I'm in way over my head thinking about this stuff. I need to stop. Could the superimposed parallel universes simply be 1. The elite members of Giza Intelligence (1% of the Human Race?). 2. The rest of us peons (99% of the Human Race?). Who knows? Oh...I forgot...the Shadow Government knows. Gotta go. Someone's pounding on my front-door...

A special note to Gizeh Intelligence: If what I have said in the previous post is correct...all I ask at this point...is that all extermination and enslavement scenarios be conclusively terminated. Just join the rest of the human race. I request that all factions throughout the solar system reconcile and join together under the authority of the U.S. Constitution and Bill of Rights. This sad chapter of universal history can have a happy ending...and a new beginning. Namaste.YouTube - 2001 A Space Odyssey Opening

I'm feeling really close to the truth...yet really far away. I'm thinking that Sirius is at the center of everything...yet I'm not sure exactly how.

Could it be that the God of This World is a Draconian-possessed androgynous black human alien from Sirius who heads Giza Intelligence, the Secret Space Program, and the Deep Underground Military Bases...and who is the real Black Pope? Could the Ark of the Covenant be the UFO which brought us here from Sirius along with technology obtained from Draconian-demons in exchange for allowing the Draconians to possess the elite-humans? Is this solar system really part of the Siran solar system? Is our sun really Sirius C? Is the ancient depiction of three suns really Sirius A, Sirius B, and Sirius C? Are the tall greys from Sirius, really just human beings? Did we all come from Sirius? Is there a stargate between this solar system and Sirius? Is all of the cr@p we have been in for millions of years really a Sirian civil war? Are we all different factions of Sirians? Would my pet project of The United States of the Solar System really have to apply to Sirius as well? Is Sirius the All Seeing Eye at the top of the pyramid? Is Sunday really Sun God Day? Is this sun really Sirius? Is the Roman Catholic Church all about Sirius? Are the Masons all about Sirius? Are the occultists all about Sirius? Is the layout of Washington D.C. all about Sirius? Is the Sirian Theocratic System really the Universal Church aka The Holy Roman Empire aka the New World Order?

How answerest thou...SaLuSa?

I tend to agree TRANCOSO. I just wonder if it's possible to remove the Draco part of the unholy trinity you mentioned? Are the Draconians really demons who are usually invisible...but who can manifest themselves in reptilian/grey form? Are the Sirians we are dealing with really human beings? When the Vatican referred to extraterrestrials as our brothers...perhaps they meant this literally. Are the Nazis, Masons, Vatican, City of London...and most of the people we love to hate...really pawns? Would an exorcism of the Sirius system as well as our solar system be necessary to rid us of most of our problems? If so...what would make this possible? Is it even possible? Has a significant faction of humanity been dealing with the devil? How expensive would this divorce be?

I have no hatred in asking these questions. I'm treating this like a science fiction mystery novel. I realize that if even 5% of it is true that we are in very deep trouble. I'm thinking that Sirius A, B, and C need to be completely divorced from Draco...and that Sirius A, B, and C need to completely reconcile under the U.S. Constitution and Bill of Rights...and completely expose all of the dark secrets, horrific wars, and deals with the devil. I just want the BS to stop. Hope springs eternal. Conduit closing.

I completely agree TRANCOSO. They have to use Secrecy and Deception to pull-off their agenda. That is Not a good sign. I think we have a chance to properly handle this BS...but that the window of opportunity is very small. The consequences of getting this wrong are enormous...I think. We seem to be like an abused spouse who believes the promise that it will be different this time. How many times do we have to get beat-up before we wake-up and get a cosmic divorce and a universal restraining order? If we keep going back for more...there is probably very little the benevolent forces throughout the universe can do for us.

I keep wondering about the distinction between supposed 'native' reptilians and the alleged 'Draconian' reptilians. Perhaps the 'native' reptilians are not really a huge problem. They seem to be more physical than supernatural. Perhaps greys are a type of 'native' reptilian. I don't know. But it does seem that there are 'non-native' reptilians which seem to be more supernatural than physical. These Draconian reptilians seem to be very evil, smart, and dangerous. Perhaps these Draconians can manifest as reptilians or hijack the native reptilians (and greys?) to do their bidding...or at least blame them for all the trouble. The greys with two brains (one which is computerized?) seem to just be robots. Do the Draconians sometimes (or always?) possess these greys? The Draconians seem to need physicality. Why is this? Why do they possess people?

We are told that we need to ascend beyond physicality. I don't buy this at all. We are also told that we will be taken to better places with spaceships and stargates. Are we sure we would really go to 'better' places? It sounds like they want our bodies and our planet. It sounds like they want to rule over us as Gods. I want to keep my body. I want to keep my planet. I want Constitutional Responsible Freedom. I want the Draconians to go to hell...and leave us alone.

Giza Intelligence is supposedly connected with Aldebaran...but I am considering the possibility that they are connected with Sirius. I haven't decided if they are with the Draconians...or against them. It sounds like they are with them...and even possessed by them. I really don't know. It just sounds like our solar system and the Sirian solar system are linked...and that we are dealing with a human phenomenon(Sirian humans and Earth humans)...with the exception of the Draconians...and perhaps some native reptilians and greys(native to both Sirius and Earth). Again...I don't know. Help somebody.

I'm simply suspecting huge doses of BS everywhere...especially from ET's who are oh so superior to us stupid mortals...and are here to help us evolve...by abducting us, experimenting on us, terrorizing us, and dictating to us...whether we like it or not. BS!!!!!

!!!!!!!!!!!! BETTER DEAD THAN REP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!SOLAR SYSTEM EXORCISM!!!!!!!!!!!

Here is something of interest regarding Aldebaran from Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aldebaran Notice especially the section on the Gnostic Neo-Nazis.

Ancient cultures
The name Aldebaran comes from the Arabic (الدبران al-dabarān) meaning "the follower" and refers to the way the star follows the Pleiades star cluster in its nightly journey across the sky. In Persia it was known as Sadvis and Kugard.[7] The Romans called it Palilicium, and it is known as 畢宿五 (Bìxiùwŭ, the Fifth Star of the Net) in Chinese. Aldebaran is identified as the lunar mansion Rohini in Hindu astronomy and as one of the twenty-seven daughters of Daksha and the wife of the god Chandra.

Gnostic Neo-Nazis
An esoteric neo-Nazi sect headquartered in Vienna, Austria called the Tempelhofgesellschaft, founded in the early 1990s, teaches a form of Gnosticism called Marcionism[citation needed]. They distribute pamphlets claiming that the Aryan race originally came to Atlantis from the star Aldebaran (this information is supposedly based on "ancient Sumerian manuscripts"). They maintain that the Aryans from Aldebaran derive their power from the vril energy of the Black Sun. They teach that since the Aryan race is of extraterrestrial origin it has a divine mission to dominate all the other races. It is believed by adherents of this religion that an enormous space fleet is on its way to Earth from Aldebaran which, when it arrives, will join forces with the Nazi Flying Saucers from Antarctica to establish the Western Imperium. [8]

Inuit culture
In Inuit astronomy, Aldebaran is called "Spirit of a Polar Bear".

Italian witchcraft
In the religion of Stregheria, Aldebaran is a fallen angel and quarter guardian of the eastern gate.

Literature
Aldebaran is referred to in Edmund Spenser's The Faerie Queene (1590), book one, canto three, stanza 16:

Now when Aldeboran was mounted hye
Aboue the shinie Cassiopeia chaire (I.III.16.1-2)
In American horror writer H. P. Lovecraft's Cthulhu Mythos, Hastur resides in the Hyades cluster, and is signified by Aldebaran being above the horizon. When Aldebaran is visible, Hastur's eye is said to be upon all it oversees.

Mexican culture
For the Seris of northwestern Mexico, this star is providing light for the seven women giving birth (Pleiades). It has three different names: Hant Caalajc Ipápjö, Queeto, and Azoj Yeen oo Caap ("star that goes ahead"). The lunar month corresponding to October is called Queeto yaao "Aldebaran's path".[9]

Native American culture
For the Dakotas (a branch of the Native American Sioux tribe), Aldebaran took on a heroic aspect. The young star was the child of the sun and the lady Blue Star. One day, he desired to hunt the white buffalo (the Pleiades). After he pulled up a sapling to make a spear, a hole was made in the ground and he could see all the people of Earth down below. The white buffalo took this chance to push him through. He was found by an old woman and was to be known as Old Woman's Grandson. On Earth, he killed many strange monsters that had been troubling the Native Americans; one monster of which was a serpent that caused drought. The young hero killed the serpent, releasing a great stream of water that became the Mississippi River. In time, Old Woman's Grandson remembered the white buffalo and returned to hunting him in the sky to fulfill his destiny.

Music
Reference to Aldebaran appears in the The Rolling Stones song "2000 light years from home" from the 1967 psychedelic rock album Their Satanic Majesties Request. The Welsh-born Dark Ambient musician Brian Williams (Lustmord) has a track entitled Aldebaran of the Hyades on his 1994 album The Place where the Black Stars Hang. Enya included a song named Alderbaran on her first album, Enya (later re-released as The Celts). Austrian musician B. Fleischmann includes a song called "Aldebaran Waltz" in his 2006 album, The Humbucking Coil.

Aldebaran is also the title of a song by Essra Mohawk, and is included on her album "Revelations Of The Secret Diva".

Thank-you no caste. I did see the other post. What if what we are really dealing with is Draconian Demon Possessed or Controlled Humans vs Pleiadian Angelic Assisted Humans? What if all of the physical ET's who are here are really Human Beings? Would this violate the non-intervention rule? Are native Reptilians and Greys being forced to do the bidding of the Draconians? Are the Greys who are doing the abductions, etc...really clones, robots, or PLF's? Will the native Reptilians and Greys be used as scapegoats by the Draconian Cabal?

I'm presently seeing Draco > Aldebaran > Sirius B > Earth (Giza Intelligence, Vatican, Nazis, Masons, Illuminati, Occultists, City of London, United Nations, Washington D.C., Deep Underground Military Bases, Secret Space Program) = Military/Industrial/Financial/Draconian Theocracy. This is not exactly a happy-go-lucky, live and let live, group of humans and extraterrestrials (in spirit form?)...to say the least! I suspect that this is where all the drug money...tax money...war blood money...bankster bail-out money...missing trillions from the defense budget, etc...really goes. Negative Karma to the nth degree is being generated daily. Judgement Day will not be pretty or pleasant. Crime does not pay on Judgement Day. Getting nervous guys? It won't be long now. The Horror.

The fun never ends...does it?

That figure at the 1984 Olympics looks like one of our Draconian Masters...looking down on us stupid mortals...like a Gargoyle on a Cathedral.

Here is something relevant to this thread that I posted on another thread:

The Aldebarans are supposedly renegade Pleiadians. Did they thumb their noses at the Pleiadian Powers That Be...and make deals with the Devil aka Draconians...to obtain Technology and Spiritual Power? Was the Pleiades really Heaven? Was the Person In Charge really God. Was Lucifer a Pleiadian who tried to get a better deal by dealing with the Dracs? Did this result in the famous War in Heaven? Did Lucifer drag one third of the Pleiadians to Aldebaran...then to Sirius...and finally to Earth? Are we all Fallen Angels? Is this why Lucifer is the God of This World? Some say Lucifer is no more...but I doubt this. Is Aldebaran still renegade Pleiadian presently? Is Sirius A and Arcturus completely unfallen Pleiadian presently? Is Sirius B and Earth in Sirius trouble? Is a final battle brewing to settle this thing once and for all?

Or...is the whole Universe under Draconian control...including the Pleiades? Did the God in the Pleiades keep this a secret to make a bad situation seem like Heaven? Did Lucifer smell a rat...and try to fight fire with fire...hoping to get technology and spirituality from the Dracs...and then turn on them? Could the final phase of this be happening presently? Is that what's brewing? Is this 'The Great Work'? Are Sirius B and Earth engaged in a rebellion against the Dracs which must be crushed? Will the Empire strike back? Does Sirius B and our Sun contain Planets in Rebellion? Do they threaten the Draconian Universal Church Theocracy? Did Lucifer mean well...but did he or she bite off more than they could chew...and go insane? I keep thinking that Lucifer is like Colonel Kurz in 'Apocalypse Now'. If Constitutional Responsible Freedom really catches fire...will this be the end of Draconian Universal Domination? I really and truly don't know. All of the above could be complete BS.

I don't know who the good-guys and who the bad-guys are anymore. Do you?



Take another look at the details of my previous couple of posts. If the whole universe was Drac-controlled...and this was being hidden from you...but you figured it out. How would you fight the tyranny being effected through your beloved leader? Would you confront your leader publicly while privately dealing with the Dracs to try to get their technology and spirituality? You'd end up fighting both your beloved leader and his loyal (and clueless?) followers...plus when you double-crossed the Dracs...you'd have to fight them as well. Did Lucifer and his(her?) followers get kicked out of Heaven...and then get involved in a horrific fight with the Dracs? Was this the 600,000 year Gaian-Orion War? Supposedly no one won...they just stopped killing each other. Did a sort of 'cold-war' follow? Is this the situation we find ourselves in presently? Is this why everything is so $crewed-up? Is the New World Order a Draconian attempt to completely regain domination over humanity? Is this how much trouble we are really in...or is it much worse? I suspect that it is. Is Lucifer insane because of the hopelessness of the situation? Are all of us Renegade Pleiadians?

I continue to believe that Constitutional Responsible Freedom would be in everyone's best interest...including the Pleiadians and Dracs. The God thing really doesn't work. I suspect that Lucifer found this out the hard way. Humanity is waking up to this very harsh reality as well. If what I am thinking is true...the Pleiadian God was wrong. Lucifer was wrong. And the Draconians were (and are) wrong. Two new commandments I give unto all of you: I. Thou Shalt Have No Gods. Period. II. Thou Shalt Not Be An @sshole. Period. I really don't want to fight with the Dracs. I can't believe that there is no possibility of them warming to the idea of Responsible Freedom. I don't know what made them so mean...but perhaps there is a legitimate reason. Regardless...why not base the Universe on the best principles...rather than on brute-force? Why is this so hard? Lord Draco...we need to talk. Soon. In the meantime...you're a warrior Lord Draco...so you might like this video. But really...Lord Draco...isn't war and killing really, really stupid? Isn't this video insane? I think it is. We can do better than this...can't we Lord Draco? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZpvLCptAHT8&feature=related

Here is a bit of a restatement of questions which I have previously asked:

Are we really dealing with the following? Draconian-Pleiadian-Annunaki Theocracy vs Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom

How would Giza Intelligence fit in with the above? Is Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom a grave threat to the Universal Church? Is Earth a Planet in Rebellion against the Draconian-Pleiadian-Annunaki Theocracy aka Universal Church? Will the Empire Strike Back to crush this rebellion? Does might trump right? We might not have to wait long to find out. Something seems to be brewing. Hmmmmmm.

I continue to be mystified by the 4,000+ views of this thread...combined with very few comments (other than my own). Does this indicate that Giza Intelligence is key to all of the mysteries we discuss on this site? I just want all of us to get informed about who we really are...and what's really going on...without becoming angry or going crazy. Obviously...I want a sovereign and free humanity...especially in this solar system. I certainly hope this is a possible possibility.
I'm leaning toward a hypothesis that the original creation is a mystery...which is probably a combination of evolution and intelligent design. I see evidence of this everywhere. What I don't see is an All Powerful, All Knowing, All Loving, and All Present Creator God of the Universe running this solar system. I'm seeing something quite sinister.

I don't think the Annunaki, Pleiadians, or Dracs created us. They may have done some genetic engineering (mostly dumbing us down to control us).

I'm seeing a cabal of Annunaki, Pleiadians, and Dracs playing god. Could this have been what Lucifer rebelled against in the Pleiades? Did war in heaven result? Did Lucifer and a third of the Pleiadians get kicked out of heaven? Did Lucifer then try to play god in Aldebaran with a third of the angels? Did this apostasy spread to Sirius and Earth...among other places? Are we all part of the third of the angels? Did Lucifer try to fight a wrong with a wrong? We know that two wrongs don't make a right. Did Lucifer go insane? Is the whole concept of theocracy the real root problem? Should the Ten Commandments be replaced by the Two Commandments?

I. Thou Shalt Have No Gods.
II. Thou Shalt Not Be An @$$hole.

I think so.

I really don't wish to demonize or destroy anyone. I just want the bs to stop.

Here is a comment which I posted on another thread which is relevant to this thread:

I have a fascination regarding cathedrals and pipe-organs. The whole temple and worship concept goes way back into antiquity. Lucifer was supposedly the chief musician in 'heaven'. If 'heaven' is really the Pleiades...perhaps there were cathedrals and pipe organs in the Pleiades...and Lucifer brought the whole theological concept...including temples, cathedrals, pipe-organs, and worship...from the Pleiades to Aldebaran...then to Sirius...and finally to Earth. As above...so below. I guess I'm seeing two rival 'gods' leading a civil war. Are the Annunaki and Dracs mercenary interdimensional warriors and laborers? Was the Pleiadian 'god' instrumental in the destruction of Atlantis? Did the Luciferian 'god' take the Atlantian civilization underground? Is this Giza Intelligence? Are there underground mansions, cathedrals, libraries, and museums...combined with military bases and stargate temples? Does Lucifer (or equivalent) possess the ability to end most life on Earth through 'Earth Changes'? Is alien technology really ancient Pleiadian technology? I'm beginning to think so. The exact composition and motivations of the various secret factions are obviously unknown. My guess is that there may be three major factions...two theocratic (one Pleiadian and one Aldebaran Luciferian)...and one namaste constitutional responsible freedom faction.

Hitler may very well have been a regular visitor to this underground or inner Earth realm. This may also be true for the Popes. I don't know. This is all just wild speculation. But studying the Nazi phenomenon may be the real window into what is going on.

When Henry Kissenger was learning about the 'alien presence' he worked night and day...and wouldn't communicate with anyone...not even his wife. What he was learning must have been devastating. It couldn't have been good. Notice that certain key people, such as Henry Kissinger and Zbigniew Brzezinski (both Jason Scholar study directors)...who presumably know the complete story...quietly direct the Presidents...administration after administration. The Presidents presumably do not know the complete story...with the possible exception of George H.W. Bush.

Once again...I just want the secrecy to end...I want all hard core regressive beings (human and non-human) to leave this solar system...and I want the solar system to be based upon namaste constitutional responsible freedom. That should correct most of the major ills...regardless of who is presently running things or which et's are good or bad. If this works...other star systems might try doing this as well. Is this too much to ask?

Comment by eleni: Is it not possible the reptoids have been demonized and the real malevolent factors are just the PTB and are not controlled by ET's (or original species as the reptoids supposed look at their-selves as such) but by dark forces they tap into via ritual magic and have nothing at all to do with off planet species?

CommentHere is another comment which I posted on another thread, but which is relevant to this thread:
by Seashore: I think it's that they are outnumbered. I'll throw this in: Stewart Swerdlow said in Blue Blood, True Blood that most human civilizations that exist elsewhere are totalitarian by necessity because of the constant Reptilian threat.

My Response: Are we in the middle of a civil war involving two rival Human Gods...one Pleiadian and one Aldebaran Luciferian? http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=11123&highlight=giza+intelligence This would mean two rival Theocracies. Do both sides do business with Interdimensional Reptilians...or is it just the Aldebaran Luciferian side? Do the Interdimensional Reptilians wish for this Human Civil War to result in the extermination of every man, woman, and child on Earth? Do they have to make us destroy ourselves? Are they unable to destroy us directly?

I have received the following internet messages saying 'Try not to think in terms of good or bad. Understand this is not your planet. Then, understand nothing can be done to you that you don't do to yourself. Know that there are quadrillions of planets and they don't have a massive climate change every 26,000 years and violent deranged people like yourselves. Why on Earth would any race want to live here with you knowingly? The most intelligent life on the planet is not human.' And 'You can't rule yourselves'. And 'We're in your back'. And 'Y'all love fantisizing over my ancestral decorations, places, spirituality that you don't get, the greatness you won't achieve, and the melanin you'll never have. This depiction of my ancestors is pathetic. Y'all always make them look just as degenerative and recessive as you. Anyway, play and have fun as much as you still can. Yes you are running out of time, and to be honest, there is absolutly nothing you can do about it. I have no mercy, you lie and mock and blasphem all the way to hell.' And 'You know this isn't funny! The Lord God will judge you for claiming God ship. Just because God showed you a little bit of His secrets you think you know everything. He will NOT have mercy on you!'

These comments did not sound human. Imagine them being spoken by the human/alien in the fourth video below. Also imagine the words spoken by Leo (in the 3rd video) as being spoken in the context of the 4th video. Could this be representative of one of the two Human Gods?

It seems to me that both rival Human Gods are wrong. Theocracy is always wrong. http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=15014 Tyranny is always wrong. Could both Human Gods have been deceived by the Interdimensional Reptilians? I don't know. It further seems to me that Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=15878 is a way to get the rival Human Gods to stop fighting...and to make the Interdimensional Reptilians leave the Pleiades, Aldebaran, Sirius, Our Solar System...and who knows where else? Are the Teachings of Jesus, the U.S. Constitution, and the Bill of Rights representative of this third non-theocratic way? Is this the Andromedan perspective which Alex Collier speaks of? Please rewatch his videos with this post in mind. Please forgive me for posting these videos one more time. I just think they are helpful in connecting the dots connected with these subjects. Some things need to be repeated over and over before they are grasped.YouTube - ABC's 'V' - Upfront Trailer - with Elizabeth Mitchell - 3rd November 2009YouTube - The Temptation of Jesus by the Devil in the WildernessYouTube - Leo Zagami the 2012 ArmageddonYouTube - Ra Stargate - Devil Came To Me

I know that Human Beings exist. I know that Spirits exist. I know that UFO's are real. I know that we are in huge trouble. Other than that...I don't have privileged inside information. HJ...Do you have evidence or inside information?

I'm just dealing in possibilities and probabilities...and treating all of this as science fiction...which just might be true.

Could we be dealing with a perfect storm of a combined war of the races...war of the sexes...and war of the gods? I caught a glimpse of something the other day...that just about floored me. I don't wish to be specific. It's too explosive.

Annunaki, Draconian, Pigmented, Non-Pigmented, Male, Female, Theocratic, Non-Theocratic, Human, Non-Human, Physical, Non-Physical. Just think about various combinations and conflicts regarding these words. This is not an exhaustive list either. There may be huge seemingly irreconcilable differences among various factions throughout the universe.

But once again...why can't this hypothetical mess be addressed in the context of Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom in the context of the U.S. Constitution and Bill of Rights in the context of the United Nations? I don't wish for any group to be misused or abused...or done away with. Could future U.N. sessions look like the Star Wars Bar?

I found this in Wikipedia. Could this have something to do with that which is brewing?

Gnostic Neo-Nazis http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aldebaran
An esoteric neo-Nazi sect headquartered in Vienna, Austria called the Tempelhofgesellschaft, founded in the early 1990s, teaches a form of Gnosticism called Marcionism[citation needed]. They distribute pamphlets claiming that the Aryan race originally came to Atlantis from the star Aldebaran (this information is supposedly based on "ancient Sumerian manuscripts"). They maintain that the Aryans from Aldebaran derive their power from the vril energy of the Black Sun. They teach that since the Aryan race is of extraterrestrial origin it has a divine mission to dominate all the other races. It is believed by adherents of this religion that an enormous space fleet is on its way to Earth from Aldebaran which, when it arrives, will join forces with the Nazi Flying Saucers from Antarctica to establish the Western Imperium. [8]

Thank-you eleni and TRANCOSO. I am researching the links presently...along with that Patricia Cori interview. Sometimes I think that I just want to ask questions and speculate...rather than seriously research...and find unexpected answers that throw me for a loop...and make me eat crow! On the other hand...I think that intuitive inquisitiveness has it's place with subjects as bizzare as this one! I am definitely out of my element...and in over my head...regarding the major secret power factions in this solar system. I feel very uncomfortable thinking about this subject. I know that this is playing with fire...and I am prepared to stop...and proceed in a different direction. There's a reason why some people have Q Clearances or Cosmic Clearances...and why others, such as myself, are lucky to get a passport. Anyway, I hope this thread is doing more good than harm.

Could this link have something to do with Giza Intelligence? http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=16588&page=21

Four Factions in the Solar System?

1. Human Pleiadians (Pigmented God the Father/Mother Theocracy)

2. Human Aldebarans (Nazi Aryan/Luciferian Theocracy)

3. Human Andromedans (Christlike Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom)

4. Reptilian Draconians and Annunaki (Dominating Factions #1 and #2)

Solution: Exorcise Faction #4 from the Solar System...and unite Factions #1 and #2 under Christlike Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom.

Usual disclaimer: All of the above may be total bs.

The bottom line is that I just want things to work out well for all factions and all individuals. Namaste to All.

Here is another version of the previous post. I'm just stumbling through this...and probably into a heap of trouble.

I'm still trying to think through three major hypothetical factions. Richard Hoagland speaks of the Nazis, Masons, and Magicians within NASA. I would guess that they represent the major players in the Solar System. There are supposedly three major factions in three major underground (under ice?) bases under one of the polar icecaps (can't remember which). A third of the 'angels' were kicked out of 'heaven'. Is this reference indicitive of three Pleiadian factions? One Pleiadian/PTB faction? One Pleiadian/Luciferian faction? One Pleiadian faction who chose not to participate in the 'War in Heaven'? I'm thinking that the Pleiades, Aldebaran, and Andromeda are key to understanding these three hypothetical factions. Could the 'Trilateral Commission' be so named because of the three major hypothetical factions? Are the following groupings somewhat accurate? However the groupings are arranged...I'm becoming more certain that we have three major players (four if we include the Interdimensional Reptilians). The first two factions are extremely dangerous...and the third faction is the least powerful (but has the solution to the sad state of affairs). Just speculation, of course.

1. Pleiades/Humans/Draconians/Sirius-A/Annunaki/Nibiru(Sirius-C?)/Mars/Lemuria/Zionism/Magicians/Vatican/Illuminati.
2. Aldebaran/Humans/Draconians/Radical-Luciferian/Sirius-B/Venus/Earth's-Moon/Teutonic-Zionism/Nazis/Giza-Intelligence/Bavarian-Illuminati.
3. Pleiades/Andromeda/Arcturus/Moderate-Luciferian/Masons/US-Constitution/Responsible-Freedom/Less Draconian Involvement (but still some).

The existence of each of these hypothetical factions may be completely justified from a historical perspective...and I'm sure they all have their sad-stories and horror-stories. But can't we do better than this in modernity? Why can't these three factions (if they exist as described) unite under Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom...in the context of the U.S. Constitution and Bill of Rights...in the context of the United Nations...and applied to the entire Solar System? They could continue to address all grievances via Constructive Competition in an Open Court. A Solar System Exorcism would undoubtedly be necessary to make this proposal a reality. The Universal Super Powers That Be would undoubtedly have to agree to allow this to occur...or it would be a non-starter.

Why does this have to be so hard?

[quote=Luminari;185939][/quote]

Orion the Hunter is holding and looking at Aldebaran. Is this correct? Is this significant? Where is Orion the Hunter from? Where is he going? Is it significant that M42 is part of the sword? Sirius is supposedly the All Seeing Eye at the top of the pyramid. Or is the eye simply illuminated by Sirius. Or is Sirius 'illuminated' by Aldebaran? Sirius is located by one of Orion's feet. Does this represent a hierarchy? 'As above...so below'? Aldebaran>Sirius B>Giza Intelligence? Are the Andromedans a moderate faction of Giza Intelligence?

Here is another piece of the puzzle: http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/gaiaguys/AYTF-Giza.htm

Thank-you No caste. The mythology surrounding the various factions seems to be mostly traditional and arbitrary. I'm mainly interested in who the major hidden groups are...and what can be done to prevent Armageddon, the Seven Last Plagues, Earth-Changes, Theocracy, Tyranny, the New World Order, Extermination, Enslavement, etc.

Does anyone have insights regarding the major hidden factions in our solar system? I've suggested some possibilities...but I don't really know. I smell smoke...and I'm sure there's fire. I'm suspecting that the power centers of these hypothetical factions are in underground bases here and on the moon.

Why can't the various factions reconcile...reveal everything to the public...and then just rejoin the human race? Why does all of this have to be so dark and creepy? Can't we just move forward as a united and free human race? I feel like I only know .01% of what's really going on.

I'm sure these hidden factions (if they exist) are very advanced technologically and intellectually...but I suspect that, with the exception of one of the groups, that their spirituality is very dark and powerful. But what do I know? Too much? Too little? Probably both.

Were Giza Intelligence the real 'Raiders of the Lost Ark'? Were the World Wars really Zionism vs Teutonic Zionism? Was Indiana Jones an Andromedan Sympathizer?YouTube- Raiders of the Lost Ark - Theatrical TrailerYouTube- Teutonic Zionism

Which of the factions do you suppose was responsible for 9/11 no caste? Did ET phone Rome...and call 911? Your last two comments were fascinating! What shall we talk about? 9/11? Artifacts? Freudian debris? Strands of DNA? The origin of 'V' species? Which reminds me of the incident in Paris involving Dr. Claudie Haignere...her overdose and lab fire. One source suggested that she was doing DNA research which might have involved aliens. She supposedly exclaimed 'The World Must Be Warned!' 1. http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=9394&highlight=claudie+haignere 2. http://www.pasteur.fr/recherche/genopole/03genopole_en.html 3. http://www.ufo-blogger.com/2008/12/franch-alien-dna-researcher-astronaut.html
Where have all the microbiologists gone?

Perhaps the Dracs possess the PLF's/Greys. The Dracs seem to be physically challenged...from what I've heard.

Please consider this http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=15878 in the context of the current thread.

Thank-you no caste. I'm looking at the links now. Try this one for the threads: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=15663&highlight=orthodoxymoron+threads I just want to say one more time...that I really don't know what I'm doing with all of this stuff. I'm just trying to get in the middle of all the fringe material...and try to rationally deal with it by just posting random thoughts about all of it. I know you know that...but some others might not. Everything in our world seems to be up for grabs right now. It seems to be a somewhat unstable situation...which could invite WWIII and a harsh tyranny...if we're not very careful.

I watched the first linked video you just posted some time ago...but it was good to watch it again. It sounds like 'we' thought we could 'deal with the devil' without getting $crewed. It sounds like we now have hell to pay. How do we extricate ourselves from this mess? Did we think we were taking advantage of the 'aliens'...when the reality was that they were the ones who were taking advantage of us? To paraphrase JFK...those who ride to power on the back of a tiger...ususally end up inside. Are we presently inside?

Regarding the secret major factions...I just hope that everything can be worked out without millions of people being killed or sacrificed. I don't necessarily have a problem with Earth Humans or Extraterrestrials working behind the scenes to make things better...but I'm sensing that all is not well...that things are out of control...and that everyone is in a very desperate situation. Even if this is not the case...it is a possibility which should be exhaustively explored.

A Solar System based upon Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom...in the context of the U.S. Constitution and Bill of Rights...in the context of the United Nations...might be a good place to begin...to keep us from being enslaved or exterminated. But that's just my two cents worth of paradigms. Just the simple and naive thoughts of a neurotic disfunctional underachieving human.:wink2:

Is Gizeh Intelligence the main-game in our Solar System? Is it both good and evil? Is Lucifer at the helm? Is a Draconian at the helm? Are the major factions really branches of Gizeh Intelligence? I'm very confused about all of this. I think if I really knew what was going on...I would be told to shut-up in no uncertain terms. I realize this pseudo-quest is playing with fire.

I just have huge problems with things like the Crusades, the Inquisition, the Civil War, the World Wars, Vietnam, Iraq, Assassinations, Terrorism, 9/11, the Great Depression, Planned Financial Collapses, Starvation, Disappearing Middle Class, Satanic Rituals, Human Sacrifices, Earth Changes, the New World Order, Theocracies, etc, etc, etc. Why is this world so violent and stupid? In a sense...I don't care if there are secret organizations, underground bases, and a secret space program. I just feel like this world has been out of control for a long, long time...and that something very, very evil is going on. Someone please straighten this BS out. I can't do it by arguing on the internet. This seems to be an exercise in futility.

Once again...I continue to lean toward eliminating nearly all of the secrecy, and basing the Solar System on Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom...in the context of the U.S. Constitution and Bill of Rights...in the context of the United Nations. I don't want to eliminate Gizeh Intelligence, the Vatican, the City of London, Washington D.C., the United Nations, etc. I just want them to clean up their acts...and run this Solar System properly. If there are Draconian Reptilians running the show...perhaps they need to be relocated out of the Solar System. I have a sinking feeling that we live in a Haunted Solar System. What the hell is going on? Or what from hell is going on? We can't just keep sweeping this cr@p under the rug...into Deep Underground Military Bases.

I don't know what's going on with whoever was instrumental in the original creation/evolution of the Human Race. I'm not seeing this being or beings anywhere close to our Solar System. I'm rewatching 'Stargate SG1' and that may describe a lot of what is really going on. I keep thinking that something very bad happened to whoever made us...perhaps in a war or a coup d' etat. I'm seeing stand-in wannbe gods throughout Earth history...right up to the present. I'm thinking that we are mostly on our own. I'm thinking that Earth Humans need to be their own God. I don't trust anyone else. Actually...I don't even trust us...but we may be the best that we're going to get.

I think we may all be Renegade Pleiadians who rebelled against a Pleiadian/Draconian Theocracy...and ended up in the Aldebaran Star System...and subsequently traveled to the Sirius Star System...and finally to our Solar System. We may be Fallen Angels...under the direction of Lucifer. If so...I think that despite a valiant effort...we may be right back into Draconian Theocracy territory...and that Lucifer has been partially insane ever since we got here. I sincerely hope I'm wrong about all of this...but pieces of the puzzle are beginning to fit...and I don't like what I'm seeing. I so hope I'm wrong.

I really don't want to think about this anymore. I'm starting to read the 'Wall Street Journal' and to watch 'Bloomberg'...so I may just focus on business...and forget about this stuff. And then I might not have to have a close encounter of the worst kind with the Alphabet Guys or the Jesuits. Those are some of the people who I think really and truly know what's going on. But their bosses frown on loose cannons running around stirring up trouble and sticking their noses into sources of forbidden knowledge. Again...I hope that I'm just a paranoid nut-case...and that none of this stuff is true.

I just feel like I'm frantically going round and round and round...under the watchful and scornful gaze of the Dracs...just like in this video! YouTube- smart turbo with hayabusa engine

This might sound dumb...but I'm going to OD on SG1 and WSJ for awhile. This is not a random selection. I may or may not return.

One last thought (for awhile)...the U.S. Constitution provides for an organized decentralism...or organized anarchy...or a non-theocratic spiritual state. It's not perfect...but bi+ching about a lifeboat's deficiencies (and not climbing aboard) after being shipwrecked...is the epitome of stupidity.

Godspeed.

I posted this elsewhere...but it seemed to fit this thread as well. Don't forget to watch the third episode of 'V' tonight. Think about the following while you watch. Once again...the following is educated speculation. It is a possibility.

Could it be that Satan and Demons are really Interdimensional Draconian Reptilians who hate Humans? Could it be that God, Lucifer, and Jesus are Pleiadian Humans...and that even Lucifer is a good-guy or good-gal? They could all possibly be good. Could it be that they are all at odds with the Dracs...and that they simply have different philosophies regarding how to deal with them? Do they lead the three or four factions which I suspect are headquartered in underground bases...here and on the Moon? I believe in the literal existence of all of the above. With this in mind...consider the following link regarding God, Jesus, Satan, Lucifer, etc: http://www.lucifer.com/lucifer.html Do the Dracs control the Vatican...against the will of the Curia and the Pope? Is the term 'Luciferian' really a cover for 'Draconian'? I keep thinking that the Dracs need to be kicked out of our Solar System. I keep thinking that no one should bow down and worship anyone...including worshipping God, Jesus, Satan, Lucifer, etc. We should simply reverence the Divinity Within Humanity aka The Christlike Holy Spirit. We should see Christ in All Persons. Lucifer...is this correct? I continue to suspect that you would be ok if the Dracs were gone...you retired...and if our Solar System was based upon Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom. I still wish to hear you improvise on the Cavaille-Coll pipe-organ at Saint Sulpice...after this mess is resolved. Lucifer...can you use your Galactic Rolodex to arrange a Solar System Exorcism...and to arrange replacing the U.N. Charter with the U.S. Constitution and Bill of Rights...and have this apply to the entire Solar System? I tend to think that you can. Perhaps you have already called in the strike. If so...thank-you in advance. See you at Saint Sulpice. Namaste Lucifer.

Could the four factions which I discussed previously...be lead by the following?

1. God (Pleiadian Human) - Zionist - Theocratic
2. Lucifer (Pleiadian Human) - Teutonic Zionist - Giza Intelligence - Dictatorship
3. Jesus (Pleiadian Human) - Andromedan - Christlike Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom
4. Satan (Draconian Interdimensional Reptilian) - Demands Worship, Praise, Submission, and Obedience. Plays God. Dominates #1 and #2. Attacks #3 with a vengeance.

Is #4 the real problem? Could I convince most of you Dracs to choose #3...and rebel against your leaders? You have nothing to lose but your chains.

Murcuriel...thank-you for your posts. Sometimes it takes thick skin to survive in this philosophical and spiritual food-for-thought fight. Hang in there!

I found this on a thread by the eXchanger. I condensed it, and transfered it. Thank-you eXchanger!

I found the following to be highly interesting. It wouldn't surprise me if this is quite close to the truth. This could really be who we are...and who our 'gods' are...and I'm not talking about the Founders or the Creator God of the Universe. I'm not seeing this Ultimate Divine Presence at work in this Solar System at this time. I wish I knew what happened to the original God. The vacuum is being filled by stand-ins and wannabe gods. I appreciate their efforts...I guess...but perhaps we don't need any gods whatsoever. I have no way of verifying the information...and I assume that it was channeled. I am wary of channeling...yet I still found the information to be fascinating. Reader discretion advised.

How does Gizeh Intelligence fit into all of this? Darned if I know! The truth is down there! Or...the truth is down there...up there...on the Moon!

The Truth about ETs - Original source: www.salrachele.com

Approximately 60% of all UFOs reported are from solar systems outside our own. The majority are from Zeta Reticuli, Alpha Centauri, Rigel & Betelguese (Orion), Sirius A & B, and the Pleiades. Approximately 20% are above top-secret military tests of experimental craft, often reverse engineered from Zeta craft. Approximately 20% are natural phenomena mistakenly identified as artificial craft.

In addition to the above, there are millions of encounters with beings from other dimensions (parallel, higher, etc.), most of whom are benevolent.

We Are All ETs to Some Extent

There is really no difference between ETs and humans, because Earth has been genetically manipulated for aeons by different ET races to the point that almost all of us have genetics from other star systems. There are often some physical genetic markers carried from generation to generation that can help identify one’s ET heritage. For example, those carrying genetic material from Nordic Pleaideans are often tall and muscular, with blond hair and blue eyes.. But with all the mixing and blending of our melting pot planet, this is a hard thing to track. For example, I am Venusian, but I do not have any markers that I'm aware of (I'm Italian with dark hair and eyes and olive skin while most Venusians are fair skinned and blond by nature).

Actually, if a non-human being were to walk among us (and some do), he/she might not even be noticed. Not only can some alien races disguise themselves, but many already look a lot like us.

As I've stated before, approximately 80% of all ETs are benevolent, kind, loving souls who sincerely want to lift humanity and welcome them back into the cosmic family. About 20% of ETs are malevolent, power-hungry beings with total disregard or even disdain of humans. Of course, there's some neutral middle ground (mostly alien scientists who have no ill feelings toward humanity but are not evolved enough spiritually to be in a position to decide what's best for us). In the name of research, they might dissect a human to learn more about him/her. (The subject of abductions is another matter for another time.)

The problem is, most of the negative ETs are vibrating in the 3D and 4D realms and so are often visible to 3D and 4D humans. Many of the higher, more loving races exist in 5D, 6D and 7D and can only be contacted by humans who are attuned to those densities.

So it APPEARS there are a lot of negative ETs involved with Earth. And of course, most of the world's rulers are controlled by negative ETs
(because of their lust for power).

There are many different "species" of aliens. Here's my latest assessment including those in human embodiment:

Orion Constellation: Councils of Rigel & Betelguese, Incarnates from Mars and Maldek. 80%
Pleiades System 7D: Adamic Race (original earthlings) from Lyra/Vega DNA, Atlantean Priest-Kings. 15%
Sirius B Binary System: Biblical Gods, Greek Gods, descendants of Israel & the Middle East. 2%
Venus, 6th Density: Generally blond-haired, blue-eyed, fair-skinned humans. 1%
Pleiades System 4D: Nordic-type tall muscular humans (original Vikings, Scandinavian races). 1%
Andromedan 4D: Oriental-type humans with small slanted eyes. 0.5%
Antares 4D: Red giant race mentioned in Genesis, Nordic-types, stocky European. 0.3%
Zeta Reticuli 3D: Human incarnates of original Zeta race before hybridization. 0.1%
Zeta Reticuli 3D Hybrid: Human incarnates derived from breeding programs. less than 0.1%
Andromedan 3D Hybrid: Human incarnates derived from breeding programs. less than 0.1%
Tau Ceti, Alpha Centauri, Polaris: Human incarnates from these star systems. (mostly 6D-8D). less than 0.1%
Arcturus 7D-9D: Emissaries incarnate in human form. less than one million.
Nibiru (Planet X): Nibiruan Council members, on and off-planet incarnations. about 80,000
ETs in alien bodies: Humanoids with off-planet incarnations. about 32,000
Walk-ins (soul transfers): Various races taking over human bodies through soul transfer. about 6,000
Other categories (3D-12D): Humans from star systems not mentioned above. about 50 million
Other entities (7D or higher): Spiritual masters from higher dimensions (avatars in manufactured bodies). about 300

Population percentage breakdown by density (current vibratory level of humans):

3D -- About 78%
4D -- About 22% (includes yours truly at approx. 4.65)
5D -- About 0.1%
6D -- About 0.00001%
7D -- About 0.000000001%

Here is my assessment of the types of craft observed in our skies, including the ones I've seen physically. The percentages are out of the total observed by humans:

Grey, saucer shaped, 10m-20m diameter - Zeta Reticuli - 3D/4D. 50%
Grey, saucer shaped, 10m-20m diameter - Illuminati Black Ops (Earth). 30%
Black, triangular, a few meters across - Alpha Draconis 3D (Reptilian). 10%
Multicolor, saucer-shaped - Pleiades 4D/7D, Venus 6D. 3%
Spherical, green glowing - Pleiades 4D/7D 1%
Black, triangular, very large - Illuminati Black Ops (Earth). 1%
Cigar-shaped (mothercraft - very large) - Zeta Reticuli - 3D/4D. 1%
Grey, Cylindrical - Andromeda - 3D/4D. 1%
Interdimensional, various sizes and colors - Sirius B, Orion, other systems (5D-9D). about 3%

NOTE: The Orions interbred with humans nearly half a million years ago. To my knowledge they have only a handful of emissaries from the constellation circling our heavens. The same goes for the Sirians. What about an impending invasion? Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but it already happened over 500,000 years ago and yeah, they won. No new invasion will be successful because Gaia (Mother Earth) is ascending
and only those souls on the path of ascension will be allowed to remain on Earth beyond the 2012 - 2030 A.D. window. See Earth Changes.

Please use your own divine judgment when dealing with ETs and especially when dealing with humans, as the percentage of negatively vibrating humans is much higher than that of ETs. In fact, if it were up to chance (which it is not), you would stand a better chance of meeting a positive ET than a positive human.

Detailed Descriptions of ETs - A complete description is found in Life On the Cutting Edge.

The Orions look like us because almost 80% of us are Orions.
The Pleiadeans look like us because they were the original root race of Earth.
The Sirians are a bit taller and lighter than the average humans.
The Antareans are large, muscular and have reddish-brown skin.
The Andromedans tend to incarnate as orientals, but the original ETs are tall and lanky with large heads and small slanted almond eyes.

The Zetas come in three main flavors:

(1) alabaster white and short with huge black almond eyes;
(2) short and grey with large black almond eyes (the most common); and
(3) tall, blue-skinned hybrids with small slanted almond eyes.

The other races are higher dimensional and can change their appearance at will.
The Venusians are fair-skinned, blond and translucent.
The Arcturians are large, blue-skinned translucent beings.
The higher-dimensional Pleiadeans are shimmering golden figures of light.
The highest level Pleiadeans look like the blue-white stars in the visible Pleiades star cluster.

ETs in Our Solar System - Note: Some of this information is also available in the article on Souls and Soul Rays.

Jupiter has advanced civilizations in the etheric atmosphere of the giant planet, vibrating at 5th and 6th density levels. They are not completely free of service-to-self (STS) vibrations and there is some kind of hierarchy to their government. They are large translucent beings originating in many local sectors of the galaxy. They were called to Jupiter to learn and grow spiritually with the assistance of Arcturians and Venusians. These beings have developed the power side of their nature more than the love side, although they are generally of a positive energy. However, that energy is somewhat harsh compared to the Venusians. Their biggest lesson appears to be finding balance between love, wisdom and power and integrating the mistakes they made during the Mars experience hundreds of thousands of years ago.

The Orions (who have controlled Earth for the last half million years) sometimes incarnate etherically in the atmosphere of Jupiter once they have ascended from the warrior-masculine-aggressive Martian paradigm.

Most of the rulers of the Jupiter conclave (about 1,000 rulers and 150,000 entities) are being tutored from higher realms in the ways of unconditional love, and how to govern a planet without ego superiority issues (a tough lesson).

The Venusians are a sixth density race from which the goddess mythology arose. They look very much as pictured in visionary paintings – long flowing golden hair, flowing robes and translucent bodies of light, some with wings.

The Martians are really the Orions prior to coming to Earth. They began their incarnations on the surface of Mars and later went underground when their atmosphere was destroyed by warfare.

The Maldekians are really Orions that once inhabited Maldek, the planet between Mars and Jupiter. They blew their planet apart with warfare and what’s left is the asteroid belt. The souls incarnated on Mars and Earth after the destruction of Maldek. The destruction of this planet threw the other planets out of their original orbits and created problems far beyond the solar system. For this reason, the Divine Councils of the higher dimensions have intervened and will not allow the total destruction of any more planets in this sector.

The Saturn Tribunal is a council of higher-dimensional entities from various systems that use etheric Saturn as their base of operations.

Original source for the above information: www.salrachele.com

Murcuriel...you are obviously very knowledgeable and intelligent. I often feel as though I should not be posting so much about things I know so little about...but my insecurities drive me forward into areas which make me even more insecure. Your post contains so much profound insight.

A sentence from the last post before yours really reinforced something I have suspected for a long time...namely that a high level of spiritual development is necessary to contact the higher realms. Here is the quote:

"The problem is, most of the negative ETs are vibrating in the 3D and 4D realms and so are often visible to 3D and 4D humans. Many of the higher, more loving races exist in 5D, 6D and 7D and can only be contacted by humans who are attuned to those densities."

I suspect that most of the channelers and gurus who conduct workshops and sell books...are not as highly spiritually evolved as they think (or would like us to think). This is why I don't get involved in this stuff. I watch from a safe distance (if that's possible). I am frightened by traditional religion and New Age religion. I applaud everyone for trying to do the right thing...but believer beware. I think we live in a haunted prison planet...and that we are in huge trouble. We need to focus on responsibility and self-governance...rather than focusing on hocus-pocus and mumbo-jumbo. http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=15878 On the other hand...Jesus said 'Seek ye first the Kingdom of God, and His righteousness...and all these things shall be added unto you.' But I have concluded that the true Kingdom of God is defined by Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom. Jesus also said that the 'Kingdom of God is within you'...and that 'the truth will set you free.' More than anything...I think that Jesus was a whistleblower-insider...who we have not really carefully listened to and taken seriously.

Please consider this Amen Ra thread http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?p=202245&posted=1#post202245 in the context of the Gizeh Intelligence thread. They might be interconnected. The Dog-Star Sirius, Ancient Egypt, Amen Ra, and Gizeh Intelligence may be at the center of everything here on Earth. What would Daniel Jackson say? What would Hathor say?

I'm starting to get really nervous and shaky regarding all of this. All of the above may be fully aware of who I am...and what I am posting. If this is true...I doubt that they are overwhelmed with feelings of love and joy. Probably just the opposite. The spirits may be restless...and the gods may be angry.

Check this source out: http://www.scribd.com/doc/20738632/3290626-Secret-Societies-and-Their-Power

Here is another link which you might find interesting (John Rhodes): http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/sumer_anunnaki/reptiles/reptiles38.htm

Here's yet another speculative intellectual ejaculation resulting from the masturbation of the mind:

What if Reptilians evolved...but not Humans? What if the entire universe was Reptilian? What if there were no Humans anywhere? What if the entire universe was a Reptilian Universal Church Theocracy? What if Humans were created as a slave race? ('Let us make man in our image') What if Lucifer (Ptah?) was the Reptilian in charge of the genetic engineering project which resulted in the creation of Human Beings? What if Humans were mistreated as slaves? What if a group of Reptilians, led by Lucifer, conspired with Humans, to kill God the Father (Ra?)...and take over 'Heaven'? What if this was the Luciferian Rebellion which led to War in Heaven...and the death of God the Father (Ra?)? What if the Reptilians loyal to God (Ra?) fought against the Luciferian Reptilians and Human Beings...driving them out of the Garden of Eden (Heaven?) What if Battlestar Moon was used to transport the Luciferian Reptilians and Humans to Aldebaran, Sirius, and Earth...while being violently pursued by Nibiru? What if Interdimensional Reptilians aka The Spirit of God aka Amen battle with Luciferian Interdimensional Reptilians and the Divinity Within Humanity aka The Holy Spirit...to regain control of the Renegade Human Race? What if the New World Order is the Kingdom of Ra? What if the Luciferian Reptilians and a select group of Humans run Earth from underground bases on Earth and the Moon? Could this be Gizeh Intelligence? Could Reptilians and Humans loyal to Ra be Zionists? Could Reptilians and Humans loyal to Lucifer be Teutonic Zionists? Could a pacifist union of both factions be Followers of Jesus? Could Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom be the solution to this ancient mess?

How much trouble am I in now? Probably quite a bit. But once again...this is just speculation...with no inside information whatsoever.

Thank-you Echo6. Who knows if they're true? But I am trying very hard to approximate reality. I'm not pulling these theories out of a black hole.

[QUOTE=Echo6;219690]From what i can gather, you are doing a reasonably good job so far. Maybe expand your search parameters a little.[/QUOTE]

Thank-you Echo6. I'm just trying to find peace. The violence, corruption, lies, attitudes, etc...are difficult for me to handle. I'm just trying to solve the world's problems...and by so doing...solve my own problems. I want to spend more time envisioning a Perfected Humanity Living in a Perfected Solar System. In a sense...I want to live in a Dream Solar System...and I want everyone to make it...including the Regressives. This sort of thinking is what I call Positive Reality Based Science Fiction. I am trying to cultivate a Solar System View...rather than a World View. I am trying to be on Everyone's Side...even though this is probably impossible.

I don't have a problem with interacting with Genuinely Benevolent Non-Humans.
I don't have a problem with Globalism based upon Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom.
I don't have a problem with Deep Underground Military Bases...as long as every square-meter of them are open to our representatives and top ranking military personnel...and as long as nothing clandestine or horrific is transpiring in them. I love watching Stargate SG-1.
I don't have a problem with Underground Cities. I think that most of the Earth's population should live underground.
I don't have a problem with Underground Mach Whatever Leviton Trains. They should probably become the preferred method of future transportation.
I don't have a problem with Advanced Spacecraft and Interplanetary Travel.
I don't have a problem with Philosophically and Theologically Rethinking Everything.
I don't have a problem with Reasonable Amnesty and Immunity for Complete Disclosure, Cooperation, and Reasonable Restitution...so that we can clean this mess up...and MOVE ON TO BIGGER AND BETTER THINGS. The Regressives, the Elites...AND the General Public should probably share equal blame for the mess we are in.

I just want the Secrecy, Corruption, Violence, Starvation, War, Terrorism, Deception, Etc...to STOP NOW!!!

Here's a behind the scenes look at what happened in a Deep Underground Military Base when Gizeh Intelligence pulled the plug on Adolph Hitler in 1941. The Computer Gaming Language was just a cover for what really happened. The horror! (viewer discretion advised) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Qi_9lEbdJg Seriously...what really did happen in 1941 regarding Hitler and Gizeh Intelligence? The Roman Catholic interaction with Hitler is very interesting as well. Did Pope Pius XII and Adolph Hitler mean well in the 30's? Was Hitler not supposed to go to war...and not supposed to mistreat the Jews? Some say so. What the hell went wrong then? Will we ever know the truth? Has Gizeh Intelligence been historically necessary? Was/is it a matter of fighting fire with fire? What force stands in opposition to Gizeh Intelligence? I keep hypothesizing a Zionist vs Teutonic Zionist conflict...going way back in history. I have also recently been taking a closer look at Gabriel, Michael, Lucifer, the Luciferian Rebellion, and the War in Heaven. Was World War II simply a continuation of a conflict which began before there was Human life on Earth?

Take a look at the following link: http://servicetoone.wordpress.com/category/05a-chapter-v-part-2/ I found this most interesting:


"I am going to quote Jan van Helsing from his well researched book: “Secret Societies and Their Power in the 20th Century” again and this time when comes to explaining what Agarthi/Agartha is, because his research confirms to some extent what members from Thule have told me, but is still just a part of the story. Again, Chapter X will explain it in more details:

“ULTIMA THULE” apparently was the capital city of the first continent peopled by Aryans. This was called HYPERBOREA and was older than Lemuria and Atlantis (continents with advanced cultures since submerged). The Scandinavians have a tale of “Ultima Thule”, the wonderful land in the high North, where the sun never sets and the ancestors of the Aryan race dwell. Hyperborea was up in the North Sea and sank during an ice age. It is assumed that the Hyperboreans came from the solar system Alderbaran which is the main star in the constellation Taurus, and that they were about four meters tall, white, blond and blue-eyed. They knew no war [1] and we[r]e vegetarians (so was Hitler). According to alleged Thule texts they were technically very advanced and flew “Vril-ya”, flying machines that today we call UFOs. These flying disks were capable of levitation, extreme speeds and the maneuvers known from today’s UFOs due to two counter-rotating magnetic fields and they used the so-called Vril power as energy potential or fuel (Vril = ether, Od, Prana, Chi, Ki, cosmic force, Orgon…, but also from the academic “vri-IL” = as the highest deity = God-like), i.e., they take the energy from the earth’s magnetic field (free energy) like the “tachyon converter” of Captain Hans Coler.When HYPERBOREA began to sink the Hyperboreans are said to have burrowed with huge machines gigantic tunnels into the Earth’s crust and settled under the Himalayan region. The subterranean realm is called AGHARTA and its capital SHAMBALLAH. The Persians call this land “Aryana” the land of origin of the Aryans.

