Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust

Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
http://www.holocaustdenialvideos.com/

NOTE; THIS WAS WRITTEN BY Devaraj Ishaya not ME

Before you read the passage below,
copied from Website Link,
please take a moment and set aside all you have heard
about the holocaust
and look at the information with fresh eyes.

I also suggest, that every time you read the words "holocaust is a hoax", replace it with "holocaust facts were distorted".

you ALSO might want to read this first:

This remind me of the link in TruthWillSetUFree's thread about Rothschild bloodline.
http://pakalert.wordpress.com/2009/1...-reading-this/

*then come back, and, READ FROM HERE -- THANK YOU --AGAIN NOT MY WORDS BELOW in THIS POST

NOTE; THESE ARE NOT MY WORDS BELOW HERE:



I have heard about people claiming that the holocaust was a hoax,
but I never new why...
because the media does not give you all the information,
only the key words to trigger and influence the reaction
to get the desired results.

What are those results. Read the manifesto below.


Also take a moment and check out
What is the big deal about the Holocaust?
which refers to the page this manifesto was copied from.



__________________________________________________ _____



Manifesto

This website advocates kindness and good vibes toward all Jewish people. We like black people and people of all races, nationalities, religions; and we like gay people. We feel that it was Hitler's belief in military solutions that was primarily responsible for the European disaster that was World War II. We just believe the holocaust is a hoax. We are anti-militarists first, and holocaust deniers second. Today it is the holocaust myth that props up militarism. Here's why:

Of the many terrible things about World War II,
the single worst thing wasn't the holocaust,
because that's a hoax.

The worst thing was German soldiers fighting Soviet soldiers because millions of young men on both sides died. That was the single worst thing out of many terrible things. And the lesson from that is militarism and military solutions are always a disaster. That lesson is obscured when the worst thing about World War II is considered to be the holocaust because then the opposite conclusion is drawn: militarism seems good. Righteous militarism to defeat Hitler. Fighting intolerance. Americans largely see World War II as the "good fight" against Evil. The holocaust myth props up that assertion and obscures the truth: World War II was a European disaster.

The holocaust myth gives a "fighting for tolerance" theme to World War II, and the "fighting for tolerance" theme continues to justify military aggression up to recent times: it was used to justify the US invasion of Serbia/Kosovo, Afghanistan and Iraq. The wrong conclusions about World War II based on the false information that is the holocaust, reverberate into militaristic solutions creating disasters today.

Because the holocaust myth was never exposed, the masses never lost their gullibility and are easily manipulated for pro-war purposes. Case in point: before the 2003 invasion of Iraq, most Americans believed Saddam Hussein had killed millions of his own people. They also believed he had weapons of mass destruction.

These videos try to break the myth down into understandable pieces, camp by camp, detail by detail.

The holocaust myth holds up militarism. It's time for the West to move past both.

__________________________________________________ __________________________


One more thing folks,
the reason I am passing this around is not to create a conflict
with anyone's beliefs,
but to show how easy it is to be manipulated to believe
the propaganda we are fed, to justify more atrocities.


Question Authority?


I am truly sorry if I have offended anyone.

Know that I too have lost parts of my family heritage
to the Holocaust.


Let Truth Prevail!

We are heading towards Unity Consciousness. Lies can not exist when we all know we are One.

Peace and Blessings
Devaraj Ishaya

NOTE; THE ABOVE WAS WRITTEN BY

Devaraj Ishaya

************************************************** *****
on a side note, from the eXchanger

my family fled prior to this occurring,
in the mid 1800's
i really want to let this sink in, before, i make my response

this is definitely an eye opener


http://www.holocaustdenialvideos.com/
Last edited by THE eXchanger; 12-19-2009 at 06:23 AM.

02-23-2009, 09:46 PM #2
oldpaganfreak
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
i can't access videos, so these are lost to me.
i certainly believe the holocast has been distorted. for one thing, it was not just jews that were taken to camps. queers, communists, gypsies, political dossodents, mentally and physically handicapped people, were also taken.
very rarely are the others even mentioned. this is also a travesty.
i would really like to know the truth.

02-23-2009, 10:02 PM #3
Machinamentum
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
I found some good videos on that same topic, haven't seen them all but the little I did see, talks about the MK-Ultra and holocaust.

Adam Curtis:

Adam Curtis- The Living Dead 1/3: On the Desperate Edge of Now

You Have Used Me As Fish Long Enough

The Attic

02-23-2009, 11:53 PM #4
Avid
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Thank you for eXchanging your positive views.
I tried with my post
http://www.projectavalon.net/forum/s...ad.php?t=11463
however, this just shows that we are being programmed.
I have been watching the freedom of thought and speech being eroded in Canada - where I used to live. In the 1970's it was a wonderful place, multi-cultural and multi-lingual.
Now look what's happening:
http://www.radicalpress.com/?p=924

This denial of freedom of views deprives us of our future, our cohabitational dialogue, our appreciation of our history and very diverse cultures. If we can put it all in perspective we can come to terms and move on. MOVE ON!
The poor disillusioned brainwashed people are innocently preventing us from moving forward, guided by those who have ulterior motives such as greed and power.
I remember a wife of a famous Illuminati stating before she died:
"If my sons want war - there will be wars". I can't find a link at the moment, but we are all being manipulated, 'divide and rule' is in action as we watch the news daily.
Thank you Susan

02-25-2009, 09:11 PM #5
EpiphaMe
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
eXchanger wrote: ..."because the media does not give you all the information, only the key words to trigger and influence the reaction to get the desired results."

My point here is how unnecessary it is to watch the videos or read this n that about it, whether it's 'holocaust distorted' or ' hoax '...
fact is WAR ensued, it happened, is still happening.

I remember in the early 70's proclaiming that WAR is NOT an option anymore... PERIOD!... at the same time, individually wrapped American (plastic) cheese slices go on the market shelves.. know what I mean? and it's BOUGHT!!

War is to not be tolerated... PERIOD! When you read those words, notice your reaction! More than likely the thought creeps in that "those others" need to be blasted off the planet....we can't wait for them to be updated to the 21st century..... THEN we can start anew (kind of mentality)... as we deem ourselves so "up on it"...

that is the point yes??? any more discussion needed?

Where is the solution... HOW do we get us all together to overthrow this mentality??? Even those websites/authors/whistleblowers can't agree with what to do..

How DO we make an impact with our numbers... because I still think that numbers, large numbers of people CAN make a difference.... physically!!!! Not just meditating together en masse!

I've had a sort of bad day... thank you for listening to my little rant, however imposed it may be.

02-25-2009, 09:59 PM #6
orthodoxymoron
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Is there a War and Atrocity Museum anywhere in the world? How many Holocaust Museums are there? What percentage of the total WWII deaths were holocaust fatalities? War needs to stop now! It is corrupt as hell. Why do they sugar coat it with uniforms, parades, ceremonies, speeches, etc, etc? Why do the rich get richer with war...while the poor get maimed and killed? We don't accidentally stumble into war. It is planned with cold, calculating precision many years ahead of the actual war. What are they planning for us right at this very moment? The smoking gun may be a mushroom cloud. In WWII...the smoking gun was TWO mushroom clouds. As an afterthought...there is a Hitler speech on January 30, 1939, where he attacks the global financial system as being responsible for both world war two and world war one! Was Hitler with or against the international financiers? The historical financing of BOTH sides in wars by the international bankers is utterly chilling. What about the alleged malevolent alien interaction with Hitler? Was this the Reptillians, Greys, Gizeh Intelligence...or are they all the same group? And what about the Nazi/Vatican collaboration prior to, and during, WWII? What about the Rat-Lines? What about Project Paperclip? OK...I've got to go back to my little dream-world. It's such a nice safe place.
Last edited by orthodoxymoron; 02-26-2009 at 04:58 AM.

02-25-2009, 10:25 PM #7
Avid
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by orthodoxymoron
Is there a War and Atrocity Museum anywhere in the world? How many Holocaust Museums are there? What percentage of the total WWII deaths were holocaust fatalities? War needs to stop now! It is corrupt as hell. Why do they sugar coat it with uniforms, parades, ceremonies, speeches, etc, etc? Why do the rich get richer with war...while the poor get maimed and killed? We don't accidentally stumble into war. It is planned with cold, calculating precision many years ahead of the actual war. What are they planning for us right at this very moment? The smoking may be a mushroom cloud. In WWII...the smoking gun was TWO mushroom clouds.
The PTB cannot survive without total control and market manipulation, they need to make war to refinance themselves (Haliburton et al), meanwhile the 'bailout' is 'payoff' money in reality - what they expected to profit by, they want their cut and be damned to the folk who have to pay to the completely fraudulent (owned by the PTB) 'Fed' - who print the money who make folk beholden... 'Fed' - who print the money who make folk beholden... 'Fed' - who print the money who make folk beholden et al....
WAKE UP!!!!
The so-called 'Fed' is a federal as FedEx - it's a brand - a business, privately owned by shareholders - you don't owe them a cent - their taxes are illegal.
Aaron Russo died to make the world aware.
The rot we can find out now via the internet is mindblowing, we can't rely on single sources - this is why we are HERE!

02-26-2009, 01:04 AM #8
Humble Janitor
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
I simply choose not to question the Holocaust.

If it did not happen, then why is there proof that it did?

02-26-2009, 02:08 AM #9
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by eXchanger
http://<br /> Peace and Blessings <b...j Ishaya
PLEASE NOTE
that Devaraj Ishaya - wrote it

NOT the exchanger

the eXchanger said:

where i said,

""on a side note, from the eXchanger

my family fled prior to this occurring,
in the mid 1800's
i really want to let this sink in, before, i make my response

this is definitely an eye opener " --

to this point,

that is ALL i said, on this topic

i clearly quoted, who said what, above !!!

love/susan
Last edited by THE eXchanger; 02-26-2009 at 02:11 AM.

02-26-2009, 03:12 AM #10
Dr MAG
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by eXchanger
http://www.holocaustdenialvideos.com/


Before you read the passage below,
copied from Website Link,
please take a moment and set aside all you have heard
about the holocaust
and look at the information with fresh eyes.

I also suggest, that every time you read the words "holocaust is a hoax", replace it with "holocaust facts were distorted".

I have heard about people claiming that the holocaust was a hoax,
but I never new why...
because the media does not give you all the information,
only the key words to trigger and influence the reaction
to get the desired results.

this is definitely an eye opener

http://www.holocaustdenialvideos.com/


eXchanger thank you for the guts to put this up. The fact you have to preface your post with a "Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust" as a caveat should speak to everyone's minds just how far down the slippery-slide into a black hole we have gone as far as seeking undivided, unbiased truth goes. That we have to approach some questions as if we are treading on the holiest ground and have to be afraid if we should shift even one atom of dust on the settled floor of political and media agreement, says a great deal about the rules of entrainment in this new religion we are certainly under.

I just want to make a comment on a PRIMAL reason why the very act of questioning the holocaust can feel so uncomfortable. All of us molded into the Western mind-space container, cookie-cutter shaped, generally do feel intense squeamishness when trying to approach this question, let alone ask it, openly. Don't give up if you feel like that. Plenty will exploit your uncertainty. Just press on into the unknown, into the black space of your own internal empty surrounds, and begin the questioniing.

PRIMAL reason Westerners feel so uncomfortable to ask really taboo questions is not just because our MINDS and mentalities have been molded (yes, they sure are, through a well-oiled machinery of distortion, also called psyops, prevalent through the everyday media as well as the usually associated extreme MK-Ultra type of programming). No, it is because the most important work, the nth-degree work to assure docile subjects, was accomplished on the PSYCHE. Modern psychology does not deal with the psyche.

So when we gain courage to try and look the monster of disinformation in the face, we are confronted by our own inner distortions and weakness, and it hurts.
People will kill rather than feel a squirming worm under the scrutiny of their own need to awaken, perhaps brought home to them by a sudden rivetingly important question from someone else.
And here we have one of the those questions.

The question of the veracity and truth of the holocaust.

Ater looking at the videos on eXchanger's link above to try and get some clarity, and rewire neurons, there is also David Bradley Smith, fulfilling a motivated publishing role in France. He was forced to leave the US. His site is THE FRENCH CONNECTION. Many audio interviews here:
http://www.iamthewitness.com and on
http://www.iamthewitness.com/books
you can download book pdfs of prominent individuals who have spoken out, for example, Israel Shahak and Benjamin Freedman.

+++++++++++
It is important to pursue the truth.

02-26-2009, 07:05 AM #11
KathyT
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by eXchanger

http://www.holocaustdenialvideos.com/
Exchanger,
Thank you very much for posting it, it is very interesting to read. It brings back a memory I have of 35 years ago... my parents having an argument with one of their friends, this friend was saying the holocaust was a lie. I was rather young, and though I don't remember who the friend was, or why they were saying this, I do remember the tone and conviction of the person speaking. Never thought I'd see the detail as is presented on that link. Without you bringing it to us, we might not have the opportunity to review it.
Thanks again!

02-26-2009, 08:57 AM #12
Noela
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Bishop Williamson who believes the generally
reported "facts" of the holocaust have been
distorted is now in hiding in Britain, having
been expelled from Venuzuela for stating
his beliefs.

On national television last night I saw
David Irving, historian, who went to
jail for having similar beliefs.

It seems strange to me, that in countries
that believe in free speech someone can
be jailed for giving a view that is
contrary to the "norm". I,m not sure
what the charge was, but certainly
the judge labelled him "racist" and
commentators assert that to hold
such views means the person is
anti-semitic - but surely, the one
does not follow from the other.

02-26-2009, 09:15 AM #13
burgundia
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldpaganfreak
i can't access videos, so these are lost to me.
i certainly believe the holocast has been distorted. for one thing, it was not just jews that were taken to camps. queers, communists, gypsies, political dossodents, mentally and physically handicapped people, were also taken.
very rarely are the others even mentioned. this is also a travesty.
i would really like to know the truth.
You are right that it was distorted. My friend's father was a prisoner in Auschwitz. The first people taken there were Polish people. everybody thinks that only Jews died there. The total number of 6 billion is probably exaggerated , divide it by 2 to get a more probable one.
let's not forget who financed the war machine.

02-26-2009, 02:05 PM #14
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
there is much more, than just that holocaust

north america suffered one pre-1490

however, we don't read about that one !!!

(and, it was likely 60,000,000) yup 60 million

there were many who feld france
in approx 1864

from strassbourg, and, alsase-lorraine, a part of france
(celtic people)

and, also those who feld the green capital of germany
erdurf (?) also germanic celtics

anymore, more on this - in a bit

love/susan

02-26-2009, 06:02 PM #15
KathyT
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noela
On national television last night I saw David Irving, historian, who went to
jail for having similar beliefs.
I thought this would be odd it it were in America, so I looked up David Irving on Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Irving

For clarification, Wikipedia says:
"David John Cawdell Irving (born 24 March 1938) is a British writer[1] specializing in the military history of World War II. His interpretations of the Third Reich have proved highly controversial due to allegations of undue sympathy for the Third Reich and antisemitism, and because of his involvement in the Holocaust denial movement. He is the author of 30 books, including The Destruction of Dresden (1963), Hitler's War (1977), Uprising! (1981), Churchill's War (1987), and Goebbels — Mastermind of the Third Reich (1996).

Irving's reputation as an historian was widely discredited[2] after he brought an unsuccessful libel case against American historian Deborah Lipstadt and Penguin Books in 1996. During the trial, an English court found that Irving was an "active Holocaust denier," as well as an antisemite and racist, and that he "associates with right-wing extremists who promote neo-Nazism."[3] The judge also ruled that Irving had "for his own ideological reasons persistently and deliberately misrepresented and manipulated historical evidence."[3][4]

On a visit to Austria, Irving was apprehended, tried and convicted of "glorifying and identifying with the German Nazi Party", which is a crime in Austria under the Verbotsgesetz law. He served a prison sentence from February to December 2006 on the charges."

03-01-2009, 07:30 PM #16
cantaloupe
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Let's not forget that the Japanese in China killed what is estimated to be double the number of Jews that were purportedly killed by the Nazis. The holocaust(s) happened. They have always happened and they continue to this day. I don't doubt that the numbers have been exaggerated to capitalize on the appropriate outrage / emotional charge created by such an occurrence, or that what has since been perpetrated has less to do with the original atrocity and is more about the agenda of a small group that is now practicing the same sort of policy against yet another group. Maybe it should be termed holocaust reappraisal so that we can look at it without dissing the Jews or what happened to them and thereby finally learn from it. Never again has turned out to be, in reality, ever again.

03-02-2009, 01:37 AM #17
Antonia
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Wow Suzan... certianly a brave and interesting post.
I couldn't download these video's I tried and tried... I don't have the right soft ware... but ... I have many members of my family on my German/Hungarian mothers side who died in Auschwitz and Belson... My aunt on my fathers side was an ambulance driver for the British. She was one of the first people who drove in to a concentration camp with her ambulance when they were liberated...She saw first hand what lay behind the wire!!

I don't know exactly how many gypsies, homosexuals, disedents, catholics and Jews, were actually killed in these camps as well as the jews who starved to death in the ghetto but exact numbers are not important to me...

What matters is that there was a deliberate plan to kill people. like in Stalins Russia... like in Cambodia with the Kumer Rouge, like in America with the Red Indians, like in the Inquisition in the middle ages .... like today with Palastinians being slaughterd by the Isreali's.... It all happened and it's the deliberate intent that shocks me not the debate about statistics....

These people who died were all sacrifices to the lower astral entities who controle the Dark Kabal....

Many claim that the millions of Jews who died in the Holocaust were Khazarian or Ashkenazi jews who were Easten European and whom many elitest and rightwing 'Hebrew' jews and Zionists would not consider properly Jewish as they were descendid from converts and not the direct lines of those present on the mountain when Moses was given the ten commandments...

Some people argue that the deeply Zionist Jews or the Illumanati Jewish families would not give a rats XXX how many of these not so Hebrew Jews were killed in the Holocaust.... infact would have been happy to see them die as this could then be used as propaganda to help overthrow and murder Palastinians and creat a Zionist IsreaL..

I'm not sure if this was mentioned in any of the videos as I haven't seen them
but to deny that a very very large numbers of innocent men women and children were slaughterd is wrong... they were... Do the video's say this??? Innocent people are still being slaughterd today...in places like Gaza, Darfur and the Congo.

I would like to use this moment to send love and healing to all souls of all people who have suffered persicution and discrimination and some very sacred and deep white golden light to the souls of those who have died through war and genocide... and deep rays of magenta/violet compassion to the heart's of those who have done or are doing the killing. STOP.... FEEL THE LOVE ....AND MOVE BACK IN TO THE LIGHT....

Thank you Suzan...
Last edited by Antonia; 03-02-2009 at 01:39 AM.

03-02-2009, 04:13 AM #18
clarkkent
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
dont know how they'd fake all the starving and dead bodies, not to mention the countless survivors with horror stories, maybe the numbers were exaggerated but i doubt the genocide (of jews) was.

what would be the point of making up the holocaust is? who benefits? this seems to be in the "rense" department of ultra paranoid zionist conspiracies - remember there are conservative right wing conspiracy theorists and religious fundamentalist conspiracy theorists. i wont be surprised if hear were all mind controlled to believe that native americans werent here before us or that the slave trade was a hoax and black people swam over by themselves because they wanted to make money on farms. im all for the idea that much of history as taught to us is distorted or an outright lie, but its easy to go to far and believe that everything you know is some massive mind control experiment they are beaming from space.

people are quick to believe off the wall or scary info no matter how nuts it is. remember in october when everyone thought FEMA was going to come nab people in the night just for going to websites like this?


heres some gross footage out of the mountain of evidence of the holocaust.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...olocaust&hl=en

03-02-2009, 07:12 AM #19
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
i think the main point here
is that it was more than just the jews,
it was many people -- NOT just the jews
but, many different types of people

it is also likely a whole lot more people
than, we were ever told, it was

when st. patrick, got rid of snakes in ireland

they were NOT the variety that had no legs / and, no arms

they were people -- people who would NOT join the church

in ireland don't the people still fight ?
& isn't it all about religious differences ?

when the churches;
put water on you, in their rituals
it is to stop your real snake from rising

03-02-2009, 07:33 AM #20
oldpaganfreak
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by eXchanger

when st. patrick, got rid of snakes in ireland

they were NOT the variety that had no legs / and, no arms

they were people -- people who would NOT join the church
they were the druids. st patrick was also a book burner. he burned hundreds of books. what was lost of irish history, lore and culture, no one will ever know.

03-09-2009, 05:05 AM #21
sun-toon´
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by Antonia
What matters is that there was a deliberate plan to kill people. like in Stalins Russia... like in Cambodia with the Kumer Rouge, like in America with the Red Indians, like in the Inquisition in the middle ages .... like today with Palastinians being slaughterd by the Isreali's.... It all happened and it's the deliberate intent that shocks me not the debate about statistics....

These people who died were all sacrifices to the lower astral entities who controle the Dark Kabal....

Some people argue that the deeply Zionist Jews or the Illumanati Jewish families would not give a rats XXX how many of these not so Hebrew Jews were killed in the Holocaust.... infact would have been happy to see them die as this could then be used as propaganda to help overthrow and murder Palastinians and creat a Zionist IsreaL..

I'm not sure if this was mentioned in any of the videos as I haven't seen them
but to deny that a very very large numbers of innocent men women and children were slaughterd is wrong... they were... Do the video's say this??? Innocent people are still being slaughterd today...in places like Gaza, Darfur and the Congo.
I have to agree with your appraisal Antonia. It doesn't matter how many died, what matters is that they were killed deliberately, and ritualistically in order to feed parasites. It also doesn't matter what other holocausts occurred or whether they were worse. From my understanding 160 million humans have been killed in the last century from wars and genocidal events.

I used to ignore everything that had to do with the holocaust. I understood that it was horrible, but it was nothing I did, would do, or wanted attached to my experience. Then a few months ago I came across a picture on the web of a group of Ukrainian women standing naked in a field...shivering, their clothes strewn across the ground. They were old and young, pregnant, holding babies and children. The next picture shows them laying dead...maybe a hundred women, with a soldier shooting at one who was still alive.

I was transported into Jung's "imagination for evil". If you don't believe it was a holocaust, try this: Imagine what kind of being would humiliate, torture with fear, and murder moms holding babies. As I read stories about the mobile killing units, it was clear that these were occultist ritual mass murders. They didn't just shoot people in the streets, they created a process, or ritual...they raised up the level of fear in the victims to the highest degree they could, then killed whole families together as if they were lower forms of life than animals.

I found it a painfully enlightening experience. Now, it doesn't matter to me if it was 6 million or 600,000 or 60,000, I know these atrocities went on and that it is no hoax. This information is easy enough to find, and there's no reason to disbelieve it. When I was a kid I used to go to a barber who was from Eastern Europe. He had his Nazi prison camp ID tattooed on his arm. There was no faking that either, it was the reality of his life.

I'm saying all this to lay out my feelings so it will be clear that I'm sickened by all of it and in no way a denier. But, this being said, there have been holocausts and genocide all over the planet. Every race and creed has been involved, most on both sides. What makes the Nazi/Jewish holocaust so special is the marketing of it by Zionist interests. The ways they've used it to justify the establishment of Israel and the way that occurred, how they've stifled freedom of speech and debate...to the point of jailing researchers, the way that prison camp images are brought up again and again in order to bring sympathy to Zionist maneuverings and distract from Israeli atrocities is...well it's pretty amazing that they've pulled it off so well.
Now, in the past couple months I've seen pictures of a hundred dead children from Gaza. I've heard it justified with the "threat to our people" "never again" mantra. If there's much of a difference you could have fooled me.

So it becomes like the debate about evolution. There may be a hundred possibilities for where life came from and how humans came into being, but the debate is focused on extremists who believe their god created the Earth 5,000 years ago, and those who think life popped into existence out of random chance. This is not an accident. If more points of view were allowed, the chance that reality might be one of them could increase to the point of becoming dangerous to the global paradigm.
The more these holocaust deniers spew, the more it becomes an issue of did/didn't instead of a focus upon the meaning of the event. This is an intentionally created distraction. We should be studying the type of mind which would commit these atrocities, trying to understand who and what that is, where it is now and how do we confront it as it rears it's head; as it always does again and again...not counting bodies or focusing our compassion on a single ethnic group.

eXchanger- Thanks for taking the risk to put up this thread. This issue begs for proper illumination.
Last edited by sun-toon´; 03-09-2009 at 02:59 PM.

12-18-2009, 05:50 AM #22
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldpaganfreak
they were the druids. st patrick was also a book burner. he burned hundreds of books. what was lost of irish history, lore and culture, no one will ever know.
some of us, do remember

since, i don't want to litter up this thread - with pure info

see our other thread !!! The earth history one

http://www.projectavalon.net/forum/s...d=1#post203779
Last edited by THE eXchanger; 12-18-2009 at 06:34 AM.

12-18-2009, 08:32 AM #23
Wisdom
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
There is lot of talk about the holocaust and some about other atrocities but, what about the atrocities of the: Atlantic Slave Trade, the apartheid in South Africa, Genocide in Darfur, Rwanda, and all (except one) the other country's in Africa who has gone through a civil war ( Nigeria is the only country that did not go through a civil war).

Not to mention the countless people that had died and are dying from A.I.D.S and other artificial diseases.


I'm upset that ( what I call the African Holocaust) is to me ignored and not even mentioned. If you count the number of black people that have died from racism of any sort since the early 1600s all the way up to the present. The number may be between 250 million to 1.3 billion+ people.

And the fact that the Natives of the west were nearly wiped out from this B.S .

Not to mention the fact that a lot of the Jews themselves treated Africans and African americans like ****. To me it's like,{ o.k you went through the same racist **** we went through BUT, you still hate me because of my skin color, that goes for some Japanese, Korean, Chinese, Philippines, Arabs and even gays. Who have all gone through degrading experiences and yet when they look at the black person, they hate him/her for no reason.}

For example, the Koreans, Japanese, and Philipinos have witnessed first hand Caucasian hatred towards blacks and instead of not following the hatred, they go right into it.

I'm NOT saying everybody is that way but, there is a lot of the bullied turning into the bullies. Point is, WHAT makes the holocaust so devastating, WHY was the bombing of Hiroshima so tragic that America felt a such great remorse and offered to help rebuild them, and not Africans.


What did we get when we were set free, it was supposed to be 40 acres and a mule but a lot of them did not even get that. Was are home continent, who for a long time was greatly mistreated and to some degree still is, ever receive 1 trillion dollars to rebuild, NO!!!, we got aids, because American military scientist wanted to test a bioweapon to stop the Russians,I'm guessing they said " we'll just test it on these people, their lives mean nothing". Did they offer to cure the virus, no. Not to mention it spread all over the world.

You guys know that they should have been cured that disease a long time ago. But the PTB want to make an excuse that there's no funding, that's because their not funding it.


My main point is that, we should notice everybody and look into all holocausts in the world. Not trying to offend anybody, just telling it like it is.

*rant over*, Peace.

12-18-2009, 04:08 PM #24
silverlightning
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
This is the ego Chögyam Trungpa Rinpoche talked about. It shows it self on the individual plane as well as the collective. All social systems, religions, different political movements are collective expressions of ego. Advanced thought systems designed to protect against suffering and pains of whatever kind; generated out of some kind of fear.