Here we should mention that Karl Haushofer claimed that Thule was actually called Atlantis and – contrary to all other researchers of Tibet and India – he said that the surviving Thule-Atlanteans were separated into two groups, a good one and an evil one. Those who called themselves after their oracle Agharta were the good and settled in the Himalayan region, the evil ones were the Shamballah who wanted to subjugate humanity and they went West. He maintained that the fight between the people of Agharta and Shamballah had been going on for thousands of years and that in the Third Reich the Thule-Gesellschaft as Agharta’s representative continued it against the representatives of Shamballah, the Freemasons and the Zionists. This perhaps was his mission."


Does the last paragraph describe the origins of Zionism and Teutonic Zionism? Or...is this rivalry even more ancient...possibly going back to the fabled 'War in Heaven'? I wish to make it clear that I have zero animosity toward Jewish or German people. I'm just curious regarding the true story of our past and present...rather than the sugar-coated and dumbed-down version of tripe...which passes as history.

Aldebaran > Thule > Agharta > Altlantis > Gizeh Intelligence > Teutonic Zionism? (Followers of Lucifer?)

Aldebaran > Thule > Shamballah > Lemuria > Zionism? (Followers of Gabriel?)

Damned if I know.

Your points are well taken Mercuriel. My guess is that historically...one thing led to another...and things got out of control...if they ever were in control. Is it helpful to think of Universal History as one big mess involving power struggles between powerful (but not all powerful) Reptilian and Human Gods and Goddesses? Is the concept of having ALL of the Gods and Goddesses retire...and basing everything on Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom...a valid idea? It seems reasonable to me...but I have no idea what the actual realities are throughout the Universe...or even in this Solar System. I'm just seeing very powerful hidden forces at work...and I'm very, very frightened and disillusioned. I know that I'm still really living in a dreamworld...and I don't think I could handle the full reality of the Universal Predicament. The most powerful beings in the Universe may not be in the best position to make the best decisions. Think long and hard about that one! Absolute Power Corrupts Absolutely. I don't think there are any exceptions...and insanity might be part of the deal. If we really arrived at the top of the Universal Pyramid...we might not like the view...

Here is a really wild theory: "รูปนี้คือเส้นวงโคจร" Any questions? Seriously, the translation is as follows: What if there are a lot of moons and planets orbiting Nibiru? Some say that there are. http://www.google.com/images?rlz=1T4GGIR_enUS216US217&q=nibiru&um=1&ie=UTF-8&source=univ&ei=E7PsTIDhFYu0sAPPg6yMBw&sa=X&oi=image_result_group&ct=title&resnum=5&ved=0CEMQsAQwBA
What if our moon was once in orbit around Nibiru? What if we all are Nibiruans spiritually or soul-wise? What if there was a rebellion - and we all got brought to Earth via the Moon? What if all of us participated in stealing fire from the gods - and the Moon was our getaway car? Might Lucifer and Michael have been the leaders of said rebellion? Was this rebellion, theft, and war - the Original Sin - which all mankind is guilty of? Now isn't that heretical? Then - what if a genetic hybridization program created many races? Who came first - the Humans or the Reptilians? Is there a star war every time Nibiru approaches Earth? Is this what the PTB are preparing for? Or - is all of this Nibiru, Annunaki, and Reptilian stuff a great big load of you know what? Did we come here 14,400 years ago? Did Nibiru try to destroy us with a global flood 10,800 years ago? What happened 7,200 and 3,600 years ago? Or - should I be following these numbers with BC? If so, Nibiru isn't due back here for another 1,500+ years! I'm getting tired of asking questions - and the answers might cause me to abandon all hope. I keep asking question after question after question - and receiving very few answers. What the hell is really going on? Lucifer??? Gabriel??? Michael??? Amen Ra??? Queen of Heaven??? Somebody talk to me!!! Google seems to be my one and only friend. See the following:

Check this out! http://www.futuretg.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=441:indipendence-day-was-450000-years-ago-&catid=45:human-evolution&Itemid=67 (Un-edited)

"Most people suppose that some alien civilization will land and will destroy us, will exterminate us. But this will not happens, because happens millenniums ago. Honestly, the civilization that visit us, don't want to exterminate us. They simply want slaves to stole the light and the result of their job, as well the earth's jewels.
They still rule us ...

From Patricia Cori Atlantis Rising, we got a list of the visit of the Annunaki from 450,000 BC until Zero Point, when the Christ born. Here is the list,

What becomes significant in our discussion of the Annunaki is how their planet's continual reentry into your system coincides with periods of great upheaval and monumental change upon the Earth. Visitations from the Annunaki have marked the following key time frames in your solar system's history:

450,000 years ago, the Nebiruans first visit Earth, returning at regular intervals since then, approximately every 3,600 years

97,200 BC (The Annunaki intervene in the Great Experiment- the seeding of Homo sapiens

52,400 BC (Nebiru's entry into your solar system coincides with other celestial events which cause Planet Earth to flip its axis, initiating your most recent Ice Age

28,800 BC (The second cycle of Atlantis comes to a close with the glaciation of the continent

25,200 BC (The Annunaki establish military bases on Mars.)

21,600 BC (Annunaki transit stations are created on the Moon.)

18,000 BC (The first Annunaki settlements in the land known to you as Africa establish mining colonies of precious ores.)

14,400 BC (The Annunaki land in Atlantis, which coincides with the beginnings of opposition in the Priesthood.)

10,800 BC (Atlantis disappears below the ocean.)

7200 BC (The Annunaki appear in Mesopotamia, intervening in the Sumerian civilization.)

3600 BC (The Annunaki intervene in Egypt, a civilization established through direct intervention with Sirian and Pleiadian Light Emissaries.)

ZERO TIME (The birthing of the Christed One.)

Calculating a 3,600 year cycle, it is clear that the lone planet is not scheduled back into your solar system in time for the Mayan date or 21 December 2012 AD. This is of particular significance to the cosmic unfolding of events occurring at that projected point in the space-time continuum and devastating to the Nebiruans. Just as before, with the collapse of Satais, all heavenly bodies orbiting the ascending star will be pulled through the black hole and into the higher dimension. Nebiru, however, will be out there in galactic winter, at a remote point somewhere between the Sirius star system and yours, neither close enough to be pulled through with you, nor near enough to Sirius to grab orbit in our system. They are fearful, worried about their fate, and they are searching desperately for a solution.

So, when they arrive for the first time, we were in embryo. Then, they modify our DNA. They are the so-called Dark Brothers. The Family of Light, did nothing to change this because they know how the Universe works. Their visit, was a continuous challenge for us, valid still today, but soon they will become not-operative.

No additional comment, is necessary. Thanks, Giovanni A. Orlando."

Treat all of this as if it were science fiction. I sample and speculate. I don't know much for certain. I guess I'm trying to place myself in the middle of life, the universe, and everything - in a somewhat neutral and non-committal manner. The more I look at all of this - the less I think I know - and the less capable I feel. I mostly point to the work and skills of others. Thank-you for the heads-up on the Andromeda Collective. I have listened to Alex Collier quite a bit in the past - and he claims to have had extensive contact with the Andromedans - but I consider his material to be a combination of fact and fiction. I really like Alex, and I am very close to his thinking editorially and politically (at least regarding his past lectures). If you are interested in further study regarding Gizeh Intelligence - I would suggest taking a very close look at the Nazi phenomenon - before, during, and after World War II. Consider all of Joseph Farrell's ('SS Brotherhood of the Bell') and Jim Marrs' ('Rule by Secrecy', 'Rise of the Fourth Reich') books, interviews, and lectures. My goal is mostly to change myself - and I do this by thinking out-loud on the internet. But, as I'm sure you know, everything is monitored. Viewing and posting on these controversial subjects probably gets one placed on dozens of lists. At this point - I don't care. I'm really trying to communicate with everyone - especially those on the inside - which would include those working for various agencies which might be monitoring sites such as this one. Hi guys and gals! The goal is to get informed - without getting mad, or going mad.

Carol wrote:As I stand rocking back and forth in my corner here OXY I really think we are too far down on the totom pole for anyone to want us on any list.

You're probably right, Carol - but it's sort of fun to think that some mysterious and powerful agency actually gives a damn about little-old me! I sure hope that I'm not on anyone's fecal-list when the excrement hits the air-conditioning system! People start out, worrying about what people think of them. Then, they stop worrying about what people think. Finally, they realize that no one really gives a rat's @$$! I'm half-joking and half-serious when I speak of rocking back and forth in a corner. The internal conflict generated by considering life, the universe, and everything - combined with a feeling of utter uselessness and helplessness - is quite intense, at times. Wanting everything - while having nothing - is a form of mental illness which I experience each and every day. Some of us nobodies wish to be somebodies - and we engage in self-aggrandizing tempests in internet-teapots - while rocking back and forth in the corner - doing you know what...



Even maliciously fabricated BS has value, in the sense that it provides us with a mental and spiritual workout. I like to sample a wide variety of sources and subjects. That way, I don't have to agonize as much over whether a particular person or story is genuine. I just take it all in - and formulate a hypothesis. Then I just keep working with that hypothesis, to see if it holds up. The problem I am having, is in trying to stimulate and maintain rational coversation regarding the controversial topics and theories which particularly interest me. I mostly have to talk to myself. I don't wish to walk alone - but if I have to, I will. Most of the time - only my dog will walk with me. Sometimes, he won't even go...

I assume that I am accompanied by both good and evil unseen beings continually. This sort of tramples on the right to privacy - but what the heck. Sometimes I even swear at these beings - in a friendly way - but I don't wish for them to talk back! I'm really annoyed by the whole state of affairs - historically and presently. It seems to be utterly absurd. I mostly have to live in my own little dreamworld, to maintain my sanity - and perhaps this, in and of itself, is insanity. There are advantages and disadvantages to standing apart from the crowd. Independence is a good thing - but too much independence is disastrous. One should not be a Rebel Without a Clue. I'm actually attempting to befriend the Powers That Be (Human and Otherwise) in a rather detached, antagonistic, sarcastic, and irreverent manner. I'd love to tour the full extent of Gizeh Intelligence Facilities (throughout the solar system?) someday - but I don't wish to sell my soul to you know who - in order to be granted the privilege of doing so. I'm trying to be the worst enemy and the best buddy of the PTB. Don't try this at home kiddies...

Here are the links to my threads on AV1 and MOA. I included them here because they are really an ongoing research project. I'm trying to change myself - and I am trying to encourage others to think in unconventional yet productive ways. This is a unique approach - which may make it of some value to someone somewhere or somewhen. This thread is an experiment (aren't they all?)...which includes mostly threads based on videos...or threads which contain many video links...which I have started. I'm not particularly bright or noteworthy...but the videos which I have viewed...especially when viewed as a group...are earth shattering to me. The threads are a healthy mixture of problems and solutions. If you have the time...which is doubtful...please look at all of these threads...and look for commonalities. There is a bit of a theological slant...but certainly not an orthodox or Bible thumping slant. Prepare to be shocked...to cry...to get mad...to be enlightened...and to experience the Eureka Phenomenon!

I would love to read a twenty page critique of all of these threads - written by a Jesuit or a CIA analyst - complete with a psychological evaluation, etc. I'm very serious. I don't need to be right. I just don't feel as though anyone has seriously considered these threads. They were designed to make people think - and then to arrive at their own conclusions - but I don't think that happened at all. I honestly feel as though Gabriel, Michael, Lucifer, and a couple of alphabet agents and Jesuits are the only ones who looked at this material with a penetrating gaze. Even if I was very close to the mark - I wasn't a threat (I didn't try to be) - because no one seemed to pay much attention to any of it. I had hoped for some very detailed and passionate debating. The 'Amen Ra' thread seemed to generate the most interest (13,200 views and counting) - but I have no idea what the reactions were and are now that AV1 is closed to posting. I feel very empty and lost in all of this. I feel as though I wasted my time and energy - accomplishing nothing. I am making a renewed call for help - into the vast regions of space and cyberspace - to seriously look at this material as a group - and tell me what you think - positive or negative. Where are the scholars? Is there any intelligent life out there that isn't so high and mighty that they can't take a few hours to make a proper evaluation of all of this? Come down out of your ivory tower - I dare you! The water's warm. Come-on in! I'm waiting - but I'm not holding my breath. You important people with your degrees and badges have more important things to do - don't you? Like getting us into even more trouble than we're already in? Don't take what I just said too seriously. I am impatient and frustrated - and I'm simply taking my dissatisfaction with life out on those who don't deserve it. Life isn't fair - is it?

1. God, Jesus, Satan, Lucifer, et al: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=15014&highlight=orthodoxymoron

2. Secrets of the Vatican: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=13767&highlight=orthodoxymoron

3. Tell Me Who I Am: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=14402&highlight=orthodoxymoron

4. Waco Revisited: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=15185&highlight=orthodoxymoron

5. Al Bielek - Philadelphia Experiment and Montauk Project: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=14348&highlight=orthodoxymoron

6. Xcon Potpurri: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=14241&highlight=orthodoxymoron

7. Kevin Trudeau with Alex Jones - 5-26-09: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=14241&highlight=orthodoxymoron

8. Red Letter Church: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=13495&highlight=orthodoxymoron

9. Reptilians and Mind Control: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=13373&highlight=orthodoxymoron

10. 'V' Movie(Series) Revisited: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=13202&highlight=orthodoxymoron

11. Jesus: The Last Pharaoh?: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=13776&highlight=orthodoxymoron

12. Important Mass Manipulation Video: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=12702&highlight=orthodoxymoron

13. 1990's Prophets: Vindicated or Debunked?: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=11000&highlight=orthodoxymoron

14. Alien Advice: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=10158&highlight=orthodoxymoron

15. Cool Music Videos: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=15470&highlight=cool+music+videos

16. NASA: Triumph and Tragedy: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=15618&highlight=tragedy+triumph

17. United Nations Charter: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=15552&highlight=Shadow+moon

18. In the Shadow of the Moon: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=15635&highlight=Shadow+moon

19. TWA 800 Revisited: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=15187

20. Unique War Video: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=14409

21. Bilderberg Video: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=12970

22. Dogon Sirius Mystery - C2C: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=15731&highlight=dogon

23. The Point: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?p=158238#post158238

24. The Washington Mutual Story: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=13996&highlight=washington+mutual+story

25. Oklahoma City Bombing Revisited: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?p=158668#post158668

26. The United States of the Solar System: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=15878

27. What is Giza Intelligence? http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=11123&highlight=giza+intelligence

28. Called to Be Free - a Video: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=13882&highlight=worldwide+church

29. Lucifer: Deity of the Elite: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?p=163179#post163179

30. Tesla: Master of Lightning: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=16193

31. Secret Mysteries of America's Beginnings: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?p=165729#post165729

32. The Dulce Book: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?p=167075#post167075

33. New World Order: Devil in the Vatican: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?p=167745#post167745

34. The Lucifer Effect: Understanding How Good People Turn Evil: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=16609&highlight=lucifer+effect

35. Enron Video: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?p=175040#post175040

36. No End In Sight: Iraq War Documentary: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=16897

37. Ted Gunderson Interviews Chip Tatum (CIA, Drugs, Etc.): http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?p=177127#post177127

38. Sirius Issues: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?p=178234#post178234

39. Superimposed Parallel Universes: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?p=178255#post178255

40. Lawyerese Goes Galactic: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=17276&highlight=wall+street+journal

41. Stargate SG-1: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=17834

42. Amen Ra: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=18223

43. The Dark Side of the Moon Mission: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=18273&highlight=moon+video+orthodoxymoron

44. Open Letter to the Beings of the Universe: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=19065&highlight=open+letter+beings+universe

45. Moonraker: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=19284

46. Who Are Gabriel, Michael, and Lucifer? http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=19376&highlight=gabriel%2C+michael%2C+lucifer%3F

47. Krlll: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?p=238849#post238849

48. Cartoon Aliens: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=20141&highlight=cartoon+aliens

49. Thuban Thoughts: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=20379

50. Thuban Thoughts II: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=20963

51. Very Cool Short Videos: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=20400&highlight=cool+short+videos

52. Violent Movies, Books, Games, Cartoons, and Toys: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=20849

53. Abortion, Euthanasia, Suicide, and Murder: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=20852

54. Prevention is Central to Healthcare: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=21143

55. I Have a Dream! Free at Last! http://www.projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?p=261981#post261981

I may have been a bit harsh, self-pitying, and self-centered in that introduction. Lots of very bright people did participate on those threads - and I didn't have to pay them. The top people with top clearances, degrees and badges probably don't dare open-up on the internet - and for good reason. Many of them may have had to sell their souls to you know who, to get where they are. The higher up one goes (especially regarding the subjects in question) the more controlled and watched one may become. I have attended so many classes which involved people with doctorate degrees - discussing this and that - especially theological issues - that I know what a high tension academic discussion feels like - and I have extrapolated to know what a behind closed doors academic discussion would feel like - and I crave this. Of course - if I got what I wanted - I probably still wouldn't be happy!

Thank-you for your interest. Dogs have owners. Cats have staff. I'm just trying to put together something which is neither traditional religion or new age. I lost my faith - and I'm trying to establish a new faith. I keep thinking I need to stop - but then I keep thinking that if we don't arrive at a proper understanding regarding all of this - that the long term consequences will be devastating. I really shouldn't have been so brash regarding top people with top clearances. I have no idea what they have to deal with. I'm just frustrated and impatient. I'm flying blind - and I have no idea if I'm helping or hurting legitimate efforts to save the world - and make it a better place. I'm almost feeling as though I'm trying to partner (uninvited) with the best aspects of the secret government - so as to edge out the worst aspects. I don't wish to be a crusading rebel without a clue - and I don't wish to be a dumb dog who will not bark. It seems to me that it will take an almost superhuman effort to really get this right.

Thank-you Linda and Carol for your very thoughtful comments. Have either of you studied comparative gods, goddesses, theologies, and mythologies - rather than simply comparative religions? I'm leaning toward Humanist Christocentric Egyptological Science Fiction to try to salvage my shattered faith. Most people stop studying theology when they lose their faith. People should study theology twice as much after they lose their faith! I'm actually more angry with myself than I am with anyone else. I guess I have the most problems with the extremes and absurdities. History is a mess. Something has been very wrong. I actually would welcome an ideal world and solar system government which operates like a well-run corporation (with the U.S. Constitution and Teachings of Jesus at it's core). On the one hand - I rail against the corrupt and incompetent powers that be. On the other hand - I rail against the stupid general public sheeple. I'm actually trying to redesign world and solar system government - and imagine myself as being an active participant in it. I just started a novel to that effect. And I just gave up on proceding with this novel. The first page scared the heck out of me. This is all a big cause and effect game. Life is a game. The Most Dangerous Game. We are all players in the Game of the Millenium. We are all actors and actresses on the stage of the Theater of the Universe. I'm really trying to figure out who the *&%$#! script-writer is. Hello Lucifer! Smile!

I'm not going to keep commenting on my own threads to try to generate interest. The ball is in your court. There are some other threads I wish to follow - but I think I'm done with my threads for the foreseeable future. This does not imply a lack of interest or a change of heart. I just don't wish to play the part of the crusader. I might try to visit the United Nations, Washington D.C., the City of London, and the Vatican once again (I visited them many years ago). I will continue to fantasize about being a part of a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System which includes the U.N., Washington D.C., the City of London, the Vatican, the Underground Bases, and the Secret Space Program - except that in my dreamworld there is no secrecy or corruption. Once again - I don't wish to fight the New World Order - I wish to HI-JACK IT!! 'Take me to Nirvana!!' I'd love to put the dream into practice - but I'm not going to push it right now. If someone wants to pick me up in a UFO, and take me to the Darkside of the Moon to meet with Lucifer - I'll be ready to go at a moments notice. What am I saying?

Are Satan, Lucifer, the Rothschilds, the Rockefellers, the Royal Family, and the Vatican the biggest seed-money rock stars on the planet - who are doing the most to make the world a better place? Trickle down theory voodoo economics? Where are the Billionaire Ghandi's? Jesus was pretty tough on rich people. Are billionaires the most socially responsible people on the planet? Did they gain their money through socially responsible activities? Can wealth become anticompetitive at some point? Should those with the most money have the greatest political clout? Should those with the gold - RULE? One of the greatest tragedies of history is the non compassionate use of accumulated wealth. I know that a lot of contactees and gurus are opposed to money - but I disagree. Money and private property are expressions of freedom. The problem with money is the irresponsible pursuit and use of money. Perhaps the billionaires should be placed under the scanning electron microscope to look for illegality and irresponsibility. Blood Money, Drug Money, and Destructive Money of All Kinds - should be repaid to society - with interest and penalties. I'm also not a big fan of ET Mentoring. Have the Gods, Goddesses, Angels, Archangels, ET's, and Ascended Masters been promoting Responsibility, Freedom, and Human Sovereignty (other than the Andromedans)? Boy - I sure got a lot out of my system - and I didn't even feel hostile. It must've been something I ate - or maybe the devil made me do it.

Having said all of the above - I'm getting tired of being an internet warrior. It seems to be a monumental waste of time. Remember what Jesus said about pearls and such? Money Talks and BS Walks. The Bottom Line is the Bottom Line. Winning Isn't Everything. It's the Only Thing. Perhaps the secret is to be a Humanitarian on the Surface - and a Shrewd and Ruthless SOB Below the Radar. Could the Worship of Fame, Fortune, and Power - rather than the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit - help to explain why the Corrupt Rule the Stupid? Is Greed Good? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7upG01-XWbY I need to go for a long walk with my dog - and then perhaps I need to create a ten-year business plan. Who knows - in ten years I might have to change my tune and eat my words...

OK...I'm back from my walk...and I decided that the Corrupt Will Always Rule the Stupid - because both the Corrupt and the Stupid are happy with the arrangement - despite all outward appearances. Additionally - Both the Corrupt and the Stupid are Threatened by Non-Corrupt Highly Intelligent People - and will Fight Them Vigorously. Think about THAT... Perhaps this is why no one has REALLY followed the Red Letter Teachings of Jesus for 2,000 years - and why they probably never will... Narrow is the way. Read Revelation 20:12. Is December 21, 2012 really Judgement Day?

I'm on the verge of pusuing a business plan which is neither corrupt or stupid - and which will be executed in a manner which threatens neither the corrupt or the stupid. I may simply live a life of quiet decadence...and leave the corrupt and the stupid to their own devices...

When Avalon 1 was closed to posting - I decided not to participate in any other forum sites (including Avalon 2) - so I just posted on YouTube. I really enjoyed posting on a wide variety of videos - not just on the esoteric or controversial ones. Now that I'm back on a forum site - I see the strengths and weaknesses of such an approach. There is a HUGE amount of information and insight on Avalon 1 & 2, and Mists of Avalon - but the participants can get into a rut - and can even become desensitized and irritable. I just decided not to post more threads, or add to the ones I have already posted. Preaching to the choir is a major reason for this. I'll probably keep looking at Avalon and Mists of Avalon - and I may post on someone elses thread once in a while - but I'm going to spend a lot more time on business and on getting out in nature. Growing food, buying organic food, being vegetarian, eating raw food, exercising in nature, seeing a naturopathic physician, and listening to inspiring music - are excellent ways to cultivate physical, mental, and spiritual health. Too much esoteric, conspiracy, religious, and political info-warring (on the internet or otherwise) is probably a recipe for disaster. Nuff said. Now I'm going for another walk with my dog.

WE THE PEOPLE OF EARTH CAN HAVE TRUTH OR RESPOSE - WE CAN HAVE ONE OR THE OTHER - BUT WE CAN'T HAVE BOTH

I have freely admitted that I am emotionally-challenged, intellectually-limited, and a perpetual-speculator - but have I seriously gotten it wrong over the past couple of years? This madness is an ongoing-test and a paradigm-shift. I really don't know where I will ultimately end up - but I am concerned that alternative thinking seems to lack a common center. Like it or not - the major religions have a depth which comes from discipline, repetition, and sheer numbers. Perhaps this is why I am thinking of myself as sort of a Renegade Roman Catholic - even though I have never been one. I continue to try to harmonize the Teachings of Jesus, the U.S. Constitution, and the Latin Mass. My existence is a very strange one - and it seems to be getting stranger every day. I am also imagining myself to be a part of a Non-Corrupt and Completely-Open Solar System Government. When I finally end up in the nut-house - the shrinks are gonna go nucking futs!!

I think I'm beginning to mellow a bit. I really don't wish to be shrill toward anyone - even toward the really b@d@$$ nasties - human or otherwise. But I still think we need a Solar System Exorcism of sorts - a Galactic Time-Out - for the worst of the worst. You b@$t@rds know who you are!!! Try watching the Star Wars movies with all of these threads in mind - especially regarding a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System aka The United States of the Solar System - based upon Responsibility and the U.S. Constitution. Again - this is a test. This is only a test.

The avatar is the work of an artist named Harry Anderson http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harry_Anderson_(artist) - and was probably painted in the 60's. It depicts Jesus Christ knocking on the United Nations (as a giant door) and attempting to gain admission. "Behold - I stand at the door, and knock." From what I have seen - Jesus is still knocking - and U.N. troops may be on the way to deal with the 'threat'! Here is some more of Harry Anderson's art: http://www.goodsalt.com/search/results.html?&keyword1=results&search_terms=harry%20anderson&image_x=0&image_y=0&ipp=30

Carol, your post completely caught me off guard, and blew me away! Thank-you for the appreciation, and thank-you for the hybridization information. All types of technology have the potential for good or evil - but I keep getting the feeling that technology is out of control - and that secret laboratories are spawning all types of very dangerous products of technology. How should technology be properly managed throughout the solar system? And yes, if the entire solar system is not covered - some very horrible experimentation might be proceeding unchecked on Phobos or Iapetus. My internet posting is really catharsis. What worries me is that most people don't have the time or energy to really sift through all of the conflicting and confusing information - and that they won't be able handle what we are presently discussing. Heck - couples fight over how toothpaste gets squeezed out! People look out of it and dazed as it is. I work with the public every day, and half the people barely make eye contact with me. I'm sensing an insensitivity and lostness which will make it very difficult for the general public to understand and cope with what's been going on under our noses, over our heads, and under our feet - for a very long time - seemingly using tax money, drug money, and even blood money.

You mentioned Paola Harris, and I immediately thought of Col. Philip Corso, and I watched part of one of Paola's lectures, and noted that Col. Corso was Head of Intelligence (U.S) in Rome, from 1944-47 (and was heavily involved in Project Paperclip, if I'm not mistaken). I'm presently leaning toward the theory that Roswell 1947 and Muroc 1954 were staged by the Secret Government and Secret Space Program, of which Project Paperclip was no doubt an integral part. I suspect that real UFO's and PGLF's or Hybrids were used - but that they originated from Earth Underground Bases rather than Distant Stars or Planets. Underground Bases, Hybridization Programs, Ancient UFO Technology, and Occult Wisdom and Spirituality - going back thousands of years - may explain most of the Alien and UFO phenomenon. That's my theory - and I'm sticking to it - at least for now. Have there been any recent interviews or books by Philip Corso, Jr.? He seems to know a heck of a lot - but seems reluctant to really open up - for understandable reasons.

Once again - I'm trying to imagine being on the inside of a non-corrupt solar system government - as a mechanism for dealing with the historical madness and this present darkness. If the ideal and the reality can gradually be brought closer together - we might actually survive - and emerge as a model solar system. Hope springs eternal. I'm trying to imagine living inside of the United Nations, Washington D.C., the City of London, the Vatican, the Secret Government, the Secret Space Program, and the Underground Bases - throughout the solar system - as sort of an observer and facilitator - obviously in a delusional dreamworld. "Mr. Smith Goes to the Darkside of the Moon!" Perhaps this is a coping mechanism. I think I'm going to start reading the CFR journal 'Foreign Affairs' again - just to foster a creative link between little old me - and Megalomaniacs Anonymous. I want to try to be a non-corrupt 'One of Them' - rather than fighting with the PTB from the 'outside'. This is very tricky territory, and if it isn't done properly, I could see someone going downhill in a great big hurry. My preoccupation with an 'Anna', 'Kali', or 'Lucifer' character, who rules over all of us, might be an indication that I'm picking up speed on the slippery slope to perdition. The horror...

Thank-you for your detailed and thoughtful reply. You have obviously done a huge amount of research. The alien reincarnating into a human story is fascinating because I am fixated on the hybridization theory of the alien presence - that we are really them - and they are really us. I ironically posted an internet page a couple of years ago, where I 'claimed' to be a human reincarnation of the alien KRLLL - and that I had gone turncoat - and sided with the human race. I received a very angry response from someone stating that I was claiming 'godship' and that I would be severely punished!! I don't doubt that ancient aliens came to Earth (possibly from Sirius and Aldebaran). We may be some of those aliens. What I am enamored with is the idea of a Lucifer/Shiva/Kali/Anna figure being in charge of Earth - lifetime after lifetime - possibly as a hermaphroditic hybrid goddess of sorts - with complete reincarnational recall, with 100% use of their brain capacity - unlimited access to possibly stolen ancient advanced technology and wisdom - and so on. Could such a hypothetical figure have created most of our mythologies and theologies - secretly ruling over us with deception and force? I'm not questioning that a very real event occurred at Roswell in 1947 - involving real otherworldly technology and beings. But I am considering that the Secret Government is the same one which has been ruling Earth for thousands of years - and controls the megalomaniacs we love to hate.

Monday, February 18, 2008

I am known to humans as KRLLL. I am known to humans as an alien. I have been living on Planet Earth since the middle of the twentieth century. My planet of origin is located in the Pleiades. It is known as Pleon. I bring peace and wisdom. There is another alien force on Planet Earth who is your master. This alien force is not your friend, and yet you obey. I bring liberation, and yet you do not listen. Time is running out. Change course or forever face enslavement.

Here is something for you to consider:

1. Evolution of Everything (Physical & Spiritual).

2. Genetic Engineering & Rule by Good Aliens/Spirits (God) in the Garden of Eden (Ancient Earth). General Peace & Harmony.

3. Attack/Deception/War of Evil Aliens/Spirits against the Good Aliens/Spirits/Humans. The Good Aliens/Spirits are driven from the Garden of Eden (Ancient Earth). Humanity made a mistake of Biblical proportions. Genesis reads a bit differently, doesn't it? But what makes more sense? The Reptillian Devil was in charge, which is why Genesis reads the way it does!

4. Genetic Engineering & Rule by Evil Aliens/Spirits with Humans fighting with each other. Ancient religion emerges (Summarian, Egyptian, etc. - created by Evil Aliens/Spirits to control Humans).

5. Moses & Others rebel against the Evil Aliens/Spirits/Religions with the help of Good Aliens/Spirits. The Bible (Old Testament) is a mixture of Good & Evil. One has to carefully read between the lines to figure out what is really going on. The truth had to be disguised. Some activity atributed to God is really evil and of Satanic origin. Atrocities and sacrifices are examples.

6. Jesus intensifies the rebellion and establishes a condensed, non-corrupt version of the Old Testament religion promoted by Moses and Others. The Teachings of Jesus are generally ignored by the Christian Church for 2,000 years. Thus, the Evil Aliens/Spirits/Religions retain their control of Planet Earth.

7. People finally do what Jesus said to do (they haven't so far), and the Battle of Armageddon results. Good Aliens/Spirits/People battle Evil Aliens/Spirits/People for control of Planet Earth.

8. The Evil Aliens/Spirits/People are driven from Planet Earth and onto Nibiru, which becomes the Devil's Island Prison Planet of the Universe. The Good Aliens/Spirits/People gain total control of Planet Earth. This is the Garden of Eden regained, and what is known as Heaven or Paradise.

Proceed wisely.

KRLLL

Here is the response I received on April 7, 2008:

"You know this isn't funny! The Lord God will judge you for claiming God ship. Just because God showed you a little bit of His secrets you think you know everything. He will NOT have mercy on you!"

I'm thinking that my AV1 and MOA threads - combined with my YouTube posting will ultimately benefit mostly myself. I know that sounds selfish - and it probably is - but trying to convince others to travel the same road that I am on is probably an exercise in futility. I am starting to go through my old threads - and I am enjoying this immensely. I didn't do market research - and then tell people what they wanted to hear, and give them what they wanted. Some of my areas of study, my questions and conclusions - are downright politically incorrect and blasphemous. At a later date - some of them could be outlawed as being hate speech. Who knows - I may eventually be arrested - or worse. When will the excrement really hit the air-conditioning system? Obedience can be a good thing. Obedience can be a bad thing. I will ultimately go along with anything which is reasonable and rational - even if it isn't my own idea. I have been trying to quietly influence the infowar. So far - this worldwide infowar has been a cold-war - and I hope that it will continue to be so - but judging from history - it may very well turn violent at some point. I suspect that infiltration and instigation will be used to get people all riled-up and running in the streets - again judging from history. Then the noose will be tightened to 'restore and maintain order'. I obviously support law and order - but the best way to control the masses is to teach them responsibility and self-control. Unfortunately - I don't see this being done. The Irresponsible are leading the Irresponsible. The Corrupt are ruling the Stupid. The Blind are leading the Blind. The Bland are leading the Bland. This is very, very sad...

Don't be afraid. I mean no harm. This is just a modification of my previous 'out of here' message. I am going to retrace my steps - and really attempt to absorb the territory I have covered so hastily and hesitatingly - and really attempt to separate the wheat from the chaff. I will also attempt to internalize the wheat - and to walk the walk. I have tried to bring others along with me on my journey - and this may have been a mistake. But I really do think that the areas covered are key - and that they should be studied carefully. What I should probably do - is proceed as though I were writing a doctoral dissertation - and produce a 1,000 page scholarly book - with 100 pages of footnotes. I doubt that such a lofty goal will materialize - judging from my limited track record - but someone needs to do this. Joseph Farrell - where are you?

I'm also going to read a bunch of fringe books - and watch a bunch of sci-fi DVD's. I'm really going to try to post a lot less - but I'm not mad. Speaking of which - the more calm and passive the discovery process, the better. The disclosure material itself is so explosive - that one should probably go out of their way to take it slow and easy. I'm still interested in a job which helps to facilitate a Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Solar System aka The United States of the Solar System - which involves access without authority. Hell - I just want to fly in a UFO - without getting shipped off to a slave-labor yttrium mine on Planet 666 - and then used as food when I slow down. I really and truly hope that this solar system is in the process of becoming much more reasonable and ethical - with or without me. Namaste. I am of peace. Always.

I found it time consuming to dig up the old threads...and sometimes the search would not produce the long lost threads. Also...there is a progression of thought which has occurred...although some might call it a digression. At this point...I am filled with a mixture of dispair and hope. These threads are not intended to make anyone happy. They are intended to approach the reality of what is really going on in this universe...and then to facilitate the most positive long-term outcome possible...for all beings...throughout the universe. I want to view all of the gory details...and then begin to create order out of chaos...and rise to new heights...sort of like the Flight of the Phoenix. [url="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OxfZHP1HHHg"]YouTube - Flight of the Phoenix Trailer (2004)[/url]
Thank-you Anchor. All I can do is point in directions where I see light. I have nothing original...yet I can sense when other people are on the right track...I think. I don't have everything figured out. I'm just struggling and thinking out loud. One probably shouldn't do that in public...but I don't consider this forum to be public. The groupings of the videos seemed to be important to me. They fit together...and complement each other. The puzzle is quite large and complex. Smoke is just pouring out of my ears.

I just keep hoping that people will be able to adjust to all of the new information without becoming violent or going insane. There is so much upsetting and conflicting information out there. Plus...I believe there is an unseen battle on a supernatural level. We are getting pushed and pulled in all directions...and we all have breaking points. Each person must find their own way in their own time. In many ways...I think the transition is going well. It could be going a hell of a lot worse.

I'm going to go through all of the above threads...and watch all of the videos. The people in these videos are not the last word...but many of them are trail blazers or pioneers who should not be ignored...and who can help us discern the truth or error in subsequent prophets or whistle-blowers. I like to consider information which is at least five years old...in order to evaluate the validity of the then new information or predictions. People need to win my trust. But no one is perfect. Some of my favorites had very serious flaws. I like Bill Cooper a lot, for example...but he struggled with alcohol and temper issues. He was very confrontational with authorities...and sometimes did not know when to stop. In other words...no one should become an idol or a god.

When I listed these threads...I realized that they were not particularly profound...but that they covered some territory which I hadn't found elsewhere on this site. I guess this is just another potential piece of the puzzle...and what a puzzle it is! Good luck everyone!

I would love to meet with a group of scholars regarding the above threads...and have a completely blunt...non politically correct...take off the gloves...12 hour marathon discussion/debate. This group might include Jesuits, Alphabet Agency Representatives, Reptilians, Greys, Researchers, Lucifer, etc. Unfortunately...at the end of the 12 hours...I would know way, way too much...and we all know what that would mean. Actually, I would probably be so depressed...that they wouldn't have to do a thing...if you know what I mean. I feel like we are just scratching the surface here in this forum...but we may all need much thicker skin to be able to properly handle the full truth. In a sense...we may need to go to hell...before we can go to heaven. I tend to think that many leaders fear that the human race would go to hell...and stay there if they were told the full uncensored truth. This may be a major reason why there is not full disclosure. There are some legitimate reasons for secrecy...but I think that most of the reasons are evil and corrupt as hell. This forum may be an experiment...to see how non-insiders react or respond to the gradual release of inside information. This may help non-corrupt powers that be to properly introduce the new information to the general public. Just a thought.

Thank-you. I love it when they all find out that the aircraft engineer is a toy plane designer!! Surprise! What if the person who has the most to offer to get us out of this mess...has absolutely no credentials or credibility?! Do we evaluate ideas based strictly upon merit...or do we worship titles and resumes? Haven't the experts of the world gotten us into this mess? Why should we trust them to get us out of this mess? What if a being in the form of a young lady...runs the solar system?

Step right up! Pick a thread! Any thread! But be prepared to have your preconceived notions completely unravel. :shocked:

You know...I would love to see a file on my posting activity...done by a seasoned C.I.A. analyst. Maybe someday I will see such a file...in the hands of a prosecuting attorney. I hope not...but these are very crazy times. I have absolutely no idea whether these threads...plus any other postings on this site and YouTube...are in any way, shape, or form...considered to be a problem by any authorities...at any level. I tend to think that so few people view this material...that the effect is really inconsequential. And of those few people...the ones who actually connect the dots may actually be non-existent. But for those in the know...I have a sneaking hunch that they see exactly what I am seeing...and that this composite picture is quite startling...and potentially destabilizing.

At this point...I don't really see what the point of all this really is. I open myself up to being placed on lists of troublemakers. Very few people are influenced. And these few are probably less happy after seeing some of what I'm seeing. So I'm thinking that maybe we really are sheep who cannot lead ourselves...and that efforts to change this may be futile at best...and detrimental and destabilizing at worst.

I keep saying that I am going to take a break...but I just can't stop posting. Well...I'm going to try again.

I'm trying to take a break from posting...but I just couldn't resist requesting that someone make a critical study of these threads...and issue a verdict. I'm too close to them...at this point...to be objective. They are sort of a road less traveled. Be honest about the overall picture which emerges. Thank-you in advance. :original:

I'm transmitting a request for help into the vast regions of space and cyberspace...for conversation regarding these threads. Is there intelligent life out there? The threads are very diverse...yet there is a common thread. I'm just trying to figure things out...and I don't have the answers...or even the questions. Again, I'm too close to these threads to really be objective...and I need some criticism...constructive or otherwise. Consider these threads to be Orthodoxymoron University. Upon completion...you will receive a Disoriented to the nth Degree. :shocked: And you think you have problems now?

I'm running out of steam (if I had any to begin with). On an ongoing basis...over many months...the subjects and concepts which I am interested in...seem to spark very little interest in others. I can understand this...but I don't know where to turn...to continue my quest...or if I should be a quester at all. Any ideas? If I had lied...and claimed to be a hybrid abductee with all the answers...and dire predictions…complete with dates...there would probably be huge interest! What the hell is going on?

GOING...Going...almost gone...

[url="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=22QYriWAF-U&feature=related"]YouTube - One is the Loneliest Number[/url]

[url="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TXZMZ-XvvzI"]YouTube - They're Coming to Take Me Away, Ha-Haaa - Napoleon XIV[/url]

gone :tongue2:

Because the search function continues to be non-functional...I thought I'd bump this thread to see if there are any takers. 'Come into my threads'...orthodoxymoron said to the unsuspecting Avalon members. :sneaky2:

Thank-you JesterTerrestrial. I don't know what to do. For now...I'm going on a bump-strike. I'm going to bump this thread every few days until the search function is completely restored! I wanna talk about some of these threads. Maybe I should reincarnate to the forum as a claimed ET from Planet BS...and do a mentoring thread titled 'The New Attitude of Gratitude and Servitude'...full of bs and exotic terminology aka intergalactic mumbo jumbo aka the universal language. Then there would probably be tens of thousands of views and hundreds of comments. Then I could write a book...and move out of this dump. You sneak and peak guys know what I'm talking about. Please flush the toilet next time...

Thank-you. They know more about us than we know about ourselves.

I like to think that we are the best buddies of the non-corrupt powers that be...because we are rationally examining some very controversial subjects...rather than going crazy. I like to think that we are sort of a buffer...which will help to keep society balanced. I like to think that we are a part of a low-key disclosure project...where a lot of the secrets of the universe...and dark secrets...are gradually being integrated into the public consciousness...in an evolutionary rather than a revolutionary manner.

I'm still looking for unsuspecting mortals to communicate with. I'm just trying to build on what I have examined thus far. I'm not new to thinking about spiritual things and science...but I am new to looking at all of the relatively new information available on the internet. It's quite startling and overwhelming to me. I'm looking for a unified field theory of the alien presence. I have a feeling that when we research everything to death...in a free and open society...we will be astonished at how simple and obvious things will turn out to be. We seem to be presently wallowing in a fog of illusions, smoke, and mirrors. I feel like I'm at sea most of the time. I want things to start clarifying and solidifying...even if I don't like the reality which emerges.

The most important thread to me is the 'United States of the Solar System' thread. http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=15878 I'm trying to pull all of the theological and metaphysical stuff into the orbit of the U.S. Constitution and Bill of Rights...as a non-theocratic union of spirituality and state. It may seem dry and boring at first...but I think there are a lot of dazzling possibilities in this approach. I'm not a constitutional scholar...but I am sold on the concept of Constitutional Responsible Freedom. I don't know where this will lead...but I am going to attempt to take this concept as far as I can...and hopefully more capable people will take the concept where it deserves to go. I'm just a crazy mixed-up pseudo-intellectual who is trying to find peace and happiness in a very crazy universe. I am completely convinced that facing reality...including the realities of historical atrocities and enslavements...will pave the way for a better universe. We may have to wade through an unbelievable amount of negative material in order to see the light. The threads can be somewhat negative...but there is always an attempt to find solutions and to emerge with a stronger paradigm.

The second most important thread to me is the one on 'God, Jesus, Satan, Lucifer, Etc.' http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=15014&highlight=orthodoxymoron This thread is quite irreverent...but a stronger spiritual foundation is that which is desired. I believe that this thread dovetails with 'The United States of the Solar System' thread. I confess that I am a heretic...but I'm really trying to exorcise the demons from the church and from the solar system. All of the ufo/alien/spiritual/religious/political discussion should be addressed from a theological and constitutional perspective.

So please take a look at both of these threads, if you haven't already...or take another look. Most of the other threads are instructive regarding these two primary threads. Oh what a tangled web I'm weaving...and I'm not practicing deceiving. Just the opposite.

Thank-you Noela. The link seems to not be functional. Here is a link which works. http://www.thedivinecouncil.com/Introduction%20to%20the%20Divine%20Council%20MTIT.pdf Here is a link to a Dr. Michael Heiser interview. http://derekpgilbert.com/?p=3342 It's really quite good. I love this sort of thing! Here is a video of an Old Testament scholar who has a doctorate from the University of Edinburgh...Dr. Alden Thompson. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4523891344008092279# I have one of his books 'Who's Afraid of the Old Testament God?' He is a very pastoral scholar who presents problems...or hints at problems...and then resolves them in a soothing and pastoral manner. I once told him that I didn't think that Jesus was God. He unsuccessfully attempted to change my mind. I like him a lot...but I am taking a radical surgery approach presently...and hoping that the patient doesn't die while I attempt to remove the theocratic-cancer which I believe is growing on the human race. I am attempting to replace a Universal Church Theocracy with Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom. I can't be fired for my radical views. My livelihood is not tied to my editorial bias. I think that we need to stop beating around the burning bush. We need to be very, very honest...even if this results in severe pain and suffering. We need to take a swig of whiskey...bite the bullet...and get on with it. Avalon seems to be an appropriate place to attempt this. I would never try this in a church setting. The resulting controversy would be an intellectual and spiritual Armageddon. Check this thread out...regarding a huge controversy within the Worldwide Church of God (I don't just pick on the Catholics!). The video is very well done. http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=13882&highlight=worldwide+church There is a time and a place for everything. I'm admittedly a pseudo-intellectual bull in a theological china closet...a real loose cannon...armed with a tactical nuke! "Calling all Jesuits! Calling all Jesuits! Be on the lookout for orthodoxymoron! That cursed Judas!"

Seriously...I would love to be present during a top-level Jesuit theological discussion. They fascinate me...and they terrify me. They could do much to promote Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom...and to breathe spiritual and ethical life into it...once Lucifer (or equivalent) retires...and they are freely able to integrate their discipline, organization, and education into modern life. I'm serious. They know better...but their hands seem to be tied...and they are obedient servants. They need to be free. That's what I think anyway...but what do I know? I don't want the church to disappear. I want the church to be completely reformed and purified. I'm not sure about the details.

I like listening to people who know how to combine academic freedom with pastoral responsibility. The two people in the previous post (Heiser and Thompson) know how to do this very well.

Jordan Maxwell has a Roman Catholic background...and as a child listened in on conversations regarding Vatican intrigue. I have heard him hint that the Vatican does what it is told to do (by non-humans who are not necessarily good). He properly understands that the historical and contemporary Vatican does not view the United States and the U.S. Constitution as a positive development on the world stage...to say the least.

Now I'm going to listen to Jordan Maxwell. I still find it interesting how his lecture at Awake and Aware was seemingly cut short while he was talking about the Vatican being the biggest enemy of the United States. I think this is true...but I don't think the Vatican really wants to be...but they do what they are told to do.

This may sound crazy...but the Draconians may have to decide that Responsible Freedom is in their best interest...before the Vatican can really do the right thing. I think the historical and present hierarchical arrangement of the universe is all wrong...but what do I know?

I'm sorry you wasted your time on the WCG video. I have noticed a decided preference for the sensational throughout society...and not just on this site. Hollywood has trained us well to expect to be entertained...while we as a society ignorantly head straight toward the hot place. I hope that the new 'V' series will combine attention-grabbing sensationalism with a solid dose of reality regarding the trouble we are really in.

However boring they may be...documentaries which chronicle how people have been misled and manipulated...can prevent untold disillusionment and heartache. I see people jumping out of the frying pan...right into the fire...every single day.

Jordan Maxwell seems to have a crystal clear view of the trouble we are in. He convincingly presents the problems. Unfortunately...he offers few solutions. I have feebly offered some of my solutions here in Avalon. Unfortunately...there seems to be almost no interest in them. Jordan may be right. We may be so apathetic and desensitized...that we are past the point of no return regarding the New World Order Theocracy scenario.

The cynical views of Sigmund Freud and Edwin Bernays may be spot-on. Does anyone know what I'm talking about? Anyone?

Welcome beren...and thank-you. I agree with Jordan Maxwell that we are in a spiritual war...which could help to explain why valid solutions are skipped-over, ignored, or actively opposed. If we could see the unseen forces which I believe surround each and every one of us...we would probably be horrified. Ignorance is bliss...but it can get us enslaved and exterminated.

See you on the Jordan Maxwell thread.

The battles which go on just beyond our perceptions must be something to behold. I still think that evil entities can tempt, harass and annoy us...despite angelic protection. Obviously I don't know the details. This is just what I think.

Power Corrupts. Absolute Power Corrupts Absolutely. Are there any beings in the universe who are exempt from the truth of this concept? I don't think so. Has universal history consisted of tyrants replacing tyrants replacing tyrants replacing tyrants? I think so. How long does it take for a good-guy to become a bad-guy once they achieve Absolute Power? Not very long...in my view.

I have not read J.R.R. Tolkein's books...but I have read several C.S. Lewis books. My favorite is 'Screwtape Letters'.

You rightly understand the relationship between freedom and responsibility. I'm just starting to grasp this subject. This is the key to everything. This is the truth which will set us free.

If we choose to do the right thing...the bad-guys are going to try to keep us from doing the right thing. To believe that believers are somehow exempt from competition with evil entities is naive in my view. We are in the middle of a spiritual war.

Thank-you for your insights.

I'm just thinking out loud here...which is what I do every day here...for better or for worse. I'm going to renew my vow to review these threads. Sometimes repetition is essential. Churches use repetition...week after week after week. This is partly good and partly bad. The alternative crowd runs around like chickens with their heads cut off! I guess what I'm saying...is that I'm going to try to build on a foundation. I'm considering the United States of the Solar System thread to be the foundational thread...with the other 52 threads as supporting evidence. I doubt that anyone else has the time, motivation, or energy to help me do this...but one never knows.

It's no secret that I'm burned-out big-time with traditional religions of all kinds. I seem to pick on the Roman Catholics...but they're just the biggest game in town...which most of the others follow...whether they realize it or not. I don't hate any of them...but I'm still burned-out. I am equally suspicious of New Age philosophies, religions, and programming’s. I'm really one miserable S.O.L.S.O.B. But misery loves company...so here is my invitation to accompany me on my spiritual quest...but don't expect it to make you happy. I just want the truth. I don't care about the happy part. The PTB will give you what you want...and tell you what you want to hear...as they lead you down the primrose path...on the Highway to Hell...paved with bad intentions.[url="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQIxn7s3ym8"]YouTube- AC/DC Highway to Hell Live!![/url]

I hope no one takes any of these threads too seriously. I'm just trying to make everyone think...sometimes by being a bit contrarian and irreverent. I want to stop posting...but I just can't seem to help myself. The areas of study are more important than any conclusions I have seemed to reach. Your answers are more important than my answers.

Which is more important and desirable...Peaceful Dialogue or Triumphant Victory? Which of these two options should the most powerful factions in our Solar System choose to pursue?

I don't really know...because I don't really know the facts. All I know is that what has been (and is presently) transpiring...is really $crewed-up. Just look at the carnage and misery of the past 100 years. And we're supposed to be 'civilized'. For shame.

I'm having a bad day. I don't want a solution. I just wanna bitch.

The most recent Avalon meltdown screwed up most of the video links...and I have been spending hours repairing the damage. I made a post...just before the meltdown...where I questioned whether I should post it or not. Well...when I tried to...I got that database problem screen repeatedly. I went to another site...and when I returned...the message had posted. Shortly thereafter...the site went down. I'm sure there was no connection...but it made me wonder at the time. Also right after I made that questionable post...I could have sworn that something supernatural briefly appeared between me and the monitor. Probably just my imagination...but it made me wonder at the time. This whole thing seems to be an uphill battle...with few rewards...and many possible problems...such as getting on lists for discussing controversial topics in a public forum. It really seems to be an exercise in futility and a tempest in a teapot. Gotta go take my medicine...before I really get going. Over and out.

Thank-you Jacqui D. I'm just dealing with the kid's-stuff...and even that is scaring the heck out of me. :shocked:

To all the new people...I have been stumbling around the internet for a while now...and this is a collection of some of my escapades. Please take a look...and tell me what you think. I think the regulars got tired of me a long time ago...so maybe I can pick a fight with some of you newbies...before you get me all figured out! These threads probably won't make you happy. They might cause you to become very upset...so be forewarned. My goal is to make you think...and not to spoon-feed anyone with anything. I keep saying that I don't know...and I really don't. I'm just trying to deal with the crazy world and universe we live in. I see things getting worse...before they get better. We are going through a trial by fire...on the way to bigger and better things.

Some of the links in the threads may be ruined. There was a site meltdown...and it destroyed most of the links on my threads. I've reconstructed some of them...but it may be a few days before I finish repairing the damage.

Just another invitation for conversation. I'm not trying to make anyone happy. I'm just trying to relentlessly pursue the truth...and not necessarily according to SaLuSa. If you want to be happy...move to Oregon and smoke weed. :smoke:

Rational conversations and concepts do not seem to succeed. Fame, fortune, power, and pleasure seem to do very well. We also seem to be sitting ducks for exciting, sensational, and entertaining things...even if these things are not ultimately in our best interest. It may be past time to move on. I think I wore out my welcome a long time ago. I often feel as though I got dropped off on this planet by mistake. I don't feel like I belong here. Maybe I don't. I've been neglecting my personal finances and home maintenance. Idealistic dreamers may always lose to greedy b@$t@rd$. The bottom-line may be the bottom-line after all.

This is just an renewed invitation to talk to me about some of these threads. The subjects were not chosen with malice and forethought. They were pretty much random choices of roads less traveled. I have encountered few kindred spirits throughout my life...but hope springs eternal. I'm still searching.

This is pointless. I'm out of here. I need to concentrate on doing what pays the rent. I also feel like I'm grandstanding and self promoting...and I don't like that. Also...this stuff is too controversial...and I want to try to get myself off of the lists before the theocracy and enslavement really kicks in. I have learned the hard way that people really do not want to be free...and I certainly do not wish to force freedom on anyone. That would be an oxymoron. :zip:

I am still interested in discussing these threads. Is this an appropriate forum to do so? Is there another forum which might be more interested and receptive? Should I join the crowd...and Groove with the Thubans? Maybe I should start channeling...conjure up UFO's...or have an intimate relationship with a Reptilian. It's got to be sensational...doesn't it? Give 'em what they want...right? Tell 'em what they want to hear...right? Maybe I should do some market research...and post accordingly. Any ideas?