This armour built and rebuilt for centuries, easily generates oppositions, victims, violence, search for power, an endless chain reaction.

One of Trungpa's challenging exercises was daring to feel other peoples pain, taking it in, without defence or armour, and change it to something else. I think the monks who practised this kind of spiritual alchemy called it Tung Len, and perceived themselves as a kind of spiritual warrior.

It's a very long time since WW2, slave-trade, the pain persisting is old, but how it acts upon every individual is very much in the here and know. To transform this pain involves daring to meet your own thoughts, feelings, actions with honesty and directness as well as others. If you ever try this approach do it with some what who know it; opening your heart can be a very overwhelming experience.

12-18-2009, 04:18 PM #25
theseeker64
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Join Date: Nov 2009
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Bump...thank you for bringing this to the surface. I truly believe that the Bablyonian Talmud is the cornerstone of the NWO. Please read the link below:

http://www.sherryshriner.com/sherry/talmud-nwo.htm

We need to keep an open mind and consider all possibilities.

theseeker64
Avalon Senior Member



Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 8
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wisdom
There is lot of talk about the holocaust and some about other atrocities but, what about the atrocities of the: Atlantic Slave Trade, the apartheid in South Africa, Genocide in Darfur, Rwanda, and all (except one) the other country's in Africa who has gone through a civil war ( Nigeria is the only country that did not go through a civil war).

Not to mention the countless people that had died and are dying from A.I.D.S and other artificial diseases.


I'm upset that ( what I call the African Holocaust) is to me ignored and not even mentioned. If you count the number of black people that have died from racism of any sort since the early 1600s all the way up to the present. The number may be between 250 million to 1.3 billion+ people.

And the fact that the Natives of the west were nearly wiped out from this B.S .

Not to mention the fact that a lot of the Jews themselves treated Africans and African americans like ****. To me it's like,{ o.k you went through the same racist **** we went through BUT, you still hate me because of my skin color, that goes for some Japanese, Korean, Chinese, Philippines, Arabs and even gays. Who have all gone through degrading experiences and yet when they look at the black person, they hate him/her for no reason.}

For example, the Koreans, Japanese, and Philipinos have witnessed first hand Caucasian hatred towards blacks and instead of not following the hatred, they go right into it.

I'm NOT saying everybody is that way but, there is a lot of the bullied turning into the bullies. Point is, WHAT makes the holocaust so devastating, WHY was the bombing of Hiroshima so tragic that America felt a such great remorse and offered to help rebuild them, and not Africans.


What did we get when we were set free, it was supposed to be 40 acres and a mule but a lot of them did not even get that. Was are home continent, who for a long time was greatly mistreated and to some degree still is, ever receive 1 trillion dollars to rebuild, NO!!!, we got aids, because American military scientist wanted to test a bioweapon to stop the Russians,I'm guessing they said " we'll just test it on these people, their lives mean nothing". Did they offer to cure the virus, no. Not to mention it spread all over the world.

You guys know that they should have been cured that disease a long time ago. But the PTB want to make an excuse that there's no funding, that's because their not funding it.


My main point is that, we should notice everybody and look into all holocausts in the world. Not trying to offend anybody, just telling it like it is.

*rant over*, Peace.
You seem to have alot of resentment towards "Caucaision" people or is it just people with white skin? Anyway, Jews played a large part in the slave trade.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M0hQ_...EA37B&index=10

12-18-2009, 05:22 PM #27
theseeker64
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Join Date: Nov 2009
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noela
Bishop Williamson who believes the generally
reported "facts" of the holocaust have been
distorted is now in hiding in Britain, having
been expelled from Venuzuela for stating
his beliefs.

On national television last night I saw
David Irving, historian, who went to
jail for having similar beliefs.

It seems strange to me, that in countries
that believe in free speech someone can
be jailed for giving a view that is
contrary to the "norm". I,m not sure
what the charge was, but certainly
the judge labelled him "racist" and
commentators assert that to hold
such views means the person is
anti-semitic - but surely, the one
does not follow from the other.
Your right in some countries people are going to prison for questioning the holocaust. There is something wrong with that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M0hQ_...EA37B&index=10

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TVU3I...eature=related

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FqR0S...eature=related

12-18-2009, 05:30 PM #28
Céline
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Any attack on Humans...should concern all of us.

Am i surprised to hear that the facts are distorted? no...only surprised that some are still surprised....

History is written by the victors..afterall.

12-18-2009, 05:34 PM #29
pineal-pilot-in merkabah
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by Humble Janitor
I simply choose not to question the Holocaust.

If it did not happen, then why is there proof that it did?
It did, i choose not to investigate deeply because its a subject that doesn matter much to me. 60 million christians were killed in communist soviet block , thats a holocaust. The usa/nato slaughter of iraqis is another holocaust. Africa is another world bank /imf holocaust. there are lots so why pick that one out specifically? perhaps because its convinient for the zionist bankers and the like to work unhindered by sheilding themselves and their activitis using thier state of israhell to commit world wide terror ect. lots of people were killed at the same time jews, christians , muslims, gays, ect ect.

the figures have been overblown and were continually revised down over a period. death is death though no matter how many were lost.

12-18-2009, 06:09 PM #30
theseeker64
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Join Date: Nov 2009
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by Humble Janitor
I simply choose not to question the Holocaust.

If it did not happen, then why is there proof that it did?
WAKE UP!! Because the Jews use the holocaust as leverage to control the finanances. What do you think? Who do you think owns the Federal Reserve? Who do you think owns the media? Do your research.

I am not talking about Torah Jews. I am talking about the Jews that use the Talmud as an excuse to use us gentiles like their slaves.

12-18-2009, 06:34 PM #31
Peace of mind
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
As long as official proof of civilization remains hazy and hidden in the confines of elite order…there is nothing but His-Story to talk about. But, do wonder why it is a secret and who is to gain from it being a secret.
It’s a fact that religious scriptures have been revised over and over. It’s no secret that original text and artifacts have been destroyed, looted and kept out of sight for various reasons. Much of what we know is nothing but fabrications or straight out lies. Everything taught to us in these controlled learning institutions (schools) is meant for control. Scientist is still trying to figure out the correct way to do mathematics and physics. They have admitted numerous times that math and science as we know it will be rewritten in the new future.

Honestly, I think most people can’t handle the truth and will look for alternative stories to satisfy their egos and perceptions. Humans were meant to live in peace not chaos. I’m amazed that tribes and Amish people are still thriving while the world is in chaos around them. Why is modern day society not living in peace? Who’s responsible for the world being the way it is today? I’m sure we all know the answer.

I often wonder what’s really important to people? Do they want to uplift or do they want to remain as part of the problem? Hmmm…around and around we go...

You want a fact? Here’s one…

Right now, we all have the opportunity to make true history, history we can all be proud of and find inspiring.

Peace

12-18-2009, 07:38 PM #32
mntruthseeker
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Absolutely it was more than just jews were killed. There were many different nationalities and many of them happened after the so called war was ended. Russians, Polish, Romanians etc

What do you think happened in Viet Nam ? Iraq and any other place they decided

Most of the people died of a flu like symptom or starvation from some type of desease. Exactly what they want to do here. In fact they never stopped this insanity

I seen videos similiar to Viet Nam and there they had the cage like cells right in the towns loaded with the people

It is very sad and my heart goes out to all of them and we must know the truth in order NOT to let it continue to happen

I'm so tired of people that say, they do not want to know, its not important or of course it happened.

The Jewish -people have been profiting from this since it happened. Many have gotten rich.

My heart goes out to them also because they believe the lies that were told. When it turns back unto them and the reality slaps them in the face they will want nothing more than to stop the lies. Right now the Jewish feel it is their given rights to take what they can (my husband tries to assure me that possibly it was due to their faith only) All and all it was genocide same as now


NOW, I have nothing against the Jewish people..........I'm not racist in any way as its not who I am. I dont personally think the Jewish people are profiting from all this but only TPTBs as they do with all wars


People who can watch this and not catch the whole picture of this happening all over the world as we speak are really missing out.

In so many of our 3rd world Countries this sort of evilness continues today. Its senseless

So if you think this is not real, think again.......Its very important that the truth is known.

I have a hard time knowing all of this, as I have for the last 5 years with such a pain in my heart, believing that some who will watch these videos or read some of the other stories out there, can deny its authencity.

It was not just Jews, It was not just in Germany..................and TPTBs are getting filty rich off these wars. In one way or another we are their profits

So many in my family think that its not important and they are so wrong

12-18-2009, 07:47 PM #33
joe2288
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Posts: 652
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
I agree with you eXchanger, The holocaust my have indeed been distorted like

so many other things are. It's interesting to note as well, had the Europeans

Not colonized america we'd have an entire different civilization here, both are

tragedies.

12-19-2009, 12:55 AM #34
mkspllmn
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Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 196
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
In our quest to open our minds and free our spirits we have all undergone many psycological changes. One of the most difficult is to stand away from the comfort of "knowing what we know". This has been the second most difficult part of my jurney. ( the first has been facing myself).

Yes. we have been told many things that are not true by the people we want to trust the most, our leaders. For what do we do when our leaders turn against us?

A brave post by eXchanger and in the right spirit. Its not about Jews, its about truth. What else have they told us that is not true?

Thanks for the post Susan!

12-19-2009, 02:03 AM #35
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by mkspllmn
In our quest to open our minds and free our spirits we have all undergone many psycological changes. One of the most difficult is to stand away from the comfort of "knowing what we know". This has been the second most difficult part of my jurney. ( the first has been facing myself). Yes. we have been told many things that are not true by the people we want to trust the most, our leaders. For what do we do when our leaders turn against us?
A brave post by eXchanger and in the right spirit. Its not about Jews, its about truth. What else have they told us that is not true?
Thanks for the post Susan!
YOUR WORDS, are well worth repeating ...
it is, all about truth, once, we get that out there,
love prevails
(there is a little more, over on my main thread~Earth History)
which is a lot less sticky LOL

12-19-2009, 02:54 AM #36
eleni
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
I don't think it's black and white........

Growing up I have known Holocaust Jewish survivors.......and of course they have one way of looking at it.........

But my parent's in law were also in Hitler's SS and have other things to say........

12-19-2009, 03:10 AM #37
Humble Janitor
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
I still don't understand why people wish to downplay the jewish holocaust.

I'd expect that behavior out of the Iranian President or a neo-nazi but not people on Avalon.

12-19-2009, 03:12 AM #38
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by Humble Janitor
I still don't understand why people wish to downplay the jewish holocaust.

I'd expect that behavior out of the Iranian President or a neo-nazi but not people on Avalon.
when will you get it,
it wasn't just about JEWS , it was about many other people too

1/3 was jewish/the other part was 2/3 other

who do you think, controls this world ??? the natives ?

zionists-and, you know, 'real jews', do NOT consider, zionists, to be jewish

so, the big question -- what are they ???

12-19-2009, 03:26 AM #39
Humble Janitor
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
It doesn't matter what they are.

You're correct as in many people other than Jews died. However, the majority of people killed were Jewish or of Jewish descent.

12-19-2009, 03:27 AM #40
eleni
Avalon Senior Member

Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 865
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Zionist Jews do consider themselves Jewish.......many don't know how deep it leads......only the one's at the top know.......but they also work hand in hand with other's and at the top there is not the divisiveness one sees at the lower levels. It's a political game being played.

I'm not downplaying it- because I don't see how anyone can deny it happened. There were other people killed.

Also consider that some who entered the SS did not wish to do so but did it against their will.

12-19-2009, 03:28 AM #41
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Maybe, Avalon needs a special section

one, for just "healing" and, "love", and, 'warm fuzzies'

maybe, on it's own page ???

the search for truth,

'real' truth is a major component of love

it is the highest eXpression of love

if you truly understood,
what families, like my own,
who ran out of russia/poland thru france,
than, thru germany to canada to esc. prussian war 1874 approx

and, from france, to germany, and, to the usa
to avoid the prussian war

and, from germany, to usa, to canada
in the 1800's

and, from cornwall, to the usa, to canada
in 1805

and, from wales, to the usa, to canada in 1805

and, from ireland, to montreal/canada in 1900

and, from switzerland to france, and, then to germany
and, then, to usa/and, then to canada in 1813

and, one brave one, who explored canada, in the late 1700's
returned to scotland, and, even took some natives back with him

you'd likely understand, what truly went on

if you refused to align with the church~you ran/or you got killed

there were some, that escaped germany went to che rep.,
and, said, they were jews ???

i guess, they thought the jews, would be stronger,
than, the other religions

some changed last names - by reversing the order

some actually, hid, in families, carrying different sur names,
than, the ones, they were birthed too

some - actually changed their names

i can tell you that minus 30
without any central heat / or electric, etc.,
was NOT very easy ~ however, it was done

and, i know, part of my family bought a huge plot of land
only to discover, there wasn't a road to it
and, have to make roads

thus in canada, there are many places, they call
"the old hwy # X" as, when the old road was built
it didn't go straight, it went around boulders/and, streams etc,
and, in some cases, bridges needed to be built

people who live in euorpe etc.,
live in an old world

and, most never had to contend
with the elements of canada ~

some places, not far from toronto

didn't have electric / or heat - or even water inside
until the mid - to late 50's

also- the draco german blood / wanted to eliminate the elven german blood

there is a lot of history, you just don't know

This is a controversial subject - hidden holocausts !!!

There are many of them

12-19-2009, 04:02 AM #42
orthodoxymoron
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Posts: 3,093
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
I've recently become interested in Zionism vs Teutonic Zionism...with all of it's ancient and galactic connections. I think this goes very, very deep...with some very, very hard-core people at the top of each faction. There could possibly be a reptilian connection to both factions...and could involve the Deep Underground Military Bases, the Secret Space Program, the City States, and the Gods and/or Goddesses of This World...going back into Ancient Egypt, Lemuria, Atlantis, Sirius, Aldebaran, and the Pleiades. I know very little about this...and I'm really afraid to dig. I'm nervous enough as it is! I think that the political, religious, financial, and military implications of this power struggle are enormous. I also think that the collateral damage is in the scores of millions over the past 100 years...including the Holocaust Victims. A continuation of this BS could mean the end of us all. This world really, really sucks...IMHO.