I'm still interested in some rational conversation on these quite diverse and random threads. There is a common editorial slant...which should become clear as you sample the various threads. It's sort of a road less traveled...but that might make all the difference. I don't try to make people scared or angry...and I don't claim special powers or experiences...so there is limited interest. However...simple and boring might be the way out of this mess.

I'm trying to let go of a lot of this stuff. One side of me wants to be a crusader for The United States of the Solar System. The other side of me wants to shut the @#$% up...and just live...especially since it appears that most of us are not interested in being responsibly free or in the self-rule of this Solar System. I completely identify with Jordan Maxwell's comments at the end of the Camelot interview. I have sensed the same thing in many other progressive and profound thinkers.

I may just gather what I have done on the site...and craft it into something...I don't know what. I just need to do something different. Maybe I'll just review everything. I've been trying to build some sort of a foundation...as in philosophical and theological roots...which would actually work for everyone. I think I just need to go through all of the threads...and rethink everything. A little bit of knowledge...and a lot of emotion...can be very dangerous...and I don't wish to be dangerous. Just the opposite. So...I'm going to try to post a lot less. I've tried to do this before...but the abraxasinas situation and my first ufo sighting sort of wore me down to an all-time low.

I really think you might find these 52 threads to be a profitable road less travelled. I've tried to be honest...but I am a master of none of the subjects. I claim very little. I just wanted to discuss various topics which mostly were not the latest craze. I have longed for some academic analysis of my speculations and thinking...but so far...this has not occurred...and I doubt that it ever will. I guess I'll just have to keep using my imagination...to explore these roads less traveled. Perhaps that will make all the difference.

Thank-you for your wise words Devakas. The whole world contains much wisdom...and that includes India. I'm trying to think of myself as a citizen of Earth...and open to all cultures, races, and religions. I live in the United States...but I don't think of myself as an American...in a nationalistic or protectionist sense. I like the principles and concepts of the founders and the founding documents...but I consider myself to be a citizen of India as much as a citizen of the U.S.

Thank-you lisa. I'm often more shallow and gullible...than I am truly open. But I'm working on it. It takes an open person to know an open person...and you seem to be equally open. Namaste. People have lives. They have families. They have jobs. They have problems. They don't have the time, energy, and inclination to basically become monks...and think everything though...with much pain and suffering. It's a nasty job...but someone's gotta do it! Thank-you for the tip on the meditation course. Of course...my problem may be that I meditate too much! Or...do I vegetate too much? Some call it laziness. I call it deep thought! Forget Deep-Throat. Listen to Deep-Thought! Everyone's too involved!

What if nearly everything is BS? What if we are all deluded? What if our battles are really delusions in conflict? What if we need to start from scratch? I'm just considering these threads to be my attempt to sample various modalities of thinking. The real answers may yet be on the horizon. I feel very unsatisfied with nearly everyone and everything. The United States of the Solar System is my best idea for a next step. If we do this...the stage may be set for doing something of a more refined nature in 100 years. I believe in evolutionary change...and this seems to be a logical next step. But I think we're just scratching the surface of considering the possibilities regarding what things should really be like here in this Solar System. Please think long, hard, and independently...but don't get angry or go crazy. Good Luck!!

I just want everyone to be happy and get along with each other. This is the goal behind all of my threads and posts...even the most controversial ones. I'm thinking that I've pretty much made my point...and that I probably should not post nearly as much. I probably won't go to Avalon 2...but I'll always be lurking in the shadows. Thanks to all who have helped me to learn about life, the universe, and everything...and that includes you abraxasinas.

Here are some posts I made on another thread...and I just wanted to condense them...and place them in a more appropriate context than the original thread...where I got a bit carried away. Here goes:

I grew up worshipping and praising 'God'. I don't do this anymore. I have painfully come to the conclusion that the very concept of 'God' is highly problematic. I believe in spiritual things. I believe in good and evil. I believe in the highest ethical behavior. I believe in life after life after life. But We the People of Earth should not bow down and worship, praise, and unquestioningly obey anyone...male, female, human, reptilian, grey, it, etc, etc. We the People of Earth should rule ourselves. I think that Jesus tried to tell us this...in a bit of a round about way. The religious people have gotten it wrong...and the atheists have gotten it wrong. I guess I want a secular spirituality which does not involve formal, arbitrary, and ritual religion. I can say more about this...but I'm tired...and I find this difficult to discuss at the moment. For now...see the statement below:

We the People of Earth have before us the opportunity to forge for ourselves, and for future generations...a True World Order. A world where Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom...not the Old World Disorder Demonic Theocracy...governs the conduct of nations. When we are successful...and we will be...we have a real chance at this True World Order...an order in which a credible United Nations can use Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom to fulfill the promise and vision of All Races.

Organized religion is the isness turned into the business of a luciferian monopoly on monotheism. How's that for a heretical mouthful? I'm so gonna burn!

A Reading From the Twenty First Chapter of Leviticus:

1.And the LORD said unto Moses, Speak unto the priests the sons of Aaron, and say unto them, There shall none be defiled for the dead among his people:
2.But for his kin, that is near unto him, that is, for his mother, and for his father, and for his son, and for his daughter, and for his brother,
3.And for his sister a virgin, that is nigh unto him, which hath had no husband; for her may he be defiled .
4.But he shall not defile himself, being a chief man among his people, to profane himself.
5.They shall not make baldness upon their head, neither shall they shave off the corner of their beard, nor make any cuttings in their flesh.
6.They shall be holy unto their God, and not profane the name of their God: for the offerings of the LORD made by fire, and the bread of their God, they do offer : therefore they shall be holy.
7.They shall not take a wife that is a whore , or profane; neither shall they take a woman put away from her husband: for he is holy unto his God.
8.Thou shalt sanctify him therefore; for he offereth the bread of thy God: he shall be holy unto thee: for I the LORD, which sanctify you, am holy.
9.And the daughter of any priest, if she profane herself by playing the whore , she profaneth her father: she shall be burnt with fire.
10.And he that is the high priest among his brethren, upon whose head the anointing oil was poured , and that is consecrated to put on the garments, shall not uncover his head, nor rend his clothes;
11.Neither shall he go in to any dead body, nor defile himself for his father, or for his mother;
12.Neither shall he go out of the sanctuary, nor profane the sanctuary of his God; for the crown of the anointing oil of his God is upon him: I am the LORD.
13.And he shall take a wife in her virginity.
14.A widow, or a divorced woman , or profane, or an harlot , these shall he not take : but he shall take a virgin of his own people to wife.
15.Neither shall he profane his seed among his people: for I the LORD do sanctify him.
16.And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying ,
17.Speak unto Aaron, saying , Whosoever he be of thy seed in their generations that hath any blemish, let him not approach to offer the bread of his God.
18.For whatsoever man he be that hath a blemish, he shall not approach : a blind man, or a lame, or he that hath a flat nose , or any thing superfluous ,
19.Or a man that is brokenfooted , or brokenhanded ,
20.Or crookbackt, or a dwarf, or that hath a blemish in his eye, or be scurvy, or scabbed, or hath his stones broken;
21.No man that hath a blemish of the seed of Aaron the priest shall come nigh to offer the offerings of the LORD made by fire: he hath a blemish; he shall not come nigh to offer the bread of his God.
22.He shall eat the bread of his God, both of the most holy, and of the holy.
23.Only he shall not go in unto the vail, nor come nigh unto the altar, because he hath a blemish; that he profane not my sanctuaries: for I the LORD do sanctify them.
24.And Moses told it unto Aaron, and to his sons, and unto all the children of Israel.

The Word of the Lord? Thanks Be to God?

The problem with my posts is the disruption and disorientation factor. Hopefully this is minimal here in this philosophical no-man's land of Avalon. But exercise extreme caution in the area of theology. It is a Pandora's Box. People sometimes divorce...go insane...commit suicide...etc...when they lose their faith. A pastor once told me not to get too deep into theology. I belonged to a church which prided itself on the fact that people studied their way into the truth of this faith. But later...many of their children went to college...and found out that all was not well with the faith...and studied their way out of the church. And all too often...no one other than their parents...seemed to give a rat's patootie. All too many of us received a swift kick on our way out the door.

The God of This World is Not the God of This Universe. I suspect a malevolent collection of aliens playing God...with a kingpin named Lucifer. Jesus tried to set us free. The Teachings of Jesus can help us to tap into the divinity which is in each of us. This is not an arrogant assertion. But it may be Us vs Them...and we need to understand this if we are going to stand up to Them...and Set Ourselves Free. I try to follow the words of Christ...but I am not waiting for him to come and save us. Beware of a staged UFO invasion and a staged Second Coming of Christ. God save us from our saviors...and we have nothing to fear but the fearmongers.

"God's work on Earth must truly be our own." (JFK)

Achieving a critical mass of Christ-like beings(human and non-human) on Earth is the key to liberation. This will precipitate a global exorcism. I'm not anti-alien...just anti-demon. I speak in speculative generalities because the people in the know...don't seem to want us to know. They keep us guessing.

Originally Posted by 14 Chakras:
Quote: "Achieving a critical mass of Christ-like beings(human and non-human) on Earth is the key to liberation."

Response by 14 Chakras: I agree on the human part, this is the key. A critical mass of Christ Beings, a "Christ Mass" of people of planet earth (not aliens pretending to be humans - sorry aliens, you don't qualify for this part of the mission, this is not your planet) who surrender the illusion they are only human and replace it with the reality that they are infinite spiritual beings who, in Oneness with all life, are here to raise up creation from within, is required to make the shift into the golden age without the prophesied 'birth pains / cataclysms / atrocities'... The question is, are YOU going to step up to the plate?

My response: I like this post. But if malevolent aliens are jerking our chain...we may need the help of benevolent aliens to accomplish a global exorcism. If malevolent aliens are holed up in heavily fortified Deep Underground Military Bases throughout the solar system...with reinforcements on the way...we may be in more trouble than we can possibly imagine. We probably need insiders...human and non-human...to be decidedly on the side of Responsible Freedom. I like the idea of interacting with benevolent aliens. I wouldn't even have a problem with some of them living on Earth...but they could never be our rulers or gods...and truly benevolent aliens would never play the part.

God is a Composite. If God is an it...is Satan an it too? If there is a Divine Feminine...is there a Demonic Feminine too?

I offer the following as a suggestion rather than as a dogmatic assertion. It is my idealistic view of what theology should be(if we need theology at all). I do have a darker view of theology...which is partially explored in this thread. These thoughts seem to make sense to me, but they are not orthodox or widely believed. They could be considered to be heresy. So burn me!

The Trinity is avoided by a lot of clergy. It's a lot easier to speak of loving neighbor as self, than it is to speak of one God, in three persons. And we haven't seen any of them. That we know of, at least! Is God the Father the one who sends fire down from heaven, makes rules, orders people to kill other people, is overbearing and authoritarian? Or is God the Father the same as God the Son, Jesus Christ? Jesus said, "Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father." So is it the first or second option? All of the above or none of the above?

Allow me to gingerly suggest that God the Father can be equated with what I refer to as God the Concept: The most ideal, yet realistic conceptualization of God, which changes constantly as times, knowledge, needs and perceptions change. God the Concept can be male, female, or a composite of the two. A combination of reality and fiction! There is enough reality for believers to believe, and enough fiction for doubters to doubt. I believe that God exists, but that it is still necessary to invent Him, or Her, at least partially! And believe it or not, I say this with the utmost reverence and respect. I believe that God wishes for us to be open-minded and honest. If we are wrong, God can work with us on that. That is forgivable! If we are narrow, closed-minded, arrogant, and dishonest...well that comes very close to sinning against the Holy Spirit. God can't do a lot to help us at that point! God the Father, as pictured in the Old Testament, was the conceptualization of God necessary to accomplish the foundational development of religion, with the door left wide open for future representations of God, and the advanced development of religion.

Is Jesus Christ the only Son of God, begotten, not made, of one being with the Father? Has God appeared in human flesh only once in all of history, and for only 33 years, and of that, with only 3 years of high-profile visibility? Allow me to gingerly suggest that God the Son can be equated with what I call God the Human: The most God-like human, male or female, alive at any moment throughout human history, and inclusively, but not exclusively, Jesus Christ! For practical purposes, to avoid confusion, and because they are true and ageless, the Teachings of Jesus are the absolute foundation of the Christian Church. They build on the moral teachings of the Old Testament without including the ceremonial and ritual teachings!

In the fullness of time, prophetically, Jesus Christ emerged as the most God-like person on the face of Planet Earth. Indeed, he was, and is God. No other human can make that claim! But Jesus said, "greater things will you do!" How could the followers of Almighty God do greater things than God Himself? Jesus set the standard, and drew a line in the sand regarding character and behavior. But when Jesus came to Earth, He was on a mission-trip, not an ego-trip! Would you really respect someone who expected to be worshiped and praised? I do respect someone who walked the walk, talked the talk, and simply asked to be loved and taken seriously. In mind, character, and personality, others throughout subsequent history undoubtedly equaled the spirituality and morality of Jesus Christ. But it has not been their role to be the benchmark of humanity, the gold standard of righteousness!

In one sense, others have been God the Human, but not in the same sense as Jesus Christ. They have more precisely been God's Ambassadors to Planet Earth. These highly righteous people did not become the new foundation. These people must keep referring back to the life and teachings of Christ. That is the standard! It is their role to live the life of Christ, and to apply the teachings of Christ to their time. As Christians, we are followers of Jesus Christ. He is the foundation of the magnificent structure being constructed on Earth, called the Kingdom of God!

Is the Holy Spirit really real, and really God? Is the Holy Spirit the most real, most presently present, and most agelessly God? Allow me to gingerly suggest that the Holy Spirit is the most God-like spirit being at any moment throughout spirit history. Not a single entity! Kindred spirit beings represent the mind, character, and personality of this primary spirit being to human beings here on Earth! Corporately, these spirit beings constitute the Holy Spirit. Omnipresent! They represent to us the living Christ, based upon the historical Jesus, and especially the teachings of Jesus. But the adaptation is contemporary!

The inverse of all that I have said above would constitute a Satanic Trinity! I believe in this reality as well. This is a very, very dangerous reality! This is why I plead with you to pray to God earnestly in the name of Jesus Christ, and with the power of the Holy Spirit! Pray! Don't delve, or play spiritual games! If you experiment rather than pray, you will undoubtedly end up playing with the Devil and the Demons!

I am saying this to scare the Hell out of you! Have I succeeded, or do you feel lucky? Satan would love to have you go ahead and make his day...

Could this(the second video) be getting close to who Lucifer aka Satan aka God of This World is? We might be very surprised at who runs Earth, the Solar System, and the Universe. Do world leaders have to bow down to such a being in an inner earth temple? See video clips below.

I agree with you completely. This is very simple...yet very complex. When we finally get this sorted out(if we survive)...it will probably seem so obvious and elementary...yet it may take us millions of years to get there. I hope not. But how long has this universe been engaged in fighting over who gets to be God and who gets to be The Master Race?

I'm trying to think through a constitutionally based solar system...where reptilians, humans, and greys peacefully engage in commerce, athletics, education, tourism, the arts, entertainment, etc. There would be no God, no Satan...and nobody would have to bow down and worship anyone. No one would be a master...and no one would be a slave. Everyone would be in charge. I keep referring to the U.S. Constitution because of it being in use for over 200 years, and being currently in use. There could be others...perhaps superior...but I'm trying not to reinvent the wheel. It does not imply nationalism or protectionism. It does imply We the People(we the beings?) being in charge...in an organized decentralism.

If there are Deep Underground Military Bases throughout the solar system inhabited by various factions of humans, greys, and reptilians...an all out war would be utterly devastating. A voluntary cooperation under a constitution would make so much more sense. The gods could retire...which is what I want. I don't want Lucifer(or equivalent) to be hurt or killed...I just want the reign of terror to end.

I'm suspecting that well intentioned beings of all races...for billions of years...have tried to be God...and failed miserably. Absolute Power Corrupts Absolutely...no matter how intelligent and well-intentioned you are. It turns a Good God into an Evil Satan...and it probably doesn't take very long.

Did I suggest making the Bible the standard? I have suggested making the U.S. Constitution the standard. Truly benevolent reptilians, greys, and humans should have no problem with this. It would be corrupt beings who wish to be God Almighty or The Master Race who would object to a decentralized form of government which empowers everyone.

I think that it is very plausible that when anyone is ruled over...that they eventually rebel. Then they try to rule...only to find their subjects rebelling against them. Could one third of the angels have been humans...one third reptilians...and one third greys? Were the humans in charge? Did the humans abuse their power and mistreat the reptilians and greys? Did the reptilians rebel? Were the greys caught in the middle? I'm thinking more and more...that the history of this universe is very, very sad. Jesus said 'I have many things to tell you...but you cannot bear them.' Jesus also said to 'be wise as serpents'...and I don't think he was referring to rattlesnakes. Despite the plagiarisms, redactions, supressions, misinterpretations, etc, etc...I think that Jesus was the real deal...and tried to set everyone free...including the reptilians and greys.

I'm exploring the possibility that it may be impossible to be God...without becoming Satan. Absolute Power Corrupts Absolutely. I guess I'm calling for all of the Gods and Satans to step down from their thrones and retire...and empower the beings of the universe with Constitutional Responsible Freedom.
I guess I'm not calling for a new God. I'm calling for No God. I believe in the existence of God...but I believe that God should not exist.

Atheistic Spirituality: Orthodoxymoron or Wave of the Future? Thou shalt have No Gods. This is a new thought for me...and I am not dogmatic(godmatic?)...not yet anyway.

Hello Lucifer. Why don't we just call the whole thing off...and go and get drunk? I'll buy.

Pat Condell has quite a few videos on YouTube. I generally like him...although I would never rant like he does...not publicly anyway! He's a bitter ex-Catholic! One has to have a theological background to be able to rant like he does. I love theology...and I hate theology...simultaneously.

In the fourth video...at 2:14...there is a four-fingered hand...which looks like an alien's hand in a famous alien photo...to me at least. Hmmmm.

Watch these videos over and over...and imagine the 'god' in the temple speaking the words spoken by Leo. Do we have a match? Is this what Lucifer looks and sounds like? Does Lucifer live in an Inner Earth Stargate Temple/Cathedral in a Deep Underground Military Base where Eucharistic Liturgies involving Live Human Sacrifices are performed? Do world leaders worship and praise the God of This World in this Temple/Cathedral? Was Leo possessed? Was 9/11 an Inside Earth Job? Did ET Phone Rome...and Call 911? I'm obviously speculating...and making a giant leap...but the shoe seems to fit. Is the New World Order the Sacred Roman Empire aka The Kingdom of God aka One Nation Under Satan? The Old World Disorder Demonic Theocracy? Leo was looney...but was his rant very revealing regarding the nature of the NWO? Listen very closely. What does he say about God being a Man...an Alien from Sirius...the Prince of Sirius? The Prince of This World? Giza Intelligence? Seriously. Is Lucifer losing it? I maintain that Lucifer is more deranged than evil. Beings throughout universal history have become drunk and deranged with power...despite their best intentions. Hello Lucifer. Am I getting too hot? The power of Christ compels you to surrender the solar system to Constitutional Responsible Freedom. The universe is watching. I don't hate you. I just want you to retire. Imagine that: Me Tempting Satan! I want all Gods and Satans to retire...Permanently. Absolute Power Corrupts Absolutely. God is a Fraud. God is Satan. Satan is God. The Universal Church is the Synagogue of Satan: A Luciferian Monopoly on Monotheism.
Checkmate. Game Over. Lucifer...Let My People Go. Now. Then I'll buy you a drink...and we'll talk about sacred music. I go for Baroque.
YouTube - The Temptation of Jesus by the Devil in the Wilderness
YouTube - Leo Zagami the 2012 Armageddon
YouTube - Ra Stargate - Devil Came To Me
YouTube - Oh My Goddess movie:God is a girl
YouTube - ABC's 'V' - Upfront Trailer - with Elizabeth Mitchell - 3rd November 2009
YouTube - The Day The Earth Stood Still - Trailer HD
YouTube - Leo Zagami Admits Demonic Possession but fights satanists
YouTube - (2/10) Moziah Delivers Leo Lyon Zagami from Lucifer
YouTube - (3/10) Moziah Delivers Leo Lyon Zagami from Lucifer
YouTube - (4/10) Moziah Delivers Leo Lyon Zagami from Lucifer
YouTube - Satan in the Vatican
YouTube - Catholic Inquisition and The Torture Tools

I found the following in chapter 19 of the 'Dulce Book' http://www.thewatcherfiles.com/dulce_book.htm on the watcherfiles.com website. I don't know if this is credible...but it really made me think. If the U.S. Constitution was the central authority of the solar system...instead of any deity or demon...no one would be worshipped, humiliated, exalted, enslaved, etc. If Lucifer is the god of this world(and solar system?)...and will not relinquish power to anyone else('if I can't have them...nobody can!')...because of fear, pride, and degeneracy...might a constitutional ultimate authority allow this being to retire with grace...and return to Draco or Orion? I'd really rather skip the Battle of Armageddon.

'One of the 'targets' to which Mr. Brown's military RV trainer sent him was the Grey aliens' collective mind, and more specifically he was instructed to search out the ultimate command or control center of the collective.

Shortly after this particular experiment began [one of many], Brown found himself in an area where several Greys were working, although he did not know exactly where this was. He 'followed' the collective mind or thought-flow and found it to be absolutely massive, giving him the feeling of something unbounded, and almost universal in nature. However, he did detect a center, a definite 'heartbeat' of this massive collective matrix, into which and out from which a steady stream of information was flowing.

He noticed, at one point, an unusual 'subspace' being that seemed to be directing the activities of the Greys he was observing, and discovered that the bodies of the Greys themselves were incarnated by such 'subspace' beings which apparently entered the Greys' embryonic bodies and used them as vessels to manipulate physical reality.

Brown was then instructed to locate other of these beings who apparently controlled the Grey collective from a subspace or astral level, and found himself in an area where several of these subspace or paraphysical entities were located. As he continued towards this 'center' the number of subspace or non-corporeal beings increased until he came to a place of much activity, something like a grand central station type of area, where these beings were very active in various pursuits. He did not know exactly where this was, but noticed that the closer he came to the control 'center' the more he sensed an increasing rigid atmosphere of absolute military-like control. He came to what he sensed was the central governing center of the subspace beings' activity, and in the center of this there was another area where a "council of 10" very high-level subspace or paraphysical entities congregated. These were apparently the governing principalities who were engaged in running the whole operation. The security here was absolutely incredible.

Then he perceived the SUPREME LEADER of this council of 10 paraphysical entities... and at about this point Courtney Brown was jerked back into his body, so to speak. He sensed that this leader had detected the presence of his own subspace, astral or magnetic body which he had projected, and had followed this RV 'intruder' back to his physical source. Brown and his trainer felt an oppressive, dark 'cloud' enter the room and it stayed there for about half a minute scrutinizing the scene. It left, apparently seeing the two RV'ers as "small frys" who were not worth wasting its time on.

Before Brown's expulsion from the command center however, he was able to perceive for a brief moment what this being was really like. He or it was an extremely powerful being, but one with a twisted personality that was full of darkness. Apparently this being had come into conflict with another Force which it saw as its enemy. Brown sensed within this being a severe self-esteem problem, in spite of its incredible power, and because of this it had a consuming desire to be worshipped by others. Brown was confused when he sensed that these subspace beings, and in turn the Reptilians/Greys, were actually COMMANDED by this leader to engage in self-indulgent and destructive activities. This being apparently wanted his servants to use self-indulgent rewards or fear of punishment to maintain the absolute hierarchical command structure within its empire -- as well as through the rest of the subspace hierarchy, and in turn throughout the Reptilian Grey's collective 'hive' society that they completely infested.

Brown also got the impression that it was FEAR and PRIDE -- its perceived NEED to be worshipped -- that kept this being from negotiating with its ancient enemy, and that this being was utterly desperate to maintain its very survival or existence [strange for a seemingly immortal subspace being] and chose to resort to rebellion and terrorism in a desperate attempt to take control of the situation. Brown recieved a strong impression that this being was the ultimate universal terrorist!!! Apparently because of its all-consuming ego this being would NEVER humble itself before its 'enemy', and the same might be said for most of the upper echelon of the hierarchy who depended on the praise of their fellow collaborators to maintain their illusion of self-importance.

These beings, one might say, had long ago and of their own free-agency 'imploded' in upon themselves -- becoming 'spiritual black holes' with all-consuming appetites, absolute astral vampirial-like parasites, having extinguished all 'light' within themselves and therefore being unable to be brought back "into the light". Incapable of giving out 'light', they have become totally reprobate, devouring any and all life and innocence around them that they can possibly consume. The leader of this subspace 'collective' had long ago drawn these other dark beings into itself, like a large black star devouring other smaller ones around it. This irreversible state MIGHT not apply entirely to ALL of these "subspace" beings, as we will see later on.

Now if we go to the book of Revelation, chapter 12, we find that the ultimate leader of the serpent race's collective or 'hive mind' is Lucifer, also known as the "great red dragon", the "old serpent", "the Devil" or "Satan" in the same chapter. Lucifer was one of the three original archangels [aside from Michael and Gabriel] who each apparently had charge over one-third of the light beings whom the Almighty had created... possibly numbering in the billions or trillions.'

YouTube - INTERVIEW WITH GOD
YouTube - Joan Osborne - One of UsYouTube - Godless and free
YouTube - The Great Dictator - speech
YouTube - Where the Hell is Matt? (2008)

I don't blame the Roman Catholic Church. This goes way, way back into antiquity...and is Luciferian. Human beings are not our enemies. Lucifer works through all religions...old and new. We live in a haunted planet. We are truly in a very spooky prison. If Jesuits choose to turn on Lucifer enmasse...the demonic reign of terror will probably end. The Jesuits may turn out to be the best friends of the human race. But if they do this...they may pay a very frightful price. We live in very interesting and dangerous times. Hang on folks.

I enjoyed watching these videos...but there is truth and error to be found everywhere. Just don't choose one church or guru...and don't stop asking hard questions. I've learned a lot from New Age sources...and from Jordan Maxwell...but I have learned a lot from Roman Catholics, Atheists, Agnostics, Protestants, Etc, Etc. My mind is a real zoo of ideas. That's a scary thought...isn't it?

antonia: Thank-you.

tone3jaguar: I agree. I'm not an expert on this subject. I'm just trying to think about it...and get other people to think about it. What I presented in the first post is simply the way I am leaning presently. This could change completely and suddenly. I'm not blindly speculating...but I am speculating nonetheless.

I feel like I'm fighting an uphill battle with this stuff. If I really understood what I'm dealing with...I'd probably leave the topic completely alone. We wrestle not against flesh and blood...but against principalities and powers...and spiritual wickedness in the heavenlies. The horror.

I don't think evil is supposed to be here...but that it is part of the evolution of the universe. It may have been unavoidable. Again...I think that beings throughout the universe have done the best they could for billions of years...but have probably gotten it wrong over and over again. One would think that the God concept is the way things should be...but again...I presently think that it is impossible for a God to avoid becoming a Satan. Again...Absolute Power Corrupts Absolutely. This may be the Original Sin. The Mystery of Iniquity. This is why I am leaning toward a constitutional model of organized decentralized power...with Responsible Freedom as the Modus Operandi. This is not rocket science. It is really restating the obvious. But sometimes the obvious is obscure. I choose to eschew obfuscation!

When this present darkness turns to brightness...I really and truly would sit down and have a bottle of fine wine with Lucifer...and I've never had a drink in my life. I just want the BS to end. I don't want revenge, vengeance...or even justice. I just want the bad guys and gals to become good guys and gals. Amnesty and Immunity in exchange for full disclosure, cooperation, and reasonable restitution...would be fine with me. Again...the BS simply needs to stop.

I don't know if Lucifer frequents Avalon...probably not...but one never knows. I'm certainly not going to involve myself in rituals or exorcisms to get my 'opportunity' to interview Lucifer. Therefore...I sometimes address Lucifer...just in case. Hello Lucifer. Let my people go. Retire.

Here is a link which is relevant to this thread. Zagami stated in the video interview with Forerunner that aliens are just a cover for demons. This source says the same thing: YouTube - January 26th, 2008 - Part 2 (2nd Interview)
I tend to think that both good and evil is hierarchical in nature...with leaders of both polar extremes. I guess I'd like to see this all go away. I really want the bad guys to become good guys. I'm really confused and conflicted about non human races. Should they be kept at a distance so they don't dominate and enslave us...or should they be completely involved in our society? If we extend the hand of friendship...will we lose our hand...and maybe everything else? Should Earth be completely human...for a while...until we get our house in order...and figure out what is really going on in the universe? Should a United Nations based upon the U.S. Constitution(my bias) be exclusively human regarding what happens here on Earth? I'm open and friendly...but still quite paranoid. At what point should an abused spouse become trusting?

I don't trust what anybody says...period. I think Zagami is a real loose cannon for both the good-guys and the bad-guys. He must be a royal pain for the Jesuits. I think he is a very conflicted person. I really hope he survives. He seems to be into some very, very dangerous territory. He needs to totally commit to being a good-guy...sever all of his dark ties...and then have the best spiritual advisors and bodyguards possible...24/7.

Could it be that malevolent ET's masquerade as God, Satan, Demons, Angels, and even Deceased Relatives? I'm leaning strongly toward the idea that it's Us vs Them...here on Earth at least. I don't doubt that benevolent ET's are out there...Human, Reptilian, and Grey...but I'm tending to think we are somewhat screwed for the time being. We need a Global Exorcism big-time. I could be very wrong...but this is what I presently think.

I agree.

Everyone should study theology and/or comparative religions...even if they don't believe. It seems that it is helpful to be religious...become disillusioned...and then regain faith through studying everything. But this can be an excruciating process. Many who lose their faith...never regain it. I experience spiritual agony and ecstacy simultaneously and continuously. Sounds kinda kinky...doesn't it? Call it 'Masturbation of the Mind'. This has been known to cause spiritual blindness. Everyone should struggle for ultimate truth...even if it is elusive.

This thread is generating very little interest...and I'm not sure why. I think this thread contains some very interesting concepts and conjectures...along with some evidence...which I did not have when I starting posting some of these thoughts a year or two ago. I'm unsure about who Avalon regulars and visitors really are. I often think that the PTB spies who monitor this site just laugh...if and when sensitive information surfaces...because no one probably pays much attention to it! Right Lucifer?
Is this a tempest in a teapot? Probably. But it sure is fun!

Are the aliens who get shot down and tortured(sources?) benevolent or malevolent? Are they the same ones we interact with in Deep Underground Military Bases? Who really controls these bases? I enjoy life...and I count my blessings. However...I am paranoid regarding the New World Order, Fascism, Naziism, a Malevolent Alien (demonic?) Theocracy, etc. I really do want to interact with non-human beings...but the basic Teachings of Christ and the U.S. Constitution are two things that I do not want anyone...human or non-human to destroy. I am sick and tired of a very sick, stupid, and violent history of the world. I want the BS to stop...regardless of who is, or who is not, responsible.

I had hoped for some more discussion regarding this thread. I don't care if the responses are positive or negative...I'm simply trying to generate some interest in some unorthodox views of theology...or demonology. This may be very, very important regarding figuring out what is really going on in the world...and in the universe. Try to think beyond Sunday school...and beyond the egomaniacal televangelists.

Threads are so easily lost and buried. They can be hard to find...once they fade from view. Searches seemed to work better in the past. Has anyone else noticed this?

Please consider the first post very carefully. I need some critical feedback. I'm trying to determine the level of my sanity...or insanity. I wish I were joking.

Hollywood knows more than we Goyim know. Consider this...when considering this thread. Also...look at this Lone Gunman video clip which preceded 9/11 by six months. Note particularly the appearance of the remote control pilot at 7:47. In light of the rest of this thread...is the appearance of this individual significant? Was Lucifer the remote control pilot of the planes or craft which hit the Twin Towers and the Pentagon on 9/11? Was the controlled demolition remotely controlled from the same laptop computer? Do the orders still stand...for 'Earth Changes'? Lucifer...just call off the New World Order...institute Constitutional Responsible Freedom...and retire. You've earned it.
YouTube - The Lone Gunman, Pilot Episode (Air Date: March 4, 2001)

Thank-you David. Can the scientific method be applied to these subjects? I think so. I see fudging and manipulation on both the believing and unbelieving sides. Positions are taken...and then defended by all means...both legitimate and illegitimate. The real truth may mostly be none of the above. We may all have to admit that we were wrong. But most people don't want to admit error...especially when it comes to belief systems. Keep searching...and be honest.

I'm still interested in some detailed critiques regarding the first post...including all of the short video clips. For the real impact of what I am suggesting...repeated reading and viewing may be necessary. I know this takes time...and is a bit boring. There has to be a clergyperson or Jesuit who can skillfully disect this thread. I don't mind being wrong. In fact...I would prefer to be wrong this time.

Please don't ignore this thread. This is not just a bunch of mumbo-jumbo. Is this subject too hard to think about? Is it perceived as being irrelevant? Or...is it just plain boring? Again...I would just like to hear various opinions and insights.

Are we dealing with basically three physical/spiritual races? Humans, Greys, and Reptilians? Are these races in conflict with each other? Does this go back billions, or even trillions, of years? Is there a colorful orb at the end of the tunnel? Is it just a chimera...or an oncoming train?

I'm presently leaning toward the idea that there are three basic races throughout the universe...human, reptilian, and grey...that they are all both physical and spiritual...and that they all reincarnate. There may be combinations and variations of these races...but that they are all based upon these three basic groups. I'm also leaning away from the idea that there is an all powerful, all knowing, all loving God...who rules over the universe. I'm seeing Star Wars...with the three races fighting to see who gets to be the Master Race. I'm also leaning toward the idea that here on Earth, at least, the reptilians and greys are secretly ruling the humans...and that this secrecy is coming to an end...and may result in a huge fight.

My solution is to base everything on the U.S. Constitution and Bill of Rights. Each race would use this document internally...to rule themselves with Constitutional Responsible Freedom...without interference from the other races. Then...in a Universal United Nations...based upon the U.S. Constitution and Bill of Rights...the different races would interact with each other. Enslavement and Extermination would cease...permanently. No one would blindly submit to anyone or worship anyone.

Constructive Competition would completely replace Destructive Competition. Positive Response Ability would replace Reactionary Retaliation. Constitutional Responsible Freedom would replace a Universal Church aka One Nation Under Satan aka The Old Universal Disorder Demonic Theocracy.

I'm leaning toward the idea that there have been numerous Gods and Satans...human, reptilian, and grey...spanning billions of years...and that because absolute power corrupts absolutely...a new God quickly becomes a Satan...which results in a rebellion...which results in a new God who quickly becomes a Satan...ad infinitum...ad nauseum.

I'm leaning toward the idea that Lucifer aka The God of This World...should turn the reins of power over to the U.S. Constitution and Bill of Rights...and retire. Immunity in exchange for disclosure and cooperation might need to be part of the deal. Somehow...I don't think this is going to happen...but it should. Hope springs eternal.

I don't doubt that a superior document could be produced...but the U.S. Constitution and Bill of Rights have been in use for centuries...are currently in use...are simple and to the point...and work very well when they are not ignored or subverted...as they have been, and are currently being, ignored and subverted in the United States.

I'm just trying to test these ideas...and I need both positive and negative input to do so. Avalon seems like an appropriate forum for this. I hope this is a clear synopsis of the first lengthy post...and not reduced to the point of absurdity. If you have time...please consider the entire first post. This thread is more of a tentative suggestion...than a definite proclamation. I really don't know...but it seems to connect a lot of dots...and tie a lot of loose ends.

Thank-you Ashatav. I have watched Walter Veith before...and I generally agree with his research and conclusions...although I do differ substantially with his primary theological foundation. I will watch this series of videos...and comment on them. Please...everyone should watch Walter Veith...even if you don't agree with his theological views. He presents excellent information. What did you think of my first post, Ashatav? Tell me what you really think...positive or negative. I'm sort of a Paranoid Lone Ranger right now...and almost everyone may angrily target me when they realize what I am really saying. I don't shout this stuff in the churches, state-houses, and universities. I just mumble anonymously on the internet...

If there are indeed dozens or hundreds of races which are not based on the human, reptilian, or grey models...including the one with 30 arms...and the races with balls(I mean orbs)...and if these races have advanced beyond being warriors, exterminators, dictators, etc...then they probably wouldn't have a problem with Constructive Competition and Constitutional Responsible Freedom in the context of the U.S. Constitution and Bill of Rights. If what you are saying is true...it may be easier to solve the universal problems than I thought.

Again...I'm not an authority with inside information. I'm simply trying to wade through the BS...in order to end the BS. I simply want the misery of All races(however many there are) to END.

Could it be that humans, reptilians, and greys can spiritually manifest in an infinite variety of forms? Are many forms the result of horrible genetic experiments? I'm thinking that this universe is filled with deception, illusion, and unbelievable absurdities. I wish that it was isolated to this haunted insane asylum prison planet called Earth...but I presently think otherwise.

If the more advanced and benevolent races are unable to police the universe...then it sounds like it might be up to a critical mass of humans, reptilians, and greys...to choose to do the right thing...and bring law and order to this very screwed-up universe. I envision this as being an infowar...rather than a violent war. Violence Breeds Violence Breeds Violence Breeds Violence Breeds Violence Breeds Violence Breeds Violence Breeds Violence Breeds:wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall: And God aka Satan aka Lucifer aka The Great Dictator is NOT the answer. That's how we got into this mess. If we try this madness one more time...with the hope that this time it will be different...there may be nothing left. Nothing.
YouTube - Mos Eisley Cantina Scene from Star Wars
YouTube - Richard Pryor -- Star Wars Bar
YouTube - Sexy Cyborg!

Thank-you Brook. I tend to think that Armageddon would be a final human vs reptilian battle for Earth. I don't think this has to happen...and I don't want it to happen. There might be nothing left. Peaceful solutions are always better than violent ones. I keep telling Lucifer that he or she needs to retire. I'd prefer to see him or her switch rather than fight! Lucifer probably doesn't view Avalon...but one never knows!

I think that there is a divinity which resides within humanity...and probably within reptilians and greys...unless they are simply covers for demons...as Leo Zagami and others have asserted. I don't know. But we seem to have difficulty with spiritual growth and development. It often seems like a losing battle. I just think we need to work very hard at being better and better humans, reptilians, and greys...every day...and in every way. We should try to be Christ-like...whether we believe in 'Christian' theology or not. To me...this boils down to Responsible Freedom...which I prefer to place in the context of the U.S. Constitution...rather than in any religious source material...including the Bible. I just want to see the United Nations based upon the U.S. Constitution and Bill of Rights...and invigorated with Christ-like spirituality. There is a painting by Harry Anderson, of a gigantic Jesus knocking on the side of the United Nations building...seeking entrance. http://www.nathanshumate.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/04/princeofpeace.jpg I believe this entrance will occur when the U.N. Charter is rewritten to completely harmonize with the U.S. Constitution and Bill of Rights. This is my bias...and I am testing it here in this forum. It's really very, very simple. But simple and elegant often work quite well. I'm leaning strongly toward a humanistic solution...rather than a theistic solution. This solution would include reptilians and greys...but no one would worship, enslave, or exterminate anyone. This is kindergarten stuff...really. Unfortunately...a lot of us behave as though we never passed kindergarten...

I like the idea of recognizing the divinity within humanity in a non-arrogant sense. I like the idea of exalting humanity in an unselfish manner...rather than exalting the self in a selfish manner. Perhaps we have everything we need within ourselves...individually...and as a group...to save ourselves. Perhaps we do not need an external savior such as God, Jesus, Lucifer, Aliens, etc, etc. God may be within you...but with all due respect...I don't think you're God(this is not directed to anyone in particular).

Thank-you macrostheblack. Sometimes I wonder if the original God somehow became dispersed throughout all life throughout the universe...and thus we are a part of God. Or...what if humans, reptilians, and greys...in physical and spiritual form...are the products of evolution and genetic engineering? What if this is the top of the food chain? I hope not! But what if? Why does there have to be a God? If God was necessary to create the universe...who created God? This is the sort of thing that can put one in the nut-house.

I'm still waiting for a critique of the first post. I'm trying to think of who might identify with and agree with the editorial slant in that post. Bill Cooper and Alex Collier might...but beyond that...damned if I know. Actually...damned because of that first post!

Thank-you for your thoughtful post. I'm a fan of the Teachings of Jesus...regardless of the source. I'd be a fan of the Teachings of Jesus...even if Jesus never existed. I'm also a fan of the work of Ralph Ellis regarding Jesus.

Facing reality is extremely important. Embracing the dark side or rejoicing in iniquity seems to me to be highly problematic. I don't need to jump off a cliff...or bang my head against a brick wall :wall: in order to learn that this is a stupid thing to do.

Please consider the following thread in the context of the current thread. This stuff requires a lot of hard work to get it right. I'm too lazy...so I hope some of the rest of you can figure this out! http://www.projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=14402

[quote=TraineeHuman;153664]Ortho: “Embracing your dark side” as I and Jung and the advanced forms of all the world’s religions etc mean that phrase (or similar) certainly doesn’t mean doing any destructive acts at all. I thought I’d already made that halfway clear, but apparently not. The “embracing” part refers to admitting your negative impulses to yourself – but with the result that you then don’t act on them (apart from beating up a pillow in private, etc). You don’t act on them because you’ve then – and only then! -- become aware that they can be dangerous. One thing in the background of all of this is the fact that most of the things humans do are controlled primarily by the subconscious / unconscious. As any psychologist can explain, humans mostly behave subconsciously/ unconsciously rather than with full awareness of what they are actually doing. And therefore personal/spiritual evolution always centrally involves becoming aware of things we hadn’t been aware of – particularly things about ourselves. Thus the “embracing” part means shining the light on those things, and certainly not laying further darkness on them.

The whole point about one’s “dark side” is that one is unaware of, or lies to oneself about, it’s existence. That’s why it’s “dark”, or invisible, to oneself. I could give heaps of examples, but anything that’s “ego” is the dark side. To give an example of that, consider what Dr Phil calls “right-fighting”. That term refers to the reality that many people’s approach to any disagreement is to try to prove that whatever their position is is 100% right. The only reason such people behave that way is that to them every other alternative is outside their awareness, i.e. “dark”.

The more fully one does “embrace” some part of one’s dark side, the more fully one heals it and transforms it into something positive. Here “embrace” doesn’t have the wider meaning of laissez faire, which I guess is what you’ve taken it to mean. Laissez faire parents neglect their children emotionally, and parenting of that kind sometimes creates criminals out of the kids, or at best the kids grow up psychologically messed up. That isn’t accepting (embracing) one’s kids at all. Equally, “accepting” and “embracing” one’s negative impulses means dealing with them realistically and organically and pying attention.[/quote]

Thank-you for explaining and expanding. I think I did grasp the basic context and application of your use of the term 'dark side'. I am painfully aware of my dark side...and I intend to continue to do battle with it...rather than embrace it...regardless of any sophisticated definitions. The existence of our inside dark side should make us very suspicious of the 'God Within'...which could be the 'Satan Within'.

On the other hand...I continue to address Lucifer in some of my comments. I'm treating Lucifer as an equal. I'm not fearful or worshipful...nor am I scornful or ridiculing. Perhaps this is my way of embracing the dark side. Jesus said to love others as much as we love ourselves...and to treat others as we wish to be treated. So...I guess I have tried to apply this to Lucifer. I try to imagine what it might be like to be this being. I find this truly frightening and upsetting. I'm sensing a very good being who tried to do the right thing...and ended up in a huge, huge mess...a bottomless pit, if you will. Absolute power corrupts absolutely. The road to hell is paved with good intentions. If I tried to be master of the universe...the same thing would happen to me. I might be a lot worse. Now that's a really scary thought. I keep trying to think of a way for Lucifer to retire without humiliation or destruction. How could such a being be helped to recover? Is this even possible? We don't need to replace Lucifer. We need to eliminate the job completely. Lucifer...your services are no longer required. Security will escort you to your mothership. You mother. Don't feel bad...Oedipus was one too. All of the mothers of Earth should get on this mothership...and take a tour of the universe...for recovering a$$holes. They could call it AA. I'm half joking...and half serious. I want the bad guys and gals to become good guys and gals...but they may have to leave us for a while in order to do so.

Also...thank-you Jrod7. At what point does a human cease to be a human? At what point does a grey cease to be a grey? At what point does a reptilian cease to be a reptilian? What is Lucifer...really? An androgynous hybrid from Sirius...who looks like a young human woman?

It's a real zoo. There are so many different viewpoints...and everyone thinks they are right. Once a position is taken...people tend to defend their decision...no matter what contrary evidence arises. Religions and belief systems(bs) are defended by both legitimate and illegitimate means. If you can't convince them...confuse them! I'm tending to be very fickle and wishy-washy these days. It's harder to hit a moving target! :tongue2:

I'm still waiting for a detailed critique of my first post. The water's warm! Come on in!

Thank-you mntruthseeker. I'm not an authority. I'm simply searching. I doubt that I'll ever get things figured out. Don't follow me...I'm lost too. I'd probably be fired by any church or university...and for good reason. I wouldn't appeal.

I think we are told what we want to hear...and the politicians and clergy are afraid to tell us the truth. Demons sure know about Jesus. Good luck using another name in an exorcism. Albert Schweitzer was very critical regarding the historical Jesus...but very positive regarding the Teachings of Jesus. We have to figure this subject out for ourselves...and there is no easy way. But there is no question that there is spiritual power in the name of Jesus. Insiders are supposedly told not to talk about Jesus when approaching a reptilian. Hmmmm.

I keep wondering about the biblical story of a third of the angels being cast out of heaven. Does this imply three basic races? I keep thinking that the humans were in charge...and mistreated and ridiculed the reptilians and greys...until the reptilians rebelled...and the greys got caught in the middle. I also keep thinking that the greys may have saved the human and reptilian races from exterminating each other. Is our present predicament 'payback time' by the reptilians against the humans? I don't know...but it seems that we are in deep trouble right now. To quote that great American...Rodney King...'Can't we all just get along?' Obviously not.

Disclaimer: All of the above is educated speculation...and may be totally false.

The subject of God is illusive...but it should be pursued whether one is a believer or an unbeliever. There are foundational principles and concepts contained within this study...but it can create issues. My protestant work ethic helps me make money...but my puritanical guilt complex won't let me enjoy it.

Thank-you for reminding me about Credo Mutwa. I found his story quite convincing...although I had a hard time hearing and understanding him at times.

Here is another perspective on God and Jesus: YouTube - Life of Brian

There's got to be a Jesuit out there who can critique the first post of this thread. I'm really anxious to get some detailed feedback...even if it is devastating to the general editorial slant of that post. It's sort of like the soldier who puts his helmet on the end of his rifle...and raises it over a wall to see if anyone shoots at it. That's where I'm at. My mind is really not made up. I'm simply testing. This is only a test.

OK...I'm going to try one more time. Is there anyone who can provide a critique of the first post of this thread? Do we have a 'confession' from Lucifer regarding the ordering of 9/11? I have suspected this for nearly two years. Obviously...this involves a lot of dot connecting...and is not straightforward. Consider the first group of videos as a whole. Please review this post...several times if possible...and tell me what you think. There is a lot to digest here...and a superficial look just won't work.

What about you...Lucifer? Why not begin a dialogue here on Avalon? Again...I simply wish for you to retire. Being the God of This World must be one hell of a job. I think that it would drive any being crazy...human or otherwise. In the beginning...God should not have been God. But you should not have tried to become God in retaliation for God's original sin. The new commandment should be...'Thou Shalt Have No Gods...Period.' Why not step aside...with your hardcore followers...take a break...and then reenter interaction with the universe...as one of We the Beings...and not as God or Satan? If you change...your hardcore followers will undoubtedly change. Turn Earth(and the Universe?) over to Constitutional Responsible Freedom...not to any being...but to all beings. Tempted?

Those of us in this forum are a lot more interesting than the Satanists, the Illuminati, the Vatican, the NSA, the CIA, etc. We're crazy mixed-up mortals who are very curious about things on the fringe. You might find our innocence to be refreshing and therapeutic. Oh I know...your IQ must be at least 1,000...and you've been deceiving us for thousands and thousands of years...but your New World Order is a very bad idea...for everyone...including you. Tempted now?

Come on Lucifer! Comment! Everyone's doing it! What's the matter? Are you chicken? What's wrong with it? It won't hurt you to do it just one time! It feels good! So just do it! Unfortunately...you can't say that the devil made you do it! Can you? Come on! Loosen-up Lucifer! By the way...do you manifest in the form of a young woman? Is your name really Lucy Fir? Would you get mad if the Satanists chanted 'I love Lucy'? Come on Lucifer! Laugh!

Lucifer...I mean no particular disrespect or respect. Do you respect all of the stupid mortals who bow down and worship you...or who don't believe that you exist? Of course you don't! I think that you are scared stiff of people like me...who believe that you exist...yet who don't fear, worship, or obey you...and who are trying to expose you...for who and what you really are. Now how about commenting on the first post of this thread. Was I close...or way off?

Thank-you for yet another thoughtful comment.

There are probably malevolent humans and aliens playing God. There are probably benevolent humans and aliens trying to counter the first group...by playing God themselves. There probably is no all knowing, all loving, all present, all powerful God who created the Universe and who reigns supremely over all of creation. I could be very, very wrong...and would gladly eat humble pie...and wash it down with a big cup of shut the...never mind. I picture Lucifer and friends as playing the roles of both God and Satan. Yet there seems to be a God and Satan within each of us. There seems to be an ongoing power struggle. To me...reading the Bible makes a lot more sense...if one reads it with all of the above in mind. But this can get very complicated and confusing...which is why I am trying to think of spiritual things in the context of the U.S. Constitution...with a particular focus on Responsible Freedom. This probably sounds corny...but we need very simple...yet effective solutions for humanity...or they will not work. In essence...I keep repeating that 2+2=4. I keep restating the obvious...because I fear that humanity is so screwed-up...that this needs to be done...for a while anyway. Sometimes...one must over-do in order to un-do. This is just how I see things presently. This could change at any time...and without prior notice.

Regarding the exalting of humanity...what I mean is that I want everyone to make it and to do well. I will not consider that only a select few will make it. This is why I have no plans to escape the coming supposed calamities. I will go down with the ship...and would gladly give up my spot in a lifeboat to someone else. I like the soldiers and police who I deal with almost every day...so I don't intend to run away from them or fight with them...no matter what. Hell...I even want the alien races and Lucifer to survive and thrive. I know I'm living in a dreamworld...but I like my little dreamworld...called orthodoxymoronland.

Lucifer...Is your situation similar to that of Colonel Kurtz in the movie 'Apocalypse Now'? Is this the situation of EVERY being who has EVER attempted to be God? The horror. I feel a bit like Charlie Sheen in this thread...Lucifer. But I don't want you to die. I just want you to retire. And then I want you to make sure that this BS never, ever happens again...anywhere in the universe...with any being. You can be the God-Cop(with very limited authority-obviously). Three commandments I give unto you: I. Thou Shalt Have No Gods. II. Thou Shalt Not Be A God. III. Thou Shalt Not Be An A$$hole. World Without End. Amen Ra. Fair enough? Any questions? Has anyone...going back millions of years...ever said anything like this to you? Finish the Job. Retire. Do It.YouTube - Apocolypse Now!: Better angels of our nature YouTube - Gardenias YouTube - Apocalypse Now - Kurtz Dies

I'm still waiting for a reasonably detailed critique of the first post. I consider this forum to be sort of a brain-storming session behind closed doors. I realize that there are many visitors...but public exposure is very limited. Even among active members...there is very limited interest in this sort of thread. I suspect that the people who monitor sites such as this one...may be alarmed at times...but they shouldn't worry. Not yet anyway!

This video clip helps to turn the subject of this thread in a positive direction. Listen carefully to the words of these astronauts. [url="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oI1mEWp6fZE&feature=related"]YouTube - In the Shadow of the Moon (10 of 10)[/url]
I know someone who was a young boy when the first Russian satellite was launched into orbit. At Christmastime, his church school teacher asked, "the wise-men looked up, and what did they see?" The little boy quickly answered, "Sputnik!"

When the first manned Russian spacecraft reached orbit, the cosmonaut said that he didn't see God...

Nearly a decade ago, I witnessed the re-entry of a Russian spacecraft! In at least half a dozen pieces! All brilliantly burning as they streaked across the night sky! An intoxicated man next to me thought he was hallucinating, and was relieved when I saw it too!

Fast forward to February 1, 2003. I was working a night job, and at around 4:00 a.m. I told a fellow worker about the spacecraft incident. I hadn't talked about it for a long, long time. Then, minutes later, I heard the tragic news about the disintegration of the space shuttle Columbia. Probably just a coincidence, but I put the two events together in my mind, and it made a deep impression on me. While I was telling the story of the fiery spacecraft re-entry, the 7 Columbia astronauts had only minutes to live, and no one knew what was going to happen...no human anyway...

Evelyn Husband, wife of mission commander, Col. Rick Husband, tells in the book High Calling of Rick's last written message:

"Prior to launch, each astronaut fills out papers containing information for the Astronaut Office to keep on file in event of an accident. On the last page of this packet, titled 'Special instructions for Funeral Services,' there is a section called 'Other Special Instructions.' In this section Rick wrote, 'Tell'em About Jesus! - That He is real to me.' That's what Rick wrote down in case something happened. He wanted people to know about Jesus and His love. Rick's request has now become my life's mission statement, and I communicate that every chance I get."

Regarding the Stargate video of Ra in the first post...I received this response:

'Y'all love fantisizing over my ancestral decorations, places, spirituality that you don't get, the greatness you won't achieve, and the melanin you'll never have. This depiction of my ancestors is pathetic. Y'all always make them look just as degenerative and recessive as you. Anyway, play and have fun as much as you still can. Yes you are running out of time, and to be honest, there is absolutly nothing you can do about it. I have no mercy, you lie and mock and blasphem all the way to hell.'

On another website...I received this message:

'You know this isn't funny! The Lord God will judge you for claiming God ship. Just because God showed you a little bit of His secrets you think you know everything. He will NOT have mercy on you!'