Namaste
Last edited by orthodoxymoron; 12-19-2009 at 04:09 AM.

12-19-2009, 04:13 AM #43
eleni
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Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 865
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Ortho- after WWII my father in law former SS officer (never met him) was relocated to South America and went on to develop aerospace parts for NASA so he says. Is there a connection? I don't know- he has a handler that won't allow him to speak with any of his children and he moved back to South America with the handler (as my husband calls this woman and husband is not into this subject at all but thinks its odd).

I too agree about the ET connection- very deep hole......

12-19-2009, 04:31 AM #44
orthodoxymoron
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
eleni...I think there has been a lot of compartmentalization...where people are involved in all of this...but don't really know what's really going on. I also think that some people are into this so deeply that they couldn't get out if they wanted to. They may have a tiger by the tail...and they're afraid to let go. Most people don't set out to be bad or evil...but one thing leads to another. I honestly don't think that Hitler realized how bad things were going to get. I just want to see ALL of the secrecy go away...no matter how upsetting and disruptive this is. Then the people of the world will know what we are really up against...and we can move forward as a united and free humanity...and deal with whatever demons exist...in an open manner...so that evil and corruption can be minimized. That's the theory anyway. Who knows what the future will be like? Guess we'll find out, won't we?

eleni...check out everything by Joseph Farrell regarding secret Nazi technology...including their secret activities in Argentina (in cooperation with Juan Peron). Farrell is an Oxford man (patristics!)...and does excellent research. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MVo_eIg9X3Y

At this point...I'm trying to be on everyone's side...no matter how good or bad they are...or have been. Reasonable amnesty for full disclosure, full cooperation, and reasonable restitution...works for me. Sort of like the 'Year of Jubilee' in the Old Testament...a Global Reboot, if you will.

Namaste
Last edited by orthodoxymoron; 12-19-2009 at 05:00 AM.

12-19-2009, 04:46 AM #45
mkspllmn
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Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 196
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by Humble Janitor
I still don't understand why people wish to downplay the jewish holocaust.

I'd expect that behavior out of the Iranian President or a neo-nazi but not people on Avalon.
To me the point isnt what we are told its what we are not told. Yes we are told, in main stream media, books, magazines, and in movies that "6 mil. jews where killed at concentration camps" but where is the evidence? If you watch the Discovery channel you will see about 6 seconds of actual filmed evedence. My questions are:

1. Who is it that is writing history in this way?
2. Where is the evedence?
3. Would they have a reason to lie?

Its not about down playing anything. Its about taking a fresh look at everything we have been told from a new perspective and using cognitive reasoning instead of blind trust to tell us what to believe.

12-19-2009, 04:49 AM #46
haibane
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
First of all - my apology for responding before having thoroughly read all of the previous posts in this thread, but you have indeed opened one on a sensitive subject, eXchanger. Not that I think there's anything wrong about bringing it up, even though your post doesn't make it quite clear why you did. I happen to be one of those who might be offended (and a few years back I would have been, just by anyone even bringing this up).

I have absolutely no doubt that the issue of Holocaust has been used as a basis for many agendas, which now more or less openly contradict the message that has been originally slapped over it by propaganda. I also have no doubt that facts have always been distorted in order to support those agendas. I know that some of the bankers financing both sides of the war were Jewish, and that they never gave a flying ****. But I also know that my grandparents died in the concentration camps along with so MANY others, and I've met some of those who survived, including my mother, although she was too young to have more than a few fuzzy memories.

And yes, I now believe we should be talking about all those human beings who died there, rather than continuing the Nazi-programmed division into races/nations/denominations/sexual orientations ... But still, opening a thread by saying that the Holocaust was a hoax, without giving at least a brief summary (and a bunch of off-site links isn't one, with all due respect), even if stating it isn't your own words, like that, don't be surprised to find a few people for whom this might be a wee bit too much to swallow. No offence taken or intended.

Peace,

Haibane

12-19-2009, 04:51 AM #47
mkspllmn
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by eXchanger
This is a controversial subject - hidden holocausts !!!

There are many of them
The biggest holocaust in history was the American Indian I think.

12-19-2009, 04:54 AM #48
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by mkspllmn
The biggest holocaust in history was the American Indian I think.
it was just NOT the north american native

it was also south american too

it was also guatamala, we said, about 15 years ago, there was pyramid there-now, found

and, it was mexico too

many, many, many slaughtered !!!

and, then, anasuzi ??? (i found something yesterday; i did up for someone on that) back in 2004/or 2006

interesting stuff - NO doubt

12-19-2009, 04:56 AM #49
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by haibane
s might be a wee bit too much to swallow. No offence taken or intended.
Peace,
Haibane
As we mentioned before -- THAT WAS THE TITLE OF THE ARTICLE
WRITTEN by SOMEONE ELSE !!!

12-19-2009, 04:57 AM #50
mntruthseeker
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by Humble Janitor
It doesn't matter what they are.

You're correct as in many people other than Jews died. However, the majority of people killed were Jewish or of Jewish descent.

HJ, The problem with all of this is the manner in which it happened. They lied to all of us. Yes, they were killed, but it was not the way it was reported

Many go through life believing the Germans killed the Jews and now you even see that it was not all Jews, It was all genocide same as what they are doing in Iraq, Afghanishtan, Africa, South America, China, and so on

Its TPTB slaughtering people as if we were cattle.

People want this to end now. We are fed so many lies that its time we realize this is what it is and we need to stop it ASAP

It makes no difference who they are period. They are all human beings and do not deserve to be killed for profit.

TPTB's make their money on wars. The truth must get out

I think its time to put aside each and every division in this world. No one deserves to be treated less than how we want to be treated.

Religion, Politics, Race, Sex.............any of these divisions need to be put an end to so we can move on.

14 Chakras
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Controversial as it is, I agree that there was ET interference in WWII, personally I believe it was time traveling Greys (people who jumped into Grey bodies from 47000 years from now), more than anything, but I'm sure there we're others... was very bizarre no matter how you slice it when you look at some of those videos of Nazi Germany.

I also completely agree that Nazi's were moved to South America, Brazil specifically, en masse, including Hitler where they continued their MKUltra style experimentation etc... all part of operation paper clip right?

And sure, the guys at the top we're playing both sides like they do in every war... Why did the US give half the world to communism? You need to keep the balance in duality, always have that 'enemy' about to attack or how are you going to control the people?




Quote:
Originally Posted by eleni
Ortho- after WWII my father in law former SS officer (never met him) was relocated to South America and went on to develop aerospace parts for NASA so he says. Is there a connection? I don't know- he has a handler that won't allow him to speak with any of his children and he moved back to South America with the handler (as my husband calls this woman and husband is not into this subject at all but thinks its odd).

I too agree about the ET connection- very deep hole......

12-19-2009, 05:09 AM #52
mntruthseeker
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by 14 Chakras
Controversial as it is, I agree that there was ET interference in WWII, personally I believe it was time traveling Greys (people who jumped into Grey bodies from 47000 years from now), more than anything, but I'm sure there we're others... was very bizarre no matter how you slice it when you look at some of those videos of Nazi Germany.

I also completely agree that Nazi's were moved to South America, Brazil specifically, en masse, including Hitler where they continued their MKUltra style experimentation etc... all part of operation paper clip right?

And sure, the guys at the top we're playing both sides like they do in every war... Why did the US give half the world to communism? You need to keep the balance in duality, always have that 'enemy' about to attack or how are you going to control the people?


Well you are probally right on alot of this. Paper Clip was very real.

Did you know that a ship of people had made it out to safety from this war and the USA sent them back just to be killed ?

I know that story is true. There were many aliens involved in all of this.

I once asked myself while still in school, how could this go on for months and all those people killed and no one knew.

Pretty easy to understand now. I am not going to try and figure out what percentage was what race, as it makes no difference to me, they are human beings first and upper most thats all that should matter.

Funny thing is if someone dug hard enough they would see that the body count included those in other Countries, not just Germany. Also after the so called war ended the killings never ended.

I will never believe one word out of the mouths of the people that report any of our news again.

I think that the killing has been around as long as the aliens ..........FOREVER

12-19-2009, 05:44 AM #53
orthodoxymoron
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by 14 Chakras
Controversial as it is, I agree that there was ET interference in WWII, personally I believe it was time traveling Greys (people who jumped into Grey bodies from 47000 years from now), more than anything, but I'm sure there we're others... was very bizarre no matter how you slice it when you look at some of those videos of Nazi Germany.
I'm not buying the time traveling future human theory. How about Pleiadians who have advanced technology such that they appear to be us...47,000 years from now? The reptilian and grey phenomenon puzzles me. Do humans control them...or do they control the humans? The reptilians who seem to be causing all the trouble seem to be interdimensional. Could there be some physical reps and greys who are getting blamed for something they are not responsible for. I don't know.

Namaste

12-19-2009, 05:56 AM #54
landstander
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
i have no idea if anyone has heard of anything like this but i thought it would be interesting to throw in on the subject. would love to hear if anyone else has heard something similar. i have a brother-in-law who believes he has short glimpses into his past life where he was a nazi soldier in germany. he says that he gains from these "lost memories" that the Germans discovered reptilians disguised as humans infiltrating the powers in order to gain control. they realized that the reptilians were all jewish. So basically the Germans were the good guys in a fight to save the earth taking drastic action against a race sacrificing the non-rep jews for the "greater good".
I'm not saying I believe this at all. it's pretty outrageous, but it is interesting to tie that into the secret german research with 'ufo's, the supposed German moon base, the book "Synagogue of Satan"...

I really can't imagine the holocaust being a hoax but just like most of history we've been taught, it is highly distorted and hides important truths.

This remind me of the link in TruthWillSetUFree's thread about Rothschild bloodline.
http://pakalert.wordpress.com/2009/1...-reading-this/

loved it. thanks.

and

http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com..._bloodline.htm

long reads but very worth it for the time

12-19-2009, 06:19 AM #55
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Mabye the title of the thread should be changed to
rothchild gang

12-19-2009, 06:20 AM #56
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Hehehe - a wild wizard moderator - must of changed it

12-19-2009, 06:24 AM #57
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
landstander ~ GR8 POST

I PUT ONE OF THE LINKS TO THE TOP

MAYBE, if they see that, it will help gather interest here

i think this is one straw that might break a camels back

12-19-2009, 07:36 AM #58
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
The Secret History of Our Time: The Pope and Satan, War and the Anti-Christ, Revelations and the Last Days

http://pakalert.wordpress.com/2009/1...the-last-days/

12-19-2009, 03:22 PM #59
Kundaflower
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Hey all,

True or not, what is intresting that if one doubts official story of 6milj. jews
killed you get immediately stamp in your head that says antisemitist.

It has ruin jobs for many people when they doubt about it.
Similar dilemma is with that one famous plant which people like to smoke.

No public person can doubt offcial story without ruining his life.
That tell us how bad the situation is.
Official story have became bigger than anything.

A question ? Do you think Israel would exisit if "only" 1milj. jews were killed,
or does amount have anything to do with creation of Israel ?

Love and free speech
K

12-19-2009, 04:22 PM #60
Reader
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,...est=latestnews

12-19-2009, 04:35 PM #61
mntruthseeker
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kundaflower
Hey all,

True or not, what is intresting that if one doubts official story of 6milj. jews
killed you get immediately stamp in your head that says antisemitist.

It has ruin jobs for many people when they doubt about it.
Similar dilemma is with that one famous plant which people like to smoke.

No public person can doubt offcial story without ruining his life.
That tell us how bad the situation is.
Official story have became bigger than anything.

A question ? Do you think Israel would exisit if "only" 1milj. jews were killed,
or does amount have anything to do with creation of Israel ?

Love and free speech
K

Reminds you of the talking of aliens, doesnt it ? We are all insane and I will tell you this............I'm happily insane. I heard that more jews came forward at the end of the war to collect their due process than ever lived in Germany. That has always made me wonder, where did they all come from if they were killed. I'm not putting down Jews only TPTB's. They played both sides of their war same as the rest. They put the idea in our heads that it was all for the hatred of the jews. If that is so, why did so many other ethenic groups die along with them ? They had one motive in mind same as today..............just elliminate the people so we can get them back under our control. Too many are waking up.

People think this all began in 1941 and they are sadly mistaken. WE must know the true story to avoid it to continue happening. Its time to stop them in their tracks.

12-19-2009, 04:40 PM #62
mntruthseeker
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reader
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,...est=latestnews

I read the story and they printed it out just the way they wanted to do so.


I dont buy the story and I am pretty sure many will agree. This is the same story that has been given through out the centuries. They want us to buy into this and although many will, I dont think we all will

I see the same story and ending as in all other wars and of course it is not the ones telling it that are doing this. NO it is TPTB's running these programs and killings

12-19-2009, 06:00 PM #63
orthodoxymoron
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
OK...Gizeh Intelligence supposedly supported Hitler with technology and gold in the 1930's...and part of the deal was that the Nazis would go easy on the Jews. Gizeh Intelligence supposedly withdrew their support for the Nazis in 1941. There is an interesting interview with Al Bielek...where he talks about Hitler, the Nazis, WWII, and Hitler surviving WWII. Here's the link (for relevance...listen to 00:40:00 to 01:11:00) http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...3655896&hl=en# I'm not sure about the rest of the interview...but I really found this 31 minute section to be very interesting.

Once more, the following topics are leading me who knows where. I am enticed but fearful.