I once heard a mocking, sing-song, high-pitched feminine sounding voice...emanating from a usually deep and masculine voiced televangelist...directed toward me...in public...almost shouting 'That was gooooooood!!!!'...in reaction to a polite, well intentioned, and well reasoned comment by me.

This was a short unedited internet exchange I had some time ago:

ME: What if the aliens who have been here for thousands of years are the 'bad-guys'? What if we will need the help of good aliens from elsewhere to get rid of the demonic aliens who are already here? Could this be viewed as a hostile alien attack? I really don't know. I am just speculating.

THEM: Try not to think in terms of good or bad. Understand this is not your planet. Then, understand nothing can be done to you that you don't do to yourself. Know that there are quadrillions of planets and they don't have a massive climate change every 26,000 years and violent deranged people like yourselves. Why on Earth would any race want to live here with you knowingly? The most intelligent life on the planet is not human.

ME: I'll try not to think of the Iraq War in terms of good or bad. I'll try to be morally ambiguous. I might even become CIA or a CEO. Hey, maybe violent and deranged is neither good nor bad...but thinking makes it so. The aliens who are here need us to not get our acts together. If that happens...they'll probably have to live on Nibiru...or worse. Sorry for being a smart-XXX. Wait...I'm not sorry...it's neither good nor bad. I couldn't resist. I mean well. Really.

THEM: And your point was?...............

ME: Who owns earth? Where do humans belong? What is the most intelligent life on earth? If they are so smart, and earth is so bad...why are they here? I may be deranged...but I'm not violent. You sound as though you are not human...are you an alien? If so...what kind...and from where? My point was that ethics are supremely important. I don't hurt, kill, terrorize, or abduct people...but some aliens apparently do(as do some humans). They should stop.

THEM II: Don't we like...create our own world? We're destroying our own world because our society isn't healthy.

ME: Our planet is how we plan it. Perhaps we need to fire some people in the planning department. You're right...society is sick...mentally ill. Perhaps our world is the Devil's Island Insane Asylum of the Universe. But it seems that some of the inmates are getting well...and helping other inmates to get well. Jail Break! Jail Break! Free at Last! Free at Last!

No further comments in this exchange. My questions went unanswered. The silence was deafening.

Was that you Lucifer?

Regarding the Stargate Ra video comment...many years ago a Roman Catholic musician related to me that a priest had asked 'What if God is a black woman?' I now wonder: What if this goes back to the Dogon Tribe or to Ancient Egypt? What if Lucifer aka The God of This World...is a young black woman(with the soul of an alien from Sirius)...The Prince of Sirius and The Prince of This World? What if Lucifer is a gorgeous Sex Goddess? Now I've really gone off the deep-end...right? I'm crazy...but I mean no harm. I don't suffer from insanity. I enjoy every minute of it! And I just love nuts on dates!

Hey Lucifer...how about a debate-date? We could debate architecture, music, theology, eschatology, universal history, universal governance, transition of power, etc...at Mork 'n Ork's Grey Bar...on the Dark Side of the Moon! What exactly shall we talk about? We could discuss the Soteriological and Eschatalogical Implications of the Hybrid Nature of the God of This World...or Original Sin in Heaven: The Mystery of Iniquity in the Great Controversy Between the Reptilian and Human Races in the Conflict of the Ages. That would just be an appetizer. Protection would obviously be a major concern. You'd have to promise not to bite my head off on the first date. I'm not really into the really rough stuff...like black widow tough love. You're the one my mother warned me about...in the book of Revelation! The NSA wouldn't mind handling the logistics...would they? Do you mind if I call you Lucy? If the date goes well...I could say 'I love Lucy!' Notice the Satanic hand-sign at 2:24![url="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A7F2X3rSSCU&feature=related"]YouTube - Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds[/url]

Here is another internet encounter which I found to be very interesting:

Veronica: Mad humans always existed, just don’t blame their actions (if existed) to the Reptilians. Is too easy to say people are been led by other species evils than admit that there are humans nuts by themselves. Reptilians are good, they only approach a human when they fall in love, and to do good to the beloved person. Satan is a word that means "attorney" in the original language. It is not an individual, the word can apply to many alien lawyer that have nothing to do with humans.

Orthodoxymoron: Is the Old Testament God really Satan...a Reptilian. Could the "attorney" definition have something to do with the legalism seen in the Old Testament? We humans are pretty disgusting in our own right...but I suspect that evil spirits and evil aliens make things a lot worse. Who is responsible for abductions, mutilations, etc? And what about the frightful appearance of alleged Reptilians. I'm not anti-alien...just anti-evil.

Veronica: Thanks for commenting on my post, and for the opportunity of bringing up this subject. The Old Testament Satan came from a species called Man of Tri. He was a good guy, having a beautiful personal trajectory of defending social rights on his planet, extremely intelligent, only bright and right lawyers are chosen to be a Satan. At the time he arrived on Earth, unfortunately, he had become insane, and he did a lot of harm, but it was because he was ill. His species lives 8.000 to 10.000 years of Earth, and he stayed much of this time here, doing harm. As there was few personnel from other species working here, few angels and lots of work to do in those days, nobody caught him. I am not aware if Eden destituted him while he was alive, but he did not act as a Satan here, though he had the Satan seal because he was a nominated Satan ( by Eden High Council). He acted as an insane man, because he was maddened by an illness. See, there is Good and Bad, and there is Evil. Good and Bad are complementary in a context. Evil is out of place. This is because the source of Evil is an illness. It is a virus. We call it virus of Tri because was first detected there. This virus attacks a small percentage of most populations. All species are united to find the cure, all species have problems with maddened guys, and, as humans, in all species most individuals are good guys living by common sense and good social rules.

Orthodoxymoron: Your website is very interesting. I'm wondering if you have heard of, seen or read a book titled 'The Great Controversy' by Ellen G. White? If so, what is your opinion? What is your opinion regarding the Teachings of Jesus? What is your opinion regarding the U.S. Constitution? What can you tell me about the New World Order? Is it really the Old Alien Order? Who was ultimately responsible for 9/11? Satan as a mentally-ill attorney is a fascinating possibility...

Veronica: I will bring the answers here later, just stopped quickly now to thank you. The FAQ is stuck for lack of questions and you really do good ones.
I don’t speak alone, I am supported by Lucifer embassy and by Eden. I got a long message from a Messenger Angel about these, it will take a while to translate, but I will let you know. Basically, about the book of Ellen White as well as the Teaching of Jesus, the message focus on the fact that we are the ones making the history now, there is no need to focus on history to know anything important. Each happening of history is fit for the time it happened. Constitution, summary: the real law is the law of Nature, not clearly understood yet, and the value of the C. relies on its closeness to the natural laws, not imposing limits to it. The C. is to assure freedom, but the freedom only exists when there is no need of law, be to limit, be to let free, other than the nature. As an overview, the U.S. Constitution is advanced, but not finished. Nature allow development and technology, as it works for the Aliens. What changes is the concept about life. New World Order never existed. If humans made their organizations, they were never powerful to threaten the entire world. Never existed an Alien Order, they are ordinary civilizations, with teachers and accountants and social philosophies, living well and satisfied, solving their problems as everyone else. I know it is hard to believe after all this negative marketing, but they are just here doing routine. About 9/11 the answer of the Angels is: All that participated of 9/11 are already dead.

I will put the answers here if you don’t mind, not to overload the comments on the video. You are welcome. The old testament is genuine, it was transmitted by Eden, and the prophets translated the best they could, but the angel’s language is not a piece of cake, and there are many misinterpretations, specially after translated to other languages and analyzed. People have the right to know how things are. I am a fallen angel, you probably heard that we born in human form. We have being trying to tell these things for many millennia, but the kings always kill us and burn our books. But this time there is Internet. I am telling this things on You Tube because I am still not sure if the powers of human will not try to burn the books again, if we start to speak to many people at once. Though the world is more civilized now. When you feel comfortable you can visit my blog, there is many more there about the Creation. There is also a book for download, it is a poem done by me with the angel Ariel, that is my brother. It was done to heal the heart, when people sometimes feel tired of the harshness of life. All material there is free and Creative Commons, we don’t want anything from anyone. We speak because it takes us closer of home. Have a great week.

About spirits: The spirits disturb, really. The fact is that spirits must remain sleeping, and when they are awake they do disturbance. What is important to understand is that never had, and there is not yet, personal enough to suffice the demand of work in Earth. The grays are the responsible to collect the lost spirits, this is part of their job and they are paid to do it and do well, but they are few with few equipment compared to the quantity of ghosts. If someone feel that is being disturbed, he must ask to the gray of his area to chase that specific ghost and the problem will be solved. They usually focus to sane the problems where more humans are being affected. To call the gray just make the request near one of their communication devices. These communicators are discretely placed where the community gathers to discuss the problems, such as churches or community centers, and by what they hear on these places they know where to act to solve the problems affecting more people at once. If someone speak to them directly pointing the problems, they can act more effectively.

Mutilations: Aliens never mutilate. Not even the criminals. Simply because third dimensional material has no use for anyone but to those who live in it. Most aliens can jump from 3rd to 4th dimension, but their feeding and living is done in the 4th. The 3rd is just for work, tourism or study. For any alien species the bodies of the 3rd D are troublesome to deal with directly, and is pointless. The cattle mutilations are done by rats, birds and small animals. There is plenty of analysis of these supposedly mutilated by abduction corpses, and most of them point to very understandable causes, though there might be something bizarre on nature that we cannot understand. If you wish to research deeper, there is a complete article done by a Brazilian magazine called UFO with legists doctors examining many of these cattle. All of them concluded the mutilations were done by rats, that choose the soft parts to eat first – eyes, nose, mouth, ears, reproductive parts, and from these to inside. The opening made by the small creatures who live from corpses are generally perfect and round, and they eat first from inside, it is easy to see at an apple eaten by worms. From outside it can looks good, and the small hole is perfectly round.

Real abductions: The Grays are the “nanny” of human species, as the human species of Gaia is young and still entitled do receive special care. Is the grays duty to assure that all human on the group under their care gets food, shelter and sanitary conditions ( not richness, it is only about the health). So, they ionize the air to kill bacteria, influence for resources to reach hospitals, researchers and sanitary organizations. The abductions occur when a special human individual gets ill, the “special” relies on fact that the person is a hub for the distribution of resources to many others humans. If that person gets ill many will be without resources and will be consequently ill too, so the grays operate this hub person so he can keep up as a resources distributor for that area. It is expensive for the grays, done rarely. But as humans start to communicate directly with the grays they might even buy this operations perhaps, paying by sending resources to other humans in need from that gray group. They do these exchanges with some sensitive’s, sometimes.

Reptilian appearances: The Reptilians are moved by the heart. They fall in love with humans more frequently than you can imagine, then they try to approach the person and everyone gets scared. They are an old, old species, with all existential problems solved, so they live in search of love and adventure. They are scary, of rude gestures, and cannot communicate well with humans, so the misunderstandings and confusions they cause are huge, but there is always an impulsive Reptilian in love behind, usually he does not succeed in his affair, sometimes do. They can fall in love with a person, with a population, with a politic system, with a project being made, by an object or place. It has nothing to do with the “take the world” theories, even because they don’t have to take, the Earth belong to them, and the Angels protect Earth because of them ,as they don’t fit anywhere else, while humanoids can be taken to other places. They are rough in the outside, and most sweet on the inside. Here is their place, the humans just need to learn to understand them, and I am sure will be great for all. They love to have other species living here, when a civilizations ends they long for the next.

I hope this information has a use for you. It is not something I read or heard, the source are the own Alien representatives. I took the task to clarify the misconceptions on the media on my group, and the intention is only to inform our point of view. I chose to speak person to person, with those who are interested on the issue, as being half-human myself.

Veronica: Hello friend, You Tube is making me tired. It is like a rally road and I don’t like it, I am a girl. Here are most boys trying to combat, not to fix on the subject. For discussion, only you were interesting. Keep my e-mail if you wish. You are welcome to discuss anytime.

Orthodoxymoron: Thank-you for your answers and comments. I hope that the internet and You Tube will help people to learn how to communicate more effectively and nicely. I hope things turn out well for everyone...humans, aliens, everyone. I even hope that Satan can learn to be happy without being mean and causing trouble. I don't want anyone to be miserable. Life should be enjoyed. I hope this universe can get past war. We should compete constructively...not destructively. Peace to you.

I'm almost begging for someone (perhaps a new Avalon member) to carefully examine this thread...from the beginning to this point...and to provide a relatively detailed response to the overall picture which emerges. If you read every word...and watch every video...you may be amazed. In any case...I crave an intelligent discussion of the issues and concepts raised throughout this thread. It almost seems as though there is an insurmountable brick-wall which is keeping people from dealing with the details of this thread.

I'm sorry you feel that way no caste. Perhaps you will not need pepermint to stay awake when the excrement really hits the air-conditioning...and the subjects which you found so very boring...spring to life. Unfortunately...it may then be too late. Perhaps the pepermint will then be necessary for other purposes. Good luck.

I am presently traveling from thin-ice onto very thin-ice. Reader discretion advised.

What if a Human Creator God...had absolute power...and became absolutely corrupted...and mistreated the Reptilians. What if this is Original Sin? What if the Reptilian Lucifer rebelled and destroyed this Human Creator God (was the New York Times right?)...and declared himself (or herself) to be the New God? What if this resulted in hundreds of thousands...or even millions of years of...Human vs Reptilian war? What if Earth history is a continuation of this conflict...with Lucifer playing God to the Human Race? What if all of the ancient deities were one deity...Lucifer? What if many of the major Biblical characters...including God, Moses, Jesus, Satan, etc...were all parts played by Lucifer? What if Lucifer is both good and evil...and is sort of a Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde...and can be the best of the best...and then swing to being the worst of the worst? What if Lucifer tried to do a better job than the original Human God...but became even more corrupted by absolute power than the original God? What if most of the major wars and atrocities have been instigated by Lucifer...up to, and including 9/11? What if Lucifer is very seriously insane...yet very truly in complete control of this Solar System...if not the entire Universe? What if Lucifer is responsible for most of the major architecture such as the Pyramids and the Cathedrals...and much music and science...etc? What if Lucifer is presently contemplating the extermination of most of the Human Race...and the enlavement of the rest...with the Reptilians ruling openly...sporting their new 'Human' bodies?

I sincerely hope that all of the above is utter BS...and pure, unmitigated popycock. But what if at least some of it is true? I've obviously oversimplified the theory...just to create a thumbnail sketch. I could say more...a lot more...probably too much. Please prove me wrong. I don't want any of this to be true. If it is...once again...I seek a Solar System based upon Constitutional Responsible Freedom...with No God...Reptilian or Human. I seek rampant Namaste...which would include both Reptilians and Humans. If Lucifer is playing God...I wish for Lucifer to retire and recover. Recovery may take hundreds, thousands, or even millions of years...but I do think that it is possible. Hope springs eternal. What do you think Lucifer? Can we stop the BS...and move on?

Now you know that I'm utterly mad. Can you imagine what would happen if someone preached a sermon like this? That would be the last sermon they ever preached.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CMub1_CdOrQ

Is this thread too boring, too unlikely, too upsetting, too irrelevant, too ?? Does my 'speaking' to Lucifer creep people out? I'm just trying to make a point. I'm still looking for some type of an overall analysis of the suggestions and implications contained within the entirety of this thread. It feels like I'm speaking into an empty room. Is anyone out there? Have I worn-out my welcome? Perhaps I should join the exodus...or perhaps I should say the hyksosdus. Does anyone know what I mean by that? Where should I go? What should I do? Maybe I should just forget about asking ultimate questions...and get a frikken life. Maybe I should get a real job...so I can get a Porsche...and then get a girlfriend (Lucifer doesn't seem to be interested in the above mentioned debate-date to the dark-side of the Moon - see post #64). I'm lost. Help. Analyze This. Please. Viewer discretion advised (language). Note the meeting of the Galactic Federation. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wvaweFZynY&feature=related

Thank-you 14 Chakras. A centralized and exalted unquestionable authority is a big problem. However this situation could have existed historically, and could exist presently. Are energy and consciousness synonymous? I don't think they are. I want to make this perfectly clear...I am not a pantheist.

I think I buy the idea that God (or a part of God) resides within humanity as the Holy Spirit...but I don't think God is in everything...everywhere. I also have problems with discussions of vibrational frequencies, densities, dimensions, holograms, illusion, duality, separation, etc. As I have stated throughout this thread...I have huge problems with the concept of worshipping and praising an exalted God. How about the concept of US vs REPTILIANS going back a long, long, long time? I like to keep it simple. I'd also like to see us (reps, greys, humans) leave each other alone...and have no Gods (other than the concept of Namaste). Finally...why would demonic entities want to have anything to do with pure energy? Wouldn't they want to feed off the worst and dirtiest energy? Maybe they just hate us because of millions of years of wars and atrocities...and just want to see us suffer...as revenge. Again...I like to keep things simple. Again...I think it would be in the best interest of all races to just leave each other the **** alone.

I reverence the Intelligent Designer of This Universe. I do not reverence the God of This World. I am becoming more and more attracted to the concept of Namaste. I am becoming more and more attracted to the concept of Seeing Christ in All Persons. I am becoming more and more attracted to the concept of a Solar System Exorcism. I am becoming more and more attracted to the concept of Human Sovereignty. I am becoming more and more attracted to the concept of a Vatican III and a Namaste Mass. We the People of Earth...need to get over our disfunctional relationship with the God of This World...and move on.

RedeZra: All of your posts are publication-quality...whether I agree with them or not. When I read your posts...I picture a very wise monk working in a monastery...tasked with reigning in heretics such as myself! :lightsabre:>>>>>:zip::lightsabre:

Check out the following links to the Urantia Book which are relevant to this discussion:

Chapter 53: http://urantiabook.org/newbook/papers/p053.htm
Chapter 54: http://urantiabook.org/newbook/papers/p054.htm

I've been listening to chapters 53 and 54 of the Urantia Book...regarding Lucifer, the Rebellion, and War in Heaven. If there is any truth to this at all...I keep thinking that everyone was partly right and partly wrong...and that one wrong leads to two wrongs leads to three wrongs leads to...:wall::wall::wall::wall:...a huge universal mess.

The key words in all of this are responsibility and freedom. The definitions, applications, implications, and ramifications of these words are enormous. They are a balancing act...without a safety net.

Could it be that the reptilians and greys were ruling from the shadows even in Heaven...prior to the War in Heaven...and the Fall? Did Lucifer smell a rat...and rebel in the same way that people are currently rebelling against what they perceive as the corrupt PTB? Was Heaven really Heaven...or were the heavenly PTB hiding a very dark secret? Did Lucifer soon learn that he too had to deal with the reptilians and greys? Is this true for all factions in the universe? Is Lucifer a mediator between the reptilians and Earth humans? Is the Pope the visible manifestation of Lucifer...the Vicar of Lucifer? I don't say this as a slam or an attack. I'm just trying to figure out what the hell is going on...and why nothing makes sense. If all of the above is true...could the reptilians and greys get what they want by peacefully coexisting with a sovereign humanity? Reps ruling reps. Greys ruling greys. Humans ruling humans. Wouldn't this be in everyone's best interest? I think it would.

I'm not sure what the details are...but I see huge problems involving responsibility, freedom, power, government, reptilians, greys, and humans...going back billions of years. Why can't a rational interrelationship be established between these seven words? Why is this so hard? Why does everything have to be so stupid?

How do we really know that Lucifer is gone? I doubt this. There may be more than one 'mediator' or 'administrator' between the Dracs and Humans. I keep hoping that Lucifer has (or will) switch sides and do the right thing for the human race. I know I'm naive...but I'm happier that way. :original:

The following section of the Urantia Book really got my attention:

054:1 TRUE AND FALSE LIBERTY http://urantiabook.org/newbook/papers/p054.htm

54:1.1 Of all the perplexing problems growing out of the Lucifer rebellion, none has occasioned more difficulty than the failure of immature evolutionary mortals to distinguish between true and false liberty.
54:1.2 True liberty is the quest of the ages and the reward of evolutionary progress. False liberty is the subtle deception of the error of time and the evil of space. Enduring liberty is predicated on the reality of justice—intelligence, maturity, fraternity, and equity.
54:1.3 Liberty is a self-destroying technique of cosmic existence when its motivation is unintelligent, unconditioned, and uncontrolled. True liberty is progressively related to reality and is ever regardful of social equity, cosmic fairness, universe fraternity, and divine obligations.
54:1.4 Liberty is suicidal when divorced from material justice, intellectual fairness, social forbearance, moral duty, and spiritual values. Liberty is nonexistent apart from cosmic reality, and all personality reality is proportional to its divinity relationships.
54:1.5 Unbridled self-will and unregulated self-expression equal unmitigated selfishness, the acme of ungodliness. Liberty without the associated and ever-increasing conquest of self is a figment of egoistic mortal imagination. Self-motivated liberty is a conceptual illusion, a cruel deception. License masquerading in the garments of liberty is the forerunner of abject bondage.
54:1.6 True liberty is the associate of genuine self-respect; false liberty is the consort of self-admiration. True liberty is the fruit of self-control; false liberty, the assumption of self-assertion. Self-control leads to altruistic service; self-admiration tends towards the exploitation of others for the selfish aggrandizement of such a mistaken individual as is willing to sacrifice righteous attainment for the sake of possessing unjust power over his fellow beings.
54:1.7 Even wisdom is divine and safe only when it is cosmic in scope and spiritual in motivation.
54:1.8 There is no error greater than that species of self-deception which leads intelligent beings to crave the exercise of power over other beings for the purpose of depriving these persons of their natural liberties. The golden rule of human fairness cries out against all such fraud, unfairness, selfishness, and unrighteousness. Only true and genuine liberty is compatible with the reign of love and the ministry of mercy.
54:1.9 How dare the self-willed creature encroach upon the rights of his fellows in the name of personal liberty when the Supreme Rulers of the universe stand back in merciful respect for these prerogatives of will and potentials of personality! No being, in the exercise of his supposed personal liberty, has a right to deprive any other being of those privileges of existence conferred by the Creators and duly respected by all their loyal associates, subordinates, and subjects.
54:1.10 Evolutionary man may have to contend for his material liberties with tyrants and oppressors on a world of sin and iniquity or during the early times of a primitive evolving sphere, but not so on the morontia worlds or on the spirit spheres. War is the heritage of early evolutionary man, but on worlds of normal advancing civilization physical combat as a technique of adjusting racial misunderstandings has long since fallen into disrepute.

Can anyone tell me what's with the Draconians? What exactly is their problem? What the hell do they want with us? What would it take to convince them to leave us alone? If they backed-off...would those who are between them and the average person...back-off as well? Are there dark beings who give the Dracs orders? Why can't the whole G** D*** Universe make Constitutional Responsible Freedom the Modus Operandi? There seems to be an infinite amount of power struggling, arrogant heirarchies, advanced technology, horrible cruelty, etc, etc. Most people try to do the right thing and try to be happy...but it seems that unseen forces are opposing them every step of the way...and then accusing the well meaning people of being stupid sinners, etc, etc. Are we in the middle of a hopeless situation...or what? Do all theocracies...throughout the universe...need to be abolished? Does the Universal Church need to be disbanded? Does absolute power corrupt even the most advanced beings...absolutely? I continue to think that we don't need better rulers...we need no rulers. The beings of the universe need to rule themselves under the banner and discipline of Constitutional Responsible Freedom. Could these three words be a New Trinity? I'm thrashing about in a blasphemous existential quagmire of concupiscence...which is undoubtedly anathema. I don't know what the hell that means...but it sounds cool.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7LCWKz0uV8k&feature=relatedYouTube - Aliens - 5 - The Draco Reptilian

I'm feeling really close to the truth...yet really far away. I'm thinking that Sirius is at the center of everything...yet I'm not sure exactly how.

Could it be that the God of This World is a Draconian-possessed androgynous black human alien from Sirius who heads Giza Intelligence, the Secret Space Program, and the Deep Underground Military Bases...and who is the real Black Pope? Could the Ark of the Covenant be the UFO which brought us here from Sirius along with technology obtained from Draconian-demons in exchange for allowing the Draconians to possess the elite-humans? Is this solar system really part of the Siran solar system? Is our sun really Sirius C? Is the ancient depiction of three suns really Sirius A, Sirius B, and Sirius C? Are the tall greys from Sirius, really just human beings? Did we all come from Sirius? Is there a stargate between this solar system and Sirius? Is all of the cr@p we have been in for millions of years really a Sirian civil war? Are we all different factions of Sirians? Would my pet project of The United States of the Solar System really have to apply to Sirius as well? Is Sirius the All Seeing Eye at the top of the pyramid? Is Sunday really Sun God Day? Is this sun really Sirius? Is the Roman Catholic Church all about Sirius? Are the Masons all about Sirius? Are the occultists all about Sirius? Is the layout of Washington D.C. all about Sirius? Is the Sirian Theocratic System really the Universal Church aka The Holy Roman Empire aka the New World Order?

Here is something relevant to this thread that I posted on another thread:

The Aldebarans are supposedly renegade Pleiadians. Did they thumb their noses at the Pleiadian Powers That Be...and make deals with the Devil aka Draconians...to obtain Technology and Spiritual Power? Was the Pleiades really Heaven? Was the Person In Charge really God. Was Lucifer a Pleiadian who tried to get a better deal by dealing with the Dracs? Did this result in the famous War in Heaven? Did Lucifer drag one third of the Pleiadians to Aldebaran...then to Sirius...and finally to Earth? Are we all Fallen Angels? Is this why Lucifer is the God of This World? Some say Lucifer is no more...but I doubt this. Is Aldebaran still renegade Pleiadian presently? Is Sirius A and Arcturus completely unfallen Pleiadian presently? Is Sirius B and Earth in Sirius trouble? Is a final battle brewing to settle this thing once and for all?

Or...is the whole Universe under Draconian control...including the Pleiades? Did the God in the Pleiades keep this a secret to make a bad situation seem like Heaven? Did Lucifer smell a rat...and try to fight fire with fire...hoping to get technology and spirituality from the Dracs...and then turn on them? Could the final phase of this be happening presently? Is that what's brewing? Is this 'The Great Work'? Are Sirius B and Earth engaged in a rebellion against the Dracs which must be crushed? Will the Empire strike back? Does Sirius B and our Sun contain Planets in Rebellion? Do they threaten the Draconian Universal Church Theocracy? Did Lucifer mean well...but did he or she bite off more than they could chew...and go insane? I keep thinking that Lucifer is like Colonel Kurz in 'Apocalypse Now'. If Constitutional Responsible Freedom really catches fire...will this be the end of Draconian Universal Domination? I really and truly don't know. All of the above could be complete BS.

I don't know who the good-guys and who the bad-guys are anymore. Do you?

Perhaps the deception continues after we die. I don't believe in a literal heaven or hell...but who knows what we may experience or be confronted with when we die. I just think we should reasonably question everything. And I mean everything.

There is a lot of good...and a lot of love. But I'm seeing a lot of lies glossing over what's really going on. I'm presently speculating that there has been (and continues to be) a massive power struggle involving various factions of humans and non-humans. I tend to think that the original genuine Creator God is somehow removed from the picture (no details or proof)...and that to fill the vaccum we have wannabe gods playing god. The bad-guys presently seem to have the upper-hand. I'm thinking we are renegade Pleiadians who jumped out of the frying pan...and into the fire. Perhaps we are seeking freedom in a very tyrannical universe. Perhaps we are a threat to the universal order. I really don't know. A study of true and false freedom is probably a very important study to engage in. There is an excellent treatment of this subject in the Urantia Book (chapter 53 or 54). These chapters are quite interesting. Once again...I don't know what's really true...and what's total bs. I'm just dealing in possibilities and probabilities.

I wonder what it would be like to be hooked up to a black budget virtual reality machine which was connected to a supercomputer containing soul memories. Or could an entity (good or evil) superimpose it's imagination upon our imagination to create a seemingly real life experience. Is this the essense of regression hypnosis? Are people really reliving their past lives...or is this yet another deception? All of this seems to be very tricky. I like to evaluate other people's experiences...rather than seeking exotic experiences and encounters. I tend to think all of this is potentially very dangerous.

I'm still waiting for a somewhat detailed analysis of this thread. We're all so busy...and at first glance...the subject of the thread seems boring. Well...maybe it is boring.

Here is a comment which I posted on another thread which is relevant to this thread:

I have a fascination regarding cathedrals and pipe-organs. The whole temple and worship concept goes way back into antiquity. Lucifer was supposedly the chief musician in 'heaven'. If 'heaven' is really the Pleiades...perhaps there were cathedrals and pipe organs in the Pleiades...and Lucifer brought the whole theological concept...including temples, cathedrals, pipe-organs, and worship...from the Pleiades to Aldebaran...then to Sirius...and finally to Earth. As above...so below. I guess I'm seeing two rival 'gods' leading a civil war. Are the Annunaki and Dracs mercenary interdimensional warriors and laborers? Was the Pleiadian 'god' instrumental in the destruction of Atlantis? Did the Luciferian 'god' take the Atlantian civilization underground? Is this Giza Intelligence? Are there underground mansions, cathedrals, libraries, and museums...combined with military bases and stargate temples? Does Lucifer (or equivalent) possess the ability to end most life on Earth through 'Earth Changes'? Is alien technology really ancient Pleiadian technology? I'm beginning to think so. The exact composition and motivations of the various secret factions are obviously unknown. My guess is that there may be three major factions...two theocratic (one Pleiadian and one Aldebaran Luciferian)...and one namaste constitutional responsible freedom faction.

Thank-you Myra. This is mostly speculation. I don't like completely off the wall science fiction. I don't like dry and boring history books. I do like to see and hear what other people are thinking and doing...and then I like to speculate and extrapolate based upon their work. I try to make it clear that these are simply possibilities and probabilities. It's sort of fun...but sort of scary too. Some of this stuff is heavy...and undoubtedly steps on lots and lots of toes...including my own. I feel very uncomfortable with a lot of this. In most cases...I hope I'm wrong.

I'm still interested in a thoughtful review of this thread! Hope springs eternal!

firefly...there were some good thoughts and concepts in the videos. But how do we know this message is from a Pleiadian? But perhaps we're all Pleiadians. I could probably write something...record it...and claim that I was an ET from the Planet BS. A lot of people would probably believe me...but it would be a lie. I just treat all information as possibly true...especially the fringe info. I think that Constructive Competition is a good thing...and that it is essential to a free and open society. Also...a belief system isn't necessarily BS. Preachers and Politicians don't always lie...just most of the time!

I'd still like to hear an evaluation of the first post...positive or negative. Is the God concept a valid and healthy one? Or...is it inherently corrupt and tyrannical? Theological issues are so knee-jerk and emotionally charged...that I guess most people don't want to get involved...unless they have a nit to pick or and axe to grind. I just feel like we're missing the real meat of the subject of our past, present, and future...especially regarding ET's, Gods, Rulers, etc. I suspect that we are going to have to learn the hard way. Jordan Maxwell might be right about the future. I hope not...but I really see what he means.

One other thing...in the following video...which I have previously posted...is there something good and something not so good about each character? What would an ideal human look and act like? Should we strive to be better people...every day and in every way? I'm thinking we need to work toward a Perfected Humanity and a Perfected Solar System. This may be all the God and Heaven we get. I don't mean to be negative or faith-destroying...but I do wish to be honest and realistic. Lies haven't worked for thousands or millions of years. Why should we expect them to work now? I think we need to take off the gloves...and really dig for truth and goodness. I think it's going to take a lot of work and pain. This thread probably ventures where angels fear to tread...but I thought it was necessary. I envisioned extensive discussions...and conflicting concepts...but so far very few people have taken the bait. Perhaps it's just as well. In the video...I'm seeing Reptilian/Human vs Human. Who is Satan...really? Who is Lucifer...really? Who is God...really? Who is Jesus...really? Are they all Pleiadian Human and/or Draconian Reptilian? Think about it. I'm not talking about the Creator/Intelligent Designer who I think was instrumental in our original creation/evolution. I'm talking about the ones we're dealing with here and now...in this Solar System.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w6eTbhHE0jM&feature=PlayList&p=C271BC15F76286EC&index=0&playnext=1YouTube- The Temptation of Jesus by the Devil in the Wilderness

Were Giza Intelligence the real 'Raiders of the Lost Ark'? Were the World Wars really Zionism vs Teutonic Zionism? Was Indiana Jones an Andromedan Sympathizer? Please, please, please watch these videos repeatedly...then face yourself...and think and think and think. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1YXw7BxYGMU&feature=relatedYouTube- Raiders of the Lost Ark - Theatrical Trailer https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfMwK0kCccIYouTube- Teutonic Zionism

I don't know what you're smoking Paul...but I want some.:smoke:Perhaps it's just the smog...or maybe the chem-trails.

Someone please consider seriously commenting on the editorial content of this thread. I am doing some soul-searching regarding 'Lucifer', 'The God of This World', 'Fallen Angels', 'Demons', 'God the Father', 'Jesus', 'Satan', 'The Holy Spirit', 'Namaste', 'Seeing Christ in All Persons', 'The Divinity Within Humanity', etc. Definitions and word-studies are hugely important. I really think that the answers we need will be found in non-traditional, free-thinking theology...which reads more like science-fiction than a typical Sunday sermon.

What if the God who was instrumental in the creation/evolution of human beings (before this Earth even existed) became involved in a war with reptilian beings...and was imprisoned or killed? What if a horrible war of revenge resulted in the near extermination of the reptilian race? What if the souls of these reptilian beings lived on as interdimensional beings known as demons? What if these demons corrupted a Pleiadian Human into creating a Human/Reptilian Theocracy? What if a Human Musician named Lucifer (The Covering Cherub) rebelled against this theocracy...resulting in the 'War in Heaven'? What if Lucifer and a third of the Human 'Angels' were cast out of Heaven (The Pleiades?) and relocated in Aldebaran? What if Lucifer found that he or she had to do business with the Interdimensional Reptilians...resulting in an Aldebaran Theocracy? What if Lucifer and the Fallen Angels eventually ended up on Earth? What if all (or most) of us are these Fallen Angels? What if all of the ancient gods are Luciferian/Draconian or Luciferian/Annunaki? What if Lucifer really meant well and tried to do the right thing...but ended up being as bad or worse than what he or she rebelled against? What if the concept that 'Power Corrupts...and Absolute Power Corrupts Absolutely' is true...regardless of how well-intentioned or benevolent a being is? What if Jesus was representitive of the good-side of Lucifer...and representative of the original Creator-God...and the Divinity Within Humanity? What if Lucifer is a Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde personality...who has been (and continues to be) a mixture of good and evil...and who has been (and continues to be) at least partially insane? What if Lucifer is the author of the words attributed to both God the Father and Jesus...in the Holy Bible...as well as being the one who most people think of as 'The Devil'? But what if 'The Devil' is the Draconian overlord to Lucifer? What if Lucifer: The God of This World answers to Lord Draco (or equivalent)?

Could there be a Theocratic Draconian Faction and a Non-Theocratic Draconian Faction? Could there be a Theocratic Human Faction and a Non-Theocratic Human Faction? Would it be helpful to look at universal history with this as a possibility? Would we discover the above proposition reduced to a Draconian/Human Theocracy vs a Draconian/Human Democracy?

I don't know about all of the above...but sorting this out might be incredibly complex. Many good guys and gals might turn out to be evil. Many bad guys and gals might turn out to be good. The basic concepts of Theology and Governance...Humans and Reptilians...Freedom and Tyranny...etc...should be studied in an open and honest manner. Possible scenarios...possibilities and probabilities...elaborations and extrapolations...etc...may yield many helpful insights. Don't take this post too seriously. It's just preliminary speculation. I don't wish to offend anyone. I mean no harm.

Regardless of the true content of universal history...I continue to be enamored with the concept of Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom...as a non-theocratic synthesis of Ethical Spirituality and Minimalist State.

Questions or Comments?

Could it be that Satan and Demons are really Interdimensional Draconian Reptilians who hate Humans? Could it be that God, Lucifer, and Jesus are Pleiadian Humans...and that even Lucifer is a good-guy or good-gal? They could all possibly be good. Could it be that they are all at odds with the Dracs...and that they simply have different philosophies regarding how to deal with them? Do they lead the three or four factions which I suspect are headquartered in underground bases...here and on the Moon? I believe in the literal existence of all of the above. With this in mind...consider the following link regarding God, Jesus, Satan, Lucifer, etc: http://www.lucifer.com/lucifer.html Do the Dracs control the Vatican...against the will of the Curia and the Pope? Is the term 'Luciferian' really a cover for 'Draconian'? I keep thinking that the Dracs need to be kicked out of our Solar System. I keep thinking that no one should bow down and worship anyone...including worshipping God, Jesus, Satan, Lucifer, etc. We should simply reverence the Divinity Within Humanity aka The Christlike Holy Spirit. We should see Christ in All Persons. Lucifer...is this correct? I continue to suspect that you would be ok if the Dracs were gone...you retired...and if our Solar System was based upon Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom. I still wish to hear you improvise on the Cavaille-Coll pipe-organ at Saint Sulpice...after this mess is resolved. Lucifer...can you use your Galactic Rolodex to arrange a Solar System Exorcism...and to arrange replacing the U.N. Charter with the U.S. Constitution and Bill of Rights...and have this apply to the entire Solar System? I tend to think that you can. Perhaps you have already called in the strike. If so...thank-you in advance. See you at Saint Sulpice. Namaste Lucifer.

I guess that 'Gray's Anatomy' would describe and illustrate that which is 'Human'. I guess that 'Grey's Anatomy' would describe that which is 'Reptilian/Grey'. But just in case...here is the Wikipedia version...which I somewhat disagree with. I think we were created and/or evolved somewhere (and somewhen?) else...and were brought to Earth...as fully Human Beings. I don't think the Annunaki created us. They may have 'detuned' us...but who knows?

Human
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
See Homo sapiens (disambiguation).
This article is about modern humans. For other human species, see Homo (genus). For other uses, see Human (disambiguation).
Human[1]
Fossil range: 0.2–0 Ma PreЄЄOSDCPTJKPgN↓Pleistocene - Recent

Human male and female
Conservation status

Least Concern (IUCN 3.1)
Scientific classification
Kingdom: Animalia

Phylum: Chordata

Class: Mammalia

Order: Primates

Family: Hominidae

Subfamily: Homininae

Tribe: Hominini

Genus: Homo

Species: H. sapiens

Subspecies: H. s. sapiens

Trinomial name
Homo sapiens sapiens
Linnaeus, 1758
Humans are bipedal primates belonging to the species Homo sapiens (Latin: "wise man" or "knowing man") in Hominidae, the great ape family.[2][3] They are the only surviving member of the genus Homo. Humans have a highly developed brain, capable of abstract reasoning, language, introspection, and problem solving. This mental capability, combined with an erect body carriage that frees the arms for manipulating objects, has allowed humans to make far greater use of tools than any other species. Mitochondrial DNA and fossil evidence indicates that modern humans originated in Africa about 200,000 years ago.[4] Humans now inhabit every continent and low Earth orbit, with a total population of 6.8 billion as of November 2009.[5]

Like most higher primates, humans are social by nature. However, humans are uniquely adept at utilizing systems of communication for self-expression, the exchange of ideas, and organization. Humans create complex social structures composed of many cooperating and competing groups, from families to nations. Social interactions between humans have established an extremely wide variety of values, social norms, and rituals, which together form the basis of human society. Humans have a marked appreciation for beauty and aesthetics which, combined with the human desire for self-expression, has led to cultural innovations such as art, literature and music.

Humans are noted for their desire to understand and influence their environment, seeking to explain and manipulate natural phenomena through science, philosophy, mythology and religion. This natural curiosity has led to the development of advanced tools and skills, which are passed down culturally; humans are the only extant species known to build fires, cook their food, clothe themselves, and use numerous other technologies.

Thank-you for sharing the message firefly. Who knows what the source was? I'm wary of automatic writing...as I'm wary of nearly all supernatural occurrences...but the author seemed to be benevolent. I'm beginning to think that the universe is populated by very imperfect beings...and that some of these beings play god. I'm thinking that the one or ones who were instrumental in our creation are not the one or ones we are dealing with in this Solar System...historically and presently.

I think we're going to make it...but that our future may be quite difficult. I really think we live on a haunted planet...as the message suggests. I think that demons and deceptions are everywhere. Even though I no longer believe a lot of Christian (or other) theology...I don't want to venture too far from the Teachings of Jesus...or from the Living Christ (as separate and distinct from the Historical Jesus who Albert Schweitzer came to profoundly question).

Thanks again for sharing. The message sounded like it contained a lot of truth...regardless of the source. But I'd like to see even the demons relocated and rehabilitated...if that's even possible. And I'd like to know the full and honest truth about the demons...and why they seemingly hate us so much. What if they have a legitimate grievance...but have allowed it to drive them completely mad? What if the demons are mercenaries who do the bidding of malevolent human beings? These are not rhetorical questions (some of my questions are rhetorical). I just want everything to begin making sense...even if I don't like the reality of the predicament which we may be in.

There is no single right way to heal ourselves and become enlightened. If you are doing something which works for you...well keep doing it...by all means! The CD experience was interesting. Music is probably a huge part of healing and enlightenment. On the other hand...the more spiritual one becomes...the more harsh everyday reality seems to be. We probably need the beautiful experiences which come to us during meditation AND we also need to face all manner of harsh realities. This is a delicate balance...and so far I have not been able to achieve it. I'm sort of like the teenager learning to drive. Hard on the gas! Hard on the brakes! Hit the trashcans! The Dracs probably even laugh!

Check out this episode from 'Stargate SG1' titled 'The First Commandment'. It features a mere mortal...playing god. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5fMAXRxF4nQ

Is Nibiru a huge Draconian Mothership which travels throughout the galaxy creating Draconian Theocracies? [URL="http://www.nibiruancouncil.com/html/flagshipnibiru.html#"]http://www.nibiruancouncil.com/html/flagshipnibiru.html#[/URL]
Is this the real winged serpent in the Garden of Eden? Is Eve representative of the Human God of This World who becomes perfectly possessed by a Draconian Interdimensional Reptilian (eats the apple) and leads Adam (Humanity)...under the direction of the Dracs (One Nation Under Satan)? Is Nibiru the Galactic Vatican of a Universal Church? Is Nibiru owned and operated by Human Beings...or did Human Beings obtain it's services at Rent-A-Rep? I just had to ask. Please forgive the repetition of these videos. I felt that they would help to illustrate the text of this post. What do you think about Amen Ra? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amun I know very little about this Egyptian god. I don't have a negative knee-jerk reaction against ancient gods...but I think that we are not dealing with the Creator God of the Universe...in antiquity or modernity. Why this is...I do not know. I sincerely wish we were dealing with this Ultimate Deity. I really don't know what the hell is going on...but something is very, very wrong. I think the gods of this world are Humans who were or are perfectly possessed by Draconian Interdimensional Reptilians. I can't prove this. I'm not a scholar. I just think that our safest course presently is to submit to Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom...regardless of whether any deities are good or evil. Power to the People. All the People. Perhaps Nibiru can join the United States of the Solar System...and provide security services for the Solar System outside the orbit of Pluto. http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=15878 Why wouldn't this work? I'm still naive enough to think that where there's life...there's hope. Nibiruans should revolt against their theocratic or tyrannical leaders...and embrace Responsible Freedom. Come on guys...Do It!

1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k3A6_blpqpU
2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6z7O7UZxipM
3. www.youtube.com/watch?v=b365_qJEpDg&NR=1&feature=fvwpYouTube- Stargate SG1 - Goa'ulds - Awesome Gods?
4. www.youtube.com/watch?v=w6eTbhHE0jM&feature=PlayList&p=C271BC15F76286EC&index=0&playnext=1YouTube- The Temptation of Jesus by the Devil in the Wilderness

Regardless of whether you agree with me or not...or whether you like me or not...psychology/ethics/politics/religion (in the context of the subjects which surface in Camelot and Avalon) are central to solving our delemma. The City States and Secret Governments need to be profoundly purified and reformed. This will probably involve some type of benevolent off-world assistance. I envision a perfected Humanity living in a perfected Solar System. Physicality is not a bad thing...as long as it is highly ethical and spiritual...and we should appreciate it. This Solar System is prime real estate...which should be properly cared for...and we should appreciate it.

There are several major factions which go way, way back in Earth history...and further back than that...which should be identified and traced. I've made a feeble attempt to look at this...but I don't have the resources to properly do it. This is key to understanding where we came from...what the hell we are doing right now (or should be doing)...and where we are going (or could go). Controversy, turmoil, pain, suffering, and confusion are part of the deal. There is no way to neatly and cleanly figure out what's going on...and resolve our problems. Consider everything from all angles...all the time. This takes a lot of work. Beware of easy answers, simple solutions, and smooth saviors.

I suspect that we are just scratching the surface. Consider this thread to be a motivator...more than anything.

Thank-you Initiate. I'm just trying to face reality. My insecurity propels me forward...and then I discover things which make me even more insecure! My insecurity and emotional trauma make it difficult for me to properly research these important topics. There are so many agendas and lies! This world is a very troubled and dangerous place! There is so much pain and confusion!

That link you provided (nibiruancouncil.com) is fascinating! Thank-you! I really need to stop blabbing on the internet...and actually read for an extended period of time. Unfortunately...when I read...my mind wanders and I tend to go to sleep!

Speaking of reading...there is a book which was published in the late 1800's titled 'The Great Controversy (Between Christ and Satan in the Conflict of the Ages)' by Ellen White. It is very interesting regarding the subject of this thread. I don't agree with a lot of things in it...but so many principles and concepts in this book are highly profound. The Jesuits know about this book...to say the least! There was one report...if I remember correctly...where unseen hands tore this book in two...the hard way! I shared this book with an ivy-league educated theologian...who was usually rather cynical and skeptical...and he spoke positively about the book...which shocked me at the time.

OK...I went within (way within)...and this is what I came up with:

Did God the Father, Son, or Holy Spirit require the sanctuary service? Or was it Satan who required the sanctuary service? The sanctuary service involved sacrifice(killing) and ultimately human sacrifice. When we hear about heathens sacrificing their children, we cringe in horror(I do). But isn’t traditional Christianity centered in God the Father sacrificing his child? Is there a problem here? Does the sanctuary service involve a sort of appeasement of ‘the gods’?

It seems to me that Satan had more to do with the sanctuary service than God. Jesus did away with the sanctuary service. It further seems that Satan claimed ownership of the human race, and required worship, and that Jesus had to literally strike a deal with the Devil to liberate us. Jesus waged spiritual warfare with all the forces of hell and won, thus opening the door for our liberation. The death of Christ on the cross was symbolic of a victory which had already occurred. The spike that was driven through Christ’s heel continued through the serpent’s head. Unfortunately the serpent is still writhing and will continue to do so until human beings win a spriritual warfare with the forces of hell in a manner similar to that of Christ. Jesus showed the way, but he has had few true followers for nearly 2,000 years now. So this thing keeps dragging on and on. A concerted spiritual warfare might well culminate in what is refered to as Armageddon. Satan and his cohorts will not give this earth up without a huge fight.

The substitutionary atonement was not to satisfy a bloodthirsty God…but rather to silence the demons infesting this earth. The crucifixion of Christ was the first payment, and when a critical mass of human beings do what Jesus said to do, the 2nd and final payment will be made. Might this be the final application of the atonement? Does Satan, rather than God, require the so called Pre-Advent Judgment? Isn’t Satan the ultimate legalist?

I guess I see the Sanctuary Service, the Substitutionary Atonement, and the Pre-Advent Judgment as being required to silence Satan and to kick him(or her) out of our world...permanently(God/Jesus dealing with Satan). But a harmonious relationship with Christ and His Teachings is required to bring about, and participate in, the Kingdom of God...and to obtain the benefits of the Atonement.

The Lord said to Moses, “Speak to the priests, the sons of Aaron, and say to them: ‘A priest must not make himself ceremonially unclean for any of his people who die, except for a close relative, such as his mother or father, his son or daughter, his brother, or an unmarried sister who is dependent on him since she has no husband–for her he may make himself unclean. He must not make himself unclean for people related to him by marriage, and so defile himself. “‘Priests must not shave their heads or shave off the edges of their beards or cut their bodies. They must be holy to their God and must not profane the name of their God. Because they present the offerings made to the Lord by fire, the food of their God, they are to be holy. “‘They must not marry women defiled by prostitution or divorced from their husbands, because priests are holy to their God. Regard them as holy, because they offer up the food of your God. Consider them holy, because I the Lord am holy–I who make you holy. “‘If a priest’s daughter defiles herself by becoming a prostitute, she disgraces her father; she must be burned in the fire. “‘The high priest, the one among his brothers who has had the anointing oil poured on his head and who has been ordained to wear the priestly garments, must not let his hair become unkempt or tear his clothes. He must not enter a place where there is a dead body. He must not make himself unclean, even for his father or mother, nor leave the sanctuary of his God or desecrate it, because he has been dedicated by the anointing oil of his God. I am the Lord. “‘The woman he marries must be a virgin. He must not marry a widow, a divorced woman, or a woman defiled by prostitution, but only a virgin from his own people, so he will not defile his offspring among his people. I am the Lord, who makes him holy.’” The Lord said to Moses, “Say to Aaron: ‘For the generations to come none of your descendants who has a defect may come near to offer the food of his God. No man who has any defect may come near: no man who is blind or lame, disfigured or deformed; no man with a crippled foot or hand, or who is hunchbacked or dwarfed, or who has any eye defect, or who has festering or running sores or damaged testicles. No descendant of Aaron the priest who has any defect is to come near to present the offerings made to the Lord by fire. He has a defect; he must not come near to offer the food of his God. He may eat the most holy food of his God, as well as the holy food; yet because of his defect, he must not go near the curtain or approach the altar, and so desecrate my sanctuary. I am the Lord, who makes them holy.’” So Moses told this to Aaron and his sons and to all the Israelites.—Leviticus 21:1-24 (New International Version)

“When the loud cry, ‘It is finished!’ came from the lips of Christ, the priests were officiating in the temple. It was the hour of the evening sacrifice. The lamb representing Christ had been brought to be slain. Clothed in his significant and beautiful dress, the priest stood with lifted knife, as did Abraham when he was about to slay his son. With intense intrest the people were looking on. But the earth trembles and quakes; for the Lord Himself draws near. With a rending noise the inner veil of the temple is torn from top to bottom by an unseen hand, throwing open to the gaze of the multitude a place once filled with the presence of God. In this place the Shekinah had dwelt. Here God had manifested His glory above the mercy seat. No one but the hight priest ever lifted the veil separating this apartment from the rest of the temple. He entered in once a year to make an atonement for the sins of the people. But lo, this veil is rent in twain. The most holy place of the earthly sanctuary is no longer sacred. All is terror and confusion. The priest is about to slay the victim; but the knife drops from his nerveless hand, and the lamb escapes. Type has met antitype inthe death of God’s Son. The great sacrifice has been made. The way into the holiest is laid open. A new and living way is prepared for all. No longer need sinful, sorrowing humanity await the coming of the high priest. Henceforth the Saviour was to officiate a priest and advocate in the heaven of heavens. It was as if a living voice had spoken to the worshipers: There is now an end to all sacrifices and offerings for sin. The Son of God is come according to His word, ‘Behold, I have come-in the volume of the Book it is written of Me,-to do Your will, O God.’ ‘With His own blood’ He entered in ‘the Most Holy Place once for all, having obtained eternal redemption.’ Heb. 10:7; 9:12.”—Desire of Ages (Ellen White) p. 807-808(Home Library Edition)

‘”When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the holy angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory. All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate them one from another.” Thus Christ on the Mount of Olives pictured to His disciples the scene of the great judgment day. And He represented its decision as turning upon one point. When the nations are gathered before Him, there will be but two classes, and their eternal destiny will be determined by what they have done or have neglected to do for Him in the person of the poor and the suffering. In that day Christ does not present before men the great work He has done for them in giving His life for their redemption. He presents the faithful work they have done for Him. To those whom He sets upon His right hand He will say, “Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: for I was hungry and you gave Me food; I was thirsty and you gave Me drink; I was a stranger and you took Me in; I was naked and you clothed Me; I was sick and you visited Me; I was in prison and you came to Me.” But those whom Christ commends know not that they have been ministering unto Him. To their perplexed inquiries He answers, “Inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of these My brethren, you did it to Me.” Those whom Christ commends in the judgment may have known little of theology, but they have cherished His principles. Through the influence of the divine Spirit they have been a blessing to those about them. Even among the heathen are those who have cherished the spirit of kindness; before the words of life had fallen upon their ears, they have befriended the missionaries, even ministering to them at the peril of their own lives. Among the heathen are those who worship God ignorantly, those to whom the light is never brought by human instrumentality, yet they will not perish. Though ignorant of the written law of God, they have heard His voice speaking to them in nature, and have done the things that the law required. Their works are evidence that the Holy Spirit has touched their hearts, and they are recognized as the children of God. How surprised and gladdened will be the lowly among the nations, and among the heathen, to hear from the lips of the Saviour, “Inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of these My brethren, you did it to Me.” How glad will be the heart of Infinite Love as His followers look up with surprise and joy at His words of approval!’—Desire of Ages (Elllen White) pgs. 685 & 686 (Home Library Edition)

Forensic-only justification is legalistic. It is simplistic legalism offered as the solution to complex legalism. Responsibility is the real solution....being responsible caretakers of our world, ourselves, and each other...by exercising personal responsibility. Being right with God and others...by being right with God and others...not simply being declared to be right. But perfection is not required...because God is not a legalist. We can always do better...but we should not have a nervous breakdown trying to be 'perfect'. There should be Kaizen(continual improvement)...without ever 'arriving'. We don't have to be 'perfect' to be 'good enough' for God.

Furthermore, does Revelation teach a 'Final Solution' which involves killing all 'undesirables'? In other words, human beings being killed by a God of Love for rejecting a God of Love. I have stated this very bluntly...but is this a misrepresentation?

For those who choose to follow Satan...would it be ethical and appropriate to allow them to follow and worship their leader on a distant 'Devil's Island' planet for all eternity...rather than being tortured or killed by God?

The Great Commission: "Then Jesus came to them and said, 'All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age."---Matthew 28:18-20(NIV).

Have Christians been busy doing this for 2,000 years...or doing everything but this? Is this the Great Omission? I'm guilty too. I'm no poster child. By the way, why does Jesus say 'all authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me?' Given to him by whom, and when? Did he win this authority away from Satan during his earthly ministry? Is this the first part of the deal with the Devil(Holy Place phase)? Is doing what Jesus told us to do the second and final part of this deal(Most Holy Place phase)? Is this where the Pre-Advent Judgment comes in?