1. Zionism
2. Teutonic Zionism
3. Egypt and North Africa
4. Reptilians
5. Underground Bases
6. Secret Space Program
7. The City States (Vatican City, City of London, Washington D.C.)
8. The Pleiades
9. Aldebaran
10. Sirius
11. Lucifer
12. Rebellion in Heaven
13. War in Heaven
14. Continuation of this Rebellion and War on Earth (on Earth as it was in Heaven!?)

Could the Reptilians basically run the Universe via a Universal Church Theocracy? Did they destroy the Founders...and take over? Are Humans divided regarding how to deal with the Reptilian Problem? Are the two camps basically:

1. If you can't beat 'em...join 'em?
2. Fight with them to the death (Better Dead Than Rep)?

Could the absurdities and horrors of history (as well as the compounded lies) make sense if all of the above are taken into account...and interpreted properly?
Last edited by orthodoxymoron; 12-19-2009 at 07:12 PM.

12-19-2009, 07:12 PM #64
mkspllmn
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by landstander
i have no idea if anyone has heard of anything like this but i thought it would be interesting to throw in on the subject. would love to hear if anyone else has heard something similar. i have a brother-in-law who believes he has short glimpses into his past life where he was a nazi soldier in germany. he says that he gains from these "lost memories" that the Germans discovered reptilians disguised as humans infiltrating the powers in order to gain control. they realized that the reptilians were all jewish. So basically the Germans were the good guys in a fight to save the earth taking drastic action against a race sacrificing the non-rep jews for the "greater good".
I'm not saying I believe this at all. it's pretty outrageous, but it is interesting to tie that into the secret german research with 'ufo's, the supposed German moon base, the book "Synagogue of Satan"...

I really can't imagine the holocaust being a hoax but just like most of history we've been taught, it is highly distorted and hides important truths.

This remind me of the link in TruthWillSetUFree's thread about Rothschild bloodline.
http://pakalert.wordpress.com/2009/1...-reading-this/

loved it. thanks.

and

http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com..._bloodline.htm

long reads but very worth it for the time
Very interesting landstander! Ive often wondered that if Hitler has been demonized by history, could that mean that the oppisite is actually true.

This thread has so many good posts on it. I wish I could respond to them all!

12-19-2009, 07:18 PM #65
mkspllmn
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by eXchanger
it was just NOT the north american native

it was also south american too

it was also guatamala, we said, about 15 years ago, there was pyramid there-now, found

and, it was mexico too

many, many, many slaughtered !!!

and, then, anasuzi ??? (i found something yesterday; i did up for someone on that) back in 2004/or 2006

interesting stuff - NO doubt
Yea, what about the Roman empire and actually every war in history! 6M killed in concentration camps in Germany is a drop in the bucket. Why is it so glorified in history?

12-19-2009, 07:32 PM #66
orthodoxymoron
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by landstander
i have no idea if anyone has heard of anything like this but i thought it would be interesting to throw in on the subject. would love to hear if anyone else has heard something similar. i have a brother-in-law who believes he has short glimpses into his past life where he was a nazi soldier in germany. he says that he gains from these "lost memories" that the Germans discovered reptilians disguised as humans infiltrating the powers in order to gain control. they realized that the reptilians were all jewish. So basically the Germans were the good guys in a fight to save the earth taking drastic action against a race sacrificing the non-rep jews for the "greater good".
I'm not saying I believe this at all. it's pretty outrageous, but it is interesting to tie that into the secret german research with 'ufo's, the supposed German moon base, the book "Synagogue of Satan"...
Welcome landstander!

This is fascinating. Obviously it is not hard evidence...but simply one more piece of the puzzle. Is the Zionist side in cooperation with the Reptilians (if you can't beat 'em...join 'em)? Is the Teutonic Zionist side at war with the Reptilians (better dead than rep)? These are not rhetorical questions. I really don't know. But this could be all about differing philosophies regarding the Reptilian Problem (rather than the Jewish Problem). This is very creepy territory...and I feel very uncomfortable thinking about it. In attempting to understand this subject...one could get negatively labelled rather quickly. I'm not on anyone's side...I'm just curious.

I have speculated that the Luciferian Rebellion in Heaven was against a Reptilian/Human Theocracy rather than a rebellion against the Founders/Ancients/Creator God of the Universe...and that those who followed Lucifer are the Renegade Pleiadians from Aldebaran (with Gizeh Intelligence and the Nazi phenomenon at it's core). This theory would fit with what you have related.

My proposed solution is for all major factions (Zionist, Teutonic Zionist, Reptilian) to accept the concept of Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom...and stop fighting. Mutually beneficial and peaceful interaction would be the goal. But I get the picture that the Reps are pretty hard-core and unrepentant...and don't think much of negotiating. They just do whatever the hell they want to...and no one is powerful enough to destroy them. They might have to decide...without pressure or force...that Namaste Constitutional Resposible Freedom would be in their long-term best interest. I think that it would be...but it's not up to me. How 'bout it Lord Draco?
Last edited by orthodoxymoron; 12-19-2009 at 07:53 PM.

12-19-2009, 07:52 PM #67
ChristinCP
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
I definitely don't think the Reptilians were Jews. If anything, the Nazi's were being controlled by Reptoid/Anunnaki factions - and this is probably how they got so much inside, esoteric and technological knowledge. Thoth via Drunvalo Melchizedek says that the Jews/Hebrew race were an ET group unlike any other, and not related to any other - and that no one is sure really where they came from, but that their mission and path is very special.

The holocaust was terrible and never should have happened, and it has negative Reptilian fingerprints all over it, from the Nazi/Nordic (anunnaki/Reptilian) side. George Kavassilas talks about how the Anunnaki have evolved out of their Reptoid forms into the very beautiful Nordic forms - hence the blond hair/blue eye craze of the Nazis. These are some NASTY beings. I'm sure some are okay, but they are not here to be our friends; and in no way, shape, or form was the holocaust anything but discusting and unforgivable. The individuals involved in it will suffer at their own consciences in the next world.

12-19-2009, 08:00 PM #68
orthodoxymoron
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
A major complication in all of this is the Nazi/Vatican alliance...and the Jesuit influence in the SS. What a tangled web! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e9zBX4gt0eo
Last edited by orthodoxymoron; 12-19-2009 at 08:17 PM.

12-19-2009, 09:15 PM #69
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
WE ARE HERE

the name israel -
why did they choose it ???

is - iSiS - part of the order of melz

ra - RA - part of the order of metatron

el - EL - part of the order of elhoim

that is why, they choose it !!!

although, they themselves, NONE OF THEM, are members of that !!!

"K"

12-19-2009, 09:20 PM #70
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
This part of the above thread mentioned above this link

http://pakalert.wordpress.com/2009/1...the-last-days/

WOW !!!

THANK YOU, that is an eye opener 'n a half

12-19-2009, 09:21 PM #71
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
WE ARE HERE

Draco BLOODLINES - vs. ELEMENTAL / Elven BLOODLINES

"K"

12-19-2009, 09:30 PM #72
mkspllmn
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by eXchanger
The Secret History of Our Time: The Pope and Satan, War and the Anti-Christ, Revelations and the Last Days

http://pakalert.wordpress.com/2009/1...the-last-days/
This talks about how we are lured in with great promises, then led down the garden path to our own demise. We fall for this every time (well, nearly every time). Here is how it works:

1. They hoard an item that we have become accustomed to but nobody knows they have it.
2. The item becomes scarce to the population and we look to them to get some for us.
3. The item magically appears out of no where. However if you want some you will have give something up. They will tell you what that is. It is always something precious but just a small amount (like our time on the earth in the form of tax). At the same time they promise us the item will remain cheap and plentiful. Later we grow to depend on the item (addiction) and the payment becomes quite burdensome. At the same time the item mysteriously becomes more and more scarce.
4. Finally we turn to them in desperation to get some for us and the cycle continues.

12-19-2009, 11:13 PM #73
housemouse2
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
6 million jews. Ever wonder where that number came from? The Nazi did keep records of the inmates but 6 million seems a bit far fetched even to me.

Here is an interesting read: http://www.stormfront.org/truth_at_last/holocaust.htm

The holocaust is an interesting concept and is probably not the actual truth. I find most of what is put forth as "fact" in history books is in fact distorted tales.

Prior to ww2, Hitler had a working relationship with the founding families of what became Israel. Matter of fact he set up training camps in Germany for the Jewish settlers to learn how to survive in Palestine.

I do believe Hitler was also infected with syphilis and was actually losing his mind, in similar fashion to Al Capone. Also, Hitler was drugged up pretty good...a daily injection of a homemade serum his personal doctor made.

I doubt the authenticy of Hitler's book. It was said the manuscript was written by a cell mate of Hitler's during ww1. That the manuscript was dictated and not actually written by Hitler...who was an avid art student and well educated person. Why have a corporal dictate the manuscript of a racist book while sitting in prison during ww1 and then later publish the book? Makes no real sense.

Next the Jewish community is actually splintering. Zionism and the Torah Jews are very much at odds over the very state of Israel.

A simple fact is there would be no state of Israel today if there was no holocaust. The propaganda spewed after ww2 about Jews being made into lampshades and soaps made it impossible for anyone to stand against the drive to give the Jewish people a hunk of Palestine.

And what is happening world wide today...Germany and other countries making it illegal to even post a doubt about the official story of the holocaust makes me believe they are hiding something.

For if the holocaust could stand up to real scrutiny then there would be no need to outlaw "holocaust denial." If I lived in germany I could go to jail for this post. I'm sure some people in the USA would like me to go to jail for this post as well.

Hollywood has done an excellent job at manifesting the holocaust into an undeniable "fact" which has portrayed all of Hitler and his SS as evil to the core. When in fact Hitler even got Time magazine man of the year in 1938, had been the driving force behind the Volkswagen, public works and helped establish the settlers of Israel.

The Germans had lost ww1, entered a great depression and was ready for "change." They were desperate to reclaim themselves as a "master race" in the eyes of the world. The term Nazi is slang for National party.

The truth may never be known about the holocaust but one things does strike me as very strange. The biggest holocaust in history happened right here in the USA. Matter fact it even gave Hitler the idea for the camps. The Native Americans were literally wiped out. Rounded up, placed onto "reservations." Untold millions died as the result of a holocaust.

Yet, the Indians have to fight for the right to sell tax free cigarettes on reservations while the Jews literally own Hollywood, the US government and have even received compensation from the holocaust from governments world wide.

The jewish holocaust cannot be questioned...for if you do you will be accused of racism. They have untold power, untold influence and weapon (the holocaust) which can be used against anyone, anywhere and at anytime.

How does a state no bigger than New Jersey get the 3rd most powerful military in the world? How come Israel doesn't need to allow nuclear inspectors into their state? Why do we send billions of dollars to a foreign state while our own people lose thier homes, starve and cannot afford health care?

The holocaust has made it impossible for anyone to question a state called Israel's motives, ambitions and forbids the disclosure of decades of shady deals.

What I fear is that eventually the holocaust will no longer protect American Jews from Israel's crimes. That there will be another holocaust akin to the KKK movement and this one will be in America.

I have a number of Jewish friends and because of Israel and Hollywood, I now fear for their safety.

The holocaust does need to be looked at with a fresh pair of eyes. We need to know the truth as what happened, by whom and why. We also need to expose the holocaust in Gaza and the west bank...and the fact that the 1967 borders of Israel are illegal under international law. Therefor Israel is the occupiers. Not the other way around.

If we fail to reign in Israel then eventually it will be the Arabs who will be the new "Jew" and the new holocaust. They will gain the same power the Jews have gained. They will be looked upon as a victim and not an aggressor in the future. The racism pendulum will swing the other way and the new power elite will be Arab. Mark my words.

12-20-2009, 04:30 AM #74
taomation
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
This is a very interesting set of videos. I think that the most interesting part is that they are BANNED on Youtube. So much for free speech and debate. Sounds like Al Gore on the climate change hoax.

And then when David Cole, (a Jew himself) points out some very interesting anomolies at Aushwitz the Anti Defimation League starts making death threats against him to the point where he retracts his statements sounding like he is at the barrel of gun.

I think that is safe to say that we should question everything we have been taught. Because where there is any agenda there is probably a lie or a least the potential for one.

I have always throught that is was kind of strange that there is very little talk about Stalin who was said to have killed ten times the amount of people that were reportedly killed Nazi Germany.

Thank you Exchanger. This is a very touchy subject... Peace....

12-20-2009, 04:47 AM #75
no caste
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
One thing - no, 2 things that bother me - no, 3 things.

1. Possible fiddling with the numbers (4.4 million?).
2. Neglecting the other numbers.
3. Something I read about Elie Wiesel.* Don't know if it's true.

Haven't read the whole thread yet, Susan. Don't like to wade in. I have waded enough politically - next thing y'know poof I'm a Nazibotski!
________________________________________________

* Auschwitz Survivor Claims Elie Wiesel is an Impostor
Translated from the Hungarian - March 4, 2009
http://www.henrymakow.com/translated...hungarian.html

#76
orthodoxymoron
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Perhaps one of the greatest lessons we can learn from participation in Avalon...is to keep asking the right questions...in the right way. We probably need to question everything...but in a measured and tactful manner.

The bad guys and gals (human and otherwise...native and ET) probably play all sides...so just about everyone and everything may be a mixture of good and evil.

Namaste

12-20-2009, 06:14 AM #77
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
i think,the big question is how many holocausts have their been

and, how much bigger were they, than, we think ???

12-20-2009, 06:20 AM #78
sjkted
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
eXchanger: Thank you for bringing up this topic.

I've been looking into this topic on my own recently as it appears that too many of these details aren't adding up. For example, Hitler being 1/4 or 1/10 or whatever percentage Jewish, being financed by the Rothschilds, the creation of Israel immediately after the war. Ironically, for a people who experienced ethnic cleansing, one would think the state of Israel would be a little more respectful towards creating settlements.