I have a problem with a Pre-Advent Judgment as being something which God needs or requires(the Lord knows them that are his). But if it is something which Satan requires as a part of a legalistic, lawyer-like, celestial courtroom, universal power struggle, legal wrangling regarding the souls of men and the fate of the human race at the end of this present darkness...then I am all ears. It can help to explain why 2,000 years after Jesus paid it all, and saved the human race...things are worse than ever. What went wrong? We can't say everything is fine when it obviously is not. 'Christ is waiting with longing desire for the manifestation of Himself in His church. When the character of Christ shall be perfectly reproduced in His people, then shall the Lord come to claim them as His own.'--Christ's Object Lessons (Ellen White), pg 69. Try taking the Teachings of Jesus seriously, and start talking about them and implementing them at the local church level...and see how much trouble you get into. How about the Fundamental Teachings of Jesus Christ? How about Teachings of Jesus Seminars? This applies to all Christian churches. Christianity is a religion about Jesus...not the religion of the teachings of Jesus. Who needs the Anti-Christ?

I think I believe in a sort of ‘harvest eschatology’. To me, the U.S. Constitution and the Red Letter Teachings of Jesus are much more important than Fundamentalist Christianity. I’m probably more on the wavelength of the following:

“Not many people of moderate persuasion have much sway in the church any more. I was reminded why recently when the Episcopal Church did two important things: It elected a woman bishop to head the denomination, and it backtracked on appointing gay bishops. The first move seems Christian. Women deserve to hold church office as much as political office (one diocese, however, was so incensed that it voted to leave the church, and worldwide there are still Anglican movements that do not permit women to be bishops or ordained priests). The second move was an act of cowardice because it did not reflect the ideals of love in Christianity and was motivated by reactionaries in the Episcopal denomination. Countering a long tradition of laissez-faire tolerance, the reactionaries have gotten tough and threatened to form their own church if gays are promoted in the priesthood. The worldwide Anglicans are more intolerant, upholding that homosexuality is forbidden, unnatural, wrong or an outright sin, depending on who is doing the disapproving. You'd think that someone would stand up and ask a simple question: Who are we to condemn gays if Christ didn't? In fact, who are we to condemn any sinner, since Christ didn't? Christianity is about forgiveness, and for the past two decades, as fundamentalism swept through every Protestant denomination, moderates and liberals have been driven out, and were roundly condemned as they left. Along with them went tolerance and forgiveness, not to mention love. Did Christ teach love or is that just a liberal bias? In the current climate, it's hard to remember, but one thing is certain: Once a tight cabal of fundamentalists takes over any denomination, Christ's teachings go out the window. The reversal of Christianity from a religion of love to a religion of hate is the greatest religious tragedy of our time. Those of us who haven't been swept up in worldwide fundamentalism, which has corrupted Islam, Hinduism and Judaism as well, have been caught in a double bind. We can't join any sect that preaches intolerance, yet we can't fight it, either, because by definition fighting is a form of intolerance. To escape this double bind, moderates have stayed silent and stayed home. But that tactic failed. As healthy as it is to nourish your own devotion and faith, it's disastrous to allow extremists to take over the church, because the statehouse, the board of education, the Congress, and eventually the presidency are next. Perhaps civil society will solve the problem of religious extremism. So far it hasn't. America finds itself in the sad plight of being the world's most prominent secular society hijacked by sectarians. One can only hope that the church comes to its senses and regains its moral center. If that doesn't occur, the core teachings of Christ will be lost, for all intents and purposes, to this generation.” --- Deepak Chopra

I have decided to follow Jesus. Though none go with me...still I will follow. No turning back.

Thank-you Initiate. I'm basically crazy...but I pull myself together long enough to produce semi-rational posts. It almost seems as though one has to go to hell to get at the truth. The theory is that the unseen bad-guys fight you every inch of the way when you start getting close to the truth. THEY DO NOT WANT TO BE EXPOSED. The truth will set us free...but it might make us very miserable along the way. Jesus said that he had many things to tell us...but we couldn't take it. I think we are learning about a lot of those things in Camelot and Avalon (including all the links)...especially if we read between the lines. I sincerely hope that we can take it. I think things will mellow out once we gain (regain) our freedom...but I also think we will always face huge problems of various kinds.

You have obviously done your homework Initiate...and I'm learning a lot from all of your posts. I sometimes think we have academics who post here...who wouldn't dare talk about Camelot and Avalon topics in the classroom. Who knows...we may even have some off-world posters. This forum may be a model for a future United Nations which includes the entire Solar System.

Consider rewatching (or watching for the first time) all of the Stargate episodes (including the movie)...with theology in mind...in each and every episode. Also consider rewatching (or watching for the first time) all of the 'V' episodes (1984 and 2009)...with theology in mind...in each and every episode. Theology may be stranger than Science Fiction.

Could many Human Beings, Supercomputers, and Androids be possessed by Draconian Interdimensional Reptilians aka Demons? Could two main factions really be Zionist Theocratic (Pleiadian) and Teutonic Zionist Luciferian (Aldebaran)? Is there a third Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom faction (Andromedan?) which seeks an end to this madness through peaceful means? I tend to think (without inside info) that the first two factions (whoever they really are) are not in control of the situation (if they ever were). I think they have both been deceived. Perhaps this would be a good time for all three factions to cooperate with each other...and call upon benevolent extraterrestrials...to perform a Solar System Exorcism. I don't know what the root issues are with the Dracs...but I think they should go now. We can address various grievances in a constructive and appropriate manner...at a later date. I continue to support the idea of amnesty for full disclosure, full cooperation, and reasonable restitution...applying to all factions. Who knows...the Dracs might eventually turn out to be model citizens!

Here is the most heretical post yet. It is merely speculation. Here goes.

What if God (of this world), Jesus, Satan, Lucifer, (and other deities?) are all the same being? What if this single being has multiple personalities? Jesus said 'I and my Father are one' and 'If you have seen me...you have seen the Father'. Satan is strangely absent in the Old Testament. Are Satan and the Old Testament God the same being? Could Josephus be the same being? I have speculated that there is always some level of insanity connected with absolute power. I suspect that the leader of this world...going way, way back is a Human/Reptilian God from the Pleiades/Aldebaran/Sirius who is a mixture of good and evil...sanity and insanity...male and female (androgynous)...black and white...human and reptilian. Did this being bring us all here (in Nibiru?) a long, long time ago? I don't know. I'm simply considering possibilities.

If this is true...what would it take for this hypothetical being to snap out of it...and come to their senses? Would a Solar System based upon Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom rather than a Theocracy...really be the solution? If this being retired...could they recover over time? I think so. How about it God/Jesus/Satan/Lucifer/Etc? Are all of the above really Amen Ra? I mean no disrespect. Should 'Thou Shalt Have No Gods' be the first and last commandment? If this theory is true...I think there can be a happy ending...for everyone...including God/Jesus/Satan/Lucifer/Amen Ra/Etc.

Please review Post #109 with this post in mind. I'm simply trying to stimulate thoughts and solutions. This universe may be stranger than we think. It may be stranger than we can think. What do you think? Do you think? Come on! Think!

Some people think Formula One drivers are gods. They might be right. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XSJb-dBtJ7Y&feature=related

Thank-you Murcuriel. The Urantia Book gets at the heart of the problem...doesn't it? Here are the links (with the material in the previous post...in context):

Chapter 53: http://urantiabook.org/newbook/papers/p053.htm
Chapter 54: http://urantiabook.org/newbook/papers/p054.htm

Listen to this while you read! YouTube- Dupré Improvising at St Sulpice, Paris

I found this on a thread by the eXchanger. I condensed it, and transfered it. Thank-you eXchanger!

I found the following to be highly interesting. It wouldn't surprise me if this is quite close to the truth. This could really be who we are...and who our 'gods' are...and I'm not talking about the Founders or the Creator God of the Universe. I'm not seeing this Ultimate Divine Presence at work in this Solar System at this time. I wish I knew what happened to the original God. The vacuum is being filled by stand-ins and wannabe gods. I appreciate their efforts...I guess...but perhaps we don't need any gods whatsoever. I have no way of verifying the information...and I assume that it was channeled. I am wary of channeling...yet I still found the information to be fascinating. Reader discretion advised.

[quote=eXchanger;192491]The Truth about ETs - Original source: www.salrachele.com[/quote]

Approximately 60% of all UFOs reported are from solar systems outside our own. The majority are from Zeta Reticuli, Alpha Centauri, Rigel & Betelguese (Orion), Sirius A & B, and the Pleiades. Approximately 20% are above top-secret military tests of experimental craft, often reverse engineered from Zeta craft. Approximately 20% are natural phenomena mistakenly identified as artificial craft.

In addition to the above, there are millions of encounters with beings from other dimensions (parallel, higher, etc.), most of whom are benevolent.

We Are All ETs to Some Extent

There is really no difference between ETs and humans, because Earth has been genetically manipulated for aeons by different ET races to the point that almost all of us have genetics from other star systems. There are often some physical genetic markers carried from generation to generation that can help identify one’s ET heritage. For example, those carrying genetic material from Nordic Pleaideans are often tall and muscular, with blond hair and blue eyes.. But with all the mixing and blending of our melting pot planet, this is a hard thing to track. For example, I am Venusian, but I do not have any markers that I'm aware of (I'm Italian with dark hair and eyes and olive skin while most Venusians are fair skinned and blond by nature).

Actually, if a non-human being were to walk among us (and some do), he/she might not even be noticed. Not only can some alien races disguise themselves, but many already look a lot like us.

As I've stated before, approximately 80% of all ETs are benevolent, kind, loving souls who sincerely want to lift humanity and welcome them back into the cosmic family. About 20% of ETs are malevolent, power-hungry beings with total disregard or even disdain of humans. Of course, there's some neutral middle ground (mostly alien scientists who have no ill feelings toward humanity but are not evolved enough spiritually to be in a position to decide what's best for us). In the name of research, they might dissect a human to learn more about him/her. (The subject of abductions is another matter for another time.)

The problem is, most of the negative ETs are vibrating in the 3D and 4D realms and so are often visible to 3D and 4D humans. Many of the higher, more loving races exist in 5D, 6D and 7D and can only be contacted by humans who are attuned to those densities.

So it APPEARS there are a lot of negative ETs involved with Earth. And of course, most of the world's rulers are controlled by negative ETs
(because of their lust for power).

There are many different "species" of aliens. Here's my latest assessment including those in human embodiment:

Orion Constellation: Councils of Rigel & Betelguese, Incarnates from Mars and Maldek. 80%
Pleiades System 7D: Adamic Race (original earthlings) from Lyra/Vega DNA, Atlantean Priest-Kings. 15%
Sirius B Binary System: Biblical Gods, Greek Gods, descendants of Israel & the Middle East. 2%
Venus, 6th Density: Generally blond-haired, blue-eyed, fair-skinned humans. 1%
Pleiades System 4D: Nordic-type tall muscular humans (original Vikings, Scandinavian races). 1%
Andromedan 4D: Oriental-type humans with small slanted eyes. 0.5%
Antares 4D: Red giant race mentioned in Genesis, Nordic-types, stocky European. 0.3%
Zeta Reticuli 3D: Human incarnates of original Zeta race before hybridization. 0.1%
Zeta Reticuli 3D Hybrid: Human incarnates derived from breeding programs. less than 0.1%
Andromedan 3D Hybrid: Human incarnates derived from breeding programs. less than 0.1%
Tau Ceti, Alpha Centauri, Polaris: Human incarnates from these star systems. (mostly 6D-8D). less than 0.1%
Arcturus 7D-9D: Emissaries incarnate in human form. less than one million.
Nibiru (Planet X): Nibiruan Council members, on and off-planet incarnations. about 80,000
ETs in alien bodies: Humanoids with off-planet incarnations. about 32,000
Walk-ins (soul transfers): Various races taking over human bodies through soul transfer. about 6,000
Other categories (3D-12D): Humans from star systems not mentioned above. about 50 million
Other entities (7D or higher): Spiritual masters from higher dimensions (avatars in manufactured bodies). about 300

Population percentage breakdown by density (current vibratory level of humans):

3D -- About 78%
4D -- About 22% (includes yours truly at approx. 4.65)
5D -- About 0.1%
6D -- About 0.00001%
7D -- About 0.000000001%

Here is my assessment of the types of craft observed in our skies, including the ones I've seen physically. The percentages are out of the total observed by humans:

Grey, saucer shaped, 10m-20m diameter - Zeta Reticuli - 3D/4D. 50%
Grey, saucer shaped, 10m-20m diameter - Illuminati Black Ops (Earth). 30%
Black, triangular, a few meters across - Alpha Draconis 3D (Reptilian). 10%
Multicolor, saucer-shaped - Pleiades 4D/7D, Venus 6D. 3%
Spherical, green glowing - Pleiades 4D/7D 1%
Black, triangular, very large - Illuminati Black Ops (Earth). 1%
Cigar-shaped (mothercraft - very large) - Zeta Reticuli - 3D/4D. 1%
Grey, Cylindrical - Andromeda - 3D/4D. 1%
Interdimensional, various sizes and colors - Sirius B, Orion, other systems (5D-9D). about 3%

NOTE: The Orions interbred with humans nearly half a million years ago. To my knowledge they have only a handful of emissaries from the constellation circling our heavens. The same goes for the Sirians. What about an impending invasion? Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but it already happened over 500,000 years ago and yeah, they won. No new invasion will be successful because Gaia (Mother Earth) is ascending
and only those souls on the path of ascension will be allowed to remain on Earth beyond the 2012 - 2030 A.D. window. See Earth Changes.

Please use your own divine judgment when dealing with ETs and especially when dealing with humans, as the percentage of negatively vibrating humans is much higher than that of ETs. In fact, if it were up to chance (which it is not), you would stand a better chance of meeting a positive ET than a positive human.

Detailed Descriptions of ETs - A complete description is found in Life On the Cutting Edge.

The Orions look like us because almost 80% of us are Orions.
The Pleiadeans look like us because they were the original root race of Earth.
The Sirians are a bit taller and lighter than the average humans.
The Antareans are large, muscular and have reddish-brown skin.
The Andromedans tend to incarnate as orientals, but the original ETs are tall and lanky with large heads and small slanted almond eyes.

The Zetas come in three main flavors:

(1) alabaster white and short with huge black almond eyes;
(2) short and grey with large black almond eyes (the most common); and
(3) tall, blue-skinned hybrids with small slanted almond eyes.

The other races are higher dimensional and can change their appearance at will.
The Venusians are fair-skinned, blond and translucent.
The Arcturians are large, blue-skinned translucent beings.
The higher-dimensional Pleiadeans are shimmering golden figures of light.
The highest level Pleiadeans look like the blue-white stars in the visible Pleiades star cluster.

ETs in Our Solar System - Note: Some of this information is also available in the article on Souls and Soul Rays.

Jupiter has advanced civilizations in the etheric atmosphere of the giant planet, vibrating at 5th and 6th density levels. They are not completely free of service-to-self (STS) vibrations and there is some kind of hierarchy to their government. They are large translucent beings originating in many local sectors of the galaxy. They were called to Jupiter to learn and grow spiritually with the assistance of Arcturians and Venusians. These beings have developed the power side of their nature more than the love side, although they are generally of a positive energy. However, that energy is somewhat harsh compared to the Venusians. Their biggest lesson appears to be finding balance between love, wisdom and power and integrating the mistakes they made during the Mars experience hundreds of thousands of years ago.

The Orions (who have controlled Earth for the last half million years) sometimes incarnate etherically in the atmosphere of Jupiter once they have ascended from the warrior-masculine-aggressive Martian paradigm.

Most of the rulers of the Jupiter conclave (about 1,000 rulers and 150,000 entities) are being tutored from higher realms in the ways of unconditional love, and how to govern a planet without ego superiority issues (a tough lesson).

The Venusians are a sixth density race from which the goddess mythology arose. They look very much as pictured in visionary paintings – long flowing golden hair, flowing robes and translucent bodies of light, some with wings.

The Martians are really the Orions prior to coming to Earth. They began their incarnations on the surface of Mars and later went underground when their atmosphere was destroyed by warfare.

The Maldekians are really Orions that once inhabited Maldek, the planet between Mars and Jupiter. They blew their planet apart with warfare and what’s left is the asteroid belt. The souls incarnated on Mars and Earth after the destruction of Maldek. The destruction of this planet threw the other planets out of their original orbits and created problems far beyond the solar system. For this reason, the Divine Councils of the higher dimensions have intervened and will not allow the total destruction of any more planets in this sector.

The Saturn Tribunal is a council of higher-dimensional entities from various systems that use etheric Saturn as their base of operations.

Original source for the above information: www.salrachele.com

The latest Avalon meltdown rendered the video links inoperable. I reconstructed them...so everything is back to normal...until the next meltdown.

Please consider this Amen Ra thread http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?p=202245&posted=1#post202245 in the context of the God, Jesus, Satan, Lucifer thread. Amen Ra may really be at the center of everything.

Can you picture Jesus driving a Ferrari, wearing a sweat-suit and a Rolex watch as He pulls out of His beach-house driveway? Most would recoil from such a thought! Some would say that to suggest this is irreverent and inappropriate. Once again, I am conflicted. I love Jesus, both historically and within my heart. However, I would love to have a Ferrari, a Rolex, and a beach-house! Could I have my Jesus, and my Ferrari too? Is this the Rich Young Ruler 2009? Allow me to suggest that if I ever became a Wall Street wizard, a best-selling author, or a song-writer and singer, it would be entirely appropriate, as a Christian, to have a Ferrari, a Rolex, and a beach-house. Gasp! Shock! Disbelief! Disgust!

Now that I'm in deep H2O, allow me to try to escape the do-gooder sharks! The money making activities listed, if done honestly and ethically, are entirely appropriate. If a lot of money is made, the books are properly kept, and the taxes are honestly paid (even though the Federal Income Tax appears to be unconstitutional), the car, watch, and home are just rewards of the free enterprise system. The Ferrari could be a $60,000 used F355, rather than a $160,000 F430. Likewise, the Rolex could be purchased from an estate sale instead of on Rodeo Drive. The beach-house could be a small, modest property, located far from Malibu. If purchased shrewdly, all of these items could be excellent investments, and yield large financial returns.

Then, the majority of the income of all of the above could be donated to a variety of worthy causes. And one could drive said Ferrari to a Habitat For Humanity project, and pound nails for 8 hours. And the upper crust friends one would make on the job and on the golf course could be encouraged to go and do likewise! And they would have the resources to make a huge difference in this miserable world. Have you heard of Bill Gates, Paul Allen, Warren Buffet, Jimmy Carter, Bono, et.al.? I'm not sure that they started out to be Christ-like, but they sure are giving away lots of time and money! Maybe we Christians have been too narrow in what we define as Christ-like! I know I have...and I'm trying to change.

The Ferrari dealers make money to send their kids to college while people enjoy the nice cars. The Rolex employees make money for the necessities of life while people enjoy wearing these nice watches. Likewise, the construction and real-estate people make money to make their mortgage payments, while buyers enjoy their nice new homes. Part of the rationalization for this materialistic daydream is that good, ethical people should be well rewarded for their success. The bad, unethical people should not be well rewarded! They should be stripped of what they have, and locked up! I know I'm living in a dream-world. Having said this, one probably doesn't need a Ferrari collection, or 3 waterfront estates throughout the world! And one should never, ever be unethical or dishonest in the pursuit of money! People should pursue money and then become philanthropists. And they should never, ever look down on anyone. They should never, ever stop being nice to everyone.

I like the ancient Egyptian body position of reaching up with one hand, and reaching down with the other. Taking and giving. I also like the phrase, "Stand tall, and lift!" Striving for success and then helping others to climb higher! We must not neglect the top or the bottom. And the middle-class should be getting larger instead of smaller! How about one big, happy, stratified middle-class, with incentives, but without extreme wealth or destitute poverty? So, yes, I think it is possible at least, that Jesus would drive a Ferrari, wear a Rolex, and live in a beach-house! He probably would do it incognito to avoid misunderstandings. But Jesus hung out with just about everyone, from rich to poor...and maybe we should too!

As an afterthought, it should be just fine to not have a car, a watch or sweat-suit, and live in a studio apartment with no view! I have! The historical Jesus didn't even have a house! We shouldn't look up to others, or look down on others! We should all look straight ahead at each-other as children of God! By the way, don't take this too seriously. But don't dismiss it entirely, either!

Thank-you 14 Chakras. The exaltation of humanity...rather than the exaltation of self...should be the goal. The way of the cross should not involve self-degradation or self-flagellation...but rather should involve physical, emotional, and spiritual discipline. The Ferrari story was intended to illustrate that one does not have to be retentive to the nth degree in order to be Christ-like.

Is God a Girl? Does the following Anime Music Video reveal part of the Divinity Within Humanity? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gD4oNCn1jpo I'm not trying to be a smart alec...and I'm not asking a rhetorical question. Do you consider this video to be inspiring or offensive? On YouTube...someone commented that God was not a girl...because a girl wouldn't have $crewed things up this badly!!! Another person said that having a girl God would be better than having a mean old man for a God!!! Whatever the case may be...I think that we need to gradually perfect the Human Race...and perfect the Solar System...and not through Draconian Eugenics and Extermination...but rather through following Responsibility wherever it leads.

Jesus said 'you must be like little children to enter the Kingdom'...and elsewhere the Bible says 'a little child shall lead them'. I have a problem with some of the risque drawings in the video...but overall...the artistic beauty, uplifting music, innocence, and spiritual allusions...are representative of a small portion of the Divinity Within Humanity. Focusing on the ideal in art, music, literature, science, nature, spirituality, governance, etc...will lead us to higher ground...on the road to utopia.

Remembering me, discover and see,
All over the world, she’s known as a girl,
To those who are free, their minds shall be key,
Forgotten as the past, cause history will last.

God is a girl, wherever you are,
Do you believe it, can you receive it?
God is a girl, whatever you say,
Do you believe it, can you receive it?
God is a girl, however you live,
Do you believe it, can you receive it?
God is a girl, shes only a girl,
Do you believe it, can you receive it?

She wants to shine, forever in time,
She is so driven, shes always mine,
Clearly and free, she wants you to be,
A part of the future, a girl like me,
There is a sky, illuminating us,
Someone is out there, that we truly trust,
There is a rainbow, for you and me,
A beautiful sunrise, eternally.

God is a girl, wherever you are,
Do you believe it, can you receive it?
God is a girl, whatever you say,
Do you believe it, can you receive it?
God is a girl, however you live,
Do you believe it, can you receive it?
God is a girl, shes only a girl,
Do you believe it, can you receive it?

She wants to shine, forever in time,
She is so driven, shes always mine,
Clearly and free, she wants you to be,
A part of the future, a girl like me,
There is a sky, illuminating us,
Someone is out there, that we truly trust,
There is a rainbow, for you and me,
A beautiful sunrise, eternally.

God is a girl, wherever you are,
Do you believe it, can you receive it?
God is a girl, whatever you say,
Do you believe it, can you receive it?
God is a girl, however you live,
Do you believe it, can you receive it?
God is a girl, shes only a girl,
Do you believe it, can you receive it?

Thank-you zaina. The goal is a higher level of psychological, ethical, and spiritual development...resulting in a better world. But part of the process involves facing unpleasant realities. Hopefully this can be accomplished in a somewhat balanced fashion...but there is really no easy or right way to do this. There are pros and cons to just about everything.

Could we consider most of the human beings depicted in religious art...including Ancient Deities, Jesus, Mary, the Saints, et al...to simply be Idealized Human Beings...painted or sculpted by Idealized Human Beings? In other words...the focus would be on idealizing or perfecting the Human Race...rather than following or reverencing any particular deities. We would simply Reverence the Divinity Within Humanity. This is an attempt at unifying humanity...while maintaining responsible freedom. One could appreciate the painted and sculpted works in the Vatican and Washington D.C...for example...without ascribing any particular veneration to Pagan or Christian Deities.

Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom...in the context of the U.S. Constitution and Bill of Rights...in the context of the United Nations...and applied to the Solar System...is a related attempt at unifying humanity...while maintaining responsible freedom. The goal would be a Perfected Humanity existing in a Perfected Solar System with Infinite Diversity and Responsible Freedom. If we make our bed and sleep in it...reincarnating endlessly...shouldn't we go first-class?

The 'Quest of the Historical Jesus' by Dr. Albert Schweitzer, written a century ago, is not exactly a devotional book. It is a hard reading review of several major critical studies of Jesus, and mostly negative. But in the last chapter there are some positive gems which emerge from the darkness. The devotional aspects of the study of Jesus should not be neglected! But the scholarly and critical studies should not be neglected either! This is an often painful process, but it makes us strong.

"But the truth is, it is not Jesus as historically known, but Jesus as spiritually arisen within men, who is significant for our time and can help it. Not the historical Jesus, but the spirit which goes forth from Him and in the spirits of men strives for new influence and rule, is that which overcomes the world." --The Quest of the Historical Jesus pg. 401

"Jesus as a concrete historical personality remains a stranger to our time, but His spirit, which lies hidden in His words, is known in simplicity, and its influence is direct. Every saying contains in its own way the whole Jesus. The very strangeness and unconditionedness in which He stands before us makes it easier for individuals to find their own personal standpoint in regard to Him."--The Quest of the Historical Jesus pg. 401

"But in reality that which is eternal in the words of Jesus is due to the very fact that they are based on an eschatological world-view, and contain the expression of a mind for which the contemporary world with its historical and social circumstances no longer had any existence. They are appropriate, therefore, to any world, for in every world they raise the man who dares to meet their challenge, and does not turn and twist them into meaninglessness, above his world and his time, making him inwardly free, so that he is fitted to be, in his own world and in his own time, a simple channel of the power of Jesus."--The Quest of the Historical Jesus pg. 402

"He comes to us as One unknown, without a name, as of old, by the lake-side, He came to those men who knew Him not. He speaks to us the same word: 'Follow thou me!' and sets us to the tasks which He has to fulfil for our time. He commands. And to those who obey Him, whether they be wise or simple, He will reveal Himself in the toils, the conflicts, the sufferings which they shall pass through in His fellowship, and, as an ineffable mystery, they shall learn in their own experience Who He is."--The Quest of the Historical Jesus pg. 403

Jesus taught mostly in nature. The most inspirational environment is nature! I believe that the Holy Spirit can best get through to us when we contemplate eternal things in nature. The best place to have church is not in church. The best church is no church!

Having said that, I am torn. I love architecturally and acoustically inspiring churches. Especially while experiencing sacred music in these vast spaces. Singing the great hymns of the church with congregation, choir, organ and orchestra, as the sunlight streams through the stained glass windows is truly a mountain top experience! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sx1eMwlDFb8 I believe that artistic expression and creativity are hugely important parts of life and Christianity. They lift us up!

However, I am often troubled by the price and the pride. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YstlGy1Ld0&feature=PlayList&p=D0E04C581E768398&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=2 Is Jesus impressed? I sometimes imagine the stained glass Jesus with tears streaming down His face because of being ignored, despised and rejected by His professed followers! Would those in Darfur be impressed? Should we build more orphanages than churches? I once stood at the altar of a magnificent Gothic cathedral, reading the story of the rich young ruler from a large leather-bound Bible on a golden pedestal. For a moment, I thought the Word of God clashed with the House of God! Are churches sometimes places where there is a form of godliness without the power? Where people stand, sit, bend, nod, and are politely kind to God? Also, the message and music are often determined by those with the dough, not by those in the know!

Obviously, when it's cold, dark and rainy, it's nearly impossible to have a religious service outside! I guess we need church buildings, but we don't need jeweled, gold plated shrines, bedeviled with hideous gargoyles! We need the grand and glorious, but with sound and simple construction, so as not to become slaves to buildings and bills! Think minimalist cathedral. Was that an oxymoron? Sometimes I'm an oxymoron! And don't forget the soup kitchen!

Also, church is not for everyone. The church is not the very gate of Heaven! The Christian Church is not Salvation4Sale! At least it shouldn't be. Church may, or may not, be necessary for balanced psychology, ethics and spirituality. Sometimes church can even make things worse! On the other hand, those who have left the church have often jumped out of the frying pan and into the fire, and had their fingers burnt right up to their arm pits!

Finally, remember what Jesus said to the disciples when they were admiring a church building...

OK...I'm going to brainstorm in this post. Could at least some of the following be true?

Amen Ra = God the Founder = Intelligent Designer? Purposefully physically extinct (but could exist on another dimension)? The Divinity Within Humanity? Created Reptilians as a slave race? ("Let us make man in our image"). Destroyed by the Reptilians...or by Lucifer? Destroyed during the War in Heaven?

Lucifer = Eve, Hathor, Isis, Mary (brought us to Earth from the Pleiades/Aldebaran/Sirius IN the Moon aka Battlestar Galactica aka Ark of the Covenant)? Created the major religions...including being the major author of the Bible? Is the Human Goddess of This World? Is alive presently? Perfectly possessed? Posting on the internet? Was deceived by the Reptilians who offered technology, protection, and a new Earth (the Promised Land) = Ate the Apple? In charge of the Deep Underground Military Bases / Stargate Temples / Secret Space Program?

War/Expulsion in Heaven has Garden of Eden (Pleiades?) and Exodus (Hyksosdus?) parallels?

The major factions in the Solar System can be associated with 1. Amen Ra? 2. Hathor? 3. Horus? 4. Serpent? Think about it.

Adam = Earth Humanity?

Winged Serpent = Reptilians / UFO's (Conspired with Lucifer against Amen Ra?). Provided technology, protection, and tenant in possession status on Earth for humanity...in exchange for work, worship, and ?...aka The Covenant? Nibiru? Reptilian God of This World? Did Horus/Jesus obtain a New Covenant?

This is a very tangled hypothetical web which might be pure unmitigated poppycock...or which might be the biggest part of disclosure?

I have a feeling that we will be meeting Hathor in the near future...and that she might be a lot like Anna in "V"...except with darker skin and an English accent...with exquisite musical abilities...and an astronomical IQ. Just a feeling...mind you. Now I need to take my medicine...before I go to my psychiatrist and exorcist appointments. Too hip. Gotta go.

1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wsPMtPTSF3s&feature=related
2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nieF177sbks&feature=related
3. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DWkdV0VBMTw&feature=related
4. http://www.hulu.com/watch/62967/stargate-sg-1-hathor
5. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ahjPQjQGdbU
6. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k3A6_blpqpU
7. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BcL---4xQYA

I'm presently toying with the idea that Lucifer and Satan are two separate and very different beings...that Lucifer is the Human God (or Goddess) of This World...and that Satan is the Reptilian God (or Goddess) of This World. Human Responsibility is extremely important...but so is the Hierarchy of Power on this planet...which may significantly involve Non-Humans or Extraterrestrial Humans. Leave no moonrock unturned.

I'm presently thinking of Lucifer as a very intelligent, very refined, very beautiful, very conflicted, young (yet ancient) Human Goddess of This World...who may have brought us here in the Battlestar Moon...from Sirius, Aldebaran, and the Pleiades...to escape an oppressive theocracy. Perhaps the Reptilians were already here...and a deal with the Devil was worked out (after a long and bloody battle?) for us to stay on Earth...which involved work and worship. Who knows? What I do know is that we are in huge trouble...the nature of which I am unsure. I see Lucifer as being caught between the Devil and a Human Race who is waking-up to what is really going on. I suspect that the pressure is almost unbearable. But I do think that the time has arrived (and is long overdue) to place ALL of the facts on the table...before the general public...and to openly clean up the mess we are in...as best we can. Perhaps Lucifer tried to take advantage of the Reptilians...and the Reps tried to take advantage of Lucifer and the Human Race. There has to be a Key Board Room located on the Earth or the Moon...where Lucifer, Satan, and certain key persons/beings meet to discuss and debate the future of humanity. My guess is that most of these meetings would drive most of us insane. This is pure speculation based upon at least some evidence and reason.

If you haven't already seen it...watch the David Icke / Arizona Wilder interview. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1289338414420676723#docid=1672359608251731916 Warning: There are some very upsetting and graphic portions of the interview. I found David's monologue at the beginning to be very informative. The planned-wars, human-sacrifices, satanic-rituals, and child-abuse are reprehensible, unconscionable, and unfathomable in the extreme, and to the nth degree. This @#$%^& BS needs to STOP IMMEDIATELY. We probably need the City-States and the United Nations...but NOT IN THEIR PRESENT CORRUPT FORM.

Sometimes I think I have been (or am presently!) a reptilian!! Who knows?? When I speak of a Solar System Exorcism...I intend this toward all very hard-core malevolents of all races. I want the really, really bad guys and gals (of all races, including human) to leave...until they learn to play nice. I want the good guys and gals (of all races, including reptilian) to stay. But this isn't up to me.

Isn't the 'All Seeing Eye' (both Egyptian and Masonic?) directly related to the Dog-Star Sirius? Isn't Sun-Worship really the worship of the ET's from Sirius (The Sun God)? Ever heard of 'Sun God Day'?

My religious background is SDA...but I'm a real mongrel at this point (a rebel without a church!). I recommend two books by Ellen White...'Desire of Ages' and 'Great Controversy'...but not much else. Dr. John Harvey Kellogg and Dr. Desmond Ford are very interesting people (heretics!) to study in the SDA historical zoo. I don't go to church...but if I did...it would probably be an Episcopal church. If I were in New York...I might attend St. Thomas, St. Barts, or St. John the Divine. Unfortunately...I presently have huge problems with the penetential and sacrificial aspects of the Eucharistic Liturgy (and the pagan symbology)...even though I love the robes, music, incense, ceremony, reverence, awe, glory, grandeur, and fellowship. The 1928 Book of Common Prayer is much better than the present one...but I don't like either one! The Psalms are printed in their entirety...but where the hell are the Teachings of Jesus? Who's church is it anyway? I'd rather stay home...and eat chocolates!! I also have problems with the Substitutionary Atonement. So did Bernard Shaw. He thought it was unethical. I think that the entire sacrificial system was and is a colossal irresponsible and bloody mess! Apologetics in this area tend to degenerate into exegetical monstrosities. I have a way with words...don't I?

I just re-watched the first episode of 'V'...and the thought struck me...could Anna be Lucifer/Hathor/Mary (the Human Goddess of This World) and Freddie (the one who always seems to be with Anna) be Satan (the Reptilian God of This World)? Could Amen Ra really be the Human God in the Pleiades who Lucifer rebelled against? I really don't know. I'm just trying to feel my way through this God and Goddess business...even though I know that I am venturing where Angels fear to tread.

Thank-you MyShadow, Moxie, and 777 The Great Work. Battlestar Moon is beautiful.

The Goddess of This World just gave me a verbal warning: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=edNMl1lqZmA&feature=related :lol3: This is so fitting...because I feel like a Columbo character...sticking my nose where it doesn't belong! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=leybGZjiqoE&NR=1 I once saw Peter Falk on location one dark night. I loved his style! Unfortunately...chasing the Gods and Goddesses is driving me crazy! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y-ZF4ZiF3cI&NR=1 All of this is enough to drive a man to drink! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NABdJ1nK9dg&NR=1

Here is a comment from Kelphi:

Ortho, One is only un-blinded of Gods truth from one source only- The Holy Spirit. God has spoken. His Word is true. Man will go to great lengths before bowing the knee to God. And for most it will be too late.

You will one day confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, this is true for all, but you had better hope you did this before His day. I believe you have already heard and know the Gospel. But belief is all that is veiled from you. You know what to do my friend.

Peace & Love,

Kelphi[/QUOTE]

Kelphi, I confess that the words of Jesus Christ as interpreted by the Holy Spirit aka the Divinity Within Humanity is the Very Word of God to me. I embrace the Great Commission in Matthew 28. Your superior, condescending, and even threatening tone conflicts with you calling me friend...and your claim to peace and love.

I consider all of the rambling and speculating I do to merely be stumblings in the right direction. I mean well...but I'm generally clueless. Unfortunately...the ones who really know the whole story aren't talking. If they started talking...they wouldn't be talking for long. This subject is a real Pandora's Box. Please be careful. Know when to stop.

May I suggest watching the Ralph Ellis 1. http://www.consciousmedianetwork.com/members/rellis.htm 2. http://www.consciousmedianetwork.com/members/rellis2.htm , Acharya S http://www.consciousmedianetwork.com/members/acharya.htm , and David Icke http://www.consciousmedianetwork.com/members/dicke2.htm interviews on ConsciousMediaNetwork.com over and over...until it really sinks in. Then rewatch the Stargate SG1 series on hulu.com ...rewatch all of Alex Collier's, Bill Cooper's, and Anna Hayes' videos on Google and YouTube. Finally...rewatch 'V' (1983 and 2009). Things should start to fall into place. But don't join any stupd cults...or get involved with dangerous hocus-pocus and mumbo-jumbo groups. You may even wish to keep going to church for the music, architecture, art, fellowship, bingo, food, members of the opposite sex, business contacts, insights of the preacher/rabbi/priest...but don't worship anyone or anything other than the Divinity Within Humanity aka The Holy Spirit. Even Jesus said that the unpardonable sin was the Sin Against the Holy Spirit. I reverence the Teachings of Jesus...regardless of their source. Lucifer/Hathor could have written most of the Bible...for all I know. The Teachings of Jesus could be the greatest hits of ancient wisdom written by Lucifer/Hathor. But I tend to think that a Reptilian Satan made sure that the Teachings of Jesus never got any traction.

I think that Lucifer/Hathor may be behind a lot of the governmental and religious systems throughout history (under the watchful eyes of Satan/Reptilians)...and that this very human being is alive and well presently...and posting on the internet. I may have to eat my words, and eat humble pie regarding the last sentence...but this presently makes sense to me. Fasten your seatbelts...hang on tight...and don't go crazy...like me. I think that cool, calm, and rational interdisciplinary thinking is essential to sorting this stuff out. Combine faith and doubt. Do not neglect either.

Here is another link which you might find interesting (John Rhodes): http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/sumer_anunnaki/reptiles/reptiles38.htm

Cathedral - Crosby Stills and Nash https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tt50rSPw2qI

Lyrics: http://www.crosbystillsnash.com/

Six o' clock
In the morning, I feel pretty good
So I dropped into the luxury of the Lords
Fighting dragons and crossing swords
With the people against the hordes
Who came to conquer.

Seven o'clock
In the morning, here it comes
I taste the warning and I am so amazed
I'm here today, seeing things so clear this way
In the car and on my way
To Stonehenge.

I'm flying in Winchester cathedral
Sunlight pouring through the break of day.
Stumbled through the door and into the chamber;
There's a lady setting flowers on a table covered lace
And a cleaner in the distance finds a cobweb on a face
And a feeling deep inside of me tells me
This can't be the place

I'm flying in Winchester cathedral.
All religion has to have its day
Expressions on the face of the Saviour
Made me say
I can't stay.

Open up the gates of the church and let me out of here!
Too many people have lied in the name of Christ
For anyone to heed the call.
So many people have died in the name of Christ
That I can't believe it all.

And now I'm standing on the grave of a soldier that died in 1799
And the day he died it was a birthday
And I noticed it was mine.
And my head didn't know just who I was
And I went spinning back in time.
And I am high upon the altar
High upon the altar, high.

I'm flying in Winchester cathedral,
It's hard enough to drink the wine.
The air inside just hangs in delusion,
But given time,
I'll be fine

OK...I'm gonna talk out of both sides of my mealy speculative mouth. Here's another 'what-if?' adventure:

What if Humans and Reptilians evolved simultaneously...and genetically manipulated each other (mutual manipulation:naughty:)...and eventually ended up in a Human controlled Universal Theocracy...with Humans as the Gods...and Reptilians as the Angels? What if God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit were a Human Trinity...with the Father and Son being individuals...and the Holy Spirit being the Divinity Within Humanity (the souls in each person)? What if the Reptilian Race had a Shadow Trinity...consisting of Lucifer, Michael, and Gabriel...or Father, Son, and Holy Spirit? The Humans would be both physical and non-physical. The Reptilians would be both physical and non-physical.

What if the Reptilians got sick and tired of this Theocratic BS...and Lucifer led a rebellion against the Human Race...which exploded into the War in Heaven...killing the Human God the Father? What if a third of the Human Race was taken as hostages and slaves (perhaps deceived)...some (or all) of whom ended up on Earth...under the rulership of the Reptilian Lucifer?

I really started out with this general theory...before exploring other options. The one thing that remains the same...is that we need to get past the Master/Slave and Corruption/Violence BS. Otherwise...I'm pretty darn easy. Perhaps too easy. Sometimes I feel like the Kumbaya Olive Branch of the Gizeh Intelligence.

I'm asking you to look at a Human Trinity from all angles...and to look at a Reptilian Trinity from all angles. Look at all of the possibilities regarding the evolution/creation of both races. And finally to look at Church and State...and the subjects of Theocracy and Democracy...from all angles.

What would a Reptilian Trinity vs Human Trinity conflict look like? There would be a lot of confusion and deception...wouldn't there. None of the mythologies or theologies could really be trusted...could they? We can't really trust anything or anyone...can we? We just have to keep digging...keep asking questions...and keep speculating...without becoming enraged or going insane. What fun!

Here is one version of a resolution of the mess we are in...written by Ellen White...in the late 1800's...in a book titled 'The Great Controversy Between Christ and Satan':

"I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it." Revelation 21:22. The people of God are privileged to hold open communion with the Father and the Son. "Now we see through a glass, darkly." 1 Corinthians 13:12

We behold the image of God reflected, as in a mirror, in the works of nature and in His dealings with men; but then we shall see Him face to face, without a dimming veil between. We shall stand in His presence and behold the glory of His countenance. {GC 676.4}

There the redeemed shall know, even as also they are known. The loves and sympathies which God Himself has planted in the soul shall there find truest and sweetest exercise. The pure communion with holy beings, the harmonious social life with the blessed angels and with the faithful ones of all ages who have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb, the sacred ties that bind together "the whole family in heaven and earth" (Ephesians 3:15)--these help to constitute the happiness of the redeemed. {GC 677.1}

There, immortal minds will contemplate with never-failing delight the wonders of creative power, the mysteries of redeeming love. There will be no cruel, deceiving foe to tempt to forgetfulness of God. Every faculty will be developed, every capacity increased. The acquirement of knowledge will not weary the mind or exhaust the energies. There the grandest enterprises may be carried forward, the loftiest aspirations reached, the highest ambitions realized; and still there will arise new heights to surmount, new wonders to admire, new truths to comprehend, fresh objects to call forth the powers of mind and soul and body. {GC 677.2}

All the treasures of the universe will be open to the study of God's redeemed. Unfettered by mortality, they wing their tireless flight to worlds afar--worlds that thrilled with sorrow at the spectacle of human woe and rang with songs of gladness at the tidings of a ransomed soul. With unutterable delight the children of earth enter into the joy and the wisdom of unfallen beings. They share the treasures of knowledge and understanding gained through ages upon ages in contemplation of God's handiwork. With undimmed vision they gaze upon the glory of creation--suns and stars and systems, all in their appointed order circling the throne of Deity. Upon all things, from the least to the greatest, the Creator's name is written, and in all are the riches of His power displayed. {GC 677.3}

And the years of eternity, as they roll, will bring richer and still more glorious revelations of God and of Christ. As knowledge is progressive, so will love, reverence, and happiness increase. The more men learn of God, the greater will be their admiration of His character. As Jesus opens before them the riches of redemption and the amazing achievements in the great controversy with Satan, the hearts of the ransomed thrill with more fervent devotion, and with more rapturous joy they sweep the harps of gold; and ten thousand times ten thousand and thousands of thousands of voices unite to swell the mighty chorus of praise. {GC 678.1}

"And every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, Blessing, and honor, and glory, and power, be unto Him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever." Revelation 5:13. {GC 678.2}

The great controversy is ended. Sin and sinners are no more. The entire universe is clean. One pulse of harmony and gladness beats through the vast creation. From Him who created all, flow life and light and gladness, throughout the realms of illimitable space. From the minutest atom to the greatest world, all things, animate and inanimate, in their unshadowed beauty and perfect joy, declare that God is love. {GC 678.3}

Take a very, very long and very, very hard look at the following:

1. Archangel Gabriel
2. Archangel Michael
3. Archangel Lucifer
4. Ancients or Founders
5. Anunnaki Reptilians
6. Draconian Reptilians
7. Grey Reptilians
8. Interdimensional Reptilians
9. God and Satan
10. Angels and Demons
11. Human Beings
12. God the Father
13. God the Son
14. God the Holy Spirit
15. Theology and Theocracy
16. Heaven and the Garden of Eden
17. Rebellion and War in Heaven
18. Expulsion and Exodus
19. Law, Covenant, and Constitution
20. Slavery and Freedom
21. Creation and Evolution
22. Love and Responsibility

What are the precise definitions, descriptions, interactions, and overlaps of these words? This may be the most important study one can possibly make. Lay aside your preconceived notions...and forget the bad experiences you may have had in connection with religion and church. Theology is at the center of Disclosure. The Jesuits know exactly what I'm talking about...but they are quite mysterious and secretive. They have very short leashes...and their masters carry very big sticks.

Disclosure = The PTB telling us the truth about all of the above...without telling us the truth about all of the above. I'm still enamored with the idea of applying Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom to both the Human and the Reptilian races...both internally and cooperatively. Unfortunately...reason and solutions are often unwelcome in the heat of battle...especially when hatred, fear, and pride override everything else.

I have repeatedly suggested that the really hard-core negative ET's should be removed from this Solar System...and I still feel that way. But what if we are basically cattle to the present negative ET's...and thus receive some protection from them from even worse ET's? It seems to me that there would have to be a universal consensus to grant us freedom and sovereignty in this Solar System. I'm presently very interested in Gabriel, Michael, and Lucifer...especially regarding the Luciferian rebellion (against Ra?) and the War in Heaven. Our plight seems to be directly related to a continuation of the original War in Heaven. Is there basically a three way power struggle for control of the Human Race? Could the following be true:

First Race: Represented by The Founders aka The Ancients aka God the Father aka Ra? Destroyed in the War in Heaven?

Second Race: Represented by the Angel Gabriel (Pro Ra), Zionist?

Third Race: Represented by the Angel Michael (Neutral), Andromedan, Christ-like?

Fourth Race: Represented by the Angel Lucifer (Anti-Ra), Teutonic Zionist?

Fifth Race: Represented by Jesus Christ? The Human Race?

Are the first four hypothetical races various types of Reptilian and/or Human Races? Or...are they all Draconian? Was/is the War in Heaven fought over the Human Race? Where was/is Heaven? Try not to think about this from a traditional Judeo-Christian or a New Age perspective. Sort of start from scratch...and think way out of the box. I think this may be important. Are one or two of the above the real problem(s) here on Earth? Lucifer has a bad reputation...but I keep sensing that there's someone worse than Lucifer...named Satan, perhaps? I don't have the answers. I just want to try to make you think, and think, and think!

Here's a really creepy trailer for the new movie "Legion" (viewer discretion advised): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P6p01-in6-k&feature=pyv&ad=4352961288&kw=archangel%20gabriel Could at least part of the basic premise presented here be true?

Here's one of my favorite video clips from "The Last Temptation of Christ": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w6eTbhHE0jM

This video clip from Stargate SG-1 shows Human Gods and Goddesses possessed by the Goa'uld: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b365_qJEpDg&NR=1&feature=fvwpYouTube- Could there be some truth to this?

I think I keep catching glimpses of the way things really are...but I can't create a concise yet comprehensive picture of what's really going on. I'm reading a Courtney Brown free E-book...which, if true, is mind-boggling and unbelievable. It's basically remotely viewed...which seems pretty creepy to me. I suspect a mixture of fact and deception. I'm very suspicious of most everything!

Were the Founders or Ancients really Human Beings? Did an originally very good Human God become corrupt and insane while theocratically ruling both Humans and Reptilians...with the Reps being mistreated? (Power Corrupts. Absolute Power Corrupts Absolutely) Was this the Original Sin? Did this result in the Luciferian Rebellion and War in Heaven? Were most Human Beings destroyed...including the Human God? Are we some of the few Human Beings who survived? Is the Universe presently a Reptilian Theocracy or Universal Church? Is Earth a Planet in Rebellion? Are most of the religions (historical and contemporary) really Reptilian Religions? Are we kept alive by Reptilians who are somewhat sympathetic to the plight of Humanity...or are we kept alive by the Reps in the same way that a rancher protects his herd of cattle? Is our misery and plight part of a cosmic 'Pay Back Time'? Are the Reptilian PTB lead by Gabriel, Michael, and Lucifer? Do they argue and fight regarding our fate? Are they Human, Reptilian, or Hybrid? Is the Reptilian Agenda to place Reptilian Souls in Human Bodies...and to Exterminate/Enslave Humanity to an Unfathomable Extent? Is the New World Order really a Reptilian Kingdom of God? If all of the above is true...what would convince the Reps to base the Universe on Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom...and to support Human Sovereignty in This Solar System...at least? These questions are not rhetorical.

Here's an interesting news story regarding an ancient piece of pottery with Hebrew writing which hints that the Bible could have been written much earlier than thought. What I really found interesting though...was the theological perspective starting around 03:00 regarding human nature. I completely agreed. Actually...I agreed with everything Father Jonathan Morris said! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RRvvbaTm_KY

QUOTE=777 The Great Work;252651][SIZE="3"]Y do u call yourself, the ortho- box mor -on?? :winksmiley02::winksmiley02:[/SIZE][/QUOTE]

Because, in one sense, I am very orthodox, reverent, conservative, and historically oriented. In another sense, I am very irreverent, liberal, and futuristic. Also...a lot of people think I'm crazy or a moron...even though I can be quite clever at times...especially in print. Put that all together and you have an oxymoron. Therefore orthodoxy + oxymoron + moron = orthodoxymoron. Dr. Laura Schlessinger uses the same nickname...but I didn't copy her...and I don't think she copied me!

[QUOTE=Jonah;252658]Hello there Ortho,

Keepin busy i see...

well im going to join you on your imaginative contemplation of Dragonhood. Although i will be careful because it is not my wish to start any more fuss from people who seem to take things and put them in there head and then say attack!!! No thank you... my fear comes from myself... this i learned sometime ago... anyway...

As to your quote above..... I am speculative as to the outcome of such a "evolution" will call it... however... i do not see anything in Abrax's material about Reptilians.... I took the whole dragon thing as follows :once all personal archetypes of lineage (from the stars) have been fulfilled than a person can begin the transformation of the material body to fully encompass their light body.... or dragon body... but I may have missed something..[/QUOTE]

This is not a fear-mongering thread or a Thuban fan-club thread. It is quite academic and detached. There is no aspiration, veneration, or hatred. I mostly ask questions and have a lot of video links (if they still work after all of the site meltdowns). I've come to the conclusion that the Bible is a mixture of good and evil...and that the actual words attributed to Jesus are the best part. Here are some links to some irreverent threads which express some of my rambling non-authoritative thoughts on the subject.

1. http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=13767&highlight=orthodoxymoron

2. http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=13495&highlight=orthodoxymoron

3. http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=13776&highlight=orthodoxymoron

4. http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=15878

5. http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=11123&highlight=giza+intelligence

6. http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=13882&highlight=worldwide+church

7. http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?p=163179#post163179

8. http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?p=167745#post167745

Is Alpha Draconis not the center of the Draconian Reptilian civilization (according to folks who claim to know)? Are Dragons not Reptilian? If not...what are they? What is a Drac? All of this is interrelated...and the abraxasinas/Thuban material seems to support my original hypothesis and early posts on this (and other) threads. I am requesting a title change of the current thread to:

God, Jesus, Satan, Lucifer, Gabriel, Michael, Amen Ra, Hathor, Abraxasinas, Thubans, et al

I'm not really into the 'duality' and 'illusion' jargon. There is concretely positive and negative, good and evil, benevolent and malevolent, progressive and regressive, angels and demons...although perceptions and interpretations can be illusory at times. Whatever happened to Sin?

Unrelatedly...my 'Thuban Thoughts' thread is still not available...even though it contains nothing sexual or attack-oriented...and is not an abraxasinas thread. Why? Did it really tick the negative entities off? If so...GOOD! Bring it on! Let's go! Actually...why don't we just all get along...and be benevolent and loving beings...instead of being jerks? I know that there are good and evil entities around me 24/7...and I often talk to them...but I don't pray to them. Sometimes I even swear at them...and flip them off! I may have a lot more than a monkey on my back. I may have an interdimensional reptilian IN my back. I once saw an internet message saying 'we're in your back'. Supposedly reptilians can latch onto humans via their lower chakras. I don't think I'm possessed...but I'm pretty sure that I'm harrassed 24/7. They'd probably like to do a lot more to me...if they could. Who knows...maybe they will.

My 'Thuban Thoughts' thread is still unavailable...even though the Thuban Q&A thread is available in read-only form. Is this a simple oversight...or is there a legitimate (or illegitimate) reason why? In the meantime...please closely examine posts #158 and #159 for a series of questions and answers which I find quite revealing. I still see abraxasinas/walk-in as being in defection mode...and revealing a lot of inside dragon-land stuff. I could be very wrong. How hard would it be for a top-level darkside host/walk-in to transition to the love and light side? I think it might be nearly impossible. However...I think that a huge number of human and non-human defections...from darkness to light...will be necessary to resolve this conflict of the ages. Some have suggested that this isn't going to happen...and that the reptilian beings will just laugh. Well...laughter is a good thing...so maybe that's a start. I will continue to dream...and continue to seek reconciliation and restoration. I will not pursue trench-warfare and triumphalism. I'm thinking that both the human and reptilian races are guilty as hell...and that's pretty guilty. I'm not sure what the proper relationship should be between these two major races...but I'm hopeful that a balance-point can be achieved. Namaste abraxasinas. Namaste Thubans. Namaste Lucifer. Namaste Gabriel. Namaste Michael. Namaste Humans. Namaste Reptilians. Namaste Demons. Namaste Angels. Namaste Benevolent Beings of the Universe. Namaste Malevolent Beings of the Universe. A new commandment give I unto you: "Thou Shalt Have No Gods". This is the first and last commandment.
[QUOTE=Jonah;253256]Ortho... we are in the process of restoring your thread... although..it may have to be read only...

what was it you wanted me to rename this thread to again.. i seem to have deleted your email??[/QUOTE]

Thank-you for you consideration Jonah. I am requesting a title change of the current thread to:

God, Jesus, Satan, Lucifer, Gabriel, Michael, Amen Ra, Hathor, Abraxasinas, Thubans, et al

Any Thuban thoughts? Is there currently an open Thuban thread? Can this subject be discussed in a detached and academic manner? Imagine being in a graduate class at Oxford, Cambridge, Yale, or Harvard...meeting in an old and elegant lecture hall...with a professor who might be a lot like Joseph Farrell. Imagine discussing abraxasinas and the Thuban material in this setting...with a hundred doctoral candidates. Things would be a lot different than the chaos we have witnessed recently...wouldn't it? Why can't we conduct business in this manner and fashion?