I agree that as far as the mainstream is concerned that this is a controversial topic, but so long as everyone here is coming from a place of light and integrity and honest inquiry as to what happened, there is no reason the details and facts need to be hidden.

This video just came out about a week ago. See http://www.prisonplanet.com/israel-w...er-laptop.html. I struggle to make sense of it.

For those who have not researched the matter, the problem is not the Jews, but the Zionists. All Zionists are Jewish, but not all Jews are Zionists. Zionism is a political movement. Interestingly enough, there is a group of Jews (non-Zionists) in Israel called refusniks who refuse to participate in the expanding of settlements and the destruction of Palestenian land. I guess they would be similar to the 9/11 truthers or the 3% movement in the US.

What I don't get is that a lot of the Holocaust Debunk/Revisionist movies and literature seems to downplay the number of Holocaust victims and some of the testimony given during the Nuremburg trials. I think it's safe to say the trials were rigged, but what is the big picture here?

So what if there were 1, 3, or 6 million people killed in the camps? What does it matter whether they were Jews, gays, or political dissenters? Does it matter whether they were killed from hard labor coupled with malnutrition or gassed? My point is that no matter how you crunch the numbers, it was still a huge travesty with substantial damaged caused even to the survivors.

I'm still trying to wrap my head around all of these details. It seems to me that there was a genocide situation, although it may have been grossly(?) overstated by the Zionists during the Nuremburg trials and for propaganda reasons in order to entice the US into joining the war and also for the creation of Israel.

Is that it or is there anything else I'm missing?

-- sjkted

12-20-2009, 06:26 AM #79
sjkted
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Another interesting point about this is that in many European countries it is illegal to say anything contrary to the public story on the Holocaust. Can you imagine being jailed for just expressing that maybe some of the details were fudged or not correctly stated or for being a whistleblower/witness.

See some of the laws regarding Holocaust denial on Wikipedia at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust_denial_laws.

12-20-2009, 06:30 AM #80
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by mkspllmn
The biggest holocaust in history was the American Indian I think.
i think the biggest holocaust is still going on,

and, it is against, almost all of us

12-20-2009, 06:32 AM #81
sjkted
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by Humble Janitor
I still don't understand why people wish to downplay the jewish holocaust.

I'd expect that behavior out of the Iranian President or a neo-nazi but not people on Avalon.

Why is it that it is a "Jewish" holocaust? If I may ask, how do you define a Jew? Are you referring to a specific racial group or a group of people who share a set of beliefs or something else?

12-20-2009, 06:44 AM #82
sjkted
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by eXchanger
i think the biggest holocaust is still going on,

and, it is against, almost all of us
I agree. It's amazing that TPTB are still able to profit from the meme of concentration camps as publicized by Alex Jones and some of the Youtube videos. Regardless of whether or not they are true, they certainly do a good job of portraying ordinary people as future helpless victims.

12-20-2009, 07:05 AM #83
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
it's pretty complicated

maybe next year; everyone should do their census forms

and, say they are zionist jews


or, write down - i am NOT from around here !!!

or, it is a secret

12-20-2009, 08:21 AM #84
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by sjkted
Why is it that it is a "Jewish" holocaust? If I may ask, how do you define a Jew? Are you referring to a specific racial group or a group of people who share a set of beliefs or something else?
The majority of people killed were jews (or according to some people, they were either zionists or non-zionists).

I don't wish to debate the legitimacy of something that angers me to even think about and for that, I must bow out.

12-20-2009, 03:14 PM #85
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
i do NOT ever remember, even studying it, in canada ???

i'll have to ask some of my friends
~ i kind of dreamed my way through high school

but, i do NOT even recall, anything really being taught about it,
in the early 70's

12-22-2009, 12:48 PM #86
wynderer
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Hi All -- i haven't seen anything yet on this thread or anywhere else that convinces me the Holocaust was a 'hoax' -- there are many US soldiers who helped to liberate the camps who can tell you they were real -- & i have known Jews who lost nearly all their families in the camps

there may be some political angle to the denial movement -- i sometimes wonder if part of the denial movement is because most humans do their best to avoid the truth of the fact that evil things are being done, right here & now, under their noses & sometimes in plain sight

also -- a good way to kind of pre-deny the FEMA camps

Peace & Freedom, wynderer

12-25-2009, 05:17 AM #87
mntruthseeker
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
eXchanger............. IT WAS NOT 6 MILLION JEWS...............they were Germans, The expulsions (today called "ethnic cleansing"). GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT

I think that you are 100 per cent correct on what you are saying and even though this is such a heated issue in this thread it irritates me so much to see people shut their eyes to the truth and continue to believe all the BS that our media/news cast has told us

Here is an article I came across today and at the bottom there are pictures and a list of other books written about this.

In my heart I try to imagine how people strongly denied these stories back during this time frame and even now today when they only have to open their eyes and see that it has never really stopped.

What happened in other Countries and even now in Iraq, Afghanistan, India, China etc........................what are they thinking ?


It truly does hurt to know the truth.........but its time that some people put aside their sun glasses and see the FACTS because this is exactly what they are trying to do in the USA today.

http://www.rense.com/general88/after.htm
Last edited by mntruthseeker; 12-25-2009 at 05:23 AM.

12-25-2009, 05:26 AM #88
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Whether or not the holocaust as we think of it today happened.

There were massacres, all over occupied areas. Entire villages exectued.

6 million jews seems more shocking, then a whole local populace. Higher number, but given regional concentration not the same. But still very bad.

Victim mentality.... i see all over now. Minorities, religious.... whatever.

Further division of the divided is how i see it.

12-25-2009, 05:37 AM #89
mntruthseeker
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by 371
Whether or not the holocaust as we think of it today happened.

There were massacres, all over occupied areas. Entire villages exectued.

6 million jews seems more shocking, then a whole local populace. Higher number, but given regional concentration not the same. But still very bad.

Victim mentality.... i see all over now. Minorities, religious.... whatever.

Further division of the divided is how i see it.


Yes, it is very sad and did you know that after the war they had more Jewish people recorded than listed prior to the war ? I have nothing against the Jewish people but its the ones that are behind this as was pointed out before that are making money off this war. There is a huge difference in their story and the truth................These people were slaughtered and not the way its written

The truth needs to come out so people will see that it was the Israel,USA, Britain and Russia especially the NAZI'S that had a hand in this as they are today. Especially the Jesuits & Vatican.............evil evil

We still have so many people that shut their eyes to the truth.

I feel its important because although I hate to say this, I know that we still have many people that just dont give a **** because it happened there and not here. Well its happening all over and they need to know its what they want to do here
Last edited by mntruthseeker; 12-25-2009 at 06:35 AM.

12-25-2009, 05:38 AM #90
mntruthseeker
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by the exchanger
i think the biggest holocaust is still going on,

and, it is against, almost all of us


exactly

12-25-2009, 08:00 AM #91
sjkted
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Here's an interesting side note I found while I was watching this. The internment camps were not just limited to Europe during World War II. In the United States, we actually rounded up about 120,000 Japanese naturalized CITIZENS and US-born citizens, deprived them of their property and put them in camps. Of course, this completely violates the constitution and bill of rights.

The only thing different from Europe is that I haven't heard claims of anyone being killed. It was very recent that the government officially apologized and offered reparations of $20,000 or so per internee. Of course, many of them have since died and thus will never be compensated.

For more details, see the Wikipedia article.

--sjkted

12-25-2009, 08:04 AM #92
sjkted
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
I also remember from Victor Frankl's book that a large number of camps were plagued by virus outbreaks that were caused by poor hygiene and the large number of people living in close quarters. I wonder what percentage of these people died from these types of outbreaks.

--sjkted

12-25-2009, 09:30 AM #93
wynderer
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
whatever the statistics were, a lot of people -- not just the Jews, but way more of them than anyone else -- died in terrible pain & suffering in those camps -- & those who did this are alive & well in my own country especially

& knowing/seeing how good the nwo is at using not just symbols, but words/language itself to manipulate minds -- i just wonder about the phrase 'holocaust denial' getting so much play recently -- w/the Big Daddy of all Holocausts in the works right now

Peace & Freedom, wynderer

12-25-2009, 04:20 PM #94
mntruthseeker
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
alot of them starved to death (IMO why so many were so very thin) Veneral Deseases from being raped from all the soldiers after the war

It was said that is when so many died. The story I put out there says more so much and yet he writes he elliminated the worse !

I guess what bothers me the most is when and how they died. The horrific crimes against humanity.

Genocide to make their so called perfect race

12-25-2009, 05:24 PM #95
wynderer
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
i'm 62 yrs old & was in Junior High when A Eichmann was caught & brought to trial -- there were many Jewish kids in my classes -- there were also a number of first-person accounts written in the '50s by survivors of various camps in our school library which i read -- one survivor wrote that it was not an absence of the Light in the camps, it was the presence of evil

to me it does not matter the exact number of the millions who died in the camps or on the forced marches, or how they died, other than that some deaths were more horrible than others --especially how the babies died -- even one human being forced to die that way is wrong -- &, this being Christmas Day, may i remind those souls still hanging around who were involved in perpetrating those cruelties, that Jesus had some rough things to say re the future of those who hurt the children, the little ones

& may i apologize to all those of the Jewish faith for what has been done to your people over the centuries in the Name of Jesus

Peace & Freedom, wynderer

12-25-2009, 06:04 PM #96
mntruthseeker
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
I totally agree with you that no human being should be made to suffer this way.

Its never been over. I know many families also that have been directly effected by genocide that is happening today.

People talk about the Holocaust as if it is a thing of the past and it was only Jews. That gets under my skin because it is not the truth. It is still happening and no matter who they are it isn't right. DIVISION they created it and they are now using it to fix our world. Who wants it ?

To some it may seem "not important" that the truth be told but to me it is very very important. To accept it as it was written is accepting anything they do and tell us. The it continues

The saying goes "the truth will set you free" We all know they write HIS-story.........same as they re-wrote the Bible. BS Its all their teachings and I refuse to go around believing any more of their lies.

So we go about our lives believing that those damn germans killed those poor jews ? Naw, dont think so. Put blame where blame lies..........the Zionist, Russians, Americans, British and the Zeta-Reptilians killed the human beings and WWII was not the first time,that has been proven

I feel that to say - it doesnt matter, is wrong as wrong can be. It does matter because its happening still. This holocaust is nothing more than their decision of who is to live or not. Just like their new wonderful health care bill. It was just the kick off of this NWO they are.

12-25-2009, 06:07 PM #97
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
I don't understand why people seem to treat this type stuff like it is something new.

This has been going on forever.

12-25-2009, 06:14 PM #98
mntruthseeker
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by 371
I don't understand why people seem to treat this type stuff like it is something new.

This has been going on forever.

Your right, but its the "cover up" of what really happened.

Have you always known the truth ? If so, does it not bother you to continue to push the wrong ideas off on the world ?

out of sight, out of mind is the way the world is and its time for them to realize that we are living a blatan lie here.

People can believe what they want but IMO, it helps TPTB continue on their way slaughtering anyone that they deemed unfit to live.

12-25-2009, 07:03 PM #99
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by mntruthseeker

Have you always known the truth ? If so, does it not bother you to continue to push the wrong ideas off on the world ?

out of sight, out of mind is the way the world is and its time for them to realize that we are living a blatan lie here.
Nazi atrocities? YES always have known, it is my heritige.

Living a blatant lie? No, didn't always know. And certainly not just how much of it is a lie.

Out of sight, out of mind indeed. Most people simply don't care, until it effects them personally.

Then they are upset, and cry about it. That is like a rocking chair- gives them something to do but doesn't get them anywhere.

12-25-2009, 07:43 PM #100
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by 371
I don't understand why people seem to treat this type stuff like it is something new.

This has been going on forever.
true - however, iT iS TYME to alter/change/and, morph and shift it,
into something of a higher order - so, the collective consciousness
on earth - is forever changed

if you read, here :

you;ll quickly discover who jehovah - really was

it might surprise you

THE TRUTH about Earth Changes & ETs -- They are us, we are them

http://www.projectavalon.net/forum/s...ad.php?t=17838

post 88 - starts the main info

WHY CAN'T PEOPLE find it ???

#101
mntruthseeker
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by 371
Nazi atrocities? YES always have known, it is my heritige.

Living a blatant lie? No, didn't always know. And certainly not just how much of it is a lie.

Out of sight, out of mind indeed. Most people simply don't care, until it effects them personally.

Then they are upset, and cry about it. That is like a rocking chair- gives them something to do but doesn't get them anywhere.

Yes, I am upset about this. I can't imagine that I am alone with my feelings.

But apparently its fitting to let the world go along their way and accept the fact there is nothing we can do about this now so forget it.


I dont feel that way, I didnt know all of this and yes it is very hard to comprehend the scope of what happened and I dont care if it happened 100 years ago. People still walk around with their heads in the cloud believing their stories.

Its time for the world to open their eyes and see who did this and why.
Because it is still happening. Or do you think the Holocaust was a one time thing ?

I just find your last response pretty harsh and hope that more people will wake up to the truth now that word is getting out to us.

It matters regardless of those that have always known. It matters alot

12-26-2009, 07:11 PM #102
mntruthseeker
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
I just happened to run into this today and felt I must put it here for all the people that feel that this thread was based on Untruths or that it shouldn't of even been started

REVISIONISTS

Revisionists - Men & Women of Heart & Soul.flv From: FredrickToben | December 24, 2009 | 140 views 1. This is an incomplete compilation of Revisionists who have dared to confront the Hoax of the 20th Century - the Jewish Holocaust-Shoah lies because of their love for truth, among other topics.
2. Remember, anyone who thinks and absorbs new information, then refuses to fudge the books because the new information threatens their world view, is a Revisionist.
3. Holocaust believers are either ignorant of the physical facts, liars or both, and that is why they legally persecute anyone who refuses to believe in their lies.
4. For many the maxim still holds - the truth hurts, but don't look for a scapegoat.
5. Life's lesson is - get over it and liberate yourself through hard mental work from your own mental conceptual prison - Arbeit macht Frei. ... (more info)



https://www.youtube.com/user/Fredrick.../0/WB27ecKd-3o

12-26-2009, 08:16 PM #103
derpif
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Wow I`m so upset now.
Never thought that there are people on this site dumb enough to even discuss this. Sorry.
I`m from Germany and my mother was born in 1935. My Grandmother was born 1911. I know from first hand witness accounts that it happened.
No one here in Germany, except the f#cking Neo-Nazis, would discuss this seriously.
I don`t find words for the ignorance and stupidity to post this eXchanger.

derpif

12-26-2009, 08:53 PM #104
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by derpif
Wow I`m so upset now.
Never thought that there are people on this site dumb enough to even discuss this. Sorry.
I`m from Germany and my mother was born in 1935. My Grandmother was born 1911. I know from first hand witness accounts that it happened.
No one here in Germany, except the f#cking Neo-Nazis, would discuss this seriously.
I don`t find words for the ignorance and stupidity to post this eXchanger.

derpif
NO ONE HERE, is disputing it did NOT happen

everyone here is in absolute agreement, it did

what we are discussing is how wide spread are these holocausts ???

(what was NOT recorded in history)

and, how much more truth is there, to dig for ???

SO IT DOES NOT HAPPEN AGAIN ~ WHAT CAN WE ALL DO,
as part of humanity-who care NOT to have a repeat performance of things like this ???

i have interesting german lineage,
that can be tracked back to 1150ad

we also lived through, a lot of 'hatred' towards
having a german last name, that was discussed yesterday,
at Xmas, to get lengths

so~you don't have to tell me, it happened

WE KNOW iT HAPPENED

in a discovery for 'real' truth

HOW eXpansive was it ???

that is what we are debating

and, how it is, we might all advert it happening again !!!

that is what we are discussing here

WE REPEAT, WE DID NOT WRITE THAT ARTICLE

THERE is a lot of war going on ~ between draco blood/and, elven blood

are you aware of that ???

and, german people were transported - or, choose to run
to advert, getting slaughtered

some even ran from russia/to poland/to france and, into germany-and, onto others parts of the world

many, many people lost their lives ~ most never got to talk about it

although, some do whisper in The Trinity/or The Trine of The Ethers....

that is what we are discussing !!!
Last edited by THE eXchanger; 12-26-2009 at 08:57 PM.

12-26-2009, 08:59 PM #105
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
some chickens ~ aligned with churches
instead of keeping their chosen belief systems
to save their lives

did you know, some germans, converted to jews
prior to 1900, as, they thought that was safer
and, relocated to CHE REP

12-26-2009, 09:00 PM #106
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
when they say st. patrick slayed snakes in ireland

we are NOT talking about the type that slitter on the ground

the catholic/and, pros. still fight in ireland, even today

prior the 2/3rd century - the catholic church didn't even eXist

12-26-2009, 09:07 PM #107
derpif
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Then go ahead and discuss how ExPANSIVE it was, I don`t care.
There is no difference if 6.000.000 or 3.000.000 people died.
Maybe I don`t get the point here.

12-26-2009, 09:14 PM #108
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by derpif
Then go ahead and discuss how ExPANSIVE it was, I don`t care.
There is no difference if 6.000.000 or 3.000.000 people died.
Maybe I don`t get the point here.
the biggest point might be
~ maybe 'the germans' were NOT the real ones, behind it all
(although, history has made it appear that way)

NOT always can you judge men/or women
based only on the 'suits' they present to this world
or, perhaps, are forced to wear

war is NOT a very fair thing ~ to anyone

there is, a lot of important things
~ starting to bubble to the surface

we need to learn to all be in peace, and live in peace

a lot of pieces on earth are starting to work together

so, the past, does NOT repeat itself

12-26-2009, 09:27 PM #109
derpif
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by THE eXchanger
the biggest point might be
~ maybe 'the germans' were NOT the real ones, behind it all
(although, history has made it appear that way)

No reptillians involved, just pure human evil.
You might consider that the Nazis were heavy Methamphetamine users,
known as Pervitin back then. This drug turns people into icecold agressive beings. Much more likely than anything else.
http://www.amphetamines.com/nazi.html
http://translate.google.com/translat...ml&sl=de&tl=en

12-26-2009, 10:07 PM #110
sjkted
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by derpif
Wow I`m so upset now.
Never thought that there are people on this site dumb enough to even discuss this. Sorry.
I`m from Germany and my mother was born in 1935. My Grandmother was born 1911. I know from first hand witness accounts that it happened.
No one here in Germany, except the f#cking Neo-Nazis, would discuss this seriously.
I don`t find words for the ignorance and stupidity to post this eXchanger.

derpif
derpif: I'm curious to hear what you think of the German laws to prevent free speech on the holocaust.

There is an official story about what happened that lead to the formation of Israel. In watching what the Zionist government is doing lately, I have become interested in this topic again because it seems like there are some details that don't add up. It seems like the people best qualified to tell this story are the German people who experienced it, but one can face imprisonment for saying anything other than the official story.

The Neo-Nazi thing makes absolutely no sense to me. Hitler had Jewish blood (1/8 or 1/10th) which he even mentioned in Mein Kampf. Hitler was financed by Jewish bankers such as the Rothschilds without whom he would have not been able to accomplish anything. Further, after the Zionists established Israel, they have been pushing the Palestinians further and further out and destroying their land and property. They are heavily financed by the United States and enjoy some substantial privilege in the Middle East as a result of it. There is something here that just doesn't add up.

FWIW, I studied German in college for four years. My mother's side of the family is Jewish and I've been told I lost distant relatives in the camps. For this reason, my mother protested my studying German or having anything to do with German language or culture. I don't have any grudges. I just want to know what really happened because it appears we are in a position where history may be repeating itself. Those who don't know what really happened in the past are doomed to repeat the same mistakes.

--sjkted

12-26-2009, 10:28 PM #111
derpif
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Hi sjkted,
in my opinion it is very unfortunate and stupid from Germany that denying of the Holocaust is prosecuted.
This topic is only discussed in underground extremist circles. It is a great taboo here. That is what it makes so interesting for many young people.
In an open discussion with these so called revisionists you could debunk their lies easily for everyone to hear.
In my opinion even the most extremist political view should be allowed the freedom of speech. Everything else is very dangerous.

Greetings
derpif

12-26-2009, 10:52 PM #112
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
and, the german laws

where i got a parcel of 'pine bark' back in the mail

stating-i was trying to import 'illegal drugs' LOL

we tried to warn many germans/and, NOW EU countries

of the dangers of CODEX /HEALTH PRODUCTs etc.,

and, they didn't listen

they said, that will NEVER happen here

NOW ~ SO MANY RESTRICTIONS in GERMANY ~ it is scary

they should take some lessons from the swiss,
in how they arm themselves !!!

12-26-2009, 11:48 PM #113
mntruthseeker
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
I dont believe that Germany had all that much to do with this as I see them as the victims.

You just have to ask yourself who profited from this ?

who was in the big hurry to grab all the files and hide them within the vatican

So, I would think if I was a victim of such horrific crimes I would most deffinately want the truth to get out there.


The worse part about all of this is that it continued throughout the years


Most of the world thinks Hitler did all this and oh well he is dead so why worry.

I'm sorry to all that are so bothered with this but to me, its important because of what is happening in the Middle East today

01-16-2010, 10:22 AM #114
golfsierra
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Join Date: Jan 2010
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
To support derpif here:

All that nonsense about a 'secret conspiracy organization' behind the Nazis just utilizing them to conduct the holocaust is hair raising BS.

The Nazi decided at the Wannsee conference to solve the 'problem' of the jewish population in Europe and bring it to an end. Ther was noone else involved in this discussion except the German Nazi party.

I don't see the Nazis, especially all the responsible political and military leaders of the German gov at that time, as 'victims'. The aren't.

I am from Germany, too.

And to straighten things out: Discussion about the Holocaust is not forbidden in Germany, but denying it is ! For a good reason as you easily can see.

If denying the holocaust was unlawful in Sweden, USA and some other countries, Nazis all over the world and especially German Nazis would'nt be able to buy and distribute so much Nazi propaganda. In fact, all that stuff like DVDs, books and flags is produced in countries, who fought the Third Reich until it fell - but after the war, they stopped fighting Nazis. Why ?

Abut that parcel with "pine bark" in it (whatever that is), and the German customs claiming that illegal drugs were in it: It depends on what each country (in Europe additionally the EU in Brussels) defined as 'illegal drugs'. Custom has their lists of drugs that can not be imported to or exported from Germany legally. If 'pine bark' is on the list, so what ? Maybe in other countries it's legal, and other stuff may be illegal instead.
There basically is nothing wrong with the laws in Germany. They are different to those in other countries, but do you really expect, that more than 170 nations on this globe have the same understanding of what is legal and what is not ?
Beg you pardon.
Last edited by golfsierra; 01-16-2010 at 10:25 AM.

01-16-2010, 10:42 AM #115
golfsierra
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Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 10
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by THE eXchanger
the biggest point might be
~ maybe 'the germans' were NOT the real ones, behind it all
(although, history has made it appear that way)

..........

there is, a lot of important things
~ starting to bubble to the surface
Well,

lot of nonsense about what happend in WW II / Third Reich is coming out all the time, written by people driven by 'conspiracy' ideas, paranoia, or just not able to separate their fantasies from reality anymore. Some of those people are book writers, and the motive for doing so is is just plain money. People are very gullible and rumors, written as a book, do sell very well.

If you really want to find out about the Holocaust, visit the memorial in Berlin or Yad Vashem in Jerusalem.

What you thing is 'important' has to be questioned concerning the evidence (never provided) and the credibility of those spreading those rumors.

01-16-2010, 10:53 AM #116
golfsierra
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Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 10
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by orthodoxymoron
OK...Gizeh Intelligence supposedly supported Hitler with technology and gold in the 1930's...and part of the deal was that the Nazis would go easy on the Jews. Gizeh Intelligence supposedly withdrew their support for the Nazis in 1941. There is an interesting interview with Al Bielek...where he talks about Hitler, the Nazis, WWII, and Hitler surviving WWII. Here's the link
Al Bielek (his full name is Alfred Bielek) was proven to be a liar and hoaxer already in 2003. Wondering, why people still refer to his utter nonsense, maybe because his bedtime stories are popping up time after time.
See http://www.bielek-debunked.com
for a full report about him lying.

Best regards,

Golf Sierra

01-17-2010, 12:39 AM #117
housemouse2
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Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 117
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
some red cross documents were recently floating around on the web. In their own documentation they knew of the camps, inspected them, sent care packages to them as well.

I find it very hard to believe the international red cross would help Hitler cover up 6 million murdered people. The red cross documents which appear real to me indicate 200,000 deaths due to typus.

Knowing the red cross from my own experience I can only summarize either the red cross inspectors were ignorant beyond belief or the holocaust as we have come to know it is a grossly distorted version of what actually happened.

Hitler did indeed have the red cross in Germany both before and during the war. How could the red cross not only know about these camps but also visit them and still have no clue of a holocaust?

I've always taken the media's word for it without any critical thinking. But when you apply critical thought even 3 million dead is an impossible number for the given time frame and method used.

then add in relief agencies who did have access to these camps and their negligence to report anything like what the military reported at the end of the war.

We all sit here and agree that another holocaust should never happen but fail to realize another holocaust has happened, is happening and there are far worse holocaust which get no national attention. Just research Gaza and get a clear picture of what is really going on over there.

The native American Indians were nearly wiped off the face of the earth. When Lenin took over Russia millions of people were killed.

We have learned nothing from the holocaust which now seems less than accurate.

America has been slowly turning into a fascist empire where our own citizens are no longer safe from our government due to the Patriot act. Many are beginning to realize 9/11 was done by our own government with the help of Mossad.

The holocaust has morphed from a tragic event that never should have happened to a reason not to even question the current government of Israel or be labl3ed anti-Semitic if you do. So, in response to this "trick" and the connection to 9/11 many Americans are now questioning how authentic story of the holocaust truly is.

"Holocaust denial" isn't a racist movement as people tend to think but rather a questioning of how accurate the history is. For if the history proves otherwise and Israel government has been using this tragic event as a weapon to get whatever they want, than those people who did suffer and die in the holocaust did so for nothing.

Israel has been implicated in some very serious crimes (along with the USA) against humanity. White prosperous bombs in a civilian populated area is a war crime. Depleted uranium rounds (USA also guilty of this in Iraq) is a war crime. Cutting off water, electricity, food and medical supplies to a civilian population is a war crime. Any and all land grabbed in an invasion is a war crime.

Unlike Israel the USA doesn't have a weapon to use against anyone who questions us. The little state the size of NJ has the 3rd most powerful military in the world. (How does that happen?) And the moment you question their actions or responses they can throw up the holocaust like some holy grail which give them a free hall pass to kill innocent civilians in Gaza Strip, illegally kick out Palestine citizens from their homes and cut down ancient olive trees for the "settlers" whom are nothing more than land grabbers on illegal land.

The reason we must find out the truth as to what happened, by whom and why over 60 years ago in Germany is becuase that tragic event is being used to allow a holocaust now. But this time the Jews are doing what the Nazi's did. And if they are not careful the innocent Jews here in the USA and world wide will pay for those crimes once more. There will be a new wave of anti-Jewish fever to grip this nation if we do not stop the abuse.

03-06-2010, 02:46 PM #118
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
isn't it companies like the red cross,
that have people earning 400,000 + per annum ???