Has anyone gotten abraxasinas's take on all of this? Has Tango said anything recently about this? It sounds as though my 'Thuban Thoughts' thread might be read-only. We'll have to wait and see on that one...but this implies to me that the stated reasons for the banning of abraxasinas and the closure of the Thuban related threads are merely the tip of the iceberg. Who is really in charge of what is occurring. I'm just feeling as though this is not administrative business as usual. I'm not impatient or angry...but I am worried.

OK...I'm still not seeing 'Thuban Thoughts'...even in read-only form. Was it something I said? If someone has access to this thread...you may wish to examine it with a fine-toothed comb. I have no idea what might have been problematic. The actual abraxasinas quotes and Thuban material are quite brief. The comments were all quite polite and on-topic. So...what's going on here? Has Bill or Kerry said anything about the abraxasinas situation in the last few days? I don't care so much about administrative decisions...as I do about the integrity of the administrative process and chain of command. Has anyone reviewed posts 158 and 159? Any thoughts? I feel like the Man Behind the Iron Curtain! Or...The Man Who Never Was! I don't know why I said that! I just thought it sounded cool!

LET MY 'THUBAN THOUGHTS' GO!! FREE 'THUBAN THOUGHTS'!! LIBERATE ALPHA DRACONIS!! JOHN MAY LIVES!! FREE WILLY!! FREE LOVE!!

Could we discuss post #157 in great detail? Even if this is total BS...it might be a profitable exercise in examining an alien proposal or mandate. This could come in handy later on. Even if abraxasinas and the Thuban thing is a complete fabrication...could bits and pieces of all of this reveal important information regarding what we are dealing with? Did you like my little joke in the previous thread? I just couldn't resist...but I probably should have. Someone can generate all sorts of BS...and make it sound all complicated and technical. I didn't even work at making this believable. I just randomly did a word association game combined with pure, unmitigated popycock...and I'm sure it shows. I don't even want to wait and see if anyone takes the bait. I'm not that kind of guy! I may add my comments in red (a red-letter edition of the alien constitution!) to shed light on what is really being stated in this document. I doubt that it is genuine...but one never knows. It could be representative of a proposed, or actual, alien constitution...which might become the law of the land on Earth.

I'd really like to have some in depth online conversation and even debate...in a really first-class manner...with the members of this forum. What would it really be like to sit in on meetings of very informed people and other than people...who are discussing what to do about this Solar System and it's inhabitants...human and non-human. Would these be pleasant and cordial meetings...or would there be a lot of shouting? Would armed guards be standing by...both human and non-human. Do firefights sometimes erupt at these meetings...like a drug-deal gone-bad? What do we really think about abraxasinas and the Thubans...at this point...after all of the confusion? I'm really undecided. I don't really know what happened. How are we to know what's genuine...and what's completely fabricated? I continue to like the idea of remaining detached and polite...but not being afraid to ask questions which might be upsetting to the aliens, spirits, entities...or whoever. I like the idea of being genuine with them. I think they're smart enough to know if we're being real or if we're being fake. I just wish that I really, really knew the totality of the history of the universe...or at least all of the crucial aspects. Most of what we do...is flying blind. Everyone has a different version of the 'way it really is'. The process of conversation and decision-making is what really concerns me. I'm not seeing a consistent flow of logical thinking, and in-depth research. That goes for me...as much as for anyone else. I see a lot of knee jerking...and other kinds of...never mind.

My last comment on the Thuban Q&A has me worried...the one regarding a Solar System Exorcism and the establishment of the United States of the Solar System. Did that cause a problem? I certainly hope not. I just have a problem with enslavement, extermination, and being treated like a herd of cattle by an alien race...who could possibly be downright demonic. However...I think everything we do in Avalon is pretty low-level...but what if the whole abraxasinas/Thuban thing was a significant part of disclosure? How would we know? Disclosure might be a very strange and rocky process. It might not be anything like what we might imagine it to be. Who knows...we may have witnessed the real deal. I'd like to know what's really going on...and what the real issues are. Should we even be interested...if we can't know the facts? I hope that some sort of a factual statement regarding the abraxasinas/Thuban thing will be forthcoming. I always feel like I'm trying to walk on ice...or trying to build on shifting sand. I have absolutely no idea what beings throughout the Solar System think about what we do here. I wish we could have some authoritative conversation at some point. I really hate this speculation and guessing game. I'm ready to go back to sleep. On the other hand...I'm not sure I ever woke-up. I just listened to Alex Jones and Jessie Ventura for about 20 minutes...and they're in a whole different league. I don't really know what team I'm on. I don't really know who the good guys and bad guys are. I keep thinking that I should just shut-up...and try to make a significant amount of money...for the first time in my life. But then I start feeling guilty. I remember reading a poem in college titled 'Terrance, this is stupid stuff'. Maybe this really is stupid stuff. Maybe we're just sampling the poison store. See the final verse of this poem...a couple of posts below.

Who knows...maybe Bigmo is really John May!! (the one in 'V') Just kidding!! The whole abraxasinas/Thuban thing was quite bizzare. Again...I wish to take a very close look at that Dragonian Constitution material in post #157. I'll do that later today...after I get some rest. That "Thuban Thoughts" disappearance really has me spooked. (it doesn't take much) Anyway...here is 'Terrance, this is stupid stuff' (which I referred to in a previous post). The final verse is the key. The king gradually increased his exposure to various poisons...and built up an immunity to them...so that when his enemies poisoned his food...he ate it without effect. Then he made his enemies eat the food they poisoned...and they died. Maybe we really are like the king...here in Avalon. It's good to be king. Long live the king. Long live Avalon.

A. E. Housman (1859–1936). A Shropshire Lad. 1896.

LXII. Terence, this is stupid stuff

‘TERENCE, this is stupid stuff:
You eat your victuals fast enough;
There can’t be much amiss, ’tis clear,
To see the rate you drink your beer.
But oh, good Lord, the verse you make,
It gives a chap the belly-ache.
The cow, the old cow, she is dead;
It sleeps well, the horned head:
We poor lads, ’tis our turn now
To hear such tunes as killed the cow.
Pretty friendship ’tis to rhyme
Your friends to death before their time
Moping melancholy mad:
Come, pipe a tune to dance to, lad.’

Why, if ’tis dancing you would be,
There’s brisker pipes than poetry.
Say, for what were hop-yards meant,
Or why was Burton built on Trent?
Oh many a peer of England brews
Livelier liquor than the Muse,
And malt does more than Milton can
To justify God’s ways to man.
Ale, man, ale’s the stuff to drink
For fellows whom it hurts to think:
Look into the pewter pot
To see the world as the world’s not.
And faith, ’tis pleasant till ’tis past:
The mischief is that ’twill not last.
Oh I have been to Ludlow fair
And left my necktie God knows where,
And carried half way home, or near,
Pints and quarts of Ludlow beer:
Then the world seemed none so bad,
And I myself a sterling lad;
And down in lovely muck I’ve lain,
Happy till I woke again.
Then I saw the morning sky:
Heigho, the tale was all a lie;
The world, it was the old world yet,
I was I, my things were wet,
And nothing now remained to do
But begin the game anew.

Therefore, since the world has still
Much good, but much less good than ill,
And while the sun and moon endure
Luck’s a chance, but trouble’s sure,
I’d face it as a wise man would,
And train for ill and not for good.
’Tis true, the stuff I bring for sale
Is not so brisk a brew as ale:
Out of a stem that scored the hand
I wrung it in a weary land.
But take it: if the smack is sour,
The better for the embittered hour;
It should do good to heart and head
When your soul is in my soul’s stead;
And I will friend you, if I may,
In the dark and cloudy day.

There was a king reigned in the East:
There, when kings will sit to feast,
They get their fill before they think
With poisoned meat and poisoned drink.
He gathered all the springs to birth
From the many-venomed earth;
First a little, thence to more,
He sampled all her killing store;
And easy, smiling, seasoned sound,
Sate the king when healths went round.
They put arsenic in his meat
And stared aghast to watch him eat;
They poured strychnine in his cup
And shook to see him drink it up:
They shook, they stared as white’s their shirt:
Them it was their poison hurt.
—I tell the tale that I heard told.
Mithridates, he died old.

[QUOTE=Stardustaquarion;255829]orthodoxymoron, Ashayana in the interview with Jeff Rense talks about the Draconians and Reptilians, I thought it may be of interest to you

Love[/QUOTE]

Thank-you Stardustaquarion. I'm going to listen to it now. I think Ashayana knows a hell of a lot...but I don't necessarily trust her...or believe everything she says. But then again...I don't trust anyone...especially myself. And that's the truth.

I'm going to begin speculating about a hypothetical mediator or mediatrix between the Human and Reptilian races...spanning thousands...or even millions...of years. This would involve a Human Spirit God of This World...and a Reptilian Spirit God of This World...cohabitating an Apostolic Succession of Human Bodies. Theanthropos? Baldacchino? Co-mediatrix? This concept is really at the core of this entire thread...and may be at the core of the abraxasinas/Thuban phenomenon...if it is legitimate and real. Don't laugh at me. This is something which needs to be carefully examined. Go through this entire thread...and see what you think. I'm just going to attempt to take this concept to the next level (of absurdity?)!! This is a wild ride...isn't it? I really believe that such a being exists...historically and presently...and that they are the key to the future of humanity. I could be very wrong...but that's my story...and I'm sticking to it...for now. They're probably reading this thread.

Hello Hathor/Mary! I'd really like to have a proper question and answer thread with you someday. I might not do too well...face to face. I think better with my fingers! I hope that you are doing OK. Think before you flame!

Think long and hard about the avatar of abraxasinas in the Thuban Q&A thread. I think that this being is at the center of disclosure...which might be of a very startling nature. I am not on a triumphalistic witch-hunt...in any way, shape, or form. I merely seek understanding...and a resolution to the horrible mess which humanity seems to be stuck in. I prefer a non-violent resolution...but I am a pragmatic person...sometimes. Disclosure might consist of a series of false-starts and missteps. It may play out just the opposite of what one might expect in a Hollywood movie. Disclosure might turn out to be a huge disappointment to most ufologists...and to the general public. The elites already know. What did they know...and when did they know it?

Consider this thread as a step toward a New Theology. Find your own way...in your own time. If you've lost your faith...then find a new one. My intent wasn't to turn people into bitter and angry atheists. My New Theology consists of this thread...combined with the Amen Ra thread...the United States of the Solar System thread...and the Red Letter Church thread...basically. I'll probably be working out the details for the rest of my life. Good luck with your quest. Don't take life too seriously. On the other hand...perhaps we need to take life more Siriusly. Namaste. :wink2:

I don't know if the following really 'fits' in with this thread...but I'm listening to an Anna Hayes / Jeff Rense interview...and I had a thought. What if people like Alex Collier, Anna Hayes, Leo Zagami, Tony/abraxasinas, et al have to make an agreement with non-human entities to promote a certain agenda? They are given access to certain forbidden information...but they have to present it in a certain way...as my theory goes. They might be given 50% truth and 50% bs...which they have to intermingle...with a certain editorial slant. This is just another one of my crazy speculations. I'm trying to stop. I really am. I'm thinking that there is a lot of deal-making which goes on. Even the Bible speaks of the 'Old Covenant' and the 'New Covenant'. There is the supposed 1954 Greada Treaty...among others. I continue to think that we got our @$$ kicked in an ancient war...and that OUR technology and wisdom was stolen from us...and we were genetically and educationally dumbed down by our conquerors. I think they need us...because it's really our technology...and perhaps human beings are the only ones who can use it. Perhaps the non-humans have to use human slaves to work with this ancient technology and wisdom. In the Stargate SG-1 episode 'The Fifth Race'...only a human (Capt. O'Neil) is able to be programmed with the knowledge of the ancients. Perhaps the Ptah, the Founders, the Ancients...or God the Creator...are really Ancient Human Beings. I tend to think that a lot of aliens would like to let us go...but if they did so...and we realized how badly we have been misused and abused...up to and including the killing of an Ancient Human God...we might go berzerk...and begin a brand-new Star War against the alien races. Who knows? I'm sure the Shadow Government knows...but it sounds like they're in so much trouble...and into this thing so deep...that they can't do a damn thing about it. It sounds like they are not in control of what's going on here on Earth. Commoners like you and me might be required to sort a lot of this stuff out. Just a thought. We haven't been mind controlled...and we haven't signed binding agreements...so we may be the only ones with the necessary freedom to be able to solve some of the perplexities facing humanity. Just more speculation on my part. Once again...I really intend to stop. I've had quite enough...but I do believe I'll have another drink. A real strong one. One more thing...Anna Hayes described three alien factions which the elites have agreements with...if I heard correctly. I have been speculating about three major factions. Also...there are supposedly three major bases below one of the polar icecaps. I keep thinking about Gabriel, Michael, and Lucifer. Maybe I should just smoke a great big joint...like the one in 'Up in Smoke'. :smoke: That was some good $**+ man!

I hesitated to begin this thread. I am torn. I want truth and goodness to triumph...yet achieving this is a very painful process. The history of our world is very sad and violent. No organization or country has escaped this brutal gang of facts. The history of the Vatican is a huge part of our history...and this includes all of us. There should be no angry finger pointing. The video which I am posting is critical...yet not hateful or vindictive. I am offended by the cartoons, photoshopped pictures of the Pope, hurtful internet comments, etc, etc. There should not be a hateful, superior, triumphalistic, or sing-song attitude manifested toward anyone or any organization. This includes the Vatican.

Everyone should research the Vatican...whether they are religious or not. There are so many aspects of our historical and contemporary world which are interconnected with the Vatican. All roads lead to Rome. I'm not a Roman Catholic...and I never have been...but I have attended dozens of masses and concerts. I adore the art, architecture, and music...even the art and architecture with pagan aspects. I have been in many cathedrals...and I have been to the Vatican. It is truly impressive. I have had very good luck with the Roman Catholics I have known and worked with...including priests and musicians. They are doing the best they can.

However, there is something which seems to torment the soul of the Roman Catholic Church. I fear that the hierarchy has to deal with unimaginable problems...which may include dealing with the devil himself(or herself). They may be caught between the devil and the deep blue sea. Does the Vatican mediate between Lucifer and the Human Race? Is it the Human Race vs the Underworld? We may be in more trouble than we think. Watch the following video with an open and non-judgmental mind:

YouTube - SECRETS OF THE VATICAN PART 1
YouTube - SECRETS OF THE VATICAN PART 2
YouTube - SECRETS OF THE VATICAN PART 3
YouTube - SECRETS OF THE VATICAN PART 4
YouTube - SECRETS OF THE VATICAN PART 5
YouTube - SECRETS OF THE VATICAN PART 6

Now watch these videos...and ask yourself if there is a connection:

1. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2414574348304077734
2. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8420071240361070544
3. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1070329053600562261

Connect the Dots. Respond Responsibly.

OK...this is creepy. When I posted the links on this thread...they all worked fine. But 30 minutes later...part 5 didn't work...and a few minutes later part 3 quit working. The other parts worked fine. I noted this on the thread...and now they are all working...so I edited the post. Now you see 'em...now you don't. Yesterday...Part 1 of 'V' on Google didn't work while Part 2 did. Now they both work. The sequence is scrambled in both the YouTube and Google versions. I am sane...aren't I?

Any thoughts or reaction to the video? Tell me what you think...positive or negative.

Once again...I'm seeing very little interest in something which I think is extremely important. I'd like to discuss this in a rational and charitable manner. The better we deal with this sort of thing...the more willing the insiders will be to reveal more...and work toward resolving this mess...together as We the People of Earth.
Please take the time to consider these videos as a group...and tell me what you think.

Thank-you. I alternate between not wanting to think about this stuff at all...and wanting to really help solve this mess...and help the human race to move on to bigger and better things than war, starvation, financial crisis, meaninglessness, etc, etc. The solution...in retrospect...may be very, very simple...yet it may take thousands of years to recognize this answer to any significant degree...apply it globally...and rescue ourselves. Think about the Vatican, Tesla, Advanced Technology, Underground Bases and Cities, City States, Atlantis, Lemuria, Lucifer, the Nazis, and the New World Order. Then read what I have written below.
Then take a long walk...face yourself...and think long and hard.

Have you ever watched 'Brides of Christ'? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQgHCQh2sJE&feature=related If not...please do...it's really good...and made me cry. The human race has so much negative baggage. I don't hate anyone or any organization. I just want the human race to get out of the quicksand. This may take a long time...and a lot of pain. I think that eventually the human race will emerge with a highly ethical secular spirituality which will not involve church attendance, rituals, or hocus pocus of any kind. I believe that we survive our physical deaths...and simply get recycled...whether we are good or bad. This makes it all the more important that we create a better world to return to. This is our home.

Thanks for your comments.

Could the UFO/ET phenomenon be from within Earth...rather than from outer space? Could 'alien' technology be ancient human(or reptilian) knowledge? Could the city states...including the Vatican...be controlled from within Earth? Is much of the ET phenomenon really demonic in nature? Is Earth's crust riddled with tunnels, cities, and bases? Is nuclear weaponry, anti-gravity, free-energy, and other space-age technology really from the Vatican Library...and/or other ancient texts stored underground...rather than back engineered from outer-space UFO's? Is that giant Earth sculpture representative of what is really within Earth? Could many of the church atrocities have been ordered from within Earth...rather than by deranged power and money hungry surface humans? Is the true God of the Universe largely shut out of Earth...leaving surface humans to deal with powerful human and reptilian beings(both physical and spiritual) from within Earth? Is the Pope the Vicar of Lucifer...rather than the Vicar of Christ? Does the church or Pope have any real choice in the matter? Are we really dealing with basically good people...negotiating with and battling dark underground forces?

Am I a paranoid, neurotic, deluded wretch who is blaspheming God...and will be punished in the flames of hell...after the Jesuits get done with me? I'm sort of kidding...and sort of serious! I really mean well...and am trying to help...but there is the possibility that I am making things worse by raising these issues. My mind is not made up on any of these subjects...and probably never will be. I'm open to new information and re-evaluation.

Thank-you for the link. I'm checking it out. The church seems to contain the best and the worst people in the world. There must be huge daily power struggles and debates within the church...behind closed doors. Have you former Catholics ever watched Pat Condell? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y4mWiqkGy-Y&feature=PlayList&p=8395D0A894F4A22D&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=8
He's a bitter ex-Catholic atheist! He's very rude and irreverent...yet he makes a lot of sense...and is very funny.

I keep worrying that the people in the history books or on the evening news are not calling the shots...and that non-humans may be telling the people and organizations we love to hate...what to do. If I were an elite with immense power, wealth, influence, etc...I would probably try to create heaven on earth...and run as clean and tight a ship as possible. No human sacrifices, no financing both sides in wars that I started, no crashing stock markets and ruining economies, no starvation, no satanic rituals, no atrocities, no environmental nightmares, no extermination, no enslavement, etc, etc, etc. I would try to get the people of the world to really like me...and bypass all the corrupt and destructive bs...while I continued to live in my seaside estate...drive my Enzo Ferrari, attend social functions, etc. I see some of the smartest people doing the most bizarre, corrupt, and destructive things imaginable. I like what I see and hear when NWO people are interviewed...yet I hate the NWO. Sometimes I think the NWO people hate the NWO too...but don't have a choice in the matter. Perhaps I am being too kind to these people...but I am sensing something very evil behind what I think are front men and errand boys. Is Lucifer calling the shots? Is Lucifer a little old lady reptilian/human hybrid from Atlantis? Think about it...a very, very smart...very, very evil...and very, very cruel being wearing a flowing cape and a jeweled crown...issuing orders both verbally and telepathically...while sitting on a throne in an underground cathedral more dazzling than St. Peter's. Could this being be playing God and Satan at the same time...to control and enslave humanity? Far-fetched? Probably...but I'm thinking in this direction at this time. That could change in 5 minutes. I'm in the speculation business. Unfortunately I'm wasting a lot of time...driving myself(and others?) insane...and making no money. How stupid is that?

I guess I'm looking for the highest standards and practice of psychology, ethics, and spirituality...without all of the ritual religious baggage. I don't want to start another religion...a true one this time. I don't want to be a spiritually bankrupt atheist. I don't want to channel ancient...and supposedly superior...disembodied entities. I just want to go through life without hurting, killing, stealing from...or otherwise screwing my fellow humans. Then I would like to get recycled...if it's not too much trouble.

I found this interchange between Jordan Maxwell and Alex Jones to be very interesting: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfMwK0kCccI. In this thread...I am not trying to blame the Catholics for all of the evil and destruction in the world. I am trying to get at what is behind many groups and individuals...which continues to divide and conquer us. In the recent Project Camelot interview with Joseph Farrell...he makes a comment regarding present day Germany...which seems to coincide with the Maxwell/Jones clip. I can't remember the details. Watch the interview...which is fantastic...and you'll notice it.

Here is a clip of Malachi Martin being interviewed by Art Bell(warning: the video is graphic and the subject is exorcism): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c91jUTGyNCQ. Here's another one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p6Cq7gx22S0&feature=related And another: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p6Cq7gx22S0 This stuff is real. One last video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OLp9xigjajM&feature=related. I don't agree with everything in this one...especially the part about the Pope going to hell. I don't believe in heaven and hell as historically presented...and I certainly don't know the heart of anyone.

Thank-you no caste. There is plenty of dirt...if one wishes to dig. I can only stomach so much...and then I have to move on to more pleasant subjects.

golden lady: I'm glad you like the thread. It's sort of a necessary evil. I don't relish this subject...but it seems to be central to understanding how this world really works.

If you want to really dig...read 'Murder in the Vatican' by Lucien Gregoire...regarding the death of Pope John Paul I. This book really made my hair stand on end.
'In God's Name' by David Yallop is another book which will keep you awake at night...

To any practicing Roman Catholics: I'm not suggesting that you stop going to church...but I do think that being well informed is very important. Your local church and priests are probably a blessing to the community. It's just that I think there is a powerful dark side at the highest levels of the church...and that the visible church leaders may not be in ultimate control. I doubt that they are happy with the situation...but it may be nearly impossible to change things for the better. I think we are all in a lot of trouble.

Jesus drove the money changers out of the temple with a whip. Perhaps this needs to happen again...

On a more positive note:
YouTube - Daniel Roth Playing the Widor 6th YouTube - Dupre Toccata at Notre Dame de Paris YouTube - Sophie-Veronique Cauchefer-Choplin plays Dupré

Sometimes I wonder if the cathedral architecture, organ design and music...is really from underground cathedrals. Reptilians are supposedly builders. Masons are builders. Hmmmm. According to biblical theology...Lucifer was the preeminent musician in heaven. Hmmmmm. As far as I know...they don't know who designed Chartres Cathedral. Imagine that! Sometimes I wonder if organists find music of unknown origin waiting for them when they arrive at the church to practice. Notice how complex and abstract the above music is. Have you ever seen the sheet music? I have some by Bach, Widor, Vierne, Dupre, etc. Devilishly difficult. We supposedly received religion and technology from the reptilians and greys. What else did we receive? The Vatican Library may contain the comprehensive answer to this question. The truth is in there. I'm not gonna say another word...

YouTube - Engineering the Impossible: Chartres Cathedral

What would happen if church services and masses were music only? No liturgy. No sermons. Just music...complete with organ, orchestra, choir, and congregation? The pastors and priests would be counselors...and would officiate at special services and ceremonies. There probably is not an easy answer. I am beginning to have a problem with the concept of worship and praise. It seems to me that this is what Lucifer aka Satan really wants and needs...and that the God of the Universe doesn't want or need this sort of thing at all. It makes me wonder who is really being worshipped and praised on Sun-God Day. I love the music, architecture, glory, and grandeur...but I am seeing a huge and fundamental problem. This applies to all churches...and not just the Roman Catholic Church. I don't go to church.

If I did go to church...and attended a Roman Catholic Church...I would probably consider myself to be a...Pope John Paul I, Bishop Fulton Sheen, Father Malachi Martin...Roman Catholic. Those who are in the know...in the Roman Catholic Church...really know. I would love to sit in a room full of Jesuits...and talk theology. Unfortunately...I might not make it out of there alive! They have a reputation...you know! I just hope that the dark forces can be converted or exorcised from the church...and the entire world. I continue to think that the Roman Catholic Church is a major part of the problem...and potentially a major part of the solution.

Please consider the following thread: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=13495&highlight=letter+church It touches on some of the issues raised in this thread...and contains many positive solutions.

Are the Vatican and Italy on good terms...or is there trouble brewing? The reason I ask...is the last post...and what Leo Zagami said recently when in 'prison'.

One of the best kept Secrets of the Vatican is no longer a secret. It is now possible to purchase Indulgences Online with a Papal Account.

My question continues to be...who is REALLY calling the shots? Is it a group of men sitting around at the Vatican...dreaming up all manner of evil and atrocity for Earth? Or...are these men TOLD what to do by evil aliens and/or evil spirits? If the second choice is the correct one...how much of a choice do they have in the matter? I presently consider the Pope to be the Vicar of Lucifer...rather than the Vicar of Christ. I really don't think he has much of a choice. Christ is supposed to mediate between God and Humanity. I currently think that Christ stands between Lucifer(the God of This World) and Humanity...and that there is a war between the Vatican and Christ. Somehow...the Vatican must betray Lucifer and embrace Christ. But this might result in the Battle of Armageddon. They have embraced Lucifer...and betrayed Christ...for a hell of a lot more than 30 pieces of silver...believe me. This is simply my personal speculation.

I've said it before...I like Roman Catholics. I have had very good luck with Roman Catholics. This includes priests and musicians. Human history is very violent and sad. Roman Catholic history is simply part of human history. It is our history. I don't wish to single them out as being the source of all evil in the world. I really think that they have had to deal with the devil...literally...throughout their history...in ways we may not be able to even imagine. I just think that the truth...in all of it's gory details...needs to be told...NOW...no matter how upsetting and disruptive this may be. It is time. I'm not an expert or authority on these subjects. I'm just trying to face reality...historically and presently. My internal insecurity and turmoil keeps me searching. We need to see the darkness and the light...and then focus on the light. I would never get into an angry argument with a Roman Catholic regarding their beliefs. I don't think they are lost souls. They are part of the human race...and I am pro-human. We need to rethink everything...and religion is a big part of this rethink. Keep going to church...but keep getting informed. If you're not going to church...you don't need to go...but keep getting informed. There is no easy way to deal with this.

PTL = Pass The Loot or Pay The Lady.

Jesus didn't build churches and ask for money...so why do his professed followers do this? Are the Teachings of Jesus at the center of Christianity? Are you kidding? We worship fame, fortune, and power. So...preachers and churches gain fame, fortune, and power...by promoting a God of fame, fortune, and power. Clever. :sneaky2:

On the other hand...there probably is a place for churches and church schools. The two should probably always combine their facilities to save money. Ironically...one of my favorite examples of a cost effective church/school combination...is a particular Roman Catholic church and school...where I think they got just about everything right. But I tend to think that churches and church schools should not be tax-exempt. They should be treated like any other business. Perhaps the model should be one of schools with concert halls...where excellence in psychology, ethics, spirituality, the arts and sciences...is the norm. Preachers and churches should not lie to their people. They should not preach guilt and fear...along with fame, fortune, and power...in order to collect more and more money...often from sincere people...who can't afford to give...and who receive emotional problems in return for all of their time, money, and effort.

I don't believe in hell...but sometimes I wish there really was a hell...if you know what I mean.

Some of you might find the following thread to be interesting in the context of this thread. http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?p=182404#post182404 Once again...just consider the factual information as part of the puzzle...without anger or rancor.

I just found an interesting debate between Eric Phelps and Leo Zagami. I know very little about the details...but I enjoy listening to people who know what they are talking about...and who know how to debate effectively. This sort of thing can cause smoke to come out of your ears! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jGi4gSkcBEw

Thank-you for your interest. Once again...I simply desire understanding regarding the most powerful visible organization on the planet. I have zero animosity. People should probably keep going to church. I just want a new reformation...based upon the Teachings of Jesus and the U.S. Constitution. I realize that this is anathema...but that it is the right thing to do in modernity. I envision a non-penitential and non-sacrificial Namaste Mass based upon the Latin Mass. I love the art, music, ceremony, fellowship, etc...but the Satanists and Moneychangers need to be driven out of the temple. Powerful off-world forces would probably need to approve these heretical reforms. I'm not a theologian...but this is how I see things presently.

I like the idea of a 5% National Consumption Tax to fund legitimate Federal Government functions and projects...and the elimination of all the stupid tax forms, loopholes, etc. Why does everything have to be insane?

That video clip was creepy. Check out 'Murder in the Vatican' by Lucien Gregoire regarding the untimely death of Pope John Paul I. I've enjoyed attending masses...but I do not enjoy the intrigue, murder, and mayhem. 'In God's Name' by David Yallop is another interesting book...if you like reading about corruption, intrigue, murder, and mayhem.

I have no issues with rank and file Masons or Roman Catholics. What concerns me is who owns and operates this Solar System? My concerns are very high up. This is all about Solar System Administration. I am very, very interested in Gabriel, Michael, and Lucifer. Who are they...REALLY? I am very frustrated regarding all of the threads I have started. I am very frustrated with my life. I keep seeing the light vs dark battles...but I can never seem to pin anything down...or get any traction whatsoever. I can see clearly now...but I can't do a damn thing! I used to think that the answer was in the Bible. Then I lost my faith...and I thought that the answer was blowing in the wind. Now...I think that the truth is Down There...under the surface of the Earth and the Moon...in bases...possibly run by Draconian Reptilians.

But I don't really know if these beings exist...and if they do...what their true nature really is. How many factions are there? Are they all bad? Are they all good? Are they a mixture of good and bad? Who's winning? Of Gabriel, Michael, and Lucifer...who is the best...and who is the worst? Are they all Draconian Reptilians? Are they all Greys? Are they all Humans? Are they all of the above? Are they none of the above? Do they even exist? I've recently been thinking that Gabriel is the real problem...that Lucifer rebelled against Gabriel...and that Michael is the peacemaker. I'm toying with the idea that in "Heaven"...these three were at the pinnacle of the temple. I'm also toying with the idea that the "War in Heaven" was a three way power struggle among these three...which continues to this very day...here on Earth. Could this be getting at the heart of the "Alien Presence" which drove Bill Cooper to drinking and irritability? Bill said that it wasn't the Jews, the Catholics, or the Masons, et al. He said that it was the Mystery Schools and Secret Societies. This thing could be very hard to pin down.

I think I'm going to go and see "Avatar" and "Legion" this week...which will probably really mess with my already very confused and feeble mind. All of this is interesting...but I don't think it's doing me or anyone else much good. I want the truth...but I fear that the truth may push me (and a lot of other people) over the edge. Be careful as you research these subjects. I think that this is necessary work...for those who can handle it...but that it is truly playing with fire. Don't take this stuff lightly! On another thread I said that I needed to find a good Jesuit...but that a good Jesuit is hard to find!! When the dirt really hits the fan...and I think it will...I want a good CIA agent and a good Jesuit to help me through what may be quite literally 'Hell on Earth'. Remember the CIA type of guy in the original "V" who saved everyone's @$$? They didn't like him...but he knew what the hell was going on...and he knew what to do. Something to think about.

The Satanists and the Money Changers need to be driven out of the temple...in an Italian Police Van! Then they can go to work on the Deep Underground Reptilian Bases! Of course...the good Reps and Greys can stay!

In a sense...a Government is a Church...and a Church is a Government. They are two sides of the same coin. The question is 'What is the nature of the Church and the Government?' A "Constitutional Theocracy is a form of government in which within the context of a modern democracy a particular religion is granted a central role in the legal and political system. In contrast to a pure theocracy, power resides in political figures operating within the bounds of a constitution, rather than religious leadership. A form of government (also referred to as a system of government or a political system) is a system composed of various people, institutions and their relations in regard to the governance of a state. ... Theocracy is a form of government in which a religion and the government are intertwined..." http://www.nationmaster.com/encyclopedia/Constitutional-theocracy Could the United States of America be under a Constitutional Theocracy presently? Could the United States of America have always been under such a Constitutional Theocracy? See Article 6 of the U.S. Constitution. Was the 1954 Greada treaty simply an extension of this hypothetical Constitutional Theocracy? http://www.thewatcherfiles.com/future.htm Is the U.N. Charter superceding the U.S. Constitution a further expansion of a Constitutional Theocracy? To stop preaching...and go to meddling...How would the Roman Catholic Church function if it were based upon Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom...and was in complete harmony with the US Constitution, Bill of Rights, and the Teachings of Jesus? Would a Pope be elected by the general membership every four years? Would the Teachings of Jesus, the US Constitution, Bill of Rights, and the Will of the People...supercede Canon Law, the Curia, the Pope, the Black Pope (and whoever the Black Pope takes orders from)? Would this create chaos...or would it minimize evil and corruption? For Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom to work...the Roman Catholic Church would have to go along with it...and looking at history...this would be nearly impossible. The RCC is the biggest 'We Never Change Church' imaginable. The Sirius Powers That Be would have to order it done...or it would be a non-starter. For Sirius (and Alpha Draconis?) to sign-off on this...We the People of Earth would have to exhibit a significant level of Knowledge and Responsibility. There is presently a Forbidden Knowledge Explosion...and the BIG question is 'Will We the People of Earth Respond Responsibly?' How about a non-penetential and non-sacrificial Ecumenical Namaste Mass based upon the Latin Mass...Celebrating the Divinity Within Humanity? Now I'm really meddling! I'm an abominable heretic...yet I prefer the glory, grandeur, reverence, and awe of the traditional service...rather than the 'Jesus is my buddy, show-up in shorts and a t-shirt, praise-song, hippie reefer-madness'.
1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=94sa1Byb7fw 2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tP5guVydW7w&NR=1 3. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XL4PO9jIj2I&feature=related 4. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gq8i69-L-Fs&feature=related 5. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pxBjqrPAUg8&NR=1

In a sense...I desire a Minimalist Humanistic Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom Theocracy . I simply desire that everything work out well for everyone...everywhere and everywhen.

I just spoke with someone who says they are God. But they smoke and drink to smelly and loud drunkeness...and say they've never heard of the Jesuits! I even tried to talk this "God" out of destroying the world. He seemed to like me...so maybe we have a chance! They reminded me of another person who told me they were going to walk on water...because they wanted a challenge! The first person considered America to be Babylon...rather than Rome being Babylon. I've heard other people say this as well. Leo Zagami hinted at this while in 'prison'. I hope Leo's OK. Sherry Shriner takes this view, as well. Bill Cooper pointed his finger at 'America' rather than Europe. Do Deep Underground Reptilian Bases under North America control even the Vatican? How deep is this snake hole? Is the inner Earth one big maze of snake holes...consisting of bases, cities, stargates, temples, cathedrals, leviton trains...all ruled by the God/Satan of This Prison Planet? I presently think that God is Satan...and that Humans are not in charge of Humanity. I'm seeing a very dark reality...with billions of victims. I really, really hope I'm wrong. I really don't enjoy seeing a demon behind every bush. (every Bush???!!!) Sorry...I couldn't resist. Nothing personal Magog!

Update regarding "God". "God" has been looking for me...and I'm told that "God" dreamed that I was murdered...and this "God" appeared to be a 'vengeful God'...and very protective toward me...so I'm told. I found this fascinating and chilling...because I have talked very little with this person....and they know nothing about my controversial threads and comments here on Avalon. I worry about that sort of thing...because if people really took me seriously...and if I'm correct about a lot of things...the results could make life difficult for a lot of the custodians of the status quo...and I think they know this very well. But not very many people latch on to what I say...so there should be no real cause for concern...right? That's what I keep telling myself...but I'm not so sure. Believe it, or not, I'm trying to make life easier for everyone...including the really bad guys and gals...human and non-human. But just for the record...if anything happens to me...it was NOT an accident or self inflicted. All of my close friends and relatives know this...and they have my top 10 list of suspects. Do you really want to turn me into a martyr...and discredit your own cause? If anyone is ever really bothered or threatened by what I say...talk to me. I'm reasonable...and I try really hard not to be stubborn. I will stop...if asked nicely and reasonably. I'm trying to dig into things that are already out there...and then formulate positive solutions...even though they don't seem positive sometimes. I have zero animosity toward anyone...really and truly. But perhaps I should cut back on my posting. Maybe I will.

Mercuriel...the BS didn't start with the Vatican...or start when the Vatican was supposedly infiltrated. This goes back to the War in Heaven...in my opinion. There seems to be a very bitter and ancient conflict between the Human and Reptilian races. I don't know the details...but this whole thing has been playing out in the Pleiades, Aldebaran, Sirius, Mars, Atlantis, Lemuria, Babylon, Egypt, Rome, Jerusalem...and in the Roman Catholic Church...right from the beginning of this organization. If it hadn't been them...it would've been another organization. This goes way deeper than corrupt men sitting around at the Vatican...dreaming up all manner of evil and atrocity for Planet Earth and the Human Race. It goes deep into Underground Reptilian Bases...I believe. A Draconian Reptilian may tell the Black Pope what to tell Pope Benedict. I think the top level Vatican hierarchy does exactly what they are told to do. That's just what I think. I don't really know...or have any inside information or proof. If I did...I probably wouldn't be safe on Pluto. Recently...I've been thinking that we are Prisoners of War on a Prison Planet with Grey Guards and a Reptilian Warden...and that the Reptilian Agenda for Earth is administered primarily through the City States (Vatican City, City of London, and Washington D.C.) and the United Nations. I tend to think that somehow we lost an ancient Human vs Reptilian war...and we are experiencing some sort of Payback Time. I'm speculating that the Universe is ruled by a Reptilian Universal Church Theocracy. My hope is that All Races will eventually embrace Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom...which I think would be in everyone's best interest. I tend to agree with Jordan Maxwell...that we're pretty much $crewed. UNLESS...the Reptilians make an exception for this Solar System...and Theocratically Impose Human Sovereignty in this Solar System based upon Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom...in the context of the U.S. Constitution and Bill of Rights...in the context of the United Nations...and applied to the entire Solar System. This would have to be a top-down implementation. Anything else would probably be a blood-bath. This could serve as a test. The Reptilians might want to make this their modus operandi if the test is successful. Who knows?

Wow lisa! I wasn't expecting that! Thank-you for the link! I did read 'In God's Name' by David Yallop...and it was quite revealing. 'Murder in the Vatican' by Lucien Gregoire was even more revealing. I'm hoping that the church can be completely reformed and purified. When Jesus tried to reform the church...he got murdered...and subsequently ignored and superceded...and put on bloody and nearly naked display throughout the world...in the form of the crucifix. When Pope John Paul I tried to reform the church...he got murdered. And it sounds like Pope John Paul VI was murdered as well...for attempting to clean things up.

My Comment: Update regarding "God". "God" has been looking for me...and I'm told that "God" dreamed that I was murdered...and this "God" appeared to be a 'vengeful God'...and very protective toward me...so I'm told. I found this fascinating and chilling...because I have talked very little with this person....and they know nothing about my controversial threads and comments here on Avalon. I worry about that sort of thing...because if people really took me seriously...and if I'm correct about a lot of things...the results could make life difficult for a lot of the custodians of the status quo...and I think they know this very well. But not very many people latch on to what I say...so there should be no real cause for concern...right? That's what I keep telling myself...but I'm not so sure. Believe it, or not, I'm trying to make life easier for everyone...including the really bad guys and gals...human and non-human. But just for the record...if anything happens to me...it was NOT an accident or self inflicted. All of my close friends and relatives know this...and they have my top 10 list of suspects. Do you really want to turn me into a martyr...and discredit your own cause? If anyone is ever really bothered or threatened by what I say...talk to me. I'm reasonable...and I try really hard not to be stubborn. I will stop...if asked nicely and reasonably. I'm trying to dig into things that are already out there...and then formulate positive solutions...even though they don't seem positive sometimes. I have zero animosity toward anyone...really and truly. But perhaps I should cut back on my posting. Maybe I will.

Your Comment: Nay Brother - Scream Your Truth to the Rafters...

Stand...

The Roman Catholic Church was taken over by Forces Loyal to the Fallen Ones on June 29th, 1963. It was then signified by the carrying from that point forward by the Pontiff Pope Peter the VI and all others since, of the Crooked or Bent Cross (Which is an Esoteric Symbol of the Antichrist).

Pope John Paul the II and others have sat in a Chair with an Inverted Cross - Again the AntiChrist Symbol, and If You think that They've just missed that one while setting up the Area for His audiences - Then You haven't studied their Protocols in the right way. They miss nothing when setting up for a Papal audience and it's ALL on Purpose. Bank on that...

EG.

Fish Hat = Dagon or Poseidon Worship...

INRI = Ishtar / Nimrod / Rah Marduk / Isis (Inner Doctrine for the Initiate)

INRI = Acronym of the Latin inscription 'IESVS·NAZARENVS·REX·IVDÆORVM' (Jesus Nazarenus, Rex Iudaeorum), which translates to English as "Jesus of Nazareth, King of the Jews". (Outer Doctrine for the Profane)

I could go on Ad Infinitum...

My Comment: Mercuriel...the BS didn't start with the Vatican...or start when the Vatican was supposedly infiltrated. This goes back to the War in Heaven...in my opinion. There seems to be a very bitter and ancient conflict between the Human and Reptilian races. I don't know the details...but this whole thing has been playing out in the Pleiades, Aldebaran, Sirius, Mars, Atlantis, Lemuria, Babylon, Egypt, Rome, Jerusalem...and in the Roman Catholic Church...right from the beginning of this organization. If it hadn't been them...it would've been another organization. This goes way deeper than corrupt men sitting around at the Vatican...dreaming up all manner of evil and atrocity for Planet Earth and the Human Race. It goes deep into Underground Reptilian Bases...I believe. A Draconian Reptilian may tell the Black Pope what to tell Pope Benedict. I think the top level Vatican hierarchy does exactly what they are told to do. That's just what I think. I don't really know...or have any inside information or proof. If I did...I probably wouldn't be safe on Pluto. Recently...I've been thinking that we are Prisoners of War on a Prison Planet with Grey Guards and a Reptilian Warden...and that the Reptilian Agenda for Earth is administered primarily through the City States (Vatican City, City of London, and Washington D.C.) and the United Nations. I tend to think that somehow we lost an ancient Human vs Reptilian war...and we are experiencing some sort of Payback Time. I'm speculating that the Universe is ruled by a Reptilian Universal Church Theocracy. My hope is that All Races will eventually embrace Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom...which I think would be in everyone's best interest. I tend to agree with Jordan Maxwell...that we're pretty much $crewed. UNLESS...the Reptilians make an exception for this Solar System...and Theocratically Impose Human Sovereignty in this Solar System based upon Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom...in the context of the U.S. Constitution and Bill of Rights...in the context of the United Nations...and applied to the entire Solar System. This would have to be a top-down implementation. Anything else would probably be a blood-bath. This could serve as a test. The Reptilians might want to make this their modus operandi if the test is successful. Who knows?

Your Comment: Did I say that ? That It started with the Vatican ? I did not...

Hmmm - I don't much appreciate Baiting and I've seen alot of It lately around here.

The Post was "Secrets of the Vatican" wasn't It ?

I gave some. Simple...

Again - Please do not Polarize My posts...
_________________
Peace, Light, Love, Unity and Harmony.

Namaste,

Mercuriel

My Comment: I wasn't "baiting" or "polarizing your post". You indicated that the real trouble in the Roman Catholic Church started on June 29, 1963. I indicated that the real trouble started with the War in Heaven...and that the Roman Catholic Church is merely one more vehicle for implementing a dark agenda for Planet Earth and the Human Race. What about the Crusades and the Inquisition? What about the Dark Ages...and the mental anguish imposed upon countless millions of people throughout the centuries? What about the Nazi/Vatican relationship? You commented. I commented. You got mad. I won't trouble you further. I won't disturb your peace, light, love, unity, and harmony. I really don't like posting...and this is one more reason to stop. I don't get paid to do this. I was having a good day. Namaste?

Could the pedophilia be somehow Interdimensional Reptilian related? Is there a Demonic Dimension to this whole mess? What about the disappearance of children? Could this somehow be related to the pedophilia situation? I think the clergy of all faiths get targeted by demonic forces. I think that anyone who tries to do the right thing gets targeted. I believe that unseen entities are watching me type this message. I often talk out loud to these entities...and thank God they don't talk back. Sometimes I flip them off...and swear at them! Didn't Martin Luther throw his ink well at them? I still want that Solar System Exorcism. I still want a completely reformed and purified Roman Catholic Church. If this doesn't happen...all efforts to uplift Humanity will be in vain. My dream of Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom will be dead in the water...and a non-starter. All I will have accomplished is to get myself on the Red List aka the Dead List. Better Dead Than Rep.

The 'Law of Confusion' is a descriptive and appropriate term...but I tend to eschew obfuscation...and to espouse elucidation. A Christocentric eschatological theological approach to scriptural studies which utilizes the concept of comprehensive concentration...which assumes the red-letter teachings of Jesus as being fundamental...with the remaining portions of the biblical canon as being merely contextual...cross-referencing utilizing a Strong's Concordance...and applying the accepted norms of grammatical-historical hermeneutics...is supremely beneficial regarding definitively and devotionally ascertaining the Christ Conscious Aspects of the First Source and Center of All Things...to fully experience Jesus as Lord in modernity...being careful to exegete...rather than eisegetically twisting and corrupting the sacred texts to conform to canon law (there is no substantial body of evidence which substantiates transubstantiation)...so as not to become a reprehensible and reprobate hermeneutic whore...a cursed Judas Iscariot in dire need of prostrate penetance, confession, repentance, and reconciliation...and in grave danger of burning for all eternity as a sinner in the hands of an angry God. World Without End. Amen.
:mfr_omg::mfr_omg:
What Would Rudolph Bultmann Say?
What Would Jonathan Edwards Say?
What Would Edward Shillebeeckx Say?
What Would Pat Condell Say?
What Would SaLuSa Say?

Don't take anything I write too seriously. I'm just sort of thrashing around...spewing all manner of speculation and smart-@$$ comments. I really mean no harm. I guess I'm trying to get everyone to think in unconventional ways. I don't have the answers...only questions and suggestions. I'm not an authority on anything. My last comment was pretty much accurate...but I hammed it up a lot. I didn't really mean the last part of it...but I just couldn't resist. Please...nobody should take that personally. I am Not 'I AM'! I am not even ex-cathedra! I am, I am, I am, I am...I am deluded...yes I am! And so is Elizabeth Claire Profit!!!

I can't imagine how difficult it is to administer the Roman Catholic Church. The internal and external politics must be a real pain. Everything they say and do...can and will be used against them. I speculate that they have malevolent non-humans...above and below them...telling them what to do...with the angry and rebellious masses to the right and left of them...their trusting flock in front of them...and a closet full of skeletons behind them. What fun!

I loved visiting numerous RC churches and cathedrals. I loved visiting Florence and the Vatican. I did not...however...enjoy visiting the Colosseum...which is just down the street from the Vatican. It's the Colosseum and Demonic parts that trouble me very, very deeply. Now about that Solar System Exorcism.

I'd love to hang out in Modena...eat lots of good Italian food in the gastronomic capital of Italy...drink a bottle of fine wine with Gabriel, Michael, and Lucifer...and spend some quality time at the Ferrari factory. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_kwxzU4wL4 Someone told me that the Pope has the 400th Enzo Ferrari! I actually asked a Ferrari representative about this...and they just smiled. I'd also like to camp out at Monza...and watch the Ferraris and beautiful women...while arguing the fine points of theology and cosmology with a renegade Jesuit! Then...I'd like to go back to Sorrento...and watch a beautiful sunset over the Bay of Naples.

It's becoming a pattern with me. I like to watch(or listen to) groupings of longer videos and recordings regarding a particular subject. This thread is regarding who we are...or supposedly are. I'm very confused and conflicted concerning this very basic subject. Here are several videos for your viewing pleasure. Please watch them more than once...if you can. There is so much material to absorb. I'm finding these videos to be quite enlightening and therapeutic...in an upsetting sort of way...if that makes sense. We live in a very strange universe. Nothing is neat and tidy.

1. Angelika Whitecliff http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2243728372708503124

2. Lloyd Pye http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1285345463618889531

3. Michael Cremo (French introduction and English Lecture): http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2895087993533041198&hl=en

4. A'shayana Deane (aka Anna Hayes): http://www.disclose.tv/action/viewvideo/37108/Contactee_Anna_Hayes___Earth_History_Part_1/

5. Ralph Ellis
A. http://www.consciousmedianetwork.com/members/rellis.htm
B. http://www.consciousmedianetwork.com/members/rellis2.htm

6. Alex Collier http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-616495947939806971

7. Jonathan Gray YouTube - Hidden Discoveries Pt.1

I guess there is security and solace in being part of a group...even a really screwed-up group. We're all in this together...it takes all kinds...and the show must go on.
But why?

How do I know that I'm not an alien or a hybrid? Are we all completely human? Are some of us completely reptilian? Do all of us have reptilian components in our DNA? Were we created? By whom? Anunaki? Draconians? Pleiadians? Orions? Does the Divine One live on Nibiru? Who created them? Did we evolve? Here...or somewhere else? Did human life begin here...or was Earth colonized? How old is my soul(if I have a soul)? Will my soul really exist forever? If not...what's the point? Did I live in Atlantis? Did I live in Lemuria? Am I a good person or a bad person? I keep getting a sinking feeling that I am merely a Base 4 Mutation.
I wanted to be more...a lot more.

A slimy amoeba in the deep blue sea was the great grand-dad of you and me.
Then I was a monkey swinging in a tree.
Now I'm a teacher...I've got my PhD.
See what science has done for me?

Thank-you mudra...I appreciate your comment. My problem is that my mind is still...too much of the time. I have to work at making my mind work.
I'm looking for truth...not tranquility.

Did my soul exist 1,000,000,000 years ago? Will it exist 1,000,000,000 years from now? If so...will my memories survive? If not...what is the meaning of this?
We're supposed to be divine...so I must be a God with Alzheimers.

Knowing who we are...where we came from...what we are supposed to be doing...and where we are going...may be necessary to get ourselves out of this mess. Someone...or something...seems to be keeping us in the dark...regarding all of the above. Keep asking questions. Keep knocking the damn doors down.

I think that I could watch(listen to) the 5 links in the first post...over and over again. I don't know how much is true...but the possibilities are astronomical. I think that these perspectives are moving us in the right direction. The gods of this world(Draconian and Anunaki?) are not the God of the Universe. Unfortunately...I think that we are dealing with the gods of this world...and that they are not very nice. So...we have a big problem. I'd like to see the gods of this world leave...at least for awhile...and let us sort this thing out for ourselves. We will probably make lots of mistakes...but they will be our mistakes...and we will learn from these mistakes...and become better and better...every day and in every way. At some point...we may be able to interact with our former gods in a constructive manner...when they have matured...and we have matured. This may take thousands of years. These gods have given us much...but they have robbed us of so very much more. I don't hate them...even if they hate us. I don't want them to be hurt or killed. I don't want them to go away mad. I just want them to go away. Sorry Lucifer. Of all the words that tongue can tell...the saddest are 'It might have been.'

Has anyone watched or listened to the 5 links in the first post? I maintain that listening to these 5 links as a group...several times...is a constructive spiritual exercise. Again...I can't vouch for the material...but a lot of it seems to be going in the right direction...and may be helpful in recognizing truth and error. There is a progressive spiritual component present in the presentation of the intellectual information. They have filled a spiritual and intellectual void for me. See what you think.

I'm starting to get really worried. The numbers of people participating in the forum are not what they should be...given the troubled and confused times we are living in. There is a tremendous amount of new information out there...and the public needs to sort through this material in a calm and rational manner. I like Alex Jones...but that's not my style. I like this forum format...but I am not seeing the type of discussion...both in interest levels and numbers...that I would like to see.

Tell me who I am. But also tell me what is going on in alternative thinking. I know very little about these subjects...which is why I ask a lot of questions.
I'm just seeing a lot of dots not being connected...that need to be connected...to get us out of this mess.

This is probably the most fascinating thread I have started so far(less than a dozen, I'm sure). Understanding our real history...going back billions of years perhaps...is probably the key to the present and future. Now I'm talking about the cutting edge history that we were not taught about in school. There is a whole world opening up to our understanding which is changing everything. Tell me what you think about all of this. I added another link(Jonathan Gray) to the first post. Here it is: YouTube - Hidden Discoveries Pt.1

Good to see you posting, Susan! Don't forget about us!

Thank-you for your thoughtful response, Lorien.

Did the God of the Universe create us in a single 24 hour period...6,000 years ago? Did we evolve from lower primates? Did the Anunnaki create us by combining their DNA with hominid DNA...to be good, obedient slaves? Were we created somewhere else...and then seeded here to colonize Earth? Were we chased here in a Star Wars? Did the Anunnaki defeat us...and then genetically modify us...to dumb us down...to make us good, obedient slaves? Are we still good, obedient slaves? Can we be spiritually and genetically modified to regain our former glory? Are we in the middle of a universal Star Wars to decide who gets to be Almighty God and Masters of the Universe? Are we fighting to decide who gets to be the Master Race and God's Chosen People? Are the Reptilians playing 'God'? Why isn't freewill tempered with responsibility? Will all malevolent beings(human and non-human) be exorcised from Earth soon? Is 2012 Judgment Day...to determine who gets to control the stargates? Are we capable of ruling ourselves? Are we better off being ruled by Reptilians? Is Lucifer a Reptilian? Do we really have to play these stupid wargames? Why can't we learn to share and play nice? Can't we just get along? Was that 20 questions?

I've been crazy for a long time...so I don't have to worry about going crazy. That frees me up to ask the unanswerable questions...and to expect convincing answers.

When I have considered all of the possibilities...and compared them exhaustively...and received a divine sign. Seriously...we don't know everything about everything. We don't know everything about anything. Everything is related to everything. So...we have to know everything about everything...to know everything about anything. Are you convinced?

Susan, thank-you for your wisdom and enthusiasm! Did we get the internet from benevolent ETs? Which ones? I thought that Al Gore invented the internet? Is AL an ET? Is Al a high ranking member of Giza Intelligence aka the renegade Pleiadians who helped Hitler until 1941(unconfirmed) and were supposedly removed from Earth in the late 1970's by the Pleiadians? Did Earth receive anti-gravity, free-energy, time-travel, nuclear weapons, integrated circuits, etc. from the same ETs...or have we received technology from more than one group of ETs? We are quickly becoming a global community...who will probably be much less likely to kill each other. We are forming a responsibly free global community...and not the tyrannical New World Order envisioned by the malevolent ETs. Will they try to use extermination and enslavement to control us? Do we threaten their reign of terror throughout the universe? Do the Pleiadians want to control us as much as the Draconians or Anunnaki? Are we the loose cannons of the universe? Is this all about Freedom vs Tyranny? Oh...never mind...just tell me who I am.

Thank-you for your detailed and reasonable responses.

In a sense...I don't care who I am...as long as I live forever(in some way, shape, or form)...remember all of my past-lives(if necessary)...and stay out of war, enslavement, and extreme suffering. It wouldn't surprise me if I was a spiritual and physical mongrel...and had been involved in unbelievable achievements and utter depravity. I would simply like to see the universe become a friendly place where all war and atrocity would cease to exist forever. Life should be enjoyed...not endured. I would be happy to live in a neighborhood of Reptilians, Greys, Pleiadians, etc, etc...as long as they didn't hurt or kill me...and respected my privacy and personal freedom. I'm thinking that all races have been horrible...and done terrible things to each other. I'm thinking that even God has been a Devil. I see the universe as being one big mess. We need to clean it up...without hurting or killing anyone.

mudra, I enjoyed listening to Tolle. Thank-you. I will listen to more after I get some rest. :original: Taking the focus off of self is a good thing...and both self exaltation and self degradation...will sink us. They are two sides of the same stupid self-centered coin.

Thank-you mudra. Here is a link(missing?) to another piece of the puzzle: YouTube - Alien Species 1 - Humans YouTube - Alien Species 2 - Greys and Reptilians

Once more...please take a look at the links in the first post. I've added a couple more links. I'm finding a benefit from listening to/watching these. I'm also finding that I need to listen to/view them several times for the information to really sink in. There is so much new(for me) information. Again...I can't vouch for the accuracy and truth of these...but they seem to be going in the right general direction. I'm interested in hearing both positive and negative responses. I don't believe everything...but they seem to resonate with me.

This is just a renewed invitation to consider the videos in the first post...as a group. I'm considering this to be a step in the right direction...rather than the gospel truth.

I am not blessed with exotic memories and experiences. My life is quite bland. This thread is probably a case of the bland leading the bland...who knows where? I'm not the slave of any source. I am very fickle. I try to consider as many sources as possible...and often these sources conflict with each other in profound ways. I try to look for commonalities. Are the sources in the first post credible...or have they been exposed as charlitans or frauds?

I'm leaning toward the theory that us Earthlings are renegade Pleiadians from Aldebaran who sided with Lucifer...got kicked out of Heaven (Pleiades)...fought a civil war with our brothers and sisters...both collaborated with, and fought against, the Dracs...traveled to Sirius...and ended up on Earth in ancient Atlantis. Are we 'fallen angels'? If this is true...no wonder we have so many issues!

Reality check: Is this true...or could it possibly be true?

Has anyone listened to and watched the links in the first post? What did you think? What are your conclusions?

The following is a very sad documentary regarding the Waco Massacre. I found it to be well done and balanced. Please consider this comparatively recent historical event in the context of current discussions regarding the New World Order, Fascism, Police State, etc. I like the idea of reexamining all terrorism, wars, disasters, assassinations, etc. This one is worth watching. Watch and weep:

1. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4298137966377572665

2. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1755692679103175934&hl=en

Is there no interest in the Waco Massacre? Has everyone seen this documentary? There is plenty of interest in the Michael Jackson thread. This is a very well done video. Addressing issues with the luxury of hindsight may help us to prevent future atrocities.

I think I may have been in a class where David Koresh was a visitor. I am also aware of some of the prophetic and political issues which swirled around this group. I am very fearful that this sort of thing(massacre) could happen again...with any number of groups or individuals. This is a very scary phenomenon. And very, very sad.

Thank-you for the responses. It's hard to get properly informed...and remain in a balanced frame of mind. We are busy. We are distracted. We are frazzled. And facing the truth about anything can require a lot of work and pain. As I started listening to people like Bill Cooper...I realized that many people who seemed to be upset with the government...were almost more upset with the general public. I don't have an answer...but I think that forums such as this one are a huge step in the right direction.

I like the idea of reviewing recent history...where the dust has settled...books have been written...documentaries have been made...and some of the major players are now retired...and are willing to open up a bit. Irrationality flourishes in the heat of battle. Hindsight is 20/20...or it should be.

I keep thinking that the whole thing right now...is for everyone...from Lucifer to the kindergarten drop-out...to get informed without getting mad. There needs to be a global rethinking of EVERYTHING. We need to consider everything...from all angles...all the time. I know that's impossible...but it's a worthy goal. People need to start getting PhD's in subjects such as RESPONSIBILITY, LIFE, THE UNIVERSE, AND EVERYTHING...instead of ENTOMOLOGY. No offense...but that really bugs me.

Thank you Unified Serenity. The internet is changing everything. The alternative media...combined with people from around the world...chatting with each other online may save us...if we can keep the internet from being heavily censored or shut down completely.

I thought I understood Waco...but this documentary brought out details that I hadn't noticed. I just thought it was worth encouraging people to do some more thinking about Waco...especially in light of what has happened since 9/11. Perhaps completely understanding one event can help us to properly understand previous and subsequent events. A lot of these horrific events seem to have eerie similarities. The repeated cover-ups, ommission of pertinent facts, slanted and one-sided lines of reasoning and questioning, blatent lies, etc, etc...are very troubling to me. Something is very, very wrong. This goes for most of our wars, assasinations, economic disasters, scandals, terrorist events, etc...throughout U.S. history.

Who, EXACTLY, is trying to destroy us...and Constitutional Responsible Freedom? Who do you think is responsible...Lucifer? When we find out who it is...what should we do about it...Lucifer? What future atrocities might they have planned for us...Lucifer? As the God of This World...perhaps you should bring them to justice...Lucifer. You are meticulously legalistic...aren't you...Lucifer? How about making a public appearance...to answer these, and other, questions...Lucifer? How about a one hour interview on 60 Minutes...with no commercials...Lucifer? It's time for disclosure...Lucifer. You are obligated to show yourself to the whole world.

I watched the video again today. What a nightmare! If they wanted to simply deal with the gun situation...they could have secured a search warrant...and arrived without an army...and politely examined the guns...and calmly dealt with any illegalities and tax issues. The authorities seemed to really want a fight. The whole thing was a horrible mess...and terribly mishandled. This was NOT another Jonestown. This seemed to be a group of rugged individualists with peculiar(but not dangerous) religious views...and some moral irregularities(which were already being addressed). The authorities seemed to want to make a bloody and burnt example out of them. Was this a trial run for the religous persecution and extermination which many fear will accompany the establishment of the New World Order? Was this a burnt offering to Lucifer? Some have suggested that 9/11 was such a sacrifice. I don't know.

The FLIR footage of machine guns being fired into the burning building was diabolical to the nth degree. These poor people...including women and children couldn't escape death at this point (in most cases, I suspect) even if they really wanted to. This is something which one might expect the Nazis to have done in WWII.

I'm still strongly leaning toward basing the United Nations on the U.S. Constitution and Bill of Rights. This would be the right way to do globalism. I have a high resolution photo of the U.N. Security Council as the background on my computer. To me...the Security Council should report to the General Assembly...which should have the ultimate power in the U.N. Check out the U.N. website. http://www.un.org/en/ The existing globalist plans seem to be dreamed up by malevolent aliens. There is some evidence for this. Right...Lucifer?

That's funny Unified Serenity! I don't think Lucifer would give me the time of day...let alone answer my questions. But, you know, I don't remember my dreams...so who knows what goes on when I sleep? I seem to wake up more tired than when I went to sleep. Ignorance is bliss sometimes! My 'questions' are simply a unique way of addressing a subject which doesn't get talked about a lot. I keep thinking that those who monitor this site might be able to pass something relevant on to those who are on the inside of what I suspect is a very, very dark predicament for humanity. I'm really glad that I'm not an insider. I'm miserable enough, as it is!

Despite everything...I think that the Branch Dividians should not have fired one shot...even if the ATF shot first. They should have run for cover...called 911...and arranged to peacefully surrender to the authorities almost immediately. Then they could have fought it out in court. You may have the right of way on the highway...but if you see an accident in the making...you need to put on the brakes and turn the steering wheel...to avoid a disaster. Exercising freedom of speech and religion, and the right to keep and bear arms, was constitutionally guaranteed...but engaging in an armed confrontation with the authorities was a very bad idea.

Regarding the Delta Force soldiers entering the compound after it was supersaturated with CS gas...I hadn't heard this before...and, if true, this whole thing was even more diabolical than I thought. I just keep asking myself 'who was giving Bill Clinton and Janet Reno orders?' This certainly was not dreamed up by the FBI and ATF people in Waco...or maybe not even in Washington D.C. Were orders being given from a Deep Underground Military Base...or the Dark Side of the Moon? Why is there a black helicopter circling my house...and a shapeshifting Delta Force soldier pounding on my front door? He's yelling that he's here to help me. Oh God! The helicopter just morphed into a UFO! I'M SO SOL!!

Thank-you deb003. It seems that the bright lights are being turned on...and the bad-guys are being exposed...and examined by a lot of microscopes. They need secrecy...and that secrecy is disappearing. When this madness is resolved...I think things will be a lot better...even for the bad-guys. In a sense...we need to save them from themselves and from the demonic forces which hover over them and possess them.

Unified Serenity: Your last post was very interesting. A lot of us are spineless wonders. We're not particularly evil...just clueless and gutless...and I'm speaking for myself. I think bribing and blackmail is rampant. Getting informed without getting mad(or going crazy) keeps rising to the top of my list of things which could save the world. A cold infowar...if you will. I continue to think that our ultimate enemies are not human. We'd goof things up on our own...but not this bad. If we got rid of the malevolent aliens(and humans) by placing all the mothers on a mothership...we would still have massive problems...but I think things would gradually improve. But it still might take centuries to reach Nirvana.

Thank-you happyhollergal. I don't really blame the media. They give us what we want...and what the aliens want us to get! Again...the internet is changing everything. If the mainstream media broadcast what we view and talk about on this forum...the results might be disasterous. There is a time and place for everything. I'm really trying to be on everyone's side...rather than taking sides.

mntruthseeker: Thank-you for watching. Misery loves company! Seriously...this documentary was very informative in many ways. It wasn't just an angry, slanted attack against the government. It was very damaging...but it presented the information in a calm, fair, and rational manner. The interviews, hearings, and footage at the compound, were very revealing. The passage of time makes it easier to properly evaluate this sad chapter in American history. My intention was not to make anyone angry. I just want us all to learn from this event...so that this sort of thing doesn't happen again.

What amazed me was how the politicians, spokespersons, and press clearly and vigorously misrepresented the true facts of the case. If someone is skillful and determined...they can make black appear to be white. What do you suppose was the true underlying motivating force in this horrible situation?

I wish that this horror was caused just by a bunch of out of control locals...but it sounded like this thing was controlled from Washington D.C. But was the Clinton Administration being told what to do? Just asking. No proof. Again...I'm interested in calm and rational retrospective evaluation...to possibly prevent future horrific events. We need to keep refining our society...every day...and in every way.

Evolutionary change is much better than revolutionary change. I suspect that the lack of evolutionary change...with all deliberate speed...leads to revolutionary change. I continue to lean toward the infowar model. Once people start running in the streets...rational thought seems to come to a screeching halt. A latter-day rennaisance will bring peace to the world.

Unified Serenity: Do you have a radio show? If so...is it on the internet?

Please consider this(You may want to skip the first 14 minutes to get to the meat of the interview): http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-9056250941263655896&hl=en I don't know how much of it is true...but a lot of what I have learned fits in with this summary...including things that I have not been exposed to...but which I have speculated might be true. I was especially interested in the Nazi and world government aspects. Please consider this...and give me some feedback. This information could be very important...if true. I value your input. Most of you have a lot more experience in these subjects than I do. Here is a short introductory video: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3818951222987511245&hl=en

To keep things fair and balanced...here is an anti-Bielek link: http://www.bielek-debunked.com/index2.html I'm simply trying to sample a wide variety of information...and look for reasonable commonalities. I don't know what to believe or disbelieve. Relentless pursuit of the truth is probably a good thing...but it does take a lot of time and energy! Most of us don't have either of these in massive doses! Presenting various possibilities in a public forum is a good way to find out what people know and think. Initial confusion often leads to eventual clarity. But when we arrive at the top of the paradigm...we might not like the view!

From notes found on Google video: Al Bielek has lead a life most would not choose to live. While many would think that time travel, meeting aliens, and working on secret projects are exciting ventures, Al paid a big price for the privilege. Because those who set the agenda wish to keep their activities secret, Al was robbed of his family, his memories, and ultimately, his identity. They used advanced technologies to erase what was dear to him. However, their technologies are not perfect. Slowly, the memories came back. Al started meeting others who had been through the same process. Ultimately, a flood of memories returned. Al gives the most comprehensive account of his life ever recorded. It will shock and disturb most people to learn what is really going on in this planet. But Al has come to the conclusion that the truth needs to be published. For over ten years, Al has been featured on Radio Talk Shows and as a speaker in many conferences. His story has captivated the attention of tens of thousands of people worldwide. Many will question why Al hasn't been silenced. Perhaps, those who set the agenda are allowing brief glimpses of the truth to emerge. Perhaps it is something much bigger.

My comment: Perhaps this is why disclosure is so slow in coming. If one aspect of disclosure is officially revealed...there may be more questions than answers. This could set off a chain-reaction similar to the detonation of a nuclear device...which could devastate human(and alien?) civilization. Gradual and unofficial disclosure may be the only way to save the world...without destroying the world. Get informed without getting mad...or going crazy. My guess is that the PTB are scared stiff...in many more ways than one. We may need to help the PTB to defuse this information time-bomb. Despite their access to the underground bases...they may be in deeper do-do than we are...and that's some pretty deep snake-s***!

Did I understand Phillip Corso, Jr. to say that his father was in charge of Project Paperclip? If so...this would put him directly in charge of Nazis. Is Roswell directly related to Project Paperclip? Did I understand correctly from Phillip Corso, Jr. that his father released critical information contrary to the wishes of JFK? He also said that his father denied that Area 51 existed...if I'm not mistaken. He also said to look closely at the agencies which answer to no one...and that Steven Greer was looking in the wrong places...and for the wrong reasons. Should we be looking for Nazis and Deep Underground Military Bases for 'Disclosure'? Where did I hear that Jessie Marcel's specialty was disinformation? Was it Stanton Friedman? Stewart Swerdlow says that Roswell was a staged event. This view is also depicted in the Orion Conspiracy. Was Muroc(Edwards) 1954 a staged event? Was Ike deceived into abdicating the presidency? Is mind control and time travel a spiritual and perceptual phenomenon of illusion, smoke and mirrors? Is some of our 'modern' science really a potpourri of malevolent alien deceptions? One thing I found interesting in the Bielek recording...was that renegade Alderbaran Pleiadians helped Hitler...and wanted him to treat the Jews kindly...and that they abandoned Hitler in 1941. If this is true...did the reptilians and greys become the new power behind Hitler? Could this explain the contrast between the mostly upbeat and progressive Nazi Germany in the 30's...and the unspeakable horrors of the 40's? Here's a time travel video clip: YouTube - The Final Countdown Movie Highlights

I watched the Philip Corso, Jr. video again http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3131453436857082051&hl=en ...and then I found this scathing critique of 'The Day After Roswell': http://www.geocities.com/Area51/shadowlands/6583/roswell020.html

Phil Corso relates to Al Bielek because of the Philadelphia Experiment and time travel. Here is a lecture by Paola Harris(a personal friend of Corso) which focuses on Philip Corso: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-446805433045165885&hl=en

Please consider these videos carefully...and read between the lines...and see what conclusions you arrive at. I'll tell you mine...if you tell me yours!

I noticed that Philip Corso, Jr. made the following points:

1. That his father claimed that he saw alien bodies...and that they were basically robots with two separate brains...and used for space travel...because humans cannot travel beyond our moon without dying.
2. That his father confiscated his personal ufo photographs...and lied about their whereabouts.
3. That his father had a clearance for 9 levels above top secret.
4. That his father seemed to be in too many places and involved in too many things...in an almost miraculous manner.
5. That his father was in charge of the Nazis in Project Paperclip until he left the military.
6. That his father released sensitive information contrary to the wishes of JFK during the Cuban Missile Crisis.
7. That his father worked with several Presidents...and that only Eisenhower and Reagan really knew the truth about Roswell(what about Bush 1?).
8. That his father wrote a book titled 'Dawn of a New Age'. Publication uncertain.
9. That his father + 30 generals knew the truth about Roswell.
10. That his father was educated in England at Cambridge regarding Intelligence...and taught American Intelligence Officers what he learned there.
11. That 'The Day After Roswell' was not planned to be written...and was written in a hurry.
12. That his father had a massive collection of scientific papers regarding UFOs and Roswell...which included information about time travel.
13. That he has tried to release these papers on the internet...but that the site was shut down within 2 weeks.
14. That he has been told by high US government officials what not to say.
15. That he was told not to talk about the JFK assassination...and that he had agreed not to.
16. That his father was on a committee which investigated the findings of the Warren Commission...and that conspiracy theorists are on the wrong track.
17. That UFOs are time travel machines...and operate simultaneously in several dimensions.
18. That time travel(if it is real, he said) is why alien and UFO disclosure has not occurred.
19. That, as of 2004, Steven Greer was looking in the wrong places...and for the wrong reasons.
20. That he had refused to release his father's papers to Greer...but would consider doing so in the future.
21. That UFO researchers should investigate the groups who answer to no one...and that they needed to know where to look.
22. That most of our modern technology was derived from Roswell...and released between 1960-1963...and that subsequent technological developments have been based on that orginal release of technological information. (It is interesting to note that this period coincides with the Kennedy administration)
23. That his father was a contactee.
24. That he(Jr.) feared for his life.

Thank-you. Richard Hoagland says 'Google is your friend'.:original:

Could time travel mostly be holographic projections of recorded past events...and future extrapolations which are converted into holographic projections? Is time travel really perceptual rather than actual? Bill Cooper speaks of the 'aliens'...at Muroc in 1954...displaying a holographic projection of the Crucifixion of Christ. Note what appears to be holograms in the following: YouTube - The Temptation of Jesus by the Devil in the Wilderness Will a staged Second Coming of Christ be a holographic projection...featuring a fake Jesus? Is there a holographic projection technology in which portions of the projection can actually become physical? Some say that this whole world...including you and me...is a holographic projection. John Lear seems to know a lot about holograms. Were there no planes? Was 9/11 an Inside the Earth Job? Is all of this interrelated?

Is the interrelationship between physical/mental/spiritual/multidimensional/holographic/past/present/future the truth which cannot be revealed? Is everything an illusion? Nothing is real? Nothing to get hung-up about? Strawberry fields forever? Life 'tis but a dream? Are we merely holographic actors on a multidimensional stage? Are we merely reruns of what has already occurred? Or are we holograms of what will occur? I believe that I'll have another drink...

I still wonder if a lot of the whistleblowing information is coming from Philadelphia Experiment and Montauk Project refugees...who weren't suposed to survive...or weren't supposed to remember. One may have to go through the horrors of these projects...to really understand what the hell...or what from hell...is really going on.

Do not be alarmed! This comment does not exist. It's only a hologram! Go back to your homes! Everything is under control...by the holographic projector behind the curtain...who just so happens to be...a hologram named Lucifer.

Thank-you for your responses and links, Carol.

Here is a collection of Xcon 2004 lectures which I found to be interesting and informative:

1. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2458712180774133436&ei=4RwgStfXL5rYqAOGnfSoAQ&q=underground+bases+and+tunnels+what+is+the+government+trying+to+hide

2. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3136611432059601183&hl=en

3. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-446805433045165885&hl=en

4. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6186033608349666090&hl=en

5. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3658603973717116236&hl=en

6. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4719847809138525230&hl=en

7. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3131453436857082051&hl=en

8. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1016062432133216&hl=en

9. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8199033685705600378&hl=en

10. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3511529022158429353&hl=en

11. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-7909209335997712167&hl=en

Please watch and comment.

I'm just trying to save this thread from a premature demise. There really is a lot of good information here. Perhaps you all have seen these lecture videos before. Perhaps some of you were at the conference. This is all new to me. Tell me what you think.

If this is old news for you...what is your verdict? What is your opinion regarding what Stanton Friedman said regarding Bob Lazar? What did Philip Corso, Jr. say was the reason why disclosure has not occurred? Do you agree...or disagree? Just testing your knowledge. I hadn't heard either perspective until last week.

I think that it is good to ascertain which speakers and information can stand the test of time and scrutiny. If we simply consider the latest and most sensational information...does anyone notice when what someone said...that sounded so good at the time...later turns out to be utter BS?

When there are no responses...threads quickly disappear...never to be seen again.

I found this to be a very interesting and informative interview. Alex talks with Kevin Trudeau, the infomercial marketer ordered by a federal judge to pay more than $37 million for violating a 2004 stipulated order by allegedly misrepresenting the content of his book, The Weight Loss Cure They Dont Want You to Know About.

1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CxOJhtiMFYM
2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N5tIff3mG8o&feature=related
3. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gVopKirg3jg&feature=related
4. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UfUGBcRD4WU&feature=related
5. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hGmQyXGYaEg&feature=related
6. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NnOp709KcbY&feature=related
7. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WUl9bs-md3M&feature=related

Please listen to all 7 parts of this interview. It contains constructive insights into the thinking of the elites. I had the thought that if we all considered ourselves to be elites...and thought about how to run the world...we would, in essence, put ourselves into their secret meetings and yachts...rather than being on the outside...looking in. I know this is a bit of a stretch...but we can't think of ourselves as peasants with pitchforks. We need to think on their level...but without the delusion and corruption. The elites are not planning on running in the streets...and neither should we.

http://redletterchurch.net/ (completely removed from the internet) contains some ideas which I tend to gravitate toward. It's quite different than anything else I have encountered. Take it or leave it. It may be one more piece of a very complex and confusing puzzle.

Hello! My name is Deep Thought. We don't have church buildings and we don't ask for money. Jesus didn't either! Contribute to your favorite charitable organizations. Follow the money! Meet me here tomorrow! Same time. Same place. The truth is in here. Follow the truth. --- Deep Thought

Table of Contents:

1. Welcome to Red Letter Church!
2. Red Letter Sermons.
3. The Teachings of Jesus are Fundamental.
4. What Did Jesus Say?
5. Red Letter Phobia.
6. All of Scripture Centered in the Teachings of Jesus.
7. The Great Commission: The Great Omission!
8. What is the Gospel?
9. The Teachings of Jesus in Society.
10. Apostolic Succession and the Holy Grail.
11. Church Buildings.
12. Salvation and Righteousness.
13. Money and the 50-50 Rule.
14. Jesus and Nicodemus.
15. Positive Thinking and Self Esteem.
16. The Eternal Word.
17. The Church’s One Foundation.
18. The Teachings of Jesus and the Newspaper.
19. Jesus Christ and Albert Schweitzer.
20. Jesus Christ and the Roman Catholic Church.
21. Jesus, Perfection, and Salvation.
22. Jesus and Prayer.
23. Live Out Thy Life Within Me!
24. Gates, Trees, Houses, and the Kingdom of God.
25. Creedal Statements.
26. Singing Hymns About Him.
27. The Least of These.
28. Christ and Hollywood.
29. Divine Intervention.
30. The Rich Young Ruler.
31. Creation v Evolution.
32. A Balanced Standard.
33. Liberal v Conservative.
34. Luke 21: The End Game.
35. Facing Reality.
36. Devotional Scholarship .
37. Abortion.
38. When You Feel Like ______.
39. Red Letter Lectionary.
40. Church and State.
41. Sermon On the Mount Preview.
42. The Sabbath.
43. Advent.
44. Teachings of Christ Mass.
45. Musing About Music.
46. God, the Universe, and Everything.
47. A Simple Question.
48. The Nicene Creed.
49. The Common Denominator.
50. Decentralism and Jesus.
51. Low Key Politics and Religion.
52. Christmas and the Environment.
53. Would Jesus Drive a Ferrari and Wear a Rolex?
54. Despair and Hope.
55. The Complete Gospels.
56. Tell ‘Em About Jesus!
57. A True Christmas Story.
58. The Trinity.
59. Words of Christ Mass.
60. Secret Societies.
61. The Constitution and the Gospels.
62. Behavior and Being Right With God.
63. Presidential Politics and the Gospel.
64. New Years Resolution.
65. Everything v Everything.
66. Sexuality!
67. Democracy and Freedom.
68. The Eyes Have Had It!
69. Minimalist Church and State.
70. Jesus: Truly Jewish and Truly Christian.
71. TWO: The True World Order.
72. Try This!
73. Commentary or Canon?
74. Sermon Material.
75. Think From the Other Person’s Perspective.
76. Jesus Christ: Super Star ET?

1. Welcome to the Red Letter Church!

Hello! My name is Deep Thought.

Welcome to the Red Letter Church! Actually, welcome to RedLetterChruch.net. This website consists of 76 posts in the Spirit of ‘76, and in the Spirit of Jesus Christ. The truth will set you free! It's primarily about the Teachings of Jesus Christ. It’s secondarily about the Constitution of the United States.

The goal is Responsible Freedom attained through a Minimalist Church and State! The historical foundation is the Red Letter Teachings of Jesus, dating back 2,000 years, and the Constitution of the United States, dating back over 200 years. In principle and concept, they are two sides of the same free coin. This is sound-money, if you will! Constitutional Responsible Freedom is the coin of the realm!

OK, I admit it, I’m a Red Letter Christian. Campolo made me do it! Just kidding! But Tony used the term Red Letter Christian before I did! A Red Letter Christian is a follower of Jesus, who strives to believe and do what Jesus told us to believe and do. We believe that in a red letter edition of the Holy Bible, that the words which are printed in red, are the first and last word in any Bible study. They are supremely important!

I have resisted the temptation to over-edit the words which I typed onto my website…day after day…for nearly three months. I wanted this manuscript to read like a disjointed brainstorm…because that’s what it really is! Actually…I’m just lazy! You will quickly notice that I place exclamation marks at the end of many sentences! I have tried to make each sentence worthy of the Exclamation Mark Award (EMA)! I have been criticized for writing this way! I have been told to use periods! I have been told that I cannot be taken seriously because of this style of writing! Well guess what? That’s the period…I mean…the point! I don’t want to be taken seriously!

It’s sort of like David Letterman wearing white socks with not quite long enough pants every night on national television! There is way too much seriousness in life in general, and Churchianity in particular! This manner of writing is designed to shower readers with mental ice-water! It’s supposed to wake them up! Let my sub-prime style of writing, incorporating excessive exhibitions of exclamation marks be my trademark! Forget the Mark of the Beast…it’s the Mark of the Exclamation that you’d better fear! (!!!) Is worse than (666)! Exclamation Critics beware! You are marked!

Unfortunately…some people can’t see the truth for the exclamation marks!!! Therefore, with great sadness and deep regret, I have been forced to removed some of the exclamation marks. The Devil made me do it! I have been told that this style makes it appear that I’m ranting and raving! Well I am! I’ve read books by John Shelby Spong, and as a result, I suffer from Spong-in-rare-form Encephalopathy, or for those of you from Rio Linda…Mad Christian Disease! I’m mad at Hell! I’ve had enough! And I’m not going to take this any more! And neither should you! PERIOD.

All-righty then…where was I? I guess I’m trying to imitate Martin Luther’s posting of his 95 Theses on the door of the castle church of Wittenburg, protesting the sale of indulgences (Salvation4Sale) and other evidences of corruption (Righteousness by Ritural)! But did Martin Luther use the Teachings of Jesus to make his case? Did he promote Everything4Nothing? Check it out. I am posting my 76 Theses in the Spirit of ‘76, on the internet, protesting the rejection of the Teachings of Christ by the church of Christ for 2,000 years. It is my Declaration of Independence from Churchianity!

You can have truth or rest…but not both! I promote Salvation by Responsibility, Righteousness by Righteousness, and Something4Something! Do I think that I’ve found the ultimate truth? Well…um...I…OK! I admit it! I don't have everything all figured out! Don't look at me! I didn't set this thing up! I don't have the answer! I'm not even sure what the question is! Could someone please repeat the question? Don't trust in what I write! I don't even trust myself! Think for yourself! Do your own research! And don't forget to pray! "Now we see but a poor reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known."--1 Corinthians 13:12 New International Version (NIV).

I think that I’ve located a neglected directional sign…not a destination resort of the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. So help me, God, to find the truth! If you think you “have” the truth…you probably don’t! It’s only by relentlessly pursuing the truth that you get a glimpse of it now and then! And you have to make sure that it is not a chimera or a mirage! I must confess that I think I’m probably deluded! Come to think of it…I think we’re all deluded! We just have conflicting delusions!

Allow me to apologize in advance for offending or hurting anyone. I mean no harm. Really! I am using a unique, almost irreverent approach, which may come as a shock at times! Religion can be a source of unbelievable conflict! I am basically brainstorming…and pretending, at least, that I have a completely supportive and understanding audience! I really, really like my fantasy-land! They say that to undo, you have to over-do! I do believe I overdid it this time! I’m ready to fire myself! Actually, I’m really a smart asterisk!

We don't have church buildings and we don't ask for money. Jesus didn't either! Contribute to your favorite charitable organizations, including your local church. Follow the money!

But first, get plenty of exercise in nature, plenty of rest, and plenty of prayer! Without doing these things, everything else is mostly a waste of time and energy! If you never go outside and smell the roses, never go running, walking or hiking, don’t get enough sleep, and think that you don’t need to pray…well think again! This is not optional! It is essential! Please do not skip over this paragraph!

Meet me here tomorrow! Same Time. Same Cyber-Space. The truth is in here! Follow the truth! And make sure that you are not being followed…especially by Silas!

2. Red Letter Sermons.

The church's one foundation 'tis Jesus Christ her Lord! Are the Teachings of Jesus first and foremost in your church? If not, why not? Who's church is it, anyway? Are most, if not all, sermons preached from the words of Christ? If not, why not? Ask the hard questions. Get to the bottom of this thing! The answer seems to be blowing in the wind…judging from all of the hot air you are likely to encounter…

It’s sort of like inviting a living President of the United States to a meeting of “supporters” and then seating him at the rear of the auditorium, and having other people give their speeches praising the name of the President, but without asking the President to be the keynote speaker! The name of Jesus gets praised to highest heaven, but the words of Jesus are often figuratively seated at the back of the church! How rude! Was it something He said?

Is Christianity the Teachings of Jesus believed and lived…or is it a ritualized religion about Jesus…paying little attention to what the Second Person of the Trinity actually said?! I have sometimes gotten the impression that Christians feel that Jesus’ place is on the cross on the wall of the church. But that the important business of doctrine is best left to Moses, Paul and the theologians! Jesus is expected to be seen, but not heard, and certainly not obeyed! In fact, Jesus is supposed to obey US when we pray for something!

Every sermon should be preached from the Teachings of Jesus! But context is important! The Old Testament is contextual, but not normative. Acts to Revelation is likewise contextual, but does not have veto power over the words of Jesus Christ! The Apostle Paul is not the Fourth Person of the Godhead! Sorry Paul!

The following is an exchange between me and a New Testament theologian:

Me: There is a problem here! The Red-Letter Teachings of Jesus Christ take a back seat to Paul! Christianity needs to repent, and resurrect the words of Christ, and make them first and foremost! I have decided to follow Jesus!

Response: Christ should always be given precedence over Paul. However, until Pentecost the full meaning of Christ's sayings could not be perceived. The Holy Spirit confronted Paul and led him into a unique ministry of interpretation and explanation. Because of his training it was given to Paul to explain what the atonement meant. This could not be done until after the atonement was made, i.e., until after Christ died. The primary enquiry of all intelligent souls is, 'How can I be right with my Creator?' It is only Paul who fully spells out the way with its root and its fruit. The great tragedy of even modern evangelicals is that salvation in its historical and objective senses is too often obscured. A closer attention to the writings of Paul could prevent this tragic loss.

Me: Thank-you for your thoughtful answer. But it is a classic example of "the Teachings of Jesus are lacking." I get the picture of someone who is befuddled (Jesus), and needs help with this and that from their attendant (Paul). Did the 2nd person of the Trinity not say everything of importance that needed to be said? Did He need someone to clean up after Him, and set the record straight?

Response: It is the Holy Spirit who decided that the teachings of Christ needed to be supplemented and therefore our NT does not stop at John 21. It doesn't detract from what Jesus said at all. May I recommend you compare what you can find about the meaning of the Cross from the Gospels with what you can find in the later books inspired by the Spirit of Christ.

The following is a different response by another theologian to essentially the same comment:

Thank-you for your observations. You could have added that in the creeds of the Church, starting with the Apostle’s Creed, the only mention of the historical Jesus is that he died. Zero reference to anything he taught. We need the teaching of the man and not all this rubbish taught about the man. Your suggestion is so simple, so powerful. Do it!

And as they say…“the rest is history!” So…ladies and gentlemen…prepare yourselves to hear…the rest of His-story!

3. The Teachings of Jesus are Fundamental.

This website is the result of my conviction that the words which are printed in red letters in a red letter edition of the Bible are fundamental. This, I suppose, is a more refined fundamentalism of sorts, but without all the negative baggage! When the word “fundamentalism” is used, many people think of militants marching in the streets shouting slogans, waving flags, and brandishing grenade launchers! One gets the picture that a fundamentalist is interested only in teaching and enforcing…not reasoning and learning!

On the other hand, isn’t it important to have a basic formulation of truth, including psychology, ethics, and spirituality? It is impossible to properly play a baseball game without rules and referees. It is also impossible to properly live life without a basic system of psychology, ethics, and spirituality. Ideally, the standard should be historical, include the essentials, and exclude the non-essentials!

The Constitution of the United States is a very simple and concise document! In fact, it is mostly structural and procedural in nature. On the other hand, the Christian Constitution, if you will, has historically consisted of all 66 canonical books of the Bible, with all words carrying equal weight and importance. This has created legion numbers of theologies and churches! It has been a Weapon of Mass Confusion! A real Loose Canon! Ex Cathedra proclamations have been necessary to maintain ecclesiastical law and order! Atrocities have even been perpetrated against those with differing convictions! Evangelism has been conducted with the torch and the sword, in God‘s name! If you can’t convince them…torture and kill them!

Liberalism has sought to abort these exegetical monstrosities and diabolical administrative practices, but all too often destroys the mother instead! The whole Bible is often mockingly rejected privately, while being publicly damned with faint praise! It is reminiscent of drilling a hole in your own lifeboat!

Fundamentalist Christians and Evangelicals have labored valiantly to maintain the doctrinal integrity of all 66 books in a harmonious unity! This only works if there are strong, charismatic leaders who accentuate the positive, eliminate the negative, get rid of Mr. In Between, and all those who dare question the authority of the church hierarchy and it‘s interpretations and applications of scripture!

Put bluntly, I believe that the Red Letter Teachings of Jesus Christ are fundamental, and that the rest of scripture is important, but NOT fundamental! It is contextual and illuminating, but not authoritative! Is that heresy? To Churchianity…yes! To Jesus Christ…no! Who’s side are you on? Choose you this day who you will serve!


4. What Did Jesus Say?

The question, "what would Jesus do?" or WWJD, is a popular one. It is a helpful ethical guide under the guidance of the Holy Spirit. However, there is an even more important question, I believe, "what did Jesus say?" When we find out, then it is up to us to do what Jesus said. It's almost too simple! Obviously real-life challenges are not so simple, but the words of Jesus, illuminated by careful-prayerful study and the Holy Spirit, provide an ethical-spiritual home base where we can formulate our positive responses to the challenges and perplexities of modern life!

The Teachings of Jesus have something for everyone! Most of the words of Jesus can be easily understood by a child, yet some of the words of Jesus continue to challenge the world’s sharpest minds! When reading the sayings of Christ…if the saying fits…apply it! If not…move on, and consider that particular saying later. In other words, do not destroy yourself or others with something you don’t understand, or which does not apply to the given situation!

We are not to imitate Jesus. This would be similar to imitating a President of the United States. If you are not the President, then imitating the President leads to inappropriate behavior! We all know people who act like God, don’t we? Jesus was on a very special mission! I believe that this mission was to establish His teachings as the modus operandi for the Human Race! The Teachings of Jesus are an arrow (and an exclamation mark!)…but not a period. They are a beginning and a vehicle…but not a destination. They are to facilitate a proper and orderly search for truth and a better life. This is ongoing. It is never ending. It requires a lot of hard work! You can’t simply let go and let God!

Jesus was the Savior of the World, and the Benchmark of Humanity. This is something that you and I have not been called to do! Hence, WWJD in our particular situation is like comparing apples and oranges, or divinity and humanity! When we are trying to decide what to do, the question is WDJS, or What Did Jesus Say? And don’t forget to pray!

5. Red Letter Phobia.

The term "Red Letter Christian" seems to cause many Christians to bristle! Why is this? Is it the manner of presentation by Red Letter Christians, such as myself? Perhaps. But I think the Teachings of Jesus make us very uncomfortable when we are doing something wrong, or are corrupt! Sometimes things have to seemingly get worse in order to get better. When one kneels at the feet of Jesus and looks into His face of love, one knows that they can do better (no matter how good or bad they are). The experience may make us squirm, but ultimately it makes us better people, and the world a better place!

The true purpose of non-corrupt religion is not to make us happy! At least not initially. It is to do the right thing! This may, at times, make us very unhappy! It can be difficult to deny self, figuratively take up your cross, and follow Jesus. Wrestling with reality is part of the deal. True religion is not the opiate of the people! It is often just the opposite! If it sounds and feels good…don’t believe it! You are probably in the wrong church!

I once had a philosophy teacher who warned us that his class was not designed to make us happy! It was to teach us something. He further said that if we wanted to be happy…we should drop-out, move to Oregon…and smoke pot! This teacher was later arrested for having intimate relations with a minor! He had a minor legal problem, to say the least! And after he got out of jail, he undoubtedly got to travel and meet new people! Maybe he moved to Oregon and smoked pot! Might as well…the rest of his life had gone to pot! I hope the teacher learned his lesson!

6. All Scripture is Centered in the Teachings of Jesus.

The words of Jesus are not isolated from the rest of scripture, but they are central to scripture. Each and every Bible study and sermon should be centered in the words of Jesus! It's not about excluding the rest of the Bible, but rather about understanding the whole Bible by placing the Teachings of Jesus front and center, where they belong!

I must confess that the God of the Old Testament and the book of Revelation, is often not the God that I believe in and love. I prefer the God revealed by Jesus. And doesn’t this representation imply a limited God? This gets God off the hook (if God needs to be gotten off the hook) on the suffering question, and also regarding a delayed (by our reckoning) second coming. Why does God have to be all-mighty? Isn’t most-mighty good enough? Aren’t we sometimes a bit demanding and unrealistic in our God-expectations? Isn’t this a major reason for agnosticism and atheism?

An ideal method of study is to take your favorite red letter, cross referenced version of the Bible, and read the red lettered portions, in context, and read all cross referenced texts in their contexts. The Teachings of Jesus are to the rest of the Bible what the Constitution of the United States is to the Federalist Papers. The first is normative standard, and the second is context and clarification. Don’t make things more complex than they need to be! Let the Bible be its own interpreter, with the Holy Spirit as your guide.

Try reading the four Gospels straight through two or three times. Then read just the red letter portions straight through two or three times. Then search out all of the cross referenced texts throughout the Bible, and highlight them. Then read all of these highlighted texts straight through, from Genesis to Revelation. Do this two or three times. At some point in this process, the Holy Spirit will come streaming through the windows of your soul, and you will see the light! You may very well see it a lot more clearly than I do! I’m just a goofy clown, waving a sign, and trying to point others in the right direction! I’m also a bit of a hypocrite! I haven’t arrived, and don’t expect to anytime soon!

It makes me tired just typing these marching orders! I must confess, I think I have the overall idea right, but I find it difficult to be a Bible scholar. It takes both perspiration and inspiration! To become disillusioned with the old way of relating to the Bible, and then to get inspired with the new way can give one a spiritual whiplash! Fasten your seatbelts and put your headrest up!

Lastly, integrate all of the above into everything! This isn't easy, and it's not for wimps! The texts are ancient and we live in a modern world which is becoming more complex, perplexing and dangerous by the millisecond! But if the principles and concepts of the Teachings of Jesus are not integrated into our modern world, we face negative consequences of truly biblical proportions...

7. The Great Commission: The Great Omission!

Today I wish to focus on the 'Great Commission' in Matthew 28:19-20: "Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all things whatever I have commanded you; and behold, I am with you always, even to the end of the age."

What did Jesus tell His followers to teach all nations? "To observe all things whatever I have commanded you." Any questions? What part of this command don’t we understand? Was Jesus just making a suggestion that His followers could carry out only if it wasn’t too much trouble? Perhaps this world has been evangelized with Churchianity rather than Christianity! Perhaps the Anti-Christ has been, and is, Churchianity! Can many, if not most, of the wars and atrocities of the past 2,000 years be the result of ignoring the clear Teachings of Jesus? The implications are absolutely staggering! This is one place where I would really prefer to be wrong! History is in many ways, such a dark and horrible thing! And to think that the last 2,000 years could have been altogether different causes me to feel faint and sick! It’s like someone trying to warn a train about a washed-out bridge…being totally ignored…and then watching helplessly as hundreds of people plunge to their deaths…

Was Jesus a Red Letter Christian? Indeed! He was the first! He was, and is, the CEO! Have His 'followers' followed His clear instructions? In most cases no! Why is this? Does this constitute insubordination? There may be some surprises in the hereafter. More importantly, what are we going to do to correct this failure to carry out a direct order by our Commanding Officer?

8. What is the Gospel?

What is the Gospel? Is it the Good News? Are the Teachings of Jesus Good News, Good Advice, or both? Are the Teachings of Jesus the Gospel? Do we need to read Paul to find out what the Gospel is? Does the Great Commission refer to the Teachings of Jesus…the writings of Paul…the whole Bible…or all of the above?

The Good Advice in the Teachings of Jesus is the Good News! Churchianity is condemned and Christianity is established by Christ! No more religious hoops to jump through! Just be just! That is both Good Advice and Good News!

Many Christians have been pressured into saying, “I know that I am saved!” But if you know that you are saved, why struggle to do the right thing, and fight the evil thing?! This may not be popular, but I believe that every day we are fighting for our physical and spiritual lives!

It should be obvious by now, that I believe the Teachings of Jesus to be self-sufficient and self-evident, and that they are the message to be spread throughout the world as a precursor to eschatological occurrences! When the teachings and character of Jesus are internalized in a critical mass of Christians, a tipping point will be reached, and the battle between good and evil will intensify! All Hell may break loose before we experience Heaven on Earth! The agony and the ecstasy! The first must precede the second!

9. The Teachings of Jesus in Society.

It's tempting to turn a focus on the Teachings of Jesus into a harangue! To lash out! To use a phrase of Christ's as a club to hit people over the head with, to promote our pet political or religious cause! But I feel that it's important to study all of Christ's words in an attitude of reverence and awe, and to come up to a higher level of spirituality, and then implement the underlying principles and concepts throughout society in an evolutionary, rather than in a revolutionary way. This is the mustard seed conspiracy! It consists of the seeds of greatness!

Christians should integrate rather than segregate! Christians should not be stand-offish! Christians should be “in the world, but not of the world.” The Teachings of Jesus should be communicated with kindness and sound-bites rather than with cold and arrogant sermonizing. Profound principles, concepts, and facts obtained in secular society should be integrated with the words of Jesus to give them an even more profound impact! The atheist scientists and philosophers don’t know what they are missing! They may have the facts, but they need the Spirit too!

Jesus was accused of being "a glutton and a wine drinker, a friend of publicans and sinners!" I don’t think they were accusing Him of being a grape-juice drinker! He didn't spend all day in the synagogue! I find it helpful to contemplate Christ in a variety of settings. Theology should not be imprisoned within a church or university, but needs to be reflected upon and implemented in even the most unlikely environments. These diverse environments may include the boardroom, the racetrack, the laboratory, Washington D.C. and Las Vegas (where one might be a friend of Republicans and Sinners)!

10. Apostolic Succession and the Holy Grail.

Much has been made of Apostolic Succession in Christian history! That Christ declared to Peter that He would build His church on him. That Peter was the first Pope, and that each of his successors have been the supreme representatives of Christ on earth, indeed, Vicars of Christ!

A rival view, popularized recently by Dan Brown in his book and the subsequent motion picture, The Da Vinci Code, suggests that Jesus had children, and that His offspring are the true representatives of Christ on earth...

Allow me to suggest another possibility! That the individuals and organizations throughout Christian history who have placed the Teachings of Jesus first and foremost, both in word and deed, have been the true representatives of Christ on earth! Not by declaration or birthright, but by the content of their characters! This last option could overlap the first two. But in the final analysis, by their fruits you shall know them. Were, and are, they Christ-like? Did Christ will that His church be built upon His teachings? I think so!

Remember in the movie, The Da Vinci Code, as Sophie, Langdon, Silas, Remy, and Teabing are leaving the hangar in the limo at the airport in England, after hiding from the English police, Teabing winks and comments, “people rarely notice things right in front of their eyes!”

I am going to make the bold assertion that the Holy Grail, that people have been seeking for centuries, has been hidden in plain sight for 2,000 years! The Teachings of Jesus are the Holy Grail! What is more holy and sacred, that Jesus Christ has left the world, than His Teachings?! His Blood Red Letter Teachings! The Holy Grail or Sang-real, meaning Royal Blood, is more than any possible blood-line of Christ! I believe that it is primarily the words of Christ, which reveal the character of Christ, or the essence of Christ! The words are neither masculine or feminine! They are neither Pagan or Pauline! They are Divine! The bloodline question is of “relative” importance! Any purported relative or representative of Christ does not have veto-power over the words of Christ! No one has veto-power over the words of Christ! No one except the Jesus Seminar, that is!

On the other hand, does the term “Royal Blood” imply that Christ was of royal Egyptian lineage? When Joseph and Mary fled with Jesus to Egypt, did they stay with family? The wise-men from the east worshiped him as royalty! Was Jesus a Pharaoh? Is this where a modern quest for the historical Jesus might lead? Were the wise-men wise to who Jesus really was…or am I just a wise-guy? The Scribes, Pharisees, and Sadducees thought Jesus was a wise-guy! And they were right! They just didn’t know how wise He really was!

I am going to keep attempting to get you to study for yourself, rather than tell you what to think! I don’t really know what I think most of the time, so who am I to tell you? I truly believe that at least 38.7 percent of what I have typed on this site is pure unmitigated poppycock! Just don’t ask me to itemize the 38.7 percent! If you figure it out…tell me and we’ll both know! It’ll be our little secret…OK? I tend to be rather suspicious, especially of myself. So, use this site to start your thinking process…not to end it! This subject is too important, and you are too mature (hopefully) for spoon feeding! But it can be frustrating and exhausting! And please…don't forget to pray!

11. Church Buildings.

Jesus taught mostly in nature. The most inspirational environment is nature! I believe that the Holy Spirit can best get through to us when we contemplate eternal things in nature. The best place to have church is not in church! The best church is no church! And didn’t Jesus tell us, in essence, not to go to church, in Matthew 6:5,6? He told us to pray privately, didn’t He?

Having said that, I am torn! I love architecturally and acoustically inspiring churches! Especially while experiencing sacred music in these vast spaces! Singing the great hymns of the church with congregation, choir, organ and orchestra…as the sunlight streams through the stained glass windows is truly a mountain top experience! I believe that artistic expression and creativity are hugely important parts of life and Christianity! They lift us up!

However, I am often troubled by the price and the pride! Is Jesus impressed? I sometimes imagine the stained glass Jesus with tears streaming down His face because of being ignored, despised and rejected by His professed followers! Would those in Darfur be impressed? Should we build more orphanages than churches? I once stood at the altar of a magnificent Gothic cathedral, reading the story of the rich young ruler from a large leather-bound Bible on a golden pedestal. For a moment, I thought the Word of God clashed with the House of God! Are churches sometimes places where there is a form of godliness without the power? Where people stand, sit, bend, nod, and are politely kind to God? Also, the message and music are often determined by those with the dough…not by those in the know!

Obviously, when it's cold, dark and rainy, it's nearly impossible to have a religious service outside! I guess we need church buildings, but we don't need jeweled, gold plated shrines, bedeviled with hideous gargoyles! We need the grand and glorious, but with sound and simple construction, so as not to become slaves to buildings and bills. Think minimalist cathedral! Was that an oxymoron? Perhaps…but sometimes I'm an oxymoron! And don't forget the soup kitchen! And please…pretty please…don’t forget to pray!

Also, church is not for everyone! The church is not the very gate of Heaven! The Christian Church is not Salvation4Sale! At least it shouldn't be! Church may, or may not, be necessary for balanced psychology, ethics and spirituality. Sometimes church can even make things worse! On the other hand, those who have left the church have often jumped out of the frying pan and into the fire…and had their fingers burnt right up to their arm pits!

Finally, remember what Jesus said to the disciples when they were admiring a church building...

12. Salvation and Righteousness.

What must we do to be saved?

"But when I, the Messiah, shall come in my glory, and all the angels with me, then I shall sit upon my throne of glory. And all the nations shall be gathered before me. And I will separate the people as a shepherd separates sheep from the goats, and place the sheep at my right hand, and the goats at my left.

"Then I, the King, shall say to those at my right, 'Come, blessed of my Father, into the Kingdom prepared for you from the founding of the world. For I was hungry and you fed me; I was thirsty and you gave me water; I was a stranger and you invited me into your homes; naked and you clothed me; sick and in prison, and you visited me'

"Then these righteous ones will reply, 'Sir, when did we ever see you hungry and feed you? Or thirsty and give you anything to drink? Or a stranger, and help you? Or naked, and clothe you? When did we ever see you sick or in prison, and visit you?' And I, the King, will tell them, 'When you did it to these my brothers you were doing it to me!'

"Then I will turn to those on my left and say, 'Away with you, you cursed ones, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his demons. For I was hungry and you wouldn't feed me; thirsty, and you wouldn't give me anything to drink; a stranger, and you refused me hospitality; naked, and you wouldn't clothe me; sick, and in prison, and you didn't visit me.'

"Then they will reply, 'Lord, when did we ever see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and not help you?' And I will answer, 'When you refused to help the least of these my brothers, you were refusing help to me.' And they shall go away into eternal punishment; but the righteous into everlasting life." Matthew 25:31-46 Living Bible.

Did Jesus forget about the substitutionary atonement? What about John 3:16? Clue: read John 3:1-21, not just verse 16! The method of salvation presented by Paul is quite different than the method presented by Jesus! Why is this? Who do you believe? On Christ the solid rock I stand! All other ground is sinking sand…

Perhaps the above is part of the reason why many Christians accept Jesus as savior, but reject Him as Lord!

13. Money and the 50-50 Rule.

The following is a concept derived from the principles and concepts contained in the Teachings of Jesus, but not stated directly. It is simply something I have found to be helpful regarding the ethical pursuit and use of money.

I call it the 50-50 rule, derived from 'love your neighbor as yourself' and 'do unto others as you would have others do unto you.' Basically, one makes as much money as possible in the most ethical way possible, and then sets aside 50 percent of the gain for taxes and charity. Then, with the remaining 50 percent, they live a comfortable, though not ostentatious life style, and use a significant portion of this 50 percent to make even more money! Then, this additional profit again becomes subject to the same rule. Finally, when one dies, the estate is divided, with 50 percent going to taxes and charity, and 50 percent to relatives, etc.

We should avoid rich versus poor class-warfare, jealousy and hatred, or feelings of superiority! We all have a part to play in this vast mosaic of life. The poor should not neglect to learn how the rich make money, and the rich should not neglect the poor…regardless of the reasons for their poverty!

It's my way of saying that one can have their cake and eat it too! Perhaps it is a rationalization…but I don't think so! I believe that God is reasonable, and that sincere attempts to do the right thing are received with joy in Heaven!

14. Jesus and Nicodemus.

Now there was a man of the Pharisees named Nicodemus, a member of the Jewish ruling council. He came to Jesus at night and said, “Rabbi, we know you are a teacher who has come from God. For no one could perform the miraculous signs you are doing if God were not with him.” In reply Jesus declared, “I tell you the truth, no one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again.”

“How can a man be born when he is old?” Nicodemus asked. “Surely he cannot enter a second time into his mother’s womb to be born!” Jesus answered, “I tell you the truth, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless he is born of water and the Spirit. Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit gives birth to spirit. You should not be surprised at my saying, ‘You must be born again.’ The wind blows wherever it pleases. You hear its sound, but you cannot tell where it comes from or where it is going. So it is with everyone born of the Spirit.”

“How can this be?” Nicodemus asked. “You are Israel’s teacher,” said Jesus, “and do you not understand these things? I tell you the truth, we speak of what we know, and we testify to what we have seen, but still you people do not accept our testimony. I have spoken to you of earthly things and you do not believe; how then will you believe if I speak of heavenly things? No one has ever gone into heaven except the one who came from heaven--the Son of Man. Just as Moses lifted up the snake in the desert, so the Son of Man must be lifted up, that everyone who believes in him may have eternal life.

“For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son. This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but men loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil. Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that his deeds will be exposed. But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what he has done has been done through God.” John 3:1-21 NIV

15. Positive Thinking and Self Esteem.

What about positive thinking and self esteem? Are they in harmony with the Teachings of Jesus? Are they a new religion which is out of harmony with the Teachings of Jesus? What is the underlying principle in the Teachings of Jesus? Is it positive thinking and self esteem, or something else?