03-06-2010, 03:13 PM #119
Céline
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Wow....exchanger, this information is fascinating...

03-06-2010, 06:22 PM #120
Northern Boy
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
can`t believe i missed this thread


I will say that this did happen . Why it happened is another reason as is who decide it was going to happen


WHO

the Jewish controlled banking industry (Rothschild) decided that an Austrian Jew Uncle Adolf would carry out the plan . He wanted / needed a horror on perpetrated on the Jewish people for the re creation of the nation of Israel and the creation of a governing body formerly called the league of nations to become permanently enshrined in worldly affairs . Land donated by the family Rockefeller made the construction of the UN possible all that missing is the bow

03-06-2010, 07:05 PM #121
HORIZONS
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Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Arkansas USA
Posts: 156
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
If six or six million are murdered in the name of war it is ALL a holocaust. It doesn't matter how many die it is a holocaust to our true nature. If humanity cannot transcend the need for war, then humanity will eventually kill itself off the planet. Without a paradigm shift in human consciousness a holocaust of Billions will surely come upon us all.

Consciousness transformed + no war = Peace for us all.

03-07-2010, 02:15 AM #122
Slerbot
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Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Outer Towne, Orstralia
Posts: 36
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
eXchanger, I expected better from you.

You say "WE did not write this..." who is WE exactly? Do you have an evil twin I don't know about?

We do not need this foolish discussion to occur again, so your reposting of these rightoid opinions are unneccessary here, and inflammatory for it's own sake.

Short memories or what? No wonder it is the fashion to rewite EVERY history... the latest generation ALWAYS thinks it is the smartest, wisest,
most tech advanced to date. We are still being shown this is also BS - neanderthals could have had it all over us in sprirtituality and art culture.
What do we worship today? Empty vessels: Lady CaCa, famous imbeciles with freakish faces, and stupid, overpaid young men beating the meat out of each other on a field.

Not all history is neccessarily 'wrong'. That's only my opinion now, but your write up of the piece you link to says alot of what you are thinking, too.

As has been stated already, the numbers might have been fudged, Bloodlines and races might have been ignored too, but the hell did happen,
and it still happens of course, just that (many of the holocaust) victims' puppet government is perpetrating some of the same sick rituals on the true owners of the country they inhabit.
Like some child abuse victims who grow up to be pedeophiles.

I would like to obliterate that entire ugly reality and all it's root causes (extreme rascism and other ignorance, grimy secret ritual belief (harmful to others), lack of attention to warped govt policy,
political apathy combined with flag waving patriotism) and so also it's history as some of us know it - perhaps you would too, eXchanger? In my preferred next world, anyone else who really wishes, won't have any of it - inc the current culture and empathy vacuum. Is pretending a different past the way toward a better future?
Last edited by Slerbot; 04-03-2010 at 02:01 AM.

03-17-2010, 07:44 PM #123
wynderer
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Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: FingerLakes, USA
Posts: 89
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
yes, it's true that there have been many genocides thruout history -- perhaps one difference w/the Nazi attempt at genocide of the Jews [particularly -- yes, i know Jews weren't the only ones to die in the camps] -- the difference is that the other 'genociders' have passed into history -- the Nazi genociders passed to other countries & now control the real power in my own country & others -- it was also the most well-organized genocide we know of

when you deny the Holocaust, you are essentially denying present reality, &, as far as the camps go, very likely denying your own future -- human beings seem to be really good at denial

also, Holocaust denial appears to be fun for anti-Semites

[edit for this: i don't now if the documentary 'Mein Kampf' is still around -- it was released in the year A. Eichmann was brought to trial -- a lot of footage that the SS themselves had taken of the camps -- there 's also a map that the British made of the location of the camps -- they were EVERYWHERE -- i remember reading of one small camp in which the inmates were given bunks made of barbed wire to sleep on

it seems kind of tasteless & definitely un-loving to me to deny the suffering & death of so many]

Peace & Freedom, wynderer
Last edited by wynderer; 03-17-2010 at 07:51 PM.

03-17-2010, 10:15 PM #124
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
in many languages - there isn't a she/or a he - or; an i
there just, is, what there is,
we prefer 'we', rather than 'i'
if 'we' is good enough for 'the bloody queen'
than, it is 'good enough' for us - why be; a little 'i' ?
we aren't anyone's subject, we are free !!!

03-17-2010, 10:16 PM #125
THE eXchanger
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Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
also; there was a huge holocaust in america;
back in 1490 - NOT even recorded in the history books

(we sure, do NOT want history to repeat itself)

03-17-2010, 10:17 PM #126
THE eXchanger
Avalon Senior Member

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Posts: 4,915
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
the issue here; if you pay close attention
is, that, it is against the law, to even talk about it !!!

03-17-2010, 10:44 PM #127
fossileyesed
Avalon Senior Member

Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: northern bc canada
Posts: 159
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
good day susan,hope all is well
i was wondering if you've heard of unit 731.
i saw it on google awhile back.it is about how the japanese treated the chinese just before ww11 took place in 1938.the japanese were experimenting on the chinese in ways that made the germans look loving.
also found out that the concept of ovens was not a ww11 thing.
it almost seems like a script.one that got attached to the holocaust.

WARNING very disturbing.dont watch if you are tender

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bAp8bSdE5MQ

what i find even more disturbing than the cruelty,is that the american governments,did nothing,said nothing and were more than willing to receive all the results of the expeiriments.


peace,love...kent

03-17-2010, 11:12 PM #128
mntruthseeker
Avalon Senior Member

Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 2,482
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by THE eXchanger
also; there was a huge holocaust in america;
back in 1490 - NOT even recorded in the history books

(we sure, do NOT want history to repeat itself)

Personally, I think there have been these so called holocaust going back even further

I didnt know about the one in 1490, but what do people think war does in the first place ?


I know that I think it is time to put an end to this

03-18-2010, 12:39 AM #129
THE eXchanger
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Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Spiritual eXplorer-Canada
Posts: 4,915
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
yes, it is a shame, that, they try to take away our wellness businesses,
and, it is a shame, that, they invest, in the worst BUSINESS in the world, WAR

WE MUST BRING an end to it, so, everyone can

BE a PIECE of PEACE

any suggestions, on how we do that ???

03-18-2010, 04:44 AM #130
wynderer
Avalon Senior Member



Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: FingerLakes, USA
Posts: 89
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
in light of the 'Patriot Act,' other minor restrictive laws pale, & do not worry me

i still maintain that the words 'Holocaust denial' are being used to influence the collective human psyche in some way -- words are actually just symbols, & the reptilian nwo is going all out w/a symbol war on the human mind right now -- there are weird vibes around that phrase --

Peace & Freedom, wynderer

03-18-2010, 04:58 AM #131
fossileyesed
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Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: northern bc canada
Posts: 159
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
personally first,then the world.yesterday was just that,tommorow doesnt exist.
that leaves today.
that dramatically reduces the size of the problem.peace,love and harmony from there.
now it gets really complicated,lol.cause it seems to me that loving your neighbor,like your self,has become extremely foreign to most people in the world.
i dont know why.
on the personal front,i am aware that we/us/them/they and those folks are brothers and sisters,directly related to trees.ya,i know,mind boggling amazing.
it makes me sad at same time ,because i can see how simple the solution is.
for whatever reason it is a concept that for the most part is lost.

how to eliminate the fear of each other,so we can get down to loving, giving
in a more harmonious relation with mother earth.simple and yet so complicated.

nobody is gonna save me.so it starts with me.now i need some help,lol.
harmony,hmmmm,simple.

i recorded this today down at the river.
theres a couple crows singing in the middle.they must have known i was recording,lol.
i did four,and crows sang in two of them.the wind chimed in also.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8P7uSMK3TlI

peace,love,harmony...kent

03-18-2010, 05:12 AM #132
wynderer
Avalon Senior Member



Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: FingerLakes, USA
Posts: 89
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Hi Fossileyesed -- getting rid of the fear works if everyone in the game wants to get rid of it -- unfortunately for us at this time on Earth, some of the key players in the game find fear very useful & quite nourishing -- not all beings on & around Earth have hearts that will be opened should there be the promised incoming of Divine Love

Peace & Freedom, wynderer

03-18-2010, 05:36 AM #133
DiVineEnvy
Avalon Senior Member

Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 128
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Thanks for the timely topic, Susan. The 'holocaust' has been milked for every ounce of guilt possible! It is time for them to drop it and get a life. Ernst Zundel just spent seven years in the slammer for daring to re-publish a book questioning the distortions of the official holocaust claims. Meanwhile, Elie Wiesel is going around posting a full page ad in the NY Times urging for sanctions against Iran. What about sanctions against Israel - for their atrocities against the Palestinians? Read the Goldstone Report. Clearly, this identity of victimhood is a sickness.
Last edited by DiVineEnvy; 03-18-2010 at 05:59 AM.

03-18-2010, 05:51 AM #134
fossileyesed
Avalon Senior Member

Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: northern bc canada
Posts: 159
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
ya,thats the sad part.

peace

03-17-2010, 10:17 PM #126
THE eXchanger
Avalon Senior Member

Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Spiritual eXplorer-Canada
Posts: 4,915
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
the issue here; if you pay close attention
is, that, it is against the law, to even talk about it !!!

03-17-2010, 10:44 PM #127
fossileyesed
Avalon Senior Member

Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: northern bc canada
Posts: 159
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
good day susan,hope all is well
i was wondering if you've heard of unit 731.
i saw it on google awhile back.it is about how the japanese treated the chinese just before ww11 took place in 1938.the japanese were experimenting on the chinese in ways that made the germans look loving.
also found out that the concept of ovens was not a ww11 thing.
it almost seems like a script.one that got attached to the holocaust.

WARNING very disturbing.dont watch if you are tender

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bAp8bSdE5MQ

what i find even more disturbing than the cruelty,is that the american governments,did nothing,said nothing and were more than willing to receive all the results of the expeiriments.


peace,love...kent

03-17-2010, 11:12 PM #128
mntruthseeker
Avalon Senior Member

Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 2,482
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by THE eXchanger
also; there was a huge holocaust in america;
back in 1490 - NOT even recorded in the history books

(we sure, do NOT want history to repeat itself)

Personally, I think there have been these so called holocaust going back even further

I didnt know about the one in 1490, but what do people think war does in the first place ?


I know that I think it is time to put an end to this

03-18-2010, 12:39 AM #129
THE eXchanger
Avalon Senior Member

Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Spiritual eXplorer-Canada
Posts: 4,915
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
yes, it is a shame, that, they try to take away our wellness businesses,
and, it is a shame, that, they invest, in the worst BUSINESS in the world, WAR

WE MUST BRING an end to it, so, everyone can

BE a PIECE of PEACE

any suggestions, on how we do that ???

03-18-2010, 04:44 AM #130
wynderer
Avalon Senior Member



Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: FingerLakes, USA
Posts: 89
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
in light of the 'Patriot Act,' other minor restrictive laws pale, & do not worry me

i still maintain that the words 'Holocaust denial' are being used to influence the collective human psyche in some way -- words are actually just symbols, & the reptilian nwo is going all out w/a symbol war on the human mind right now -- there are weird vibes around that phrase --

Peace & Freedom, wynderer

03-18-2010, 04:58 AM #131
fossileyesed
Avalon Senior Member

Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: northern bc canada
Posts: 159
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
personally first,then the world.yesterday was just that,tommorow doesnt exist.
that leaves today.
that dramatically reduces the size of the problem.peace,love and harmony from there.
now it gets really complicated,lol.cause it seems to me that loving your neighbor,like your self,has become extremely foreign to most people in the world.
i dont know why.
on the personal front,i am aware that we/us/them/they and those folks are brothers and sisters,directly related to trees.ya,i know,mind boggling amazing.
it makes me sad at same time ,because i can see how simple the solution is.
for whatever reason it is a concept that for the most part is lost.

how to eliminate the fear of each other,so we can get down to loving, giving
in a more harmonious relation with mother earth.simple and yet so complicated.

nobody is gonna save me.so it starts with me.now i need some help,lol.
harmony,hmmmm,simple.

i recorded this today down at the river.
theres a couple crows singing in the middle.they must have known i was recording,lol.
i did four,and crows sang in two of them.the wind chimed in also.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8P7uSMK3TlI

peace,love,harmony...kent

03-18-2010, 05:12 AM #132
wynderer
Avalon Senior Member



Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: FingerLakes, USA
Posts: 89
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Hi Fossileyesed -- getting rid of the fear works if everyone in the game wants to get rid of it -- unfortunately for us at this time on Earth, some of the key players in the game find fear very useful & quite nourishing -- not all beings on & around Earth have hearts that will be opened should there be the promised incoming of Divine Love

Peace & Freedom, wynderer

03-18-2010, 05:36 AM #133
DiVineEnvy
Avalon Senior Member

Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 128
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
Thanks for the timely topic, Susan. The 'holocaust' has been milked for every ounce of guilt possible! It is time for them to drop it and get a life. Ernst Zundel just spent seven years in the slammer for daring to re-publish a book questioning the distortions of the official holocaust claims. Meanwhile, Elie Wiesel is going around posting a full page ad in the NY Times urging for sanctions against Iran. What about sanctions against Israel - for their atrocities against the Palestinians? Read the Goldstone Report. Clearly, this identity of victimhood is a sickness.
Last edited by DiVineEnvy; 03-18-2010 at 05:59 AM.

03-18-2010, 05:51 AM #134
fossileyesed
Avalon Senior Member

Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: northern bc canada
Posts: 159
Re: Warning: VERY CONTROVERSIAL - holocaust
ya,thats the sad part.

peace

read here http://www.themistsofavalon.net/t2905-american-holocaust-of-native-american-indians-compared-to-jewish-holocaust-by-nazi-hitler-rascism#66470

did you know japanese where held too

ask the actor from star trek - all about it

http://www.allegiancemusical.com/video/never-forget-never-again