Without going into a proof text rant, I must say that I find positive thinking much more biblical than self esteem! Faith is closely related to positive thinking, and is well thought of in scripture in general, and the Teachings of Jesus in particular! On the other hand, self esteem is closely related to pride, and is decidedly not well thought of in scripture in general, and the Teachings of Jesus in particular! The subject of self esteem is a real “mine” field! An extreme rendition of the joining of positive thinking and self esteem is “I Am God!” which is not something that the Bible encourages its readers to go around proclaiming! And by the way…Shirley…with all due respect…I don’t think you’re God!

The problem is self delusion and self centeredness! Not facing reality is a form of lying…to yourself! Self exaltation is self centered! Self degradation is also self centered! The religion contained in the Teachings of Jesus is a religion of responsibility! To be responsible is to face reality, and see it clearly, and then formulate a responsible course of action, and then to implement this plan. It is duty centered. The focus is external…not internal! When someone lives responsibly, the byproduct is appropriate positive AND negative thinking (which includes both faith and doubt), and an appropriate self image! They are the fruit, not the root!

In other words, positive delusion is not the solution to negative delusion…and self exaltation is not the solution to self degradation! Responsibility trumps both positive thinking and self esteem! The religion of positive thinking and self esteem is not the religion of the Teachings of Jesus! The religion of responsibility is the religion of the Teachings of Jesus!

Please don't misunderstand my seemingly harsh stance on positive thinking and self esteem! A negative thinking and self degrading Churchianity opened the door wide open to these teachings! They have come as a breath of fresh air to millions of people around the world! But some have found Peale appalling and Paul appealing! Positive thinking linked with self-esteem is corrective, but should not be considered to be normative! A religion of responsibility, as found in the Teachings of Jesus is, in my view, the normative standard!

16. The Eternal Word.

I have so much to say, but I would like to know that someone is listening out there in cyberspace. Please take a moment to send me a message, and to set me straight, if necessary! Also, study the Teachings of Jesus, in the context of all of scripture, for yourself! I'm just another website writer. I am transitory, but I have a feeling that the Teachings of Jesus will be around for a long, long time! And that they will be just as true and relevant hundreds of years from now as they are today! This provides a very necessary continuity and stability to our spiritual quest!

Throughout the centuries there have been countless religious wars, both physical and spiritual in nature! But if you look closely in the Old Testament, after studying the Teachings of Jesus, you can see the message of Jesus extending back to Genesis! This is the Word of God! You can also see the “God of this world,” or Satan, at work as well! Sometimes people get God all mixed up with Satan, especially in the Old Testament! By their fruits you shall know them. This applies even to God! Similarly, the message of Jesus can be seen in the New Testament, extending to Revelation and beyond! Jesus is the gold standard, in character, history and scripture!

Also, simply communing with God in nature, exercising, and getting a good nights sleep, is probably 90% of the spiritual battle! Sometimes theological discussions, even about the Teachings of Jesus, can give one a headache! People will always see things differently and often passionately so! And doesn't that make life interesting?!

17. The Church's One Foundation.

Sing this great hymn of the church a capella! Then, find a recording of Upon This Rock by John Ness Beck! Try to find one with brass, percussion, organ, and choir! It rocks!

The Church's one foundation is Jesus Christ her Lord;
she is his new creation by water and the word:
from heaven he came and sought her to be his holy bride;
with his own blood he bought her, and for her life he died.

Elect from every nation, yet one o'er all the earth,
her charter of salvation, one Lord, one faith, one birth;
one holy Name she blesses, partakes one holy food,
and to one hope she presses, with every grace endued.

Though with a scornful wonder men see her sore oppressed,
by schisms rent asunder, by heresies distressed;
yet saints their watch are keeping, their cry goes up, "How long?"
and soon the night of weeping shall be the morn of song.

Mid toil and tribulation, and tumult of her war
she waits the consummation of peace for evermore;
till with the vision glorious her longing eyes are blessed,
and the great Church victorious shall be the Church at rest.

Yet she on earth hath union with God, the Three in One,
and mystic sweet communion with those whose rest is won.
O happy ones and holy! Lord, give us grace that we
like them, the meek and lowly, on high may dwell with thee!

Words: Samuel John Stone (1839-1900)
Music: Aurelia, Samuel Sebastian Wesley (1810-1876)

18. The Teachings of Jesus and the Newspaper.

Which is more important...reading the Bible or reading the newspaper? Being that this is a religiously oriented site, one might think that this is a rhetorical question. Actually, I'm going to say that they are equally important! Is that heresy? I don't think so!

The historical truth of the Bible, centered in the Teachings of Jesus, but without a convincing contemporary application to the events and issues in the newspaper, is like a Maginot Line against the Evil Empire! The Devil laughs and goes around the side of the church! Sometimes he even attends church! What better place to stir up trouble? How do I know? I’ve seen his tracks…

If the character of Christ is ever reproduced in the characters of those who are in positions of power and prominence, this world will turn upside down! Wrongs will be righted, and things which are already right will remain right. Not that religious jargon will be commonplace on Wall Street and Main Street, but that genuine goodness will be the norm. I don't think we're even close to that now! Are we?

I'm a naive dreamer! What about you? Maybe this is exactly what this world needs. Go naive dreamers!

19. Jesus Christ and Albert Schweitzer.

The Quest of the Historical Jesus by Dr. Albert Schweitzer, written a century ago, is not exactly a devotional book! It is a hard reading review of several major critical studies of Jesus, and mostly negative. But in the last chapter there are some positive gems which emerge from the darkness. The devotional aspects of the study of Jesus should not be neglected. But the scholarly and critical studies should not be neglected either! This is an often painful process, but it makes us strong. And don't forget to pray!

"But the truth is, it is not Jesus as historically known, but Jesus as spiritually arisen within men, who is significant for our time and can help it. Not the historical Jesus, but the spirit which goes forth from Him and in the spirits of men strives for new influence and rule, is that which overcomes the world." --The Quest of the Historical Jesus, pg. 401

"Jesus as a concrete historical personality remains a stranger to our time, but His spirit, which lies hidden in His words, is known in simplicity, and its influence is direct. Every saying contains in its own way the whole Jesus. The very strangeness and unconditionedness in which He stands before us makes it easier for individuals to find their own personal standpoint in regard to Him."-- pg. 401

"But in reality that which is eternal in the words of Jesus is due to the very fact that they are based on an eschatological world-view, and contain the expression of a mind for which the contemporary world with its historical and social circumstances no longer had any existence. They are appropriate, therefore, to any world, for in every world they raise the man who dares to meet their challenge, and does not turn and twist them into meaninglessness, above his world and his time, making him inwardly free, so that he is fitted to be, in his own world and in his own time, a simple channel of the power of Jesus."-- pg. 402

"He comes to us as One unknown, without a name, as of old, by the lake-side, He came to those men who knew Him not. He speaks to us the same word: 'Follow thou me!' and sets us to the tasks which He has to fulfill for our time. He commands. And to those who obey Him, whether they be wise or simple, He will reveal Himself in the toils, the conflicts, the sufferings which they shall pass through in His fellowship, and, as an ineffable mystery, they shall learn in their own experience Who He is."-- pg. 403

20. The Church of Jesus Christ and the Roman Catholic Church.

Must a Red Letter Christian be anti-Catholic? Absolutely Not! A follower of the Teachings of Jesus must be anti-corruption! Reading through the words of Jesus reveals that He was anti-arrogance, anti-hypocrisy, anti-violence, and that He insisted that the rich and powerful should help the poor and weak.

I believe that constructive competition improves everyone! Destructive competition destroys everyone! One function of Protestantism is to engage in constructive competition with the Roman Catholic Church. This keeps everyone alert and on their toes! Protestants help the Roman Catholic Church to be a better church! Roman Catholics help Protestants to be better Christians. It's a system of checks and balances…sort of like the Democrats and Republicans in the United States. We need each other! Absolute power corrupts absolutely! Any organization which grows too large and powerful quickly becomes riddled with corruption. Any organization…

I'm a fan of the Anglican / Catholic liturgy! I like the structure, dignity, and history! However, I would like to see a lectionary which features the Teachings of Jesus more prominently, and with Old Testament, Psalms, and New Testament readings directly related to the Gospel, which should always be from the Teachings of Jesus. The Teachings of Jesus must be featured front and center! Every homily or sermon should be from the Teachings of Jesus Christ, year-round…even at Christmas and Easter!

Then, the teachings of Jesus need to be lived every day. Every day should be a Sabbath day! Every day should be a holy day! Not just one day a week (Saturday or Sunday). No particular day should esteemed above another!

The elaborate churches should be enjoyed! They are already built, and the artistic expression is truly breath-taking! However, new construction should probably be more in line with the humble simplicity of Christ! There has to be a balance point somewhere…I’m just not sure where…

21. Jesus, Perfection, and Salvation.

A debate that has raged for centuries is between those who say Jesus was just like us, and those who say He had an advantage over us. Both views state that Jesus perfectly obeyed the law of God from birth to death, and thus secured our salvation, by doing that which we could not do, and that by believing in Christ and His sacrifice, we are accepted by God as though we had not sinned, and saved for all eternity.

If Jesus was just like us, some believe that the substitutionary atonement is just the beginning, and that we can overcome sin just as Christ overcame sin…and indeed we must do this at the end of time, just before the return of Christ, in order to be saved. That we must stand before God without a mediator! They believe that if Jesus had an advantage over us, that the substitutionary atonement would not be valid. That it would be a hollow victory! They also believe that there is no excuse for sin, and that if there is, then the Devil is right and God is wrong!

Those who believe that Christ had an advantage over us state that Christ is the second Adam, and that He succeeded where Adam failed, and thus secured our salvation. And that there was no taint of sin whatsoever in Christ, both physically and spiritually. Further, that we, with our fallen sinful natures, can never, ever, live sinless lives until Christ returns and gives us new bodies and minds. That it is only by laying hold of the merits of the crucified Christ that we are accepted by God as though we had never sinned, and saved for all eternity.

The first option tends to lead toward legalistic perfectionism! The second option tends to lead toward irresponsibility! Decisions, decisions!

I'm going to go way, way out on a limb, and say that these two views are delusion v delusion! They both turn the old, old story of Jesus and His love into a fairy tale! They imply that God is a legalistic-perfectionistic, blood-thirsty monster who doesn't think we're good enough for Him! They are both sort of logical, when isolated from the realities of every day life, but they are utterly illogical when reality is clearly faced without distortion or rationalization!

I believe that Jesus was just like us, but that He was very, very spiritually refined and developed, and that He demonstrated to the human race, the true character of God, and what we humans are capable of achieving, and indeed must achieve, to usher in a great awakening…a true renaissance…which will bring peace to the world! By His sacrifice on the cross, Jesus made the bloody Old Testament sacrificial system obsolete, and made a new and living way to be right with God available to all, by following His Teachings and example of loving neighbor as self in a non legalistic-non pefectionistic way!

To be right with God, we need to be right with God. Not just declared right with God! This symbolic and representational demonstration did not require perfection! God does not require perfection from us…and God did not require perfection from Jesus! This may be heresy…but at least it makes sense! Nothing changed between God and us! When we see Jesus, we see the Father! Christ-like Divinity is found from Genesis to Revelation! You just have to look a little harder in the Old Testament! Human perceptions of God changed from Old to New Testaments! That's all!

We must be in harmony with the character of Christ, and decidedly part of the solution! We must not be in rebellion with the character of Christ, and decidedly part of the problem! We need to be very good, but not perfect! This is an ongoing process of cooperation between humanity and Divinity! We need God…and God needs us!

This is a hard saying! Who can hear it! But please don't gnash your teeth! Crowns or implants are very expensive! Weeping and wailing is probably ok, I guess! And please put down those stones! Go back to your homes! Everything is fine!

22. Jesus and Prayer.

“Be careful not to do your acts of righteousness before men, to be seen by them. If you do, you will have no reward from your Father in heaven. So when you give to the needy, do not announce it with trumpets, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and on the streets, to be honored by men. I tell you the truth, they have received their reward in full. But when you give to the needy, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing, so that your giving may be in secret. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you.

“And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by men. I tell you the truth, they have received their reward in full. But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you. And when you pray, do not keep on babbling like pagans, for they think they will be heard because of their many words. Do not be like them, for your Father knows what you need before you ask him.

"This, then, is how you should pray:

'Our Father' in heaven, hallowed be your name,
your kingdom come, your will be done on earth as it is in heaven.
Give us today our daily bread.
Forgive us our debts, as we also have forgiven our debtors.
And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from the evil one.

"For if you forgive men when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if you do not forgive men their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins."--Matthew 6:1-15 NIV

Is Jesus telling people NOT to go to church? Is Jesus telling people that going to church can be hazardous to their salvation? Jesus started Christianity…not Churchianity! He instructed people in how to live and pray…not how to build churches or how to conduct church services. He did not instruct people to worship Him…did He?

It’s tempting to get a real harangue going at this point! It can actually be fun…for awhile…until people start getting hurt. I think there should be a delicate balance of going to church…and not going to church. One should not view attending church and participating in religious rituals as a means of gaining God’s favor and escaping the flames of Hell. One should also not go to church to see and be seen…to make business and political contacts…or to parade how virtuous, charitable, good looking, or successful they are. Church should be there if you need it. If you don’t need it…don’t go.

To me…the best time to go to church is when there is no church service. I like the Roman Catholic tradition of having the church open every day…at least during daylight hours. It is truly inspiring to see people kneeling and privately praying to God. It’s even better when the organist is practicing. There is something about a service…or a concert…that takes away something very special from a church. The lights get turned up, the sound system gets turned on…and the stained glass windows just don’t look the same. There are people talking and laughing…which isn’t all bad…but it just isn’t as meditative. There is a tension of pretension during a service or concert which is not totally unlike a secular show.

I prefer going into an empty church…sitting down at the organ…and improvising a prayer to God. I play music that probably would not work in most church services…but that is between God and me. I think about spiritual themes as I play. If I hit a discordant note…I quickly resolve it…without having to worry about being fired by someone who looks like they need an extra-strength laxative…always...

In this passage, Jesus connects salvation with behavior…how you pray and how you treat others. The forgiveness of sins was available prior to the cross…and this forgiveness was behavior related…not unconditional! Doesn't forgiveness of sins equal salvation…in a qualifying sense? If that is the case, then salvation was available before the cross! And notice that Jesus does not tell people to pray to Him for forgiveness…so that He could then plead their case before some big, mean-old God. Jesus taught that salvation is obtained by a right relationship with God and neighbor! Not by being declared righteous…while continuing to be unrighteous! The terms remain unchanged after the cross!

Also, it is helpful to really think about the words of the Lord's Prayer, and not just mindlessly say it with the usual Godbot-like monotone and pauses!

23. Live Out Thy Life Within Me!

Here is an alternative wording to the hymn tune Aurelia, commonly known as The Church's One Foundation:

Live out Thy life within me! O Jesus, King of kings!
Be Thou Thyself the answer to all my questionings!
Live out Thy life within me! In all things have thy way!
I, the transparent medium! Thy glory to display!

The temple has been yielded, and purified of sin!
Let Thy Shekinah glory now shine forth from within!
And all the earth keep silence! The body hence-forth be
Thy silent, gentle servant, moved only as by Thee!

Its members every moment, held subject to Thy call!
Ready to have Thee use them, or not be used at all!
Held without restless longing, or strain, or stress, or fret,
Or chafings at Thy dealings, or thoughts of vain regret!

But restful, calm, and pliant, from bend and bias free!
Awaiting Thy decision, when Thou hast need of me!
Live out Thy life within me! O Jesus, King of Kings!
Be Thou the glorious answer to all my questionings!

Tune: Aurelia by Samuel Wesley (1810-1876)
Words: Frances Ridley Havergal (1836-1879)

If you haven't already noticed, hymn tunes are really poems! It's fun to just read them as poetry, without singing them! I think so, anyway!

24. Gates, Trees, Houses, and the Kingdom of God.

"So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets.

"Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.

"Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. By their fruit you will recognize them. Do People pick grapes from thorn-bushes, or figs from thistles? Likewise every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them.

"Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles? Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'

"Therefore everyone who hears these words of mine and puts them into practice is like a wise man who built his house on the rock. The rain came down, the streams rose, and the winds blew and beat against that house; yet it did not fall, because it had its foundation on the rock. But everyone who hears these words of mine and does not put them into practice is like a foolish man who built his house on sand. The rain came down, the streams rose, and the winds blew and beat against that house, and it fell with a great crash."

When Jesus had finished saying these things, the crowds were amazed at his teaching, because he taught as one who had authority, and not as their teachers of the law.
--Matthew 7:12-29 NIV

Does your pastor, priest, or rector preach the words of Christ with authority, or as a teacher of the law…without power? Is it time to change churches? Just don’t go away mad!

25. Creedal Statements.

Various churches have various statements of belief. One church believes this and another church believes that, and yet another church doesn't have a clue what they really believe! Some believe they are the one true church, that they alone are right and everyone else is wrong! They can't all be right, can they? Some believe that they have a unique contribution, but that all Christian churches are all legitimately part of the body of Christ. Many have creedal statements, or statements of belief. Many look at each-others statements in disbelief! After extensive discussions regarding beliefs, some simply believe they'll have another drink!

Let me suggest that the Teachings of Christ, without further refinement or distillation, should be the creedal statement of all Christian churches! A Christian Constitution! This could be the basis of a non-compromising Christian ecumenism! The contemporary application of these historic words would be left up to each Christian organization to apply in their own unique way, depending on their situation! This would combat corruption and confusion! I’m also guessing that various religious groups around the world might find this approach to be an acceptable common ground upon which to build a new world of peace, love, and cooperation!

By definition, a Christian is a follower of Jesus Christ! Not a follower of Moses, Peter, Paul, Mary, Luther, Smith, White, Eddy, Peale, Schuller, Graham, the Pope, or the Anti-Christ!

Speaking of the Anti-Christ, with such widespread disregard of, and even hostility toward, the teachings of Christ within Churchianity, the Anti-Christ may not have a lot to do when he (or she) finally arrives! Perhaps the Anti-Christ has been here, alive and well, possibly in the form of a committee, for the past 2,000 years...

If you are ever involved in an exorcism, try using any of the above names, other than Jesus Christ, and see what happens, or doesn't happen! Demons really exist, and they really hate the name of Jesus Christ!

26. Singing Hymns About Him.

There is a secret spiritual discipline that most neglect, but that may be the most effective character builder! That discipline is hymn singing! Not limping through an unfamiliar hymn in church. But privately singing hymns a capella, after studying the texts. Try it! Do this every day, and see what happens. You'll like it! The Devil won't…

Then, when you sing in church, you will have a new found understanding and confidence! Your spirited singing will inspire others, and they may ask how you learned to sing so well! The music director may be bold enough to have the congregation sing a hymn a capella! Your pastor or priest will be inspired to deliver a more spirited sermon! It's a chain reaction!

Sometimes a powerful sermon will inspire a powerful hymn! Tony Campolo was a guest speaker at a church I attended long ago, probably before he called himself a Red Letter Christian. He spoke in his usual aggressive style! The organ postlude was printed in the church bulletin as being Litanies by Jehan Alain. It is a wonderful modern French Romantic work which is full of fireworks and dissonant chords! But when the organist began to play, the postlude was the hymn “Onward Christian Soldiers!” I spoke with the organist, and he explained that after a sermon like that, he just couldn't play a jazzy postlude!

On another occasion, in the same church, an upbeat guest speaker spoke of faith to a congregation who had been ravaged by doctrinal controversy. We sang “A Mighty Fortress is Our God” with real gusto! The pastor remarked that he had not heard the people sing like that for a long, long time!

I like contemporary music, even contemporary hymns which are well written and have meaningful lyrics. However, there is nothing like a great historical hymn of the Christian church! My guess is that the neglect of the proper singing of these great hymns has left the door wide open for the repetitive, musically uninteresting, and lyrically bankrupt praise songs! Sorry for the sore toes!

I love classical music! Especially sacred classical music! But often there is an elitism and lack of Christ-like spirituality connected with this music. This probably makes the praise songs more attractive than they deserve to be! More sore toes!

I believe the place for well written praise songs is in a more informal setting, such as when singing around the camp fire. Believe me, this is not a put-down! If the praise songs are to be used in church, I prefer a separate service devoted to this type of music. I am not opposed to new music, just bad music!

Sorry for all the sore toes! Oh my! Have I hung myself? Medic! Medic!!

27. The Least of These.

Those whom Christ commends in the judgment may have known little of theology, but they have cherished His principles. Through the influence of the divine Spirit they have been a blessing to those about them. Even among the heathen are those who have cherished the spirit of kindness; before the words of life had fallen upon their ears, they have befriended the missionaries, even ministering to them at the peril of their own lives. Among the heathen are those who worship God ignorantly, those to whom the light is never brought by human instrumentality, yet they will not perish. Though ignorant of the written law of God, they have heard His voice speaking to them in nature, and have done the things that the law required. Their works are evidence that the Holy Spirit has touched their hearts, and they are recognized as the children of God. How surprised and gladdened will be the lowly among the nations, and among the heathen, to hear from the lips of the Savior, "Inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of these My brethren, you did it to Me." How glad will be the heart of Infinite Love as His followers look up with surprise and joy at His words of approval!
--Desire of Ages, pg. 686 by Ellen White.


28. Christ and Hollywood.

I once drove for two hours, through Los Angeles traffic, to see The Last Temptation of Christ. I wasn’t impressed. I thought that it was more boring than objectionable! I once spoke with the step-mother of a famous Hollywood director about my desire to see a well done motion picture on the life of Christ using some of the special effects seen in a movie about UFO’s. On another occasion, I spoke with the director-son of a famous actor, again about my desire to see a well made life of Christ movie. I even talked to Dr. Timothy Leary about Jesus! What a trip! The idea was to do a life of Christ movie as a 2,000th birthday present for Jesus Christ! I obviously had no clout or power of persuasion! Nothing! Many years later, The Passion of Christ appeared. But my dream of a properly performed life of Christ motion picture is still unfulfilled. Movie people…please do this! Is anybody out there?

Can anything good come out of Hollywood? Maybe yes…maybe no. But I just saw a movie which came out of Australia, and I thought it was very good! It was Brides of Christ. It's about the painful time of change before, during, and after, the Second Vatican Council, or Vatican II. Have you seen Brides of Christ? If you haven't, rent the DVD! I cried through most of it! Warning, there are some graphic scenes. Some of the characters had bad habits! Sorry!

Making organized religion work is a huge challenge! The bigger the church, the bigger the challenge, especially when change is contemplated and implemented. So many implications and ramifications! If you have a problem with organized religion, then try disorganized religion, and see if that works for you! The history of organized religion is a tragicomedy of trial and error, interspersed with horror and even atrocities! The triumph of good over evil, love over hate, wisdom over ignorance, pleasure over pain, order over chaos, makes the struggle to get it right worth all of the trouble!

While you are at the video store, rent Luther. This movie illustrates the peril and promise of trying to reform a corrupt organization. Luther didn't want to start a new church. He just wanted to cleanse the temple of the corrupt money changers and merchants. Isn't that what Jesus tried to do too? On one occasion he used a whip!

But, the 'bad guys' don't thank the 'good guys' for pointing out their sins! They don't promptly say they are sorry, and then clean up their act. Oh no! They attempt to silence the messenger! First, they attack his premise. If that doesn't work, they attack his character. And if that doesn't work, they try to kill him! This is the dark side of human nature. Is this an example of Original Sin? It is found throughout the world, and throughout history. It is not specific to one church or one nation. It is so easy to demonize one particular group of people! But all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God! We just have to keep trying to do better. Sometimes this is very, very difficult!

One movie I would not recommend is World Trade Center. The subject had potential...but I didn't like the plot! Sorry! By the way…conspiracy theorists…if 9-11 was an inside job from top to bottom, start to finish…do you really think that it would have been such a complicated and sloppy job? Did some Americans unwittingly or unwillingly facilitate this atrocity? Were loose-ends deliberately left untied? Was this an attempt to destroy our form of government and way of life? It’s not really working though, is it? Americans are smart, tough, and resilient!

29. Divine Intervention.

We live in a very negative, cynical, and skeptical world with regard to God, the Bible, and eternal life. Especially in the western world. The third world seems to be full of faith, in comparison! Some would say this is simply because of ignorance. Give them a few years and they'll be just as skeptical as the rest! What's going on here?

Let me suggest that many in the western world are battle hardened and fatigued. They've been beaten down by decades of nihilism, religious scandal, abuse, and general corruption. There has been a lot of false advertising and sensationalism, and many have been burned when the goods are not delivered or things don't make sense anymore!

Some have suggested that our concept of God is too small and limited. However, I would like to suggest that we often create an unrealistic God concept. That we make God into a fairy tale, which sets us up for disappointment, disillusionment, agnosticism, and even atheism…

I don't believe in the supernatural. I know by experience that the supernatural exists, by things that have happened to me, without me seeking anything! I will not elaborate. It's too private and even silly sounding! But I know that there is more to life than meets the eye! Further, from the myriad experiences of others, there is ample evidence for the existence of both good and evil supernatural forces! Just as there is obviously good and evil in the visible world. Perhaps heaven and hell exists in both the physical and spiritual world, side by side, but without harps or flames! I think we'll find out soon enough!

Having said that, I'm not expecting magical bail-outs from God! Occasionally, it is obvious that there has been divine intervention. But when and where this occurs is not up to us. It's up to God! Often, prayer is nothing more than us telling God what to do! I thought it was supposed to be the other way around! Who's boss, anyway? And, according to Jesus, God knows what we need before we ask! Prayer for me, is to make my life a blank check for God to write upon. To keep the lines of communication open. To respond positively to the Holy Spirit! Not to make demands on God, reminding Him of His promises to us in the Bible. That would be sort of like a lawyer pointing out contractual obligations in a court of law…

Jesus indicated that all of our prayer requests would be answered, so how does that square with what I have just said? I must confess that I haven't been successful in praying for a mountain to be cast into the sea! Or in emptying the local hospital. And often, more simple requests, such as for the healing of sick or hurt friends and relatives, are not granted. This is an area that I don't have a good answer for. Miracles…genuine miracles…do occur, but they are, in my experience and observation, far and few between, and they don't occur upon demand!

My favorite prayer is as follows: "Glorious God! In the name of Jesus Christ! With the power of the Holy Spirit! Work in my life as You choose!" I repeat these words several times to reinforce them in my mind, but not to try to convince God! This prayer puts God the Father, Jesus Christ, and the Holy Spirit, in the drivers seat! What they do in my life is completely up to them! I'm making no demands or pleadings. Who am I, to tell the Holy Trinity, what to do?!


30. The Rich Young Ruler.

A certain ruler asked him, "Good teacher, what must I do to inherit eternal life?"

"Why do you call me good?" Jesus answered. "No one is good...except God alone. You know the commandments: 'Do not commit adultery, do not murder, do not steal, do not give false testimony, honor your father and mother.'"

"All these I have kept since I was a boy," he said.

When Jesus heard this, he said to him, "You still lack one thing. Sell everything you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me."

When he heard this, he became very sad, because he was a man of great wealth. Jesus looked at him and said, "How hard it is for the rich to enter the kingdom of God! Indeed, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."

Those who heard this asked, "Who then can be saved?"

Jesus replied, "What is impossible with men is possible with God." Peter said to him "We have left all we had to follow you!"

"I tell you the truth," Jesus said to them, "no one who has left home or wife or brothers or parents or children for the sake of the kingdom of God will fail to receive many times as much in this age and, in the age to come, eternal life." Luke 18:18-30 NIV

Jesus, in a very real sense, was a rich young ruler, who had laid aside His royalty, and had become one of the peasants! Jesus wasn’t asking this young man to do anything that He Himself had not already done!

My favorite painting is The Blue Boy by Thomas Gainsborough. It is located at the Huntington Library and Art Gallery in San Marino, California. When I was six years old, I stood transfixed before this painting for at least 20 minutes. My mother was amazed! Now, when I look at “The Blue Boy” I imagine that this is what Jesus may have looked like when He dropped out of sight at the age of twelve! Was Jesus royalty between His twelfth and thirtieth birthdays? I always think of Jesus as both a royal and a commoner! This painting depicts a rich young ruler! It depicts royalty! Jesus was more than some brash young man who stumbled into the limelight, and who was disrespectful to the powers that be…and got Himself murdered! A lot more!

Reading between the lines here, I believe the point is to not neglect the poor, and to be completely in harmony with the character of Jesus Christ! One can technically observe all of the rules and regulations, yet not genuinely care about, and care for, the poor and suffering. And also not make Christ and His teachings, first and foremost. The proud observance of the rules can actually result in a downright devilish attitude!

Jesus calls us to responsible psychology, ethics, and spirituality. He wishes us to do whatever it takes to get to this level of character development! Participating in the kingdom of God does not require perfection…but it does require a high, though readily attainable, standard of living. This is accomplished through perspiration and inspiration! We cooperate with God, and work our tails off! It involves more than simply uttering the right words to God, or by being declared righteous by a member of the clergy!

31. Creation v Evolution.

Confession time. I have a problem with atheistic evolution and with fundamentalist creation. I think that the truth of our origins is an all of the above and more proposition. I don't think we really know! We think we do, but I think it is a grand mystery! Is that a cop-out? Probably! But the complexity and myriad possibilities should make all of us very, very humble. Including those with Doctor of Divinity or Doctor of Philosophy degrees!

The fossil record seems to indicate very long periods of evolution. The complexity and specialization of the human body is beyond comprehension, and seems to indicate creation or intelligent design. Consider the human head thou skeptic!

Charles Darwin, of all people, was also conflicted! “I am conscious that I am in an utterly hopeless muddle,” Darwin confessed. “I cannot think that the world, as we see it, is the result of chance; and yet I cannot look at each separate thing as the result of design.” See www.darwinproject.ac.uk/darwinletters/calendar/entry-2998.html

There are two Genesis accounts of creation…and there is a Babylonian Genesis also! Are these stories simplified versions of a much more complex process? I think this is part of the answer. Is the rest of the story something which is hidden from our view for a reason? Perhaps. Maybe the whole truth is something we are not prepared to handle, even now.

For those who don't believe in God, what about extraterrestrial genetic engineering, superimposed upon evolution? Is this something that can be easily proved or disproved? What a can of worms! I'd better stop! I might not be able to put the genie back in the lamp! Or maybe I should say…I might not be able to put the ET back in the saucer!

Have you considered the complexity of vision? There are two eyes, not one, with a nerve crossover, to give stereoscopic vision and depth perception. If you don't believe in some kind of design or intervention, please study vision in its minutest detail, over an extended period of time, in order to absorb the complexity of what's really going on here! And this process also involves that masterpiece, the brain! So many things have to be right for you to be able to read what I have written, and to understand it!

If you want to feel really small…look up into a clear midnight sky for an hour or two, with or without binoculars or a telescope. I really don't think we have this thing all figured out. We’re not even close! Come on! Be honest! Be humble! Be amazed!

32. A Balanced Standard.

In case you haven't noticed…I took a few days off. It's good to have a change of pace once in a while! I listened to a lot of Wall Street related lectures during the day. Then I listened to a lot of rock and roll at night! My ears are still ringing! Well now I'm back in the saddle again!

Can one talk or write about Jesus too much? I think so. This site is intended to promote a renewed focus on the Red-Letter Teachings of Jesus Christ, and thus does not venture far from this important subject. In every day life, this narrow of a focus would not be healthy! Balance is essential. But sometimes to undo you have to over-do!

Be open to all of life, yet be very scrutinizing and questioning of all you encounter! We should not be Jesus robots, or Godbots, if you will! On the other hand, we should keep coming back to the historical Teachings of Christ as a guiding and unifying force in our modern lives and in society. If you don't stand for something, you will fall for anything! If our standard is too complex, then confusion and frustration are sure to follow! If our standard is not comprehensive and specific enough, then it really is not a standard at all! It's, as previously mentioned, a Maginot Line against a very savvy army of darkness!

The Teachings of Jesus allow very little wiggle-room for those who are corrupt! However, they give a lot of leeway for those who are doing the best they can to do what is right! I believe that Jesus wishes for us to make the world a better place, in our own way and in our own time! We're all different! We shouldn’t be cookie-cutter Christians!

33. Liberal v Conservative.

Conservatives seem to know. They have the answer, and the answer is usually historical, and sometimes hysterical! Sometimes I have gotten the impression that a conservative is someone who rigidly guards a tradition, and is willing to do just about anything to make sure that the tradition, of whatever nature, is maintained without compromise or without admitting any deficiency or error whatsoever! This pursuit sometimes seems to involve denial of reality, or even lying, consciously or subconsciously. Historically, it has sometimes involved violence or even killing! Conservatives usually seem to view liberals with suspicion and contempt. Some conservatives act as though ignorance were a virtue! The conservatives often are the fund providers. Follow the money…

Liberals, on the other hand, seem to know better than the conservatives…but they don't really know anything for sure! The answer could be this, or it could be that…or none of the above. Liberals are often educated and sophisticated, and look down on conservatives, who they view as being rigid and stupid! Sometimes they act as though everything is a big joke! Especially everything conservative. They tend to have an in your face, rebellious attitude! The liberals often are the complainers…

What if the solution to the liberal v conservative dilemma involved combining the best of liberalism and conservatism? Wherein the best of a historical tradition is positively reinforced, but also treated with honesty regarding any deficiencies. And also having a commitment to applying a tradition to modernity in an intelligent and appropriate manner.

When one attempts to build a building, if you keep changing the foundation, you never get the building built! On the other hand, if you are not open to constructive criticism, you may end up with an unsafe eyesore! I believe that the Teachings of Jesus are the foundation or the solid rock upon which we need to build His church. All other ground is sinking sand! Let's learn from the building collapses and code violations of the past 2,000 years…

If the liberals and conservatives could come to realize that they need each other…the journey of life and discovery might be a whole lot more productive and enjoyable!

To embrace the Teachings of Jesus is to be both liberal and conservative! Jesus was arguably a liberal in style and in opposition to the corrupt status quo…but a conservative regarding upholding the best unchangeable principles and concepts of the Old Testament!

34. Luke 21: The End Game.

As he looked up, Jesus saw the rich putting their gifts into the temple treasury. He also saw a poor widow put in two very small copper coins. "I tell you the truth," he said, "this poor widow has put in more than all the others. All these people gave their gifts out of their wealth; but she out of her poverty put in all she had to live on."

Some of the disciples were remarking about how the temple was adorned with beautiful stones and with gifts dedicated to God. But Jesus said, "As for what you see here, the time will come when not one stone will be left on another; every one of them will be thrown down."

"Teacher," they asked, "when will these things happen? And what will be the sign that they are about to take place?"

He replied: "Watch out that you are not deceived. For many will come in my name, claiming, 'I am he,' and, 'The time is near.' Do not follow them. When you hear of wars and revolutions, do not be frightened. These things must happen first, but the end will not come right away."

Then he said to them: "Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be great earthquakes, famines and pestilences in various places, and fearful events and great signs from heaven.'

But before all this, they will lay hands on you and persecute you. They will deliver you to synagogues and prisons, and you will be brought before kings and governors, and all on account of my name. This will result in your being witnesses to them. But make up your mind not to worry beforehand how you will defend yourselves. For I will give you words and wisdom that none of your adversaries will be able to resist or contradict. You will be betrayed even by parents, brothers, relatives and friends, and they will put some of you to death. All men will hate you because of me. But not a hair of your head will perish. By standing firm you will gain life.

When you see Jerusalem being surrounded by armies, you will know that its desolation is near. Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, let those in the city get out, and let those in the country not enter the city. For this is the time of punishment in fulfillment of all that has been written.

How dreadful it will be in those days for pregnant women and nursing mothers! There will be great distress in the land and wrath against this people. They will fall by the sword and will be taken as prisoners to all the nations. Jerusalem will be trampled on by the Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled.

There will be signs in the sun, moon and stars. On the earth, nations will be in anguish and perplexity at the roaring and tossing of the sea. Men will faint from terror, apprehensive of what is coming on the world, for the heavenly bodies will be shaken. At that time they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. When these things begin to take place, stand up and lift up your heads, because you redemption is drawing near."

He told them this parable: "Look at the fig tree and all the trees. When they sprout leaves, you can see for yourselves and know that summer is near. Even so, when you see these things happening, you know that the kingdom of God is near.

I tell you the truth, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened. Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away.

Be careful, or your hearts will be weighed down with dissipation, drunkenness and the anxieties of life, and that day will close on you unexpectedly like a trap. For it will come upon all those who live on the face of the whole earth. Be always on the watch, and pray that you may be able to escape all that is about to happen, and that you may be able to stand before the Son of Man."

Each day Jesus was teaching at the temple, and each evening he went out to spend the night on the hill called the Mount of Olives, and all the people came early in the morning to hear him at the temple. Luke 21 NIV

Luke chapter 21 contains basic soteriology, or how we are saved, and basic eschatology, or a study of the end of time. If you don't know what eschatology is…it's not the end of the world!

Jesus proclaims that by standing firm, we will gain life. Again and again, Jesus ties salvation to behavior…not simply belief! On the other hand, belief is the beginning of behavior. By beholding Christ we become changed! Visualize Jesus…and world-peace. Give Jesus and peace a chance.

The Luke 21 end time scenario contains enough upsetting information for just about anyone! If you want to become really upset and confused, read the books of Daniel and Revelation! There are numerical challenges here as well, if you're into numbers games!

It seems that the end here depicted by Jesus was to occur shortly after His death…not 2,000 years later! Could it be that the followers of Jesus fumbled the ball? Were the words of Jesus preached with power throughout the world after His death? Did someone circumvent the Great Commission, thinking they knew better? Have the Teachings of Jesus been placed first and foremost in Christian churches during the past 2,000 years? Are the words of Christ being placed first and foremost in Christian churches now? Could it be that the Teachings of Jesus have been purposefully and systematically suppressed and relegated to the back of the bus? Will humanity have to wait another 2,000 years for the return of Christ? World without end?

35. Facing Reality.

How does one face reality? Might I suggest that a commitment to researching as many points of view as possible is a good starting point. Peer oversight and review is another sobering activity. It's, in a sense, asking, 'am I sane?' Might I also suggest a term: ‘contextual superimposition,’ which implies testing any one thing with a variety of other things, some seemingly unrelated! This can involve the combining of opposites. I’m going to go out on a limb and tell you that I learned the combining of opposites from Shirley McClain! It actually works! If it didn’t, then I’d be out on a broken limb!

Once upon a time…two lizards were sunning themselves on a rock in the desert…getting in touch with their higher selves and experiencing alternate realities! One lizard said to the other, “I have this odd sensation…this knowingness…that in a past-life…I was Shirley McClain!” Sorry Shirley! And by the way…I still don’t think that you are God! I don’t always agree with Shirley…but she has an inquisitive honesty and intensity which is worth taking a second look at. My father was a refrigeration technician in Hollywood for many years. He kept the stars cool! He told me that between takes…Shirley looked like she was in deep thought. And this was before she started publishing her controversial books. Deep thought is an excellent way to face alternate reality!

Reality is both positive and negative. If one is negative when it is appropriate to be positive, I would consider that to be a denial of reality! If one is positive when it is appropriate to be negative, I would also consider that to be a denial of reality! How does one know what is appropriate? Experience and honesty. One should be neither needlessly negative or presumptuously positive!

Faith, confidence, or positive-thinking helps one to not lose their way while dealing with a horrendous negative reality. An ability to deal with the most painful negative realities in an honest manner helps one to not lose their way in a positive dreamland, divorced from reality, that some mistakenly refer to as faith!

People who are stuck on negative and people who are stuck on positive are in deep trouble in my book. My guess is that there are many such people in mental institutions. One needs to be able to swing between the negative and the positive in a response-able manner!

Jesus was positive when appropriate, and negative when appropriate. Jesus Christ was, and is, the model of response-ability! When you read the Teachings of Jesus, keep the word responsibility in mind at all times. This magical word is the key which unlocks the true meaning of the teachings of Christ! The truth which sets us free is responsibility! And don't forget to pray!

Finally, do you know why Egyptians are so happy? Because they live in de-Nile! And perhaps because they know things about the Bible that some Christians don’t. Are some Christians living in denial?

36. Devotional Scholarship.

Those who engage in a devotional pursuit of Jesus are often wary of those who engage in a scholarly pursuit of Jesus…and often for good reason! Those who engage in a scholarly pursuit of Jesus often neglect a devotional pursuit of Jesus, and thus, tend to destroy their own faith, as well as the faith of the faithful. But the faithful often make themselves extremely vulnerable to a faith meltdown by not considering a variety of viewpoints while simultaneously engaged in their devotional-spiritual pursuit of Christ.

The scholars need to seek Jesus spiritually as little children. The faithful need to seek Jesus scholastically as little children. Jesus proclaimed that we must be like little children to enter the kingdom! This wasn't a weak suggestion! We must be teach-able or response-able to enter the kingdom. Don't think you know it all. We'll never know it all! If someone acts like a know it all…they know a lot less than they think they do…or you think they do!

Cults isolate their members from challenging or contradictory influences. They often neglect both the scholastic and devotional aspects of spirituality. They hate competition! They love control! One cult leader, in essence said, “You don’t need to study…just do what I tell you to do…go ahead and drink the Cool-Aid!” They sometimes isolate their members in compounds, or lead them into jungles. Be careful! It's a jungle out there! And don't forget to pray!

37. Abortion.

What I am about to say is not from a Gospel text. It is simply an opinion of my own, hopefully guided by the teachings of Christ, but not derived directly. If you don't agree with me, don't blame Jesus! Blame me! My guess is that very few people will agree with me on this one…which might be a good sign, come to think of it!

Well, here goes! After conception, but prior to the existence of brain waves and a heartbeat in a fetus, allow abortion on demand, under the care of a licensed physician. Any time after the commencement of brain waves and a beating heart in a now very alive baby, the act of causing the brain waves and heart beat to cease would be considered to be premeditated murder. This is my attempt to answer the shrill cries of the pro-choice and pro-life crowds.

I hate any abortion! I believe it to be always wrong! It is a holocaust which continues day after day! The above view is a compromise, admittedly. Some, probably on both sides, would call it a deal with the Devil! However, in a free society, this is something which I believe would be a step in the right direction, and remove a lot of ambiguity and arbitrariness!

When a person is terminally ill or in an accident, they are considered to be alive until their brain and heart cease to function. They are then declared dead. Why not use this definition when dealing with an unborn child?

Wow! I can't believe I said it! I've said too much, and I'm going to stop now! Put down the stones, lay down the pitch-forks, extinguish the torches, and go back to your homes! Everything is fine! I wish...

38. When you feel like.....

It's easy to be optimistic when you have lots of money in the bank, you're healthy and good-looking, and have lots of cool friends! But what if you have cancer, kidney failure, serious burns, people whisper that you're really ugly, you're bankrupt or you just lost your house, your faith, and maybe your will to live? I wish I had an easy answer...I could use such an answer more often than I care to admit.

One nice thing about staying close to Jesus is that he literally had a hell of a time when he walked this earth! He had a much tougher time than he would have, if he had not tried to help us. And, I believe, Jesus continues to have a hell of a time as he struggles to solve the problems of this earth…not to mention the whole universe! It's nice to have someone like that on our side, isn't it?

It's probably a good idea to formulate and maintain your faith with the extremes of good and evil, pleasure and pain, belief and doubt, success and failure...clearly in mind. If your faith doesn't work in the extremes of life...it doesn't work! Would your faith work if you were starving in Darfur? Or does it only work if you're netting a million a year, living in a mansion, and worshiping in a cathedral?

And why does there have to be some deep and profound reason for suffering? It just happens…to good people, bad people, children, adults, animals, etc. Suffering is the cost of doing business in the universe. I doubt that it can be eliminated…only minimized. Perhaps it’s Murphy’s fault. He wrote the wrong law, didn’t he? What amazes me, is how we humans seem to love to invent ways to increase our own suffering and misery. We even pay good money to entertain ourselves with human suffering on the silver screen. Are we addicted to suffering?

You have to work this out yourself. Glib advice usually hurts more than it helps. The earth is a battlefield and we are at war! If that sounds extreme, start reading the Bible and the newspaper! And I don't see this changing anytime soon...

Pray without ceasing! Not necessarily for protection or relief, but for the presence of God. I think God may be in more trouble than we ever dreamed of being in! We often think of God sitting on a throne, with everything under control, and no real problems, other than us! But what if God needs us as much as we need God? What if the only way out of this thing is for us to cooperate fully with God and work like our lives depended on it! Our physical and spiritual lives may very well depend on it! As much as possible, turn your eyes away from yourself, and turn them toward Jesus, others, and the responsibilities directly in your path!

If what I have said seems harsh, it's because I don't like to lie, whisper sweet nothings, or lead people down the primrose path. Life is earnest! Life is real! This is not a dress rehearsal! We have much to learn and unlearn. We're mostly making this up as we go! My guess is that for now we may have to struggle along, often not knowing why. For now, the answer, my friend, is blowing in the wind. I’d like to think that I have the answer…but you and I…and God…know better…

Cherish the light! Fight the darkness! And deep in my heart, I believe that we shall overcome some day! Truth will set us free! Stay close to Jesus…and don't forget to pray!

39. Red Letter Lectionary.

Do you ever have the feeling that the text you just heard in church was not appropriate, not helpful, and probably not the word of the Lord? I have! And while I believe that all scripture is inspired by God, I also believe that there is a time and a place for everything. Vast portions of scripture are probably best left to the classroom or to private study. Church is a place where we come to be inspired and lifted up! We come to have our faith made stronger…not weaker. We need a concise moral and inspirational foundation which is also historical. The words of Jesus should be central…as always!

I wish to propose that a Red Letter Lectionary be composed as follows:

Old Testament Reading: Selected from Proverbs, or from an Old Testament text directly related to the words of Christ in the Gospel reading.

Psalm: Duh! But directly related to the words of Christ in the Gospel reading.

New Testament Reading: Selected primarily from Acts, or the non red letter portions of Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John which are directly related to the words of Christ in the Gospel reading. Secondarily, those portions of Romans through Revelation, which relate directly to the Teachings of Jesus.

Gospel: Always selected from the red letter portions of Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John.

And further, that the sermon or homily always be based on the words of Christ. This may be called picking and choosing. It may also be called Dalmatian Theology. But I call it kicking Satan where it counts!

The Psalms and Proverbs provide the best of the Old Testament moral, inspirational, and devotional material. They also set the stage for the appearance of Jesus! The book of Acts chronicles the Ascension, Pentecost, and the progress of the early Christian church. The non red letter portions of the Gospels provide a context for the words of Christ. And finally, the Teachings of Jesus are the foundation of the Christian church! They should be the Christian Constitution!

I do not wish to imply that the left out portions of scripture are unimportant. No portion of scripture should be neglected! It's just that church is a very, very special occasion, and that the Psalms, Proverbs, Gospels and Acts are central to the singing, praying, theological and moral instruction of Christians! So many books in the Bible, and so little time! The goal is to be appropriate, and simple, yet comprehensive. And to deal with that portion of the historical which is readily adaptable to the contemporary, to avoid exasperating and confusing the faithful and the reasonable!

This is a hard saying! Who can hear it? Once again, put down the stones and pitch-forks! Extinguish the torches! Stop weeping, wailing, and gnashing your teeth! Go back to your homes! Everything will be fine! I hope...

40. Church and State.

Should the Constitution of the United States and current events be regularly discussed at church, if not during church? Should the U.S. Constitution be part of a Christian Constitution? How's that for opening a can of worms?

The Constitution protects the church from the state…protects the state from the church…protects the individual from the state…and protects the state from the individual! It also provides an orderly manner by which important decisions may be reached. Checks and balances abound. Renegade dictators need not apply! Evolutionary rather than revolutionary change is the norm. At least once we got past the American Revolution and the Civil War! Is there really such a thing as a 'civil' war? Shouldn't it be called the Uncivil War? Are we Barbarians? Can't we get along? Guess not! We should have read George Washington's Rules of Civility.

Anyway, Christians should not be ignorant or silent regarding politics. They are highly irresponsible if they leave the important issues of our nation up to others! If our faith cannot be applied effectively to contemporary issues…it's nearly worthless! Well, what about separation of church and state? Shouldn't we just sing and pray and keep our heads up in the clouds, or up...never mind? That is a rhetorical question, by the way! The state cannot establish a state church, such as the Church of England. A church leader cannot control the state…although some seem to be trying to do so! Thank God and the Founding Fathers for the U.S. Constitution! The Founding Mothers probably inspired the Founding Fathers to make history!

Christians and the Christian church should be vocal regarding religious and political issues, but they should seek to convince people with love and logic…and not to control them by force! There is a huge difference! Have you read Fox’s Book of Martyrs? Have you read about The Crusades and The Inquisition? What senseless bloodbaths! And they were ordered and carried out by professed followers of Jesus! Don't think that can't happen again. Don't I have faith in humanity? Well, no…not really…

Preachers and priests should not have to worry about losing their church's tax-exempt status when they support a political candidate or position! The establishment clause should not be confused with the free exercise clause! What about freedom of speech? The yanking of the tax-exempt status of a church because of sermon content is tantamount to prohibiting the free exercise of religion and the freedom of speech. Read the entire First Amendment. Here it is folks…the whole one sentence:

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

To say that the United States of America and the U.S. Constitution was inspired by Christianity is probably true and acceptable. To say that this is a Christian Nation is not true, and is extremely dangerous! It was my observation that the Moral Majority was Neither! And that the Religious Right is Wrong! Could a U.S. President ignore the U.S. Constitution based upon the “spirit-led” experience of the Religious Right? Has this already happened?

And by the way, is Sola Scriptura scriptural? The twin principles of freedom and responsibility, which are the foundation of the Teachings of Jesus, are non-negotiable! The context of the Teachings of Jesus is not our context, and we do have to use our brains and the internet, to make intelligent theological statements which are relevant to modernity, so as to not degenerate into pious zombies, or Godbots! Modern politics is our context! What would President Jesus Christ say and do! Would He preemptively attack a country that might be a threat at some point in the future?

Am I a bleeding heart, morally ambiguous, anti-God liberal? No! Just a Red Letter Constitutionalist! Shouldn't we all take the U.S. Constitution and the Teachings of Jesus very seriously? It sure beats the oppression of a corrupt New World Order Theocracy!

Are you mad? Probably both the religious and irreligious are mad, at this point! As a child, I learned quickly not to talk openly about religion, politics, and sex! But when I became a man, I put away these childhood lessons…to my detriment! If you think you're mad now, wait 'till I start writing about sex! You think I’m kidding…don’t you?

41. Sermon on the Mount Preview.

The disciples' place was always next to Jesus. The people constantly pressed upon Him, yet the disciples understood that they were not to be crowded away from His presence. They sat close beside Him, that they might not lose a word of His instruction. They were attentive listeners, eager to understand the truths they were to make known to all lands and all ages.

With a feeling that something more than usual might be expected, they now pressed about their Master. They believed that the kingdom was soon to be established, and from the events of the morning they gathered assurance that some announcement concerning it was about to be made. A feeling of expectancy pervaded the multitude also, and eager faces gave evidence of the deep interest. As the people sat upon the green hillside, awaiting the words of the divine Teacher, their hearts were filled with thoughts of future glory. There were scribes and Pharisees who looked forward to the day when they should have dominion over the hated Romans, and possess the riches and splendor of the world's great empire. The poor peasants and fishermen hoped to hear the assurance that their wretched hovels, the scanty food, the life of toil, and fear of want were to be exchanged for mansions of plenty and days of ease. In place of the one coarse garment which was their covering by day, and their blanket at night, they hoped that Christ would give them the rich and costly robes of their conquerors. All hearts thrilled with the proud hope that Israel was soon to be honored before the nations as the chosen of the Lord, and Jerusalem exalted as the head of a universal kingdom.

Christ disappointed the hope of worldly greatness. In the Sermon on the Mount He sought to undo the work that had been wrought by false education, and to give His hearers a right conception of His kingdom and of His own character. Yet He did not make a direct attack on the errors of the people. He saw the misery of the world on account of sin, yet He did not present before them a vivid delineation of their wretchedness. He taught them of something infinitely better than they had known. Without combating their ideas of the kingdom of God, He told them the conditions of entrance therein, leaving them to draw their own conclusions as to its nature. The truths He taught are no less important to us than to the multitude that followed Him. We no less than they need to learn the foundation principles of the kingdom of God.---The Desire of Ages by Ellen White, pages 308-309.

42. The Sabbath.

Should the Sabbath be observed by Christians? If so, is the Sabbath to be observed on Saturday or Sunday? And does Sabbath observance involve merely attending church on either Saturday or Sunday, or does it involve keeping the Sabbath holy from sundown to sundown, and abstaining from unnecessary work and travel during this 24 hour period?

What does Jesus say about the above questions? Very little. And when He does, it is usually in response to the accusations of the legalistic Jewish leaders! It was His custom to go to the temple on the Saturday Sabbath, but He did not make the fourth commandment of the Ten Commandments one of His teachings. Jesus gives voluminous moral instruction echoing the Old Testament. But regarding the ceremonial or ritual observances of the Old Testament, He is largely silent. The Teachings of Jesus Christ are about being pure in heart and action!

In light of what I have just said, should Christians not go to church? I believe that church attendance is optional, but highly, highly recommended! I further believe that every day should be a spiritual and moral Sabbath, but not a ritual or ceremonial Sabbath! One should take time to be holy each and every day! Not just one day a week, whichever day that is!

If someone wants to worship on Saturday, this is perfectly acceptable, but they should not insist that others do so also! They should not assert that their salvation may depend on keeping the right day in the right way! If someone wants to worship on Sunday, this is perfectly acceptable also, but again, they should not insist that others do so, and that their salvation may depend on it.

No individual or organization should be dogmatic regarding church attendance and regarding a particular day for church attendance! Worship options should probably be available 7 days a week, with a higher concentration of these worship options on the weekend. This subject should never be made a test of faith! Paul writes, "One man considers one day more sacred than another; another man considers every day alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind."--Romans 14:5 NIV

The line where the secular ends and the sacred begins should become increasingly blurred! Secular and sacred should eventually become one and the same thing! Paul says to pray without ceasing! Dr. Albert Schweitzer wrote extensively about his concept, Reverence for Life! We should have reverence for life, both physical and spiritual, 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, 52 weeks a year, for our whole lives! Our communion and cooperation with the Divine and the human should have no beginning or ending!